Most might see that as a throwaway line, but I think there's more to it than that. It could show a motivation behind why the Aetherians see the Borg as such a threat. Because they were at one time targeted by the Borg of their universe.
You know... thinking about that, and Kumaaarke's trauma... could be something there.
I missed that in my first playthrough, good catch. Yeah Kuumarkee could be that personal encapsulation of what's happening with the Aetherian species, and it's interesting in that light how they focus on "unity" so much (which is also a Borg aspiration, however twisted in their view.) Eg. has the trauma of the Aetherians led them to (culturally) assimilating the outlook of their past aggressors, not completely but enough to create problems next episodes.
Ex. we find a *nice* Borg collective in the next alternate universe, or an issue develops in our universe between the Cooperative and Aetherians. Cue then Kuumarkee helping the Aetherians let go and not do a needless murder. That also gives a third option to the question of are the Aetherians going to turn evil or stay unambiguously good. We can end up in temporary conflict but resolve in a happy place in the arc's finale.
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
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We did learn one bit of interesting background about the Aetherians though. The Aetherian Captain actually said his people had been decimated by the Borg in the past.
Most might see that as a throwaway line, but I think there's more to it than that. It could show a motivation behind why the Aetherians see the Borg as such a threat. Because they were at one time targeted by the Borg of their universe.
You know... thinking about that, and Kumaaarke's trauma... could be something there.
There could be more to it, yes. At the same time I'm not really surprised and I doubt that it means much more.
I mean, the Borg did some serious damage to other species in universes where they exist? Who would've guessed?
Given that even the Q seem to fear the Borg at some level, it makes sense for powerful-but not-almighty species to have suffered or remain at risk from suffering from them.
We're at a point where the Cryptic team is being shuffled off for a new group, so the creative spark/oomph in design is something that can absolutely take a hit. We aren't seeing the team at its best, its partial strength and dealing with the emotions of losing their longtime colleagues and work for the sake of a holding company's whims (ultimately, they didn't want to keep Cryptic around but DECA stepped in to take over the game...as their new thing.) Its' doing *enough* to keep the game going but the inspired touches and careful balance of player experience (something Cryptic can struggle with at the best of times) I'm not expecting. Part of me wishes the team got to make a proper farewell out of this arc, quickly jumping to an ending to make a proper send off for Cryptic and optimistic expression for what stories DECA will tell (as human creators, with the new devs making the most of a corporate situation). But that evidently hasn't been in the cards. So cue business as normal with a brittle smile and depressed feel to design.
Eg. it's worth playing these missions with that in mind because you're not going to see the best of level design, writing, and execution. To me this arc's been stumbling all year but that's what you get when you demolish a company, starting with the mass layoffs for unannounced games and then the gradual replacement of Cryptic for DECA. As flawed as these missions may be, it's some of the last work of this team (if not the last for those that recently left us). It's worth enjoying, for whatever it is, on that basis. Because for all the bad here, you still have the remaining Cryptic team trying to finish its last arc as they wanted to tell it. I'll let them stumble as much as they need to do that.
yeah that's a convenient excuse, but this arc has been on the drawing boards for over a year, well before the deca thing was announced. there was a thread about suggestions for the summer event and one of the devs, maybe it was tacofangs, mentioned how long it takes to build this sort of stuff. I know from my last job, how long software can take to code, and that was not MMO stuff it was management software, and that could take 12-18 months. with a smaller team than cryptic has.
I was disappointed with this episode, it could of used some iconian heralds helping us in the begging especially since we are messing around with their technology. maybe and inquisitor in an obelisk carrier with a defiler for the ground part that would have been neat but i think cryptic forgot about the iconian arc and presumed them dead for some reason.
spoiler alert the borg queen had incorrect ears.
These Iconians were of a different universe, why would they have Heralds? Cryptic did not forget about our Iconians, they are technically in hiding.
why wouldn't the AlterIconians not have servitors?
see this episode could easily have been stretched to another episode, a purely diplomatic affair with the PC going to OUR Iconia and negotiating for a copy of the world heart to replace the lost one in AlterIconia. Our Iconian World Heart may have even been incorporated with the Bad guy iconian tech and knowledge, allowing for the AlterIconians (yes I am really liking that word) to militarize and kick some Borg Butt
yeah that's a convenient excuse, but this arc has been on the drawing boards for over a year, well before the deca thing was announced. there was a thread about suggestions for the summer event and one of the devs, maybe it was tacofangs, mentioned how long it takes to build this sort of stuff. I know from my last job, how long software can take to code, and that was not MMO stuff it was management software, and that could take 12-18 months. with a smaller team than cryptic has.
