This isn't about the game.... its about an advertisement. Believe it or not its still not legal to lie in your advertisements even if you have a contract with existing customers that says you are allowed to change your service any time you feel like it.
That type of defense don't work in the real world.
What the TOS protects them from is making changes at any time they like. That doesn't mean they can lie to you to get you to spend money and then not follow through on something promised in an ad.
The TOS legal protections don't cover false advertising.
And if Cryptic had ever advertised the original bugship as the definitive, no-questions-asked, never-to-be-surpassed best ship in the game, you would have a point.
But, since they didn't, you don't.
They advertised an in-game item with certain abilities, and that's what they delivered. They're currently advertising a new item with arguably superior abilities. Them's the breaks. If we're all spared, and the game lasts long enough, there'll be a T7 bugship that makes the current one look like a Morris Traveller. Deal with it.
The ambiguity of the original blogs is just a distraction. Trying to bring a legal stance to it is just fruitless and despite people's perceived investment in the game, it's just a virtual ship that was well overpriced and viewed as the pinnacle long after it fell from grace.
LoR should have spelt it's demise from the over 500M+ club, but it didn't due to market controls by peeps who had too many of them or too much money to allow them to go down below the 500M mark. The ******** is similar to those who would be Hedge fund managers, when the rug get's pulled from under them they either drop like a stone or get angry. There's a lot of anger here...
Chris Robert's on SC:
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
So who is going to be the sacrificial lamb that tries to sue them over this?
I would sue them for gambling part first lol, and after that for false advertisement.
Can't say anything about the chances, because there are a number of factors to consider.
But instead of pumping more thousands $ in to Craps casino, I would sue them....perhaps start a crowd funded law suit for STO players. Sadly (or maybe luckily) I did not gamble for the assault ship back then :P.
I would sue them for gambling part first lol, and after that for false advertisement.
Can't say anything about the chances, because there are a number of factors to consider.
But instead of pumping more thousands $ in to Craps casino, I would sue them....perhaps start a crowd funded law suit for STO players. Sadly (or maybe luckily) I did not gamble for the assault ship back then :P.
yea a class action lawsuit would have to be the way to go.
problem is getting the support outside the forums since there's no way they'd allow talk like this on the forums.
Best post ever,still can't believe some posters don't known they are playing an mmo,let me share some of my knowledge it might help all those morons who don't really know what an mmo is.
Many of you are missing the point that has angered many.
It isn't a point of, oh no they expect us to spend more $.
That is a given in a mmo you folks are correct.
Where the issue for most of us that are annoyed with Cryptic is this.
We ALL know that upgrading is a standard part of playing an online video game... however....
In this Case Cryptic back last Aug. was LOOSING Sales. Because we all KNEW that a new tier of ships and a level cap increase was coming. SO people help there $ back... cause why buy something that is going to be outdated in a few weeks right.
So Cryptic Ran an AD... on there main page... that stated. Don't wait for the new stuff... buy the current stuff and when the new stuff comes we will upgrade it for you for free... cause we want your money right now.
Then they reneged on their promise. That is the issue.
If a company runs an add that was to say... new 2017 models next month... but don't wait buy the last of our 2016 models and we'll let you drive them back and get the new model for free when they come in. (Yes perhaps people would be right to question that offer... but if the company didn't follow through would they be doing something illegal ?... yes they would)
No no no no, you like many others who join a long running debate have not read what has already been said. This has been covered in great detail, they DID NOT deliver what they advertised, THAT is the point, they have even brought the EP in here to apologise for that AND altered 7 month old blogs for reasons best known to themselves.
I do wish people would take the time to read the whole thread before dropping in at the end and then us having to constantly repeat ourselves.
The only thing that needs - apparently - to be constantly repeated is this: you have no case.
You have not even the shadow of the glimmer of the ghost of the faintest vestige of a case.
Any ethical lawyer will take a fee, consider the situation, and tell you this. Any unethical lawyer will take a fee, consider the situation, and ask for more fees until you stop paying, at which point they'll tell you this. An unethical and stupid lawyer will take a fee, take the case to court, lose, and then tell you this (and bill you for court costs). All I'm doing is saving you some time and money here.
