Man, that's a special brand of self-gimp pain you're reaching for there. I mean, I know I got everyone started on the whole Protonic Polaron Turrets kick here, but I honestly can't fathom the notion that Dyson Science Consoles might be useful even compared to bog standard ordinary Science Consoles ... let alone Embassy Plasma ones or science heavy Research Lab ones.
1. 2/3rds of the skill boost of practically ANY other type of console available, so you already start pretty deep in the hole, meaning they're self-gimped BY DESIGN.
2. They do Proton Damage that isn't boosted by Proton Damage Enhancement. Thanks Cryptic!
3. They're triggered by Drain Skills (not drain procs, unfortunately!) and by Exotic Damage Skills (but not Proton Burn Damage procs from Protonic Polaron Weapons, unfortunately!).
Eh...In total im only down 50 EPG points vs Plasma Exploders of Epic Quality.But the Shield Refrequencers are boosted by EPG points so thats nice..since regular proton boosts are few and far between..
438 EPG is 7,133 Proton Damage (from the tool tip) vs 3,257.2 Plasma Damage for 4 of plasma consoles, which do not benefit from EPG)..Average damage was 7.7k with 77 activation's in a 10 min ISA on my Eng toon.(TRIBBLE team but good sample time for the ability).Swaped out the Shield consoles for Exploders and got 7.8k ave damage with 130 activations in a 7 min ISA run.
There are 7 abilities on my ship that can trigger these consoles..2 are every 15 seconds.I wonder if DRB could trigger them per pulse..
But your right..these are not the Plasma Exploder consoles..The Exploders have a 2 fold advantage damage wise over the Shield Refrequencer ..The Exploders trigger off Energy weapons which benefit from Haste,allowing for more applications...And..The Exploders can be boosted by all of the "All Damage Boost" abilities.
These are not things the Shield consoles get..Additionally they do not benefit from "x% Exotic Damage Boost" Consoles..
They also get stuck with the "0% critical chance" stuff the Exploders finally got.
Also I would point out these are not DOT's (The Shield Refrequencer) so the Temporal Specialization stuff doesn't seem like it would apply..
So Maybe Cryptic might take pity on these consoles and grant them Either a damage boost and/or a crit chance (Based on Science RnD Trait plz) given the reduced number of EPG points..Annnd maybe bump the % chance to...25%...or ..50% chance to proc using the already identified, compatible science abilities...Given that the Exploders proc 2x as often as the Shield consoles (which have a higher proc % but tons of long abilities)
That's some very interesting data you've managed to pull out there. So it looks like (on paper at least, using napkin math) that with a high enough [EPG] you can actually turn the Shield Refrequencers into something (almost) useful. Unfortunately, they just (Kirk to Khan) "keep missing the target" of being actually useful in any clear cut way.
So they're buffed by [EPG] but don't count as Exotic Damage, despite the fact that they're not coming from a Weapon, or even because a Weapon got activated. This means they don't get any +% bonus damage to Exotic Damage, and have a 0% chance for a Critical Hit, even though they are buffed by [EPG] and thus ought to be subject to the Science 15 R&D Trait, but aren't.
The Proton Damage that they do doesn't match ANY of the standard Energy Weapon Damage types, but still can't be buffed by Proton Damage buffing Tactical Consoles, which only affect Weapons (of which there are *ONLY TWO* in the entire game (The Experimental Proton Weapon and the Cannons that can't be unequipped from the DSD) and they're both not only Unique but one of them can't even be Upgraded! Other than those two weapons, the only other way to deliver Proton Damage is either by procs (Protonic Polarons or Shield Refrequencers) or by Nukara Web Mines and other Tholian Tech.
The Shield Refrequencers are designed in such a way that they're only going to be worth a THIRD LOOK (never mind a first or second) if you're running a Science Ship with at least 4 if not 5 Science Consoles and are prepared to fill each and every single one of those slots with a Shield Refrequencer [EPG] and can load up on Exotic Damage and Shield Drain BOff Skills to proc them.
By the time you get done jumping through all those hoops, your ship winds up being so hyperspecialized that there's barely any room left for anything else. It's just too "demanding" to be practical for something that doesn't work the way you'd expect it to work. It's a case of needing to go all out just to deliver underwhelming performance.
So yeah, there's a reason why these things are so rightly (and resoundingly) shunned. It's SAD, but it's not irrational.
And the Shield Heal they do falls into the "what's your point?!?" category in the current game meta. Just yet another aspect of how these items are so lacking in redeeming qualities.
They could have been designed to synergize with Protonic Polaron Weapon damage procs ... but they don't.
They could have been designed to synergize with Protonic Polaron Weapon drain procs ... but they don't.
They could have been designed to take advantage of Proton Damage buffs ... but they don't.
They could have been designated to do Exotic Damage to synergize with other things ... but they weren't.
And Cryptic has had YEARS (plural!) to do something about this state of affairs ... and they haven't.
Kinda makes you wonder what it would take to get them to sit up and take notice and DO SOMETHING about it ... even if that's something as small as a "you make a good point, maybe we should look into that" comment.
They could have been designed to take advantage of Proton Damage buffs ... but they don't.
[/quote]
So I would say the fact these dont take advantage of Proton Damage buffs is a good thing. EPG points take em further an the tac consoles could with fewer downsides. (50 EPG points are easily made up using temporal spec)...
