That's not fixing the broken bone, that's just putting a bandage on it. What we IMHO should do is instead make aft weaponry just as useful as fore weaponry.
Well that would be great to have some new special weapon like the cutting beam in reputation but the devs seems to be stuck on console, torpedo and beam array/dual cannons pattern.
I am from Belgium and english isn't my main language, sorry if I make mistakes.
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
no, it makes no sense, thsoe ships were MADE for broadsiding in-game, they are great at EXACTLY what they were built for in-game.
I never saw a dev talking about broadside in any ship blog till I play this game.
edit : sorry double post.
I am from Belgium and english isn't my main language, sorry if I make mistakes.
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,117Community Moderator
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
no, it makes no sense, thsoe ships were MADE for broadsiding in-game, they are great at EXACTLY what they were built for in-game.
I never saw a dev talking about broadside in any ship blog till I play this game.
edit : sorry double post.
thats nice, does not change the fact that broadsiding is what those ships are built for, why do you think even the stuff those ships come with are mostly beam arrays.
and as said before, wepon slots DO NOT MATTER, no matter how much stupid you apply, those ships all have garbage turn rate, they will NEVER be useful with beam banks and cannons.
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
So just because you don't like broadsiding, you think the play style should be removed altogether. Yeah sorry, thats not how this kind of things works. But I would hate to take your self important delusion away from you.
And no, a cruiser that has a horrible turn rate should not be built for front facing attacks, what kind of logic is that?
Just because broad siding isn't canon (and honestly, the canon argument for a GAME is weak strawman one at best), does not mean it can't be a dynamic within a game that is clearly, and does not have to be a slave to its source material.
If you want a Trek game that IS a slave to the canon, then go to college, get a degree in computer science, graphic designs and whatever other degrees you need to design games, get a license agreement with CBS and have at it. Until then, drop the "this isn't canon and therefor its not okay" argument. because its total TRIBBLE.
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
no, it makes no sense, thsoe ships were MADE for broadsiding in-game, they are great at EXACTLY what they were built for in-game.
I never saw a dev talking about broadside in any ship blog till I play this game.
edit : sorry double post.
thats nice, does not change the fact that broadsiding is what those ships are built for, why do you think even the stuff those ships come with are mostly beam arrays.
and as said before, wepon slots DO NOT MATTER, no matter how much stupid you apply, those ships all have garbage turn rate, they will NEVER be useful with beam banks and cannons.
Broadsiding is in the tutorial as well. IIRC.
Now a LTS and loving it.
Just because you spend money on this game, it does not entitle you to be a jerk if things don't go your way.
I have come to the conclusion that I have a memory like Etch-A-Sketch. I shake my head and forget everything.
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
So just because you don't like broadsiding, you think the play style should be removed altogether. Yeah sorry, thats not how this kind of things works. But I would hate to take your self important delusion away from you.
And no, a cruiser that has a horrible turn rate should not be built for front facing attacks, what kind of logic is that?
So because it has bad turn rate we are forced to play them as broadside? With a 5/3 ship you can still do broadside, but at least we have the choice to play the ship like we want.
I am from Belgium and english isn't my main language, sorry if I make mistakes.
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
So just because you don't like broadsiding, you think the play style should be removed altogether. Yeah sorry, thats not how this kind of things works. But I would hate to take your self important delusion away from you.
And no, a cruiser that has a horrible turn rate should not be built for front facing attacks, what kind of logic is that?
So because it has bad turn rate we are forced to play them as broadside? With a 5/3 ship you can still do broadside, but at least we have the choice to play the ship like we want.
no, you are clearly not reading what we are saying, 5/3 does not change the fact it cannot turn thus making stuff like cannons and beams banks pointless. no change in weapon slots will make it so you can use cannons and beam banks effectively. 5/3 weapons slots would STILL only make it useful for broadsiding and nothing else.
Learn how shipbuilding works, otherwise, do not talk about things you CLEARLY have no understanding about.
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
So just because you don't like broadsiding, you think the play style should be removed altogether. Yeah sorry, thats not how this kind of things works. But I would hate to take your self important delusion away from you.
And no, a cruiser that has a horrible turn rate should not be built for front facing attacks, what kind of logic is that?
So because it has bad turn rate we are forced to play them as broadside? With a 5/3 ship you can still do broadside, but at least we have the choice to play the ship like we want.
