1. You should really consider adding 5/0 and 4/0 kits. I believe the current spire physicist kit is a 5/0 kit. And there are many existing 4/0 kits.
2. I feel that the new fleet kits on Tribble are too generic. The Mk XI and Mk XII fleet kits are all 3/2 kits with generic skill bonuses.
3. The fleet kits should come with the full set of abilities they do now. That may require making some of them into 4/1 or 5/0 kits.
4. Kits should come with skill bonuses that help with their specialization. For example, a 4-fabrication/1-mechanic kit should come with bonuses to generators and turrets and drones; a 4-mechanic/1-fabrication kit should come with bonuses to demolitions, repairs, and modification specialist. This applies to fleet kits as well as drops.
5. I think you should review the drop algorithm for kits. I fear that many kits will drop with skill bonuses for the wrong specialization. For example, if you have 4 mechanic slots, then a bonus to generators is not very useful. You should also review drop ratios for different specializations. Do 3/2 and 4/1 kits drop in equal proportion or is the distribution skewed toward 3/2 kits? The same question applies to 2/2 and 3/1 kits.
On a side note, (FED) BOffs can use kit costume pieces... (haven't tried on my KDF toons)
KDF Boffs can't (atleast, my Orion I looked at can't) but very much so should. It would be nice to have little cosmetic bits so my operative tac boff and my soldier tac boff don't look the same
While we're on the subject of BOFFs and costume bits, has there ever been a reason stated why Boffs can't use anything other than the Uniform category? I'd love to have boffs in helmet-less Omega attire, or my heavies in the Voth (again, helmet-less and customized) gear.
Really looking forward to testing this modular concept. My only regret is that we're still dealing with 'kits' and not modular tricorders - which would be more in keeping with the IP in my opinion.
I dont understand why the old kits dont just get in-place conversion. Inventory issue or something?
Alright, some kits shouldnt be automatically converted, things like the Borg Medic kits that dont drop anymore.
Can we get a console somewhere that converts an old kit into the new components? That would be the best way to handle things like old Fleet kits or VR Mk X kits.
Since the New kit options in the outfit selections seem to be part of this revamp. I figured I would set this here. I have noticed that while The Bridge officers can have on some of the Kit pieces. They can't have all of them. I think It would be beneficial if the bridge officers could equip all the kit pieces. That would prep them for the Captain look that should be coming when we get to command our own fleet. And besides, who limits equipment to just a captain? Don't all officers and soldiers get to use the same equipment?
We experimented with mono-specialization kits, but they didn't really offer interesting choices or builds, in my opinion. They kind of pushed people too far into a corner, gameplay wise, to feel really good to me.
I disagree with you, and I am inclined to believe you guys did it for balance reasons. Hence the emphasis in the above quote.
It's what min-maxers do: go far into a corner.
Because, admit it, a 5-slot Mechanical kit would be a little too powerful:
Full Shield Tanking and bombing capabilities? Yes please!
In my playstyle, I have no use for any Fabrication powers whatsoever. They are a nuisance, IMO, and also a danger (more chain targets to hit, fab explosions hitting owner, etc). I am still trying to figure which Fabricator power I'm going to use in my kit, and I can't see any reasonable choices. Maybe except for Force Field Dome, but I am still losing something else (better) for it.
Bottom line: mono-specialization kits can offer interesting choices for builds and can be good, if not too much.
Really looking forward to testing this modular concept. My only regret is that we're still dealing with 'kits' and not modular tricorders - which would be more in keeping with the IP in my opinion.
So just call it a tricorder instead. The costume pieces are off by default now, so you don't even have to look like you're wearing a kit. A lot of the kit powers use tricorders or tricorder-ish animations anyway.
For those of us who want to play with the new system, but don't want to leave all our existing kits behind, can we get a kit turn-in system, where we give our pre-revamp kits to a vendor and get an equivalent kit back? (Or a dilithium and fleet credit refund... I sunk a lot of resources into getting my plasma flamethrower turrets)
Full Shield Tanking and bombing capabilities? Yes please!
