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Introducing the VIP Program

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    mark88arsitekmark88arsitek Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited August 2015
    PLEASE , PLEASE !! dont make this program buyable using ZEN! its dangerous ! farmers can buy this for their benefits or farmers get benefits from this.
    Please make it ONLY buyable using Creditcard/real money.
    please support the developer , you play this game, at least u must support them also,
    IF this program use ZEN, then mostly maybe player buying AD from ......
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    theycallmetomutheycallmetomu Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,861 Arc User
    I like the VIP - system. It kind of separates the users from the abusers. However, DO NOT make the VIP thing be buyable ingame. That way AD farmers cannot buy it and it can be used as an indicator of who is a f2p leech and who is a supporter of the game.

    Gee, sounds like your REAL complaint is the zen exchange itself.
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    suicidalgodotsuicidalgodot Member Posts: 2,465 Arc User
    Typically Cryptic. Not thought through, IMHO, as the benefits shut down other offered products.

    Makes me think the end is near...
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    drartwhodentdrartwhodent Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 305 Arc User
    Looks like a good deal to me.
    DON'T
    PANIC!
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    theycallmetomutheycallmetomu Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,861 Arc User
    I dunno man, the net player response seems to be uncharacteristically enthusiastic.

    The only problem is, well, the zen backlog has basically tripled since the announcement.
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    suicidalgodotsuicidalgodot Member Posts: 2,465 Arc User
    I like the VIP - system. It kind of separates the users from the abusers. However, DO NOT make the VIP thing be buyable ingame. That way AD farmers cannot buy it and it can be used as an indicator of who is a f2p leech and who is a supporter of the game.

    Gee, sounds like your REAL complaint is the zen exchange itself.

    ..his real complaint is that some people use their brains and in-game mechanisms to get stuff.
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    adent086adent086 Member Posts: 108 Arc User
    I support this move, in theory. I know its a surprise to some as I don't support much the devs have done lately. However, this I do support... in theory.

    This should bring in a substantial additional revenue stream from the game, on top of what was already being bled dry from it. So, there should be no more excuses anymore as to why the devs don't have enough time or resources to fix all of the bugs that have been lingering in the system for months/years.

    Of course, I also supported Artifact Equipment and Gear when it was just coming out..... in theory. And, we all know what a sadistically abusive regular flogging of the players that has turned into. So, what do I know?

    Peace all.
    Telling us about upcoming content updates, and getting those updates out the door BUG-FREE, is *AWESOME*!! Know what's even *MORE* awesome? Fixing game breaking bugs (and/or undocumented "features") that have been in EXISTING content for months/years!!! Guess which one makes me want to spend money on a game much more than the other? Hint: It's the "more awesome" one.
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    eldeskaleldeskal Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 214 Arc User
    I generally like it. I was looking for a way to support the game that didn't feel like paying to advance. So far, that's limited me to buying a bag, and waffling on an ioun stone. This lets me gamble a little on lockboxes, have a little additional HP (which is a godsend for a CW), and I'm super happy about the mail and travel to complement my "store" artifact.

    I am a little worried that there's an infinite-money engine in the 25% discount to buy GMOPs, and then the ability to convert those AD to ZEN and buy more VIP time...though I suppose that hinges on there being Zen to buy, which the devs can artifically vacuum up, or put a cap on. So the major risk seems controllable. I'd almost even support a 5 GMOP per month limit at the discounted rate.
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    temjiutemjiu Member Posts: 92 Arc User
    for the first time in a long time I'm impressed guys. Thank you for delivering this option. One of the things that drove me absolutely crazy was the feeling that you were getting microtransactions for everything in the game. Every place I had to spend AD was another place that I couldn't just play the game. This eases up on that allot.

    On the note of the subscription term: I guess it depends on what you think a sub is.

    Magazine subscription: you subscribe to a monthly release that you pay for once, usually
    Monthly subscription (as most MMO's use the term). you pay monthly for continued access to a product.

    I view the second description as a sub, and this doesn't really fit it. but in all honesty, it's an apples to oranges thing.