You guys are right. Cryptic has misled people. Was it intentional or was it incompetence on their part? Who knows.
The fact is, this thread has become a lightning rod for the trolls who come on these forums to defend Cryptic because they have nothing better to do with their lives. It's amusing to watch them trot out the same old lines, the same old arguments using the same words. It's like laughing at someone who keeps falling over.
Other than that, this thread is a bit pointless. Nothing is going to change. Nobody is getting a free Jem Hadar Strike Ship. Why would you want it? They didn't even bother to give it a 5/2 weapon setup - it's a lazy rehash that probably took them about an hour (with artwork) to put together.
If anything, I think Cryptic have missed a trick with the T6 Bug- all the high-end damage dealers have the 5-2 or 5-3 split of weapons, whereas the Strike Ship retains the 4-3 layout of its predecessor.
This was fine at the time, but with the trend being for escorts to mount more of their guns up front, the 4-3 split is becoming increasingly outdated. It's for this reason I won't be buying shedloads of Zen in the vain hope of getting a ship lockbox.
If anything, I think Cryptic have missed a trick with the T6 Bug- all the high-end damage dealers have the 5-2 or 5-3 split of weapons, whereas the Strike Ship retains the 4-3 layout of its predecessor.
This was fine at the time, but with the trend being for escorts to mount more of their guns up front, the 4-3 split is becoming increasingly outdated. It's for this reason I won't be buying shedloads of Zen in the vain hope of getting a ship lockbox.
I agree with you but there is also a turn rate of 20 to consider as well as a trait which seems to be too good to be true according to bug section.
I expect the exchange price will drop when they fix the trait.
Until then, it's going to be a lot of fun to fly.
Ah yes the good ole... break the trait "not on purpose" to drive sales trick.
The false advertising is dirty... the fact that 50% of ship traits are broken out of the gate is more telling isn't it. I mean we all know 80% of the ship traits will get "Fixed" 3-4 months after there released and sell through has dropped.
i lfy the JSS since Day 1 and i have a bad news for u guys:
the ship trait adds nothing noticeable to your overall dmg but you'll be still dead in mere 0,5 second vs. surgical strike 3 beamboats that can aim at you,
-from any direction (gl, turning on something that is below or upper you) (not like you'd have time 2 deal dmg anyway, even if you could by lame game-engine)
-from cloak (hf, seeing whats coming, or shoot first) (as if it would matter, again)
-with instant disables as pure lock-out (that cant be resisted with the the specific skills, and spects made for disable resisting)
"Rule of Acquisition number 239, never be afraid to mislabel a product"
HAHAHA
intel powers on JSS are next to useless (no ss3, no insta kill) (waste of dps poissibility#1)
aand since ionic-storm got nerfed (fixed actually for once), ur ****'d double time here!!
same goes for its 2 seat comm, nothing of value can be used there either (waste of dps poissibility#2)
anyone better off running the usual "old" powers on it and just use it as a cannon boat, but than again its LOOOOOONG time out dps'd pre-surgical strike 3.. still thats the best u can go for (and die with)
anyone better off running the usual "old" powers on it and just use it as a cannon boat, but than again its LOOOOOONG time out dps'd pre-surgical strike 3.. still thats the best u can go for (and die with
The ship Trait suggests exacty that: use it with CSV. And add the Supremacy Trait, and watch your power levels soar!
intel powers on JSS are next to useless (no ss3, no insta kill) (waste of dps poissibility#1)
aand since ionic-storm got nerfed (fixed actually for once), ur ****'d double time here!!
same goes for its 2 seat comm, nothing of value can be used there either (waste of dps poissibility#2)
anyone better off running the usual "old" powers on it and just use it as a cannon boat, but than again its LOOOOOONG time out dps'd pre-surgical strike 3.. still thats the best u can go for (and die with)
You know, you sound exceptionally bitter.
Also not everyone ranks their ships by the potential to hit over 9000* dps
*Note: that's a dragonball reference, I know 9k isn't actually that high in STO.