That setup would only be over the top due to the presence of Chroniton Mine Barrier. That ability is currently capable of dealing 2,200 damage instantly every 22 seconds in an area of effect with 50% shield bypass due to the removal of damage reduced by range. OUtside of that, the engineer would have no method for holding a target or healing health via kit abilities. A setup like that would make Quantum Mortar or Fuse Armor quite valuable. Many players would opt to drop Transphasic Bomb due to the long deployment time animation lock. You may also find Weapon Malfunction less effective with the proliferation of Quick Fix.
In my playstyle, I have no use for any Fabrication powers whatsoever. They are a nuisance, IMO, and also a danger (more chain targets to hit, fab explosions hitting owner, etc). I am still trying to figure which Fabricator power I'm going to use in my kit, and I can't see any reasonable choices. Maybe except for Force Field Dome, but I am still losing something else (better) for it.
I am of the opinion that fabrications would be more viable if they were to spawn and work around the engineer in a similar manner to Cruiser Comm Array Commands in space. I think Forcefield Dome would be much more interesting if the ability remained around the engineer and had a chance to reflect incoming damage back to players attacking targets inside of the Forcefield Dome while providing a moderate health damage resistance buff. Run would need to be naturally disabled, but it would greatly enhance the viability of the Forcefield Dome. Medical and Shield Generator could work like the Fermion Field Vesta console. Turrets and Mortars could work like a point defense system console. Such changes would greatly enhance the viability of fabrication abilities. The fabrication modules themselves could be shown as beamed in visuals on the engineer's character model. That said, Seeker Drone is a difficult call, it is quite redundant to Support Drone. The generator, mortar, and turrets would need a re-balance to compensate for their increased mobility.
I am of the opinion that fabrications would be more viable if they were to spawn and work around the engineer in a similar manner to Cruiser Comm Array Commands in space. I think Forcefield Dome would be much more interesting if the ability remained around the engineer and had a chance to reflect incoming damage back to players attacking targets inside of the Forcefield Dome while providing a moderate health damage resistance buff. Run would need to be naturally disabled, but it would greatly enhance the viability of the Forcefield Dome. Medical and Shield Generator could work like the Fermion Field Vesta console. Turrets and Mortars could work like a point defense system console. Such changes would greatly enhance the viability of fabrication abilities. The fabrication modules themselves could be shown as beamed in visuals on the engineer's character model. That said, Seeker Drone is a difficult call, it is quite redundant to Support Drone. The generator, mortar, and turrets would need a re-balance to compensate for their increased mobility.
Those ideas are very interesting. Force Field Dome tied to the engineer would be awesome. It has a precedent, even: the giant dinos in the Voth Battlezone with their pushy forcefields. And in City of Heroes (another Cryptic's game), they had Dispersion Bubble (defense buff to teammates around the caster) and Force Bubble (repel forcefield around caster). Force Field Dome currently provides a damage resistance which is rarely effective, but I imagine the push around mechanic would work very well, although potentially abusable.
But I'm not sure about the turrets tying to the character's model. It would be aesthetically awkward, especially the turrets. And the reduced mobility would make me prefer their current ground-placed behavior.
Those ideas are very interesting. Force Field Dome tied to the engineer would be awesome. It has a precedent, even: the giant dinos in the Voth Battlezone with their pushy forcefields. And in City of Heroes (another Cryptic's game), they had Dispersion Bubble (defense buff to teammates around the caster) and Force Bubble (repel forcefield around caster). Force Field Dome currently provides a damage resistance which is rarely effective, but I imagine the push around mechanic would work very well, although potentially abusable.
But I'm not sure about the turrets tying to the character's model. It would be aesthetically awkward, especially the turrets. And the reduced mobility would make me prefer their current ground-placed behavior.
The Elachi had their shield bubble drones and walking tanks/turrets as well.
I'm not really sold on the idea either though. Taking Forcefield with you just sounds a bit like Overwatch to me, and mobile turrets would make seeker and support drones a bit redundant.
That said, I would love to see slotable (variant) skills from alien factions in the future. (A Voth burst-fire Mortar, Elachi Stasis Projector, Thalaron Drones, Tholian Photon Mine, Breen Cryo-Grenades, etc.)