It is sad these dont benefit from the RnD Sci trait or the Sci ultimate, "All Damage Buffs," a stronger shield restore proc (Given how much the Qphase torpedo removes even at low Drain expertise..) and doesnt help these proc less than the exploders Despite a higher starting % (I Blame the longer cooldowns of Sci abilites and few per pulse/shot mechanics)..
So here's a sideline question that I've been wondering about for a while now.
What is the best Proton Burn proc support you can reach for?
Some things are obvious ... like using Vulnerability Locators in your Tactical Consoles, as well as the Precision and Enhanced Rending Shots to maximize the "tempo" of Critical Hits (and thus opportunities for Proton Burn procs). After that, you've got [CrtH]x2 on the Protonic Polaron weapons themselves and as many Superior Romulan Operative Bridge Officers as you can amass (up to 5?), which basically means needing to be a Romulan Captain (with Romulan Operative also). Use of [Acc]x2 on the weapons and the Accurate personal space trait offer additional "back door" ways to produce increases in Critical Hit chance via Accuracy Overflow mechanics, although not quite as efficiently as [CrtH]x2. And, of course, there's the Science Ultimate of being able to set your Critical Hit chance to 50% for 15-30 seconds.
But then in your Science Consoles, Deflector (and Secondary Deflector) slots and elsewhere, you're looking at wanting to maximize the amount of [EPG] and/or [DrainX] that you can get to either maximize the Proton Burn damage procs and/or the Power Drain potential available in Polaron style procs (to "turn the lights off") and "backdoor disable" your target without resorting to an actual Disable. The problem is that with [DrainX], it really is a case of More Is Never Enough ... while [EPG] has a natural cut off point of 250 for the R&D 15 Science Trait (which isn't a hard stopping point).
So the question then becomes one of ... if you're trying to build a [DrainX]+[EPG] build to support both sides of Protonic Polarons (both drain and burn procs) ... what are going to be the optimal choices of Deflector(s), Impulse, Core, Deflector and Universal Consoles (all slotted into Engineering) you could pick for a Romulan Captain that you could be going for ... and in which ship? Obviously the "free" Dyson Science Destroyer isn't going to be the optimal ship for this, since the DSD Bundle Pack would have ships with +1 Console slot relative to that, but it does make for a "you must be better than THIS to meet this challenge" sort of minimum baseline to start from for the purposes of conversation. I'd also expect the new T6 Destroyer Bundle Pack to be a part of the contenders for consideration.
So if building for a [DrainX] AND [EPG] optimizing build organized around Polaron Drain and Proton Burn procs ... how would you go about doing it?
So if building for a [DrainX] AND [EPG] optimizing build organized around Polaron Drain and Proton Burn procs ... how would you go about doing it?
As one who worships at the altar of the demon goddess that is EPG, I see a potential problem here.
-to make the most of EPG, you need GW3, which requires a Cmdr Sci seat. GW1 is a limpdick substitute.
-to make the most of GW, you need 250 CtrlX, and at least 350-400 EPG.
-pumping up EPG, and CtrlX, and DrainX is possible, but it doesn't leave much room for optimizing anything else.
You're going to need a very careful selection of Research Lab Sci consoles, and an equally careful selection of Deflector dish, not to mention a very expensive Engineering console. I'm not saying it's impossible, by any means, but it won't be easy and it won't be cheap, and it will require making some significant compromises in other areas.
On the other hand, having said all that, I have to add that you have demonstrated a truly astonishing ability to create excellent game configurations. So I have confidence that if anyone can create this three-headed dragon, you can.
New Romulus Command Advanced Prototype Space Set 2-piece set bonus (+17.5 Starship Exotic Particle Generator)
So if you're looking for "as balanced as you can get" outside of Science Consoles and Weapons, you're probably wanting to look at something like this, maybe?
Omega Force Tachyon Deflector Array
+17.5 Starship Weapon Accuracy
+17.5 Starship Exotic Particle Generator
+35 Starship Control Expertise
+17.5 Starship Drain Expertise
+17.5 Starship Perception
+ [DrainX] at ultra rare
Delta Alliance Hyper-Efficient Impulse Engines
+35 Control Expertise
+16 Flight Speed
+18 Turn Rate
+5 Engine Power
Full Impulse
All Power to Engines
+122.7 Flight Speed
Diverts all power to engines
Temporal Defense Initiative Overcharged Singularity Core
+5 to 15 Auxiliary Power, based on your Singularity charge level
Maximum Warp Factor 14
Reduces the cooldown time on Singularity Power use by 10%
0.2 Slipstream Speed bonus
+35 Starship Exotic Particle Generator
Improved Plasma Shockwave
to target:20% chance to Disable 1 Subsystem for 7.5 seconds
Trajector Jump
Trajector Warp Core: Self Teleport
to self: teleport 5km forward of your current facing.
+4,755 Stealth for 2 sec
Temporal Defense Initiative Regenerative Shield Array
+26.2 Starship Drain Expertise
+6,800 Maximum Shield Capacity
(10% Bleedthrough)
393.5 Shield Regeneration every 6 seconds
Passive Shield Regeneration increases as your shields are damaged, up to a 100% increase
Reduces All Energy Damage to Shields by 10%
Temporal Defense Initiative Starship Technologies
2 Set Bonus: Predictive Decay Algorithms
+25% All Damage for Damage-Over-Time and Hazard effects
Interestingly enough, for non-Romulan captains (who also won't have access to Superior Romulan Operative for all Bridge Officer Stations), the only Warp Core that offers a modifier we're interested in is the Delta Alliance Trajector Warp Core, which yields this not quite as well balanced combination when swapped in ...
