He's not a future Doctor, but a past one. He's the same Time Lord as the Doctor and the incarnation that ended the Time War. What he did to end that war was so horrific he forfeited the 'right' to call himself The Doctor, as we was NOT living up to that name. Instead he's kind of The Incarnation That Won't Be Named, existing between Doctor 8 and Doctor 9. (as near as I can tell anyways)
To be honest there shouldn't be another doctor at all, the Timelords had 12 lives/regenerations, lets just count that shall we.
1. William Hartnell
2. Patrick Troughton
3. John Pertwee
4. Tom Baker
5. Peter Davidson
6. Colin Baker
7. Sylvester McCoy
8. Paul McGann
9. Christopher Eccleston
10. David Tennant
11. David Tennant (how easy people forget that he regenerated after being shot by a Dalek in the street but transferred the physical change into his hand in a jar during the episodes 'The Stolen Earth / Journey's End')
12. Matt Smith
Now this takes up all his lives/regenerations itself, not including spin-offs such as the one with Peter Cushing as the doctor, but now John Hurt is announced as the true 9th incarnation of the Doctor moving Christopher Eccleston and those after him 1 down meaning Matt Smith is actually the 13th Doctor. So unless they write into the 50th anniversary about how this was possible and the Doctor renewing his regenerations somehow there will be no more Doctor Who unfortunately, i'm quite upset actually as i've been a fan since William Hartnell started it all off.
Don't worry about that. You can bet anything that they will come up with an excuse to go past the 12 incarnations, maybe even reboot them completely. As long as the character is popular, it will not disappear. Anything can be changed or retconned, and it probably will.
Thanks for reminding me about that River transferred her regen that is probably how they will be able to extend the doctor.
To be honest, I wish I didn't know that... I really liked River in her initial outing, but the way they retconned her to use her with the 11th Doctor... Ugh, I wish they'd left her stored in the library... Still, it's at least one way they may give the Doctor additional regenerations (assuming they even remember that there should be a limit to the amount of times he can regenerate )
To be honest, I wish I didn't know that... I really liked River in her initial outing, but the way they retconned her to use her with the 11th Doctor... Ugh, I wish they'd left her stored in the library... Still, it's at least one way they may give the Doctor additional regenerations (assuming they even remember that there should be a limit to the amount of times he can regenerate )
SPOILERS
(we probably should have posted that a while back)
Now then...you lost me there...how was River "retconned"? The only thing I didn't care for was that the latest episode appears to be a bow-out for River, where instead I thought they'd one day do the opera of which she spoke to the 10th Doctor.
_____
Also, I think they do remember there's a limitation, and they just made a whole episode to show us. There's a very large, very recognizable tomb on the fields of Tranzalore, and the TARDIS is very much opposed to going there.
_____
Regarding John Hurt as the Doctor: the TV footage so far obviously wants us to believe there is a missing record of a 9th Doctor between McGann and Eccleston, and it well may be.
Other theories I've heard pitched:
1) Hurt is playing the same incarnation that McGann played in the TV movie and in the audio books, just greatly aged, and with a revised look. Personal thought: that'd be a huge slap in the face to McGann and the fans who like him. Bad production of the TV movie was not his fault, and he should be offered the chance to play his character again, if it is needed.
2) Hurt is playing Doctor 8.5. Thought: there's some precedent for an 8.5. The Valeyard was a composite of the Doctor's dark side taken from between later incarnations. Also Incarnation #5 began to manifest itself (admittedly greatly altered) before #4 died. Additionally, fan works have suggested occasions where a Doctor might be pulled from the time stream mid-regeneration. It is possible that the writers were taken with this concept.
3) Hurt is playing the Valeyard. It is an interesting thought, and Valeyard is a part of the Doctor he'd like to forget. It may be possible that he was summoned to do what the Doctor could not. I've noticed some on the web already calling Hurt "the Dark Doctor". In counterpoint, the Valeyard was supposedly from between 12 and 13, making me wonder how #9 (Eccleston's Doctor) could have know, he, the Doctor was responsible, since #9 is not in the 50th.
4) Hurt is playing a future X.5 Doctor. See point #2 for precedents. Interesting, but currently there's nothing I've seen to suggest a future Doctor's involvement.
5) Hurt is playing a future full-incarnation Doctor. Again, interesting, but I'm inclined to disbelieve this due to the actor's age. Knowing that William Hartnell had to leave due to age health issues, I'm inclined to think the series would not gamble on a 73 year old man holding down 3 or more seasons. I suppose he could always attempt a single season, like Eccleston, but that's a waste of a good regeneration. In counterpoint, perhaps the events of the 50th anniversary will alter the Doctor's future, erasing Hurt's Doctor and giving the regeneration to another.
Don't worry about that. You can bet anything that they will come up with an excuse to go past the 12 incarnations, maybe even reboot them completely. As long as the character is popular, it will not disappear. Anything can be changed or retconned, and it probably will.
