I like what I've seen on Tribble so far. Nice work.
I apologize if this has been asked elsewhere. In the current sector system, we get a voiceover from Spock, Sela, or Seven of Nine whenever we enter a new sector for the first time. What's going to happen to that?
I'm also curious how diplomatic restrictions are going to work. In the current system, a Fed can't enter Omega Leonis, or KDF enter Sirius Sector, unless they have a buff or sufficient Diplomacy/Marauding rep.
I like what I've seen on Tribble so far. Nice work.
I apologize if this has been asked elsewhere. In the current sector system, we get a voiceover from Spock, Sela, or Seven of Nine whenever we enter a new sector for the first time. What's going to happen to that?
I'm also curious how diplomatic restrictions are going to work. In the current system, a Fed can't enter Omega Leonis, or KDF enter Sirius Sector, unless they have a buff or sufficient Diplomacy/Marauding rep.
In answer to your question, they apparently plan on keeping them.
I can't help but feel a bit of concern about this. Even tiny little updates like changing the icons brought bugs.
I'm still constantly either switching my BOFF moves from the default one, to ones I've learned and prefer despite having set it a dozen times already. OR I'm constantly having to buy training manuals again and again to re-teach the BOFF that keeps forgetting I've taught him/her another move. So the new BOFF system is still buggy.
How many more bugs are we going to see when they do something major like change the entire sector map system???
I have not seen any major bugs relating to the new Sector Space on the test server as of yet.
Yes that it is. One point from my wish list for this game: Less loading screens.
Thank you Cryptic you made it!
Looking forward to more changes like real 360 degree space flight
or fully visit able and interact able ship interiors to increase the immersion in play experience.
In answer to your question, they apparently plan on keeping them.
Has anyone actually triggered the voiceovers with a new toon on Tribble since the revamp?
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-) Proudly F2P.Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
I'm taken aback by the words I've read in this and I seriously hope someone will take the initiative to reconsider this one aspect of the new layout.
Star Trek canon, as well as it's allure, has always been grounded in science, exploration, advancement in the human endeavor. Warp drive itself comes from scientific theory. Black holes come from actual science. This list is endless and along the way comes the Star Trek technology, once viewed by most as science fiction, becoming science reality.
The Star Trek communicator being the forerunner to the common flip phone. The Star Trek medical tricorder now available on the shelves of Walmart. With all these things an more this is no time for game expediency to overshadow all the good that STO has brought to the new generations of would-be star ship captains and their dedicated crews.
When I read things like this:
"There were some canon systems however, which, for gameplay/story reasons could not be moved. Vega, which according to the Star Charts map should be located in one of the newly added sectors in the Alpha Quadrant, is too important to the early Federation gameplay to be moved from its current location in the Risa Sector. We know about these discontinuities, but decided that while following the Star Charts is nice, it's ultimately not as important as the functionality of the game."
Vega most certainly needs to be placed where it belongs, not held for expediency that is within the full grasp of the developers to rectify. Be it location change or a rename, the power to make things right is well within the capability and I can think of no one who's going to get lost if Vega suddenly turns up where it's supposed to be.
When canon conflicts with science, default and defer to science. When expediency conflicts with canon, default and defer to canon. Make STO a trusted home for learning.
When you can be so much more, be so.
Gameplay always comes before Accuracy, Also very few people will even notice it is not in the right place.
Ok, let's say we put Earth DIRECTLY on the border between Alpha and Beta. Half of the system now sits outside the playable space of the map. You can fly up to Earth, and some other planets, but those planets on the other side of the sun? You can NEVER get to them.
Keep in mind that Sol is the ONLY system in the entire galaxy that is made up of real planets we know about, have pictures of, have data on, etc. And this is THE ONLY system in the entire STO galaxy, that you wouldn't be able to fly through in it's entirety.
Now, that may not be a big deal at the moment, but let's say we add maps to those other planets. The only way you could get to those planets is if they were ALL on the playable side of the system, which would look/be weird.
