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Coming Soon! Energy Credit Cap Adjustments (PC and Console)

borticuscrypticborticuscryptic Member Posts: 2,478 Cryptic Developer
Star Trek Online has grown and changed significantly over the years, and its in-game economy is no exception to this. These days, it's easy to find players at various levels of wealth struggling with a few aspects of the energy credit economy. For example, players without the energy credit cap unlock have found that some items have grown just out of reach. Meanwhile, other wealthier players want to sell their hard-to-get items for more than the Exchange allows.

In an attempt to address these preferences, and to help keep Star Trek Online accessible and fun for as many players as possible, we are increasing the energy credit cap for all players, increasing the exchange maximum sell price, and increasing the amount of energy credits the account bank can hold. These changes will appear in a patch coming to both PC and Console very soon. We know the economy's health in Star Trek Online is important to keep a close eye on, so we'll be watching the results of these changes to see if additional adjustments may be needed.

Here is a breakdown of before/after for these upcoming changes:

Exchange Maximum Listing Price
• WAS = 750,000,000
• NOW = 1,500,000,000

Energy Credit Cap for Gold Players on PC and All Console Players
• WAS = 1,000,000,000
• NOW = 2,000,000,000

Energy Credit Cap for Silver Players on PC
• WAS = 10,000,000
• NOW = 15,000,000

Account Bank Energy Credit Cap for All Players
• WAS = 500,000,000
• NOW = 1,000,000,000

Along with the above changes, we’ve made some relevant UI tweaks to allow for these larger values with fewer faults or formatting errors.

** NOTE: The above changes are subject to change
Jeremy Randall
Cryptic - Lead Systems Designer
"Play smart!"
«1345

Comments

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    legendarylycan#5411 legendarylycan Member Posts: 37,280 Arc User
    so, just out of curiosity and assuming you're allowed to answer, what is the absolute maximum the EC cap could be boosted to before it hits the engine's hardcoded limit?​​
    Like special weapons from other Star Trek games? Wondering if they can be replicated in STO even a little bit? Check this out: https://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1262277/a-mostly-comprehensive-guide-to-star-trek-videogame-special-weapons-and-their-sto-equivalents

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    leemwatsonleemwatson Member Posts: 5,344 Arc User
    edited June 2017
    so, just out of curiosity and assuming you're allowed to answer, what is the absolute maximum the EC cap could be boosted to before it hits the engine's hardcoded limit?​​

    If it was significantly higher, they wouldn't have only increased it to what it is now. The hard-coded limit is around 3 to 4 Billion IRC. Why invite the chance to cause issues by going towards the hard-coded limit that you would obviously ask for!?

    If an when the game becomes 64-bit, there won't be issues for a short time, until people find the limit and inflate the prices.
    "You don't want to patrol!? You don't want to escort!? You don't want to defend the Federation's Starbases!? Then why are you flying my Starships!? If you were a Klingon you'd be killed on the spot, but lucky for you.....you WERE in Starfleet. Let's see how New Zealand Penal Colony suits you." Adm A. Necheyev.
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    theskyguy21#2477 theskyguy21 Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    Great another Opportunity for some Players to charge overprice things at the exchange.
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    darkbladejkdarkbladejk Member Posts: 3,715 Community Moderator
    Extremely disappointed in this development as there is no reason for these increases save to benefit a very select few people. The only limit that should have even been increased at all was to raise the exchange to 1b to keep it in line with the current cap. If you want to cause inflation this is how you do it among a few other factors at play.
    "Someone once told me that time was a predator that stalked us all our lives. I rather believe that time is a companion who goes with us on the journey and reminds us to cherish every moment, because it will never come again." - Jean Luc Picard in Star Trek Generations

