People were screaming for "Nightmare" mode on the Borg STF's - now they got it!
wrong. People wanted a HARDER MODE. That is what the new tier (elite) is supposed to be. The tier of difficulty UNDER that is advanced. NO ONE in their right mind wanted the middle difficulty to be this ridiculous.
It it completly fine to have the elite ques be facepalm hard but to have the middle ones this ridiculous makes gearing up and even griding R&D mats next to impossible. It makes ZERO sense.
You don't know what you are talking about. RodentMaster does.
Better players than you have already beaten the new stuff on FT5/Lockbox T5s equipped with Mk XII gear.
Better players than you are already able to put out the DPS amounts required by new stuff, far more than what is strictly definable as Elite level players.
Better players actually did some sort of forward planning and realised this content was intended for level 60s with Mk XIV gear, max reps, max specialisation points, max crafting, not for old stuff.
See you would be totally right if we were talking about the HARDEST difficulty in the game but we ARENT. How hard it is for you (and others) to understand that making advanced (which is supposed to be the 2nd hardest tier of pve ques) this hard makes NO SENSE? We are not saying we dont want a super hard difficultly, we are saying we dont want the tier below that to be super hard. Do you have any idea how quickly the R&D mat (at a time when we need them the most for upgrades) prices are going to skyrocket?!?
Again this really isnt hard to understand. The hardest tier in the game should be SUPER HARD. That is where all the "elite" and "hardcore" gamers can go. The tier below that should not require the best players and gear in the game. It really is that simple.
Edit: The only other solution is to have normal ques give out advanced R&D packs as rewards.
See you would be totally right if we were talking about the HARDEST difficulty in the game but we ARENT. How hard it is for you (and others) to understand that making advanced (which is supposed to be the 2nd hardest tier of pve ques) this hard makes NO SENSE? We are not saying we dont want a super hard difficultly, we are saying we dont want the tier below that to be super hard. Do you have any idea how quickly the R&D mat (at a time when we need them the most for upgrades) prices are going to skyrocket?!?
Again this really isnt hard to understand. The hardest tier in the game should be SUPER HARD. That is where all the "elite" and "hardcore" gamers can go. The tier below that should not require the best players and gear in the game. It really is that simple.
Edit: The only other solution is to have normal ques give out advanced R&D packs as rewards.
What part of T5s on Mk XII gear being able to do ASTFs and ESTFs do you not get? You don't need a T6 or crafted gear, just a brain and piloting skills. Granted, T6 Mk XIV Epic will help, but it isn't needed.
About the only thing you have got right is VR material drops (and the Rep special drops for that matter) should be dropped guaranteed 1, chance at extra for Normals.
Given this is an ST game, Normal queues dropping these items is deity-disapproved of essential.
I won ISA yesterday with 3 different chars with T5U level 0 ships and at level 50.
I never wrote advanced can't be won.
The question was if T6 together with XIV gold will compensate the massive scale up in HP, shieldHP, resistence, shield resistence, hullregeneration and shieldgeneration cryptic build in if the player has the same skill.
And i said that it does not. Not is a very friendly word there. Even if we speak about 50% more damage with XIV gold and T6 on the one hand we speak about 500% more HP combined with the other points on the other.
God lord, I have flown my sci CC and survival Vesta with full XII purple gear, my sci BoP with full XII purple and my rom sci dyson destroyer with full XII purple gear.
Read, think, write. Allways the best way before attacking someone.
No, the content is still easy. If anything, it needs more buffs.
T6 should not be enough to make the average player good enough to do ESTFs - The entire point was to bring the content up to match where the players are at already, so Elite content is actually what is says on the tin.
Not to create just another ROFL stomp series - there is masses of power creep available already, enough that to actually make it difficult would require another 5 times as much HP.
The very fact level 40 T5s on Mk XII gear can still do ESTFs is a sign Cryptic haven't gone far enough.
