Do you not understand the difference between a player playing a character and an NPC that doesn't have enough sense to fly away from an explosion, won't redistribute shields, can't change out bridge officers for different powers, ect. ect. ect?
Enemy NPCs are allowed large hull numbers far greater then our ships. Our hanger pets are dumber then many NPC enemies. whats wrong with our friegit type hanger pets having a little extra hull then our carriers, especially when we can get the right consoles for our own ships to have more then 100k hull? Without Janoval Hardpoints...
If players can find ways to reach and pass 100k hull, why should our freiget hanger pets not be allowed 80k hull? They cant do what we do to begin with.
I understand your concerns about pet survivability, but slapping extra hull on pets is the wrong way of doing it. It's as dumb/lame/lazy as the current design of Advanced/Elite NPC ships. But just because that design decision was stupid, it doesn't mean we need to carry it out to other things.
I understand your concerns about pet survivability, but slapping extra hull on pets is the wrong way of doing it. It's as dumb/lame/lazy as the current design of Advanced/Elite NPC ships. But just because that design decision was stupid, it doesn't mean we need to carry it out to other things.
Perhaps, but it already exist now. Slapping a nerf on it now, and isolating it to only player hanger pets, will be just as stupid, if not dumber.
It has to do with the OPs thread starting post and how badly cryptic handles "bugs and exploits," often times not fixing actual bugs, and nerfing things that don't need to be altered. Sometimes those alterations are actually moves to highlight something else in a later patch. In this matter of the Hanger pets that don't need messing with, it could be for the epic pets that are coming later.
First, they lie to us and claim the pets are not working right. Then they nerf them. then they role out epic quality hanger pets that do the same thing the pre-nerf pets used to do.
i think you have a very valid point there as said in my post - pay to get back to what you used to be able to do they scale up the damage so you have to pay to scale up your dps.
as for them fixing things ..hive has been broke for at least 2 years ..lol
This is just disgusting really, you take one step to appeasing the community (justified) anger and then you go and take 20 steps back with what is almost certainly going to be paving the way to release epic quality pets and have them far superior to anything else.
I know it's all about the metrics with you people, but you might want to check that you are actually looking at STO's metrics and not some other game.
Alot of people are taking to their escape pods and jumping ship (before you nerf them to release epic quality escape pods)
I'm so glad that pets supposedly being to good is being addressed in such a timely manner, my tray resetting every time i transition from ground to space is a low priority issue that clearly isn't game breaking, pets come first. Don't think I have forgotten about my broken fleet mark consultants either.
Thanks for the update, but it was nice having pets that could survive a Warp Core Explosion. It was nice having pets be able to fend of mobs in MI so I could close rifts relatively easy too. Oh Well. They nerf it so be it just another aspect to add to the tedium known as Dilithium rising.
Cryptic is simply blatantly refusing to fix its problems. Been that way, pretty much since retail launch really.
Perhaps it is high time we did jump ship, no matter how much loyalty we have to the StarTrek Franchise. In fact, if you do have that kind of loyalty, you should jump ship from STO on the bases that cryptic is both ruining the game and abusing your interest in StarTrek.
Perhaps we should start recommend better games to each other as an open rebellion against cryptic and its years of failure to address real problems and abuse our love of Star Trek, treating us like crack addicts.
Just another Nerf in a long line of nerfs lately that only is being done to make the current intel bling ships seem better than what they really are. This is just going to continue, my "Elite" Scorpion pets have been worthless since DR launched, only pets that have been worth anything have been the frigate types like the Jem Bug ship pets and the Aquatic and Tholian counter parts, now lets get rid of them being useful at all as well.
Cryptic, all your doing is driving your long standing players away, ive been here since launch, and it seems you really no longer care about the players that have put the time and effort into this game. All you do seem to care about is squeezing your new players for anything you can get before they see that you don't really give a TRIBBLE about them either.
Enjoy the game while it lasts folks, cause this isn't ending well.
This could be a great opportunity to rebalance some of the existing pets. Geko, it would be wonderful if the team could take a little bit of time to try and even out the playing field with certain pets. Elite Federation Shuttles, Caitian Stalkers, and certain other pets are rarely if ever used. I fly:
Elite Jem'Hadar Attack Ships / Recluse ships
Elite Scorpions or Swarmers
Elite Yellowstones (rarely)
If I were a Romulan player I would make use of the Drone ships.
There are many near options remaining that just don't deliver near the level of effectiveness of other pets. The remaining fighters of all types provide a notably lacking element compared to the above ships.