    Star Trek Online volunteer Community Moderator
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    psiameesepsiameese Member Posts: 1,646 Arc User
    So incentive continues for Silver players to go Gold or Lifetime, should they want to buy any high-end exchange items over their EC cap (now 15,000,000). I suppose there is method to that business approach.
    (/\) Exploring Star Trek Online Since July 2008 (/\)
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    crm14916crm14916 Member Posts: 1,516 Arc User
    More ships & items will be further out of reach of most players, even gold/lts players...
    "Equipped with his five senses, man explores the universe around him and calls the adventure science." - Edwin Hubble
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    gaevsmangaevsman Member Posts: 3,190 Arc User
    I think i'll be able to buy a Ent-J with those prices, so, i'm kinda happy with that..
    The forces of darkness are upon us!
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    tobiashirttobiashirt Member Posts: 630 Arc User
    Out of all the ways to go at the problem, this seems the most short-term approach. It does nothing about the supply of ec, and really only allows more to be squirrled away. The new limits will be hit in short order by those who are able, but this might work for market competition on the really expensive ships. Prices will only go up on something that the market for can be cornered, and I doubt that'll happen with promo ships, at least for awhile until the new bank limits get met and more ec gets amassed.
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    dwolf1400dwolf1400 Member Posts: 37 Arc User
    Now if you would boost the amount of dilithium we could refine per day. I know we can do 8,000, then the fleet mine has another 500 per day and the veteran refiner on SFA and the KA can do 1,000 every two days. (Technically 9,000 a day)

    What about boosting that to 10k per day.
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    nommo#5819 nommo Member Posts: 1,105 Arc User
    I'm glad for the increase for Silver & Gold members & their banks, but the Exchange price limit has me weary thinking that might just drive prices higher so this could contribute to inflation of STO. Just like in real-life some of these changes will seem to help the top 1%ers that can influence the market whereas I hope it helps the normal players enough too.

    Every MMO goes through & has to deal with this economic situation. An MMO's economy grows, inflation hits a little or a lot, there's natural spikes & drops based upon supply & demand, game-play, & also artificial market manipulation too, then eventually the economy has such disparity that only the players that have played a long time have enough currency to compete market-wise & then new players slowly stop playing because they can see the writing on the wall.

    It's already happening with even more common game items from Mk II through the mid-levels at high prices for new players but if an already established player you can probably bank-roll or craft the items for a new character. Then a significant drop in price back to a more normal price range for Mk XI-XII until Very Rare.

    Thank goodness STO is a pretty generous game, if not the most generous of MMOs, even for it's free-to-play players. Most mission rewards are very good & can be earned with just an investment of time with patience. I'm glad Cryptic is taking a measured approach towards this dilemma.
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    darkbladejkdarkbladejk Member Posts: 3,715 Community Moderator
    When people have to use keys as a currency, the price of keys goes up.

    When the price of keys goes up, the price of all lockbox derived items and all lobi items goes up for everyone.

    This change will be a benefit to everyone except people who flip promo ships for profit.

    You and I both I'm sure would agree supply and demand can be and is often the major factor driving the in game economy. A key issue this game suffers from is there is too much of an EC supply with nothing to remove excess EC from the game. Phoenix Prize packs do a fairly good job at removing some of the excess dilithium from the game which keeps the zen-dilithium exchange rate at fairly reasonable levels. EC has no such equivalent which is one reason you see the hyper inflation of the game today. All this will do is allow even more EC supply to enter the game causing further dilution of the EC supply and even greater inflation of various prices within the game.

    Increasing the exchange limit to keep it in line with the current cap, that I actually agreed with as if someone is able to earn the EC cap in a single sale then more power to them. Allowing people to carry additional EC does not solve the problem we have no and will at best extend that problem out to a later date. Eventually the excess supply of EC MUST be addressed as was done with the excess dilithium supply. Increasing the supply one can hold does without adding an EC sink only makes the problem as a whole worse.
    Think about this.

    Is there a limit to the size of a bank account in real life? Or a limit to how much money a store can charge?

    No? Why isnt a car a trillion dollars? Why isnt a chocolate bar a million dollars?

    "caps" dont create or limit prices.

    In real life no there is no limit to how much an account can hold. The difference here is that there is a hard coded limit as to how much a person can hold. This limit is due to technological limitations otherwise the limit could be whatever the devs and players wanted it to be. Depending on the item there actually is a limit to how much a store can charge for something as there are laws to prevent price gouging. An example being the aids pill fairly recently. The pill was affordable for most people yet the guy decided to jack the price up tremendously potentially putting alot of lives in danger. They were smacked hard by government for price gouging as a result. Price gouging is not present in all cases but there are items that do have a limit to them. The best example of this though would be loans. Regarding banks and personal loans you can't legally charge interest above a certain percentage as it's considered usury. There are limits in place in certain items, though you would be correct this is not always the case.

