mamalion1234Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,415Arc User
edited July 2017
https://prnt.sc/fq8o84 I have 20% effectiveness against the dummy with 0% resist ignore. when i raise my resist ignore to 82% value i have 100% effectiveness against the dummy. SO it appears that the dummy has 80% damage resist but if ( devs know) apply the damage reduction rule of a 73 enemy vs 70 level player on resist ignore effectiveness too then you need 2% more resist ignore to reach the 100% effectiveness.
I've started testing DR in the new area. For now I've checked only a dozen of mobs, but I think they just added 25% DR to the previous values, so these should be the new DR numbers: Tomorrow I'll continue the test to see if this is correct.
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frozenfirevrMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,475Community Moderator
I've started testing DR in the new area. For now I've checked only a dozen of mobs, but I think they just added 25% DR to the previous values, so these should be the new DR numbers: Tomorrow I'll continue the test to see if this is correct.
Er... So 85% RI is what we should be having now?
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thefabricantMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 5,248Arc User
I've started testing DR in the new area. For now I've checked only a dozen of mobs, but I think they just added 25% DR to the previous values, so these should be the new DR numbers: Tomorrow I'll continue the test to see if this is correct.
I've started testing DR in the new area. For now I've checked only a dozen of mobs, but I think they just added 25% DR to the previous values, so these should be the new DR numbers: Tomorrow I'll continue the test to see if this is correct.
@frozenfirevr Yes, but the Tyrannosaur also has an extra 100% DR when not prone. Probably some enemies in the new dungeon have the same mechanic. I confirm mobs in the new area have 25% more DR. This is the list I’ve made so far (there could be mistakes or missing mobs). Mobs written in red don’t have their Damage Resistance and Resistance Ignored correctly updated for the new area: they still use the old values.
Ofc just found another mob: Eotyrannus (7 hp bars - 74,5 DR - solo skirmisher)
I also gave a look at their Resistance Ignored. A lot of their attacks have 15% RI, but I’ve found some with 30%. In the new dungeon they should have more RI (probably at least 30%), since before mod 12 mobs had no RI in open world.
Post edited by michela123 on
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mamalion1234Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,415Arc User
I've started testing DR in the new area. For now I've checked only a dozen of mobs, but I think they just added 25% DR to the previous values, so these should be the new DR numbers: Tomorrow I'll continue the test to see if this is correct.
The last time before the last patch based on the tests 75% was a mob in a special quest area and king of the spines (heroic encounter boss) had also 75% . if was 75% +25% then now you should see 93.75% dr.
https://prnt.sc/fpmyt2 this test happened previous wednesday which is prior to the last patch. MY character had 0% resist ignore.
@frozenfirevr Yes, but the Tyrannosaur also has an extra 100% DR when not prone. Probably some enemies in the new dungeon have the same mechanic.
Hmm... So is the prone a mechanic and not a bug like it was with dragons? I haven't really played on preview, so if I may, how long does it typically take to prone him?
And, fab's numbers are outdated already eh (EDIT: mmm... I see an exact 10% increase, am I missing something or was everything increased by 10%?)? Geez... Quite a bit of work you both put there... Thanks!
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
Hmm... So is the prone a mechanic and not a bug like it was with dragons? I haven't really played on preview, so if I may, how long does it typically take to prone him?
The mechanic is called Topple and is intended. You can check Asterdahl's post history to read more about it.
We haven't been told if a Toppled dinosaur is supposed to take bonus damage against controlled targets or specifically proned targets (Panther companion active, for example). I'd be very interested to see if someone were willing to test it though.
Sooo, to fight the unproned tyranosaur, you would need 185% resistance ignored..? What's the rough ratio of unproned to proned time..?
Would it be worth sacrificing 8000 pow for 8000 arpen, if you could reach 185% or so RI for the full fight..? If I go all out on arpen, I can hit 187%. Still with around 33k pow, compared to 41k pow with 110% RI. With companion buff, we're talking maybe a 60k pow/187 arpen vs. 70k pow/110%.
Just by looking at the differences, I'm guessing 187% is probably the way to go..? 10k loss on power being about 25% base damage loss, but with a rough 75% increase in effectiveness..?
Once you bring the health down by a certain small percentage, the RI needed drops from 185% to 85% for a period that the dino is in the "toppled" state. Also hitting the dino at the right angle should help place the dino in the "toppled" state faster. How this actually works (different DR from different positions?) I have no clue. But 185% will only be needed for a small percentage of time if you are wanting to totally negate the non toppled DR, and is probably not worth the trouble.
Post edited by niadan on
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frozenfirevrMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,475Community Moderator
Sooo, to fight the unproned tyranosaur, you would need 185% resistance ignored..? What's the rough ratio of unproned to proned time..?
Would it be worth sacrificing 8000 pow for 8000 arpen, if you could reach 185% or so RI for the full fight..? If I go all out on arpen, I can hit 187%. Still with around 33k pow, compared to 41k pow with 110% RI. With companion buff, we're talking maybe a 60k pow/187 arpen vs. 70k pow/110%.
Just by looking at the differences, I'm guessing 187% is probably the way to go..? 10k loss on power being about 25% base damage loss, but with a rough 75% increase in effectiveness..?
I'm wondering about the duration too, but it doubt it's gonna be too long. It'll probably be like the portal phase in Orcus fight. So 185% would be a waste.
Ofc just found another mob: Eotyrannus (7 hp bars - 74,5 DR - solo skirmisher)
I also gave a look at their Resistance Ignored. A lot of their attacks have 15% RI, but I’ve found some with 30%. In the new dungeon they should have more RI (probably at least 30%), since before mod 12 mobs had no RI in open world.
