And please describe why anyone might need a veteran player to learn about encounter mechanics? To learn about how things work you just need to play once, from start, to end WITHOUT anyone guiding you during action. And that means easy should be easy and forgiving. And if someone still don't want to learn it a hard way, they can always can form a team and bypass a queue.
That's assuming that understanding how things in this game work is easy. It is not.
I think it's clear that the majority here don't want content improvement to a level that's even half decent. People are happy with sitting still and using BFAW all day long against floating sponges.
So long as they're play isn't interfered with (putting the word "elite" or "advanced" on content that's dead easy doesn't make the content any better or difficult) with improvements, fixes and ability/gear balance updates they'll keep feeding Al Rivera's powercreep machine.
Eh, to me it seems like the OP is tired of using Home Runs as a stat because counting stats are one dimensional. And has finally suggested .SLG. But what the game really needs is OPS. And BV ain't that.
I can't imagine that there are things that are more important than adressing power creep.
While some difference in DPS between players is good as it's likely one of the main income sources for Cryptic, it's slightly ridiculous to have players in the game (and not just a few, it seems there are more of them every day) that are able to complete Advanced content in a fraction of the time those missions were supposed to last.
It'll also chase away newer players, who think they're good enough to play advanced content only to find themselves NOT being good enough simply because they're competing with their team mates for targets 90% of the time. Most Advanced content is no longer a fight against the enemies on the map, it's a fight for enemies.
The most interesting challenge nowadays is trying to find a target that isn't gone before you can aim your cannons or before your torpedoes reach them. At least there is some PvP in the game then after all.
I think it's clear that the majority here don't want content improvement to a level that's even half decent.
People are happy with sitting still and using BFAW all day long against floating sponges.
So long as they're play isn't interfered with (putting the word "elite" or "advanced" on content that's dead easy doesn't make the content any better or difficult) with improvements, fixes and ability/gear balance updates they'll keep feeding Al Rivera's powercreep machine.
Yeah, funny how everyone's asking for Elite queues only because their Advanced versions have been turned into a joke. Perhaps we should just restore some balance first, and then add new stuff.
Asking for Elite content when there's nothing 'elite' or 'advanced' about the current or to-be-released content is slightly illogical if you ask me.
But this would likely require a complete overhaul of enemy critters, as they'd need new powers, better AI and who knows what more.
That's assuming that understanding how things in this game work is easy. It is not.
Well, it is way more informative to read about details on wiki or forums, than trying to watch someone doing it, because you still may have no idea what other ppl do and what stuff they use except that they obviously fire their weapons on npc and npc dies. Or a "veteran" guy will have to explain everything via voice chat? To random ppl? I doubt that.
The most interesting challenge nowadays is trying to find a target that isn't gone before you can aim your cannons or before your torpedoes reach them. At least there is some PvP in the game then after all.
Which maps have that happening though?
1- ISA doesn't really fall into that. The transofrmers and gateway don't go away before you can fire. And the tactical cube takes a few hits.
2- Cure space, can be a little tricky as stuff can get vaporized fast, but even then the cubes take a hot second.
3- Khitomer space certainly gives you some targets to point at and takes minutes to chew through.
4- HSE took the OP more than 5 minutes to get through.
Counterpoint's separated into waves. The Voth maps take awhile. The Undine maps take awhile. The Romulan space stuff is time gated. The Iconian stuff has waves and takes a bit of time. Borg Disconnected is separated into waves.
The only map I've ever seen people complain about not having enough time to participate in is Crystaline Entity.
And I'm biased. I remember how much time that took 6 years ago. That damn entity OWES ME time. So I personally have no problem vaporizing it into crystal bits in mere moments.
The most interesting challenge nowadays is trying to find a target that isn't gone before you can aim your cannons or before your torpedoes reach them. At least there is some PvP in the game then after all.
Which maps have that happening though?
1- ISA doesn't really fall into that. The transofrmers and gateway don't go away before you can fire. And the tactical cube takes a few hits.
2- Cure space, can be a little tricky as stuff can get vaporized fast, but even then the cubes take a hot second.
3- Khitomer space certainly gives you some targets to point at and takes minutes to chew through.
4- HSE took the OP more than 5 minutes to get through.
Counterpoint's separated into waves. The Voth maps take awhile. The Undine maps take awhile. The Romulan space stuff is time gated. The Iconian stuff has waves and takes a bit of time. Borg Disconnected is separated into waves.
The only map I've ever seen people complain about not having enough time to participate in is Crystaline Entity.
And I'm biased. I remember how much time that took 6 years ago. That damn entity OWES ME time. So I personally have no problem vaporizing it into crystal bits in mere moments.
Transformers and gateways also take much more damage, even when some of the smaller generators are still intact. Which is most likely a sign that the power creep that we've seen since the Skill revamp is a result of increased debuffing. Those transformers drop to 80-90% in most missions I've been in before the generators are even down.