I fly carriers extensively and take great joy in using the pets. I can understand the need to keep pet damage in line with other game elements. My hope is to see pet damage scale more with player gear to provide a somewhat smoother curve for pet effectiveness. That said, in altering the ships please keep in mind that fighters and frigates generally lack the survivability of player starships and even with NPC scaling they are still frequently replenished even on normal difficulty.
Well guys, i know it's frustrating, but more than 10-15k dps immortal pets had to be something wrong in the code... just saying
I simply don't buy this. My xindi carrier does less dps than all my other ships and her pets die frequently - especially to those vardwar jellyfish mines or whatever they are. My vesta pets die constantly.
Again - is this the most pressing issue in the game? Or is it the dead and rotting advanced queues?
If it's timed for an epic pet release this will actually benefit me personally as I can't acquire the 200,000 fleet credits for level 3 pets on this character. I would happily pay 200,000 dil for level 3 pets. But that's not the issue. The issue is fiddling while the game burns.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Do you not understand the difference between a player playing a character and an NPC that doesn't have enough sense to fly away from an explosion, won't redistribute shields, can't change out bridge officers for different powers, ect. ect. ect?
I agree with you on all counts except the BOFF powers switchout. I think the lack of BOFF powers, at least on the frigate pets are the problem. Can't switch out what you don't have. Besides, IMHO they should receive optimal powers by default(at least the elite frigates)
Well, I don't know.
I launch my oddy saucer or my scorpion fighters and within seconds they are all dead.
Then I have to wait ages for them to respawn (if possible at all -> *cough* bugged odyssey chevron separation).
What is this nerf supposed to do now?
Destroy my saucer while still being docked?
We will be making some changes to Carrier Pets (e.g. Peregrine Fighters, To'Duj Fighter, Klingon Bird of Prey Pets, etc.), separation pets (like a Galaxy separated saucer, MVAM Pets, and TalKyr Support craft, etc.), as well as similarly related pets (like the Odyssey Work Bees, consumable device Scorpion Fighters, Gorn Healing Platform Drones, etc.). All these items are leveless items and all these pets were using incorrect data that was causing their HP, shields, damage and healing to be too high. In some cases, the sum of the players pets were far outperforming the players ship itself. The HP, shields, damage, healing and related values for these pets are all being reduced to scale more consistently with other player gear.
Pets that are not affected are those that deal damage based on the player, instead of independent data. Changing these pets would have no affect since they are already using player data (e.g. Andorian Wing Cannons, Avenger VATA torpedo, Bio-neural Warhead, etc.).
This change only affects pets, and not the playable versions of any of these ships (e.g. the playable Jem Hadar Attack Ship and Danube Runabout are not affected).
Here is a complete list of all pets that are affected. If a pet is missed, it is probably a mistake. Please let us know, and we will look into it.
Well, I don't know.
I launch my oddy saucer or my scorpion fighters and within seconds they are all dead.
Then I have to wait ages for them to respawn (if possible at all -> *cough* bugged odyssey chevron separation).
What is this nerf supposed to do now?
Destroy my saucer while still being docked?
I don't know about oddy saucer it only had around 50k hull when seperated but the dread saucer on the other hand had 104k hull lol. But hey it is okay that the npc's have 300k or more hull so where is the problem?
Good to hear some passing confirmation that we're getting that Sar Theln for Christmas...and when my elite drones are parsing 7k EACH, instead of 3.5k, you know there's a problem.
That said, I think everyone would greatly appreciate a hangar pet buff--especially for non-Scimitard carriers, because those are serious weaksauce for all but the most experienced and dedicated pilots.
I simply don't buy this. My xindi carrier does less dps than all my other ships and her pets die frequently - especially to those vardwar jellyfish mines or whatever they are. My vesta pets die constantly.
Again - is this the most pressing issue in the game? Or is it the dead and rotting advanced queues?
Idk you guys why you didnt notice that, but, for example, my elite tholian mesh weavers in a random isa did more than the better faw3 in the team, almost 16k, and only one died in 5min... definitely something wrong.
And i see xindi pets and obelisk ones do similar results... and it's like more than the average player dps out there.
Btw, dont misunderstand me, i dont like that change as well, but if they are gaining these "buffs" from a code bug, the fix is right.
If it's timed for an epic pet release this will actually benefit me personally as I can't acquire the 200,000 fleet credits for level 3 pets on this character. I would happily pay 200,000 dil for level 3 pets. But that's not the issue. The issue is fiddling while the game burns.
This would be a "coherent" step after the nerf :P, releasing elite pets for t5 fleet facilities or the possibility to upgrade the existing ones :P
It's good that we were warned ahead of time. Of course, the reason it's good is that we get to, for once, point out how terrible an idea this is BEFORE it actually makes it live.
