I'd have loved to have seen it handled differently, but that's not what we got. There could be any number of reasons why it was done the way it was, though. But it doesn't matter now. It's done. And after 12 pages, I think people's displeasure is well documented.
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This circular argument really needs to stop, because it's going nowhere. The devs have already stated that saving the tokens for future events was never intended. Any extra tokens that players chose to earn were offered compensation with the extra event project at the time of the event. Those of us that chose to hold onto them for future events instead, gambled and lost. It's said and done. Arguing about it now is moot.
What the devs intended has no bearing with it being specifically spelled out. Not implied by omission. Even in the US, if they tried to say it wasn't their intention because it didn't specifically say the opposite on the event page...yeah not even arbitration would accept that because an arbitration firm that did so would be sued for bias and lose at that point.
And when you buy a c-store item there should be NO GAMBLING PERIOD. Even the lockbox keys gives you what they list they give you...which is from a list of random items that you ALWAYS get SOMETHING from (which makes it a raffle). If I buy something from the c-store and it is a gamble or not if I get to use that items...guess what, they are BREAKING US LAWS at that point as I am pretty sure they do not have all the regulatory paperwork to operate a casino or other gambling operations. So...yeah no...that argument makes things even worse for Cryptic.
And yes unless somebody wants to start a class action lawsuit...yeah the expectation of change is moot. They ain't gonna change a thing. I have been saying so even before they removed the tokens. However posting how displease people are at how they handled the situation is NOT moot.
Indeed, only in case they had clearly put in the description, shown before buying the event tokens, that they will be deleted after the event, they would have had a point. Something like "do you really want to buy this item, be aware after the event it will be deleted or useless". But that did not happen.
The fact that tokens could be used when the event returned, does not show devs intent that these items only were supposed to be valid for 1 time event. I and many customers were not aware this was the devs intend. Simply deleting items from customers inventory is a bad thing.
I have no problem that devs now want to streamline things and simplify the way events functions and reduce the amount of event tokens. But they should have offered a token exchange or refund. Buyers of these tokens could not know on time that devs would change things and were not able to use all their tokens before the change, hence they still had them in their inventory. In case Cryptic would have offered an exchange period, they would not have to delete items.
I'd have loved to have seen it handled differently, but that's not what we got. There could be any number of reasons why it was done the way it was, though. But it doesn't matter now. It's done. And after 12 pages, I think people's displeasure is well documented.
I agree. Its a bad thing how it was handled. Not customer friendly. And dissatisfaction is expressed. The way it was handled will probably lead to people being more careful spending money on STO. No one likes to spend money on items that get deleted, or made useless, specially when there is no compensation, and customers just have to swallow the bitter pill.
This circular argument really needs to stop, because it's going nowhere. The devs have already stated that saving the tokens for future events was never intended. Any extra tokens that players chose to earn were offered compensation with the extra event project at the time of the event. Those of us that chose to hold onto them for future events instead, gambled and lost. It's said and done. Arguing about it now is moot.
It's called expressing their discontentment. Now you say it's moot but in a few weeks, should a similar issue arise, somebody at Cryptic will likely say something along the lines of "Why didn't say you didn't like it when we did it the first time?".
That movie ticket voucher analogy is pretty good. Buying a bundle of tickets for say Star Wars 9 but not using them while the movie is in the theater. Is the theater obligated to give you anything for them? no.
Actually, it's heavily flawed. I'll use a similar plane ticket analogy. It has a precise clearly stated purpose and this purpose dictate an expiry date, both of which is printed on the ticket. You either use it to board said plane or lose it. Tokens never had such clear expiry date, and as they had been carried over in the past, some players were reasonable while they were thinking that those were not to vanish in a foreseeable future.
Actually the tokens had a clearly defined purpose. That purpose NEVER included "save extras for later". It's true this isn't listed on the token itself. But it's listed in the event projects and descriptions of the event. "Collect 14... get this thing!" Never any mention of saving for later.
