There are exceptions to that. msva is acceptable. Mob life isn't really that high in there to begin with. And since I haven't really cared much to speed up unlocking tong I can't speak on that. I really focus on single target myself. Can't really care for mob life but I do put effort into it in msp. Another exception is when you run with the same group of players over and over you do get a feel for it and can gage when someone has simply jumped a skill gap.
I am curious as to what paragon path most of you are playing at end game. Is is SS or MoF? With loadouts, do you go swap over your abilities or to another build to ensure you do not take as much of a damage loss on bosses?
I am asking this as I seen a post here talking about Thaum/Opp. Which I think is great for mobs but when you go to take on a boss you better be setup with AoC and not Icy Vein. Also, going to MoF on bosses can help increase your damage from Smolder. It may seem on the light side but when you play to mechanics smolder can be ticking away and helping your DPS out. Another factor is abilities used, are you still using the abilities that are AoE on a boss vs Single target abilities. I have seen some CW continue to use Steal Time on single target when another ability would have been more effective.
Another thing to consider is critical severity and its diminishing returns. Using a Trans Vorpal over another enchantment could lead to some damage loss.
There are so many variables and with each variable in this game there typically is a cost around getting what you want.
I currently only run dps loadouts as thaum ss, usually sticking with high hp with or without an op (240k hp)
This gets expensive, as to truely optimize, you need at least two different weapon/enchant sets and armour chest pieces.
AS the gear progress and the armors have more hit points the 50k hp armor (psion's shroud ) becomes less important.
That's true, but in mod12 it's still the best choice (assuming you've got a pally buddy) unless executioner's is fixed now? Even then with the amount of aggro I pull I'm still not sure executioner's will be best.
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zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
Please leave CWs alone. We're in a good place right now. If one is suffering on their CW, I definitely suggest to take a look at your feat, power, boon, and gear choices and get advice from guides and other players on your current build.
Idk zebular... everything a renegade can do, a ranger can do better. Everything a thaum can do (damage), rangers and GWF's can do better. The only stand out build is MoF debuffer.
Don't get me wrong, it's not like the other classes are THAT much better....but they are better.
Please leave CWs alone. We're in a good place right now. If one is suffering on their CW, I definitely suggest to take a look at your feat, power, boon, and gear choices and get advice from guides and other players on your current build.
This. So much this. As for overall perfomance, CW is one of the 3 dominant dps classes with the other 2 being HR and GWF, no need for buffs (that would make it broken overpowered), Sharpedpge, Freedom and other CWs have proved CWs can hit very hard in both aoe and single target dps, like I said on an older message (I think someone else did as well), if they can do what why can't you? Same class, same avaialable gear so it isn't CW being underpowered, it is the player doing something (or quite a few things) wrong.
> @jaime4312#3760 said: > yyyPlease leave CWs alone. We're in a good place right now. If one is suffering on their CW, I definitely suggest to take a look at your feat, power, boon, and gear choices and get advice from guides and other players on your current build. > > This. So much this. As for overall perfomance, CW is one of the 3 dominant dps classes with the other 2 being HR and GWF, no need for buffs (that would make it broken overpowered), Sharpedpge, Freedom and other CWs have proved CWs can hit very hard in both aoe and single target dps, like I said on an older message (I think someone else did as well), if they can do what why can't you? Same class, same avaialable gear so it isn't CW being underpowered, it is the player doing something (or quite a few things) wrong.
I completely agree with this. CW's are amazing right now and a lot of people don't see it that way. With their debuffs being so potent your less likely to hear someone ask for a dps cw. But the CW's I have seen do amazing dps shows the class on a really great place right now.
Please leave CWs alone. We're in a good place right now. If one is suffering on their CW, I definitely suggest to take a look at your feat, power, boon, and gear choices and get advice from guides and other players on your current build.
My good side agrees with you, because there were definitely worse times and most of the examples are trying at the top-end party optimalisations, which is actually a very insignificant part. Yes, there's always a best combination of 5 class and yes, 4 class (or 5) is always gonna be out of it. But not being the part in that edge does not means the whole class is bad and needs to change.
My evil side still looks at the "CW feat choices" part and just laughs, laughs and laughs...
For those complaining about damage have you tried playing the MoF path as a DPS. It is not only for playing as a buffer/debuffer.
I tried to play my CW as a SS many times and I simply cannot produce the same damage I deal with my MoF CW, especially at end game content.