Um, no.
We aren't 'forced' to do anything. If a ship isn't performing the way you like you either redo it so that it does or get another ship that's optimized for what you want your playstyle to be. You don't beg the devs to make 'every' ship be changed to suit you.
Want a ship to be 5/3? I've already said it, buy one that is already 5/3.
Now a LTS and loving it.
Just because you spend money on this game, it does not entitle you to be a jerk if things don't go your way.
I have come to the conclusion that I have a memory like Etch-A-Sketch. I shake my head and forget everything.
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
So just because you don't like broadsiding, you think the play style should be removed altogether. Yeah sorry, thats not how this kind of things works. But I would hate to take your self important delusion away from you.
And no, a cruiser that has a horrible turn rate should not be built for front facing attacks, what kind of logic is that?
So because it has bad turn rate we are forced to play them as broadside? With a 5/3 ship you can still do broadside, but at least we have the choice to play the ship like we want.
Um, no.
We aren't 'forced' to do anything. If a ship isn't performing the way you like you either redo it so that it does or get another ship that's optimized for what you want your playstyle to be. You don't beg the devs to make 'every' ship be changed to suit you.
Want a ship to be 5/3? I've already said it, buy one that is already 5/3.
This is reminding me of a similar experience where somone went on a 80 page long rampage about how everything needed to be changed to his specifications or the game would soon fail and that he knew what was best for the game because he was a mod at some forum for some minor game no one cared about. Then he started ranting about how we were clearly all going against him because we were veteran PVPers (hint: maybe 1 or two people were, most of us rarely if ever PVPed) and we wanted to ruin the game for newbies.......
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
So just because you don't like broadsiding, you think the play style should be removed altogether. Yeah sorry, thats not how this kind of things works. But I would hate to take your self important delusion away from you.
And no, a cruiser that has a horrible turn rate should not be built for front facing attacks, what kind of logic is that?
So because it has bad turn rate we are forced to play them as broadside? With a 5/3 ship you can still do broadside, but at least we have the choice to play the ship like we want.
no, you are clearly not reading what we are saying, 5/3 does not change the fact it cannot turn thus making stuff like cannons and beams banks pointless. no change in weapon slots will make it so you can use cannons and beam banks effectively. 5/3 weapons slots would STILL only make it useful for broadsiding and nothing else.
Learn how shipbuilding works, otherwise, do not talk about things you CLEARLY have no understanding about.
And I guess you never tried to make a high turn cruiser. Try it, you will be surprised how fast you can turn in a cruiser with the proper build. You don't want me to make you a tutorial for it do you?
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
So just because you don't like broadsiding, you think the play style should be removed altogether. Yeah sorry, thats not how this kind of things works. But I would hate to take your self important delusion away from you.
And no, a cruiser that has a horrible turn rate should not be built for front facing attacks, what kind of logic is that?
So because it has bad turn rate we are forced to play them as broadside? With a 5/3 ship you can still do broadside, but at least we have the choice to play the ship like we want.
Um, no.
We aren't 'forced' to do anything. If a ship isn't performing the way you like you either redo it so that it does or get another ship that's optimized for what you want your playstyle to be. You don't beg the devs to make 'every' ship be changed to suit you.
Want a ship to be 5/3? I've already said it, buy one that is already 5/3.
You have been lost somewhere, read the first post again. I say that 4/4 ships are unbalanced compared to 5/3, I already have my 5/3 ships.
I am from Belgium and english isn't my main language, sorry if I make mistakes.
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
So just because you don't like broadsiding, you think the play style should be removed altogether. Yeah sorry, thats not how this kind of things works. But I would hate to take your self important delusion away from you.
And no, a cruiser that has a horrible turn rate should not be built for front facing attacks, what kind of logic is that?
So because it has bad turn rate we are forced to play them as broadside? With a 5/3 ship you can still do broadside, but at least we have the choice to play the ship like we want.
no, you are clearly not reading what we are saying, 5/3 does not change the fact it cannot turn thus making stuff like cannons and beams banks pointless. no change in weapon slots will make it so you can use cannons and beam banks effectively. 5/3 weapons slots would STILL only make it useful for broadsiding and nothing else.
Learn how shipbuilding works, otherwise, do not talk about things you CLEARLY have no understanding about.