Omega Force Tachyon Deflector Array
+17.5 Starship Weapon Accuracy
+17.5 Starship Exotic Particle Generator
+35 Starship Control Expertise
+17.5 Starship Drain Expertise
+17.5 Starship Perception
+ [DrainX] at ultra rare
Delta Alliance Hyper-Efficient Impulse Engines
+35 Control Expertise
+16 Flight Speed
+18 Turn Rate
+5 Engine Power
Full Impulse
All Power to Engines
+122.7 Flight Speed
Diverts all power to engines
Delta Alliance Trajector Warp Core
50% cooldown reduction to all Transwarp abilities
+7.5 additional Shield Power
+5 Maximum Shield Power
Maximum Warp Factor 10
+17.5 Starship Shield Subsystem Performance
Adds 7.5% of your Auxiliary Power to your Shield Power
+17.5 Starship Drain Expertise
+17.5 Starship Electro-Plasma Systems
Trajector Jump
Trajector Warp Core: Self Teleport
to self: teleport 5km forward of your current facing.
+4755 Stealth for 2sec
Temporal Defense Initiative Regenerative Shield Array
+26.2 Starship Drain Expertise
+6,800 Maximum Shield Capacity
(10% Bleedthrough)
393.5 Shield Regeneration every 6 seconds
Passive Shield Regeneration increases as your shields are damaged, up to a 100% increase
Reduces All Energy Damage to Shields by 10%
Delta Alliance Assault
2 Set Bonus: Improved Evasive Maneuvers
+25% Defense when using the Evasive Maneuvers Ability
And at the end of all of THAT "napkin math" analysis, it starts looking even more like if you're wanting to use Protonic Polarons for maximum effectiveness, you really need to be playing a Romulan captain ... both for Superior Romulan Operative (x5) plus having Romulan Operative on your captain, as well as also being able to squeeze +175 points of combined [CrtlX] [DrainX] and [EPG] out of your Deflector, Impulse, Core and Shield slots ... which now that I'm looking at it I'm thinking, "whoa..." even though they're almost evenly distributed between the three modifiers such that none of them are overwhelmingly awesome.
Still ... +70 [CtrlX], +52.5 [DrainX] and +52.5 [EPG] is nothing to sneer at when it's coming from outside your Console Slots, right?
After this, it's just Weapon Set Bonuses (and Weapon Set Consoles) and then deciding how to "balance" the Research Lab Consoles into delivering a most EFFICIENT way to raising all three of these stats on a Romulan ship with a Commander Science Station to have access to Gravity Well III. Gentlemen, engage your Cloaking Devices ...
Protonic Polarons proc's aren't buffed by EPG. The Protonic burn procs of the Science consoles from that Rep are, but that comes at the cost of much lower stat boost for their [] mod.
Just wanted to pop in and state the T6 Chel Boalg makes an excellent Kool-Aid cruiser. Been playing it all day today and have been delighted with how well it does.
A six year old boy and his starship. Living the dream.
Kool-Aid Carrier in progress. Similar setup to the kool-aid nebula but using Jupiter hull. Since I have Aeon timeships, thinking double hangars of those. No torps, handled by Aeons. 5 Protpol and the proton weapon, will have BO1 for triggering coordinated assault so imagine 12 aeons with AP Beams overloading at same time on a bare hull from protpol/drain. Carrier meant to drain while the Aeons do the damage.
Just wanted to pop in and state the T6 Chel Boalg makes an excellent Kool-Aid cruiser. Been playing it all day today and have been delighted with how well it does.
I've been taking a week off this past week, so it's going to be another 12 days or so of grinding for me before I can get that ship. Nice to know that it makes a decent alternative though for anyone who doesn't want to spend 80 million ECs to buy a Fleet Support Cruiser Retrofit on the Starfleet side.
Kool-Aid Carrier in progress. Similar setup to the kool-aid nebula but using Jupiter hull. Since I have Aeon timeships, thinking double hangars of those. No torps, handled by Aeons. 5 Protpol and the proton weapon, will have BO1 for triggering coordinated assault so imagine 12 aeons with AP Beams overloading at same time on a bare hull from protpol/drain. Carrier meant to drain while the Aeons do the damage.
Coordinated Assault
While this starship trait is slotted and you activate Beam: Overload I, II or III you will allow your pets to use Beam: Overload I. Using Cannon: Rapid Fire I, II or III will allow your pets to use Cannon: Rapid Fire I.
So you put Turrets on the Carrier, but load up your Hangars with Fighters that have Beams on them and then use a "dirt cheap" Beam Overload I to command them ALL to Overload onto target once The Lights Go Out from the Polaron Procs.
To be honest, I think you'll get a more reliable performance out of 5x Protonic Polaron plus a Neutronic Torpedo, with the Torpedo being augmented by High Yield, since with enough [DrainX] that'll give you an "on demand" way to drain all power that you can anticipate predictably enough to get a Time On Target for your Fighters to take advantage of.
Superweapon Ingenuity
Upon activating Beam: Overload I, II, or III firing mode, you will be granted an extra charge of Beam: Overload I, allowing you to fire two massive blasts of energy back-to-back. Superweapon Ingenuity can be triggered once every 30 seconds.