Just got one ... on the last pack from my first 4 pack. Was stunned ... then annoyed as I was bombarded with /tells from people wanting to buy it.
When the Delta Recruit thing goes live, I'm making myself a Vorta. The Dominion WILL conquer the Alpha ... <checks STO map> ... CORRECTION, the Dominion WILL conquer Earth and the rest of the Beta Quadrant!
Pretty sure the boffs can use the jem-hadar outfit, in fact I believe one of my kdf crews have a few boffs in it.
The pants in particular go well with some other outfit choices I've noticed.
If they do it again with other faction ships like D'Kora, Galor I'm gone for good. They need to keep their word on taking care of the owners of these ships.
Sad irony is it is stupid greed on their part also. Release probably one of the most sought after ships this early. Now of those that really want this ship that have it now, are going to go after anything else when past history has this ship the best in the game?
Makes me wonder if this is the last milking of the customers before they pull the plug.
intel powers on JSS are next to useless (no ss3, no insta kill) (waste of dps poissibility#1)
aand since ionic-storm got nerfed (fixed actually for once), ur ****'d double time here!!
same goes for its 2 seat comm, nothing of value can be used there either (waste of dps poissibility#2)
anyone better off running the usual "old" powers on it and just use it as a cannon boat, but than again its LOOOOOONG time out dps'd pre-surgical strike 3.. still thats the best u can go for (and die with)
Believe it or not, there's more to Intel than Ionic Turbulence and Surgical Strikes. The tweak to Ionic Turbulence has not reduced it's powerful debuffs at all. And you still have a LtCdr TAC/Intel station. Maybe you can slot OSS3 to feed those cannons going on CRF or whatever?
As for the Command Spec, I don't think much of it because in general, Command just plain SUCKS. Esp with a high powered Escort like the JHSS. Even on the Command Cruisers, the only Command ability I slot is Rally Point because the rest is pure garbage.
The JHSS gives you more options than the old JHAS simply for the fact that it has the perks of T6 at the very least. You can build it like an old T5U JHAS with the +1 for being a T6 ship. But since it has Hybrid BOFF stations, you have extra room for creativity.
You guys are right. Cryptic has misled people. Was it intentional or was it incompetence on their part? Who knows.
The fact is, this thread has become a lightning rod for the trolls who come on these forums to defend Cryptic because they have nothing better to do with their lives. It's amusing to watch them trot out the same old lines, the same old arguments using the same words. It's like laughing at someone who keeps falling over.
See? i just changed one word,yeah one word and the same can be said about the other side.
You shouldnt really be calling anyone a troll,specially you and you're better than anyone attitude,shame i couldnt find the post but i remember reading today a post when someone posted an idea or sugestion and you just typed the word "no"....and you calling other people trolls? oh the irony is strong in this one.
Precisely... Threads like this are click bait for anyone with a chip on their shoulder and holding a grudge against Cryptic, not just the proclaimed 'white knights' in the community...
Once the lynch mob begins to form, all the usual sheeple amass and begin to chant 'down with Cryptic' in every other post, irrespective of whether they're regurgitating tired old half-truths and rhetoric, or not...
The same arguments against Cryptic are getting rolled out just as readily as any statements in their favour, if not more so... And this is occuring even after Cryptic acknowledged, admitted to, and apologised for the mistake - whether it took 6 months or 6 minutes is irrelevant, they took ownership of the error...
However, in typical troll style, many have then taken that to be further 'proof' that they are owed something which is just absolute nonsense and, as always, anyone who disagrees is just shouted down with TROLL! or WHITE KNIGHT! accusations, rather than rational arguments...
If they do it again with other faction ships like D'Kora, Galor I'm gone for good. They need to keep their word on taking care of the owners of these ships.
Sad irony is it is stupid greed on their part also. Release probably one of the most sought after ships this early. Now of those that really want this ship that have it now, are going to go after anything else when past history has this ship the best in the game?
Makes me wonder if this is the last milking of the customers before they pull the plug.