And I guess you never tried to make a high turn cruiser. Try it, you will be surprised how fast you can turn with a cruiser and a proper build. You don't want me to make you a tutorial for it do you?
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
So just because you don't like broadsiding, you think the play style should be removed altogether. Yeah sorry, thats not how this kind of things works. But I would hate to take your self important delusion away from you.
And no, a cruiser that has a horrible turn rate should not be built for front facing attacks, what kind of logic is that?
So because it has bad turn rate we are forced to play them as broadside? With a 5/3 ship you can still do broadside, but at least we have the choice to play the ship like we want.
Um, no.
We aren't 'forced' to do anything. If a ship isn't performing the way you like you either redo it so that it does or get another ship that's optimized for what you want your playstyle to be. You don't beg the devs to make 'every' ship be changed to suit you.
Want a ship to be 5/3? I've already said it, buy one that is already 5/3.
You have been lost somewhere, read the first post again. I say that 4/4 ships are unbalanced compared to 5/3, I already have my 5/3 ships.
Again, you are wasting all your console slots on making it turn, that is a MASSIVE waste of resources, any decent shipbuilder will tell you how much of a waste it is. You are trying to make a ship into something it was, is, and never will be. What you are asking for is like asking on how to make a science ship play like an escort, or an escort and make it as defensive and engi heavy as a cruiser.
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,117Community Moderator
And I guess you never tried to make a high turn cruiser. Try it, you will be surprised how fast you can turn in a cruiser with the proper build. You don't want me to make you a tutorial for it do you?
Attacking someone like that won't win anyone over here. And I believe the answer to a slow turning is RCS Accelerators or Fleet consoles with [+turn].
You have been lost somewhere, read the first post again. I say that 4/4 ships are unbalanced compared to 5/3, I already have my 5/3 ships.
4/4 ships have been around since day one. We never had any 5/3 until the Andorian Escorts came out. So I'd say they've been balanced a lot longer than we've had 5/3s. 5/3 ships are designed for more forward firepower. 4/4 ships are more of a balanced setup.
Not every ship is suited for a 5/3 setup. For example the Bortasqu. Her turn rate isn't optimal for a 5/3 forward attack. Most other ships will outmaneuver her unless you load the TRIBBLE out of her with +turn and are a Tac with AP Alpha. Even then I'm pretty sure she still handles like a brick.
An Assault Cruiser Refit could benefit from a 5/3 as she has decent turn. However she is a standard Cruiser, not a Battlecruiser. A 4/4 works just fine for her.
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
So just because you don't like broadsiding, you think the play style should be removed altogether. Yeah sorry, thats not how this kind of things works. But I would hate to take your self important delusion away from you.
And no, a cruiser that has a horrible turn rate should not be built for front facing attacks, what kind of logic is that?
So because it has bad turn rate we are forced to play them as broadside? With a 5/3 ship you can still do broadside, but at least we have the choice to play the ship like we want.
no, you are clearly not reading what we are saying, 5/3 does not change the fact it cannot turn thus making stuff like cannons and beams banks pointless. no change in weapon slots will make it so you can use cannons and beam banks effectively. 5/3 weapons slots would STILL only make it useful for broadsiding and nothing else.
Learn how shipbuilding works, otherwise, do not talk about things you CLEARLY have no understanding about.
And I guess you never tried to make a high turn cruiser. Try it, you will be surprised how fast you can turn with a cruiser and a proper build. You don't want me to make you a tutorial for it do you?
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
So just because you don't like broadsiding, you think the play style should be removed altogether. Yeah sorry, thats not how this kind of things works. But I would hate to take your self important delusion away from you.
And no, a cruiser that has a horrible turn rate should not be built for front facing attacks, what kind of logic is that?
So because it has bad turn rate we are forced to play them as broadside? With a 5/3 ship you can still do broadside, but at least we have the choice to play the ship like we want.
Um, no.
We aren't 'forced' to do anything. If a ship isn't performing the way you like you either redo it so that it does or get another ship that's optimized for what you want your playstyle to be. You don't beg the devs to make 'every' ship be changed to suit you.
Want a ship to be 5/3? I've already said it, buy one that is already 5/3.
You have been lost somewhere, read the first post again. I say that 4/4 ships are unbalanced compared to 5/3, I already have my 5/3 ships.