Those ideas are very interesting. Force Field Dome tied to the engineer would be awesome. It has a precedent, even: the giant dinos in the Voth Battlezone with their pushy forcefields. And in City of Heroes (another Cryptic's game), they had Dispersion Bubble (defense buff to teammates around the caster) and Force Bubble (repel forcefield around caster). Force Field Dome currently provides a damage resistance which is rarely effective, but I imagine the push around mechanic would work very well, although potentially abusable.
It would be an interesting mechanic to say the least. I agree, it could be abused in mobile form, which is why running would need to be disabled. Perhaps Immunity to Knockback could be added as well to compensate.
But I'm not sure about the turrets tying to the character's model. It would be aesthetically awkward, especially the turrets. And the reduced mobility would make me prefer their current ground-placed behavior.
I suspect my idea for Turrets and Mortars would be difficult to implement. It would require a model somewhat along the lines of the Flashlight device used in Federation Starbase Incursion and other dark missions. My idea for reduced mobility was directed at Forcefield Dome alone in order to prevent players running full out after getting Motion Accelerator from a Tactical ally in order to push players into a corner.
Currently, the Module slots pop out and become visible if a new kit is equipped. But the player can unequip the kit and no longer see the Module slots.
Instead, the Module slots should always be visible, except when an old kit is equipped. Equip an old kit and the Module slots retract and aren't visible anymore. This will also encourage use of the new system and prevent Modules being lost in those slots that can become invisible.
Please consider this slight change, Devs!
Lifetime Subscriber since October 31st, 2014
Star Trek Online Captain since September, 2012
I was out testing an engineering 3 fabrication/1 mechanic Mk X kit and I was looking at the modules. I had some questions about how the powers work.
1. What do different rarities do for modules? (i.e. what is the difference between a blue Mk X turret fabrication module and a green Mk X turret fabrication module)
2. What is the difference between different marks of modules? Obviously some are easy to spot like the drone fabrications which get different level drones/damage, but the combat supply fabrication, for instance, spawns a level 2 supply kit at Mk VIII and the same (at least in the tooltips) level 2 kit at Mk X. Is there supposed to be a difference?
On a positive note, the doff powers are working with the separate modules. My "chance to spawn 2 additional turrets/mortars" doffs were both able to proc and deploy 3 turrets and 3 mortars.
What about crafting, will we be able to make X or XI level kits and modules now, or later? Most of my characters just use the old style crafted kits as they cost basically 0 resources and were "good enough" for now as I need my resources for space gear (and will for some time to come). It was one of the very few useful crafted items at 50 ( melee weapons being the other useful crafted item).
What about crafting, will we be able to make X or XI level kits and modules now, or later? Most of my characters just use the old style crafted kits as they cost basically 0 resources and were "good enough" for now as I need my resources for space gear (and will for some time to come). It was one of the very few useful crafted items at 50 ( melee weapons being the other useful crafted item).
The MK X+ green modules provided in Drozana are worse than the MK X kits currently available. Since crafting currently allows creation of MK X purple kits, I'd say equivalent modules (I am guessing MK XII blues, because purples will be Fleet Holding level, or Tier IV as we know it) should be able to be crafted.
What will happen to the users that have fleet kits? Will we get the modules already attached to said kit?
Fleet kits already purchased won't be changed. You can equip it just like it is now but you won't be able to select modules for it so it's stuck with whatever it has already.
The Mark XII (and I think Mark XI as well, but could be mistaken as I'm writing from home) kits have five module slots. While before you had a 4 Research kit, you can now use a 4 Research, 1 Medic kit and gain an extra Medic power.
We experimented with mono-specialization kits, but they didn't really offer interesting choices or builds, in my opinion. They kind of pushed people too far into a corner, gameplay wise, to feel really good to me.
I disagree. I already feel pushed into a corner with kits now. The problem with forcing players to take 1 or more modules for a different specialization is that it would require you to spread skill points pretty thin to make it completely effective, or put skill points into 1 skill to boost what is most important of the kit without being able to boost everything.
Mono specialization would allow players to spend less points in ground skills, or put them into other needed skills that don't affect kit powers, without gimping things.
The problem with kits is that for your captain skills you put skill points into, 3 or more skills will boost the kit powers. If you put too many skill points into ground you'll be less effective in space.
