theycallmetomuMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,861Arc User
edited September 2018
Okay, so, I haven't tried the HEs yet, but looking over things, none of the RAD methods mentioned really hold a handle to random queues BUT for anyone who's been around for a long time and has a lot of random currency they never used, holy heck are you going to have a time; all of those useless abandoned treasures from the River District? BAM. Suddenly RADs, converted at a 20 RAD per ratio. Riches and treasures? Also suddenly valuable.
Each 1 treasure and 1 riches earns you 40. That means each 1 riches is basically 20 RAD. So that means fishing in chult is suddenly a possible way to generate revenue.
I am 100% sold on this.
Oh wow, Vorinblood can be converted to RAD too on a 20 RAD per basis.
Older campaigns than SKT seem to be pretty terrible at generating RAD though, so this does seem like it's weighted for more advanced players.
EDIT: Finally did a HE on preview. Got 250 RP. Which is nice, but not RAD. Miscommunication somewhere?
Both chests can be rerolled. For the campaign/legendary chest you still need a key to open it but then you can reroll it (no additional keys needed for rerolling).
Sorry, can you clarify: #1: Campaign/Legendary key opens then chest, and then rerolling is FREE? Or: #2: Campaign/Legendary key opens the chest, then rerolling is done with "Reroll Token" (Daily/VIP key) even for Campaign/Legendary Chest, or AD? #3: Campaign/Legendary key opens the chest, then rerolling is done with AD only because the Daily/VIP Reroll Tokens don't work on Campaign/Legendary chests because those are not Campaign/Legendary keys you're converting?
I *think* you mean #2 - reroll tokens allow reroll of all chests, even ones that take a key to open - but I'd like to be sure.
We aren't trying to push players to any one type of content with this change. Random Queues were already a big part of many of the player bases RAD rewards and it makes sense they still would be after this change as it has a good chunk of RAD rewarded for the first run of the day.
I would say, rather, that you very clearly *are* trying to push players to a certain kind of gameplay, though, and that is "Playing the game, on characters you like playing, instead of stocking and swapping between alts you don't play because that's actually more profitable".
You're nerfing the ability to move RAD to alt characters/alt accounts by removing salvage and having RAD go straight onto the toon that earns it instead of handing it off to whoever has the biggest remaining prayer boost. You nerfed the ability to farm Random Levelling on many toons, instead rewarding only the first run of the day. You're nerfing Leadership and the massive RP gain from swapping toons and clicking all day, instead making running content more profitable and running Gathering require resources (Gold! That has a USE!) from running the game.
I don't think you're pushing players towards any particular type of content, no. I think you're pushing players, HARD, towards "Any Content At All". You're steadily, in this patch and past, removing the perverse incentives that made NOT playing a more profitable use of time than playing.
And to be clear, I like it. These economy changes are all sensible steps, and while they're nerfing lots of currently-and-until-recently-quite-profitable things like "having a ton of alts to run Leadership and salvage purchased gear", it was always weird that I got a serious material advantage from having 20 characters I didn't play over someone who had only one character that they did.
(But while I'm praising these changes as great and well-thought-out: can you drop a line to the character rebalance team that maybe nerfing the DO DC into unplayability is not a good solution to the 4-support-1-DPS meta, since now everyone will just run 1 AC DC and 3 other support toons with their 1 DPS and now lowbie DCs have no good builds?)
We aren't trying to push players to any one type of content with this change. Random Queues were already a big part of many of the player bases RAD rewards and it makes sense they still would be after this change as it has a good chunk of RAD rewarded for the first run of the day.
I would say, rather, that you very clearly *are* trying to push players to a certain kind of gameplay, though, and that is "Playing the game, on characters you like playing, instead of stocking and swapping between alts you don't play because that's actually more profitable".
You're nerfing the ability to move RAD to alt characters/alt accounts by removing salvage and having RAD go straight onto the toon that earns it instead of handing it off to whoever has the biggest remaining prayer boost. You nerfed the ability to farm Random Levelling on many toons, instead rewarding only the first run of the day. You're nerfing Leadership and the massive RP gain from swapping toons and clicking all day, instead making running content more profitable and running Gathering require resources (Gold! That has a USE!) from running the game.
I don't think you're pushing players towards any particular type of content, no. I think you're pushing players, HARD, towards "Any Content At All". You're steadily, in this patch and past, removing the perverse incentives that made NOT playing a more profitable use of time than playing.