Again, you are wasting all your console slots on making it turn, that is a MASSIVE waste of resources, any decent shipbuilder will tell you how much of a waste it is. You are trying to make a ship into something it was, is, and never will be. What you are asking for is like asking on how to make a science ship play like an escort, or an escort and make it as defensive and engi heavy as a cruiser.
If I understand well you play ships like the Arbiter, the Scimatar, the Atiska and other 5/3 ship that have low turn rate with beam arrays?
I am from Belgium and english isn't my main language, sorry if I make mistakes.
no, it makes no sense, those ships were MADE for broadsiding in-game, they are great at EXACTLY what they were built for in-game. Besides that, the 5/3 is not going to change that they have garbage turn rate, it would not change the fact they would still be basically useless for anything BUT beam arrays.
All you and the OP have proven is that you have no idea how shipbuilding works.
Obviously you give a TRIBBLE about how much Star Trek is in Star Trek online as long as all you need to do is smashing the spacebar.
And the Klingon battlecruisers not designed for cannons, really ? How much turnrate do you think is sufficient to shoot a Borg cube ?
I happen to like 4 by 4 weapon setting. If they change all to 5 - 3, then I would have to come in here and make a thread like this one and whinge about them changing it back.
Rather silly to come in here boast about your high turn rate cruiser to a group of people who've probably made more viable builds than the number of ships you own.
You can have your whinge, but at the end of the day,
1. They're never going to change all 4-4- into a 5-3
2. You can make your case til you are blue in the face, people who don't give TRIBBLE about your view won't change their mind no matter how much sense you think it makes.
3. We're obviously not going to change your mind about 4-4 setup.
4. This is a stalemate, there's really no point arguing anymore points, just go play your 5-3 battle cruisers and eventually might get tired of it and find the broadside cruisers are actually quite fun to play with.
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
So just because you don't like broadsiding, you think the play style should be removed altogether. Yeah sorry, thats not how this kind of things works. But I would hate to take your self important delusion away from you.
And no, a cruiser that has a horrible turn rate should not be built for front facing attacks, what kind of logic is that?
So because it has bad turn rate we are forced to play them as broadside? With a 5/3 ship you can still do broadside, but at least we have the choice to play the ship like we want.
no, you are clearly not reading what we are saying, 5/3 does not change the fact it cannot turn thus making stuff like cannons and beams banks pointless. no change in weapon slots will make it so you can use cannons and beam banks effectively. 5/3 weapons slots would STILL only make it useful for broadsiding and nothing else.
Learn how shipbuilding works, otherwise, do not talk about things you CLEARLY have no understanding about.
And I guess you never tried to make a high turn cruiser. Try it, you will be surprised how fast you can turn with a cruiser and a proper build. You don't want me to make you a tutorial for it do you?
I see the beem spammer squad is out in full force. 5/3 is what makes sense for all cruisers. At least, if you want a game which somehow mirrors what was seen on screen.
5/3 would make a lot more ships viable again, whithout turning them into broadsiding abominations. Klingon battlecruisers, D'Deridex, Galor.. just to name a few.
So just because you don't like broadsiding, you think the play style should be removed altogether. Yeah sorry, thats not how this kind of things works. But I would hate to take your self important delusion away from you.
And no, a cruiser that has a horrible turn rate should not be built for front facing attacks, what kind of logic is that?
So because it has bad turn rate we are forced to play them as broadside? With a 5/3 ship you can still do broadside, but at least we have the choice to play the ship like we want.
Um, no.
We aren't 'forced' to do anything. If a ship isn't performing the way you like you either redo it so that it does or get another ship that's optimized for what you want your playstyle to be. You don't beg the devs to make 'every' ship be changed to suit you.
Want a ship to be 5/3? I've already said it, buy one that is already 5/3.
You have been lost somewhere, read the first post again. I say that 4/4 ships are unbalanced compared to 5/3, I already have my 5/3 ships.
Again, you are wasting all your console slots on making it turn, that is a MASSIVE waste of resources, any decent shipbuilder will tell you how much of a waste it is. You are trying to make a ship into something it was, is, and never will be. What you are asking for is like asking on how to make a science ship play like an escort, or an escort and make it as defensive and engi heavy as a cruiser.