The problem here is that Cryptic let players do that for years without even a warning about this rampant misuse. We're talking about a can of worms along the lines of "squatters' rights" and Cryptic had to thread more carefully with it, and they did not. We wouldn't even be having the same argument if they would have accepted said tokens to fill current FTFO, giving players one last time to spend them. They had options and they CHOSE to go bulldozing. So I don't blame player still ranted a week latter.
Why specify "after this date", as the last time a weekend event was held was in February? I believe that's why people are expecting one last Weekend event, as this phrase could be interpreted as one will be held between June 13th and August 8th. That's why it was clearly asked as a yes or no question, and leaving it unanswered means we'll have to wait and see what it meant.
I think you're reading between the lines too hard. What do you think they mean by "this date"? To me it makes sense to interpret "this date" as the date of posting the blog.
Maybe you're right. To me, "this date" refer either to the previously mentioned date in the text but as there aren't any making sense, it seems to refer to some paragraph that got deleted before the final release of the communiqué. To you, it meant the day the post was published. For some, it meant some obscure date between now and August. It could mean something else for somebody else. On the forums I came across at least five people who convinced me that all those interpretations are reasonable. All the devs had to do was to either answer "yes" or "no" when asked about this, yet they eluded the question. And I have to admit that a two days "Weekend event" would be a great way to gather last minute tokens.
It was NOT a misuse. PERIOD. They were ubiquitous 'Tokens' for said Events. If it were a misuse they would have done what they did with Winter, Summer, and Anniversary Events when they Year locked those. Instead this went on for, what, four years beyond that.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
> @ltminns said: > It was NOT a misuse. PERIOD. They were ubiquitous 'Tokens' for said Events. If it were a misuse they would have done what they did with Winter, Summer, and Anniversary Events when they Year locked those. Instead this went on for, what, four years beyond that.
... and it was obvious they were meant to be spent and not warehoused. So, yeah, it's some form of misuse. As you said, it went on for many years, so hoarders had some sort of squatters' right over their misuse. This said, two wrongs don't make a right. Both hoarders and Cryptic are at fault here.
> @coldnapalm said: > lexers615#4253 wrote: » > > > @ltminns said: > > It was NOT a misuse. PERIOD. They were ubiquitous 'Tokens' for said Events. If it were a misuse they would have done what they did with Winter, Summer, and Anniversary Events when they Year locked those. Instead this went on for, what, four years beyond that. > > ... and it was obvious they were meant to be spent and not warehoused. So, yeah, it's some form of misuse. As you said, it went on for many years, so hoarders had some sort of squatters' right over their misuse. This said, two wrongs don't make a right. Both hoarders and Cryptic are at fault here. > > > > > Says who? Certainly not the devs. At least for YEARS until they decided to do this. You can't blame the players for doings things within the system you make for them.
You clearly haven't read my last two posts in here.
> @ltminns said:
> It was NOT a misuse. PERIOD. They were ubiquitous 'Tokens' for said Events. If it were a misuse they would have done what they did with Winter, Summer, and Anniversary Events when they Year locked those. Instead this went on for, what, four years beyond that.
... and it was obvious they were meant to be spent and not warehoused. So, yeah, it's some form of misuse. As you said, it went on for many years, so hoarders had some sort of squatters' right over their misuse. This said, two wrongs don't make a right. Both hoarders and Cryptic are at fault here.
I disagree. It was not obvious, if it was obvious all people would have spend those tokens and there would be no unsatisfied customers now. Also there was no clear expiration date mentioned before the buy was done.
STO has many kinds of items. Its a game in which grinding and collecting thing is a major part of the game play. Many items can be grinded, collected or bought for later use. It is no misuse to keep items that always were usable to be used again at a later moment, in this case when the event returned. In fact because these items always could be used again later, people saved them.
The fact that they could not be used continuously actuality enforced people storing the extra tokens that could be earned or bought for later, to use when the event reoccurred.
Even consumable items do not have an expiration date. You can stockpile them for later use. No one is forcing you to use them. But you still own them. Would be strange if they got deleted form your inventory by Cryptic because they wanted to free up database space or for whatever reason, without compensating the customer for it.