Pretty sure the T6 Galor will be c-store cardassian republic exclusive, cause devs have said they regretted making the Galor a lockbox ship.
Pretty sure the T6 Galor will be c-store cardassian republic exclusive, cause devs have said they regretted making the Galor a lockbox ship.
I'm still thinking this is the last hurrah before the plug is pulled. With Delta Recruits leading to the Iconian war, the big baddie we've been against for so long, what else is there?
Have to wonder when they'd fit a Cardassian republic exclusive in.
I'm still thinking this is the last hurrah before the plug is pulled. With Delta Recruits leading to the Iconian war, the big baddie we've been against for so long, what else is there? Rehashed Borg? Rehashed Dominion?
Have to wonder when they'd fit a Cardassian republic exclusive in.
Gotta love unbridled paranoia... I've been playing for well over 2 years now and can remember being told 'don't buy an LTS as STO will be shutdown within 6 months, guaranteed!!1!'...
Just because S10 might bring about the beginning of the Iconian War, it does not mean that war will be over in a single season... Cryptic could easily spread the Iconian War across several seasons - the initial invasion, the Alpha Quadrant on the brink of collapse, and then the inevitable turning of the tide, spread over S10, S11 and S12 for example...
This could even be used as a spring board for the introduction of new playable factions, which have united with the Federation/Klingon Empire, in order to stave off the Iconian advance...
Nor does any of this mean there will be no other story arcs that Cryptic can introduce, once the war is indeed over...
What after the Iconians then? Rehashed Borg? Rehashed Dominion? They wiped out any chance of the Krenim and a new temporal war (which had some of the best potentional long term plot). Vidiians aren't a threat, evil pre-ascended Ocompa again and their caretaker? That wasn't exactly a threat. Photonics aren't exactly an issue unless they have a huge leap in tech.
I'm still thinking this is the last hurrah before the plug is pulled. With Delta Recruits leading to the Iconian war, the big baddie we've been against for so long, what else is there? Rehashed Borg? Rehashed Dominion?
Have to wonder when they'd fit a Cardassian republic exclusive in.
I just don't see it ... to me if they were getting ready to pull the plug they would pull out all the stops to get people happy and spending money. 4x XP permanently, MK XIV rare drops on instances, etc etc.
I fully expect either a Cooperative or Cardassian mini faction in the next expansion, followed by whichever one is not used. They'll just tailor the story to incorperate it, such as "Oh, the Iconians bombed Cardassia!", or "The Borg Queen just made a deal with the Iconians, oh no!"
As a former SWG player I've seen an MMO on its death bed before, and STO is certainly not. The economy is the first sign, in SWG towards the end most player shops were abandoned (SWG had player created vendors rather than one large exchange). It was very hard to find things to buy. When the exchange starts drying up, THATS when you worry.
Comments
But, since they didn't, you don't.
They advertised an in-game item with certain abilities, and that's what they delivered. They're currently advertising a new item with arguably superior abilities. Them's the breaks. If we're all spared, and the game lasts long enough, there'll be a T7 bugship that makes the current one look like a Morris Traveller. Deal with it.
LoR should have spelt it's demise from the over 500M+ club, but it didn't due to market controls by peeps who had too many of them or too much money to allow them to go down below the 500M mark. The ******** is similar to those who would be Hedge fund managers, when the rug get's pulled from under them they either drop like a stone or get angry. There's a lot of anger here...
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
Can't say anything about the chances, because there are a number of factors to consider.
But instead of pumping more thousands $ in to Craps casino, I would sue them....perhaps start a crowd funded law suit for STO players. Sadly (or maybe luckily) I did not gamble for the assault ship back then :P.
Holy Grail of Gamification is Addiction | 5 Ways to Accomplisch | and the Psychology of Freemium
yea a class action lawsuit would have to be the way to go.
problem is getting the support outside the forums since there's no way they'd allow talk like this on the forums.
Many of you are missing the point that has angered many.
It isn't a point of, oh no they expect us to spend more $.
That is a given in a mmo you folks are correct.
Where the issue for most of us that are annoyed with Cryptic is this.