And we need to add that on the Alpha Quadrant side too, right? Same thing applies, but the the whole system has to be rotated 180º so that the planets are accessible on THAT side of the border.
All of the above makes my skin crawl. We want Sol to be a special system, but not like that.
That's what I'd like and what I always meant by having Sol in both quadrants:
Why can't you put an identical copy on both sides? Take exactly what is now in the Beta Quadrant, leave it exactly where it is there, and put the same exact thing just over the border in the Alpha Quadrant? While it wouldn't be straddling the line it'll at least be in both quadrants as it should be, and be accessible from either.
Again, Taco, this is yet another piece of awesome work you did here... THANK YOU!
But I bet you knew the Sol System was going to stir the pot a little for it being the center of all and because of its very particular nature.
Would it be ridiculous to have 2 copies of the Sol system, one on each side of the wall. This would keep all planets accessible from either side of the border. I know, there is a stretch of mind to do on where the system really lay on the map, but I think most people will easily imagine it is a border system either we can approach it alpha or beta side.
So, i fly from Bajor and I can approach Sol with no border jump as much as I could if I fly from Vulcan... There would be no perceptible different either way, I simply feel like I am really flying to the hub of Federation with no border jump. Once inside, I can either choose alpha or beta as a drop point.
You will say, but how 'weird' will it be to have me near the "beta sol system" and my friend in sector space near the alpha... if both drop point are in different relative position to the system, I am relatively sure people can stretch their mind to imagine we don't see each other... simply cross border and then we just see each other again on the same 'relative position' to Sol.
I am sorry Taco, but this is THE system people are going to focus on and press on... I think the copy idea could solve that problem of having Sol "on the border"
Not half of the Solar system on one side and half on the other. Just a full copy on both sides with the option to warp out to either quadrant (Beta by default because of current low-level missions).
TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class. Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider. Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
What I don't get is why the Mutara sector and Mutara nebula is deep in Borg space (especially now since it can only be accessed via the transwarp gate), when Kirk's Enterprise managed to get there quite fast: The Genesis planet which was created from the nebula was reached within hours in ST3 TSFS. This brings me to the next issue, what is the nebula actually doing in the game? It was destroyed/transformed when the Genesis device detonated in ST2 TWOK. I know the nebula doesn't currently have any role in the game, but as a fan of the original series movies, it... doesn't sit well with me.
Now as I can see from the new map, while the transwarp gate was removed, the Mutara sector still lies far beyond Romulan space. I think Romulans would have noticed if the Enterprise and the Reliant were to cross their space to get there.
That's not Borg space. The Borg have conquered part of the Beta Quadrant in STO. That's been the case since launch when they transwarped into the Beta Quadrant started assimilating rocks and trees. (I forget if we ever learned the story behind them assimilating non-organic or non-sentient matter.)
At no point was anything in STO supposed to be in the Delta Quadrant until we arrived at the Solonae Dyson Sphere. The Borg front was always supposed to be a front in a part of the Beta Quadrant where the Borg transwarped in and the Undine also invaded, non-adjacent to any Borg controlled systems. That's why there's a Federation starbase in Infected.
Lol , Why Is Only CardassiaN Space in the alpha quadrant . And why are the romulans , klingons and Starfleet in the beta quadrant ,
Because that's how the official Star Trek maps are.
There is Federation space there. Bajor. Trill. Betazed. Earth is located close to the border.
The Klingon and Romulan presence in the beta quadrant is minimal but they are there just outside the map we have. Romulans (used to?) control some systems just north of the map we have. (And Garth of Izar's homeworld is north of Breen space.)
Klingons control some regions to the south.
The Klingons, Romulans, and Federation are much more Beta Quadrant based though. That's been the case since prior to Enterprise when CBS approved maps. And there are periodic references prior to that on the shows, establishing that most of TNG takes place in the Beta Quadrant. (Heck, a bit "east" of the current map is Veridian III.
