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Silver Rec, Heroics, Prices.
emperornf
Posts: 55 Arc User
I don't want to be "that" guy but i need SOME outlet for these feelings.
I'm a simple man with many toons, and in my eyes the appeal of Heroic Gear was how not-out-of-reach it was. By which i mean that it required a reasonable amount of effort to obtain while not being especially powerful. If someone wanted to grind for gear in order to obtain something better, they probably stuck to doing rampages.
Now, this previously easy to obtain gear has skyrocketed in price. Personally i don't see why there was a need for that, especially since an even better tier of gear has rolled out. The entry-level 40 lvl gear has been put on an even higher shelf now, personally i'll be forced to settle for regular dropped/AH bought gear on most toons, at least for a long time. I don't feel particularily motivated to grind for 150x3x27 Silver Recog, with current channels of gaining silver recognition i would be lucky to outfit 2-4 toons before losing all will to keep playing.
I just don't like the changes which put grind in places where there was no need for it. What i liked the most about CO was how little grind there was involved compared to the competitors (I mean Grind for the necessities such as experience and gear, the bare minimums). More toons will now take a hit in efficiency making for weaker teams.
I'm not exactly mad or anything, i'm neither gold nor lifetime (Zen buyer, weird situations like these are exactly why i was always afraid of subscribing) so i'm not tied down to this game in case things go full south. I'm just concerned about how these outrageous new prices will affect potential new players, we are hurting for those.
EDIT:
I quit the game, if you are wise you will do the same. Thank me later, send a postcard, or not. Just save yourself.
I'm a simple man with many toons, and in my eyes the appeal of Heroic Gear was how not-out-of-reach it was. By which i mean that it required a reasonable amount of effort to obtain while not being especially powerful. If someone wanted to grind for gear in order to obtain something better, they probably stuck to doing rampages.
Now, this previously easy to obtain gear has skyrocketed in price. Personally i don't see why there was a need for that, especially since an even better tier of gear has rolled out. The entry-level 40 lvl gear has been put on an even higher shelf now, personally i'll be forced to settle for regular dropped/AH bought gear on most toons, at least for a long time. I don't feel particularily motivated to grind for 150x3x27 Silver Recog, with current channels of gaining silver recognition i would be lucky to outfit 2-4 toons before losing all will to keep playing.
I just don't like the changes which put grind in places where there was no need for it. What i liked the most about CO was how little grind there was involved compared to the competitors (I mean Grind for the necessities such as experience and gear, the bare minimums). More toons will now take a hit in efficiency making for weaker teams.
I'm not exactly mad or anything, i'm neither gold nor lifetime (Zen buyer, weird situations like these are exactly why i was always afraid of subscribing) so i'm not tied down to this game in case things go full south. I'm just concerned about how these outrageous new prices will affect potential new players, we are hurting for those.
EDIT:
I quit the game, if you are wise you will do the same. Thank me later, send a postcard, or not. Just save yourself.
Post edited by emperornf on
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I did try looking for alternatives to Heroics but Q gear is either too expensive, or too weak for a level 40. And AH is vacant.
So with that said, i decided to take a "break" from CO until something is done about this. As much as i love the game, this put too high of a wall for me to overcome in order to have fun like i used to.
I refuse to do alerts or any other kind of activity without wearing decent gear. This is the kind of thing that makes you a liability, and also makes people feel disappointed when they see you in their team. If the choices are to be a burden or to quit, i'd rather move on.
Mercenery is only a few stat points from Heroic gear. It also has 3 slots and comes from boxes as well as Q store.
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Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
I understand that they added a few other ways to gain SCR, like alert dailies other than special smash, but in that case the LOGICAL change would be to raise the price of each piece to something like 50-60 at best. Double the price would make more sense than FIVE TIMES the price.
Here's hoping...
But then like I said... there's always Merc gear, which for some reason has a bad rep. But it's cheap on the AH and when you look at the numbers it's very close to heroics. There's also Legion Gear but that involves trading in keys and zen
One thing I do like ... is some of the low level devices are really cheap.. and fun. A couple of the pet ones have very high HP and hit hard too. The Emperyan and the Greater Demonic both have over 13k hp (at least on my AOPM toon they do) and can handle most boss fights.
Then there's fun stuff like the Quaalar swarm etc.. that can go with a theme. None of them are pricey. I like not having to rely on RNG for fun bits like that.
Ok I need a new hobby, I'm reading these forums too much this morning... LOL.
Maxing a toon takes 3-4 days, gearing it takes 6, that's what i liked because from then on you could move onto another toon or focus on doing stuff like Q and G grinding - Not out of necessity and not ungeared as is the case now.
I'd rather if they fixed SCR the way it was, but maybe made double GCR events.
But as i'm addicted and can't quit the game, i'm Cryptic's little B.