A season is developed in a 3-4 month period, starting with the completion of the last one (with respect to each department, with some buffer time to fix bugs if available). Cryptic has a drawing board for how an arc will go and *maybe* what will follow but they can absolutely change that approach. This was done for slotting in Age of Discovery after Victory is Life (which interrupted plans that it took the Terran arc to circle around again, in heavily altered form), in needing to shift from one desired cameo to another based on actor availability (which happened for the last arc), and in shifting the implementation of arcs based on player responses and feedback (even to the limited extent of "oh players didn't like that, I'll tweak things next time"). Within Age of Discovery there was a plan to tell parallel arcs between Killy and J'Ula but that immediate season plan was very quickly abandoned to focus on J'Ula and then, much later, focus back on terrans (with Killy in a minor supporting role.) From a cursory examination of recent STO history and cognizance of what the devs have told us, there's wiggle room in how they execute things (white board outline =/= contract). And here you're talking about huge shifts in veteran personnel, with new folks moving up into positions and making decisions in those roles. See also what happened when STO leadership changed between Victory is Life and Age of Discovery...
The Cryptic team is fundamentally different, and increasingly so, and the decisions made on how to proceed season to season cannot possibly be expected to be 1:1 if the old guard was still at their desks with no disruption to their longstanding working relationships and environment. Their original arc outline is not a detailed bible for how to proceed and even as something as elementary as *interpreting* that plan will change if you put someone new in the role. Not the least of which because with changes in the number of available personnel, thus the scope of planned updates from anything the team might have envisioned in early 2023 will not be executable. Conscious changes will be made out of necessity. Then add in all of the above, plus changes from shifting available collaborators and the discussions they would have had about how to proceed with the season/arc (layering indirect effects on top of direct effects).
It's convenient to look at only *some* parts of development for the sake of a desired outlook. Look at the whole picture and consider accordingly, and appreciate that even if it means gamers can't reasonably moan about content at quite the same volume as they'd would like to (as in in this case the context of the team is likely driving notable implementation issues, not decisions. Thus the normal feedback process is moot as there's no decision to modify with player data. Constraint is shaping development and nothing short of throwing a couple billion at Embracer last year will change that for this season). It's also convenient to hold that management software experience is equivalent to crafting a narrative product (changes to which are entirely incomparable to targeting a software package's design goals), despite your own experiences with the game and its release dynamics, and to hold that outside work as actually supporting your assumed argument here (losing senior personnel in any project is going to affect its development pace and trajectory).
Post edited by duncanidaho11 on
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
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ok, you know far more about the schedules at Cryptic than a developer does whatever flaost your boat
No I more accurately remember what's been said than you, likely have more experience sitting in those conversations, and don't assume magic time dilation's occurring between when the current (small scale) dev team is available to start work on a new season given the output of the last. Even if you assume the team started work on a season 6 months ago, to match a 3-4 month release cadence their work will have finished in a 3-4 month window on that season (plus buffer time for bug fixes) to be able to contribute to the next release. The only exception to this was expansions and parallel groups of developers, which banked extra work over time to be able to build to the big release despite a fixed team size. Those were abandoned to spare that work to improve seasons (given available personnel after the shift of STO to then third fiddle between Magic Legends [defunct] and Neverwinter) which thereby shifted the time between work and execution to a much more consistent, immediate scale. We've watched Taco (2409 FED interior update) and Thomas (T'Varo update) livestream modeling work for upcoming content to match this cadence to boot. And when it comes to timing out suggestions for Risa, you just need to make sure you're hitting a planning stage of development (ie. >4 months out) rather than mid flow. Because that raises the bar that suggestion needs to meet to "stop the presses, we need to throw everything aside to make this" which no forum suggestion is reasonably going to achieve. Hence why I posted some early winter event suggestions here this month (to make doubly sure that was available for when it can influence the process).
When someone uses more specific, relevant detail than you in a conversation, you may want to actually listen rather than doubling down on vague suppositions and irrelevant attitude. You may learn something. That does not mean adopting all of my opinions. It just means being able to better function than throwing a quip back to hit the point of "nya uh."
Living isn't about proving what you thought was right, whatever that meant 5 minutes ago, because that's laughably irrelevant. It's making sure you improve yourself to the best possible degree, ensuring that you're as on point as possible for a brain powered meat volume at a keyboard.
Which this IP has banged on about at some length. If you're not going to listen to me, maybe you just need to spend more time internalizing what's been told to you through the media you care about. Don't do a disservice to yourself in trying to score fake internet points on a forum.
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
The story arc alternative universe theme is ok i suppose. *thinks to self- what the hades are reality vertices/tethers, does that even make sense by definition of the word reality? At first i thought they had assimilated founders when i saw the new enemy. I played as a jem hadar and i did like how some of the npc's responded to the fact a "dominion" captain/vessel was coming to aid their efforts. The mission played well, nothing broken. Thought the voice acting and sound quality was good.
I deleted the reward and didn't even know it couldn't be banked. I delete most rewards these day due to their vfx/sfx and "new" trek influence.
The story arc alternative universe theme is ok i suppose. *thinks to self- what the hades are reality vertices/tethers, does that even make sense by definition of the word reality?
.
Reality vertices: reference point in the structure of reality
Reality tethers: something binding to a facet of reality's structure
It's Trek, technobabble comes with the territory and it's not always meant to be cleanly interpretable as the ambiguity and confusion can help sell how beyond normal human experience the magic pew pews are.