We ALL know that upgrading is a standard part of playing an online video game... however....
In this Case Cryptic back last Aug. was LOOSING Sales. Because we all KNEW that a new tier of ships and a level cap increase was coming. SO people help there $ back... cause why buy something that is going to be outdated in a few weeks right.
So Cryptic Ran an AD... on there main page... that stated. Don't wait for the new stuff... buy the current stuff and when the new stuff comes we will upgrade it for you for free... cause we want your money right now.
Then they reneged on their promise. That is the issue.
If a company runs an add that was to say... new 2017 models next month... but don't wait buy the last of our 2016 models and we'll let you drive them back and get the new model for free when they come in. (Yes perhaps people would be right to question that offer... but if the company didn't follow through would they be doing something illegal ?... yes they would)
You have not even the shadow of the glimmer of the ghost of the faintest vestige of a case.
Any ethical lawyer will take a fee, consider the situation, and tell you this. Any unethical lawyer will take a fee, consider the situation, and ask for more fees until you stop paying, at which point they'll tell you this. An unethical and stupid lawyer will take a fee, take the case to court, lose, and then tell you this (and bill you for court costs). All I'm doing is saving you some time and money here.
The fact is, this thread has become a lightning rod for the trolls who come on these forums to defend Cryptic because they have nothing better to do with their lives. It's amusing to watch them trot out the same old lines, the same old arguments using the same words. It's like laughing at someone who keeps falling over.
Other than that, this thread is a bit pointless. Nothing is going to change. Nobody is getting a free Jem Hadar Strike Ship. Why would you want it? They didn't even bother to give it a 5/2 weapon setup - it's a lazy rehash that probably took them about an hour (with artwork) to put together.
Free Tibet!
This was fine at the time, but with the trend being for escorts to mount more of their guns up front, the 4-3 split is becoming increasingly outdated. It's for this reason I won't be buying shedloads of Zen in the vain hope of getting a ship lockbox.
I agree with you but there is also a turn rate of 20 to consider as well as a trait which seems to be too good to be true according to bug section.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1395621
5 front DHCs in front might have actually pushed things a lil.
Im also looking forward to the next EP apology on topic when they adjust the trait long after the promotion is over and suited its purpose.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
I gonna have fun
Until then, it's going to be a lot of fun to fly.
Ah yes the good ole... break the trait "not on purpose" to drive sales trick.
The false advertising is dirty... the fact that 50% of ship traits are broken out of the gate is more telling isn't it. I mean we all know 80% of the ship traits will get "Fixed" 3-4 months after there released and sell through has dropped.
Same here! My avatar will be updated shortly with the new JHSS
the ship trait adds nothing noticeable to your overall dmg but you'll be still dead in mere 0,5 second vs. surgical strike 3 beamboats that can aim at you,
-from any direction (gl, turning on something that is below or upper you) (not like you'd have time 2 deal dmg anyway, even if you could by lame game-engine)
-from cloak (hf, seeing whats coming, or shoot first) (as if it would matter, again)
-with instant disables as pure lock-out (that cant be resisted with the the specific skills, and spects made for disable resisting)
"Rule of Acquisition number 239, never be afraid to mislabel a product"
HAHAHA
intel powers on JSS are next to useless (no ss3, no insta kill) (waste of dps poissibility#1)
aand since ionic-storm got nerfed (fixed actually for once), ur ****'d double time here!!
same goes for its 2 seat comm, nothing of value can be used there either (waste of dps poissibility#2)
anyone better off running the usual "old" powers on it and just use it as a cannon boat, but than again its LOOOOOONG time out dps'd pre-surgical strike 3.. still thats the best u can go for (and die with)
The ship Trait suggests exacty that: use it with CSV. And add the Supremacy Trait, and watch your power levels soar!
An Overwhelm Emitters might be useful too.
I just love Polaron based ships for some reason
You know, you sound exceptionally bitter.
Also not everyone ranks their ships by the potential to hit over 9000* dps
*Note: that's a dragonball reference, I know 9k isn't actually that high in STO.