    Using the car example, someone can ask that trillion dollars all they want but no one is going to pay that price. In order to receive said price you must be able to justify said price and cost to people. If someone is going to charge $1trillion for a car, there needs to be roughly $1trillion worth of car there or something to justify the cost. Caps on their own do not limit price no, that you are correct on. However when paired with a sink of some type then a cap as well as the sink can and will reduce prices.
    "Someone once told me that time was a predator that stalked us all our lives. I rather believe that time is a companion who goes with us on the journey and reminds us to cherish every moment, because it will never come again." - Jean Luc Picard in Star Trek Generations

    Star Trek Online volunteer Community Moderator
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    grithokgrithok Member Posts: 14 Arc User
    As an older returning player, I have learned that I can not afford to buy much or anything with EC and with these changes I probably never will. The exchange doesn't have anything that I can afford. I have a huge barrier to enter the economy. Letting inflation runaway seems to be a problem and I may never catch up to it.
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    brudisiousbrudisious Member Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited June 2017
    great give the black market sites exactly what they want to make their profits easier to manage. they'll sell the star ships on the exchange for a higher premium to make more money from suckers who buy EC from them. because lets be honest with ourselves the literal only things that GET that high of an asking price on the exchange is your BULL TRIBBLE lockbox ships and specialty R&D ships which cost a fortune for those unlucky enough to NOT have the resources of these sites that can shell out tons money for get a many copies of these ships and turn right around and sell them for a premium. jemhadar strike ships and timeline dreadnought ships from r*D packs go for over 300$ ALONE. but you dev's dont care you still get YOUR cut in the long run dont you? its a TRIBBLE up cycle. they will sell you EC to go and buy a ship on the exchange that THEY'RE selling. and they even sell ships flat out and trade them to you or mail them to you directly. ive tried telling you people this in emails before. SELL THE SHIPS ON Z-STORE FOR A PREMIUM PER CHARACTER!!! keep the lockboxes dont get rid of those, instead offer up sets to go along with the ships that you sell on the zstore, shileds, eng, core, deflector. make those a drop from the box but increase the odds of getting one of those to make it more fair. say 2.5%-10% keep other loot the same drop rate or adjust accordingly, then have a weapon set for each ship on the lobi store to give players something to spend those lobi on in addition to a lobi store ship. you could easily make over 100-200 dollars. THAT way AND you'd have more players willing to buy lock boxes and the ships just to complete the set! and at the very least you can still get 60 from every player who bought the ship outright from the z-store! AND THE BEST PART?! you take away the bread and butter that the black market sites use to make a profit OFF YOUR GAME..... the lockbox ships. take those out of the equation and i promise you'd get more revenue to make this game better!

    i have and legitimate concern and opinion and i will not be silenced!
    Post edited by brudisious on
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    desdinova216desdinova216 Member Posts: 34 Arc User
    as far as why the cap is being raised to 2b and not higher is possibly (I am not a dev or a programmer) is that internally the economic system uses signed integers and the largest 32 bit signed integer is 2,147,483,648 so set at 2b for simplicity
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    where2r1where2r1 Member Posts: 6,054 Arc User
    No squirrels working over at my accounts...I spend EC like a mad woman.
    "Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK

    “Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
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    rattler2rattler2 Member Posts: 58,020 Community Moderator
    dwolf1400 wrote: »
    Now if you would boost the amount of dilithium we could refine per day. I know we can do 8,000, then the fleet mine has another 500 per day and the veteran refiner on SFA and the KA can do 1,000 every two days. (Technically 9,000 a day)

    What about boosting that to 10k per day.

    The Dilithium Economy is touchier than the EC Economy. Any influx of Refined Dilithium in any large quantities drives the exchange rate UP. This is usually seen a few days after people start finishing DL flooding events like Mirror. More noticeable after Crystalline. Increasing the refine cap will flood the market with supply, driving prices up unnecessarily.
    db80k0m-89201ed8-eadb-45d3-830f-bb2f0d4c0fe7.png?token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJzdWIiOiJ1cm46YXBwOjdlMGQxODg5ODIyNjQzNzNhNWYwZDQxNWVhMGQyNmUwIiwiaXNzIjoidXJuOmFwcDo3ZTBkMTg4OTgyMjY0MzczYTVmMGQ0MTVlYTBkMjZlMCIsIm9iaiI6W1t7InBhdGgiOiJcL2ZcL2ExOGQ4ZWM2LTUyZjQtNDdiMS05YTI1LTVlYmZkYmJkOGM3N1wvZGI4MGswbS04OTIwMWVkOC1lYWRiLTQ1ZDMtODMwZi1iYjJmMGQ0YzBmZTcucG5nIn1dXSwiYXVkIjpbInVybjpzZXJ2aWNlOmZpbGUuZG93bmxvYWQiXX0.8G-Pg35Qi8qxiKLjAofaKRH6fmNH3qAAEI628gW0eXc
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    jslynjslyn Member Posts: 1,784 Arc User
    Is there a limit to the size of a bank account in real life?