And to be clear, I like it. These economy changes are all sensible steps, and while they're nerfing lots of currently-and-until-recently-quite-profitable things like "having a ton of alts to run Leadership and salvage purchased gear", it was always weird that I got a serious material advantage from having 20 characters I didn't play over someone who had only one character that they did.
(But while I'm praising these changes as great and well-thought-out: can you drop a line to the character rebalance team that maybe nerfing the DO DC into unplayability is not a good solution to the 4-support-1-DPS meta, since now everyone will just run 1 AC DC and 3 other support toons with their 1 DPS and now lowbie DCs have no good builds?)
This.
Although, if the goal was *just* to make the characters you run be the ones that get bonuses, there'd be no reason to make the RAD rewards from running dungeons any less than the salvage value you got from dungeons before.
Also, as I mentioned in the professions section-if the goal was to discourage you from having value from 2000 charaters, then it'd make more sense to have morale and artisans available be account wide.
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someonediesMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,257Arc User
@noworries#8859 make tokens undescardable and remove ability to double-click it.
well i suppose there hav been worse changes in the past lol although these changes require the beer goggles to be taken off an the reading glasses to get put on lol (which havnt been done for few mods... cough the refinment changes cough cough) lol
Oh wow, Vorinblood can be converted to RAD too on a 20 RAD per basis.
Older campaigns than SKT seem to be pretty terrible at generating RAD though, so this does seem like it's weighted for more advanced players.
EDIT: Finally did a HE on preview. Got 250 RP. Which is nice, but not RAD. Miscommunication somewhere?
Guess my 150k voin blood will come in handy. Suddenly Map in bottles might be a decent thing :')
this was already called out in a separate thread someone posted. But for everyone to see below is what I found for the exchange for 1000 RAD. If I have a typo please let me know
I think the thing to keep in mind here I think would be how much time does it take to play the game to get these. In some cases the currencies involved aren't used to complete the campaign at all(barovian coins,chultan riches,omuan treasures, demonic ichor). For previous mods Chult and Barovia those currencies got salvageable gear so it makes sense I guess for RAD to only come from them and I'm not sure there is way to grind them like voninblod.
the icewind dale one for example you can only get 3 tears and 3 gold each day so there is an inherent limit of 3k RAD per day per toon with that one. That probably is the way to go I think. Something that is self-limiting if it potentially could be taken advantagle of. I also think something that the content would take about a half hour would be a good sweet spot for this.
dungeons would still be better though and they should be
0
someonediesMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,257Arc User
Oh wow, Vorinblood can be converted to RAD too on a 20 RAD per basis.
Older campaigns than SKT seem to be pretty terrible at generating RAD though, so this does seem like it's weighted for more advanced players.
EDIT: Finally did a HE on preview. Got 250 RP. Which is nice, but not RAD. Miscommunication somewhere?
Guess my 150k voin blood will come in handy. Suddenly Map in bottles might be a decent thing :')
this was already called out in a separate thread someone posted. But for everyone to see below is what I found for the exchange for 1000 RAD. If I have a typo please let me know
I think the thing to keep in mind here I think would be how much time does it take to play the game to get these. In some cases the currencies involved aren't used to complete the campaign at all(barovian coins,chultan riches,omuan treasures, demonic ichor). For previous mods Chult and Barovia those currencies got salvageable gear so it makes sense I guess for RAD to only come from them and I'm not sure there is way to grind them like voninblod.
the icewind dale one for example you can only get 3 tears and 3 gold each day so there is an inherent limit of 3k RAD per day per toon with that one. That probably is the way to go I think. Something that is self-limiting if it potentially could be taken advantagle of. I also think something that the content would take about a half hour would be a good sweet spot for this.
dungeons would still be better though and they should be
You still can not jump over the 100000 AD daily refine wall.
I was trying this out all day on Preview, all you AD farmers can put your worries and fears to rest. I dropped by Dread Ring and 1 bronze HE there paid out 113 RAD, the Trade Bar store will sell you 1000 RAD for 20 bars, and 1000 RAD for 50 Barovian Coins. I don't know if the gold and silver make more but I had to do it solo. I don't know what one considers a good deal. However currently you can buy a salvage crate for 250 BC and you might get a blue item worth 2500 RAD or a purple worth 5000 RAD. When this arrives 250 coins is a guaranteed 5000 RAD.