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
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IDK - Even as a Star Trek story for me it was a bit too self referential and small universe. Tasha yar becomes a Borg AQueen and is fighting her daughter Sela??
I mean she's conquered the majority of the Galaxy and in numerous confrontations Queen Tasha has never managed to assimilate her daughter?
And it seems they finally managed to find a Voice Over Director that works well with Denise Crosby as at least her voice acting improved a fair bit, which was nice.
But overall yeah, whatever story there is seems to be meandering around; and these "Control' Borg were easier than even the regular STO Borg. Must be pretty wimpy if yeah, they're still fighting to control the Galaxy after 100 years at it. The Iconians of this alternate dimension seemed wimpier as well compared to the STO Ionians we fought in the Iconian War Arc.
IDK - If this story (such as it is) is just going to devolve into "Help random Dimension fight off their local Borg infestation..." <-- yeah that's already getting old. Thought we would get more with 'The Borg King' and the 'tougher' version of the Borg.
Plus 4 episodes in what 18 months? Seems STO is fast approaching Maintenance Mode at warp speed.
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
But overall yeah, whatever story there is seems to be meandering around; and these "Control' Borg were easier than even the regular STO Borg. Must be pretty wimpy if yeah, they're still fighting to control the Galaxy after 100 years at it. The Iconians of this alternate dimension seemed wimpier as well compared to the STO Ionians we fought in the Iconian War Arc.
Why does this universe need to swing with the bravado of the Warhammer 40k universe to be valid? Wimpy is fine, especially when that's applied across all factions. That characterizes the universe. Not every parallel dimension has the same tone as others, nor try to one up each other in who can be the most hardcore.
Plus 4 episodes in what 18 months? Seems STO is fast approaching Maintenance Mode at warp speed.
The season cadence is exactly the same. What we've seen in recent arcs is what could have been dual episodes lumped together in LOOOONG eps. The break doesn't seem to be necessary anymore for folks to play through, though I'd argue the length of the last two prior episodes reached an excessive point that should have welcomed an episode split. This season was refreshing as in for once this arc it felt like we had an older style STO episode (doesn't hit a double feature length stretch). Eg. we actually saw a measurable decrease in shipped content. See also the simplicity of the new TFO.
And that's down to the transition between Cryptic and DECA. Ie. we've lost senior personnel who didn't want to switch to the new remote pay grade, meager benefits, and EU work hours (with more to be lost as their longtime colleagues leave, the culture changes and new opportunities for their talents and experience open up) but their replacements haven't come back online. Eg. this isn't linear path to maintenance mode (as would be the case if Embracer had just shuttered or spun down Cryptic without a subsidiary coming in to rescue STO/NW/Champs). We're in the midst of a big shift in who's running the game (with every anticipation by DECA to support STO at equal or greater strength) with the new people still in the process of being hired and trained (the two latest being hugely talented folks who've been part of the STO community and care deeply about continuing the game right). It's an inflection point between who's still on board to work on STO, and who's coming up to work on STO in future. And Cryptic isn't (somehow and crappily) denying its staff other opportunities (very hard to come by with the decimation of studios over the past year) when they arise to force them to stay so we don't experience any hiccups in the volume of stuff delivered each season.
The bare fact we got the usual system update + episode + TFO + lock box/update is impressive given the team's present circumstances, and the event is giving us 500 lobi + account gold phoenix tokens to help mitigate for the enthusiasm dip of the transition.
Eg. the sky isn't falling because of this and what'll likely be a couple more lighter seasons. Use thinky powers to reconcile new information to adjust expectations, and know this slightly subdued pace isn't a permanent shift. STO is once again changing hands, this time while live. It's a TRIBBLE situation for the current team, but our *stuff* is fine. As a community, that's worth keeping in mind, not only to keep ourselves sane as we deal with this change from our side, but so we can show some appreciation to the folks who made the stuff we care about while they're still here and within relatively easy reach.
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
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If realities are linked together by vortices, tethers and maybe even a nice bowknot to top it off, it does leave me wondering whether we can really talk of 'realities' or a 'different reality'.
Seems like it's all just one reality with different layers. After stuff like death and all other things that are supposed to be consequential, I guess 'reality' is just one more of those concepts that are losing all meaning due to all this multiverse sillyness.
If realities are linked together by vortices, tethers and maybe even a nice bowknot to top it off, it does leave me wondering whether we can really talk of 'realities' or a 'different reality'.
Seems like it's all just one reality with different layers. After stuff like death and all other things that are supposed to be consequential, I guess 'reality' is just one more of those concepts that are losing all meaning due to all this multiverse sillyness.
I'm not a fan, if that wasn't clear.
Then you'll want to stay away from Heinlein's later works, as they involve a multiversal theory in which each universe is either a quantum-mechanical-style spinoff (ie, the first universe Jacob Burroughs translated to, where he wound up in what seemed like his own garage until he noticed that none of the labels on his gear contained the letter "J"), or is created by fictions from other universes (as in the team arriving in Barsoom and Oz, and at one point being hailed by a Lensman before winding up aboard the Dora from Heinlein's own Lazarus Long universe).