I'm really excited about this change. I share some of the same concerns about Cestus, Nimbus, and Mutara, but otherwise it looks great. (Although I would love to see Bolarus in the game.)
I did notice one typo on the new map: the Minos Korva system in the Minos Korva sector is misspelled as "Minas Korva" on the map. I'm not on Tribble so I can't verify whether the misspelling is also apparent in the actual player-traversable map, but it at least is in the galaxy map you bring up by pressing "M".
Again, Sol, (and all it's friends) have BEEN in the Beta Quadrant for the entire existence of Star Trek Online. We have not moved them in any significant way. The Sirius Sector Block has simply dissolved, and left the Vulcan/Orion/Risa Sectors where they have always lived in game.
Maybe that way for STO but it wasn't that way on the shows/movies TBH.
_____
Lifetime no longer gives a forum title. That should be updated on the Lifetime page that mentions what you get. PMing the CSR doesn't work neither.
Yes, it was like that in the shows... but thanks to stellar drift, Sol is over the edge of the two quadrants and in Beta now
And STO is 40+ years after the shows, so of course things have changed a little
One 40 years in the amount of time it would take to rotate around the fully is one flaw there to move so much that you change quadrants.
Oh and quadrants imaginary lines stay in the same position while the galaxy rotates. Weird.
Edit: and looking at some maps, the Delta is touching Beta. So why was all the Voyager dialogue about getting to the Alpha quadrant when Beta was right next to their current quadrant location? They wanted to get back to Quark's for a game of Dabo that bad?
_____
Lifetime no longer gives a forum title. That should be updated on the Lifetime page that mentions what you get. PMing the CSR doesn't work neither.
and i personally think that they just call themselves the "Alpha Quadrant powers". its technically not the "Alpha" Quadrant, but no one questions it. Kinda like how the Dallas Cowboys have never once had a stadium that was actually in Dallas, with the old Texas Stadium being in Irving and the current AT&T Stadium being in Arlington
there are other examples of this but i couldn't think of them
I mean....who wants to be a Beta Quadrant power? sounds kinda second best
Edit: and looking at some maps, the Delta is touching Beta. So why was all the Voyager dialogue about getting to the Alpha quadrant when Beta was right next to their current quadrant location? They wanted to get back to Quark's for a game of Dabo that bad?
The production staff brought this up themselves, they only referred to the Alpha Quadrant in both DS9 and Voyager so as not to confuse the average viewer from week to week. Though there was mention of the Beta Quadrant border in "Renaissance Man".
Maybe that way for STO but it wasn't that way on the shows/movies TBH.
Actually in Star Trek Into Darkness it confirms outright that Qu'Nos is in the Beta Quadrant (or "Kronos" as the people of Earth liked to spell it at that time, because Federation/Klingon relationships weren't at the point where correcting spelling mistakes were all that important, but this "error" is consistent with the original movies where the error had yet to be corrected as well).
Definitely no ambiguity that the Klingons are in the Beta Quadrant. I believe this also indirectly confirms the Romulans are there as well given the position of their border. Most people take it as being like "the West" in real life, which includes places like Australia, even though they aren't really anywhere near the geographical western hemisphere (or it is, but almost coming in from the other side it is that far east).
Also in the later episodes of Voyager they mention they are about to enter the Beta Quadrant before they get sent back to Earth, so that's definitely consistent there as well (although somebody really needs to remind the devs that the Delta Quadrant map is on a different scale from the Alpha/Beta map).
Actually in Star Trek Into Darkness it confirms outright that Qu'Nos is in the Beta Quadrant (or "Kronos" as the people of Earth liked to spell it at that time, because Federation/Klingon relationships weren't at the point where correcting spelling mistakes were all that important, but this "error" is consistent with the original movies where the error had yet to be corrected as well).