If I understand well you play ships like the Arbiter, the Scimatar, the Atiska and other 5/3 ship that have low turn rate with beam arrays?
well, not just me, but most players who know what they are doing, if they do not they are doing it for the lols, or possibly PVP.
no, it makes no sense, those ships were MADE for broadsiding in-game, they are great at EXACTLY what they were built for in-game. Besides that, the 5/3 is not going to change that they have garbage turn rate, it would not change the fact they would still be basically useless for anything BUT beam arrays.
All you and the OP have proven is that you have no idea how shipbuilding works.
Obviously you give a TRIBBLE about how much Star Trek is in Star Trek online as long as all you need to do is smashing the spacebar.
And the Klingon battlecruisers not designed for cannons, really ? How much turnrate do you think is sufficient to shoot a Borg cube ?
nope, while i do use the spacebar, that is not all i do. and yeah. borg cubes are not the ONLY thing you are fighting, i mean, unless you mean "playing" as in sitting around doing the borg alerts all day and nothing else.
nope, while i do use the spacebar, that is not all i do. and yeah. borg cubes are not the ONLY thing you are fighting, i mean, unless you mean "playing" as in sitting around doing the borg alerts all day and nothing else.
What exactly is it you can't keep in front of a Tor'kaht or Negh'var ? Iconians ? Undine ? Mirror fed spacewhales ?
And what would 5/3 take away from a beam built ? The broadside is exactly the same.
no, it makes no sense, those ships were MADE for broadsiding in-game, they are great at EXACTLY what they were built for in-game. Besides that, the 5/3 is not going to change that they have garbage turn rate, it would not change the fact they would still be basically useless for anything BUT beam arrays.
All you and the OP have proven is that you have no idea how shipbuilding works.
Obviously you give a TRIBBLE about how much Star Trek is in Star Trek online as long as all you need to do is smashing the spacebar.
And the Klingon battlecruisers not designed for cannons, really ? How much turnrate do you think is sufficient to shoot a Borg cube ?
Here we go...the creator of last weeks all ships should have 5 forward slots thread!
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,117Community Moderator
What exactly is it you can't keep in front of a Tor'kaht or Negh'var ? Iconians ? Undine ? Mirror fed spacewhales ?
And what would 5/3 take away from a beam built ? The broadside is exactly the same.
I believe its the idea that we all need our 4/4 cruisers convered to 5/3 "for balance purposes". They are balanced just fine. We don't need to force every cruiser into a 5/3 loadout because it is not necessary. If this happens, where will it stop? When we can mount Dual Heavy Cannons on everything? When everything flies like a cookie cutter Avenger or Scimitar? When everything has the same BOff layout and console layout?
I resent someone trying to change them to 5/3 just because they don't like 4/4
and so does my Fleet Guardian.
Didn't see that coming.
I am from Belgium and english isn't my main language, sorry if I make mistakes.
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,117Community Moderator
My cruisers do just fine in combat, both in groups and alone. In a group, I tend to use Beam Fire at Will combined with Attack Pattern Beta to debuff as many enemies as possible so that everyone can benefit from it. Also, running with full Kobali set makes her pretty durable, and she's got the Quantum Phase weapon set on.
My Fleet Assault Cruiser also does the BFAW/APBeta combo, but with Phased Tetryon, the full Nukara set, 2 piece weapon/console Nukara, and full Krenim set. Tetryon for DAYS. May not have the Lt. Cmdr Science my Guardian has, but I have flown an Assault Cruiser variant in one form or another since I first got to the level to get the standard Assault Cruiser.
Both, combined with my chosen traits, make them decent at broadsiding while being maneuverable enough to use Torpedoes as well. While not specialized in DPS or Tanking, they can hold their own against most NPCs. Against a dedicated PvPer, DPS Chaser with uber DPS, or sneak sneak Alpha Strike builds... I know I'll get wasted as those builds are set up for maximum damage before you can even react.
But the fact remains, my Cruisers fit my playstyle for cruisers. I have a different style when I pop into an Escort, and I have a different style for Science ships. I know how to fight my ships effectively. If I wanted a 5/3 cruiser, I'd get the Avenger or Arbiter. I don't want that forced on me because someone feels they don't line up with battlecruisers like the Avenger.
I believe its the idea that we all need our 4/4 cruisers convered to 5/3 "for balance purposes". They are balanced just fine. We don't need to force every cruiser into a 5/3 loadout because it is not necessary. If this happens, where will it stop? When we can mount Dual Heavy Cannons on everything? When everything flies like a cookie cutter Avenger or Scimitar? When everything has the same BOff layout and console layout?