Meanwhile, why our "reality" remains significant is because it's our reality. As I note whenever the subject of quantum multiverse theory comes up at another website, the fact that some other guy in some other reality looks like me and shares my DNA doesn't make him me - as of the point where our universes split, his different experiences and reactions made him a completely different person, and his existence would not invalidate my own. In this episode's case, that version of my captain died at the Battle of the Wormhole, her ship burning off Bajor. But that never happened to Capt. BadName1701, commander of USS InvalidEntityName-B, from the main STO timeline. They were different people entirely, because they had different lives.
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,671Community Moderator
Well we already know that the multiverse is connected thanks to USS Discovery having to destroy the ISS Charon before it poisons the Network to such a degree that it kills all life in all realities.
The fact that we're seeing events in alternate realities being connected through various means here is just more proof that realities are connected.
I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite colored text = mod mode
Well we already know that the multiverse is connected thanks to USS Discovery having to destroy the ISS Charon before it poisons the Network to such a degree that it kills all life in all realities.
The fact that we're seeing events in alternate realities being connected through various means here is just more proof that realities are connected.
That was established long before the first episode of Discovery streamed. Way back in 1993 with TNG S7 Paralells
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
Well we already know that the multiverse is connected thanks to USS Discovery having to destroy the ISS Charon before it poisons the Network to such a degree that it kills all life in all realities.
The fact that we're seeing events in alternate realities being connected through various means here is just more proof that realities are connected.
That was established long before the first episode of Discovery streamed. Way back in 1993 with TNG S7 Paralells
Technically, it was even before that, in the 1967 TOS episode Mirror, Mirror. Back then, multiple-universe/cross-time stories were very popular in novels by a lot of the top sci-fi novel writers like Andre Norton, Robert A. Heinlein, H. Beam Piper, and others, so it is natural that some of it would find its way into Trek.
Done right, stories like that have almost limitless potential. For instance, Andre Norton's Witch World has dozens of books published over four decades without ever getting stale. And in the case of Trek the differences between the various series and movies and whatnot pretty much require multiple universes/timelines/whatever to resolve the often-glaring inconsistencies each incarnation of the show have from the differing viewpoints of the various production teams (PIC is the poster child of that, each season is practically a different series, though they all have problems).
Did anyone else notice a sliding effect during ground combat in this mission?
I did not have the ice boots equipped on any character, but they appear to be sliding even before combat so the borg nanite wires are not responsible.
That is unless the effect lingers after combat.
Edit: or the Control Borg sprayed the whole sphere with lubricant to allow for the tentacle npc movement effect.
This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
Did anyone else notice a sliding effect during ground combat in this mission?
I did not have the ice boots equipped on any character, but they appear to be sliding even before combat so the borg nanite wires are not responsible.
That is unless the effect lingers after combat.
Edit: or the Control Borg sprayed the whole sphere with lubricant to allow for the tentacle npc movement effect.
Didn't notice that during the event, but running the new TFO on another toon I did notice a bit of sliding during the phases where the Nanite Tentacles show up. Wonder if it's a side effect of the tech that makes the Tentacles possible.
Did anyone else notice a sliding effect during ground combat in this mission?
I did not have the ice boots equipped on any character, but they appear to be sliding even before combat so the borg nanite wires are not responsible.
That is unless the effect lingers after combat.
Edit: or the Control Borg sprayed the whole sphere with lubricant to allow for the tentacle npc movement effect.
I think the Control Borg might be using a version of the Frictionless Particle Grenade of the Intel spec. It does use a texture that looks like the Control nanites, after all.
So many possible puns for slippery Borg, but best not to utter them on a forum for all ages.
Edit: Just one to get it out of the system.. Friction is Futile.
Post edited by questerius on
This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,671Community Moderator
I think the Control Borg might be using a version of the Frictionless Particle Grenade of the Intel spec. It does use a texture that looks like the Control nanites, after all.
I think so too. Control Borg have a Section 31 connection after all. Makes sense they might use a few intel abilities on us.
I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite colored text = mod mode
It's a shame the sto wiki is not yet updated for this mission.
E.g. the control skirmisher appears to have a Tetryon Minigun and the Control Tentacles exert some intel abilities.
First time i ran this mission i was caught off guard by the Site-to-site ensnare and went down after being swarmed by 20+Tentacles.
I use intel in my ninja ground build and it was unpleasant to have my ninja engineer with paper thin defenses, reliant on stealth, turned the table on.
As a proper XB i adapted, but it was a surprise.
This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
It's a shame the sto wiki is not yet updated for this mission.
E.g. the control skirmisher appears to have a Tetryon Minigun and the Control Tentacles exert some intel abilities.
First time i ran this mission i was caught off guard by the Site-to-site ensnare and went down after being swarmed by 20+Tentacles.