Definitely no ambiguity that the Klingons are in the Beta Quadrant. I believe this also indirectly confirms the Romulans are there as well given the position of their border. Most people take it as being like "the West" in real life, which includes places like Australia, even though they aren't really anywhere near the geographical western hemisphere (or it is, but almost coming in from the other side it is that far east).
Also in the later episodes of Voyager they mention they are about to enter the Beta Quadrant before they get sent back to Earth, so that's definitely consistent there as well (although somebody really needs to remind the devs that the Delta Quadrant map is on a different scale from the Alpha/Beta map).
Alpha, Beta, Gamma, Delta.... Omega. We all know where those words come from and what they represent, correct? So it would seem these breaking down the galaxy into four parts has an origins with the Federation and more directly Earth. So those four parts are made up and the people who did it said, "Hey, we'll put ourselves in the second one before we really know what lies in the first one over there." That's very interesting.
And now we are using JJ-verse source is very sad too. I know it's what's in the movies but those are not the best written things out there. j/s Plus who knows what the differences are in the JJ-verse and the Prime verse. There could be different boundary lines there.
The whole quadrant thing has been nothing but a mess since it was brought into Trek. It has changed over time from one episode to the next. But if the quadrant system has the origins in the Federation, it would be natural for them to put themselves in the first quadrant. And the founding worlds of that would be Earth, Vulcan, Andoria, and the Tellarite homeworld. Or was it already made and then they said to use the Greek alphabet. Sort of like a dialogue when landing on New Romulus with a KDF character and D'Tan says "or New Romulus in your language" makes me think he needs to learn Klingon because English is not the native tongue off Klingons. But it's just my pet peeve that things in the lore seems so centered as having an Earthly influence but things right next to the context seem to try not to have it. But I'll leave that lore bit here. There are bugs to report in this new system like not able to see the ship flying in space now and getting stuck at Betazed because noticed it was able to be clicked to visit, etc.
_____
Lifetime no longer gives a forum title. That should be updated on the Lifetime page that mentions what you get. PMing the CSR doesn't work neither.
Very good and detailed work guys! I think it s one of the best improvements you ve made in the game so far. It looks very impressive! Cant wait to fly around!
And now we are using JJ-verse source is very sad too.
We don't need to use the JJ-verse movies (which, I agree, are best ignored), Qo'nos is definitively located in the Beta Quadrant in The Undiscovered Country. That's where the Excelsior was when it felt the impact of the destruction of Praxis.
Of course the Quadrant system doesn't make any sense, and it's origin in canon was a pointless throwaway comment that should have been retconned away but was hardened instead. What can you do?
I personally love the new map, but I wish the devs had felt more liberty to ignore the Star Charts where they make no sense, like the position of Nimbus. Of course, the one star system they refuse to move is Vega, which is one of the few real stars on the map. I agree with a previous poster there, go back and rename the system the Borg attack. Call it Vayga, if you want. Everyone wins.
Trouble is, scriptwriters seem to like the name Vega, so there are loads of canon systems referred to as that - they can't all be the real star Vega. (And as Realmalize points out on his maps website ( https://malsmaps.wordpress.com/real-sector-maps-for-star-trek/ ) probably none of them are, because the real Vega is a very hot star probably not much good for human-habitable planets. He offers the neat rationalisation that probably people publicising new colonies or refineries like the name Vega as much as scriptwriters do, so several people have named their places "Vega" whether they are or not.)
As for why the Federation called the quadrant they were in the Beta Quadrant rather than the Alpha Quadrant, that does kind of make sense - the quadrant system was obviously invented by Earth, since Sol marks the dividing line between Alpha and Beta. So Sol isn't in either quadrant, and presumably they just arbitrarily called the one on the left of their maps Alpha and the one on the right Beta, without asking anyone else. Of such random line-drawing is geography made.
Anyway, arguments over how they drew the map aside, I really like this update, it's more than worth the hassle that's evidently gone into it! The alteration to Tour the Galaxy is a nice touch - I mena, who cares about sectors? They're just lines on a map. "Visit as many planets as you can" is somehow much more satifying.