For example: For the embassy Romulan Fire Team kit you have 4 ground abilities that boost the kit powers - Grenades, Special Forces, Squad Command, and Advanced Tactics. I was only able to squeeze points into Grenades (Plasma Grenade IV is the main reason I got the kit) and Squad Command. This means that Ambush and Suppressing Fire from the kit are not being boosted at all. Personally I would like to drop both Ambush and Suppressing fire and go with other kit abilities that are boosted by Grenades and/or Squad Command.
The problem with kits is that for your captain skills you put skill points into, 3 or more skills will boost the kit powers. If you put too many skill points into ground you'll be less effective in space.
This problem would be easily solved by allowing players to have 400,000 skill points rather than 366,000 skill points.
I disagree. I already feel pushed into a corner with kits now. The problem with forcing players to take 1 or more modules for a different specialization is that it would require you to spread skill points pretty thin to make it completely effective, or put skill points into 1 skill to boost what is most important of the kit without being able to boost everything.
Mono specialization would allow players to spend less points in ground skills, or put them into other needed skills that don't affect kit powers, without gimping things.
The problem with kits is that for your captain skills you put skill points into, 3 or more skills will boost the kit powers. If you put too many skill points into ground you'll be less effective in space.
The new kits give you some skill point bonuses to mitigate that, though.
Can't wait to fiddle around with this. The old kits were pretty much set in stone and weren't flexible. I'd love to switch some skills around to fit my play-style.
is there any possible way we could go to our fleet holding and do a trade-in of our old fleet kits? We would get the new kit with the set Mk IV ability and the other abilities returned to us as modules. I really don't want to have to buy a whole new fleet kit to get the abilities I want for it.
Definitely want this if old kits can't just be broken down into their parts when update hits holodeck.
Many FC and dil (money) has been paid to get them. Not cool having to basically airlock them. Being bound and useless for boffs, would make them redundant.
It is absolutely unacceptable to be adding additional bonuses to these kits and forcing us to make a second massive fleet purchase to replace them.
I demand, literally demand retroactivity on fleet kits. This is BS. Fleet kits are insanely expensive at mk xii and replacing them just because you want to make them both modular (as well as giving them additional bonuses, wtf?) as well as customizable is a direct insult to those of us that still spend money to support this game.
You make those fleet purchases I made this month retroactive and apply them to the 10 spire kits I just bought last week or you just closed my very deep wallet to your company. Most people are just now completing the spire and getting those kits, and only NOW do we learn those kits are not going to be grandfathered in? Thats utter horsecrap.
I would STRONGLY advise you add a function to the fleet store that allows us to trade in an existing fleet kit for the new modular variant of the same mark and type. You just completely screwed me over, and im not at all happy about this one.
Did you even consider the people that were buying the newest ones right now?
Do NOT expect me to pay more money or time to repurchase something I JUST bought. Not gonna happen.
Thats all.
Fleet Admiral Rylana - Fed Tac - U.S.S Wild Card - Tactical Miracle Worker Cruiser
Lifetime Subscriber since 2012 == 17,200 Accolades = RIP PvP and Vice Squad
Chief of Starfleet Intelligence Service == Praise Cheesus
Comments
2. I feel that the new fleet kits on Tribble are too generic. The Mk XI and Mk XII fleet kits are all 3/2 kits with generic skill bonuses.
3. The fleet kits should come with the full set of abilities they do now. That may require making some of them into 4/1 or 5/0 kits.
4. Kits should come with skill bonuses that help with their specialization. For example, a 4-fabrication/1-mechanic kit should come with bonuses to generators and turrets and drones; a 4-mechanic/1-fabrication kit should come with bonuses to demolitions, repairs, and modification specialist. This applies to fleet kits as well as drops.
5. I think you should review the drop algorithm for kits. I fear that many kits will drop with skill bonuses for the wrong specialization. For example, if you have 4 mechanic slots, then a bonus to generators is not very useful. You should also review drop ratios for different specializations. Do 3/2 and 4/1 kits drop in equal proportion or is the distribution skewed toward 3/2 kits? The same question applies to 2/2 and 3/1 kits.