When I play older content I find that SS does better damage due to high burst for lower end content but for the later content where enemies have more health and take a bit longer to kill, MoF seems to perform better due to the DoT from smolder.
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mamalion1234Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,415Arc User
For those complaining about damage have you tried playing the MoF path as a DPS. It is not only for playing as a buffer/debuffer.
I tried to play my CW as a SS many times and I simply cannot produce the same damage I deal with my MoF CW, especially at end game content.
When I play older content I find that SS does better damage due to high burst for lower end content but for the later content where enemies have more health and take a bit longer to kill, MoF seems to perform better due to the DoT from smolder.
For those complaining about damage have you tried playing the MoF path as a DPS. It is not only for playing as a buffer/debuffer.
I tried to play my CW as a SS many times and I simply cannot produce the same damage I deal with my MoF CW, especially at end game content.
When I play older content I find that SS does better damage due to high burst for lower end content but for the later content where enemies have more health and take a bit longer to kill, MoF seems to perform better due to the DoT from smolder.
especially on bosses is top:)
MoF with 100% critical chance with Critical Conflag slotted you have smolder up 100% of the time. It is a constant DoT. It also grants 20% crit serverity. This allows you to use another weapon enchantment that is not a Vorpal or Dread. All allowing for more damage, especially on single targets.
Now Icy Vein vs. Abyss of Chaos, well Abyss of Chaos better be the one you are using when going against bosses as that will allow you to add to your damage since Icy Vein only makes gaining chill stacks faster and on boss you don't need quicker chill stacks. What you need is more damage.
I ran with some good SS CW that use Thaum/Opp build. They did more damage than I did until we got to the boss. Damage wise on bosses, I always did more damage than them as a MoF.
Aren't TR and CW the only two classes with DPS path that offers no meaningful party buff? I suppose MoF Thaum with swath could be somewhat useful if debuff not already at soft cap.
Aren't TR and CW the only two classes with DPS path that offers no meaningful party buff? I suppose MoF Thaum with swath could be somewhat useful if debuff not already at soft cap.
Ray of enfeeblement in single target? Some CWs split points between icy veins and frigid winds on their aoe loadout. Also, the bitter cold debuff on an aoe loadout.
But yeah, for the standard dps builds (SS thaum) CWs don't offer much in terms of party utility.
Ray of enfeeblement in single target? Some CWs split points between icy veins and frigid winds on their aoe loadout. Also, the bitter cold debuff on an aoe loadout.
But yeah, for the standard dps builds (SS thaum) CWs don't offer much in terms of party utility.
Perhaps DPS path should offer some kind of party buff/utility.
Ray of enfeeblement in single target? Some CWs split points between icy veins and frigid winds on their aoe loadout. Also, the bitter cold debuff on an aoe loadout.
But yeah, for the standard dps builds (SS thaum) CWs don't offer much in terms of party utility.
Perhaps DPS path should offer some kind of party buff/utility.
If you go Rene, the Capstone gives party utility. The companion you use (sword trio) gives party utility. Some feats in Rene, and Oppressor give party utility. Artifacts give party utility (i.e. Lantern). Mounts and Insignia bonuses give party utility.
Ray of enfeeblement in single target? Some CWs split points between icy veins and frigid winds on their aoe loadout. Also, the bitter cold debuff on an aoe loadout.
But yeah, for the standard dps builds (SS thaum) CWs don't offer much in terms of party utility.
Perhaps DPS path should offer some kind of party buff/utility.
If you go Rene, the Capstone gives party utility. The companion you use (sword trio) gives party utility. Some feats in Rene, and Oppressor give party utility. Artifacts give party utility (i.e. Lantern). Mounts and Insignia bonuses give party utility.
Slowed, stunned, frozen mobs give party utility.
Learning how to dodge, gives party utility...
Killing mobs fast give party utility.
I said DPS path. Mof rene is in a very good place. And there's no need for two renes in a party.
SS is the DPS path. I doubt you will see too many 2 cw 5 man groups. With the upcoming bonding nerf, you may...may, see more Rene/Thaum SS dps. Personally I am trying my best to stay Thaum/Rene SS if I can balance my crit and maintain my high HP build.
Post edited by niadan on
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lukejones77Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 282Arc User
Please leave CWs alone. We're in a good place right now. If one is suffering on their CW, I definitely suggest to take a look at your feat, power, boon, and gear choices and get advice from guides and other players on your current build.