I imagine you will still complain and tell me to stop lecturing players on how they spend their time. Even if they do spend it foolishly.
I just want to say that these recent changes to "fix the economy" are aimed at players generating/refining RAD.
The problem is:
The players that have absurd amounts of AD didn't get it by salvaging gear and refining RAD. The super rich players in Neverwinter aren't using the methods that you are adjusting.
The Knox companion was a cool idea. There are a million other ways you can implement things like that (small AD sinks) simultaneously. That one time thing isn't going to change the economy, but enough of that stuff very well could.
You could even make AD sinks that require continual investment. You could add RNG AD sinks that are incorporated into every single new piece of gear. You could add tons of expensive "one-time only" fashion sets/pieces. You could add HUGE AD sinks that increase your chances (RNG) of getting bound things like the Shadowstalker +5s. It is ridiculous that many players will never have that ring, no matter how much money they throw at you (or AD they use). Think about that, it is a very good example of what I am arguing here.
Players will pay for these things. With enough effort, and carefully placed sinks, you could actually make some changes to the economy.
Nerfing the players "living in poverty", is not going to do much to the economy.
Personally, I don't really care what changes happen to the AD, RAD, or the economy. I haven't been playing that often lately. However, I am just pointing out the simple fact that you are "adjusting" the wrong parts of the economy, in my opinion.
I really do like Neverwinter. This comment is not to bash the development team. I just want to point out that there are much better ways to deal with what is going on.
Okay, so, I haven't tried the HEs yet, but looking over things, none of the RAD methods mentioned really hold a handle to random queues BUT for anyone who's been around for a long time and has a lot of random currency they never used, holy heck are you going to have a time; all of those useless abandoned treasures from the River District? BAM. Suddenly RADs, converted at a 20 RAD per ratio. Riches and treasures? Also suddenly valuable.
Each 1 treasure and 1 riches earns you 40. That means each 1 riches is basically 20 RAD. So that means fishing in chult is suddenly a possible way to generate revenue.
I am 100% sold on this.
Oh wow, Vorinblood can be converted to RAD too on a 20 RAD per basis.
Older campaigns than SKT seem to be pretty terrible at generating RAD though, so this does seem like it's weighted for more advanced players.
EDIT: Finally did a HE on preview. Got 250 RP. Which is nice, but not RAD. Miscommunication somewhere?
I noticed that too when I logged on. Campaign currencies (where I ground my bloody eyes out) will be my 'pay dirt'. Other than that it looks really limited at first glance. I didn't have any rAD options for the Demonic HEs I ran in WoD but it may just be in lieu of underdark rings or in conjunction. Might be just bad RNG but not sure.
> It's fair to say the Devs are trying to guide you into a specific playstyle. I was simply trying to explain what that playstyle is: run the random queues.
If that was the case there wouldn't be RAD on the Seals vendor, tradebar store, campaign stores and guild mark store. There also wouldn't be RAD from HEs and I wouldn't have said earlier in this thread that I would look into added RAD to the Barovian hunts.
We aren't trying to push players to any one type of content with this change. Random Queues were already a big part of many of the player bases RAD rewards and it makes sense they still would be after this change as it has a good chunk of RAD rewarded for the first run of the day.
Yes there is some issues with the amount other stuff than dungeons (not talking random queues, just regular dungeons here) give compared to everything else. But when that is said it seems I've missed a thing or two you've said like the part with the hunts, for that I apologize I need to go back and read all of the thread again.
@noworries#8859 One thing though. You said that HEs are supposed to drop RAD. Is this meant to be a 100% thing? I'm not asking about amount, but if this is supposed to always happen, happen the majority of the time or only rarely? Because from the ones I did last night the drop rate seems to be worse than the drop rate of RAD from xp overflow rewards. I did about 30 HEs, large and small, on various maps, and didn't see a single drop. (Which was why I didn't realize it was supposed to happen until I read this.) Of course if this is not supposed to be the correct drop rate then we're looking at a bug, but that's a different issue altogether.
And now to read all of the ten pages of this thoroughly.
Logic is the beginning of wisdom, not the end of it.
@noworries#8859 I know this wasn't discussed here, but you really have to add more content for players. It like every new mod I play for few months then I lay off for few months cause I get tired of running the same things. I'm afriad a 5 man short skirmish won't last very long on my play time...