Here's a good one, Infected space advanced. Took forever to get past the first encounter since I was saving my damage goodies for when the clock started for the most part. Once we move on to the first set of generators, I don't bother diving in, and instead keep cautioning people not to blow up generators yet because the spheres will take forever to kill. I see one guy hammering away at a generator specifically, not just catching it as collateral damage. I call him out specifically, by name, and tell him to stop. He doesn't, blows the thing before the cube is even dead.
So, I fly off to the gate, and set about wrangling up nanite spheres. I actually keep it up for a good while, dragging them a good distance from the gate. But then the rest of the team decides to abandon the transformer and start shooting the nanite spheres I've worked to keep away from them so they could kill the transformer. They end up blowing up a nanite sphere, and so a new one spawns in, headed for the transformer. Thankfully, it had no damage on it at the time, and it just flies toward it and orbits around. At this point, a dude leaves. I make my way through the gate spheres and the transformer spheres that my team pulled over to me and start lining myself up to drag the nanite sphere away from the transformer without accidentally TBRing the transformer (and thus causing the nanite sphere to use the repair beam and autofail the mission).
But at this point, someone had showed up replacing the guy who bailed. And I learned just what his story was as he came swooping past on my left side, cancelling full impulse with the fire button, as his scimitar flies right in, FAWing away. He immediately did damage to the transformer (even if the generators would autorepair it anyway), the nanite sphere hit it with the repair beam, and the mission failed. The guy literally charged in and failed the mission immediately for us in all of ten seconds of being there.
cbrjwrr: I think you're misunderstanding my posts. I think you're taking the wrong conclussions from them.
I think resumod, tyrannyfighter22, and myself are all on the same page.
Tucana66 just seems to be pushing his own agenda which equates to "L2P, newb!" and making excuses for something every level headed objective observer would note is inexcusable.
T6 Intel Cruiser / LVL 54 / Maco Deflector / Dyson Resilient Shield / Dyson Warp Core / All Fluidic Beam arrays MK /crystalline entity Advanced / used to own that thing and could take it down in 5-8 min (depending on Allies) now I cant even complete it. They really need to do something about this.
We've been telling you people to upgrade your ships and stop saying "muh playstyle" as a deflection from the need to start dealing actual damage in STO. The entire game revolves around damage. If you can't deal damage, you'll have damage dealt to you instead - which is why you're all being wrecked by NPCs with 400% more HP.
Okay, Technically this is not advanced stf. This was a Klingon Fleet alert vs Fed ships.
Just upped my Adapted Destroyer to T5U, and popped a graviton emitter in my new science slot just to have it filled. Pretty much all fleet advanced dual disruptors. have the cutting beam and borg torpedo. (technically the fulle borg set everything.)
My destroyer was our smallest ship. Normally for a Fleet Alert I pop a GW and spam beams and torps, our combined fire power swats first in, then we clean up flankers. Etc.
This time, GW and beam spam. Shikars ignore my weapons. As I am now dueling with a Centaur I check his stats. 110K hp. Not sure how good his shields were but it took us till time limit to clear the second wave. This is not even advanced. What happened?
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
It's possible to get 15k+ DPS with a T5 free ship and MkXI blue gear.
Not exactly "super hardcore " gamer mode.
Especially if you have MkXII gear and rep equipment with a Fleet Ship.
Actually the Fleet Galaxy is capable of 20k+ DPS and it's one of the worst ships in game.
But thats if you WANT to do hyper DPS. Not everyone should HAVE to do that kind of playstyle. I want a ship that can do ISA without the crutch of FAW, CSV, Spread, a super-partigen GW, or the overprice TBR doff. Something other than damage. I don't want to participate in the DPS race, no matter how stupidly easy that race may be. Thats the problem, not that it can't be done, but that we shouldn't have to.
Besides if you're running an organized team of dedicated DPSers, y'all should probably have been in Elite anyways. You're the people they made that mode for after all.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
But thats if you WANT to do hyper DPS. Not everyone should HAVE to do that kind of playstyle. I want a ship that can do ISA without the crutch of FAW, CSV, Spread, a super-partigen GW, or the overprice TBR doff. Something other than damage. I don't want to participate in the DPS race, no matter how stupidly easy that race may be. Thats the problem, not that it can't be done, but that we shouldn't have to.