Will be even better for Mk12 Kits, oh the possibilities!
KDF Boffs can't (atleast, my Orion I looked at can't) but very much so should. It would be nice to have little cosmetic bits so my operative tac boff and my soldier tac boff don't look the same
While we're on the subject of BOFFs and costume bits, has there ever been a reason stated why Boffs can't use anything other than the Uniform category? I'd love to have boffs in helmet-less Omega attire, or my heavies in the Voth (again, helmet-less and customized) gear.
Can we get a console somewhere that converts an old kit into the new components? That would be the best way to handle things like old Fleet kits or VR Mk X kits.
Totally agree! It never made sense to me that BOFF's could not have kits.
My only question right now is: why are you giving modules that cannot be equiped?
I disagree with you, and I am inclined to believe you guys did it for balance reasons. Hence the emphasis in the above quote.
It's what min-maxers do: go far into a corner.
Because, admit it, a 5-slot Mechanical kit would be a little too powerful:
- Weapons Malf
- Chroniton Barrier Mine
- Transphasic Bomb
- Shield Recharge
- Equip Diagnostics
Full Shield Tanking and bombing capabilities? Yes please!
In my playstyle, I have no use for any Fabrication powers whatsoever. They are a nuisance, IMO, and also a danger (more chain targets to hit, fab explosions hitting owner, etc). I am still trying to figure which Fabricator power I'm going to use in my kit, and I can't see any reasonable choices. Maybe except for Force Field Dome, but I am still losing something else (better) for it.
Bottom line: mono-specialization kits can offer interesting choices for builds and can be good, if not too much.
STO Screenshot Archive
So just call it a tricorder instead. The costume pieces are off by default now, so you don't even have to look like you're wearing a kit. A lot of the kit powers use tricorders or tricorder-ish animations anyway.
Raptr profile
I am of the opinion that fabrications would be more viable if they were to spawn and work around the engineer in a similar manner to Cruiser Comm Array Commands in space. I think Forcefield Dome would be much more interesting if the ability remained around the engineer and had a chance to reflect incoming damage back to players attacking targets inside of the Forcefield Dome while providing a moderate health damage resistance buff. Run would need to be naturally disabled, but it would greatly enhance the viability of the Forcefield Dome. Medical and Shield Generator could work like the Fermion Field Vesta console. Turrets and Mortars could work like a point defense system console. Such changes would greatly enhance the viability of fabrication abilities. The fabrication modules themselves could be shown as beamed in visuals on the engineer's character model. That said, Seeker Drone is a difficult call, it is quite redundant to Support Drone. The generator, mortar, and turrets would need a re-balance to compensate for their increased mobility.
I agree, there are many mono-specialized builds that would be viable and fun to use within the game.
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
Those ideas are very interesting. Force Field Dome tied to the engineer would be awesome. It has a precedent, even: the giant dinos in the Voth Battlezone with their pushy forcefields. And in City of Heroes (another Cryptic's game), they had Dispersion Bubble (defense buff to teammates around the caster) and Force Bubble (repel forcefield around caster). Force Field Dome currently provides a damage resistance which is rarely effective, but I imagine the push around mechanic would work very well, although potentially abusable.
But I'm not sure about the turrets tying to the character's model. It would be aesthetically awkward, especially the turrets. And the reduced mobility would make me prefer their current ground-placed behavior.
STO Screenshot Archive
The Elachi had their shield bubble drones and walking tanks/turrets as well.
I'm not really sold on the idea either though. Taking Forcefield with you just sounds a bit like Overwatch to me, and mobile turrets would make seeker and support drones a bit redundant.
That said, I would love to see slotable (variant) skills from alien factions in the future. (A Voth burst-fire Mortar, Elachi Stasis Projector, Thalaron Drones, Tholian Photon Mine, Breen Cryo-Grenades, etc.)
I think the kit visuals are rank limited, and your BOffs can only go up to Commander rank.
Raptr profile
I suspect my idea for Turrets and Mortars would be difficult to implement. It would require a model somewhat along the lines of the Flashlight device used in Federation Starbase Incursion and other dark missions. My idea for reduced mobility was directed at Forcefield Dome alone in order to prevent players running full out after getting Motion Accelerator from a Tactical ally in order to push players into a corner.