This. So much this. As for overall perfomance, CW is one of the 3 dominant dps classes with the other 2 being HR and GWF, no need for buffs (that would make it broken overpowered), Sharpedpge, Freedom and other CWs have proved CWs can hit very hard in both aoe and single target dps, like I said on an older message (I think someone else did as well), if they can do what why can't you? Same class, same avaialable gear so it isn't CW being underpowered, it is the player doing something (or quite a few things) wrong.
"CW is one of the 3 dominant classes" is one way to put it. Another to state it is that the top two classes far outshine the bottom 3, and CW is not in the top 2. Fact is, relative to the top 2 classes, the bottom 3 need some DEV love.
Now, I appreciate that the top CWs are happy people. I appreciate that the game is working for them. I also appreciate that the game is dominated by buffs and debuffs in a way that outshines class differences.
Knowing a run really really well (always striking at the right time with the best powers you have and the best buffs active within the party) makes a *huge* difference. I suspect few people on the planet understand buffs/debuffs as well as Sharp. Suggestions along the lines of "Sharp wandered onto preview with Unforgiven and proved that CW DPS is not a class issue" is just lolz. Let them go head to head today where Sharp looks something like Unforgiven here: https://youtube.com/watch?v=itEmlbiRWFk&t=1478s , and I'll really take notice.
Context is everything: - The CW as a buff/debuff support class is just fine. The very different DPS CW role is really struggling to be seen as viable for new content. - Yes, you've seen CWs do amazing damage. Sure. Thing is though, there are 2 far better class options for DPS, so when the latest tough content comes out, the DPS CW is out in the cold. Yeah, a guild/friend team can boost them, or any DPS class for that matter - until they nerf what's currently happening with buffs. Fact is, though, friends aside, the DPS CW is not a competitive option for new content. - Is being a competitive option within DPS classes so important? Yes!!! Didn't used to be, but as of the last couple of modules a large number of people switched to playing GWF. Add to that all the x2 RP events and easy top-line gear, and the problem isn't just a few BIS running around - it's an toxic endemic that is ruining module releases. This must be the most under-played, disjoint module release ever. - Top CWs happy, telling us to re-gear and follow Sharp's advice? Well, the Sharp advice is a bit dated, though you can see the up-to-date, top-of-line, Sharp-accredited Mystik youtube version here: https://youtube.com/watch?v=P6haS9bEUR8. Fact is, a lot of CWs are this, or close to it, but not seeing results that make them a top line DPS alternative option for new content. Check carefully the number of pots and foods consumed by Mystik, just casually standing there, perfectly balanced with 80K power.
Top CWs, I know you're brilliant players, you understand your runs really well, you time well, and, most importantly, you know exactly how to play those critical buffs and debuffs (which are more important than class differences). Maybe just consider what the wider game is like, for more casual players that don' have your sharp-edged understandings that deliver a critically better result. Just check the playing landscape and consider where balance sits across the various DPS options - all else being equal. Really, your achievements go far deeper than your class and gear/build options, and it's simply not a fair sell for viability to the wider player base.
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zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
edited September 2017
My main CW is a SS renegade. His build has rarely changed since the beginning of the game. I don't claim to be a Top CW player, in fact I am no where near the top. I play casually, very casually as of late. Heck, I'm barely over 10k IL on him and I do just fine in most content. Yeah, I don't PvP nor have any desire to so if this feeling of CW inadequacy is over PvP, then that is a whole different ball-game to me. I also play mostly solo content but even the group content, I have little worries but then again, I have never cared for out-dpsing other players. If others you play with care so much that you're not out-dpsing them, then I suggest to find different players to play with. There's no reason to be competitive with the DPS chart in PvE content.
If you're having a hard time on your CW, then instead of calling foul on the class, I suggest to make a new thread in the CW Class forum where you detail your character's chosen stats, feats, boons, skill rotation, and equipment choice and ask for advice on where to improve.
Edit: I don't even go for any current meta for the class. I stick to a theme of lightning and arcane, which I have done so since Alpha. I rarely even use any frost abilities which are so commonly seen with the dps-focused players. I will only slot Chill Strike when I am in a Dungeon. Otherwise, I stick to purely Lightning/Arcane stuff. So, coming from me who doesn't even follow a high dpsing spec and has below average IL for being around since the beginning, I still am quite capable of holding my own in most content.
