They should have scrapped this game instead of COH.
Bad Apples like this, is what gives the CoH Community the Bad name
Post edited by avianos on
POWERFRAME REVAMPS, NEW POWERS and BUG FIXES > Recycled Content and Events and even costumes at this point Introvert guy who use CO to make his characters playable and get experimental with Viable FF Theme builds! Running out of Unique FF builds due to the lack of updates and synergies! Playing since 1 February 2011 128 + Characters (21 ATs, 107 FFs) ALTitis for Life!
Didn't save the game, did it? Just how populated were the villain regions, anyway?
This argument has been dealt with so many times, the ASPCA is ready to step into the thread to deal with allegations of abuse of horse corpses.
I will just state, I am often amused about the whole "villain" thing when it concerns CoH. Text flavor aside, all they were, in most scenarios, were slightly darker hero missions. In fact, most of the time when it concerns someone answering the question "when did the missions actually get villainous in CoV" the answer is almost universally Westin Phipps. One contact out of dozens in City of Villains where the flavor text didn't have you selling something off or doing heroic clean up work for the name of... Arachnos I guess. And even in Phipps mission, you just end up betraying him instead of pulling off the villainous deeds at the end of the day.
And to answer your question on Villain population. Before Going Rogue, villains had a decent population size, but no where near hero side size. Villains and heroes were isolated. though a few zones would allow for cross play, the lion's share of zones were all on hero side, with the villain side content being restricted to seven zones, with an 8th being added when Hamidon was finally ported to villains, and the two other zones being devoted to PvP. Villains were gradually allowed to be tag-a-longs to heroes in certain hazard zones (like the Rikti War Zone and Dark Astoria) but the villain side never saw an exclusive zone addition after the Abyss was added.
This of course had a very negative impact on the population of villains, especially since the ATs in PvP tended to under perform or require a ramp up time to be as effective as their closest counter part on the hero side. And of course, this "balance" was often trumpeted as "Heroes are always suppose to win" mentality. When it was obvious that all the promises of new exclusive content and zones for villains was pretty much dead in the water, it was asked about opening up the hazard zones instead to at least allow for some alternative progression paths. Instead, we got told, by a large portion of the community and some devs that it wouldn't make sense for a villain to roam free in the city, despite due process and all that.
Post Going Rogue expansion, Villain side became a ghost town. No ands, ifs or buts about it. Villains either went Rogue or full on hero/vigilante in the alignment system, with people only going villain if they wanted to get badges (aka achievements). The only activity you really saw villain side was at the black market and thanks to markets being merged, became increasingly sparse with people around. Honestly, I think if Paragon and Positron had their way, they would have removed Villains entirely and just converted the Rogue Isles into an alternative leveling path for heroes.
Yea, I had my love of CoV, and I am bitter at what Paragon and Positron did to abandon or insult the Villain player base, and the lip service lies they gave as a result. While part of me understands dev time limitations, the amount of content that went exclusively to hero side was appalling when Villains desperately needed so much work, such as alternative leveling paths and so forth. I honestly hate what Going Rogue did to villains, including destroying much of the iconic music of that game, including the title music, the newbie zone music and so forth. I mean this was City of Villains Title Theme for a long time, then when I go to play CoV after Freedom was introduced I am greeted by this attrocity. I almost thought I had my Star Trek 2009 movie sound track in the player. And I remember the first time I started playing CoV entering into Mercy and hearing this music, and in Freedom I went back because I wanted to hear it again, only to be greeted by this attrocity. I dunno who designed it, or what, but damn they were taking an ax to murder the feel of my beloved villain side.
So this has turned into one of those games where they rip people off with randomized chests, i won't bother with CO again.
They should have scrapped this game instead of COH.
Sorry bub, but CoH killed itself. I know people can't accept that, and that's fine, but they were hemorrhaging players as evidenced by the constant decline of subscribers. They had a very good tendency to do that. When the PvP update in Issue 12 hit, 25,000 people up and quit because PvP was essentially ruined (it was a physical drop subscribers went from around 125,000 to 100,000). And I know people kept getting increasingly unhappy with the direction CoH was going to.
I think you misunderstood, i never said it did. However i wouldn't be surprised if they closed COH just so games like CO could make more money, it makes sense.
It's not that we can't let COH go, so far there has been nothing to take its place.
I think you misunderstood, i never said it did. However i wouldn't be surprised if they closed COH just so games like CO could make more money, it makes sense.
It's not that we can't let COH go, so far there has been nothing to take its place.
Uh, and who and how would this work? Especially since many CoH players have been purposely sabotaging reviews and attacking CO since its launch and continue to do so even with CoH gone but always crowing up about how great Vigilance or Titan will be when all evidence points to the contrary?
Didn't several of the CoH devs get picked up by Cryptic after CoH closed? Then go on to create CO?