I use intel in my ninja ground build and it was unpleasant to have my ninja engineer with paper thin defenses, reliant on stealth, turned the table on.
It's a shame the sto wiki is not yet updated for this mission.
E.g. the control skirmisher appears to have a Tetryon Minigun and the Control Tentacles exert some intel abilities.
First time i ran this mission i was caught off guard by the Site-to-site ensnare and went down after being swarmed by 20+Tentacles.
I use intel in my ninja ground build and it was unpleasant to have my ninja engineer with paper thin defenses, reliant on stealth, turned the table on.
As a proper XB i adapted, but it was a surprise.
You could always update it yourself.
Sure, that is assuming i had time to assemble the data and write the article.
That commodity, time, is sadly not abundant,
This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
This may seem like a throwaway episode, but there is an underlying arc here. What does it mean that so many Borg leaders are being defeated? Think about it. Power vacuums get filled. The question is how. Will the new leaders originate in the given 'timeline'? Or will there be a multi-dimensional alignment of all these different types of Borg? The new TFO sort of hints at that, given that we get random encounters will so many different sorts.
One of the Lukari ships entered the Aetherian dimension. They came back... Brainwashed? The Aetherians are also very interested in Undine space for some reason.
And now we have one of the Aetherians seemingly blow himself up as a last defence mechanism.
What if they seeded their entire dimension with some form of nanites? Someone else, somewhere (don't remember exactly where, but it was in another thread here) suggested that they may have found the ideal way to establish 'harmony' and all the other stuff they talk about.
It would be kind of like what the Undine did with their dimension.
One other thing:
during the episode, someone said something like 'ah, the Iconian World Heart', as if they had been waiting for the moment to get close to it. I don't think it was any kind of Borg who said it, it certainly didn't sound like the voices they use for player characters. Somehow I'm thinking that the Aetherians were after this World Heart.
We know that, in our dimension, it contained all sorts of biological and technical data. It is heavily implied that without it, the Iconians couldn't produce normal Heralds, hence the demon versions we encounter. What if, in order to assimilate large parts of each dimension, the Aetherians need some sort of key knowledge of the major species living in it? The World Heart contains everything they could possible need to know of the Iconians, so that would explain their interest in it.
I know I'm not connecting the dots very well here, but then again, there are a lot of dots to connect.
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,671Community Moderator
So far the Aetherians have been helpful. Could they be a form of Benevelent Enemy in the future? Not sure. As of right now though we just don't know what will happen next. We've got the Mirror Borg that have taken a massive blow, and now the Control Borg are advancing in one universe but aren't exactly the multiversal threat the Mirror Borg were. At least not yet.
Honestly it is hard to say what could be the big threat since we've dealt blows to two different Borg groups. Could this lead to a confrontation with our own Borg as well? Are the Aetherians waiting to stab us in the back? Is this all just Borg on Borg action and we don't even know it?
We'll just have to wait and see how this arc progresses. Also if Captain Sela might be used as a way to bring back a character that's in prison on a more regular basis as well. Like she comes over to our universe sort of thing. Who knows.
I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite colored text = mod mode
I hope the Aetherians don't turn out to be just another backstabber, that trope is way, way overused nowadays, and Trek has traditionally been more about the road least travelled, not part of Hollywoods cynical traffic jam of lemmings. Jumping into the middle of the "anything good has to be a trick" pack mentality is the expected thing, something actually surprising would be to make it look like they are heading for that worn out trope but have a plot twist where the "too good to be true" aliens actually ARE as morally good as they seem.
That could still produce some friction, of course, and the tension could make diplomacy rather brittle at times if the devs were subtle enough with it, which would be good off-the-beaten-path storytelling. Playing the Aetherian/Borg arc straight also would be an excellent way to resolve the current problem of STO being too far in the future to effectively do SNW content while at the same time Paramount seems to be ramping up that era and giving later eras a rest, by way of making certain beachheads in parallel universes whose fates are somehow tied together on an ongoing basis.
It is one way Paramount's era-blindness actually works in STO's favor since they have already established that despite the look of technology and some minor size changes in certain props Star Trek suffers from the same effective tech stagnation as Star Wars and it really does not matter much what era the heroes come from, their neat toys are all pretty much just as effective in any other era as the tech of whatever era they are in.
I hope the Aetherians don't turn out to be just another backstabber, that trope is way, way overused nowadays, and Trek has traditionally been more about the road least travelled, not part of Hollywoods cynical traffic jam of lemmings. Jumping into the middle of the "anything good has to be a trick" pack mentality is the expected thing, something actually surprising would be to make it look like they are heading for that worn out trope but have a plot twist where the "too good to be true" aliens actually ARE as morally good as they seem.
That's why I said earlier that if you must make the Aetherians the villains make them a "means good but is too naive/obsessed to notice they're problem not the solution" kind of villain where they're essentially as good as they seem.
Making them a backstabber is a path to cynicism best left in Warhammer, in Trek there's other ways then "Blood for the Blood God!"