We don't need to use the JJ-verse movies (which, I agree, are best ignored), Qo'nos is definitively located in the Beta Quadrant in The Undiscovered Country. That's where the Excelsior was when it felt the impact of the destruction of Praxis.
Of course the Quadrant system doesn't make any sense, and it's origin in canon was a pointless throwaway comment that should have been retconned away but was hardened instead. What can you do?
I personally love the new map, but I wish the devs had felt more liberty to ignore the Star Charts where they make no sense, like the position of Nimbus. Of course, the one star system they refuse to move is Vega, which is one of the few real stars on the map. I agree with a previous poster there, go back and rename the system the Borg attack. Call it Vayga, if you want. Everyone wins.
Funny you mentioned where Nimbus was. I had noticed that after posting last in the thread and I scratched my head on that. I know I have blocked a lot of Star Trek V out of my memory on purpose but I could have sworn it should be located more where Fed, Klingons, and Romulans had in common border. Not so deep in Romulan space. I was telling a friend I thought that was odd but he blocked out more of Star Trek V than even I did. lol
Plus isn't that going to be an odd flight path for new characters? Go all the way up there for Nimbus episodes from what happens just before it and where you go just after no matter what faction you play?
_____
Lifetime no longer gives a forum title. That should be updated on the Lifetime page that mentions what you get. PMing the CSR doesn't work neither.
Alpha, Beta, Gamma, Delta.... Omega. We all know where those words come from and what they represent, correct? So it would seem these breaking down the galaxy into four parts has an origins with the Federation and more directly Earth. So those four parts are made up and the people who did it said, "Hey, we'll put ourselves in the second one before we really know what lies in the first one over there." That's very interesting.
And now we are using JJ-verse source is very sad too. I know it's what's in the movies but those are not the best written things out there. j/s Plus who knows what the differences are in the JJ-verse and the Prime verse. There could be different boundary lines there.
The whole quadrant thing has been nothing but a mess since it was brought into Trek. It has changed over time from one episode to the next. But if the quadrant system has the origins in the Federation, it would be natural for them to put themselves in the first quadrant. And the founding worlds of that would be Earth, Vulcan, Andoria, and the Tellarite homeworld. Or was it already made and then they said to use the Greek alphabet. Sort of like a dialogue when landing on New Romulus with a KDF character and D'Tan says "or New Romulus in your language" makes me think he needs to learn Klingon because English is not the native tongue off Klingons. But it's just my pet peeve that things in the lore seems so centered as having an Earthly influence but things right next to the context seem to try not to have it. But I'll leave that lore bit here. There are bugs to report in this new system like not able to see the ship flying in space now and getting stuck at Betazed because noticed it was able to be clicked to visit, etc.
They may very well have visited the Alpha Quadrant first, the explanation given by places like the Star Charts is that Earth was chosen as the dividing line, with "west" being the Alpha Quadrant, and "east" being the Beta Quadrant. Why they picked them the way they did is unknown. Given what the Vulcans were like in the late 21st and early 22nd centuries it seems sensible that Earth would have headed towards the Alpha Quadrant first (because the Vulcans weren't keen on humans heading into the paths of the Klingons or Andorians who are both in the Beta Quadrant in this system).
Of course it may have been an older Vulcan tradition than Earth took on itself and redefined with themselves as the basis. The order is rather curious, but given the Federation were technically (thanks to Q) in the Delta Quadrant before the Gamma Quadrant suggests this may have been some pre-defined convention rather than anything to do with the order they were visited in.
As for language, I suspect this is the old "universal translator" playing havoc with us as "viewers", translating to us completely differently from what's actually happening (like the mysterious absence of Picard's French accent).