    The only question I have for the dev's (as brought up here), are the gift box items going to be BoP/BoA when using our VIP keys, or are they going to be identical to the standard keys we get now (which give us BoE stuff that we can keep or sell). This doesn't kill the VIP program, but it does decrease it's overall value a bit. And its something that SHOULD be brought up if it is true...people will not be happy to be surprised with BoP items on release day

    Man....I can finally burn through all those older boxes I have floating around.

    the only thing I'd ask for to make it better for spacey people like me is an option to have the fund charge regularly so I don't miss a VIP payment. Please note I said option :D I understand that many don't want a true sub model, so I'm just asking for an option to have it go automatically for dudes like me. I'm the guy that sets all his utility payments on autopay so I don't forget.
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    eldeskaleldeskal Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 214 Arc User
    Ha. Making the discounted Wonderous Bazaar items bound-to-account (while leaving the non-discounted ones unbound) would solve nearly everything.
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    shdwdncr666shdwdncr666 Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    I'm still waiting to see an answer about the benefits vs. time paid for. When your VIP time expires, do you lose access to those benefits? (Like the mailbox, or bank, etc.)
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    beckylunaticbeckylunatic Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 14,231 Arc User
    I'm still waiting to see an answer about the benefits vs. time paid for. When your VIP time expires, do you lose access to those benefits? (Like the mailbox, or bank, etc.)

    Why would you keep the benefits month to month if you stop paying for them? This is also implicitly answered in the regard that if you allow your VIP status to lapse, you won't have lost ranks if you pick it up again.
    Guild Leader - The Lords of Light

    Neverwinter Census 2017

    All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
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    plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,314 Arc User
    edited August 2015
    eldeskal wrote: »
    Ha. Making the discounted Wonderous Bazaar items bound-to-account (while leaving the non-discounted ones unbound) would solve nearly everything.

    Why? People complained about GMoP is too expensive. This allows those are not in VIP program to get cheaper GMoP from AH. VIP can sell GMoP for 85k and still make a profit. Non-VIP does not need to pay 100k. Better situation than current.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
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    plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,314 Arc User
    I'm still waiting to see an answer about the benefits vs. time paid for. When your VIP time expires, do you lose access to those benefits? (Like the mailbox, or bank, etc.)

    I think it is pretty obvious you won't have those access if VIP expires.

    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
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    linaduinlinaduin Member Posts: 187 Arc User
    Since I started playing NW this is the first thing I've seen that's made me think about really spending money. I'd like more info regarding what is and isn't bound but otherwise it seems a fair deal. I was on the verge of leaving the game but this could could pull me back. I wonder how many who did leave will return?
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    linaduinlinaduin Member Posts: 187 Arc User
    PLEASE , PLEASE !! dont make this program buyable using ZEN! its dangerous ! farmers can buy this for their benefits or farmers get benefits from this.
    Please make it ONLY buyable using Creditcard/real money.
    please support the developer , you play this game, at least u must support them also,
    IF this program use ZEN, then mostly maybe player buying AD from ......

    We might be alone here but I tend to agree with you. And I couldn't care less if it's called a subscription or not.
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    regenerderegenerde Member Posts: 3,044 Arc User
    PLEASE , PLEASE !! dont make this program buyable using ZEN! its dangerous ! farmers can buy this for their benefits or farmers get benefits from this.
    Please make it ONLY buyable using Creditcard/real money.
    please support the developer , you play this game, at least u must support them also,
    IF this program use ZEN, then mostly maybe player buying AD from ......
    ... and if they change that, they will lose even more players.
    Take a look at the Steam charts for NWO, or just look ingame into the auction house, they're allready losing players due to several reasons.
    I do believe in killing the messenger...
    Want to know why?
    Because it sends a message!
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    wentriswentris Member Posts: 542 Arc User
    Team buff when grouped (All members + VIP players gets +1000HP if below level 65 and +2000HP if above. This stacks for each member with VIP.

    I think stats increase and VIP-only team buffs are wrong, because it may create non-VIP discrimination when looking for groups in dungeons. Other than that - I like that, fair trade between players convenience + company money. And since VIP in longer run is going to repay most of the money invested - even f2ps should be happy. I hope that either VIP pack is tradeable on AH, or we gonna have enough sinks to make ZAX work as good as it used to in mod 2
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    linaduinlinaduin Member Posts: 187 Arc User
    regenerde wrote: »
    PLEASE , PLEASE !! dont make this program buyable using ZEN! its dangerous ! farmers can buy this for their benefits or farmers get benefits from this.
    Please make it ONLY buyable using Creditcard/real money.
    please support the developer , you play this game, at least u must support them also,
    IF this program use ZEN, then mostly maybe player buying AD from ......
    ... and if they change that, they will lose even more players.
    Take a look at the Steam charts for NWO, or just look ingame into the auction house, they're allready losing players due to several reasons.