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I missed that in my first playthrough, good catch. Yeah Kuumarkee could be that personal encapsulation of what's happening with the Aetherian species, and it's interesting in that light how they focus on "unity" so much (which is also a Borg aspiration, however twisted in their view.) Eg. has the trauma of the Aetherians led them to (culturally) assimilating the outlook of their past aggressors, not completely but enough to create problems next episodes.
Ex. we find a *nice* Borg collective in the next alternate universe, or an issue develops in our universe between the Cooperative and Aetherians. Cue then Kuumarkee helping the Aetherians let go and not do a needless murder. That also gives a third option to the question of are the Aetherians going to turn evil or stay unambiguously good. We can end up in temporary conflict but resolve in a happy place in the arc's finale.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
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There could be more to it, yes. At the same time I'm not really surprised and I doubt that it means much more.
I mean, the Borg did some serious damage to other species in universes where they exist? Who would've guessed?
Given that even the Q seem to fear the Borg at some level, it makes sense for powerful-but not-almighty species to have suffered or remain at risk from suffering from them.
yeah that's a convenient excuse, but this arc has been on the drawing boards for over a year, well before the deca thing was announced. there was a thread about suggestions for the summer event and one of the devs, maybe it was tacofangs, mentioned how long it takes to build this sort of stuff. I know from my last job, how long software can take to code, and that was not MMO stuff it was management software, and that could take 12-18 months. with a smaller team than cryptic has.
why wouldn't the AlterIconians not have servitors?
see this episode could easily have been stretched to another episode, a purely diplomatic affair with the PC going to OUR Iconia and negotiating for a copy of the world heart to replace the lost one in AlterIconia. Our Iconian World Heart may have even been incorporated with the Bad guy iconian tech and knowledge, allowing for the AlterIconians (yes I am really liking that word) to militarize and kick some Borg Butt
A season is developed in a 3-4 month period, starting with the completion of the last one (with respect to each department, with some buffer time to fix bugs if available). Cryptic has a drawing board for how an arc will go and *maybe* what will follow but they can absolutely change that approach. This was done for slotting in Age of Discovery after Victory is Life (which interrupted plans that it took the Terran arc to circle around again, in heavily altered form), in needing to shift from one desired cameo to another based on actor availability (which happened for the last arc), and in shifting the implementation of arcs based on player responses and feedback (even to the limited extent of "oh players didn't like that, I'll tweak things next time"). Within Age of Discovery there was a plan to tell parallel arcs between Killy and J'Ula but that immediate season plan was very quickly abandoned to focus on J'Ula and then, much later, focus back on terrans (with Killy in a minor supporting role.) From a cursory examination of recent STO history and cognizance of what the devs have told us, there's wiggle room in how they execute things (white board outline =/= contract). And here you're talking about huge shifts in veteran personnel, with new folks moving up into positions and making decisions in those roles. See also what happened when STO leadership changed between Victory is Life and Age of Discovery...
The Cryptic team is fundamentally different, and increasingly so, and the decisions made on how to proceed season to season cannot possibly be expected to be 1:1 if the old guard was still at their desks with no disruption to their longstanding working relationships and environment. Their original arc outline is not a detailed bible for how to proceed and even as something as elementary as *interpreting* that plan will change if you put someone new in the role. Not the least of which because with changes in the number of available personnel, thus the scope of planned updates from anything the team might have envisioned in early 2023 will not be executable. Conscious changes will be made out of necessity. Then add in all of the above, plus changes from shifting available collaborators and the discussions they would have had about how to proceed with the season/arc (layering indirect effects on top of direct effects).
It's convenient to look at only *some* parts of development for the sake of a desired outlook. Look at the whole picture and consider accordingly, and appreciate that even if it means gamers can't reasonably moan about content at quite the same volume as they'd would like to (as in in this case the context of the team is likely driving notable implementation issues, not decisions. Thus the normal feedback process is moot as there's no decision to modify with player data. Constraint is shaping development and nothing short of throwing a couple billion at Embracer last year will change that for this season). It's also convenient to hold that management software experience is equivalent to crafting a narrative product (changes to which are entirely incomparable to targeting a software package's design goals), despite your own experiences with the game and its release dynamics, and to hold that outside work as actually supporting your assumed argument here (losing senior personnel in any project is going to affect its development pace and trajectory).
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
No I more accurately remember what's been said than you, likely have more experience sitting in those conversations, and don't assume magic time dilation's occurring between when the current (small scale) dev team is available to start work on a new season given the output of the last. Even if you assume the team started work on a season 6 months ago, to match a 3-4 month release cadence their work will have finished in a 3-4 month window on that season (plus buffer time for bug fixes) to be able to contribute to the next release. The only exception to this was expansions and parallel groups of developers, which banked extra work over time to be able to build to the big release despite a fixed team size. Those were abandoned to spare that work to improve seasons (given available personnel after the shift of STO to then third fiddle between Magic Legends [defunct] and Neverwinter) which thereby shifted the time between work and execution to a much more consistent, immediate scale. We've watched Taco (2409 FED interior update) and Thomas (T'Varo update) livestream modeling work for upcoming content to match this cadence to boot. And when it comes to timing out suggestions for Risa, you just need to make sure you're hitting a planning stage of development (ie. >4 months out) rather than mid flow. Because that raises the bar that suggestion needs to meet to "stop the presses, we need to throw everything aside to make this" which no forum suggestion is reasonably going to achieve. Hence why I posted some early winter event suggestions here this month (to make doubly sure that was available for when it can influence the process).