    The volume of the building in which you are trying to put your money.

    Or a limit to how much money a store can charge? ... Why isnt a chocolate bar a million dollars?


    Yes. It is called 'price control'. It was originally created in the year 301 by Roman Emperor Diocletian in his Edict of Maximum Prices. Although, the idea did not really gain wide scale traction until 1793 when it was implemented by France's Committee of Public Safety.

    Were you under the impression that chocolate bars fell in to the same price range by coincidence?
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    meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,594 Arc User
    Extremely disappointed in this development as there is no reason for these increases save to benefit a very select few people. The only limit that should have even been increased at all was to raise the exchange to 1b to keep it in line with the current cap. If you want to cause inflation this is how you do it among a few other factors at play.


    ^^ Everything he said!
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    startrekronstartrekron Member Posts: 231 Arc User
    Awesome could we get the daily Dilithium cap raised when this happens?

    "Live Long and Prosper but always carry a fully charged phaser, just in case!". Arrr'ow

    Co-Leader of Serenity's Grasp
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    szimszim Member Posts: 2,503 Arc User
    Fantastic. Though I would have prefered the new caps to be set even higher. Allowing for most promo ships to once again be listed on the exchange will greatly increase transparency, as the master key currency market is very shady and easy to manipulate.

    And inflation ist most certainly NOT caused by EC cap increase. That's the most ridicoulus statement I've ever heard. Like in real life, if you were to limit all personal bank accounts to to capped at 100'000$, inflation would be a thing of the past. :D A cap increase is a reaction to inflation, not the other way around.
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    trillbuffettrillbuffet Member Posts: 861 Arc User
    crm14916 wrote: »
    More ships & items will be further out of reach of most players, even gold/lts players...

    Yeah I know a guy has been a few years now since that mail fiasco where there was no adequate way to store doffs other than the mail system. So they basically destroyed hundreds of trillions worth of doffs from this player which I doubt he'd ever come back after that. Its mainly to cater to a certain group of players and not the entire community of players when it boils down to it.

    Although when they nerfed that contraband method some of us in KDF used for so long and had heavily invested into it they could have solved the problem making it account bound and put in a sliding scale on just dropping it all at once and adjust the time until delivering it to make it easier but they just decided to put another nail in the coffin especially to the long time kdf players.
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    sarah2774sarah2774 Member Posts: 238 Arc User
    All promo ships regardless of exchange EC cap will be listed at the maximum listing price when it comes out. It better the exchange EC cap is not increase as it will only benefit the greedy. With higher cap it will take a longer time for price to drop to market prices and not speculative prices.
    Promo ships are using master key currency market which limits their sales to trading channel. This cause them to try to rush the sale and lower prices of the items to actual market prices and not speculative prices.
    OPv9m3F.jpg
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    salazarrazesalazarraze Member Posts: 3,794 Arc User
    This is a great move. Anybody that can't see this is just plain dumb.

    With the increase of the exchange posting limit, promo ships that are not on the exchange at prices between 750M and 1.5B will now actually be on the exchange. What does that mean? It means that everything can be done out in the open now. Prices can be measured ACCURATELY instead of just guessed at in private trades.

    It will be harder to swindle and harder to get swindled. This is a great move, and anybody saying otherwise just doesn't know jack or is probably a rip-off artist that's pissed off.
    When you see "TRIBBLE" in my posts, it's because I manually typed "TRIBBLE" and censored myself.
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    protoneousprotoneous Member Posts: 2,985 Arc User
    I'm really thankful for this EC cap increase. It'll come in real handy having 1 billion in my account bank and another 2 billion EC on me just in case I ever need to purchase two ships.
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    knockedup#2486 knockedup Member Posts: 32 Arc User
    Great another Opportunity for some Players to charge overprice things at the exchange.
    Players can "charge overprice things at the exchange" all they want, and it won't do them any good as long as nobody's buying...
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