Funny you mentioned where Nimbus was. I had noticed that after posting last in the thread and I scratched my head on that. I know I have blocked a lot of Star Trek V out of my memory on purpose but I could have sworn it should be located more where Fed, Klingons, and Romulans had in common border. Not so deep in Romulan space. I was telling a friend I thought that was odd but he blocked out more of Star Trek V than even I did. lol
Plus isn't that going to be an odd flight path for new characters? Go all the way up there for Nimbus episodes from what happens just before it and where you go just after no matter what faction you play?
We were discussing this over on reddit as well. Funnily enough, even though it would make more sense in-universe to put a joint venture like this at the convergence of the 3 empires, the Star Charts location makes more sense with the events of the film, such as the time it took for a Klingon Bird of Prey to get there was at least several hours more than it took the Enterprise to get there from Earth. Plus it makes sense for it to be more toward the galactic core, given the short time it took to get there (though I think it really wasn't the core, just somewhere that direction).
You're right, it is a bit of a drive from Temporal Ambassador up to Nimbus. But I'm actually ok with that. I think traveling the universe should be a big part of this game. For one, the more time you spend out in sector space, the more you might see and be tempted to play Foundry missions from the Top 3 system
I think the devs have done a really good job. Nothing about maps and distances and locations in Star Trek is consistent. They drew from many sources, by the way, not just Star Charts. They looked at Stellar Cartography maps, Memory Alpha, screencaps of maps from the show, and altered or made up what they had to to make it all fit.
Comments
I apologize if this has been asked elsewhere. In the current sector system, we get a voiceover from Spock, Sela, or Seven of Nine whenever we enter a new sector for the first time. What's going to happen to that?
I'm also curious how diplomatic restrictions are going to work. In the current system, a Fed can't enter Omega Leonis, or KDF enter Sirius Sector, unless they have a buff or sufficient Diplomacy/Marauding rep.
In answer to your question, they apparently plan on keeping them.
I have not seen any major bugs relating to the new Sector Space on the test server as of yet.
Thank you Cryptic you made it!
Looking forward to more changes like real 360 degree space flight
or fully visit able and interact able ship interiors to increase the immersion in play experience.
Has anyone actually triggered the voiceovers with a new toon on Tribble since the revamp?
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-)
Proudly F2P. Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
Gameplay always comes before Accuracy, Also very few people will even notice it is not in the right place.
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
Personally, can't wait for it
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
That's not Borg space. The Borg have conquered part of the Beta Quadrant in STO. That's been the case since launch when they transwarped into the Beta Quadrant started assimilating rocks and trees. (I forget if we ever learned the story behind them assimilating non-organic or non-sentient matter.)
At no point was anything in STO supposed to be in the Delta Quadrant until we arrived at the Solonae Dyson Sphere. The Borg front was always supposed to be a front in a part of the Beta Quadrant where the Borg transwarped in and the Undine also invaded, non-adjacent to any Borg controlled systems. That's why there's a Federation starbase in Infected.
Because that's how the official Star Trek maps are.
There is Federation space there. Bajor. Trill. Betazed. Earth is located close to the border.
The Klingon and Romulan presence in the beta quadrant is minimal but they are there just outside the map we have. Romulans (used to?) control some systems just north of the map we have. (And Garth of Izar's homeworld is north of Breen space.)
Klingons control some regions to the south.
The Klingons, Romulans, and Federation are much more Beta Quadrant based though. That's been the case since prior to Enterprise when CBS approved maps. And there are periodic references prior to that on the shows, establishing that most of TNG takes place in the Beta Quadrant. (Heck, a bit "east" of the current map is Veridian III.
I did notice one typo on the new map: the Minos Korva system in the Minos Korva sector is misspelled as "Minas Korva" on the map. I'm not on Tribble so I can't verify whether the misspelling is also apparent in the actual player-traversable map, but it at least is in the galaxy map you bring up by pressing "M".
http://i.imgur.com/vybMkh6.jpg
Maybe that way for STO but it wasn't that way on the shows/movies TBH.
Lifetime no longer gives a forum title. That should be updated on the Lifetime page that mentions what you get. PMing the CSR doesn't work neither.
because the star charts said so. also the game has always been this way.