Everything in STO has a certain value or has a certain price. The real misuse here is the deletion of items form customers without their consent and without compensation.
If you do not care losing items without compensation, then please give me all your items you have stockpiled. I bet you will not do that. Which means you also do value your virtual-items, just as I do.
@totenmet You are deliberately misquoting me. I didn't say I wouldn't mind losing my whole inventory, but I said I didn't mind having lost one sole token as in the process I gained more than I lost.
You are also coming up with the fallacious argument that if something is obvious a bad idea then no one will do it. You know perfectly that there are tons of weirdos doing stupid things on a daily basis (juggling with chainsaws, poking hornet nests, and a lot worse). So far in the thread several people admitted having 20+ tokens on a toon and having continued to gather more without spending then on the extra projects. That was an accident begging to happen. I agree that Cryptic should have issued some form of compensation but hoarders were ALSO wrong in the first place.
If there were any horders they would have been featured on The Learning Channel already.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
> @ltminns said:
> It was NOT a misuse. PERIOD. They were ubiquitous 'Tokens' for said Events. If it were a misuse they would have done what they did with Winter, Summer, and Anniversary Events when they Year locked those. Instead this went on for, what, four years beyond that.
... and it was obvious they were meant to be spent and not warehoused. So, yeah, it's some form of misuse. As you said, it went on for many years, so hoarders had some sort of squatters' right over their misuse. This said, two wrongs don't make a right. Both hoarders and Cryptic are at fault here.
Says who? Certainly not the devs. At least for YEARS until they decided to do this. You can't blame the players for doings things within the system you make for them.
Well, while individual posters might cast blame or what not... In the end, Cryptic isn't "blaming" anyone, or trying to punish someone. They are making a change to the game that they think will work better overall.
People might feel being "inconvenienced" as some kind of personal slight or a punishment, but it's just a game change that might affect some people negatively. But not all - I can't be the only player that had a lot of uncompleted projects and an extra influx of unexpected marks and Dilithium due to this change. I suspect though that the number of players majorly affected in the first place - positively or negatively - is low, however.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
> @coldnapalm said: > IF they had not SOLD those tokens for money, I would be more in the whatever camp. And in fact before I realize they sold some of those tokens for money, I very much was in the whatever camp. With the inclusion of actual cash transaction however, I feel they are more in the wrong move than whatever category. If they do something for people who actually bought those items with zen, I will be back to whatever again. For me personally, I kinda like having the unified token. Makes hoarding for the next event even easier. And since I spent NOTHING on those tokens, for me personally, I came out a bit ahead with the change.
More or less how I feel. And in order to implement the change, they didn't HAVE to delete the tokens beforehand. They CHOSE to go buldozing without a fair warning.
> @coldnapalm said:
> IF they had not SOLD those tokens for money, I would be more in the whatever camp. And in fact before I realize they sold some of those tokens for money, I very much was in the whatever camp. With the inclusion of actual cash transaction however, I feel they are more in the wrong move than whatever category. If they do something for people who actually bought those items with zen, I will be back to whatever again. For me personally, I kinda like having the unified token. Makes hoarding for the next event even easier. And since I spent NOTHING on those tokens, for me personally, I came out a bit ahead with the change.
More or less how I feel. And in order to implement the change, they didn't HAVE to delete the tokens beforehand. They CHOSE to go buldozing without a fair warning.
There's nothing you could have done with the tokens anyways.
No, there's nothing we could have done with the Tokens by ourselves. Only Cryptic could provide the avenue for use. You know, like they are doing with the Weekend Tokens.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
> @markhawkman said: > There's nothing you could have done with the tokens anyways.
That's inaccurate. Cryptic could have enabled those to be alternate currency for current FTFO event with a warning that any unused token will vanish on let's say September 1st. Players would have had the whole summer to spend them. Cryptic had A universe of options to choose from.