    I hear you, but if the bulk of the money spent on these not-subs ends up with botters, or the not-subs just mop up existing AD and ZEN, then the game doesn't receive the money for further development and we're back with a **** game that no-one will play anyway. I don't have any strong feelings about it but I can see a problem either way they do it. I guess their hope is that there will be so little ZEN in-circulation soon that it won't be possible to convert AD to ZEN anyway, and players will eventually have to start spending $RL on ZEN for not-subs. Presumably Cryptic can track how much ZEN has been purchased and spent and they know what's in-circulation and how quickly it could be consumed through a popular new ZEN-sink like this; and they must be confident that after the initial ZEN-grab most on-going not-subs will be bought with $RL via ZEN. Only Cryptic has that knowledge. If that's the case then it probably won't make a difference, ultimately, but allowing not-sub purchase through ZEN is good PR and consistent with their F2P status. OK - I'm convinced.
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    jaydenomega812jaydenomega812 Member Posts: 152 Arc User
    Oh boy.

    First of all I guess I should point out the obvious after sifting thru the posts on this topic that players of the game do seem generally super enthusiastic about this program meaning the devs had better get it right in every little finite detail or it's going to be another let down in an already obvious string of such. I.E.....nothing better be account bound other than the key and the discounts to purchases.

    Second....yea dude....it's a subscription. Anytime you pay a fee to get something for a while then stop paying the fee to stop getting the something it's a subscription. Being that there is time to have to purchase to continue receiving benefits......that made it a subscription. The rewards themselves fall in line with what would be considered a freemium. At least it's all optional, but...

    Third, I could see it cause division in the community. Oh you don't support the game your just a f2p leech....we don't want to play with you....get out of here. -.- *clap clap clap* Further, if things in the future say on livestreams (when there are any of these) are handouts to VIP's only yea it's going to drive more division in the community. May the indomitable battle strike smite anyone not a VIP.

    Fourth, it is going to back up the ad to zen exchange so hard that it might possibly end up taking 30 days just to get the zen to buy another time pack. Good luck to those that would use the ad exchange to get stuff like blood rubies to help boost rp in artifact stuff. With it being something which can be done with in game assets then I hardly see how it's going to drive a final profit boost. So why not just make the changes for everyone to begin with??

    And final but not least....for anyone that doesn't keep up with money topics on web news agencies....PWE (Perfect World Entertainment, the company which is a driving factor in making this game and others playable) just sold for 1 BILLION USD!!!! So....let's do some quick math.....say PWE has 10 games for 10 years....1 billion divided by 10 divided by 10 ends up being 10 million per year per game!!! WOW! Astounding profitability given that all of it is free to play with option to buy in. Without checking actual numbers though I would be more apt to say that NW and STO are higher profit drivers than any other of there games since they have a more US based cult following. But, still....10 million per year per game....like wow....and and and STO and NW both haven't been out that long just going based on how long PWE has been an established company. Like wow.

    The one without a doubt benefit to anyone not in the program is that lock box dropped items will soon be much cheaper making them finally affordable to a wider array of players. So much so that it might even draw newer players in or either be a means to an end to well gear alternates typically used only for leadership tasks right now. Either way....to those which think time pack funding will come from lock box drop sales will find that to be true only for a short short time.

    That's my honest evaluation of this program.

    As with anything new...I'm going to sit back and see how it works out first by listening to reviews before I jump in and say yea it's awesome or yea it's awful. Already though I'll say I'm sad to see a subscription coming to NW and this will be a turning point for the game.
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    linaduinlinaduin Member Posts: 187 Arc User
    The one without a doubt benefit to anyone not in the program is that lock box dropped items will soon be much cheaper making them finally affordable to a wider array of players. So much so that it might even draw newer players in or either be a means to an end to well gear alternates typically used only for leadership tasks right now. Either way....to those which think time pack funding will come from lock box drop sales will find that to be true only for a short short time.