Wonder if Superweapon Ingenuity would synergize with Coordinated Assault, in effect allowing your Fighters to shoot TWO Beam Overloads in quick succession ... even if you have no Beams at all on your Carrier ship. Of course, if you're going to go that far, you might as well just load yourself up with 5x crafted Polaron Beam Arrays [Over] and a Neutronic Torpedo and start REALLY leveraging the firepower of this {english accent} fully armed and operational Battle Carrier! {/accent} Granted it'll be back to riding the merry-go-round and broadsiding a lot if you do that, but hey ... if you've got it, flaunt it. Beam Overloads for everyone! Take two, they're free!
Superweapon Ingenuity doesn't proc Coordinated Assault to give a second overload to your pets, and [over] doesn't proc either one. Also, it'd probably best to slot at least one beam to fire off and consume the buff, as it sits ready for a long time preventing you triggering another BO until it times out.
You could get a nice T5-U lockbox ship from the exchange for 80 Mil or less, instead of those 4 Fleet modules for the Support Cruiser. Tal Shiar Adapted Destroyer and Xindi-Aquatic Narcine Dreadnought Carrier could make for interesting canidates.
Superweapon Ingenuity doesn't proc Coordinated Assault to give a second overload to your pets, and [over] doesn't proc either one.
Figures there's be no cascading/free lunch. So Coordinated Assault triggers only on CLICK of a Beam Overload Skill from the Tray.
Well, there's always Elite Jem'Hadar Fighters with Polaron Turret/Beam Array/Dual Cannons (and Rapid Fire I but no Beam Overload) to take advantage of Coordinated Assault AND provide you with more Polaron proc opportunities and which can basically be launched from practically anything with a Hangar Bay.
Does a near spit-take upon seeing the shattered hulks left behind the first time I tested using a drain/photon build regale you enough?
I did try Elite Scorpions as to not mix weapons types but they seemed lackluster, Callisto's require some intense micromanaging to be effective, So I figure the Aeons had the best bang for my buck on the Jupiter, AP beams plus their special is deadly to a bare hull. I see the Carrier as more of a single target overwhelm, smash and move on to the next.
So to clarify...what DOES buff the Protonic Proc besides the **** Voth consoles? Epg?
There are two types of Protonic Procs:
The Protonic Weapons and Protonic Polaron Weapons procs are buffed by the Protonic Stabilizer Universal console, Dyson Auto-Targetting modules, and DSD two-set. Critical hits on that weapon give it a roll chance for its Protonic proc.
The Dyson Science "Shield Refrequencer" consoles scale off Mark and rarity of that console and EPG for their Protonic procs. Random chance for proc on certain Science abilities (hovering over one will list if it does or not).
[beam] and [cannon], and there non-fleet versions didn't last I tried them. I didn't try All Damage from the Nukara Trait and Iconian Rep console that I recall of, but those should probably work with both types.
So to clarify...what DOES buff the Protonic Proc besides the **** Voth consoles? Epg?
There are two types of Protonic Procs:
The Protonic Weapons and Protonic Polaron Weapons procs are buffed by the Protonic Stabilizer Universal console, Dyson Auto-Targetting modules, and DSD two-set. Critical hits on that weapon give it a roll chance for its Protonic proc.
The Dyson Science "Shield Refrequencer" consoles scale off Mark and rarity of that console and EPG for their Protonic procs. Random chance for proc on certain Science abilities (hovering over one will list if it does or not).
[beam] and [cannon], and there non-fleet versions didn't last I tried them. I didn't try All Damage from the Nukara Trait and Iconian Rep console that I recall of, but those should probably work with both types.
So are the Proton Weapon procs boosted by all damage buffs like APA?
A quick test seems to indicate that they do, with the tooltips swith the Proton proc values going up and down thanks to Pilot Spec-Wingman (All Damage buff based on numbers of allies in a certain range) as ships flew into and out of range while sitting in DS9 space.
Though, I ran into an odd issue is that I was getting two separate sets of Proton damage chances (four total entires including both Voth and non-Voth) with differing values. If there's two actual proc rolls for a given enemy type, that could be enough to make these broken in an OP way...
In short, a drain build taking the top DPS spot for that run in HSE. It would have been higher if we actually coordinated properly and focus-fired the main targets drained.
On a semi-related note, I *did* find a use for a Protonic Polaron weapon on a ground build. So on one of my Tacs, I had a random drop sitting in my bank from long ago when I was getting Dyson rep: a Protonic Polaron Pulsewave assault [CritD]x2. I was looking for something optimized for Miner Instabilities where CC is paramount and disabling weapons can be a nice counter as it is all too easy to get ganked by 30 sniper rifles hitting you and knocking you down all at once. So - U upgraded it to UR and got another [CritD] mod (Yay!) and thought I would try to use it for the lulz. Normally I'm wary of losing a mod for the chance of a second proc, much less the chance of a proc ON proc, but I figured if you can get your ground CritH high enough, you can get it to something close to a 7.5% chance of a proc. In this case, this particular toon had a 25% chance of CritH. The proc is 25% chance on Crit, so on napkin math, it puts the chance of proc close to 7.5%, yes? Not bad for the chance of a disable and some protonic damage. I find it to be a very useful ground weapon in this particular situation and variation.
On another semi-related note - I want to post something about Protonics, both weapons and consoles, why they suck and thoughts on what to do to fix them to the STO Reddit. Can you guys help me crystallize the ideas? Some of the posts here have been very helpful.