And terrible it is.
Now, I have a pretty good idea as to whom those being outperformed by carrier pets are. Many of us do. After all, *we've seen the livestream on twitch*. But you can't dumb things down to the lowest common devominator.
DR has been nothing but gigantic HP sponges. HP sponges and timers. Changing the focus away from DPS INDEED.
How exactly are NPC AI ships supposed to deal with NPC AI ships that are functionally identical but have ten times or more the health? A Scorpion fighter (aka 'wet tissue paper) cannot survive the, for example, mirror vessels, all of whom were ALREADY 1-2 shotting them with their universal point defense consoles or whatever it is they've got that acts like that.
Meanwhile, Science is still stuck with limits from back when you didn't want them to accidentally harm a sphere, Torpedoes are still stuck with half the DPS of energy weapons AND THEN get slashed to 1/8th by their shields (whom atop quartering have twice the resist against kinetic as they do energy), shields that no longer go down. Scrambling sensors hasn't worked at all in weeks, Mac users still can't play, the power tray still tosses things off randomly after the problem was supposedly repaired, and new players are getting permanently stuck in the academy (and don't return after they exit) after their first mission or two because you can't be bothered to let them beam out after the XP nerf makes the mission that would take them away fail to appear.
When people's pets being *almost, but not quite worthless enough* is your big important focus to work on, you might have a tiny problem with priorities.
Well guys, i know it's frustrating, but more than 10-15k dps immortal pets had to be something wrong in the code... just saying
really ive never logged up any 15k carrier pets average is 2k dps i did see one register 6k dps in a infected but that was just 1 player and couldnt replicate it with same pets so unless someone is exploiting a loophole then i dont see what the fuss is about ive not seen any awesome pets solo a cube or something.
there is a saying "A fool and his money are easily parted" , when the balance between a gamer having fun and paying for bits here and there the dev making a steady income , i even became a monthly gold player and bought inbetween if i wanted to try to get something from the evil boxes or get a ship , now seriously considering to cancel said membership and pug it for a bit.
the more time goes on and the nerf here and there and putting players who have paid for "some"
lobi gear and fleet stuff to go from moderate player to pug in one swift patch, i begin to think why am i paying for this ..
If i stop enjoying a game i stop playing - as i have done with previous games and left all the money I put into it and walked away as not prepared to pay any more when i see it as a developer greed fest and not a new challenge.
incorrect data that was causing their HP, shields, damage and healing to be too high.
:eek: Wha??? HP/shields too high? You nutz? Especially on fighters who pop when you look at them? Does anyone use peregrines? They die before they even do anything. Now I might agree that some pets are OP vs other pets, but not EVERY pet is OP. I know my Tholian frigates survive well, but my Romulan Drone frigates are always dying.
Pets doing more damage than the player ship.
That's the POINT of a carrier. :rolleyes:
:mad: Four of my toons use pets: Tholian carrier, JHDC, Scimitar and Oddy. Thanks for giving me another reason to head back to WoW when it's new expansion drops this month. I should finish the Mirror Invasion and get my 50k Dil and shotgun right before 11/13.
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10k DPS form pets now days isn't amazing like it would have been pre-DR.
I understand your concerns about pet survivability, but slapping extra hull on pets is the wrong way of doing it. It's as dumb/lame/lazy as the current design of Advanced/Elite NPC ships. But just because that design decision was stupid, it doesn't mean we need to carry it out to other things.
STO Screenshot Archive
Perhaps, but it already exist now. Slapping a nerf on it now, and isolating it to only player hanger pets, will be just as stupid, if not dumber.
i think you have a very valid point there as said in my post - pay to get back to what you used to be able to do they scale up the damage so you have to pay to scale up your dps.
as for them fixing things ..hive has been broke for at least 2 years ..lol
I know it's all about the metrics with you people, but you might want to check that you are actually looking at STO's metrics and not some other game.
Alot of people are taking to their escape pods and jumping ship (before you nerf them to release epic quality escape pods)
Please Cryptic,
Get yer self together mon!
Perhaps it is high time we did jump ship, no matter how much loyalty we have to the StarTrek Franchise. In fact, if you do have that kind of loyalty, you should jump ship from STO on the bases that cryptic is both ruining the game and abusing your interest in StarTrek.
On that note, HERE! Have a Link to Star Citizen!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pF6UL8G54LE
https://robertsspaceindustries.com/about-the-game
Perhaps we should start recommend better games to each other as an open rebellion against cryptic and its years of failure to address real problems and abuse our love of Star Trek, treating us like crack addicts.