How about about adding difficulties to normal epic dungeon for example normal, hard, expert and giving different RAD and rewards for each difficulty (more or less the same concept you have with the cards in Barovia). That will be a huge addition to unplayed content for a lot of end game players without getting the boredom of running the same 3 dungeons all the time.
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adinosiiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,294Arc User
What bothers me is that on (unstated) intention seems to be to force players to do things "your way" ... specifically, rely on Random queues for a significant chunk of their rAD income.
Now, I have been getting my rAD from running hunts and ToNG with my friends....that's what I enjoy doing. Now you are making changes that basically force me to choose between getting less rewarded for things I enjoy, or do things I do not really enjoy for the rewards I want.
Bad choice...you might lose quite a few players if those changes go live as they are.
One downside is that this now hurts Guilds, who need their members to donate this currency for the Guild to advance. Could there be a way to lessen the blow?
Learn more about Dungeons & Dragons tabletop at Alphastream.org.
One downside is that this now hurts Guilds, who need their members to donate this currency for the Guild to advance. Could there be a way to lessen the blow?
Gold creates that cost less gold to create than the submitted gold value?
My main problem and concern with these changes. There are two path in mmo dungeon making.
I. Harder, longer dungeons and raids with better loot. T3/T4? dungeons with good loot with worth more than 1-2-300k AD and has a length of 30-40-50mins...
II. Shorter, spammable, skirmish-like dungeons with loot with not really much price to sell. Think of Folly and batiri with the price of less than a hundred AD.
These changes are a step away from harder dungeons and one step toward shorter dungeons.
Everything which came from dungeon chests after the people opened that dungeon on live.will have no value in no time if you can try it 4 more times.
The last farmable thing: the UES prices will drop rapidly after a double enchantment event.
On the bright side it can be used for farming mandatory things like executioner arms from CR. And its an AD sink I admit it but AD sink should be fashions, more dyeing options, mount skins etc.
See, that is where you are wrong. It is not just the hunts, I mean even now it is easy to max your AD on your account quickly by doing dungeons, you don't have to do the hunts - yes it is far faster doing just the hunts but still. Now if you are only going to get like 4,000 AD for a full dungeon run.... Yeah, to get 100,000 AD is going to take bloody ages, ain't no one got time for that!
Let's pretend dungeon doesn't drop any purple pieces on the floor... beucase for me they don't most of the time You get 8-12k rad at the end of most dungeons depending on what pieces drop. The only exception being Tong that has a higher chance of giving you an extra 4-6k piece from the third boss With these changes RAD Gain is more porpotionate to the dungeon difficulties. Just the new skirmish gold is 4k.. Pretty easy to do and fast. Right now without counting random queues, if I were to do tong (best RAD dropper) It would take me 6 runs not counting Additional drops and seals. So since people are more lucky than me it means in 3-4 Tongs they are capped in daily RAD.
How is this fair or good? That means 1hr on gameplay... Now excuse me if I may, but how is it fair that playing 1hr a day then alt+f4 allows you to generate as much AD as people that play over 2hours? In most games casual players aren't and should be able to gain everything in the few hours they are able to spare a day. Otherwise there's no incentive for them to purchase anything and no incentive for other players to dedicate an extra amount of time to the game. The people that play a lot of hours, would be more enclined on making multiple accounts to hit this cap creating more AD generation. Instead of just playing the game normally. 1hour to cap your daily RAD is being ridiculous. That means I can potentially 'grind' for 30hrs and get a months worth of RAD in advance. Why would this ever be good? Why is it good to make AD so easy to gain that people log off after 1 hour of gameplay?
These changes are actually good. People just have a problem with changes regardless if its good or bad. Everyone is entitled to an opinion. But when people blab about 'Time to quit... its the end of the game'... as much as opinions aren't wrong... clearly those people are trying hard to disprove that logic.
OK @scorpioneitaa - I admire both your mathematic skills and wishfull thinking level here.
Lets pretend that everyone in game are Tong ready. Lets pretend that you and every1 else on server are able to finish 4xTONG and 1xNew skirmish in an 1 hour. Lets pretend that TONG will generate for them best drop according to your description above - 16k RAD x 4 and another 4k rAD form skirmish - its still its just 68k rAD here - random que bonus cannot aply here as it must be premade - to even try that, invoke rAD bonus is optional but even then its nowhere near to 100k AD cap. Especially if you play everyday you wont be abe to replenish invoke bonus fast enaugh.