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
Currently, the Module slots pop out and become visible if a new kit is equipped. But the player can unequip the kit and no longer see the Module slots.
Instead, the Module slots should always be visible, except when an old kit is equipped. Equip an old kit and the Module slots retract and aren't visible anymore. This will also encourage use of the new system and prevent Modules being lost in those slots that can become invisible.
Please consider this slight change, Devs!
Star Trek Online Captain since September, 2012
1. What do different rarities do for modules? (i.e. what is the difference between a blue Mk X turret fabrication module and a green Mk X turret fabrication module)
2. What is the difference between different marks of modules? Obviously some are easy to spot like the drone fabrications which get different level drones/damage, but the combat supply fabrication, for instance, spawns a level 2 supply kit at Mk VIII and the same (at least in the tooltips) level 2 kit at Mk X. Is there supposed to be a difference?
On a positive note, the doff powers are working with the separate modules. My "chance to spawn 2 additional turrets/mortars" doffs were both able to proc and deploy 3 turrets and 3 mortars.
The MK X+ green modules provided in Drozana are worse than the MK X kits currently available. Since crafting currently allows creation of MK X purple kits, I'd say equivalent modules (I am guessing MK XII blues, because purples will be Fleet Holding level, or Tier IV as we know it) should be able to be crafted.
STO Screenshot Archive
Fleet kits already purchased won't be changed. You can equip it just like it is now but you won't be able to select modules for it so it's stuck with whatever it has already.
I disagree. I already feel pushed into a corner with kits now. The problem with forcing players to take 1 or more modules for a different specialization is that it would require you to spread skill points pretty thin to make it completely effective, or put skill points into 1 skill to boost what is most important of the kit without being able to boost everything.
Mono specialization would allow players to spend less points in ground skills, or put them into other needed skills that don't affect kit powers, without gimping things.
The problem with kits is that for your captain skills you put skill points into, 3 or more skills will boost the kit powers. If you put too many skill points into ground you'll be less effective in space.
For example: For the embassy Romulan Fire Team kit you have 4 ground abilities that boost the kit powers - Grenades, Special Forces, Squad Command, and Advanced Tactics. I was only able to squeeze points into Grenades (Plasma Grenade IV is the main reason I got the kit) and Squad Command. This means that Ambush and Suppressing Fire from the kit are not being boosted at all. Personally I would like to drop both Ambush and Suppressing fire and go with other kit abilities that are boosted by Grenades and/or Squad Command.
This problem would be easily solved by allowing players to have 400,000 skill points rather than 366,000 skill points.
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
Please tell me that MK X through MK XII purple frames and kit modules will be available without fleet membership.
And please explain the reasoning for not having frames in the Dilithium store and modules that are only Mk IX greens.
Definitely want this if old kits can't just be broken down into their parts when update hits holodeck.
Many FC and dil (money) has been paid to get them. Not cool having to basically airlock them. Being bound and useless for boffs, would make them redundant.
Oh come on!
I demand, literally demand retroactivity on fleet kits. This is BS. Fleet kits are insanely expensive at mk xii and replacing them just because you want to make them both modular (as well as giving them additional bonuses, wtf?) as well as customizable is a direct insult to those of us that still spend money to support this game.
You make those fleet purchases I made this month retroactive and apply them to the 10 spire kits I just bought last week or you just closed my very deep wallet to your company. Most people are just now completing the spire and getting those kits, and only NOW do we learn those kits are not going to be grandfathered in? Thats utter horsecrap.
I would STRONGLY advise you add a function to the fleet store that allows us to trade in an existing fleet kit for the new modular variant of the same mark and type. You just completely screwed me over, and im not at all happy about this one.
Did you even consider the people that were buying the newest ones right now?
Do NOT expect me to pay more money or time to repurchase something I JUST bought. Not gonna happen.
Thats all.
Fleet Admiral Rylana - Fed Tac - U.S.S Wild Card - Tactical Miracle Worker Cruiser
Lifetime Subscriber since 2012 == 17,200 Accolades = RIP PvP and Vice Squad
Chief of Starfleet Intelligence Service == Praise Cheesus