Guess it's just a matter of perspective. If you run a beam setup, it doesn't matter. 4/4 works so why should it get changed ?
That's one side of the coin.
Now have a look at warmaker001b's signature. That's how I want to set up my Klingon battlecruisers ingame. If a cannon/turret 4/4 setup would be on the same level as a broadsider, I wouldn't try to argue on the internet (you know what they say about it...)
But it isn't. To get it even near the efficiency of a broadside setup, every little optimization helps. And then 5/3 is a big deal.
Would 5/3 hurt my Fed captain's Galaxy built ? No, not at all. Whould it help my Klingons ? Yes, quite a lot.
Imho the game mechanics should be modified to make "lol RP builts" competitive. It is a Star Trek game after all.
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Well that would be great to have some new special weapon like the cutting beam in reputation but the devs seems to be stuck on console, torpedo and beam array/dual cannons pattern.
I never saw a dev talking about broadside in any ship blog till I play this game.
edit : sorry double post.
Because...
and
Never enough Dakka for some people.
thats nice, does not change the fact that broadsiding is what those ships are built for, why do you think even the stuff those ships come with are mostly beam arrays.
and as said before, wepon slots DO NOT MATTER, no matter how much stupid you apply, those ships all have garbage turn rate, they will NEVER be useful with beam banks and cannons.
So just because you don't like broadsiding, you think the play style should be removed altogether. Yeah sorry, thats not how this kind of things works. But I would hate to take your self important delusion away from you.
And no, a cruiser that has a horrible turn rate should not be built for front facing attacks, what kind of logic is that?
If you want a Trek game that IS a slave to the canon, then go to college, get a degree in computer science, graphic designs and whatever other degrees you need to design games, get a license agreement with CBS and have at it. Until then, drop the "this isn't canon and therefor its not okay" argument. because its total TRIBBLE.
Broadsiding is in the tutorial as well. IIRC.
So because it has bad turn rate we are forced to play them as broadside? With a 5/3 ship you can still do broadside, but at least we have the choice to play the ship like we want.
no, you are clearly not reading what we are saying, 5/3 does not change the fact it cannot turn thus making stuff like cannons and beams banks pointless. no change in weapon slots will make it so you can use cannons and beam banks effectively. 5/3 weapons slots would STILL only make it useful for broadsiding and nothing else.
Learn how shipbuilding works, otherwise, do not talk about things you CLEARLY have no understanding about.
Um, no.
We aren't 'forced' to do anything. If a ship isn't performing the way you like you either redo it so that it does or get another ship that's optimized for what you want your playstyle to be. You don't beg the devs to make 'every' ship be changed to suit you.
Want a ship to be 5/3? I've already said it, buy one that is already 5/3.
This is reminding me of a similar experience where somone went on a 80 page long rampage about how everything needed to be changed to his specifications or the game would soon fail and that he knew what was best for the game because he was a mod at some forum for some minor game no one cared about. Then he started ranting about how we were clearly all going against him because we were veteran PVPers (hint: maybe 1 or two people were, most of us rarely if ever PVPed) and we wanted to ruin the game for newbies.......
And I guess you never tried to make a high turn cruiser. Try it, you will be surprised how fast you can turn in a cruiser with the proper build. You don't want me to make you a tutorial for it do you?
You have been lost somewhere, read the first post again. I say that 4/4 ships are unbalanced compared to 5/3, I already have my 5/3 ships.
Again, you are wasting all your console slots on making it turn, that is a MASSIVE waste of resources, any decent shipbuilder will tell you how much of a waste it is. You are trying to make a ship into something it was, is, and never will be. What you are asking for is like asking on how to make a science ship play like an escort, or an escort and make it as defensive and engi heavy as a cruiser.
Attacking someone like that won't win anyone over here. And I believe the answer to a slow turning is RCS Accelerators or Fleet consoles with [+turn].
4/4 ships have been around since day one. We never had any 5/3 until the Andorian Escorts came out. So I'd say they've been balanced a lot longer than we've had 5/3s. 5/3 ships are designed for more forward firepower. 4/4 ships are more of a balanced setup.