And STO is 40+ years after the shows, so of course things have changed a little
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
One 40 years in the amount of time it would take to rotate around the fully is one flaw there to move so much that you change quadrants.
Oh and quadrants imaginary lines stay in the same position while the galaxy rotates. Weird.
Edit: and looking at some maps, the Delta is touching Beta. So why was all the Voyager dialogue about getting to the Alpha quadrant when Beta was right next to their current quadrant location? They wanted to get back to Quark's for a game of Dabo that bad?
Lifetime no longer gives a forum title. That should be updated on the Lifetime page that mentions what you get. PMing the CSR doesn't work neither.
example
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8570/16492677187_7e0b7cfa0f_h.jpg
also, thinking ahead here......>.>
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8683/16698911302_7bd8a04244_o.jpg
and i personally think that they just call themselves the "Alpha Quadrant powers". its technically not the "Alpha" Quadrant, but no one questions it. Kinda like how the Dallas Cowboys have never once had a stadium that was actually in Dallas, with the old Texas Stadium being in Irving and the current AT&T Stadium being in Arlington
there are other examples of this but i couldn't think of them
I mean....who wants to be a Beta Quadrant power? sounds kinda second best
The production staff brought this up themselves, they only referred to the Alpha Quadrant in both DS9 and Voyager so as not to confuse the average viewer from week to week. Though there was mention of the Beta Quadrant border in "Renaissance Man".
Commanding Officer: Captain Pyotr Ramonovich Amosov
Dedication Plaque: "Nil Intentatum Reliquit"
Actually in Star Trek Into Darkness it confirms outright that Qu'Nos is in the Beta Quadrant (or "Kronos" as the people of Earth liked to spell it at that time, because Federation/Klingon relationships weren't at the point where correcting spelling mistakes were all that important, but this "error" is consistent with the original movies where the error had yet to be corrected as well).
Definitely no ambiguity that the Klingons are in the Beta Quadrant. I believe this also indirectly confirms the Romulans are there as well given the position of their border. Most people take it as being like "the West" in real life, which includes places like Australia, even though they aren't really anywhere near the geographical western hemisphere (or it is, but almost coming in from the other side it is that far east).
Also in the later episodes of Voyager they mention they are about to enter the Beta Quadrant before they get sent back to Earth, so that's definitely consistent there as well (although somebody really needs to remind the devs that the Delta Quadrant map is on a different scale from the Alpha/Beta map).
Alpha, Beta, Gamma, Delta.... Omega. We all know where those words come from and what they represent, correct? So it would seem these breaking down the galaxy into four parts has an origins with the Federation and more directly Earth. So those four parts are made up and the people who did it said, "Hey, we'll put ourselves in the second one before we really know what lies in the first one over there." That's very interesting.
And now we are using JJ-verse source is very sad too. I know it's what's in the movies but those are not the best written things out there. j/s Plus who knows what the differences are in the JJ-verse and the Prime verse. There could be different boundary lines there.
The whole quadrant thing has been nothing but a mess since it was brought into Trek. It has changed over time from one episode to the next. But if the quadrant system has the origins in the Federation, it would be natural for them to put themselves in the first quadrant. And the founding worlds of that would be Earth, Vulcan, Andoria, and the Tellarite homeworld. Or was it already made and then they said to use the Greek alphabet. Sort of like a dialogue when landing on New Romulus with a KDF character and D'Tan says "or New Romulus in your language" makes me think he needs to learn Klingon because English is not the native tongue off Klingons. But it's just my pet peeve that things in the lore seems so centered as having an Earthly influence but things right next to the context seem to try not to have it. But I'll leave that lore bit here. There are bugs to report in this new system like not able to see the ship flying in space now and getting stuck at Betazed because noticed it was able to be clicked to visit, etc.
Lifetime no longer gives a forum title. That should be updated on the Lifetime page that mentions what you get. PMing the CSR doesn't work neither.