Multiple devs did, but they went to other games in Cryptic, not specifically Champions. When they fired BaB at Paragon, he was picked up and was working on Neverwinter, but I do believe BaB has moved on. After Paragon closed down several of the CoH devs were picked up by Cryptic, including Positron, but were put on Neverwinter or STO. I know Positron was let go for pretty lazy and botched work he did, and of course when people found out he was let go all the conspiracy theories and so forth started anew.
Some people think gambling is immoral and condemn them because of their random nature. Others just hate spending money on anything and will complain every time they are tempted to pull our their wallets. Still others just hate on stuff because they like to hate stuff. Take your pick!
I think you misunderstood, i never said it did. However i wouldn't be surprised if they closed COH just so games like CO could make more money, it makes sense.
It's not that we can't let COH go, so far there has been nothing to take its place.
It really doesn't make sense to close a game to benefit another company, especially one with which you've had a somewhat contentious relationship.
As for CoH's closure, as far as I can tell, it was for two reasons.
1. CoH was not new and shiny, and NCSoft prized the leading edge in games.
2. Its population had declined just enough that NCSoft talked themselves into thinking the first point mattered.
It's a shame it died, it had a wonderful community and I have fond memories of playing the game in the first couple of years. I'm happy to get my supers fix here though.
As for CoH's closure, as far as I can tell, it was for two reasons.
1. CoH was not new and shiny, and NCSoft prized the leading edge in games.
2. Its population had declined just enough that NCSoft talked themselves into thinking the first point mattered.
It's a shame it died, it had a wonderful community and I have fond memories of playing the game in the first couple of years. I'm happy to get my supers fix here though.
I won't get into it much, but no those are neither of the reasons. Let's just leave it that CoH was not as healthy as people were led to believe.
As a long time CoH player and someone who jumped on evil side as fast as it turned up. The devs seemed to listen to demented players over in CoH players like Golden Girl who would post rants on forums about people who play as bad guys. Devs listened to these nutters concentrated on one side more than the other and the game died.
Same stuff happen to Street Fighter V devs in that game listened to a vocal minority didnt put in arcade mode ...game died fast.
Lesson to have from these two games players dont know jack sh*t about making a good game.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
I think you misunderstood, i never said it did. However i wouldn't be surprised if they closed COH just so games like CO could make more money, it makes sense.
It's not that we can't let COH go, so far there has been nothing to take its place.
Uh, and who and how would this work? Especially since many CoH players have been purposely sabotaging reviews and attacking CO since its launch and continue to do so even with CoH gone but always crowing up about how great Vigilance or Titan will be when all evidence points to the contrary?
Didn't several of the CoH devs get picked up by Cryptic after CoH closed? Then go on to create CO?
Multiple devs did, but they went to other games in Cryptic, not specifically Champions. When they fired BaB at Paragon, he was picked up and was working on Neverwinter, but I do believe BaB has moved on. After Paragon closed down several of the CoH devs were picked up by Cryptic, including Positron, but were put on Neverwinter or STO. I know Positron was let go for pretty lazy and botched work he did, and of course when people found out he was let go all the conspiracy theories and so forth started anew.
Okay.
Buffing everything to stupid high levels and nerfing everything to piss poor levels yields the same results, but not the same community reactions.
Uh, and who and how would this work? Especially since many CoH players have been purposely sabotaging reviews and attacking CO since its launch and continue to do so even with CoH gone but always crowing up about how great Vigilance or Titan will be when all evidence points to the contrary?
Is it wrong for me to say "Ah, the good 'ol days" when Vigilance and Titan suddenly appeared and the devs came to CO forums and started to try to bash the game out of existence? It's been so long since I remembered the last time someone gloated "These games will be the next CoX and CO can rot". Seems like the haters will hate one thing: That they were wrong and we on CO were right to never give up hope. Which reminds me, I do remember seeing people around on CO who hate the game for they are CoX refugees, but you don't see them anymore or they just don't talk about it no more. I even seen people in bios who like to show off their egos about them supporting Titan or Vigilance projects but now they are all "Uh, I don't know what you're talking about." Last time I looked at the Titan project website long ago, the rate of supporters went down and the 'charity' came to a complete stop because people got tired of waiting and waiting to hear updates on how they were doing on the developments. I actually had find it humorous to how many out there start theories and lies to try to get a game shut down all because the competition died off because of poor marketing and game development decisions and point the finger to something else.
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They should have scrapped this game instead of COH.
Oh look someone took the plunge and made a first post - and it was to bash CO in favour of COH.. death of COH had nothing to do with CO buddy.
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Bad Apples like this, is what gives the CoH Community the Bad name
Oh look someone took the plunge and made a first post - and it was to bash CO in favour of COH.. death of COH had nothing to do with CO buddy.
Agreed
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I will just state, I am often amused about the whole "villain" thing when it concerns CoH. Text flavor aside, all they were, in most scenarios, were slightly darker hero missions. In fact, most of the time when it concerns someone answering the question "when did the missions actually get villainous in CoV" the answer is almost universally Westin Phipps. One contact out of dozens in City of Villains where the flavor text didn't have you selling something off or doing heroic clean up work for the name of... Arachnos I guess. And even in Phipps mission, you just end up betraying him instead of pulling off the villainous deeds at the end of the day.
