Disappointed people are under no obligation to play the game as provided to us by the developers. The language around accountability is a weird powerplay by people on the outside of development to assert themselves somehow.
I like to think he's curled up in his office LAUGHING at this outrage. Because, man, what an outstanding job he's done hooking people if they have this much energy to pour into critiquing his every word.
People talk about the lockbox buyers as suckers. What kind of sucker to do have to be to give a flying targ's butt about a guy whose excited for his own product and has a history of overselling that enthusiasm? How bad of a finger's-twittching STO junkie do you have to be to even listen to those 3 hour shambling train wrecks of a podcast?
Seriously, feed him your hate. It only makes him more powerful.
Here's something that would enrage even the staunchest supporters:
"Greetings players! We are pleased to announce today that we are retiring the C-Store! Over the next few weeks, previous C-Store items will be added to the Infinity lockbox! Following this change, only lockbox keys will remain in the c-store. Isn't this exciting!! We hope you all enjoy!"
If something like that happened, I'd uninstall STO faster than you can say "make it so"
> @nikeix said: > I like to think he's curled up in his office LAUGHING at this outrage. Because, man, what an outstanding job he's done hooking people if they have this much energy to pour into critiquing his every word. > > People talk about the lockbox buyers as suckers. What kind of sucker to do have to be to give a flying targ's butt about a guy whose excited for his own product and has a history of overselling that enthusiasm? How bad of a finger's-twittching STO junkie do you have to be to even listen to those 3 hour shambling train wrecks of a podcast? > > Seriously, feed him your hate. It only makes him more powerful.
people dont have to comb through hours of audio and listen to every podcast.
pretty much everybody knows there is 1 podcast that gets the most dev attention.
its so bad that some people have called it their "mouthpiece"
and that was the podcast he made the statement on.
so while i do get your point dont pretend people have to go out of their way to find what he said.
he said it on the most prominent podcast that gets all of the dev attention.
Here's something that would enrage even the staunchest supporters:
"Greetings players! We are pleased to announce today that we are retiring the C-Store! Over the next few weeks, previous C-Store items will be added to the Infinity lockbox! Following this change, only lockbox keys will remain in the c-store. Isn't this exciting!! We hope you all enjoy!"
If something like that happened, I'd uninstall STO faster than you can say "make it so"
If your enjoyment of a game is so tenuous as to depend on a small feature within its economy, why wait?
> @reyan01 said: > Here's the stinker: He didn't lie. > > Definition of the word Faction from the Oxford dictionary: "Faction: a small organised dissenting group within a larger one, especially in politics" > > Seems like a rather appropriate use of the term to me.
the "lie" wasnt about it being or not being a "faction". the "lie" was that he said it was AT LEAST AS MUCH of a faction as Romulans.
being a faction is one thing. being at least as much of a faction as romulans is something else.
the latter sugests some kind of equality, when they couldnt be less equal.
Here's something that would enrage even the staunchest supporters:
"Greetings players! We are pleased to announce today that we are retiring the C-Store! Over the next few weeks, previous C-Store items will be added to the Infinity lockbox! Following this change, only lockbox keys will remain in the c-store. Isn't this exciting!! We hope you all enjoy!"
If something like that happened, I'd uninstall STO faster than you can say "make it so"
If your enjoyment of a game is so tenuous as to depend on a small feature within its economy, why wait?
Since it's not going to happen, I wouldn't call my enjoyment tenuous at all. And the C-Store is in no way a small feature.
This just slays me. What will being "held to it" and "taken to task" look like? Are you hoping your singular outrage is enough to force them to start over from scratch so they can strictly adhere to what you assumed based on some random Dev comment? Should someone be fired, sued, publicly flogged?
The one and only "consequence" you can offer has nothing to do with long-winded walls of text.
Someone hasn't actually been reading those "walls of text", or he'd have seen this:
I'm not asking for anybody's head on a pike, so stop pretending I'm being unreasonable. I'm simply asking for Geko to come out and say "I said something that was misconstrued by both players and the media as being more than it was. I'm sorry for the confusion." That would be the simple, adult thing to do. Something he's had two months to do prior to this release, mind you, but I'd settle for hearing it now.