Besides if you're running an organized team of dedicated DPSers, y'all should probably have been in Elite anyways. You're the people they made that mode for after all.
So stick to normal mode and stay out of Advanced/Elite difficulty. If normal mode gets nerfed even more, then it'll be paradise for you. Your mindset is incompatible with MMO gameplay - I'm not sure why you're even playing lol
Your entire argument is "I don't want to improve myself! Why should I do that? It's too easy to be better!"
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
The old adage "If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all"? Applies here, too, when you're dealing with other posters.
I don't expect warm and fuzzy, but barely polite would be a pleasant change. Please don't respond to troll or flame posts.
My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
I'm sorry some people are upset that 5k (or less) DPS ships aren't good enough for Advanced or Elite queues, but there's a pretty simple solution for that: stay out of those queues. If your ship isn't good enough to complete them at the new difficulty (bugs not withstanding) then you should change what you're doing. Whining about how hard it is doesn't do any good when it really doesn't take a lot of effort to understand the basics of good ship design and layout if you just pay attention. Nobody's telling you that you need to go out and set DPS records, however I don't think it's too much to ask that people actually try.
I'm sorry some people are upset that 5k (or less) DPS ships aren't good enough for Advanced or Elite queues, but there's a pretty simple solution for that: stay out of those queues. If your ship isn't good enough to complete them at the new difficulty (bugs not withstanding) then you should change what you're doing. Whining about how hard it is doesn't do any good when it really doesn't take a lot of effort to understand the basics of good ship design and layout if you just pay attention. Nobody's telling you that you need to go out and set DPS records, however I don't think it's too much to ask that people actually try.
It's amazing when 2 totally different people think so much alike!
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Ok lets not turn this thread into a flame fest or Bluegeek will be by. oricolawle - post a build which will easily take us all up to 30k DPS - I am all for reading it. Other than that everyone, please don't criticize other players play styles on a back and forth. We know that the game is a smash your spacebar DPS race, however, many of us were hoping to have better AI. In addition the Advanced seems to be way too high right now - that's supposed to still be pugable. Forget talking about "elite lvl 60" as that should be organized group only.
Lets still hear your stories - remember the ones where others totally f-up the mission are the most interesting!:eek::P
Thx.
Edit: Snap - ninja'd by Bluegeek as I was typing this post!
The problem with "troll" posts is that the word is so vague that it means "I've been disagreed with! I'm being trolled!"
"Do you propose only that all players fly the same build or must they fly the same ship as well? All must be Tac I assume at the very least?"
There's a set of design rules that most high-end ships incorporate, which is focusing on what actually deals damage: energy weapons. I don't care what your ship uses to achieve the mission, but it better be putting out at least 12k DPS or I'm going to end up carrying you through the STF/fleet action/etc. It's unacceptable for you to build ships that other people have to support. Pull your own weight. It's not hard.
It's amazing when 2 totally different people think so much alike!
I'm feeling trolled by this post, that it seems to insinuate that oricolawle and I are the same person when we are not. Feel free to have a mod compare our IP's.
Flaming and/or Trolling
You may not post content which contains insults to other users or Perfect World Entertainment Staff, are specifically made to create undue discontent on the forums, disturbances in forum threads, pick fights or otherwise promote unfriendly conversation.
Enough already.
My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
I'm feeling trolled by this post, that it seems to insinuate that oricolawle and I are the same person when we are not. Feel free to have a mod compare our IP's.
LOL.
For your other identity - yes my tac ships can handle that dps level. My science and engineering I doubt make it there. I guess I'll delete those What ship do you recommend? Scimitar?
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
So apparently it's not trolling when it's against people with low post counts. Ok sure, that's fair. Guess that'll teach me to actually voice my opinion, especially when it goes against someone else's "playstyle".