And to answer your question on Villain population. Before Going Rogue, villains had a decent population size, but no where near hero side size. Villains and heroes were isolated. though a few zones would allow for cross play, the lion's share of zones were all on hero side, with the villain side content being restricted to seven zones, with an 8th being added when Hamidon was finally ported to villains, and the two other zones being devoted to PvP. Villains were gradually allowed to be tag-a-longs to heroes in certain hazard zones (like the Rikti War Zone and Dark Astoria) but the villain side never saw an exclusive zone addition after the Abyss was added.
This of course had a very negative impact on the population of villains, especially since the ATs in PvP tended to under perform or require a ramp up time to be as effective as their closest counter part on the hero side. And of course, this "balance" was often trumpeted as "Heroes are always suppose to win" mentality. When it was obvious that all the promises of new exclusive content and zones for villains was pretty much dead in the water, it was asked about opening up the hazard zones instead to at least allow for some alternative progression paths. Instead, we got told, by a large portion of the community and some devs that it wouldn't make sense for a villain to roam free in the city, despite due process and all that.
Post Going Rogue expansion, Villain side became a ghost town. No ands, ifs or buts about it. Villains either went Rogue or full on hero/vigilante in the alignment system, with people only going villain if they wanted to get badges (aka achievements). The only activity you really saw villain side was at the black market and thanks to markets being merged, became increasingly sparse with people around. Honestly, I think if Paragon and Positron had their way, they would have removed Villains entirely and just converted the Rogue Isles into an alternative leveling path for heroes.
Yea, I had my love of CoV, and I am bitter at what Paragon and Positron did to abandon or insult the Villain player base, and the lip service lies they gave as a result. While part of me understands dev time limitations, the amount of content that went exclusively to hero side was appalling when Villains desperately needed so much work, such as alternative leveling paths and so forth. I honestly hate what Going Rogue did to villains, including destroying much of the iconic music of that game, including the title music, the newbie zone music and so forth. I mean this was City of Villains Title Theme for a long time, then when I go to play CoV after Freedom was introduced I am greeted by this attrocity. I almost thought I had my Star Trek 2009 movie sound track in the player. And I remember the first time I started playing CoV entering into Mercy and hearing this music, and in Freedom I went back because I wanted to hear it again, only to be greeted by this attrocity. I dunno who designed it, or what, but damn they were taking an ax to murder the feel of my beloved villain side.
Sorry bub, but CoH killed itself. I know people can't accept that, and that's fine, but they were hemorrhaging players as evidenced by the constant decline of subscribers. They had a very good tendency to do that. When the PvP update in Issue 12 hit, 25,000 people up and quit because PvP was essentially ruined (it was a physical drop subscribers went from around 125,000 to 100,000). And I know people kept getting increasingly unhappy with the direction CoH was going to.
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It's not that we can't let COH go, so far there has been nothing to take its place.
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Uh, and who and how would this work? Especially since many CoH players have been purposely sabotaging reviews and attacking CO since its launch and continue to do so even with CoH gone but always crowing up about how great Vigilance or Titan will be when all evidence points to the contrary?
Multiple devs did, but they went to other games in Cryptic, not specifically Champions. When they fired BaB at Paragon, he was picked up and was working on Neverwinter, but I do believe BaB has moved on. After Paragon closed down several of the CoH devs were picked up by Cryptic, including Positron, but were put on Neverwinter or STO. I know Positron was let go for pretty lazy and botched work he did, and of course when people found out he was let go all the conspiracy theories and so forth started anew.
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As for CoH's closure, as far as I can tell, it was for two reasons.
1. CoH was not new and shiny, and NCSoft prized the leading edge in games.
2. Its population had declined just enough that NCSoft talked themselves into thinking the first point mattered.
It's a shame it died, it had a wonderful community and I have fond memories of playing the game in the first couple of years. I'm happy to get my supers fix here though.
I won't get into it much, but no those are neither of the reasons. Let's just leave it that CoH was not as healthy as people were led to believe.
Silverspar on PRIMUS
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Same stuff happen to Street Fighter V devs in that game listened to a vocal minority didnt put in arcade mode ...game died fast.
Lesson to have from these two games players dont know jack sh*t about making a good game.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
Uh, and who and how would this work? Especially since many CoH players have been purposely sabotaging reviews and attacking CO since its launch and continue to do so even with CoH gone but always crowing up about how great Vigilance or Titan will be when all evidence points to the contrary?
Multiple devs did, but they went to other games in Cryptic, not specifically Champions. When they fired BaB at Paragon, he was picked up and was working on Neverwinter, but I do believe BaB has moved on. After Paragon closed down several of the CoH devs were picked up by Cryptic, including Positron, but were put on Neverwinter or STO. I know Positron was let go for pretty lazy and botched work he did, and of course when people found out he was let go all the conspiracy theories and so forth started anew.
Okay.
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