When the Delta Recruit thing goes live, I'm making myself a Vorta. The Dominion WILL conquer the Alpha ... <checks STO map> ... CORRECTION, the Dominion WILL conquer Earth and the rest of the Beta Quadrant!
Off topic, can BOffs use the Jem'Hadar outfit?
The pants in particular go well with some other outfit choices I've noticed.
If they do it again with other faction ships like D'Kora, Galor I'm gone for good. They need to keep their word on taking care of the owners of these ships.
Sad irony is it is stupid greed on their part also. Release probably one of the most sought after ships this early. Now of those that really want this ship that have it now, are going to go after anything else when past history has this ship the best in the game?
Makes me wonder if this is the last milking of the customers before they pull the plug.
Believe it or not, there's more to Intel than Ionic Turbulence and Surgical Strikes. The tweak to Ionic Turbulence has not reduced it's powerful debuffs at all. And you still have a LtCdr TAC/Intel station. Maybe you can slot OSS3 to feed those cannons going on CRF or whatever?
As for the Command Spec, I don't think much of it because in general, Command just plain SUCKS. Esp with a high powered Escort like the JHSS. Even on the Command Cruisers, the only Command ability I slot is Rally Point because the rest is pure garbage.
The JHSS gives you more options than the old JHAS simply for the fact that it has the perks of T6 at the very least. You can build it like an old T5U JHAS with the +1 for being a T6 ship. But since it has Hybrid BOFF stations, you have extra room for creativity.
Precisely... Threads like this are click bait for anyone with a chip on their shoulder and holding a grudge against Cryptic, not just the proclaimed 'white knights' in the community...
Once the lynch mob begins to form, all the usual sheeple amass and begin to chant 'down with Cryptic' in every other post, irrespective of whether they're regurgitating tired old half-truths and rhetoric, or not...
The same arguments against Cryptic are getting rolled out just as readily as any statements in their favour, if not more so... And this is occuring even after Cryptic acknowledged, admitted to, and apologised for the mistake - whether it took 6 months or 6 minutes is irrelevant, they took ownership of the error...
However, in typical troll style, many have then taken that to be further 'proof' that they are owed something which is just absolute nonsense and, as always, anyone who disagrees is just shouted down with TROLL! or WHITE KNIGHT! accusations, rather than rational arguments...
Pretty sure the T6 Galor will be c-store cardassian republic exclusive, cause devs have said they regretted making the Galor a lockbox ship.
I'm still thinking this is the last hurrah before the plug is pulled. With Delta Recruits leading to the Iconian war, the big baddie we've been against for so long, what else is there?
Have to wonder when they'd fit a Cardassian republic exclusive in.
Gotta love unbridled paranoia... I've been playing for well over 2 years now and can remember being told 'don't buy an LTS as STO will be shutdown within 6 months, guaranteed!!1!'...
Just because S10 might bring about the beginning of the Iconian War, it does not mean that war will be over in a single season... Cryptic could easily spread the Iconian War across several seasons - the initial invasion, the Alpha Quadrant on the brink of collapse, and then the inevitable turning of the tide, spread over S10, S11 and S12 for example...
This could even be used as a spring board for the introduction of new playable factions, which have united with the Federation/Klingon Empire, in order to stave off the Iconian advance...
Nor does any of this mean there will be no other story arcs that Cryptic can introduce, once the war is indeed over...
I just don't see it ... to me if they were getting ready to pull the plug they would pull out all the stops to get people happy and spending money. 4x XP permanently, MK XIV rare drops on instances, etc etc.
I fully expect either a Cooperative or Cardassian mini faction in the next expansion, followed by whichever one is not used. They'll just tailor the story to incorperate it, such as "Oh, the Iconians bombed Cardassia!", or "The Borg Queen just made a deal with the Iconians, oh no!"
As a former SWG player I've seen an MMO on its death bed before, and STO is certainly not. The economy is the first sign, in SWG towards the end most player shops were abandoned (SWG had player created vendors rather than one large exchange). It was very hard to find things to buy. When the exchange starts drying up, THATS when you worry.