Most people believe that the Doctor was given all of River's remaining regenerations at the end of the Let's Kill Hitler episode - she poured all of her energy into him.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
Now then...you lost me there...how was River "retconned"? The only thing I didn't care for was that the latest episode appears to be a bow-out for River, where instead I thought they'd one day do the opera of which she spoke to the 10th Doctor.
When Steven Moffat was doing the Nerd HQ seminar at SDCC he said River has had encounters with other Doctors beyond 10 and 11, so it's not impossible for her to come back if the story needed it.
She might be back at some point with 12 but Ms. Kingston isn't getting any younger and unless there's a 50+ year-old as #12 I'm not sure people want to see her making out with more younger guys.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
When Steven Moffat was doing the Nerd HQ seminar at SDCC he said River has had encounters with other Doctors beyond 10 and 11, so it's not impossible for her to come back if the story needed it.
She might be back at some point with 12 but Ms. Kingston isn't getting any younger and unless there's a 50+ year-old as #12 I'm not sure people want to see her making out with more younger guys.
Regardless, you've got the problem of an 1100-year old alien making out with a 50-year old child. :P
They can always bring River back for special occasions the same way Jeff Bridges played youthful CLU again in the second Tron movie. For that matter, there are several Doctors...
Actually, I set the Wayback Machine and reviewed the Lets Kill Hitler episode. It was never stated as an absolute that River gave every last bit of regeneration. What was said came from Amy who stated that "apparently" River gave up all her regenerations. "Apparently" being the key word. Should clever River have retained one, then after Doctor 10 left the library, with a bit of writers' mumbo-jumbo, River could come back as someone else. What was in the machine was a backup, a copy of herself, as I understood from the episode.
She might be back at some point with 12 but Ms. Kingston isn't getting any younger and unless there's a 50+ year-old as #12 I'm not sure people want to see her making out with more younger guys.
When the Doctor first met River (and the last time she saw him), she did comment about how young he was looking...
I think the River story has run it's course. We have a new Doctor coming and I assume Steven will give us some new directions for him to go as well. I'm content to leave River in the novel-verse. Not that I didn't like her, but we've seen her first appearance, her goodbye/death, her second goodbye, and her third goodbye. That's enough.
As far as the Regenerations, whether she gave him 1, 5, or 9 doesn't really matter. It'll, hopefully, be several years before we need to worry about 13, 14, and 15 - and the continuity can be changed a dozen times by then. Heck, the Timelord will probably even be back by then.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
I'm not sure people want to see her making out with more younger guys.
What do you mean Younger guys, the Doctor is at least 1104 years old, that's one hell of an age gap and I don't know how old River Song is, but it's not that old
I am surprised David Tennant of all people didn't last longer in the role. Most of the new series doctors have given it up early for some reason. I am not sure who would make a good actor to portray what is arguably the doctor's last life.
We all assume they will continue the series after this doctor but I think that could be false. They might give it a rest and reboot and remake the series in a few years.
It really depends on what personality they want for the character this go around. Nutty? Serious and stern? Brooding and Angry? I am kind of tired of the youngish nuts in the role.
What do you mean Younger guys, the Doctor is at least 1104 years old, that's one hell of an age gap and I don't know how old River Song is, but it's not that old
I did say Ms. Kingston, as opposed to River. It doesn't matter how old the Doctor is. Matt's only 30.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
We all assume they will continue the series after this doctor but I think that could be false. They might give it a rest and reboot and remake the series in a few years.
It's very possible that Doctor Who could take a break after 12, but as of right now the show's running quite high in popularity, not only in the UK but around the world. Unless 12 screws up so badly to turn fans off, or something unforeseen happens at the BBC, the odds are quite good that Doctor Who will continue on for some time.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
So, if Matt Smith is the 11th, then there are two more left.
The regenerations were originally limited to 9. Then Tom Baker, as the Doctor, said it was 12 - meaning you could have 13 bodies. Russell also had the Doctor in SJA say it was 507, so who knows. The Doctor lies.
If you count David's second regeneration and John Hurt the current body would be the 13th. But, as I said above, River gave the Doctor her regenerations - some or all. So the Doctor would have up to 22 regenerations because River used 2.
Edit: And I would assume that River gave him all her regens, as the Doctor had to use some of his healing energy to heal River when she broke her wrist.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
I am surprised David Tennant of all people didn't last longer in the role. Most of the new series doctors have given it up early for some reason. I am not sure who would make a good actor to portray what is arguably the doctor's last life.
We all assume they will continue the series after this doctor but I think that could be false. They might give it a rest and reboot and remake the series in a few years.
It really depends on what personality they want for the character this go around. Nutty? Serious and stern? Brooding and Angry? I am kind of tired of the youngish nuts in the role.
and you still have a wildcard out there that opens up possibilities, ranging from recurring cameos to a full spinoff, all born from the question, "Where is Jenny/Ginny?"
I'd love it if they found a way to bring tennant on full time to be the doctor again, I know I shouldn't and it won't happen , but a guy can dream can't he lol.