Sad, really sad Direction
Heroics are no way End-game gear now, they lost that rank when Legion and Justice came out
worse is that right now there is no Alternative way to farm Gold Reg
Now, a level 40 toon can earn 5 SCR from Special and Daily Alerts, plus UNITY, plus another 5 per adventure pack or comic series. An ambitious player could get 20 SCR, by doing one of each thing, though you could do all the packs and get 40 SCR in one day.
I agree that the nearly all the recog prices went too high, but there is more SCR out there now. I would have been fine with prices tripling, since SCR availability more or less tripled.
EDIT:I forgot, Rampages award SCR now, too.
Whoever you are, be that person one hundred percent. Don't compromise on your identity.
If i did this on 3 toons, i used to get full sets in 2 days. 2 sets if i did Unity 1 on 6 toons.
I agree that there is more SCR out there, but the prices skyrocketed out of balance, even considering the more SCR channels.
Like i said earlier, the price of a piece was 30 and now it's 150, that's five times as much. I'd be fine with double or even triple the price, but five is just brutal.
Worse still those travel powers are garbage, if I hadn't already unlocked them I'd be so disappointed with unlocking bat flight or scarab flight, they're demonstrably worse then regular flight, pricing them at that level is punishing players for playing the game.
Now having said all that I applaud adding all the costumes to the Recognition center, those Alert drops were so rare that I never got one, in all the years I've been playing the game I never got an Alert drop, and I've gotten all of the Vibora bay drops. I like the fact that there's more ways to get silver recognition. I like that you've started to get rid of all these extra currencies. I like the idea of standardizing the UNITY mission rewards, but I hate the pricing. There's a lot of great things with this update it's too bad you dropped the ball in the pricing. It's a fumble on the one yard line.
"The lady doth protest too much, methinks."
"Without data, you're just another person with an opinion." -- W. Edwards Deming
Hour-ish adventure packs. It's just peachy.
40-50 with just UNITY missions? Even if that were the case (and we both know it's not) it's still going to take you 9 days to get what you could get in 6. Please share with the group how you can get 40-50 SCR from UNITY missions. I mean my statements about UNITY rewards were, in your words, "completely false", and so I eagerly await your explanation.
Perhaps you meant misleading? As there are additional ways of getting SCR now? This wasn't the case I was making but fine, let's consider the time it takes to generate the SCR needed to get Heroic Gear shall we?
UNITY missions took an hour or so to complete, so before the update you could get your heroic gear with six hours of work.
To get 40-50 SCR, which is still not equivilent by the way, you need 75 SCR daily to get your heroic gear in six days, but to get the 40-50 SCR you cite, you need to do alerts, special alerts, rampages, Steel Crusade, UNITY, UNITY2 and whatever other hoops or missions you need to jump through, which is fine if you got four or five hours to sink into the game every day on grinding, but for most casuals that's just not going to happen. Most of my friends didn't bother with UNITY before the update because it took too much time. Now Heroic gears is effectively out of their price range.
Please explain how you figure this new system is better? More ways to grind, sure, but more grinding required.
My opinion is that it's a change that players will get used to, and will be quickly forgotten. The costs are not what I would have set, but I do think providing additional incentive SCR incentives for running existing content is an improvement.
"Without data, you're just another person with an opinion." -- W. Edwards Deming
"Without data, you're just another person with an opinion." -- W. Edwards Deming
The cost for heroic gear has already begun to jump in price on the AH. Where the Defensive piece was around 100-150g it is now 240-250. So yes you can buy them from the ah, but they won't remain 'cheap' for long. Much like the change in the cost that happened when they nerfed the legion drop rate.
Yeah, I get it, I can buy Mercenary gear, which is worse, but now I have to dip into my resources... The other grind.
Yeah, Cryptic thought that Heroic was too easily attainable, but if they wanted their content gated off to people who have done a big gear grind, then gate it off to Justice gear. That grind is already there. Taking something we've had for years - with no indication that there was anything wrong with it - and nerfing it so hard just feels like ill will. I know that's not the case, but as a customer it's just how it feels. It's like the vehicle weapon nerfs that happened a while back, except there was no common sense indicator telling us (me) that this was totally overpowered and a change would be coming.
Honestly, this is the very first thing Cryptic has ever done that's gotten me to consider just not playing anymore. And at the very least, it's going to get me to make less alts, guaranteed. The game is getting less alt-friendly with every new grind put in. I already didn't bother with Justice gear and the Onslaught stuff because I'd rather make a few new alts in the time it would take to grind out that gear for one character, and now we can pile on Heroics to the list of things I won't bother to do. It's so discouraging. Changing our "level 40 starting gear" to yet another grind just leaves thhe most foul taste in my mouth.
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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I have around 54 alts, and I think 25 or so are level 40. Three have Justice, three have Legion, and I think six have Heroic. The rest have a mix of Nem, Q, Merc, and level 40 mission blues. They all do just fine.
I play my top three characters in the hardest game content (fire and ice, Andrith, maybe Gravitar). The rest pretty much do fine with nearly everything else.
Whoever you are, be that person one hundred percent. Don't compromise on your identity.