How can you want more dps when you won't put the time in to get it. Don't speak for the casual crowd because casuals will never have top dps. That's why we see so many trash gwfs now. The class is so easy to play yet people STILL suck at it. You don't have to be Sharp to maximize damage but you do have to be alert and knowledgeable. The thing about it is if one can do it why can't you? Why does this have to be about top players vs casual when you aren't putting enough into your craft to generate the amount of dps that others can. I remember in mod 8 I believe was the rise of trapper hr. Before then we were overcoming all the bs that our class had subpar/decent damage and then out of the blue Sume and a few others came out with their builds. Suddenly hrs are kicking names and taking butt like never before because we adapted and learned. Hell I was so bent on getting my dps up there I was throwing money into the game, simultaneously farming, theory crafting, rereading sharp's dated guides(even though I play hr), hell even meditating (a bit too much). My point is that when someone showed us what we could do our paradigm as a whole shifted. Your top CW's showed you guys what you could do and only a few individuals paradigm has shifted. So is the problem the actual class itself or the people that might not be putting the actual work in? It might be both but after running with sharp, lailach, and the occasional random cw in msva that comes out of nowhere on the charts, I know for a fact that the cw class is very capable and people aren't performing at the level they are capable of performing. Same goes to the trs. Never in my life have I seen a tr one shot mobs in msp and FBI until I ran with a certain someone, and THEIR dps was supposed to be lower. A lot of people run to gwfs because they are so easy to play, maybe that's true but they don't think about the other classes potential. Just because it's easier for a gwf to get there doesn't mean that the cw can't. And for what it's worth its probably better proving that the cw can in order to reverse this current paradigm that CW's are only good buffers. Before they fixed piercing blades on hr I was hell bent on beating top trappers with similar gear. It was tough af. One missed flurry was an incredible dps drop. One failed dodge, one missed rotation was a loss. I was able to do it just barely but I still changed the paradigm at least for myself that combat could keep up. I course it was rare but I knew I could do it. I would challenge top hrs to racing me constantly just so I could grow and learn and compare. I don't do it much anymore and I rarely play now but the point is I proved a so called second to trapper combat dps spec could do it and this was before the change. So many freaking variations outside the norm spec in order to keep up or win but it was worth it. If you want easy dps go play a gwf or gf but if you want to hone in and be a class specialist and do more than just the average CW's dps then learn your class. You guys are so beast that I actually have been working on a pocket cw and was saving up a lightning enchant for him until the enchant changes came about. It sucks that very few see how capable this class is. Or maybe it's just me overlooking.
@niadan thanks man. Probably went a bit over the top but I mean everything I said. The class is so capable. I've seen multiple people use it in a way that's beyond the norm. Maybe they should buff the class but at the end of the day casual dps will always be casual dps. And who really wants that? How will that help when the player would still be lackluster
My main CW is a SS renegade. His build has rarely changed since the beginning of the game. I don't claim to be a Top CW player, in fact I am no where near the top. I play casually, very casually as of late. Heck, I'm barely over 10k IL on him and I do just fine in most content. Yeah, I don't PvP nor have any desire to so if this feeling of CW inadequacy is over PvP, then that is a whole different ball-game to me. I also play mostly solo content but even the group content, I have little worries but then again, I have never cared for out-dpsing other players. If others you play with care so much that you're not out-dpsing them, then I suggest to find different players to play with. There's no reason to be competitive with the DPS chart in PvE content.
If you're having a hard time on your CW, then instead of calling foul on the class, I suggest to make a new thread in the CW Class forum where you detail your character's chosen stats, feats, boons, skill rotation, and equipment choice and ask for advice on where to improve.
Edit: I don't even go for any current meta for the class. I stick to a theme of lightning and arcane, which I have done so since Alpha. I rarely even use any frost abilities which are so commonly seen with the dps-focused players. I will only slot Chill Strike when I am in a Dungeon. Otherwise, I stick to purely Lightning/Arcane stuff. So, coming from me who doesn't even follow a high dpsing spec and has below average IL for being around since the beginning, I still am quite capable of holding my own in most content.
Just because you enjoy a playstyle that's "unique" doesn't mean there isn't issues with the class or that the enjoyment of others that prefer some competitive aspects aren't worth listening to.