Another common trait on forums such as these: "long posts are bad because reading is bad".
Do yourself a favor and read a person's posts before you go criticizing them, please. Not to be rude, but repetition is one of my peeves, so I'll just keep directing my old posts back at you until you actually read them.
Stil waiting for the link to that blog. I'm sure for the level of outrage expressed there MUST be an official post from Cryptic with those exact word in in it, yes?
Still waiting for you to understand that an official game dev should not speak about future content if they don't intend to be held to their statements later on.
Its face value is as an informal channel - and the funny thing is how hard you're trying to make it anything else. When the universe disagrees with your expectations, maybe you should change your expectations.
"It is a new faction - we were coy about calling it a new faction in the press release - there was some marketing concerns about the connotations of it, but it's at least as much of a new faction as Romulans."
They were coy to call it a new faction, because there were marketing conerns about the connotations of it. What were these connotations they migh thave talked about? I guess it's pretty much exactly what people read into it. That it would have as many faction-specific missions as the Romulan or the Klingon faction.
But he calls it as least as much as a faction as Romulans - why? Because in his mind, the faction episodes are not part of what makes a faction a faction. He has the developer view on things, and a faction mission is like every other mission.
But unique bridge officer powers? A tutorial? A selection in the new character selection screen? New SFX for beaming, warp trails, sensor scans, tricorder scans, faction-specific costume options, new sound effects? That's what will define the feel of a faction a lot more than anything else.
You run your x faction missions, and you move on to faction-agnostic stuff, queues or heck, maybe even PvP? Those missions are forgotten and don'T define your faction experience. Those SFX? The fact that every time you beam somewhere, you see a TOS beam animation? Every time the communication sounds, you hear the TOS communicator? Every time you click the game UI to open the open your inventory? Then is where you notice. "Oh, yeah, this is my TOS character." And it must all be build for the faction, and only a faction could possibly require that kind of features.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
But he calls it as least as much as a faction as Romulans - why? Because in his mind, the faction episodes are not part of what makes a faction a faction. He has the developer view on things, and a faction mission is like every other mission.
I think you are right. But you know what? He should have explained that when he saw how much his comments were being misunderstood.
Instead he ignored every single request to clarify what he meant, which started the very day the podcast was released.
I agree he didn't "like", and he isn't some awful person. But he did have the responsibility to correct the major misunderstanding his words caused, and he refused to do that.
> @mrtrexy#6456 said: > I think some people are being too hard to Geko. At the same time I think other people are being too easy on him. > > I don't think he "lied". He got excited and exaggerated. > > That doesn't mean he should be flogged, but he shouldn't be given a free pass either. > > As a mature adult he should have just admitted his mistake. But he didn't. > > And that is why we have a problem. Because he never corrected himself.
its always amazing how the cryptic defense force gets quiet after someone posts something so reasonable they cant make a real argument against it.
I'd just like to hear Geko's mental check boxes that were checked off when deciding to call the TOS captains their own faction.
Unique T1 ship, unique intro arc, faction-specific Bridge officers, separate ability names/icons, era-appropriate console variants, and their own transporter effect seem non-trivial to me, but I'd like to know if there were other factors in the 'yes' column.
> @mrtrexy#6456 said:
> I think some people are being too hard to Geko. At the same time I think other people are being too easy on him.
>
> I don't think he "lied". He got excited and exaggerated.
>
> That doesn't mean he should be flogged, but he shouldn't be given a free pass either.
>
> As a mature adult he should have just admitted his mistake. But he didn't.
>
> And that is why we have a problem. Because he never corrected himself.
its always amazing how the cryptic defense force gets quiet after someone posts something so reasonable they cant make a real argument against it.
Because no one has proven yet that he did in fact make a mistake. It's still all assumptions and, as said earlier, making up your own criteria and setting your own standards and then conclude that someone didn't keep his promise just because he didn't live up to that arbitrary standard.