The Plasma proc on Weapon Signature Nullifiers and Amplifiers from the Fleet Embassy no longer bypasses shields, has had its damage reduced to 25% of what it was previously, and now procs per cycle instead of per shot.
and Entropic Rider (whatever that was) was apparently a per-shot thing too, but not anymore
so the only source of per-shot procs left is Omega Graviton Pulse Module
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
Comments
Heres my Current Test Bed...It saddens me These consoles work soo much better on this ship over my Caprimul DSD...
http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/58922c72a518865260faa14f5feacade
Eh...In total im only down 50 EPG points vs Plasma Exploders of Epic Quality.But the Shield Refrequencers are boosted by EPG points so thats nice..since regular proton boosts are few and far between..
438 EPG is 7,133 Proton Damage (from the tool tip) vs 3,257.2 Plasma Damage for 4 of plasma consoles, which do not benefit from EPG)..Average damage was 7.7k with 77 activation's in a 10 min ISA on my Eng toon.(TRIBBLE team but good sample time for the ability).Swaped out the Shield consoles for Exploders and got 7.8k ave damage with 130 activations in a 7 min ISA run.
There are 7 abilities on my ship that can trigger these consoles..2 are every 15 seconds.I wonder if DRB could trigger them per pulse..
But your right..these are not the Plasma Exploder consoles..The Exploders have a 2 fold advantage damage wise over the Shield Refrequencer ..The Exploders trigger off Energy weapons which benefit from Haste,allowing for more applications...And..The Exploders can be boosted by all of the "All Damage Boost" abilities.
These are not things the Shield consoles get..Additionally they do not benefit from "x% Exotic Damage Boost" Consoles..
They also get stuck with the "0% critical chance" stuff the Exploders finally got.
Also I would point out these are not DOT's (The Shield Refrequencer) so the Temporal Specialization stuff doesn't seem like it would apply..
So Maybe Cryptic might take pity on these consoles and grant them Either a damage boost and/or a crit chance (Based on Science RnD Trait plz) given the reduced number of EPG points..Annnd maybe bump the % chance to...25%...or ..50% chance to proc using the already identified, compatible science abilities...Given that the Exploders proc 2x as often as the Shield consoles (which have a higher proc % but tons of long abilities)
Wishful thinking but hey..heres to hoping..
Rouge Sto Wiki Editor.
So they're buffed by [EPG] but don't count as Exotic Damage, despite the fact that they're not coming from a Weapon, or even because a Weapon got activated. This means they don't get any +% bonus damage to Exotic Damage, and have a 0% chance for a Critical Hit, even though they are buffed by [EPG] and thus ought to be subject to the Science 15 R&D Trait, but aren't.
The Proton Damage that they do doesn't match ANY of the standard Energy Weapon Damage types, but still can't be buffed by Proton Damage buffing Tactical Consoles, which only affect Weapons (of which there are *ONLY TWO* in the entire game (The Experimental Proton Weapon and the Cannons that can't be unequipped from the DSD) and they're both not only Unique but one of them can't even be Upgraded! Other than those two weapons, the only other way to deliver Proton Damage is either by procs (Protonic Polarons or Shield Refrequencers) or by Nukara Web Mines and other Tholian Tech.
The Shield Refrequencers are designed in such a way that they're only going to be worth a THIRD LOOK (never mind a first or second) if you're running a Science Ship with at least 4 if not 5 Science Consoles and are prepared to fill each and every single one of those slots with a Shield Refrequencer [EPG] and can load up on Exotic Damage and Shield Drain BOff Skills to proc them.
By the time you get done jumping through all those hoops, your ship winds up being so hyperspecialized that there's barely any room left for anything else. It's just too "demanding" to be practical for something that doesn't work the way you'd expect it to work. It's a case of needing to go all out just to deliver underwhelming performance.
So yeah, there's a reason why these things are so rightly (and resoundingly) shunned. It's SAD, but it's not irrational.
And the Shield Heal they do falls into the "what's your point?!?" category in the current game meta. Just yet another aspect of how these items are so lacking in redeeming qualities.
They could have been designed to synergize with Protonic Polaron Weapon damage procs ... but they don't.
They could have been designed to synergize with Protonic Polaron Weapon drain procs ... but they don't.
They could have been designed to take advantage of Proton Damage buffs ... but they don't.
They could have been designated to do Exotic Damage to synergize with other things ... but they weren't.
And Cryptic has had YEARS (plural!) to do something about this state of affairs ... and they haven't.
Kinda makes you wonder what it would take to get them to sit up and take notice and DO SOMETHING about it ... even if that's something as small as a "you make a good point, maybe we should look into that" comment.
Protonic Kool-Aid Down The Drain Cruiser
Immortal BOff Skills combo for Ground
They could have been designed to take advantage of Proton Damage buffs ... but they don't.
[/quote]
So I would say the fact these dont take advantage of Proton Damage buffs is a good thing. EPG points take em further an the tac consoles could with fewer downsides. (50 EPG points are easily made up using temporal spec)...
It is sad these dont benefit from the RnD Sci trait or the Sci ultimate, "All Damage Buffs," a stronger shield restore proc (Given how much the Qphase torpedo removes even at low Drain expertise..) and doesnt help these proc less than the exploders Despite a higher starting % (I Blame the longer cooldowns of Sci abilites and few per pulse/shot mechanics)..
Rouge Sto Wiki Editor.
What is the best Proton Burn proc support you can reach for?