@Spacebaronline: I don't play the Master Race in my futile protest against how easy it is to use, so the Scimitar wouldn't be something I could help with. I only make Starfleet builds. Klingons aren't interesting to me and the Master Race is a joke.
Comments
How's the T6 Mat'Ha working out?
I reckon I'll wait until the inevitable nerfs.
wrong. People wanted a HARDER MODE. That is what the new tier (elite) is supposed to be. The tier of difficulty UNDER that is advanced. NO ONE in their right mind wanted the middle difficulty to be this ridiculous.
It it completly fine to have the elite ques be facepalm hard but to have the middle ones this ridiculous makes gearing up and even griding R&D mats next to impossible. It makes ZERO sense.
See you would be totally right if we were talking about the HARDEST difficulty in the game but we ARENT. How hard it is for you (and others) to understand that making advanced (which is supposed to be the 2nd hardest tier of pve ques) this hard makes NO SENSE? We are not saying we dont want a super hard difficultly, we are saying we dont want the tier below that to be super hard. Do you have any idea how quickly the R&D mat (at a time when we need them the most for upgrades) prices are going to skyrocket?!?
Again this really isnt hard to understand. The hardest tier in the game should be SUPER HARD. That is where all the "elite" and "hardcore" gamers can go. The tier below that should not require the best players and gear in the game. It really is that simple.
Edit: The only other solution is to have normal ques give out advanced R&D packs as rewards.
What part of T5s on Mk XII gear being able to do ASTFs and ESTFs do you not get? You don't need a T6 or crafted gear, just a brain and piloting skills. Granted, T6 Mk XIV Epic will help, but it isn't needed.
About the only thing you have got right is VR material drops (and the Rep special drops for that matter) should be dropped guaranteed 1, chance at extra for Normals.
Given this is an ST game, Normal queues dropping these items is deity-disapproved of essential.
No, the content is still easy. If anything, it needs more buffs.
T6 should not be enough to make the average player good enough to do ESTFs - The entire point was to bring the content up to match where the players are at already, so Elite content is actually what is says on the tin.
Not to create just another ROFL stomp series - there is masses of power creep available already, enough that to actually make it difficult would require another 5 times as much HP.
The very fact level 40 T5s on Mk XII gear can still do ESTFs is a sign Cryptic haven't gone far enough.
So, I fly off to the gate, and set about wrangling up nanite spheres. I actually keep it up for a good while, dragging them a good distance from the gate. But then the rest of the team decides to abandon the transformer and start shooting the nanite spheres I've worked to keep away from them so they could kill the transformer. They end up blowing up a nanite sphere, and so a new one spawns in, headed for the transformer. Thankfully, it had no damage on it at the time, and it just flies toward it and orbits around. At this point, a dude leaves. I make my way through the gate spheres and the transformer spheres that my team pulled over to me and start lining myself up to drag the nanite sphere away from the transformer without accidentally TBRing the transformer (and thus causing the nanite sphere to use the repair beam and autofail the mission).
But at this point, someone had showed up replacing the guy who bailed. And I learned just what his story was as he came swooping past on my left side, cancelling full impulse with the fire button, as his scimitar flies right in, FAWing away. He immediately did damage to the transformer (even if the generators would autorepair it anyway), the nanite sphere hit it with the repair beam, and the mission failed. The guy literally charged in and failed the mission immediately for us in all of ten seconds of being there.
I think resumod, tyrannyfighter22, and myself are all on the same page.
Tucana66 just seems to be pushing his own agenda which equates to "L2P, newb!" and making excuses for something every level headed objective observer would note is inexcusable.
We've been telling you people to upgrade your ships and stop saying "muh playstyle" as a deflection from the need to start dealing actual damage in STO. The entire game revolves around damage. If you can't deal damage, you'll have damage dealt to you instead - which is why you're all being wrecked by NPCs with 400% more HP.
Get on my level. ISA is easy.