So please think before you type something like that ok? And lets be honest here - if we try to talk serious here put "luck" aside OK?
What you described above is not impossible, but its very very hard to acomplish even for special super uber premade made for that. And I am talking MOD 14 here.
And no, new or casual players are unable to go Tong or even dream to finish this one. For most players the change will bring them less AD at their disposal as easier dungeons will bring less rewards. And best part is - they gona be happy with rerolls - until they gona run dry with rerol tokens.
With MOD 15 so far: Average eLOL rAD drop on preview - 5k average TONG - 8k per chest. Level up - 3k rAD Small HE - 100 rAD Big HE - guildies reported 300/500 rAD
Now, add to the chest a temptation, of reroll for the better - 1hr to fill 100k rAD limit in MOD 15 - good luck with that @scorpioneitaa
Bugs: Tomb of the Nine Gods chests -regular dungeon chest could not be opened (unknown cause) -was unable to apply reroll, despite character having copied dungeon keys from live server
I do not know if this was limited to Tomb or not, but it might be wise to check the chests of other dungeons. I can only imagine the rage of people that finish off discount dracula and then they can't open the chest for their Crown Seals.
The funny thing about all MMOs is that everybody has their own play-style. Some gamers play the content. Some gamers just want to farm. Some gamers are entrepreneurs building up in-game currancies for whatever reason. Some just want the thrill of PvP. My goodness! Just look at EVE Online and you'll see what I mean. "Diversity" is the key word here and Neverwinter is no exception. And so, if a gamer just wants to farm, what is that to you, oh self-righteous complainer?
You are free to play the game your way. At the very least, have the common decency to let other gamers do in Neverwinter what they find enjoyable. Now as for Astral Diamonds, some of you argue that "you don't need 100k of Astral Diamonds". Oh, really?
And who exactly are you to determine that?
Perhaps a new gamer "needs" a large amount of Astral Diamonds to buy that BiS Artifact or rare Mount to get their character up to meet the required end-game IL to progress. Perhaps a new gamer is so tired of getting their heads bitten off in-game by team-mates for being "under-geared for Demogorgon" that they desperately need the Astral Diamonds to upgrade everything in their character build to meet the perceived "community standard"... not to forget obtain and upgrade their "BiS-only" companion to Legendary and "properly" gear them up as well. (Don't bother denying it, I've been quietly watching far too much of general chat over the past few weeks. The Trolls are taking over and killing Neverwinter in the process.)
Don't be so quick to start dictating how much Astral Diamonds a gamer "needs" before you consider your own humble and n00bish beginnings... If your character is so maxed out that you want for nothing... Bravo! Good for you! But for the rest of us normal gamers just starting out, we NEED Astral Diamonds. Lots of them! Otherwise, there is no point in attempting any end-game content because we simply don't meet the IL to satisfy the other gamers who do.
"Talent is a flame. Genius is a fire." - Sir Bernard Williams
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theycallmetomuMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,861Arc User
The funny thing about all MMOs is that everybody has their own play-style. Some gamers play the content. Some gamers just want to farm. Some gamers are entrepreneurs building up in-game currancies for whatever reason. Some just want the thrill of PvP. My goodness! Just look at EVE Online and you'll see what I mean. "Diversity" is the key word here and Neverwinter is no exception. And so, if a gamer just wants to farm, what is that to you, oh self-righteous complainer?
You are free to play the game your way. At the very least, have the common decency to let other gamers do in Neverwinter what they find enjoyable. Now as for Astral Diamonds, some of you argue that "you don't need 100k of Astral Diamonds". Oh, really?
And who exactly are you to determine that?
Perhaps a new gamer "needs" a large amount of Astral Diamonds to buy that BiS Artifact or rare Mount to get their character up to meet the required end-game IL to progress. Perhaps a new gamer is so tired of getting their heads bitten off in-game by team-mates for being "under-geared for Demogorgon" that they desperately need the Astral Diamonds to upgrade everything in their character build to meet the perceived "community standard"... not to forget obtain and upgrade their "BiS-only" companion to Legendary and "properly" gear them up as well. (Don't bother denying it, I've been quietly watching far too much of general chat over the past few weeks. The Trolls are taking over and killing Neverwinter in the process.)