Some things are obvious ... like using Vulnerability Locators in your Tactical Consoles, as well as the Precision and Enhanced Rending Shots to maximize the "tempo" of Critical Hits (and thus opportunities for Proton Burn procs). After that, you've got [CrtH]x2 on the Protonic Polaron weapons themselves and as many Superior Romulan Operative Bridge Officers as you can amass (up to 5?), which basically means needing to be a Romulan Captain (with Romulan Operative also). Use of [Acc]x2 on the weapons and the Accurate personal space trait offer additional "back door" ways to produce increases in Critical Hit chance via Accuracy Overflow mechanics, although not quite as efficiently as [CrtH]x2. And, of course, there's the Science Ultimate of being able to set your Critical Hit chance to 50% for 15-30 seconds.
But then in your Science Consoles, Deflector (and Secondary Deflector) slots and elsewhere, you're looking at wanting to maximize the amount of [EPG] and/or [DrainX] that you can get to either maximize the Proton Burn damage procs and/or the Power Drain potential available in Polaron style procs (to "turn the lights off") and "backdoor disable" your target without resorting to an actual Disable. The problem is that with [DrainX], it really is a case of More Is Never Enough ... while [EPG] has a natural cut off point of 250 for the R&D 15 Science Trait (which isn't a hard stopping point).
So the question then becomes one of ... if you're trying to build a [DrainX]+[EPG] build to support both sides of Protonic Polarons (both drain and burn procs) ... what are going to be the optimal choices of Deflector(s), Impulse, Core, Deflector and Universal Consoles (all slotted into Engineering) you could pick for a Romulan Captain that you could be going for ... and in which ship? Obviously the "free" Dyson Science Destroyer isn't going to be the optimal ship for this, since the DSD Bundle Pack would have ships with +1 Console slot relative to that, but it does make for a "you must be better than THIS to meet this challenge" sort of minimum baseline to start from for the purposes of conversation. I'd also expect the new T6 Destroyer Bundle Pack to be a part of the contenders for consideration.
So if building for a [DrainX] AND [EPG] optimizing build organized around Polaron Drain and Proton Burn procs ... how would you go about doing it?
Protonic Kool-Aid Down The Drain Cruiser
Immortal BOff Skills combo for Ground
As one who worships at the altar of the demon goddess that is EPG, I see a potential problem here.
-to make the most of EPG, you need GW3, which requires a Cmdr Sci seat. GW1 is a limpdick substitute.
-to make the most of GW, you need 250 CtrlX, and at least 350-400 EPG.
-pumping up EPG, and CtrlX, and DrainX is possible, but it doesn't leave much room for optimizing anything else.
You're going to need a very careful selection of Research Lab Sci consoles, and an equally careful selection of Deflector dish, not to mention a very expensive Engineering console. I'm not saying it's impossible, by any means, but it won't be easy and it won't be cheap, and it will require making some significant compromises in other areas.
On the other hand, having said all that, I have to add that you have demonstrated a truly astonishing ability to create excellent game configurations. So I have confidence that if anyone can create this three-headed dragon, you can.
Looking at just the Deflector, Impulse, Core and Shield slots, we find the following.
[CtrlX] sources include:
Delta Alliance Hyper-Efficient Impulse Engines
Temporal Defense Initiative 3-piece set bonus
[DrainX] sources include:
Quantum Phase Combat Impulse Engines (for 15 seconds after Full Impulse)
Solanae Overcharged Singularity Core (wait, what?)
Delta Alliance Trajector Singularity Core
Dyson Joint Command Technologies 2-piece set bonus
Temporal Defense Initiative 3-piece set bonus
Terran Task Force Starship Technologies 2-piece set
[EPG] sources include:
So from that list, what shows up multiple times? Well I'm glad you asked ...
Dyson Joint Command Technologies 2-piece set bonus [CrtlX] [DrainX]
From this list, it can be seen that there is only ONE item that grants [CtrlX] [DrainX] [EPG] ... with lots of others providing 2 out of 3 ...
Omega Force Tachyon Deflector Array
+17.5 Starship Weapon Accuracy
+17.5 Starship Exotic Particle Generator
+35 Starship Control Expertise
+17.5 Starship Drain Expertise
+17.5 Starship Perception
+ [DrainX] at ultra rare
Oddball sources of [CrtlX] that aren't a Deflector include:
Oddball sources of [DrainX] that aren't a Deflector include:
Delta Alliance Trajector Singularity Core (+17.5 Starship Drain Expertise)
Oddball sources of [EPG] that aren't a Deflector include:
So if you're looking for "as balanced as you can get" outside of Science Consoles and Weapons, you're probably wanting to look at something like this, maybe?
Omega Force Tachyon Deflector Array
+17.5 Starship Weapon Accuracy
+17.5 Starship Exotic Particle Generator
+35 Starship Control Expertise
+17.5 Starship Drain Expertise
+17.5 Starship Perception
+ [DrainX] at ultra rare
Delta Alliance Hyper-Efficient Impulse Engines
+35 Control Expertise
+16 Flight Speed
+18 Turn Rate
+5 Engine Power
Full Impulse
All Power to Engines
+122.7 Flight Speed
Diverts all power to engines
Temporal Defense Initiative Overcharged Singularity Core
+5 to 15 Auxiliary Power, based on your Singularity charge level
Maximum Warp Factor 14
Reduces the cooldown time on Singularity Power use by 10%
0.2 Slipstream Speed bonus
+35 Starship Exotic Particle Generator
Improved Plasma Shockwave
to target:20% chance to Disable 1 Subsystem for 7.5 seconds
Trajector Jump
Trajector Warp Core: Self Teleport
to self: teleport 5km forward of your current facing.