Same with the Tac cube and the gateway: before the last spheres are cleaned up, the gateway has sometimes already lost a quarter to half of its hitpoints even if no one is really targeting it. The Tac cube's shields down at one facing as collateral damage.
Besides, the main problem is that enemies die too fast. Yes, you may be able to fire a few shots at a Gateway, but that's supposed to be one of the bosses of the map.
The Voth, Undine and Borg disconnected maps are good examples and more interesting alternatives. At the same time however, every time I've suggested that new missions should be time-gated, you'll get responses that point out that such content isn't popular enough. And they may be right. I think that's another problem. Beside DPS, it seems most players simply want everything to be vaporised quickly and be done with a mission - that was supposed to take 15-20 minutes - in less than 4 or 5 minutes.
You can take away the insane DPS, but that won't solve this other part of the problem. I guess that more interesting enemies that use different abilities are therefore the only way to make what is supposed to be advanced content slightly challenging and worthy of being called 'advanced'.
@voiddweller#2714
Actually, we guys DPS After Dark/Continuum TS channel are more than happy to help people, and I am sure we arent the only ones.
Sure, there is helpful people, but that have nothing to do with public queue, because there is no time to explain stuff when everyone want to finish mission as soon as possible. You can only learn from observation of your own mistakes here.
I think it's clear that the majority here don't want content improvement to a level that's even half decent.
People are happy with sitting still and using BFAW all day long against floating sponges.
So long as they're play isn't interfered with (putting the word "elite" or "advanced" on content that's dead easy doesn't make the content any better or difficult) with improvements, fixes and ability/gear balance updates they'll keep feeding Al Rivera's powercreep machine.
Well, i would prefer using tactics and tricks to defeat much stronger foe, than watch repetitive engagements. Ground combat offers much more than space. In space enemies either swarm you, because you can't kill them fast enough, or you can kill them fast enough and win.
No, there may be some issues with that, but the devs should work on several other things first.
[quote="snoggymack22;12918960"][quote="risian4;12918952"]The most interesting challenge nowadays is trying to find a target that isn't gone before you can aim your cannons or before your torpedoes reach them. At least there is some PvP in the game then after all.[/quote]
Which maps have that happening though?
1- ISA doesn't really fall into that. The transofrmers and gateway don't go away before you can fire. And the tactical cube takes a few hits.
2- Cure space, can be a little tricky as stuff can get vaporized fast, but even then the cubes take a hot second.
3- Khitomer space certainly gives you some targets to point at and takes minutes to chew through.
4- HSE took the OP more than 5 minutes to get through.
Counterpoint's separated into waves. The Voth maps take awhile. The Undine maps take awhile. The Romulan space stuff is time gated. The Iconian stuff has waves and takes a bit of time. Borg Disconnected is separated into waves.
The only map I've ever seen people complain about not having enough time to participate in is Crystaline Entity.
And I'm biased. I remember how much time that took 6 years ago. That damn entity OWES ME time. So I personally have no problem vaporizing it into crystal bits in mere moments. [/quote]
Ha I remember when CE first came out....damn shards seemed to chase you....
If they'd bring back the event as it was, including with special things happening between phases (like Tyken's rifts opening, sensor interference etc.) it would already be more interesting. Perhaps these effects should be increased. Gravity wells that occur at random locations for example.
Why were those things removed anyway? The event map for the Crystalline Entity was so much better than what we have now. Why remove all those nice little extra things and only keep the very simplified version that only contains one huge damage sponge?
@voiddweller#2714 So because the way you want to learn isnt conducive to the gameplay, you should assume that means it cant be reasonably learned/or taught? If a person WANTS to learn they can ask questions BEFORE joining a queue, or even after the runs completed.
The pursuit of knowledge doesn't just knock randomly on doors, the pupil must take the first move and open the door and step out. Step out into the world, and one will find that there are plenty of people who are out there, ready to help.
Or one can just make excuses about how the vet's won't help people because they didn't offer before being asked for help. We want to help people and be friends, not be someones psychic-friend.
I guess its just the eternal struggle between an internal and external locus of control.
The Voth, Undine and Borg disconnected maps are good examples and more interesting alternatives. At the same time however, every time I've suggested that new missions should be time-gated, you'll get responses that point out that such content isn't popular enough. And they may be right. I think that's another problem. Beside DPS, it seems most players simply want everything to be vaporised quickly and be done with a mission - that was supposed to take 15-20 minutes - in less than 4 or 5 minutes.
You can take away the insane DPS, but that won't solve this other part of the problem. I guess that more interesting enemies that use different abilities are therefore the only way to make what is supposed to be advanced content slightly challenging and worthy of being called 'advanced'.