Cryptic, all your doing is driving your long standing players away, ive been here since launch, and it seems you really no longer care about the players that have put the time and effort into this game. All you do seem to care about is squeezing your new players for anything you can get before they see that you don't really give a TRIBBLE about them either.
Enjoy the game while it lasts folks, cause this isn't ending well.
Elite Jem'Hadar Attack Ships / Recluse ships
Elite Scorpions or Swarmers
Elite Yellowstones (rarely)
If I were a Romulan player I would make use of the Drone ships.
There are many near options remaining that just don't deliver near the level of effectiveness of other pets. The remaining fighters of all types provide a notably lacking element compared to the above ships.
I fly carriers extensively and take great joy in using the pets. I can understand the need to keep pet damage in line with other game elements. My hope is to see pet damage scale more with player gear to provide a somewhat smoother curve for pet effectiveness. That said, in altering the ships please keep in mind that fighters and frigates generally lack the survivability of player starships and even with NPC scaling they are still frequently replenished even on normal difficulty.
I simply don't buy this. My xindi carrier does less dps than all my other ships and her pets die frequently - especially to those vardwar jellyfish mines or whatever they are. My vesta pets die constantly.
Again - is this the most pressing issue in the game? Or is it the dead and rotting advanced queues?
If it's timed for an epic pet release this will actually benefit me personally as I can't acquire the 200,000 fleet credits for level 3 pets on this character. I would happily pay 200,000 dil for level 3 pets. But that's not the issue. The issue is fiddling while the game burns.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
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Well, I don't know.
I launch my oddy saucer or my scorpion fighters and within seconds they are all dead.
Then I have to wait ages for them to respawn (if possible at all -> *cough* bugged odyssey chevron separation).
What is this nerf supposed to do now?
Destroy my saucer while still being docked?
Indeed, they were worth something, pre DR, but now you have all this wonderful DR content to play, so why do you need anything pre DR?
Wow. You people really are colossal morons. So many pressing issues right now and you walk in here and blabber about pets. PETS!
The useless part of a carrier!
What the fck.
I don't know about oddy saucer it only had around 50k hull when seperated but the dread saucer on the other hand had 104k hull lol. But hey it is okay that the npc's have 300k or more hull so where is the problem?
That said, I think everyone would greatly appreciate a hangar pet buff--especially for non-Scimitard carriers, because those are serious weaksauce for all but the most experienced and dedicated pilots.
Idk you guys why you didnt notice that, but, for example, my elite tholian mesh weavers in a random isa did more than the better faw3 in the team, almost 16k, and only one died in 5min... definitely something wrong.
And i see xindi pets and obelisk ones do similar results... and it's like more than the average player dps out there.
Btw, dont misunderstand me, i dont like that change as well, but if they are gaining these "buffs" from a code bug, the fix is right.
This would be a "coherent" step after the nerf :P, releasing elite pets for t5 fleet facilities or the possibility to upgrade the existing ones :P
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*rests head on desk*
Just read what he said, I really don't want to start ranting about this, not so soon after the last fiasco.
really ive never logged up any 15k carrier pets average is 2k dps i did see one register 6k dps in a infected but that was just 1 player and couldnt replicate it with same pets so unless someone is exploiting a loophole then i dont see what the fuss is about ive not seen any awesome pets solo a cube or something.
there is a saying "A fool and his money are easily parted" , when the balance between a gamer having fun and paying for bits here and there the dev making a steady income , i even became a monthly gold player and bought inbetween if i wanted to try to get something from the evil boxes or get a ship , now seriously considering to cancel said membership and pug it for a bit.
the more time goes on and the nerf here and there and putting players who have paid for "some"
lobi gear and fleet stuff to go from moderate player to pug in one swift patch, i begin to think why am i paying for this ..
If i stop enjoying a game i stop playing - as i have done with previous games and left all the money I put into it and walked away as not prepared to pay any more when i see it as a developer greed fest and not a new challenge.
PWE luv u long time.
:eek: Wha??? HP/shields too high? You nutz? Especially on fighters who pop when you look at them? Does anyone use peregrines? They die before they even do anything. Now I might agree that some pets are OP vs other pets, but not EVERY pet is OP. I know my Tholian frigates survive well, but my Romulan Drone frigates are always dying.
That's the POINT of a carrier. :rolleyes:
:mad: Four of my toons use pets: Tholian carrier, JHDC, Scimitar and Oddy. Thanks for giving me another reason to head back to WoW when it's new expansion drops this month. I should finish the Mirror Invasion and get my 50k Dil and shotgun right before 11/13.