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lukejones77Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 282Arc User
How can you want more dps when you won't put the time in to get it. ..... Hell I was so bent on getting my dps up there I was throwing money into the game, simultaneously farming, theory crafting, rereading sharp's dated guides(even though I play hr), hell even meditating (a bit too much). .... I don't do it much anymore and I rarely play now but the point is I proved. .... My point is that when someone showed us what we could do our paradigm as a whole shifted. Your top CW's showed you guys what you could do and only a few individuals paradigm has shifted. So is the problem the actual class itself or the people that might not be putting the actual work in?
I love your idea of "putting the actual work in", and lets play that out. We rock up to Neverwinter, one of the grindiest MMOs, gear up in our class equipment and "get to work" earning astral diamonds. Thing is, some classes are effectively been paid at a much higher rate than others for their work. Their tools are simply easier and more effective to work with. It's dangerous work, and their protective clothing is a lot better. There's a chart that shows work effectiveness, and they look really, really good on that chart, in part because they're naturally a lot faster at getting to the work and largely completing it before the slower classes get a chance. Then the day comes when the work gets tough. The previous work was easy, and the work crew was happy to take anyone along and get the job done. Yeah, certain classes were naturally gifted on that performance chart, and the company bonuses favoured them with reward drops, but it was ok...ish.
Now, it's different. Now the work is harder, and it takes longer. Now, to get through the massive grind of all the work that has to done, work crews are taking far more notice of those performance charts. You're starting to see very clear patterns of viable work crews being formed. They're built for success, cutting down on the total grind time of the work, and certain classes of worker are clearly missing from those successful work parties. Could the gaps really be that bad? Why would the company that hands out the work give certain classes of worker such inferior tools to other classes, and make it so much harder for them to go off on their own and do overtime without needing a full work crew? It's problematic. They know that when they take away good tools and give out bad ones, workers quit. Workers get used to their working conditions, and do not put up with having them taken away. The other thing is that you can get the best tools by buying them off the company. If you're a struggling class worker, you're a lot more likely to spend your money, trying to be a viable worker that gets to enjoy doing their work. Turns out, this is the big trick for the company. Their business is all about getting workers to buy better tools, but not making the tools so bad that the workers leave the company.
Of course, amongst those depressed worker classes, there are some shining examples. These workers stand out far above their depressed brethren, having learned to deal with tools that perform much more poorly, having learned to get every inch out of those tools, having worked hard to get the very latest and best models of the tools available to their class. Above all, they've learned how best to synergize with other classes and look a lot better on that performance chart. Now, I'm all for doing those things that the shining class examples do. But, I am concerned if people point to the shining examples of the class, saying "See? There! Those few workers are doing just fine. Your class tools are just fine. You just need to work harder. I know it looks easy for the other classes, but if you work long enough, perhaps pay for better tools, and study enough with your tools" you can get there." The shining examples are happy. They enjoy their work, do it well, and they're famous for it. The wider the gap between them and the average worker, the more famous they are. They are famous. Thing is, their class does have a problem - that's the reason they're famous in the first place. The company loves them too. The more workers that believe all they need is better tools to be like the shining examples, the better the company does selling better tools. The danger is, when those workers figure out that best tools was only part of the equation, and they're sitting with a large gap, having to invest far more than they realized - in what was supposed to be a fun work place.
Personally, I like working hard on my class, and I even refused to join work crews that used to have this "perma bubble" tool in the past. Problem is though, the scene I described doesn't make for healthy work place. Workers get disgruntled. They feel that their class is discriminated against. They're not a welcome part of the fun work crew place that the company said they provided. They stop coming to work. Oh , wait a minute - that's already happening...
LOL, I know I sound like a union rep here - very much not my intention (just how the word "class" plays out), but perhaps just spend a little time thinking about the bigger picture? If the company creates equal opportunity for hard workers to be successful, you'll have a far healthier work place, with far less class discrimination, and less reason for workers to leave the company to go "work" elsewhere.
Comments
I am asking this as I seen a post here talking about Thaum/Opp. Which I think is great for mobs but when you go to take on a boss you better be setup with AoC and not Icy Vein. Also, going to MoF on bosses can help increase your damage from Smolder. It may seem on the light side but when you play to mechanics smolder can be ticking away and helping your DPS out. Another factor is abilities used, are you still using the abilities that are AoE on a boss vs Single target abilities. I have seen some CW continue to use Steal Time on single target when another ability would have been more effective.