Thank you for these tests.
Brewald - GWF 18.3k Eleonore - CW Mof Renegade 17.5k Harlgard le Vieux - OP Prot 18.3k Valrik - DC AC 18.2k Furiela - SW Temp 18.1k
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gabrieldourdenMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,212Arc User
Hmm... So is the prone a mechanic and not a bug like it was with dragons? I haven't really played on preview, so if I may, how long does it typically take to prone him?
It's a new mechanic called Topple. Asterdahl confirmed it after I reported being able to "prone" Tyrannousaurs even if had no proning powers in the rotation. Before last patch it was extremely easy to topple Tyrannosaurs, T-Rexes, even the King of Spines. Now it takes more time and the topple duration is shorter (this matches a comment by Asterdahl about these monsters being too easy to topple at the time I reported the issue).
Looking at the vids on YouTube of spineking, he doesn't seem to fall over much. I think trying to hit 185% is probably the way to go if you have the opportunity to do so.
The damage reduction effect that toppleable enemies receive when not toppled has been changed from damage resistance to a shield.
As a result of this change, you will now see the text "Unyielding Poise absorbs N damage" when striking a toppleable enemy. (It will absorb 0 damage when the enemy is successfully toppled.)
Toppled enemies will now count as under the effect of a control power, as a result bonuses that affect controlled enemies will now take effect against toppled enemies.
When a toppled enemy is struck, a visual and audio effect will play to indicate that they are taking increased damage.
The purpose of topple as I have stated elsewhere is to add a unique feeling and pacing to encounters with giant enemies, to help reinforce their hulking size. Although we have made overall adjustments to enemy damage resistance in Module 12 to encourage players to seek out new sources of armor penetration, topple was not intended to further increase its desirability.
Given that topple will be limited to a small number of large enemies, a world where its resistance could be circumvented by armor penetration would be encouraging players to waste state allocation on armor penetration, or switch their equipment for a very limited subset of encounters. With that in mind, we made the above adjustments so that armor penetration will no longer improve one's damage against toppleable enemies more than it otherwise already would, given their base resistance.
Thank you all for your continued feedback on this topic!
Are there still what I presume positioning mechanics where certain "angles of attack" are more effective at toppling a dino, or did I read too much into your earlier topple mechanic posts?
Are there still what I presume positioning mechanics where certain "angles of attack" are more effective at toppling a dino, or did I read too much into your earlier topple mechanic posts?
It's still the case that attacking from certain angles will cause an enemy to topple sooner.
I also think that increase of damage resistance of mobs it a good change. I just get tired from too easy "runs". It's not what a dungeon should be. I hope content in m12 will change this.
is -4k power +4k penetration the difference? that is not so big difference.
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when i raise my resist ignore to 82% value i have 100% effectiveness against the dummy.
SO it appears that the dummy has 80% damage resist but if ( devs know) apply the damage reduction rule of a 73 enemy vs 70 level player on resist ignore effectiveness too then you need 2% more resist ignore to reach the 100% effectiveness.
Tomorrow I'll continue the test to see if this is correct.
Your so fine you blow my mind...
Hey Miche (la)...
Hey Miche (la)...
Now that damn song is in all your heads too...lol
I confirm mobs in the new area have 25% more DR. This is the list I’ve made so far (there could be mistakes or missing mobs). Mobs written in red don’t have their Damage Resistance and Resistance Ignored correctly updated for the new area: they still use the old values.
Ofc just found another mob: Eotyrannus (7 hp bars - 74,5 DR - solo skirmisher)
I also gave a look at their Resistance Ignored. A lot of their attacks have 15% RI, but I’ve found some with 30%. In the new dungeon they should have more RI (probably at least 30%), since before mod 12 mobs had no RI in open world.
https://prnt.sc/fpmyt2 this test happened previous wednesday which is prior to the last patch.
MY character had 0% resist ignore.
And, fab's numbers are outdated already eh (EDIT: mmm... I see an exact 10% increase, am I missing something or was everything increased by 10%?)? Geez... Quite a bit of work you both put there... Thanks!
We haven't been told if a Toppled dinosaur is supposed to take bonus damage against controlled targets or specifically proned targets (Panther companion active, for example). I'd be very interested to see if someone were willing to test it though.
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When I said 25% more DR I meant compared to mod 11 mobs.
Would it be worth sacrificing 8000 pow for 8000 arpen, if you could reach 185% or so RI for the full fight..? If I go all out on arpen, I can hit 187%. Still with around 33k pow, compared to 41k pow with 110% RI. With companion buff, we're talking maybe a 60k pow/187 arpen vs. 70k pow/110%.
Just by looking at the differences, I'm guessing 187% is probably the way to go..? 10k loss on power being about 25% base damage loss, but with a rough 75% increase in effectiveness..?
Eleonore - CW Mof Renegade 17.5k
Harlgard le Vieux - OP Prot 18.3k
Valrik - DC AC 18.2k
Furiela - SW Temp 18.1k
@michela123 : grazie come sempre
Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
Given that topple will be limited to a small number of large enemies, a world where its resistance could be circumvented by armor penetration would be encouraging players to waste state allocation on armor penetration, or switch their equipment for a very limited subset of encounters. With that in mind, we made the above adjustments so that armor penetration will no longer improve one's damage against toppleable enemies more than it otherwise already would, given their base resistance.
Thank you all for your continued feedback on this topic!
Are there still what I presume positioning mechanics where certain "angles of attack" are more effective at toppling a dino, or did I read too much into your earlier topple mechanic posts?