I'm a pretty big fan of the Voth and Undine maps. No Win Scenario was my all time favorite. But the Voth come a close second. And yeah, nobody really plays them in the pick up queues these days. I can still run them with my fleet and friends. The Undine I'd love love love, but after awhile, the big yellow globs get annoying.
But yeah, the time gated stuff doesn't bug me. I run Counterpoint almost every day, just be cause I like it, for instance.
No, this is not important enough to require developer attention
So let's be real for a second. How many people would we really be helping by implementing some of the changes that have been suggested? When you factor the seemingly large amount of players who only play Dabo, only log in once every week, or lunge at each other on their bridges with the nude mod . . . really, what is the realistic impact here? I suspect that if we were to make some of the "fixes" it wouldn't really help as many people as some believe.
Yeah, funny how everyone's asking for Elite queues only because their Advanced versions have been turned into a joke.
I would think that the advanced versions are now a joke because people geared for Elite and should be doing Elite are there at Advanced. That's like saying "Normal" is a joke when people geared for advanced play on Normal.
That said, recent posts have made me question whether or not the DPS community at large is ready for Elite. Not when they think the Foundry map DPSM in "Advanced" is difficult and Elite is too difficult for parse tests.
That said, recent posts have made me question whether or not the DPS community at large is ready for Elite. Not when they think the Foundry map DPSM in "Advanced" is difficult and Elite is too difficult for parse tests.
That said, recent posts have made me question whether or not the DPS community at large is ready for Elite. Not when they think the Foundry map DPSM in "Advanced" is difficult and Elite is too difficult for parse tests.
Difficult to hit 100K or in general?
A question was raised on why the "testing" had to be in advanced and the response was that Advanced already posed enough of a survivability challenge and Elite may be too difficult for most, requiring build changes to remain survivable.
That said, recent posts have made me question whether or not the DPS community at large is ready for Elite. Not when they think the Foundry map DPSM in "Advanced" is difficult and Elite is too difficult for parse tests.
Difficult to hit 100K or in general?
A question was raised on why the "testing" had to be in advanced and the response was that Advanced already posed enough of a survivability challenge and Elite may be too difficult for most, requiring build changes to remain survivable.
I'll admit that I've blown up more than I'd like, but I'm seriously selling out for DPS, and so when I'm not paying attention, sometimes I go boom. But i certainly wouldn't call it an "issue". I actually really like DPSM. It's new, it's fun, and something I can do by myself when ever I want. But if the advanced is already an issue, then I can see why you say that. Honestly, I wouldn't have guessed that anyone would react that way.
Comments
That's assuming that understanding how things in this game work is easy. It is not.
People are happy with sitting still and using BFAW all day long against floating sponges.
So long as they're play isn't interfered with (putting the word "elite" or "advanced" on content that's dead easy doesn't make the content any better or difficult) with improvements, fixes and ability/gear balance updates they'll keep feeding Al Rivera's powercreep machine.
That's definitely one of the big risks with the ideas being presented. It is certainly an issue other MMOs face.
Eh, to me it seems like the OP is tired of using Home Runs as a stat because counting stats are one dimensional. And has finally suggested .SLG. But what the game really needs is OPS. And BV ain't that.
While some difference in DPS between players is good as it's likely one of the main income sources for Cryptic, it's slightly ridiculous to have players in the game (and not just a few, it seems there are more of them every day) that are able to complete Advanced content in a fraction of the time those missions were supposed to last.
It'll also chase away newer players, who think they're good enough to play advanced content only to find themselves NOT being good enough simply because they're competing with their team mates for targets 90% of the time. Most Advanced content is no longer a fight against the enemies on the map, it's a fight for enemies.
The most interesting challenge nowadays is trying to find a target that isn't gone before you can aim your cannons or before your torpedoes reach them. At least there is some PvP in the game then after all.
Yeah, funny how everyone's asking for Elite queues only because their Advanced versions have been turned into a joke. Perhaps we should just restore some balance first, and then add new stuff.
Asking for Elite content when there's nothing 'elite' or 'advanced' about the current or to-be-released content is slightly illogical if you ask me.
But this would likely require a complete overhaul of enemy critters, as they'd need new powers, better AI and who knows what more.
Which maps have that happening though?
1- ISA doesn't really fall into that. The transofrmers and gateway don't go away before you can fire. And the tactical cube takes a few hits.
2- Cure space, can be a little tricky as stuff can get vaporized fast, but even then the cubes take a hot second.
3- Khitomer space certainly gives you some targets to point at and takes minutes to chew through.
4- HSE took the OP more than 5 minutes to get through.
Counterpoint's separated into waves. The Voth maps take awhile. The Undine maps take awhile. The Romulan space stuff is time gated. The Iconian stuff has waves and takes a bit of time. Borg Disconnected is separated into waves.
The only map I've ever seen people complain about not having enough time to participate in is Crystaline Entity.