The post you quoted is hardly worth replying to, not because no argument can be made against it, but because this same argument that I just repeated for the umpteenth time has been made against it for the past five pages. Of course one can choose to be ignorant towards that solid argument, but don't be surprised if others decide to ignore that ignorance in return.
Disappointed people are under no obligation to play the game as provided to us by the developers.
This expansion exists as an attempt to bring in new players to replace the ones that have left for various reasons over the years.
So the old classic "If you don't like it, then leave" defense is a terrible choice of defense, as it's exactly the opposite of what Cryptic actually wants.
You like this expansion. I don't. We should be able to disagree on this subject and move on like two functioning adults, without one of us trying to tell the other to leave their sandbox.
I think some people are being too hard to Geko. At the same time I think other people are being too easy on him.
I don't think he "lied". He got excited and exaggerated.
That doesn't mean he should be flogged, but he shouldn't be given a free pass either.
As a mature adult he should have just admitted his mistake. But he didn't.
And that is why we have a problem. Because he never corrected himself.
Well put.
Geko made a statement. It was later proven false. Nobody here thinks he was being malicious in doing so. None of us want him fired or flogged. We just want an apology for the mistake. That's not unreasonable to ask.
But unique bridge officer powers? A tutorial? A selection in the new character selection screen? New SFX for beaming, warp trails, sensor scans, tricorder scans, faction-specific costume options, new sound effects? That's what will define the feel of a faction a lot more than anything else.
You run your x faction missions, and you move on to faction-agnostic stuff, queues or heck, maybe even PvP? Those missions are forgotten and don'T define your faction experience. Those SFX? The fact that every time you beam somewhere, you see a TOS beam animation? Every time the communication sounds, you hear the TOS communicator? Every time you click the game UI to open the open your inventory? Then is where you notice. "Oh, yeah, this is my TOS character." And it must all be build for the faction, and only a faction could possibly require that kind of features.
I don't disagree that we should consider these things. However, one problem: once you hit Lvl 10, that content is gone forever.
I had to reroll my TOS toon because of this problem. I wanted to make my team unique to help differentiate her from my existing Federation toon, but she hit Lvl 10 and was yanked into the future before I knew it. And I quickly realized at that point that there was no longer a way for me to get any of the cool 23c stuff I was using back then.
The cool sound effects that twin beams make? Gone. The old-timey phasers? Gone. Access to uniquely dressed boffs with special 23c animations? Gone. All of the things that make this faction unique are gone when you enter the present, and there is no way to get them back.
Now, is it possible they'll fix this in a future patch? Absolutely. I actually expect K-13 to make a comeback and possibly serve us in this regard. But, again, we can't judge the expansion on what might happen in the future. We have to judge it on what they gave us. And judging purely from that perspective, this new "faction" essentially becomes a vanilla Fed toon at Lvl 10, whereas a Romulan remains unique in terms of the ships, boffs, clothing, etc for all 60 levels.
So even if you want to argue that this faction has unique animations, boffs, etc....which is a fair argument to make....the fact remains that all of those unique features vanish after Lvl 10, and there's (currently) no way to get back to them. Which means this faction is already well behind the Romulans even in this regard, as the Romulans remain uniquely flavored forever.
I mean, up until this particular teapot produced its tempest, it was common to refer to the Romulan Republic as a "fraction", mocking the notion of such an "underdeveloped" group being considered an entire faction. By that measure, one would think "as much a faction as the Romulans" to be an insult, rather than "undeserved" praise.
But y'all can keep moving the goalposts, as I know you will. I'll just be over here geeking out about the phaser and transporter effects being so exactingly copied from the old hand-drawn effects from TOS...
Do you guys really need an apology though ??? That's honestly kind of pathetic.
Don't ch'ya think demanding an apology is as bad as over exaggerating/lying ?
I mean it's kind of sad if this whole thread is just about getting an apology. I mean, Really ?!?
And even if he did apologize, you'd have a bunch of people jumping in saying "SEEEEEE, WE GOTCHYA GEKO !!!!! WE FINALLY GOT YOU !!!!"
....and then what ??