    So the smart money will be buying a 3 month not-sub ASAP (with hoarded ZEN) and milking it for every AD it's worth in the early days and then dropping it?
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    mynaammynaam Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 937 Arc User
    Like this will at least get the 90 day one to give it a try on launch. Guess it starts with stronghold.
    There are more than BIS players in this game
    RIP Real Tiamat, RIP Real Demogorgon RIP real Temple of the spider. Why remove non bis content to give to bis players ????
    FORCING the majority of your player base to play 4 mod old dungeons and trial will have a bad result on player base
    Changes are getting so bad i would rather prefer no new changes (RIP ICE FISHING in winter fest)



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    burkaancburkaanc Member Posts: 2,186 Arc User
    it was quite clear that they added injury to traps with some sinister purpose, on top of that 10k bonus hp to a VIP pvp party VIPs can buy GMOPS for 75k and sell it on ah to peasant trash still cheaper than bazaar, quite nice for a company that once promised no subscriptions, no pay2win and all content/locations accessible for everybody.
    Paladin Master Race
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    quspivquspiv Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,087 Arc User
    PLEASE , PLEASE !! dont make this program buyable using ZEN! its dangerous ! farmers can buy this for their benefits or farmers get benefits from this.
    Please make it ONLY buyable using Creditcard/real money.
    please support the developer , you play this game, at least u must support them also,
    IF this program use ZEN, then mostly maybe player buying AD from ......

    ^ This. If you want players to spend more real $ you should make it only for real $ not ZEN. If you dont, it will only encourage players to buy AD from gold sellers, because they can get more ZEN this way.

    so instead of selling more ZEN for real $ you will only get insane backlog that will make it incredibly hard to get ZEN items for casual and f2p non-hardcore players. There are players with multiple accounts and huge leadership armies who can make even 1kk AD per day without leaving the town. (just invoking + Leadership on 75+ characters)

    Also, on a side note. Please either disable the HP bonus in PvP or change it to + "X" % dmg reduction against monsters. This way it wont cause more balance issues in pvp. (PvP is already very unbalanced and you shouldnt break it more, eh)
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    jaydenomega812jaydenomega812 Member Posts: 152 Arc User
    edited August 2015
    linaduin wrote: »
    The one without a doubt benefit to anyone not in the program is that lock box dropped items will soon be much cheaper making them finally affordable to a wider array of players. So much so that it might even draw newer players in or either be a means to an end to well gear alternates typically used only for leadership tasks right now. Either way....to those which think time pack funding will come from lock box drop sales will find that to be true only for a short short time.

    So the smart money will be buying a 3 month not-sub ASAP (with hoarded ZEN) and milking it for every AD it's worth in the early days and then dropping it?
    linaduin wrote: »
    The one without a doubt benefit to anyone not in the program is that lock box dropped items will soon be much cheaper making them finally affordable to a wider array of players. So much so that it might even draw newer players in or either be a means to an end to well gear alternates typically used only for leadership tasks right now. Either way....to those which think time pack funding will come from lock box drop sales will find that to be true only for a short short time.

    So the smart money will be buying a 3 month not-sub ASAP (with hoarded ZEN) and milking it for every AD it's worth in the early days and then dropping it?

    There is no 3 month not sub as buying 3 months of time will mean once that time has ran out you stop receiving the rewards you were receiving. Just stating the obvious :) Again....this is a combination of 2 parts...time = subscription, rewards = freemium making it an overall subscription since without time you gets no rewards.

    Otherwise...yea it may very well be smart to milk it for all it's worth at its inception but in the long run which would save you more....buying the items when there cheap on the ah by waiting for them to become such or blowing a ton of ad at start to POSSIBLY get back a little more. The later will be a gamble since the more people participating will mean the more stuff in game decreasing values across the board.

    While your gambling I'll be bank rolling ad to buy the 110 mounts when they become 25k ad :) And I'll be snapping up lockboxes since they too will soon be going up in value.