> @kellmg96#5851 said: > Kael, Kurland, Geco > These 14 days, 3 week events make me want to play LESS, not MORE. > Im so sick of them.
My problem with thos is that they strongly encourage AFK leeching and botting. Crystalline can be done in five minutes (no jokes), and is simple enough. Pahvo Dissention took 16 to 18 minutes, wasn't that simple to understand in the first couple attempts, and, as nothing was done against botting and leeching, it was a pain to run on multiple characters, and I ran it with 4.
> @markhawkman said:
> There's nothing you could have done with the tokens anyways.
That's inaccurate. Cryptic could have enabled those to be alternate currency for current FTFO event with a warning that any unused token will vanish on let's say September 1st. Players would have had the whole summer to spend them. Cryptic had A universe of options to choose from.
Yeah, but that's not their already existing use, that's creating a NEW use for them.
You never said 'existing' use with your original statement.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
> @ltminns said:
> It was NOT a misuse. PERIOD. They were ubiquitous 'Tokens' for said Events. If it were a misuse they would have done what they did with Winter, Summer, and Anniversary Events when they Year locked those. Instead this went on for, what, four years beyond that.
... and it was obvious they were meant to be spent and not warehoused. So, yeah, it's some form of misuse. As you said, it went on for many years, so hoarders had some sort of squatters' right over their misuse. This said, two wrongs don't make a right. Both hoarders and Cryptic are at fault here.
Says who? Certainly not the devs. At least for YEARS until they decided to do this. You can't blame the players for doings things within the system you make for them.
The devs have said many times they want players to play the event-of-the-moment rather than skip them using tokens saved from previous ones.
I knew for a fact they were going to do something about token hoarding as soon as they made the rewards account-wide, because that was the exact same situation as before they made the summer/winter/anniversary tokens year-locked. I wouldn't go as far as calling it obvious, but the signs were in the air for those who were looking for them.
But it's not about blame. Of course you could keep spare tokens, and it's not wrong that people did so. But no future use was ever guaranteed for those tokens, beyond the event where they were given. Just because Cryptic had reused tokens before does not mean they are required to keep doing that forever. People who kept tokens between events were gambling on Cryptic reusing the tokens, and regardless of how many times they'd won that bet before, this time they lost.
When you gamble you may lose. It's nobody's fault.
> @ltminns said:
> It was NOT a misuse. PERIOD. They were ubiquitous 'Tokens' for said Events. If it were a misuse they would have done what they did with Winter, Summer, and Anniversary Events when they Year locked those. Instead this went on for, what, four years beyond that.
... and it was obvious they were meant to be spent and not warehoused. So, yeah, it's some form of misuse. As you said, it went on for many years, so hoarders had some sort of squatters' right over their misuse. This said, two wrongs don't make a right. Both hoarders and Cryptic are at fault here.
Says who? Certainly not the devs. At least for YEARS until they decided to do this. You can't blame the players for doings things within the system you make for them.
The devs have said many times they want players to play the event-of-the-moment rather than skip them using tokens saved from previous ones.
I knew for a fact they were going to do something about token hoarding as soon as they made the rewards account-wide, because that was the exact same situation as before they made the summer/winter/anniversary tokens year-locked. I wouldn't go as far as calling it obvious, but the signs were in the air for those who were looking for them.
But it's not about blame. Of course you could keep spare tokens, and it's not wrong that people did so. But no future use was ever guaranteed for those tokens, beyond the event where they were given. Just because Cryptic had reused tokens before does not mean they are required to keep doing that forever. People who kept tokens between events were gambling on Cryptic reusing the tokens, and regardless of how many times they'd won that bet before, this time they lost.
When you gamble you may lose. It's nobody's fault.
No developer ever said such a thing to me as an official statement. Not verbally and not in writing or in-game, via a message.
It is not the point that Cryptic changes things in the game, i have no problem with that. It is about deleting items (even paid items) from customers without consent from their inventory, without refund or compensation.