They don't. But what it gave was the feeling of staying in touch with the developing endgame. I have loads of alts equipped with Merc gear or Blues/Greens from drops and it's fine for solo content; but we all know how elitist team building can be in a small community, and having Heroic Gear felt like a nice little badge that you could use to convince people of your competence. And now it's five/six times harder to get and involves more team based content/Adventure packs (and I can't say I care for either too much).
The game community isn't big enough to cope with being split like this. Yes, a few players might return for the new tough content, and the forums will be filled with Grampa's War Stories of How they fought Teleosaurus when it was Really Hard, but ultimately they're just creating another stop point for a game that already has a few too many.
fire and ice, Andrith, maybe Gravitar
You can take a lvl 35 in Armadillo Secondaries and random other gear into Gracvi/F&I and you'll be fine. They've tried their best to spoil that by taking Servitor Serum away (possibly to encourage people to run Bloodmoon lairs) but I'm sure the healer toons will enjoy the resulting upsurge in popularity.
I don't do that with every character, but it's gone from "some" to "none" in one patch.
The effects of this gap are already being displayed in game. While arguments are common in zone during certain periods of the day, the arguments have begun to get worse. That's not a good thing.
Whoever you are, be that person one hundred percent. Don't compromise on your identity.
this is why I level 30-40 on Monster Island and Canada yetis. Could only stand the VB yoyo missions a few times.
Don't forget Vikorin gear.
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42 40s, LTSer.
The sad part is that some of these older than CO games that do the gear grind have been losing their population over the years. You'd think with that kind of precedence, Cryptic / PW wouldn't make the same mistakes. But I guess I shouldn't have very high expectations from a company that uses dated gaming casino data to make sweeping changes to their game. Or is basically shoving every coercive monitization idea into their games.
[at]riviania Member since Aug 2009
Typically, when a new tier of content and gear is released in a mmorpg, the previous tiers are made more accessible, not less. Why was this change even made in the first place?
The price hike needs to be reconsidered, because it's pretty toxic.
This destroyed any semblance of balance in the way i used to do things, and i don't have to stand for this. For devs to shake things out of balance like this, without a reason, is unforgivable.
I'll pop in after a few months has passed, hopefully either the prices will be fixed by then, or the rewards will become substantial enough. Until then, Sankt out.
I consider Heroics minimal 40 gear. I have .. 14? 40s and all of them have at least heroics. I ran one toon through UNITY 2 (when i could be bothered) to have the scr for a heroic set available when a new toon hit 40. And sometimes all my toons keeping up with vigilance meant they produced 35-6 SCR and could buy a piece. That kind of minor time investment kept all my alts reasonably playable without making me have to grind each toon for hours, because I'm not going to.
The really ridiculous part is that the time required to farm a heroic set is about the same as the time required to farm a justice set now (assuming you have at least 6 rampage-competent characters). That's ridiculous. (And justice farming is at least alt-friendly).
At this point, I pre-bought my next 6 toons worth of heroics, and I'm not sure I'll ever make another alt after that because of the heroic price/time increase. Which probably means I'll drift away from the game at some point and never come back.
I'll probably end up saving for the stupidly over-priced SCR costume unlocks, but since SCR is still character bound, i may never unlock a single one. I have no interest in playing the same character often enough to hit 975 SCR on one character routinely.
Like, I liked with the Mechanon recognition, how the devs actually bothered giving each piece a price based on how good it was. The really good/big parts were 24 tokens, you'd get that in 3-4 days. The dinkier pieces were 12 or 16. Now, every single costume piece, no matter how stupid, is 150 tokens. That Mechanon arm armor that adds a tiny plate to your upper arm? 150.
Even putting aside SCR is easier to get, what about the lesser tokens? MCPD, PRIMUS, UNTIL. Those aren't as easily farmable. Even on the chararacters I leveled up normally rather than just doing XP alerts, I hit 40 with only like 100 MCPD and maybe 60-80 PRIMUS. Not bad, because it was worth a few cool costume bits! Now, nada. What's the solution? Well, farm more SCR and convert them to lesser tokens! Great. I think I'd have been fine with all of this if they'd kept the Mechanon recognition and not price-gouged MCPD, PRIMUS, and UNTIL recognition stores. As it is, I should have been more serious about farming Mechanon rep before.
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Some people seem to want to act like you can't create a new character until your current character has Heroic gear.
People make the point that "the game encourages altitis!". Sure, but the degree to which the player takes that is up to the player.
The point that "there's no end game so all there is to do is make more characters" is a double-edged sword... it's true, but it also completely removes the need for a character to have heroic gear - and, oh look, they're adding endgame, so now the first part is no longer true.
Just like in any other MMO, it's going to be a reality that if you want to do endgame content on many characters, that's gonna take some time. I used to know people who would raid in wow with a character of every class... they didn't act like having to gear each character through each tier was some slap in the face to their personal preferences - they took ownership of their choice to do that.
If getting Heroic Gear for all your characters is too big of a hassle, then just don't do it. You can still alt until you're blue in the face.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.