When someone uses more specific, relevant detail than you in a conversation, you may want to actually listen rather than doubling down on vague suppositions and irrelevant attitude. You may learn something. That does not mean adopting all of my opinions. It just means being able to better function than throwing a quip back to hit the point of "nya uh."
Living isn't about proving what you thought was right, whatever that meant 5 minutes ago, because that's laughably irrelevant. It's making sure you improve yourself to the best possible degree, ensuring that you're as on point as possible for a brain powered meat volume at a keyboard.
Which this IP has banged on about at some length. If you're not going to listen to me, maybe you just need to spend more time internalizing what's been told to you through the media you care about. Don't do a disservice to yourself in trying to score fake internet points on a forum.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
I deleted the reward and didn't even know it couldn't be banked. I delete most rewards these day due to their vfx/sfx and "new" trek influence.
Reality vertices: reference point in the structure of reality
Reality tethers: something binding to a facet of reality's structure
It's Trek, technobabble comes with the territory and it's not always meant to be cleanly interpretable as the ambiguity and confusion can help sell how beyond normal human experience the magic pew pews are.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
I mean she's conquered the majority of the Galaxy and in numerous confrontations Queen Tasha has never managed to assimilate her daughter?
And it seems they finally managed to find a Voice Over Director that works well with Denise Crosby as at least her voice acting improved a fair bit, which was nice.
But overall yeah, whatever story there is seems to be meandering around; and these "Control' Borg were easier than even the regular STO Borg. Must be pretty wimpy if yeah, they're still fighting to control the Galaxy after 100 years at it. The Iconians of this alternate dimension seemed wimpier as well compared to the STO Ionians we fought in the Iconian War Arc.
IDK - If this story (such as it is) is just going to devolve into "Help random Dimension fight off their local Borg infestation..." <-- yeah that's already getting old. Thought we would get more with 'The Borg King' and the 'tougher' version of the Borg.
Plus 4 episodes in what 18 months? Seems STO is fast approaching Maintenance Mode at warp speed.
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
Why does this universe need to swing with the bravado of the Warhammer 40k universe to be valid? Wimpy is fine, especially when that's applied across all factions. That characterizes the universe. Not every parallel dimension has the same tone as others, nor try to one up each other in who can be the most hardcore.
The season cadence is exactly the same. What we've seen in recent arcs is what could have been dual episodes lumped together in LOOOONG eps. The break doesn't seem to be necessary anymore for folks to play through, though I'd argue the length of the last two prior episodes reached an excessive point that should have welcomed an episode split. This season was refreshing as in for once this arc it felt like we had an older style STO episode (doesn't hit a double feature length stretch). Eg. we actually saw a measurable decrease in shipped content. See also the simplicity of the new TFO.
And that's down to the transition between Cryptic and DECA. Ie. we've lost senior personnel who didn't want to switch to the new remote pay grade, meager benefits, and EU work hours (with more to be lost as their longtime colleagues leave, the culture changes and new opportunities for their talents and experience open up) but their replacements haven't come back online. Eg. this isn't linear path to maintenance mode (as would be the case if Embracer had just shuttered or spun down Cryptic without a subsidiary coming in to rescue STO/NW/Champs). We're in the midst of a big shift in who's running the game (with every anticipation by DECA to support STO at equal or greater strength) with the new people still in the process of being hired and trained (the two latest being hugely talented folks who've been part of the STO community and care deeply about continuing the game right). It's an inflection point between who's still on board to work on STO, and who's coming up to work on STO in future. And Cryptic isn't (somehow and crappily) denying its staff other opportunities (very hard to come by with the decimation of studios over the past year) when they arise to force them to stay so we don't experience any hiccups in the volume of stuff delivered each season.
The bare fact we got the usual system update + episode + TFO + lock box/update is impressive given the team's present circumstances, and the event is giving us 500 lobi + account gold phoenix tokens to help mitigate for the enthusiasm dip of the transition.
Eg. the sky isn't falling because of this and what'll likely be a couple more lighter seasons. Use thinky powers to reconcile new information to adjust expectations, and know this slightly subdued pace isn't a permanent shift. STO is once again changing hands, this time while live. It's a TRIBBLE situation for the current team, but our *stuff* is fine. As a community, that's worth keeping in mind, not only to keep ourselves sane as we deal with this change from our side, but so we can show some appreciation to the folks who made the stuff we care about while they're still here and within relatively easy reach.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Seems like it's all just one reality with different layers. After stuff like death and all other things that are supposed to be consequential, I guess 'reality' is just one more of those concepts that are losing all meaning due to all this multiverse sillyness.