Don't be so quick to start dictating how much Astral Diamonds a gamer "needs" before you consider your own humble and n00bish beginnings... If your character is so maxed out that you want for nothing... Bravo! Good for you! But for the rest of us normal gamers just starting out, we NEED Astral Diamonds. Lots of them! Otherwise, there is no point in attempting any end-game content because we simply don't meet the IL to satisfy the other gamers who do.
You "need" as much AD is is necessary to be competitive. What that means is that, if the economic system is such that the majority of players have leadership armies because the majority of players have leadership armies, then you're going to have to have a leadership army.
Reducing the total amount of AD players have access to really isn't that big of a deal; NW doesn't have a system for borrowing money, so the normal deflationary issues are less detrimental to the economic system. Rather, the issue with reducing the AD players get is an issue of people who have a lot of AD having more purchasing power after the adjustment.
But just how much do the players that have a lot of AD have in actual AD? Theoretically, if players get 100k per day, and the max AD cap is 100 mil, that means that even the most ridiculously rich player would be worth 1000 players. That's a lot. Does the market really have those players? Or do they have material assets (I mean in terms of things of value, not profession assets) that have value? If AD supply drops, so too will the book value of those material assets.
The real question is, what methods of getting AD are less effective relative to other methods. Running a bunch of dungeons is now a lot less profitable than it was before. A lot of other play methods are more profitable. So really, are people upset by the attempt to control the money supply, or upset that dungeons are no longer going to be the most profitable play? Because again: if other players aren't making as much money, that means that the things players buy from eachother will become nominally cheaper.
Of course, there's a few exceptions. Anything that costs zen is pegged to the price of zen. So anything from the zen shop is going to become more expensive in real terms, because the zen is capped at 500 per.
Comments
Dead🔪Each 1 treasure and 1 riches earns you 40. That means each 1 riches is basically 20 RAD. So that means fishing in chult is suddenly a possible way to generate revenue.
I am 100% sold on this.
Oh wow, Vorinblood can be converted to RAD too on a 20 RAD per basis.
Older campaigns than SKT seem to be pretty terrible at generating RAD though, so this does seem like it's weighted for more advanced players.
EDIT: Finally did a HE on preview. Got 250 RP. Which is nice, but not RAD. Miscommunication somewhere?
#1: Campaign/Legendary key opens then chest, and then rerolling is FREE?
Or:
#2: Campaign/Legendary key opens the chest, then rerolling is done with "Reroll Token" (Daily/VIP key) even for Campaign/Legendary Chest, or AD?
#3: Campaign/Legendary key opens the chest, then rerolling is done with AD only because the Daily/VIP Reroll Tokens don't work on Campaign/Legendary chests because those are not Campaign/Legendary keys you're converting?
I *think* you mean #2 - reroll tokens allow reroll of all chests, even ones that take a key to open - but I'd like to be sure.
You're nerfing the ability to move RAD to alt characters/alt accounts by removing salvage and having RAD go straight onto the toon that earns it instead of handing it off to whoever has the biggest remaining prayer boost. You nerfed the ability to farm Random Levelling on many toons, instead rewarding only the first run of the day. You're nerfing Leadership and the massive RP gain from swapping toons and clicking all day, instead making running content more profitable and running Gathering require resources (Gold! That has a USE!) from running the game.
I don't think you're pushing players towards any particular type of content, no. I think you're pushing players, HARD, towards "Any Content At All". You're steadily, in this patch and past, removing the perverse incentives that made NOT playing a more profitable use of time than playing.
And to be clear, I like it. These economy changes are all sensible steps, and while they're nerfing lots of currently-and-until-recently-quite-profitable things like "having a ton of alts to run Leadership and salvage purchased gear", it was always weird that I got a serious material advantage from having 20 characters I didn't play over someone who had only one character that they did.
(But while I'm praising these changes as great and well-thought-out: can you drop a line to the character rebalance team that maybe nerfing the DO DC into unplayability is not a good solution to the 4-support-1-DPS meta, since now everyone will just run 1 AC DC and 3 other support toons with their 1 DPS and now lowbie DCs have no good builds?)
Although, if the goal was *just* to make the characters you run be the ones that get bonuses, there'd be no reason to make the RAD rewards from running dungeons any less than the salvage value you got from dungeons before.
Also, as I mentioned in the professions section-if the goal was to discourage you from having value from 2000 charaters, then it'd make more sense to have morale and artisans available be account wide.