We don't need to use the JJ-verse movies (which, I agree, are best ignored), Qo'nos is definitively located in the Beta Quadrant in The Undiscovered Country. That's where the Excelsior was when it felt the impact of the destruction of Praxis.
Of course the Quadrant system doesn't make any sense, and it's origin in canon was a pointless throwaway comment that should have been retconned away but was hardened instead. What can you do?
I personally love the new map, but I wish the devs had felt more liberty to ignore the Star Charts where they make no sense, like the position of Nimbus. Of course, the one star system they refuse to move is Vega, which is one of the few real stars on the map. I agree with a previous poster there, go back and rename the system the Borg attack. Call it Vayga, if you want. Everyone wins.
As for why the Federation called the quadrant they were in the Beta Quadrant rather than the Alpha Quadrant, that does kind of make sense - the quadrant system was obviously invented by Earth, since Sol marks the dividing line between Alpha and Beta. So Sol isn't in either quadrant, and presumably they just arbitrarily called the one on the left of their maps Alpha and the one on the right Beta, without asking anyone else. Of such random line-drawing is geography made.
Anyway, arguments over how they drew the map aside, I really like this update, it's more than worth the hassle that's evidently gone into it! The alteration to Tour the Galaxy is a nice touch - I mena, who cares about sectors? They're just lines on a map. "Visit as many planets as you can" is somehow much more satifying.
Funny you mentioned where Nimbus was. I had noticed that after posting last in the thread and I scratched my head on that. I know I have blocked a lot of Star Trek V out of my memory on purpose but I could have sworn it should be located more where Fed, Klingons, and Romulans had in common border. Not so deep in Romulan space. I was telling a friend I thought that was odd but he blocked out more of Star Trek V than even I did. lol
Plus isn't that going to be an odd flight path for new characters? Go all the way up there for Nimbus episodes from what happens just before it and where you go just after no matter what faction you play?
Lifetime no longer gives a forum title. That should be updated on the Lifetime page that mentions what you get. PMing the CSR doesn't work neither.
They may very well have visited the Alpha Quadrant first, the explanation given by places like the Star Charts is that Earth was chosen as the dividing line, with "west" being the Alpha Quadrant, and "east" being the Beta Quadrant. Why they picked them the way they did is unknown. Given what the Vulcans were like in the late 21st and early 22nd centuries it seems sensible that Earth would have headed towards the Alpha Quadrant first (because the Vulcans weren't keen on humans heading into the paths of the Klingons or Andorians who are both in the Beta Quadrant in this system).
Of course it may have been an older Vulcan tradition than Earth took on itself and redefined with themselves as the basis. The order is rather curious, but given the Federation were technically (thanks to Q) in the Delta Quadrant before the Gamma Quadrant suggests this may have been some pre-defined convention rather than anything to do with the order they were visited in.
As for language, I suspect this is the old "universal translator" playing havoc with us as "viewers", translating to us completely differently from what's actually happening (like the mysterious absence of Picard's French accent).
We were discussing this over on reddit as well. Funnily enough, even though it would make more sense in-universe to put a joint venture like this at the convergence of the 3 empires, the Star Charts location makes more sense with the events of the film, such as the time it took for a Klingon Bird of Prey to get there was at least several hours more than it took the Enterprise to get there from Earth. Plus it makes sense for it to be more toward the galactic core, given the short time it took to get there (though I think it really wasn't the core, just somewhere that direction).
You're right, it is a bit of a drive from Temporal Ambassador up to Nimbus. But I'm actually ok with that. I think traveling the universe should be a big part of this game. For one, the more time you spend out in sector space, the more you might see and be tempted to play Foundry missions from the Top 3 system
I think the devs have done a really good job. Nothing about maps and distances and locations in Star Trek is consistent. They drew from many sources, by the way, not just Star Charts. They looked at Stellar Cartography maps, Memory Alpha, screencaps of maps from the show, and altered or made up what they had to to make it all fit.