Every item in-game has a certain in-game economic value, just deleting them is very customer unfriendly towards players and in particular to players who spend actual money on items. It has nothing to do with gambling. If you classify this as gambling, then every thing in STO is gambling, because we customers do not knew all future changes and their impacts.
My point is that if Cryptic changes things, causing deletion of items, or making items useless, there should be compensation. If Cryptic decides tomorrow to delete all your credits because they want to change things, I would react the same. I would not say to you: "you should have spend your credits while you still could" or "you took the gamble, not spending them, its your own fault you lost them now".
One week notice with no way out. Six weeks for Weekend Tokens with a chance for redemption. You know you're doing wrong when there is very little advanced notice. They just rolled ahead like these other fellows, except we were the ones forced to make the charge:
“Forward, the Light Brigade!” Was there a man dismayed? Not though the soldier knew Someone had blundered. Theirs not to make reply, Theirs not to reason why, Theirs but to do and die. Into the valley of Death Rode the six hundred.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Content is key for stockpiling, people prepare for the inevitable poorly made content arriving and would rather use in game methods that being pushed into a cash shop purchase.
How many people stockpiled the weekend vouchers using sompek so they could avoid kamikaze mary?
How many people will be stockpiling tokens thanks to the push towards running an event for a full 3 weeks to get a ship and the rather bland extra reward offered for the over flow? Or indeed fancy having a buffer in case another lazy pasta phavo happens?
How many stockpile the choice mark reward boxes because they know that some reps become nigh on impossible to earn "properly" otherwise? (comp rep being a prime example)
My point is that if Cryptic changes things, causing deletion of items, or making items useless, there should be compensation. If Cryptic decides tomorrow to delete all your credits because they want to change things, I would react the same. I would not say to you: "you should have spend your credits while you still could" or "you took the gamble, not spending them, its your own fault you lost them now".
It's equivalent to a supermarket having discount coupons then retiring them. They're not legally obligated to let you cash in the coupons after the promotion is over. I actually have some from a contest that was over 20 years ago next to me. I still have them because they're rather generic looking stickers.
My point is that if Cryptic changes things, causing deletion of items, or making items useless, there should be compensation. If Cryptic decides tomorrow to delete all your credits because they want to change things, I would react the same. I would not say to you: "you should have spend your credits while you still could" or "you took the gamble, not spending them, its your own fault you lost them now".
It's equivalent to a supermarket having discount coupons then retiring them. They're not legally obligated to let you cash in the coupons after the promotion is over. I actually have some from a contest that was over 20 years ago next to me. I still have them because they're rather generic looking stickers.
No the deletion of event tokens people payed real money for is not the same as supermarket discount coupons. You don't pay for supermarket reduction coupons. Also on super market reduction coupons clearly the end date of the promotion is written ( in my country that is mandatory).
Supermarket coupons that give discount you could for example compare with the temporary zen reductions in the zen store cryptic puts on the calendar.
But that has nothing to do with the deletion of in-game items from customers inventory without their consent or giving compensation. I am not dissatisfied with temporary discounts, I am dissatisfied with the item deletion, without given refund or compensation.
I don't see how your (@markhawkman) arguments make things right. Its not compensating me and others.
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Indeed, only in case they had clearly put in the description, shown before buying the event tokens, that they will be deleted after the event, they would have had a point. Something like "do you really want to buy this item, be aware after the event it will be deleted or useless". But that did not happen.
The fact that tokens could be used when the event returned, does not show devs intent that these items only were supposed to be valid for 1 time event. I and many customers were not aware this was the devs intend. Simply deleting items from customers inventory is a bad thing.
I have no problem that devs now want to streamline things and simplify the way events functions and reduce the amount of event tokens. But they should have offered a token exchange or refund. Buyers of these tokens could not know on time that devs would change things and were not able to use all their tokens before the change, hence they still had them in their inventory. In case Cryptic would have offered an exchange period, they would not have to delete items.