It's like a dog chasing a cat for the sake of chasing a cat. Once the cat is caught...then what ? - I guess in some cases the Dog would eat the cat - but...that would solve nothing here, unless your goal is to get him fired or the expansion pulled until it meets your expectations and requirements (which won't ever happen).
Do you guys really need an apology though ??? That's honestly kind of pathetic.
Don't ch'ya think demanding an apology is as bad as over exaggerating/lying ?
I mean it's kind of sad if this whole thread is just about getting an apology. I mean, Really ?!?
And even if he did apologize, you'd have a bunch of people jumping in saying "SEEEEEE, WE GOTCHYA GEKO !!!!! WE FINALLY GOT YOU !!!!"
....and then what ??
It's like a dog chasing a cat for the sake of chasing a cat. Once the cat is caught...then what ? - I guess in some cases the Dog would eat the cat - but...that would solve nothing here, unless your goal is to get him fired or the expansion pulled until it meets your expectations and requirements (which won't ever happen).
i think you are right that an appology at this point wouldn't really accomplish anything. so what would i like to happen? i would like for him to not let this happen again in the future.
now before you jump on me and say "people will always misunderstand", thats not what i mean. if he says something. and if he sees peopel have misunderstood it. then just explain what you meant. instead of ignoring it every time people ask what you meant, just explain it.
that way the misunderstanding gets cleared up instead of being allowed to grow and grow and grow. he could have put this issue to bed the day after the interview by just explaining what he meant. instead he ignored all questions about it. he does bear the reponsibility for that at least.
I agree he didn't "like", and he isn't some awful person. But he did have the responsibility to correct the major misunderstanding his words caused, and he refused to do that.
"Refuse to do that"... That's also an overinterpretation. Refusal to me is something active.
"Please, help me, I am starving!". "No, I won't help you." That's a refusal.
If you meet him in person, you ask him, and he does not answer - that would be a refusal. Posting one of the trillion questions on the message board and Geko not responding is business as usual. He has an actual job, and it's not "babysit the forums and extinguish every bushfire". Even the interviews are something the devs usually make outside their actual work time. And if they start really seriously bothering that they could accidentally be misunderstood, their only logical recourse would be to stop them, because they can't run after every misinterpretation or poor word choice made in an informal setting. If you want that, pretend that's exactly what has happened, and never listen to podcasts and treat anything people about their content as wild rumour too an outright lie. This way, the rest of us can keep listening.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
> @mustrumridcully0 said: > mrtrexy mrtrexy#6456 > > wrote: » > > I agree he didn't "like", and he isn't some awful person. But he did have the responsibility to correct the major misunderstanding his words caused, and he refused to do that. > > > > "Refuse to do that"... That's also an overinterpretation. Refusal to me is something active. > > "Please, help me, I am starving!". "No, I won't help you." That's a refusal. > > If you meet him in person, you ask him, and he does not answer - that would be a refusal. Posting one of the trillion questions on the message board and Geko not responding is business as usual. He has an actual job, and it's not "babysit the forums and extinguish every bushfire". Even the interviews are something the devs usually make outside their actual work time. And if they start really seriously bothering that they could accidentally be misunderstood, their only logical recourse would be to stop them, because they can't run after every misinterpretation or poor word choice made in an informal setting. If you want that, pretend that's exactly what has happened, and never listen to podcasts and treat anything people about their content as wild rumour too an outright lie. This way, the rest of us can keep listening.
many people tweeted him after the interview. when someone tweets you, you see the tweet. he just choose not to answer the questions. which is fine. but that does mean he refused to clarify the misunderstand. he let it grow when he could have cleared it up.
also, this pretty much only happens with gecko. lots of devs do lots of interviews, but it seems that only his interviews are the ones that cause misunderstandings. so the problem is not with the devs in general doing interviews, it is with the kinds of things he chooses to say when he does them.
When a developer makes a statement like this, they should be held to it, and taken to task if the end results do not meet the expectations they set.
Nah. All that will happen is that said Dev will be less inclined to give an interview next time, as everything they say can and will be used against them in a Court of Forum.
If you want an official statement, read the official blogs. If it's not in there, STFU.