+4,755 Stealth for 2 sec
Temporal Defense Initiative Regenerative Shield Array
+26.2 Starship Drain Expertise
+6,800 Maximum Shield Capacity
(10% Bleedthrough)
393.5 Shield Regeneration every 6 seconds
Passive Shield Regeneration increases as your shields are damaged, up to a 100% increase
Reduces All Energy Damage to Shields by 10%
Temporal Defense Initiative Starship Technologies
2 Set Bonus: Predictive Decay Algorithms
+25% All Damage for Damage-Over-Time and Hazard effects
Add all of that up and you're looking at ...
[CrtlX] = +35 (Deflector) + 35 (Impulse) = +70 [CrtlX]
[Drain] = +17.5 (Deflector) + 8.8 (Deflector ultra rare upgrade) + 26.2 (Shield) = +52.5 [DrainX]
[EPG] = +17.5 (Deflector) + 35 (Singularity) = +52.5 [EPG]
... 70 + 52.5 + 52.5 = 175
Interestingly enough, for non-Romulan captains (who also won't have access to Superior Romulan Operative for all Bridge Officer Stations), the only Warp Core that offers a modifier we're interested in is the Delta Alliance Trajector Warp Core, which yields this not quite as well balanced combination when swapped in ...
Omega Force Tachyon Deflector Array
+17.5 Starship Weapon Accuracy
+17.5 Starship Exotic Particle Generator
+35 Starship Control Expertise
+17.5 Starship Drain Expertise
+17.5 Starship Perception
+ [DrainX] at ultra rare
Delta Alliance Hyper-Efficient Impulse Engines
+35 Control Expertise
+16 Flight Speed
+18 Turn Rate
+5 Engine Power
Full Impulse
All Power to Engines
+122.7 Flight Speed
Diverts all power to engines
Delta Alliance Trajector Warp Core
50% cooldown reduction to all Transwarp abilities
+7.5 additional Shield Power
+5 Maximum Shield Power
Maximum Warp Factor 10
+17.5 Starship Shield Subsystem Performance
Adds 7.5% of your Auxiliary Power to your Shield Power
+17.5 Starship Drain Expertise
+17.5 Starship Electro-Plasma Systems
Trajector Jump
Trajector Warp Core: Self Teleport
to self: teleport 5km forward of your current facing.
+4755 Stealth for 2sec
Temporal Defense Initiative Regenerative Shield Array
+26.2 Starship Drain Expertise
+6,800 Maximum Shield Capacity
(10% Bleedthrough)
393.5 Shield Regeneration every 6 seconds
Passive Shield Regeneration increases as your shields are damaged, up to a 100% increase
Reduces All Energy Damage to Shields by 10%
Delta Alliance Assault
2 Set Bonus: Improved Evasive Maneuvers
+25% Defense when using the Evasive Maneuvers Ability
Add all of that up and you're looking at ...
[CrtlX] = +35 (Deflector) + 35 (Impulse) = +70 [CrtlX]
[Drain] = +17.5 (Deflector) + 8.8 (Deflector ultra rare upgrade) + 17.5 (Warp) + 26.2 (Shield) = +70 [DrainX]
[EPG] = +17.5 (Deflector) = +17.5 [EPG]
... 70 + 70 + 17.5 = 157.5
And at the end of all of THAT "napkin math" analysis, it starts looking even more like if you're wanting to use Protonic Polarons for maximum effectiveness, you really need to be playing a Romulan captain ... both for Superior Romulan Operative (x5) plus having Romulan Operative on your captain, as well as also being able to squeeze +175 points of combined [CrtlX] [DrainX] and [EPG] out of your Deflector, Impulse, Core and Shield slots ... which now that I'm looking at it I'm thinking, "whoa..." even though they're almost evenly distributed between the three modifiers such that none of them are overwhelmingly awesome.
Still ... +70 [CtrlX], +52.5 [DrainX] and +52.5 [EPG] is nothing to sneer at when it's coming from outside your Console Slots, right?
After this, it's just Weapon Set Bonuses (and Weapon Set Consoles) and then deciding how to "balance" the Research Lab Consoles into delivering a most EFFICIENT way to raising all three of these stats on a Romulan ship with a Commander Science Station to have access to Gravity Well III. Gentlemen, engage your Cloaking Devices ...
Protonic Kool-Aid Down The Drain Cruiser
Immortal BOff Skills combo for Ground
Yet another dead end for Protonics.
Protonic Kool-Aid Down The Drain Cruiser
Immortal BOff Skills combo for Ground
I've been taking a week off this past week, so it's going to be another 12 days or so of grinding for me before I can get that ship. Nice to know that it makes a decent alternative though for anyone who doesn't want to spend 80 million ECs to buy a Fleet Support Cruiser Retrofit on the Starfleet side.
Coordinated Assault
While this starship trait is slotted and you activate Beam: Overload I, II or III you will allow your pets to use Beam: Overload I. Using Cannon: Rapid Fire I, II or III will allow your pets to use Cannon: Rapid Fire I.
So you put Turrets on the Carrier, but load up your Hangars with Fighters that have Beams on them and then use a "dirt cheap" Beam Overload I to command them ALL to Overload onto target once The Lights Go Out from the Polaron Procs.
To be honest, I think you'll get a more reliable performance out of 5x Protonic Polaron plus a Neutronic Torpedo, with the Torpedo being augmented by High Yield, since with enough [DrainX] that'll give you an "on demand" way to drain all power that you can anticipate predictably enough to get a Time On Target for your Fighters to take advantage of.