    Too though something else I didn't think of earlier is that...this will open the door for more players to make even more ad in game which will not make money for the game. How? Create another account, move ad via something silly on the market like 1 portable altar, then sub to 1 month to get 30 more keys :) More chances to get more stuff! Hooray! Sell items on market, then move ad back to main account and go on spending spree!!! Hooray! Oh and hello exploit :) Maybe that's why people seem unusually excited about this already. Just stating the obvious :)

    Take the keys away though and it won't be worth much at all nor have many signing up :)
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    pr197777pr197777 Member Posts: 5 Arc User
    First of all, TYVM for making our life as contributing players a way lot easyer. Portable mail box, invocating world, portable bank, portable teleport to anywhere, 3 donjon delve keys per day (more play time), immunity to injury( even if you are gold rich it's such a time consumming), enormous raise in ad incomming and rebate and did i mention enchanting key's.

    I was very upset since the leadership sunk my play time since it take around 1 min just to log in with one character (got bad internet connection) then had to click on each completed slot twice( Pls make a harvest completed task button ;) ) then choose my leadership duty, and the glitch with invocation made me lose even my will to do it, but you gave me some hope that you'll figure something out to make it somehow more enjoyable.

    Sorry for the lack of trust i had in you, i will gladly pay 120$ for the 360 day of enjoyable content, for pvp and pve player. I'm sure it will be a great challenge for you to balance stats for the new pvp content. Hope soulbinder SW will have a chance vs avalanche and thayan bastillion ;). With 10000 more hp well be able to still have some challenge doing epic donjons. I'm sure your maketing dev have already planning a nice buy up to 200$ Worth of zen and have all above plus lvl3 of VIP content (90 day's), a cambion magus would be magic.

    I'm seeing a golden age for neverwinter, you'll definitively give the average ppls a chance to get even with those who abuse the ah. And more cheap variety of items in the AH.

    Here some suggestions for the nexts changes.

    A rank 4 mount tome (I'm sure it's on the way anyway!)

    Unlock the trade zen for ad limit for a week and see how it goes (more money for you and a balance with the incoming key's treasures).

    Add a rank 15 for VIP (add a bank enchants (around 90 slot to unlock with zen) so you just have to press unslot all button so it make it easier to switch enchants to one character to another), (23 enchants only for one char(not talking about companion with 3 runes and 6 enchants).

    Did i mention i'm excited about stronghold! TY for all the good work.
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    linaduinlinaduin Member Posts: 187 Arc User
    Just after the Gateway Leadership fiasco the price of ZEN fell below 500AD - just checked the ZAX now and there's already a backlog of over 2M ZEN @500AD. NW is sure one heck of a roller-coaster ride. Hang on to your horses, or giant crabs, or gelatinous cubes, or... whatever. Any guesses on how high the backlog will go?
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    zachariah92zachariah92 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 49 Arc User
    edited August 2015
    You could give foundry authors (high ranked ones, maybe from foundry master and up, with a minimum of daily foundries published) some kind of ViP, as we are generating "infinite" content, and sometimes, in some gamer's opinion, far better content than yours.



    NW - DD69G42V2 - The Stolen Dragon Egg
    NWS - DPVINV31F - La Corona de la Sombra
    NW - DTKMPU3RQ - Contest: Portal - The Forgotten
    NW-DRTBVIVMU - Drowned Shore: Disembark #DS#
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    angryspriteangrysprite Member Posts: 4,982 Arc User
    edited August 2015
    I'm still waiting to see an answer about the benefits vs. time paid for. When your VIP time expires, do you lose access to those benefits? (Like the mailbox, or bank, etc.)

    Reread the original announcement again.
    If you're too proud to do that then your answer is here:
    Yes.

    As for all the doom-and-gloomers: looks like you're on the wrong side with this one as the commentary is 95% for than against. Looks like this will be a successful program for Cryptic even though you don't want it to be.
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    quspivquspiv Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,087 Arc User
    You could give foundry authors (high ranked ones, maybe from foundry master and up, with a minimum of daily foundries published) some kind of ViP, as we are generating "infinite" content, and sometimes, in some gamer's opinion, far better content than yours.




    are you kidding right? nobody is forcing you to generate this "infinite content". If some players are enjoying what you've created, fine. Let those players reward your efforts if they want to. The point is, this is MMO and not some Foundry generator, so dont expect better rewards than those who actually play the game.
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