Another thing to consider is critical severity and its diminishing returns. Using a Trans Vorpal over another enchantment could lead to some damage loss.
There are so many variables and with each variable in this game there typically is a cost around getting what you want.
IMO, things always could be worst.
Aoe dps without op in party
Single target dps with op
Single target dps without op
Then the mof support loadouts
I currently only run dps loadouts as thaum ss, usually sticking with high hp with or without an op (240k hp)
This gets expensive, as to truely optimize, you need at least two different weapon/enchant sets and armour chest pieces.
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Don't get me wrong, it's not like the other classes are THAT much better....but they are better.
> yyyPlease leave CWs alone. We're in a good place right now. If one is suffering on their CW, I definitely suggest to take a look at your feat, power, boon, and gear choices and get advice from guides and other players on your current build.
>
> This. So much this. As for overall perfomance, CW is one of the 3 dominant dps classes with the other 2 being HR and GWF, no need for buffs (that would make it broken overpowered), Sharpedpge, Freedom and other CWs have proved CWs can hit very hard in both aoe and single target dps, like I said on an older message (I think someone else did as well), if they can do what why can't you? Same class, same avaialable gear so it isn't CW being underpowered, it is the player doing something (or quite a few things) wrong.
I completely agree with this. CW's are amazing right now and a lot of people don't see it that way. With their debuffs being so potent your less likely to hear someone ask for a dps cw. But the CW's I have seen do amazing dps shows the class on a really great place right now.
My evil side still looks at the "CW feat choices" part and just laughs, laughs and laughs...
I tried to play my CW as a SS many times and I simply cannot produce the same damage I deal with my MoF CW, especially at end game content.
When I play older content I find that SS does better damage due to high burst for lower end content but for the later content where enemies have more health and take a bit longer to kill, MoF seems to perform better due to the DoT from smolder.
MoF with 100% critical chance with Critical Conflag slotted you have smolder up 100% of the time. It is a constant DoT. It also grants 20% crit serverity. This allows you to use another weapon enchantment that is not a Vorpal or Dread. All allowing for more damage, especially on single targets.
Now Icy Vein vs. Abyss of Chaos, well Abyss of Chaos better be the one you are using when going against bosses as that will allow you to add to your damage since Icy Vein only makes gaining chill stacks faster and on boss you don't need quicker chill stacks. What you need is more damage.
I ran with some good SS CW that use Thaum/Opp build. They did more damage than I did until we got to the boss. Damage wise on bosses, I always did more damage than them as a MoF.
Some CWs split points between icy veins and frigid winds on their aoe loadout.
Also, the bitter cold debuff on an aoe loadout.
But yeah, for the standard dps builds (SS thaum) CWs don't offer much in terms of party utility.
Slowed, stunned, frozen mobs give party utility.
Learning how to dodge, gives party utility...
Killing mobs fast give party utility.
Now, I appreciate that the top CWs are happy people. I appreciate that the game is working for them. I also appreciate that the game is dominated by buffs and debuffs in a way that outshines class differences.
Knowing a run really really well (always striking at the right time with the best powers you have and the best buffs active within the party) makes a *huge* difference. I suspect few people on the planet understand buffs/debuffs as well as Sharp. Suggestions along the lines of "Sharp wandered onto preview with Unforgiven and proved that CW DPS is not a class issue" is just lolz. Let them go head to head today where Sharp looks something like Unforgiven here: https://youtube.com/watch?v=itEmlbiRWFk&t=1478s , and I'll really take notice.
Context is everything:
- The CW as a buff/debuff support class is just fine. The very different DPS CW role is really struggling to be seen as viable for new content.
- Yes, you've seen CWs do amazing damage. Sure. Thing is though, there are 2 far better class options for DPS, so when the latest tough content comes out, the DPS CW is out in the cold. Yeah, a guild/friend team can boost them, or any DPS class for that matter - until they nerf what's currently happening with buffs. Fact is, though, friends aside, the DPS CW is not a competitive option for new content.
- Is being a competitive option within DPS classes so important? Yes!!! Didn't used to be, but as of the last couple of modules a large number of people switched to playing GWF. Add to that all the x2 RP events and easy top-line gear, and the problem isn't just a few BIS running around - it's an toxic endemic that is ruining module releases. This must be the most under-played, disjoint module release ever.