When a developer makes a statement like this, they should be held to it, and taken to task if the end results do not meet the expectations they set.
Nah. All that will happen is that said Dev will be less inclined to give an interview next time, as everything they say can and will be used against them in a Court of Forum.
If you want an official statement, read the official blogs. If it's not in there, STFU.
actually with the dev in question, this would probably be a good thing. nearly everytime they give a interview, they say something the causes a lot of fuss. and since it seems they can not help it. limiting the number of interviews even casual ones, actually especiallycasual ones, to limit the number of problemtic statements is preferable. not really ideal but what is.
if I stop posting it doesn't make you right it. just means I don't have enough rum to continue interacting with you.
Here's a thought: If the TOS faction's 6 exclusive missions is bad, consider that the normal Feds now have ZERO faction-exclusive missions (not counting the tutorial). Yes, the TOS faction has them all, so they're not Fed-exclusive anymore.
Counting up faction-exclusive story content, TOS might not be as big as KDF/Rom but it beats Fed.
When a developer makes a statement like this, they should be held to it, and taken to task if the end results do not meet the expectations they set.
Nah. All that will happen is that said Dev will be less inclined to give an interview next time, as everything they say can and will be used against them in a Court of Forum.
If you want an official statement, read the official blogs. If it's not in there, STFU.
actually with the dev in question, this would probably be a good thing. nearly everytime they give a interview, they say something the causes a lot of fuss. and since it seems they can not help it. limiting the number of interviews even casual ones, actually especiallycasual ones, to limit the number of problemtic statements is preferable. not really ideal but what is.
Yeah, except he's the 'boss' man, so I really *do* want to hear from him, occassionally.
Like I said, if he writes things like that in an official blog, then go ahead, and blast him all you want. But attacking him so fiercely over something he said in an interview, phrased in a way that could still be interpreted many ways, that's just not nice.
When a developer makes a statement like this, they should be held to it, and taken to task if the end results do not meet the expectations they set.
Nah. All that will happen is that said Dev will be less inclined to give an interview next time, as everything they say can and will be used against them in a Court of Forum.
If you want an official statement, read the official blogs. If it's not in there, STFU.
actually with the dev in question, this would probably be a good thing. nearly everytime they give a interview, they say something the causes a lot of fuss. and since it seems they can not help it. limiting the number of interviews even casual ones, actually especiallycasual ones, to limit the number of problemtic statements is preferable. not really ideal but what is.
Yeah, except he's the 'boss' man, so I really *do* want to hear from him, occassionally.
Like I said, if he writes things like that in an official blog, then go ahead, and blast him all you want. But attacking him so fiercely over something he said in an interview, phrased in a way that could still be interpreted many ways, that's just not nice.
and the fact the boss man for whatever reason can't, and not making a jugdements on the reasons, can't simple give a interview and at least stick to the talking point or non declarative statements is a major flaw. people with his job, and with his history even more so, should know to watch what they say. yes it would be ideal if people never misunderstand but this reality and that just not how this works. sure hearing from the big boss man is nice, ok not really if your anyone beside feds but thats a different topic, it is however not a requirement. and with as many problems as it cause on a regular basis no less it, simple, may not be worth it.
and it really isn't interpretable he made a comparative statement. you can agree or not if cryptic did it, and I'm not really interested in debating that right now, but the statement itself is pretty clear.
if I stop posting it doesn't make you right it. just means I don't have enough rum to continue interacting with you.
Comments
People talk about the lockbox buyers as suckers. What kind of sucker to do have to be to give a flying targ's butt about a guy whose excited for his own product and has a history of overselling that enthusiasm? How bad of a finger's-twittching STO junkie do you have to be to even listen to those 3 hour shambling train wrecks of a podcast?
Seriously, feed him your hate. It only makes him more powerful.
"Greetings players! We are pleased to announce today that we are retiring the C-Store! Over the next few weeks, previous C-Store items will be added to the Infinity lockbox! Following this change, only lockbox keys will remain in the c-store. Isn't this exciting!! We hope you all enjoy!"