I agree. Its a bad thing how it was handled. Not customer friendly. And dissatisfaction is expressed. The way it was handled will probably lead to people being more careful spending money on STO. No one likes to spend money on items that get deleted, or made useless, specially when there is no compensation, and customers just have to swallow the bitter pill.
Thanks for your input and thoughts.
Maybe you're right. To me, "this date" refer either to the previously mentioned date in the text but as there aren't any making sense, it seems to refer to some paragraph that got deleted before the final release of the communiqué. To you, it meant the day the post was published. For some, it meant some obscure date between now and August. It could mean something else for somebody else. On the forums I came across at least five people who convinced me that all those interpretations are reasonable. All the devs had to do was to either answer "yes" or "no" when asked about this, yet they eluded the question. And I have to admit that a two days "Weekend event" would be a great way to gather last minute tokens.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
> It was NOT a misuse. PERIOD. They were ubiquitous 'Tokens' for said Events. If it were a misuse they would have done what they did with Winter, Summer, and Anniversary Events when they Year locked those. Instead this went on for, what, four years beyond that.
... and it was obvious they were meant to be spent and not warehoused. So, yeah, it's some form of misuse. As you said, it went on for many years, so hoarders had some sort of squatters' right over their misuse. This said, two wrongs don't make a right. Both hoarders and Cryptic are at fault here.
> lexers615#4253 wrote: »
>
> > @ltminns said:
> > It was NOT a misuse. PERIOD. They were ubiquitous 'Tokens' for said Events. If it were a misuse they would have done what they did with Winter, Summer, and Anniversary Events when they Year locked those. Instead this went on for, what, four years beyond that.
>
> ... and it was obvious they were meant to be spent and not warehoused. So, yeah, it's some form of misuse. As you said, it went on for many years, so hoarders had some sort of squatters' right over their misuse. This said, two wrongs don't make a right. Both hoarders and Cryptic are at fault here.
>
>
>
>
> Says who? Certainly not the devs. At least for YEARS until they decided to do this. You can't blame the players for doings things within the system you make for them.
You clearly haven't read my last two posts in here.
I disagree. It was not obvious, if it was obvious all people would have spend those tokens and there would be no unsatisfied customers now. Also there was no clear expiration date mentioned before the buy was done.
STO has many kinds of items. Its a game in which grinding and collecting thing is a major part of the game play. Many items can be grinded, collected or bought for later use. It is no misuse to keep items that always were usable to be used again at a later moment, in this case when the event returned. In fact because these items always could be used again later, people saved them.
The fact that they could not be used continuously actuality enforced people storing the extra tokens that could be earned or bought for later, to use when the event reoccurred.
Even consumable items do not have an expiration date. You can stockpile them for later use. No one is forcing you to use them. But you still own them. Would be strange if they got deleted form your inventory by Cryptic because they wanted to free up database space or for whatever reason, without compensating the customer for it.
Everything in STO has a certain value or has a certain price. The real misuse here is the deletion of items form customers without their consent and without compensation.
If you do not care losing items without compensation, then please give me all your items you have stockpiled. I bet you will not do that. Which means you also do value your virtual-items, just as I do.
My character Tsin'xing
You are also coming up with the fallacious argument that if something is obvious a bad idea then no one will do it. You know perfectly that there are tons of weirdos doing stupid things on a daily basis (juggling with chainsaws, poking hornet nests, and a lot worse). So far in the thread several people admitted having 20+ tokens on a toon and having continued to gather more without spending then on the extra projects. That was an accident begging to happen. I agree that Cryptic should have issued some form of compensation but hoarders were ALSO wrong in the first place.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
People might feel being "inconvenienced" as some kind of personal slight or a punishment, but it's just a game change that might affect some people negatively. But not all - I can't be the only player that had a lot of uncompleted projects and an extra influx of unexpected marks and Dilithium due to this change. I suspect though that the number of players majorly affected in the first place - positively or negatively - is low, however.