This:
Dead🔪sharandar 150 crescents
DR 100 vanguard scrip
underdark 100 demonic ichor
tod 100 dragon coins
SKT 50 voniblod
icewind dale 20 konig coin 1 aurils tear 1 dwarf gold
cloaked ascendancy 50 abandoned treasures
chult 25 chultan riches and 25 omuan treasures
ravenloft 50 barovian coins
I think the thing to keep in mind here I think would be how much time does it take to play the game to get these. In some cases the currencies involved aren't used to complete the campaign at all(barovian coins,chultan riches,omuan treasures, demonic ichor). For previous mods Chult and Barovia those currencies got salvageable gear so it makes sense I guess for RAD to only come from them and I'm not sure there is way to grind them like voninblod.
the icewind dale one for example you can only get 3 tears and 3 gold each day so there is an inherent limit of 3k RAD per day per toon with that one. That probably is the way to go I think. Something that is self-limiting if it potentially could be taken advantagle of. I also think something that the content would take about a half hour would be a good sweet spot for this.
dungeons would still be better though and they should be
Dead🔪I imagine you will still complain and tell me to stop lecturing players on how they spend their time. Even if they do spend it foolishly.
Play the game and have fun! This I command! LOL
I just want to say that these recent changes to "fix the economy" are aimed at players generating/refining RAD.
The problem is:
The players that have absurd amounts of AD didn't get it by salvaging gear and refining RAD. The super rich players in Neverwinter aren't using the methods that you are adjusting.
The Knox companion was a cool idea. There are a million other ways you can implement things like that (small AD sinks) simultaneously. That one time thing isn't going to change the economy, but enough of that stuff very well could.
You could even make AD sinks that require continual investment.
You could add RNG AD sinks that are incorporated into every single new piece of gear.
You could add tons of expensive "one-time only" fashion sets/pieces.
You could add HUGE AD sinks that increase your chances (RNG) of getting bound things like the Shadowstalker +5s. It is ridiculous that many players will never have that ring, no matter how much money they throw at you (or AD they use). Think about that, it is a very good example of what I am arguing here.
Players will pay for these things. With enough effort, and carefully placed sinks, you could actually make some changes to the economy.
Nerfing the players "living in poverty", is not going to do much to the economy.
Personally, I don't really care what changes happen to the AD, RAD, or the economy. I haven't been playing that often lately. However, I am just pointing out the simple fact that you are "adjusting" the wrong parts of the economy, in my opinion.
I really do like Neverwinter. This comment is not to bash the development team. I just want to point out that there are much better ways to deal with what is going on.
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@noworries#8859 One thing though. You said that HEs are supposed to drop RAD. Is this meant to be a 100% thing? I'm not asking about amount, but if this is supposed to always happen, happen the majority of the time or only rarely? Because from the ones I did last night the drop rate seems to be worse than the drop rate of RAD from xp overflow rewards. I did about 30 HEs, large and small, on various maps, and didn't see a single drop. (Which was why I didn't realize it was supposed to happen until I read this.)
Of course if this is not supposed to be the correct drop rate then we're looking at a bug, but that's a different issue altogether.
And now to read all of the ten pages of this thoroughly.
I know this wasn't discussed here, but you really have to add more content for players. It like every new mod I play for few months then I lay off for few months cause I get tired of running the same things. I'm afriad a 5 man short skirmish won't last very long on my play time...
How about about adding difficulties to normal epic dungeon for example normal, hard, expert and giving different RAD and rewards for each difficulty (more or less the same concept you have with the cards in Barovia). That will be a huge addition to unplayed content for a lot of end game players without getting the boredom of running the same 3 dungeons all the time.
Now, I have been getting my rAD from running hunts and ToNG with my friends....that's what I enjoy doing. Now you are making changes that basically force me to choose between getting less rewarded for things I enjoy, or do things I do not really enjoy for the rewards I want.
Bad choice...you might lose quite a few players if those changes go live as they are.
SHE in barovia
BHE in barovia
T3s in strongholds
Fbi, mspc, tong
Anyone let me know, thanks
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There are two path in mmo dungeon making.
I. Harder, longer dungeons and raids with better loot.
T3/T4? dungeons with good loot with worth more than 1-2-300k AD and has a length of 30-40-50mins...
II. Shorter, spammable, skirmish-like dungeons with loot with not really much price to sell.
Think of Folly and batiri with the price of less than a hundred AD.
These changes are a step away from harder dungeons and one step toward shorter dungeons.