If something like that happened, I'd uninstall STO faster than you can say "make it so"
> I like to think he's curled up in his office LAUGHING at this outrage. Because, man, what an outstanding job he's done hooking people if they have this much energy to pour into critiquing his every word.
>
> People talk about the lockbox buyers as suckers. What kind of sucker to do have to be to give a flying targ's butt about a guy whose excited for his own product and has a history of overselling that enthusiasm? How bad of a finger's-twittching STO junkie do you have to be to even listen to those 3 hour shambling train wrecks of a podcast?
>
> Seriously, feed him your hate. It only makes him more powerful.
people dont have to comb through hours of audio and listen to every podcast.
pretty much everybody knows there is 1 podcast that gets the most dev attention.
its so bad that some people have called it their "mouthpiece"
and that was the podcast he made the statement on.
so while i do get your point dont pretend people have to go out of their way to find what he said.
he said it on the most prominent podcast that gets all of the dev attention.
If your enjoyment of a game is so tenuous as to depend on a small feature within its economy, why wait?
> Here's the stinker: He didn't lie.
>
> Definition of the word Faction from the Oxford dictionary: "Faction: a small organised dissenting group within a larger one, especially in politics"
>
> Seems like a rather appropriate use of the term to me.
the "lie" wasnt about it being or not being a "faction". the "lie" was that he said it was AT LEAST AS MUCH of a faction as Romulans.
being a faction is one thing. being at least as much of a faction as romulans is something else.
the latter sugests some kind of equality, when they couldnt be less equal.
Since it's not going to happen, I wouldn't call my enjoyment tenuous at all. And the C-Store is in no way a small feature.
Another common trait on forums such as these: "long posts are bad because reading is bad".
Do yourself a favor and read a person's posts before you go criticizing them, please. Not to be rude, but repetition is one of my peeves, so I'll just keep directing my old posts back at you until you actually read them.
Still waiting for you to understand that an official game dev should not speak about future content if they don't intend to be held to their statements later on.
That "one podcast" formed the vast majority of the player and media narrative about the game's upcoming content. And perhaps most important, that podcast was prominently quoted as evidence in a defense against people's criticisms of the content previewed on Tribble. But now, all of a sudden, it's "just chit chat", apparently, and we should never ever take a podcast at face value.
I'll be sure to remember this for the next expansion, when this exact same pattern will repeat itself all over again.
I don't think he "lied". He got excited and exaggerated.
That doesn't mean he should be flogged, but he shouldn't be given a free pass either.
As a mature adult he should have just admitted his mistake. But he didn't.
And that is why we have a problem. Because he never corrected himself.
That goes for everyone who used what he said to defend the expansion prelaunch, and everyone who is using the same words to bash the expansion.
Still Japori'ing things.
The problem we have is pretty much exactly what he said himself.
They were coy to call it a new faction, because there were marketing conerns about the connotations of it. What were these connotations they migh thave talked about? I guess it's pretty much exactly what people read into it. That it would have as many faction-specific missions as the Romulan or the Klingon faction.
But he calls it as least as much as a faction as Romulans - why? Because in his mind, the faction episodes are not part of what makes a faction a faction. He has the developer view on things, and a faction mission is like every other mission.
But unique bridge officer powers? A tutorial? A selection in the new character selection screen? New SFX for beaming, warp trails, sensor scans, tricorder scans, faction-specific costume options, new sound effects? That's what will define the feel of a faction a lot more than anything else.
You run your x faction missions, and you move on to faction-agnostic stuff, queues or heck, maybe even PvP? Those missions are forgotten and don'T define your faction experience. Those SFX? The fact that every time you beam somewhere, you see a TOS beam animation? Every time the communication sounds, you hear the TOS communicator? Every time you click the game UI to open the open your inventory? Then is where you notice. "Oh, yeah, this is my TOS character." And it must all be build for the faction, and only a faction could possibly require that kind of features.
I think you are right. But you know what? He should have explained that when he saw how much his comments were being misunderstood.
Instead he ignored every single request to clarify what he meant, which started the very day the podcast was released.
I agree he didn't "like", and he isn't some awful person. But he did have the responsibility to correct the major misunderstanding his words caused, and he refused to do that.