Not every ship is suited for a 5/3 setup. For example the Bortasqu. Her turn rate isn't optimal for a 5/3 forward attack. Most other ships will outmaneuver her unless you load the TRIBBLE out of her with +turn and are a Tac with AP Alpha. Even then I'm pretty sure she still handles like a brick.
An Assault Cruiser Refit could benefit from a 5/3 as she has decent turn. However she is a standard Cruiser, not a Battlecruiser. A 4/4 works just fine for her.
If I understand well you play ships like the Arbiter, the Scimatar, the Atiska and other 5/3 ship that have low turn rate with beam arrays?
And my 4/4 ships do very well. I love them.
Obviously you give a TRIBBLE about how much Star Trek is in Star Trek online as long as all you need to do is smashing the spacebar.
And the Klingon battlecruisers not designed for cannons, really ? How much turnrate do you think is sufficient to shoot a Borg cube ?
Your argument is making even less sense now. There's nothing wrong with 4/4.
Rather silly to come in here boast about your high turn rate cruiser to a group of people who've probably made more viable builds than the number of ships you own.
You can have your whinge, but at the end of the day,
1. They're never going to change all 4-4- into a 5-3
2. You can make your case til you are blue in the face, people who don't give TRIBBLE about your view won't change their mind no matter how much sense you think it makes.
3. We're obviously not going to change your mind about 4-4 setup.
4. This is a stalemate, there's really no point arguing anymore points, just go play your 5-3 battle cruisers and eventually might get tired of it and find the broadside cruisers are actually quite fun to play with.
well, not just me, but most players who know what they are doing, if they do not they are doing it for the lols, or possibly PVP.
nope, while i do use the spacebar, that is not all i do. and yeah. borg cubes are not the ONLY thing you are fighting, i mean, unless you mean "playing" as in sitting around doing the borg alerts all day and nothing else.
What exactly is it you can't keep in front of a Tor'kaht or Negh'var ? Iconians ? Undine ? Mirror fed spacewhales ?
And what would 5/3 take away from a beam built ? The broadside is exactly the same.
Here we go...the creator of last weeks all ships should have 5 forward slots thread!
I believe its the idea that we all need our 4/4 cruisers convered to 5/3 "for balance purposes". They are balanced just fine. We don't need to force every cruiser into a 5/3 loadout because it is not necessary. If this happens, where will it stop? When we can mount Dual Heavy Cannons on everything? When everything flies like a cookie cutter Avenger or Scimitar? When everything has the same BOff layout and console layout?
I resent someone trying to change them to 5/3 just because they don't like 4/4
This as well. My Fleet Assault Cruiser flies just fine, and so does my Fleet Guardian.
Didn't see that coming.
My Fleet Assault Cruiser also does the BFAW/APBeta combo, but with Phased Tetryon, the full Nukara set, 2 piece weapon/console Nukara, and full Krenim set. Tetryon for DAYS. May not have the Lt. Cmdr Science my Guardian has, but I have flown an Assault Cruiser variant in one form or another since I first got to the level to get the standard Assault Cruiser.
Both, combined with my chosen traits, make them decent at broadsiding while being maneuverable enough to use Torpedoes as well. While not specialized in DPS or Tanking, they can hold their own against most NPCs. Against a dedicated PvPer, DPS Chaser with uber DPS, or sneak sneak Alpha Strike builds... I know I'll get wasted as those builds are set up for maximum damage before you can even react.
But the fact remains, my Cruisers fit my playstyle for cruisers. I have a different style when I pop into an Escort, and I have a different style for Science ships. I know how to fight my ships effectively. If I wanted a 5/3 cruiser, I'd get the Avenger or Arbiter. I don't want that forced on me because someone feels they don't line up with battlecruisers like the Avenger.
Guess it's just a matter of perspective. If you run a beam setup, it doesn't matter. 4/4 works so why should it get changed ?
That's one side of the coin.
Now have a look at warmaker001b's signature. That's how I want to set up my Klingon battlecruisers ingame. If a cannon/turret 4/4 setup would be on the same level as a broadsider, I wouldn't try to argue on the internet (you know what they say about it...)
But it isn't. To get it even near the efficiency of a broadside setup, every little optimization helps. And then 5/3 is a big deal.
Would 5/3 hurt my Fed captain's Galaxy built ? No, not at all. Whould it help my Klingons ? Yes, quite a lot.
Imho the game mechanics should be modified to make "lol RP builts" competitive. It is a Star Trek game after all.