Superweapon Ingenuity
Upon activating Beam: Overload I, II, or III firing mode, you will be granted an extra charge of Beam: Overload I, allowing you to fire two massive blasts of energy back-to-back. Superweapon Ingenuity can be triggered once every 30 seconds.
Wonder if Superweapon Ingenuity would synergize with Coordinated Assault, in effect allowing your Fighters to shoot TWO Beam Overloads in quick succession ... even if you have no Beams at all on your Carrier ship. Of course, if you're going to go that far, you might as well just load yourself up with 5x crafted Polaron Beam Arrays [Over] and a Neutronic Torpedo and start REALLY leveraging the firepower of this {english accent} fully armed and operational Battle Carrier! {/accent} Granted it'll be back to riding the merry-go-round and broadsiding a lot if you do that, but hey ... if you've got it, flaunt it. Beam Overloads for everyone! Take two, they're free!
Protonic Kool-Aid Down The Drain Cruiser
Immortal BOff Skills combo for Ground
You could get a nice T5-U lockbox ship from the exchange for 80 Mil or less, instead of those 4 Fleet modules for the Support Cruiser. Tal Shiar Adapted Destroyer and Xindi-Aquatic Narcine Dreadnought Carrier could make for interesting canidates.
While I havent tried protpol on my narcine yet, I do know that Coordinated Assault with the frigates is terrifying.
Figures there's be no cascading/free lunch. So Coordinated Assault triggers only on CLICK of a Beam Overload Skill from the Tray.
Well, there's always Elite Jem'Hadar Fighters with Polaron Turret/Beam Array/Dual Cannons (and Rapid Fire I but no Beam Overload) to take advantage of Coordinated Assault AND provide you with more Polaron proc opportunities and which can basically be launched from practically anything with a Hangar Bay.
Tal Shiar Adapted Destroyer
Xindi-Aquatic Narcine Dreadnought Carrier
Hmm, yes ... you're right, those would make rather curious alternatives as Carriers, if you're so inclined.
Please ... regale us with your experiences.
Protonic Kool-Aid Down The Drain Cruiser
Immortal BOff Skills combo for Ground
Does a near spit-take upon seeing the shattered hulks left behind the first time I tested using a drain/photon build regale you enough?
I did try Elite Scorpions as to not mix weapons types but they seemed lackluster, Callisto's require some intense micromanaging to be effective, So I figure the Aeons had the best bang for my buck on the Jupiter, AP beams plus their special is deadly to a bare hull. I see the Carrier as more of a single target overwhelm, smash and move on to the next.
Protonic Kool-Aid Down The Drain Cruiser
Immortal BOff Skills combo for Ground
Protonic Proc from the energy weapons?
Just the:
https://sto.gamepedia.com/Console_-_Tactical_-_Auto_Targeting_Module
https://sto.gamepedia.com/Protonic_Arsenal#Console_-_Universal_-_Proton_Particle_Stabilizer
...
I haven't tried + energy consoles yet...
Rouge Sto Wiki Editor.
There are two types of Protonic Procs:
The Protonic Weapons and Protonic Polaron Weapons procs are buffed by the Protonic Stabilizer Universal console, Dyson Auto-Targetting modules, and DSD two-set. Critical hits on that weapon give it a roll chance for its Protonic proc.
The Dyson Science "Shield Refrequencer" consoles scale off Mark and rarity of that console and EPG for their Protonic procs. Random chance for proc on certain Science abilities (hovering over one will list if it does or not).
[beam] and [cannon], and there non-fleet versions didn't last I tried them. I didn't try All Damage from the Nukara Trait and Iconian Rep console that I recall of, but those should probably work with both types.
DSD 2 piece = https://sto.gamepedia.com/Solanae_Advanced_Technologies#Set_powers
Rouge Sto Wiki Editor.
The exotic proton damage is unaffected by anything other than EPG points...
Rouge Sto Wiki Editor.
A quick test seems to indicate that they do, with the tooltips swith the Proton proc values going up and down thanks to Pilot Spec-Wingman (All Damage buff based on numbers of allies in a certain range) as ships flew into and out of range while sitting in DS9 space.
Though, I ran into an odd issue is that I was getting two separate sets of Proton damage chances (four total entires including both Voth and non-Voth) with differing values. If there's two actual proc rolls for a given enemy type, that could be enough to make these broken in an OP way...
https://www.reddit.com/r/stobuilds/wiki/math/damage_categories
For example, the fact that Focused Assault is a Category Two damage bonus...
https://www.reddit.com/r/sto/comments/5s00gr/drain_force_one_showing_the_potential_of_a_drain/
In short, a drain build taking the top DPS spot for that run in HSE. It would have been higher if we actually coordinated properly and focus-fired the main targets drained.
Fleet Defiant Kinetic Heavy Fire Support | Fleet Manticore Kinetic Strike Ship | Tactical Command Kinetic Siege Refit | Fleet Defiant Quantum Phase Escort | Fleet Valiant Kinetic Heavy Fire Support
Turning the Galaxy-X into a Torpedo Dreadnought & torpedo tutorial, with written torpedo guide.
"A good weapon and a great strategy will win you many battles." - Marshall
I knew using Kinetics would be playing the game on hard mode, but what I didn't realize was how bad the deck is stacked against Kinetics.
and Entropic Rider (whatever that was) was apparently a per-shot thing too, but not anymore
so the only source of per-shot procs left is Omega Graviton Pulse Module
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