> I think some people are being too hard to Geko. At the same time I think other people are being too easy on him.
>
> I don't think he "lied". He got excited and exaggerated.
>
> That doesn't mean he should be flogged, but he shouldn't be given a free pass either.
>
> As a mature adult he should have just admitted his mistake. But he didn't.
>
> And that is why we have a problem. Because he never corrected himself.
its always amazing how the cryptic defense force gets quiet after someone posts something so reasonable they cant make a real argument against it.
Oh, wait. I did.
Because no one has proven yet that he did in fact make a mistake. It's still all assumptions and, as said earlier, making up your own criteria and setting your own standards and then conclude that someone didn't keep his promise just because he didn't live up to that arbitrary standard.
The post you quoted is hardly worth replying to, not because no argument can be made against it, but because this same argument that I just repeated for the umpteenth time has been made against it for the past five pages. Of course one can choose to be ignorant towards that solid argument, but don't be surprised if others decide to ignore that ignorance in return.
Edit: grammar
So the old classic "If you don't like it, then leave" defense is a terrible choice of defense, as it's exactly the opposite of what Cryptic actually wants.
You like this expansion. I don't. We should be able to disagree on this subject and move on like two functioning adults, without one of us trying to tell the other to leave their sandbox.
Well put.
Geko made a statement. It was later proven false. Nobody here thinks he was being malicious in doing so. None of us want him fired or flogged. We just want an apology for the mistake. That's not unreasonable to ask.
I don't disagree that we should consider these things. However, one problem: once you hit Lvl 10, that content is gone forever.
I had to reroll my TOS toon because of this problem. I wanted to make my team unique to help differentiate her from my existing Federation toon, but she hit Lvl 10 and was yanked into the future before I knew it. And I quickly realized at that point that there was no longer a way for me to get any of the cool 23c stuff I was using back then.
The cool sound effects that twin beams make? Gone. The old-timey phasers? Gone. Access to uniquely dressed boffs with special 23c animations? Gone. All of the things that make this faction unique are gone when you enter the present, and there is no way to get them back.
Now, is it possible they'll fix this in a future patch? Absolutely. I actually expect K-13 to make a comeback and possibly serve us in this regard. But, again, we can't judge the expansion on what might happen in the future. We have to judge it on what they gave us. And judging purely from that perspective, this new "faction" essentially becomes a vanilla Fed toon at Lvl 10, whereas a Romulan remains unique in terms of the ships, boffs, clothing, etc for all 60 levels.
So even if you want to argue that this faction has unique animations, boffs, etc....which is a fair argument to make....the fact remains that all of those unique features vanish after Lvl 10, and there's (currently) no way to get back to them. Which means this faction is already well behind the Romulans even in this regard, as the Romulans remain uniquely flavored forever.
I mean, up until this particular teapot produced its tempest, it was common to refer to the Romulan Republic as a "fraction", mocking the notion of such an "underdeveloped" group being considered an entire faction. By that measure, one would think "as much a faction as the Romulans" to be an insult, rather than "undeserved" praise.
But y'all can keep moving the goalposts, as I know you will. I'll just be over here geeking out about the phaser and transporter effects being so exactingly copied from the old hand-drawn effects from TOS...
Don't ch'ya think demanding an apology is as bad as over exaggerating/lying ?
I mean it's kind of sad if this whole thread is just about getting an apology. I mean, Really ?!?
And even if he did apologize, you'd have a bunch of people jumping in saying "SEEEEEE, WE GOTCHYA GEKO !!!!! WE FINALLY GOT YOU !!!!"
....and then what ??
It's like a dog chasing a cat for the sake of chasing a cat. Once the cat is caught...then what ? - I guess in some cases the Dog would eat the cat - but...that would solve nothing here, unless your goal is to get him fired or the expansion pulled until it meets your expectations and requirements (which won't ever happen).
i think you are right that an appology at this point wouldn't really accomplish anything. so what would i like to happen? i would like for him to not let this happen again in the future.
now before you jump on me and say "people will always misunderstand", thats not what i mean. if he says something. and if he sees peopel have misunderstood it. then just explain what you meant. instead of ignoring it every time people ask what you meant, just explain it.
that way the misunderstanding gets cleared up instead of being allowed to grow and grow and grow. he could have put this issue to bed the day after the interview by just explaining what he meant. instead he ignored all questions about it. he does bear the reponsibility for that at least.