- Top CWs happy, telling us to re-gear and follow Sharp's advice? Well, the Sharp advice is a bit dated, though you can see the up-to-date, top-of-line, Sharp-accredited Mystik youtube version here: https://youtube.com/watch?v=P6haS9bEUR8. Fact is, a lot of CWs are this, or close to it, but not seeing results that make them a top line DPS alternative option for new content. Check carefully the number of pots and foods consumed by Mystik, just casually standing there, perfectly balanced with 80K power.
Top CWs, I know you're brilliant players, you understand your runs really well, you time well, and, most importantly, you know exactly how to play those critical buffs and debuffs (which are more important than class differences). Maybe just consider what the wider game is like, for more casual players that don' have your sharp-edged understandings that deliver a critically better result. Just check the playing landscape and consider where balance sits across the various DPS options - all else being equal.
Really, your achievements go far deeper than your class and gear/build options, and it's simply not a fair sell for viability to the wider player base.
If you're having a hard time on your CW, then instead of calling foul on the class, I suggest to make a new thread in the CW Class forum where you detail your character's chosen stats, feats, boons, skill rotation, and equipment choice and ask for advice on where to improve.
Edit: I don't even go for any current meta for the class. I stick to a theme of lightning and arcane, which I have done so since Alpha. I rarely even use any frost abilities which are so commonly seen with the dps-focused players. I will only slot Chill Strike when I am in a Dungeon. Otherwise, I stick to purely Lightning/Arcane stuff. So, coming from me who doesn't even follow a high dpsing spec and has below average IL for being around since the beginning, I still am quite capable of holding my own in most content.
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Then the day comes when the work gets tough. The previous work was easy, and the work crew was happy to take anyone along and get the job done. Yeah, certain classes were naturally gifted on that performance chart, and the company bonuses favoured them with reward drops, but it was ok...ish.
Now, it's different. Now the work is harder, and it takes longer. Now, to get through the massive grind of all the work that has to done, work crews are taking far more notice of those performance charts. You're starting to see very clear patterns of viable work crews being formed. They're built for success, cutting down on the total grind time of the work, and certain classes of worker are clearly missing from those successful work parties.
Could the gaps really be that bad? Why would the company that hands out the work give certain classes of worker such inferior tools to other classes, and make it so much harder for them to go off on their own and do overtime without needing a full work crew? It's problematic. They know that when they take away good tools and give out bad ones, workers quit. Workers get used to their working conditions, and do not put up with having them taken away. The other thing is that you can get the best tools by buying them off the company. If you're a struggling class worker, you're a lot more likely to spend your money, trying to be a viable worker that gets to enjoy doing their work. Turns out, this is the big trick for the company. Their business is all about getting workers to buy better tools, but not making the tools so bad that the workers leave the company.
Of course, amongst those depressed worker classes, there are some shining examples. These workers stand out far above their depressed brethren, having learned to deal with tools that perform much more poorly, having learned to get every inch out of those tools, having worked hard to get the very latest and best models of the tools available to their class. Above all, they've learned how best to synergize with other classes and look a lot better on that performance chart.
Now, I'm all for doing those things that the shining class examples do. But, I am concerned if people point to the shining examples of the class, saying "See? There! Those few workers are doing just fine. Your class tools are just fine. You just need to work harder. I know it looks easy for the other classes, but if you work long enough, perhaps pay for better tools, and study enough with your tools" you can get there."
The shining examples are happy. They enjoy their work, do it well, and they're famous for it. The wider the gap between them and the average worker, the more famous they are. They are famous. Thing is, their class does have a problem - that's the reason they're famous in the first place. The company loves them too. The more workers that believe all they need is better tools to be like the shining examples, the better the company does selling better tools. The danger is, when those workers figure out that best tools was only part of the equation, and they're sitting with a large gap, having to invest far more than they realized - in what was supposed to be a fun work place.
Personally, I like working hard on my class, and I even refused to join work crews that used to have this "perma bubble" tool in the past. Problem is though, the scene I described doesn't make for healthy work place. Workers get disgruntled. They feel that their class is discriminated against. They're not a welcome part of the fun work crew place that the company said they provided. They stop coming to work.
Oh , wait a minute - that's already happening...
LOL, I know I sound like a union rep here - very much not my intention (just how the word "class" plays out), but perhaps just spend a little time thinking about the bigger picture? If the company creates equal opportunity for hard workers to be successful, you'll have a far healthier work place, with far less class discrimination, and less reason for workers to leave the company to go "work" elsewhere.