I'm not a fan, if that wasn't clear.
Meanwhile, why our "reality" remains significant is because it's our reality. As I note whenever the subject of quantum multiverse theory comes up at another website, the fact that some other guy in some other reality looks like me and shares my DNA doesn't make him me - as of the point where our universes split, his different experiences and reactions made him a completely different person, and his existence would not invalidate my own. In this episode's case, that version of my captain died at the Battle of the Wormhole, her ship burning off Bajor. But that never happened to Capt. BadName1701, commander of USS InvalidEntityName-B, from the main STO timeline. They were different people entirely, because they had different lives.
The fact that we're seeing events in alternate realities being connected through various means here is just more proof that realities are connected.
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That was established long before the first episode of Discovery streamed. Way back in 1993 with TNG S7 Paralells
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
Technically, it was even before that, in the 1967 TOS episode Mirror, Mirror. Back then, multiple-universe/cross-time stories were very popular in novels by a lot of the top sci-fi novel writers like Andre Norton, Robert A. Heinlein, H. Beam Piper, and others, so it is natural that some of it would find its way into Trek.
Done right, stories like that have almost limitless potential. For instance, Andre Norton's Witch World has dozens of books published over four decades without ever getting stale. And in the case of Trek the differences between the various series and movies and whatnot pretty much require multiple universes/timelines/whatever to resolve the often-glaring inconsistencies each incarnation of the show have from the differing viewpoints of the various production teams (PIC is the poster child of that, each season is practically a different series, though they all have problems).
I did not have the ice boots equipped on any character, but they appear to be sliding even before combat so the borg nanite wires are not responsible.
That is unless the effect lingers after combat.
Edit: or the Control Borg sprayed the whole sphere with lubricant to allow for the tentacle npc movement effect.
Edit: Just one to get it out of the system.. Friction is Futile.
I think so too. Control Borg have a Section 31 connection after all. Makes sense they might use a few intel abilities on us.
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E.g. the control skirmisher appears to have a Tetryon Minigun and the Control Tentacles exert some intel abilities.
First time i ran this mission i was caught off guard by the Site-to-site ensnare and went down after being swarmed by 20+Tentacles.
I use intel in my ninja ground build and it was unpleasant to have my ninja engineer with paper thin defenses, reliant on stealth, turned the table on.
As a proper XB i adapted, but it was a surprise.
You could always update it yourself.
Sure, that is assuming i had time to assemble the data and write the article.
That commodity, time, is sadly not abundant,
One of the Lukari ships entered the Aetherian dimension. They came back... Brainwashed? The Aetherians are also very interested in Undine space for some reason.
And now we have one of the Aetherians seemingly blow himself up as a last defence mechanism.
What if they seeded their entire dimension with some form of nanites? Someone else, somewhere (don't remember exactly where, but it was in another thread here) suggested that they may have found the ideal way to establish 'harmony' and all the other stuff they talk about.
It would be kind of like what the Undine did with their dimension.
One other thing:
during the episode, someone said something like 'ah, the Iconian World Heart', as if they had been waiting for the moment to get close to it. I don't think it was any kind of Borg who said it, it certainly didn't sound like the voices they use for player characters. Somehow I'm thinking that the Aetherians were after this World Heart.
We know that, in our dimension, it contained all sorts of biological and technical data. It is heavily implied that without it, the Iconians couldn't produce normal Heralds, hence the demon versions we encounter. What if, in order to assimilate large parts of each dimension, the Aetherians need some sort of key knowledge of the major species living in it? The World Heart contains everything they could possible need to know of the Iconians, so that would explain their interest in it.
I know I'm not connecting the dots very well here, but then again, there are a lot of dots to connect.
Honestly it is hard to say what could be the big threat since we've dealt blows to two different Borg groups. Could this lead to a confrontation with our own Borg as well? Are the Aetherians waiting to stab us in the back? Is this all just Borg on Borg action and we don't even know it?
We'll just have to wait and see how this arc progresses. Also if Captain Sela might be used as a way to bring back a character that's in prison on a more regular basis as well. Like she comes over to our universe sort of thing. Who knows.
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colored text = mod mode
That could still produce some friction, of course, and the tension could make diplomacy rather brittle at times if the devs were subtle enough with it, which would be good off-the-beaten-path storytelling. Playing the Aetherian/Borg arc straight also would be an excellent way to resolve the current problem of STO being too far in the future to effectively do SNW content while at the same time Paramount seems to be ramping up that era and giving later eras a rest, by way of making certain beachheads in parallel universes whose fates are somehow tied together on an ongoing basis.
It is one way Paramount's era-blindness actually works in STO's favor since they have already established that despite the look of technology and some minor size changes in certain props Star Trek suffers from the same effective tech stagnation as Star Wars and it really does not matter much what era the heroes come from, their neat toys are all pretty much just as effective in any other era as the tech of whatever era they are in.
Making them a backstabber is a path to cynicism best left in Warhammer, in Trek there's other ways then "Blood for the Blood God!"