"Please, help me, I am starving!". "No, I won't help you." That's a refusal.
If you meet him in person, you ask him, and he does not answer - that would be a refusal. Posting one of the trillion questions on the message board and Geko not responding is business as usual. He has an actual job, and it's not "babysit the forums and extinguish every bushfire". Even the interviews are something the devs usually make outside their actual work time. And if they start really seriously bothering that they could accidentally be misunderstood, their only logical recourse would be to stop them, because they can't run after every misinterpretation or poor word choice made in an informal setting. If you want that, pretend that's exactly what has happened, and never listen to podcasts and treat anything people about their content as wild rumour too an outright lie. This way, the rest of us can keep listening.
> mrtrexy mrtrexy#6456
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> wrote: »
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> I agree he didn't "like", and he isn't some awful person. But he did have the responsibility to correct the major misunderstanding his words caused, and he refused to do that.
>
>
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> "Refuse to do that"... That's also an overinterpretation. Refusal to me is something active.
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> "Please, help me, I am starving!". "No, I won't help you." That's a refusal.
>
> If you meet him in person, you ask him, and he does not answer - that would be a refusal. Posting one of the trillion questions on the message board and Geko not responding is business as usual. He has an actual job, and it's not "babysit the forums and extinguish every bushfire". Even the interviews are something the devs usually make outside their actual work time. And if they start really seriously bothering that they could accidentally be misunderstood, their only logical recourse would be to stop them, because they can't run after every misinterpretation or poor word choice made in an informal setting. If you want that, pretend that's exactly what has happened, and never listen to podcasts and treat anything people about their content as wild rumour too an outright lie. This way, the rest of us can keep listening.
many people tweeted him after the interview. when someone tweets you,
you see the tweet. he just choose not to answer the questions. which is
fine. but that does mean he refused to clarify the misunderstand. he let it
grow when he could have cleared it up.
also, this pretty much only happens with gecko. lots of devs do lots of
interviews, but it seems that only his interviews are the ones that cause
misunderstandings. so the problem is not with the devs in general doing
interviews, it is with the kinds of things he chooses to say when he does
them.
Nah. All that will happen is that said Dev will be less inclined to give an interview next time, as everything they say can and will be used against them in a Court of Forum.
If you want an official statement, read the official blogs. If it's not in there, STFU.
actually with the dev in question, this would probably be a good thing. nearly everytime they give a interview, they say something the causes a lot of fuss. and since it seems they can not help it. limiting the number of interviews even casual ones, actually especiallycasual ones, to limit the number of problemtic statements is preferable. not really ideal but what is.
if I stop posting it doesn't make you right it. just means I don't have enough rum to continue interacting with you.
Counting up faction-exclusive story content, TOS might not be as big as KDF/Rom but it beats Fed.
Yeah, except he's the 'boss' man, so I really *do* want to hear from him, occassionally.
Like I said, if he writes things like that in an official blog, then go ahead, and blast him all you want. But attacking him so fiercely over something he said in an interview, phrased in a way that could still be interpreted many ways, that's just not nice.
and the fact the boss man for whatever reason can't, and not making a jugdements on the reasons, can't simple give a interview and at least stick to the talking point or non declarative statements is a major flaw. people with his job, and with his history even more so, should know to watch what they say. yes it would be ideal if people never misunderstand but this reality and that just not how this works. sure hearing from the big boss man is nice, ok not really if your anyone beside feds but thats a different topic, it is however not a requirement. and with as many problems as it cause on a regular basis no less it, simple, may not be worth it.
and it really isn't interpretable he made a comparative statement. you can agree or not if cryptic did it, and I'm not really interested in debating that right now, but the statement itself is pretty clear.
if I stop posting it doesn't make you right it. just means I don't have enough rum to continue interacting with you.