Everything which came from dungeon chests after the people opened that dungeon on live.will have no value in no time if you can try it 4 more times.
The last farmable thing: the UES prices will drop rapidly after a double enchantment event.
On the bright side it can be used for farming mandatory things like executioner arms from CR.
And its an AD sink I admit it but AD sink should be fashions, more dyeing options, mount skins etc.
Lets pretend that everyone in game are Tong ready.
Lets pretend that you and every1 else on server are able to finish 4xTONG and 1xNew skirmish in an 1 hour.
Lets pretend that TONG will generate for them best drop according to your description above - 16k RAD x 4 and another 4k rAD form skirmish - its still its just 68k rAD here - random que bonus cannot aply here as it must be premade - to even try that, invoke rAD bonus is optional but even then its nowhere near to 100k AD cap. Especially if you play everyday you wont be abe to replenish invoke bonus fast enaugh.
So please think before you type something like that ok?
And lets be honest here - if we try to talk serious here put "luck" aside OK?
What you described above is not impossible, but its very very hard to acomplish even for special super uber premade made for that. And I am talking MOD 14 here.
And no, new or casual players are unable to go Tong or even dream to finish this one. For most players the change will bring them less AD at their disposal as easier dungeons will bring less rewards. And best part is - they gona be happy with rerolls - until they gona run dry with rerol tokens.
With MOD 15 so far:
Average eLOL rAD drop on preview - 5k average TONG - 8k per chest.
Level up - 3k rAD
Small HE - 100 rAD
Big HE - guildies reported 300/500 rAD
Now, add to the chest a temptation, of reroll for the better - 1hr to fill 100k rAD limit in MOD 15 - good luck with that @scorpioneitaa
-regular dungeon chest could not be opened (unknown cause)
-was unable to apply reroll, despite character having copied dungeon keys from live server
I do not know if this was limited to Tomb or not, but it might be wise to check the chests of other dungeons. I can only imagine the rage of people that finish off discount dracula and then they can't open the chest for their Crown Seals.
You are free to play the game your way. At the very least, have the common decency to let other gamers do in Neverwinter what they find enjoyable. Now as for Astral Diamonds, some of you argue that "you don't need 100k of Astral Diamonds". Oh, really?
And who exactly are you to determine that?
Perhaps a new gamer "needs" a large amount of Astral Diamonds to buy that BiS Artifact or rare Mount to get their character up to meet the required end-game IL to progress. Perhaps a new gamer is so tired of getting their heads bitten off in-game by team-mates for being "under-geared for Demogorgon" that they desperately need the Astral Diamonds to upgrade everything in their character build to meet the perceived "community standard"... not to forget obtain and upgrade their "BiS-only" companion to Legendary and "properly" gear them up as well. (Don't bother denying it, I've been quietly watching far too much of general chat over the past few weeks. The Trolls are taking over and killing Neverwinter in the process.)
Don't be so quick to start dictating how much Astral Diamonds a gamer "needs" before you consider your own humble and n00bish beginnings... If your character is so maxed out that you want for nothing... Bravo! Good for you! But for the rest of us normal gamers just starting out, we NEED Astral Diamonds. Lots of them! Otherwise, there is no point in attempting any end-game content because we simply don't meet the IL to satisfy the other gamers who do.
Reducing the total amount of AD players have access to really isn't that big of a deal; NW doesn't have a system for borrowing money, so the normal deflationary issues are less detrimental to the economic system. Rather, the issue with reducing the AD players get is an issue of people who have a lot of AD having more purchasing power after the adjustment.
But just how much do the players that have a lot of AD have in actual AD? Theoretically, if players get 100k per day, and the max AD cap is 100 mil, that means that even the most ridiculously rich player would be worth 1000 players. That's a lot. Does the market really have those players? Or do they have material assets (I mean in terms of things of value, not profession assets) that have value? If AD supply drops, so too will the book value of those material assets.
The real question is, what methods of getting AD are less effective relative to other methods. Running a bunch of dungeons is now a lot less profitable than it was before. A lot of other play methods are more profitable. So really, are people upset by the attempt to control the money supply, or upset that dungeons are no longer going to be the most profitable play? Because again: if other players aren't making as much money, that means that the things players buy from eachother will become nominally cheaper.
Of course, there's a few exceptions. Anything that costs zen is pegged to the price of zen. So anything from the zen shop is going to become more expensive in real terms, because the zen is capped at 500 per.