And I'm biased. I remember how much time that took 6 years ago. That damn entity OWES ME time. So I personally have no problem vaporizing it into crystal bits in mere moments.
Actually... There was a time when I did just that after some STFs (upon request of course), although I used in game text chat because random peeps.
Actually, we guys DPS After Dark/Continuum TS channel are more than happy to help people, and I am sure we arent the only ones.
Transformers and gateways also take much more damage, even when some of the smaller generators are still intact. Which is most likely a sign that the power creep that we've seen since the Skill revamp is a result of increased debuffing. Those transformers drop to 80-90% in most missions I've been in before the generators are even down.
Same with the Tac cube and the gateway: before the last spheres are cleaned up, the gateway has sometimes already lost a quarter to half of its hitpoints even if no one is really targeting it. The Tac cube's shields down at one facing as collateral damage.
Besides, the main problem is that enemies die too fast. Yes, you may be able to fire a few shots at a Gateway, but that's supposed to be one of the bosses of the map.
The Voth, Undine and Borg disconnected maps are good examples and more interesting alternatives. At the same time however, every time I've suggested that new missions should be time-gated, you'll get responses that point out that such content isn't popular enough. And they may be right. I think that's another problem. Beside DPS, it seems most players simply want everything to be vaporised quickly and be done with a mission - that was supposed to take 15-20 minutes - in less than 4 or 5 minutes.
You can take away the insane DPS, but that won't solve this other part of the problem. I guess that more interesting enemies that use different abilities are therefore the only way to make what is supposed to be advanced content slightly challenging and worthy of being called 'advanced'.
Which maps have that happening though?
1- ISA doesn't really fall into that. The transofrmers and gateway don't go away before you can fire. And the tactical cube takes a few hits.
2- Cure space, can be a little tricky as stuff can get vaporized fast, but even then the cubes take a hot second.
3- Khitomer space certainly gives you some targets to point at and takes minutes to chew through.
4- HSE took the OP more than 5 minutes to get through.
Counterpoint's separated into waves. The Voth maps take awhile. The Undine maps take awhile. The Romulan space stuff is time gated. The Iconian stuff has waves and takes a bit of time. Borg Disconnected is separated into waves.
The only map I've ever seen people complain about not having enough time to participate in is Crystaline Entity.
And I'm biased. I remember how much time that took 6 years ago. That damn entity OWES ME time. So I personally have no problem vaporizing it into crystal bits in mere moments.
Ha I remember when CE first came out....damn shards seemed to chase you....
original join date 2010
Member: Team Trekyards. Visit Trekyards today!
Why were those things removed anyway? The event map for the Crystalline Entity was so much better than what we have now. Why remove all those nice little extra things and only keep the very simplified version that only contains one huge damage sponge?
The pursuit of knowledge doesn't just knock randomly on doors, the pupil must take the first move and open the door and step out. Step out into the world, and one will find that there are plenty of people who are out there, ready to help.
Or one can just make excuses about how the vet's won't help people because they didn't offer before being asked for help. We want to help people and be friends, not be someones psychic-friend.
I guess its just the eternal struggle between an internal and external locus of control.
I'm a pretty big fan of the Voth and Undine maps. No Win Scenario was my all time favorite. But the Voth come a close second. And yeah, nobody really plays them in the pick up queues these days. I can still run them with my fleet and friends. The Undine I'd love love love, but after awhile, the big yellow globs get annoying.
But yeah, the time gated stuff doesn't bug me. I run Counterpoint almost every day, just be cause I like it, for instance.
I would think that the advanced versions are now a joke because people geared for Elite and should be doing Elite are there at Advanced. That's like saying "Normal" is a joke when people geared for advanced play on Normal.
That said, recent posts have made me question whether or not the DPS community at large is ready for Elite. Not when they think the Foundry map DPSM in "Advanced" is difficult and Elite is too difficult for parse tests.
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Difficult to hit 100K or in general?
A question was raised on why the "testing" had to be in advanced and the response was that Advanced already posed enough of a survivability challenge and Elite may be too difficult for most, requiring build changes to remain survivable.
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I'll admit that I've blown up more than I'd like, but I'm seriously selling out for DPS, and so when I'm not paying attention, sometimes I go boom. But i certainly wouldn't call it an "issue". I actually really like DPSM. It's new, it's fun, and something I can do by myself when ever I want. But if the advanced is already an issue, then I can see why you say that. Honestly, I wouldn't have guessed that anyone would react that way.
The basic equation is
OPS = OBP + SLG
where OBP is on-base percentage and SLG is slugging average. These averages are defined
SLG = TB/AB
OPB = (H + BB + HBP)/(AB + BB + SF + HBP)
where:
H = Hits
BB = Base on balls
HBP = Times hit by pitch
AB = At bats
SF = Sacrifice flies
TB = Total bases