Leader of Quantum Mechanics
Member of DPS-30000
Just upped my Adapted Destroyer to T5U, and popped a graviton emitter in my new science slot just to have it filled. Pretty much all fleet advanced dual disruptors. have the cutting beam and borg torpedo. (technically the fulle borg set everything.)
My destroyer was our smallest ship. Normally for a Fleet Alert I pop a GW and spam beams and torps, our combined fire power swats first in, then we clean up flankers. Etc.
This time, GW and beam spam. Shikars ignore my weapons. As I am now dueling with a Centaur I check his stats. 110K hp. Not sure how good his shields were but it took us till time limit to clear the second wave. This is not even advanced. What happened?
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
Leader of Quantum Mechanics
Member of DPS-30000
But thats if you WANT to do hyper DPS. Not everyone should HAVE to do that kind of playstyle. I want a ship that can do ISA without the crutch of FAW, CSV, Spread, a super-partigen GW, or the overprice TBR doff. Something other than damage. I don't want to participate in the DPS race, no matter how stupidly easy that race may be. Thats the problem, not that it can't be done, but that we shouldn't have to.
Besides if you're running an organized team of dedicated DPSers, y'all should probably have been in Elite anyways. You're the people they made that mode for after all.
all flying the exact same ship as well?
http://www.theitbaby.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/jackass-Medium.jpg
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
So stick to normal mode and stay out of Advanced/Elite difficulty. If normal mode gets nerfed even more, then it'll be paradise for you. Your mindset is incompatible with MMO gameplay - I'm not sure why you're even playing lol
Your entire argument is "I don't want to improve myself! Why should I do that? It's too easy to be better!"
Leader of Quantum Mechanics
Member of DPS-30000
Because you have a very narrow definition of 'better' and are completely (intentionally?) missing the point.
Leader of Quantum Mechanics
Member of DPS-30000
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
The old adage "If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all"? Applies here, too, when you're dealing with other posters.
I don't expect warm and fuzzy, but barely polite would be a pleasant change. Please don't respond to troll or flame posts.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
Vice Admiral of - Starfleet Command -
It's amazing when 2 totally different people think so much alike!
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Lets still hear your stories - remember the ones where others totally f-up the mission are the most interesting!:eek::P
Thx.
Edit: Snap - ninja'd by Bluegeek as I was typing this post!
The problem with "troll" posts is that the word is so vague that it means "I've been disagreed with! I'm being trolled!"
"Do you propose only that all players fly the same build or must they fly the same ship as well? All must be Tac I assume at the very least?"
There's a set of design rules that most high-end ships incorporate, which is focusing on what actually deals damage: energy weapons. I don't care what your ship uses to achieve the mission, but it better be putting out at least 12k DPS or I'm going to end up carrying you through the STF/fleet action/etc. It's unacceptable for you to build ships that other people have to support. Pull your own weight. It's not hard.
@sparebaronline:
If you want a build, I need to know what ship you're using.
Leader of Quantum Mechanics
Member of DPS-30000
I'm feeling trolled by this post, that it seems to insinuate that oricolawle and I are the same person when we are not. Feel free to have a mod compare our IP's.
Vice Admiral of - Starfleet Command -
You may not post content which contains insults to other users or Perfect World Entertainment Staff, are specifically made to create undue discontent on the forums, disturbances in forum threads, pick fights or otherwise promote unfriendly conversation.
Enough already.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
LOL.
For your other identity - yes my tac ships can handle that dps level. My science and engineering I doubt make it there. I guess I'll delete those
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Well I fly so many. But I think the only ones I will upgrade right now is the Scimitar - A DPS favorite!!(for Tactical and Science toons)
Vice Admiral of - Starfleet Command -
Feel free to join if you'd like to participate.
@Spacebaronline: I don't play the Master Race in my futile protest against how easy it is to use, so the Scimitar wouldn't be something I could help with. I only make Starfleet builds. Klingons aren't interesting to me and the Master Race is a joke.
Leader of Quantum Mechanics
Member of DPS-30000