> IF they had not SOLD those tokens for money, I would be more in the whatever camp. And in fact before I realize they sold some of those tokens for money, I very much was in the whatever camp. With the inclusion of actual cash transaction however, I feel they are more in the wrong move than whatever category. If they do something for people who actually bought those items with zen, I will be back to whatever again. For me personally, I kinda like having the unified token. Makes hoarding for the next event even easier. And since I spent NOTHING on those tokens, for me personally, I came out a bit ahead with the change.
More or less how I feel. And in order to implement the change, they didn't HAVE to delete the tokens beforehand. They CHOSE to go buldozing without a fair warning.
My character Tsin'xing
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
> There's nothing you could have done with the tokens anyways.
That's inaccurate. Cryptic could have enabled those to be alternate currency for current FTFO event with a warning that any unused token will vanish on let's say September 1st. Players would have had the whole summer to spend them. Cryptic had A universe of options to choose from.
> Kael, Kurland, Geco
> These 14 days, 3 week events make me want to play LESS, not MORE.
> Im so sick of them.
My problem with thos is that they strongly encourage AFK leeching and botting. Crystalline can be done in five minutes (no jokes), and is simple enough. Pahvo Dissention took 16 to 18 minutes, wasn't that simple to understand in the first couple attempts, and, as nothing was done against botting and leeching, it was a pain to run on multiple characters, and I ran it with 4.
My character Tsin'xing
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I knew for a fact they were going to do something about token hoarding as soon as they made the rewards account-wide, because that was the exact same situation as before they made the summer/winter/anniversary tokens year-locked. I wouldn't go as far as calling it obvious, but the signs were in the air for those who were looking for them.
But it's not about blame. Of course you could keep spare tokens, and it's not wrong that people did so. But no future use was ever guaranteed for those tokens, beyond the event where they were given. Just because Cryptic had reused tokens before does not mean they are required to keep doing that forever. People who kept tokens between events were gambling on Cryptic reusing the tokens, and regardless of how many times they'd won that bet before, this time they lost.
When you gamble you may lose. It's nobody's fault.
No developer ever said such a thing to me as an official statement. Not verbally and not in writing or in-game, via a message.
It is not the point that Cryptic changes things in the game, i have no problem with that. It is about deleting items (even paid items) from customers without consent from their inventory, without refund or compensation.
Every item in-game has a certain in-game economic value, just deleting them is very customer unfriendly towards players and in particular to players who spend actual money on items. It has nothing to do with gambling. If you classify this as gambling, then every thing in STO is gambling, because we customers do not knew all future changes and their impacts.
My point is that if Cryptic changes things, causing deletion of items, or making items useless, there should be compensation. If Cryptic decides tomorrow to delete all your credits because they want to change things, I would react the same. I would not say to you: "you should have spend your credits while you still could" or "you took the gamble, not spending them, its your own fault you lost them now".
“Forward, the Light Brigade!”
Was there a man dismayed?
Not though the soldier knew
Someone had blundered.
Theirs not to make reply,
Theirs not to reason why,
Theirs but to do and die.
Into the valley of Death
Rode the six hundred.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
How many people stockpiled the weekend vouchers using sompek so they could avoid kamikaze mary?
How many people will be stockpiling tokens thanks to the push towards running an event for a full 3 weeks to get a ship and the rather bland extra reward offered for the over flow? Or indeed fancy having a buffer in case another lazy pasta phavo happens?
How many stockpile the choice mark reward boxes because they know that some reps become nigh on impossible to earn "properly" otherwise? (comp rep being a prime example)
My character Tsin'xing
No the deletion of event tokens people payed real money for is not the same as supermarket discount coupons. You don't pay for supermarket reduction coupons. Also on super market reduction coupons clearly the end date of the promotion is written ( in my country that is mandatory).
Supermarket coupons that give discount you could for example compare with the temporary zen reductions in the zen store cryptic puts on the calendar.
But that has nothing to do with the deletion of in-game items from customers inventory without their consent or giving compensation. I am not dissatisfied with temporary discounts, I am dissatisfied with the item deletion, without given refund or compensation.
I don't see how your (@markhawkman) arguments make things right. Its not compensating me and others.