Anyone ever wonder why they didn't try a spin off following Unit? Coulda had Martha n Micky in it. That woulda been cool . I know that's slightly off topic but it just popped in there haha
I'd love it if they found a way to bring tennant on full time to be the doctor again, I know I shouldn't and it won't happen , but a guy can dream can't he lol.
Anyone ever wonder why they didn't try a spin off following Unit? Coulda had Martha n Micky in it. That woulda been cool . I know that's slightly off topic but it just popped in there haha
Would be very easy to do... 11th Doctor transfers his regeneration energy to the Metacrisis Doctor, who then puts himself through the chameleon arch... Doctor restored :cool:
However... As much as I miss Tennant in the role, I don't necessarily think that a backwards step would be the best thing for the series, and would like to see a new Doctor, and less Moffatt influences...
Tennant was paid 600,000 pounds per season,. Smith was paid 200,000 - which is probably why Smith decided to leave once his 3 year contract was completed. He simply agreed to do the Anniversary episode and Christmas special for some additional pay.
They're not going to bring David back, as he still wants 600k+. They're going to pick another relative unknown so they can keep the salary down.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
Billy Murray, he could be a darker doctor, the Doctor needs to be intimidating and intelligent at the same time
"The meaning of victory is not to merely defeat your enemy but to destroy him, to completely eradicate him from living memory, to leave no remnant of his endeavours, to crush utterly his achievement and remove from all record his every trace of existence. From that defeat no enemy can ever recover. That is the meaning of victory."
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
Comments
This is what I'm hoping for myself
Don't worry about that. You can bet anything that they will come up with an excuse to go past the 12 incarnations, maybe even reboot them completely. As long as the character is popular, it will not disappear. Anything can be changed or retconned, and it probably will.
-- Smoov
Thanks for reminding me about that River transferred her regen that is probably how they will be able to extend the doctor.
To be honest, I wish I didn't know that... I really liked River in her initial outing, but the way they retconned her to use her with the 11th Doctor... Ugh, I wish they'd left her stored in the library... Still, it's at least one way they may give the Doctor additional regenerations (assuming they even remember that there should be a limit to the amount of times he can regenerate
SPOILERS
(we probably should have posted that a while back)
Now then...you lost me there...how was River "retconned"? The only thing I didn't care for was that the latest episode appears to be a bow-out for River, where instead I thought they'd one day do the opera of which she spoke to the 10th Doctor.
_____
Also, I think they do remember there's a limitation, and they just made a whole episode to show us. There's a very large, very recognizable tomb on the fields of Tranzalore, and the TARDIS is very much opposed to going there.
_____
Regarding John Hurt as the Doctor: the TV footage so far obviously wants us to believe there is a missing record of a 9th Doctor between McGann and Eccleston, and it well may be.
Other theories I've heard pitched:
1) Hurt is playing the same incarnation that McGann played in the TV movie and in the audio books, just greatly aged, and with a revised look. Personal thought: that'd be a huge slap in the face to McGann and the fans who like him. Bad production of the TV movie was not his fault, and he should be offered the chance to play his character again, if it is needed.
2) Hurt is playing Doctor 8.5. Thought: there's some precedent for an 8.5. The Valeyard was a composite of the Doctor's dark side taken from between later incarnations. Also Incarnation #5 began to manifest itself (admittedly greatly altered) before #4 died. Additionally, fan works have suggested occasions where a Doctor might be pulled from the time stream mid-regeneration. It is possible that the writers were taken with this concept.
3) Hurt is playing the Valeyard. It is an interesting thought, and Valeyard is a part of the Doctor he'd like to forget. It may be possible that he was summoned to do what the Doctor could not. I've noticed some on the web already calling Hurt "the Dark Doctor". In counterpoint, the Valeyard was supposedly from between 12 and 13, making me wonder how #9 (Eccleston's Doctor) could have know, he, the Doctor was responsible, since #9 is not in the 50th.
4) Hurt is playing a future X.5 Doctor. See point #2 for precedents. Interesting, but currently there's nothing I've seen to suggest a future Doctor's involvement.
5) Hurt is playing a future full-incarnation Doctor. Again, interesting, but I'm inclined to disbelieve this due to the actor's age. Knowing that William Hartnell had to leave due to age health issues, I'm inclined to think the series would not gamble on a 73 year old man holding down 3 or more seasons. I suppose he could always attempt a single season, like Eccleston, but that's a waste of a good regeneration. In counterpoint, perhaps the events of the 50th anniversary will alter the Doctor's future, erasing Hurt's Doctor and giving the regeneration to another.
She might be back at some point with 12 but Ms. Kingston isn't getting any younger and unless there's a 50+ year-old as #12 I'm not sure people want to see her making out with more younger guys.
Regardless, you've got the problem of an 1100-year old alien making out with a 50-year old child. :P
They can always bring River back for special occasions the same way Jeff Bridges played youthful CLU again in the second Tron movie. For that matter, there are several Doctors...
Actually, I set the Wayback Machine and reviewed the Lets Kill Hitler episode. It was never stated as an absolute that River gave every last bit of regeneration. What was said came from Amy who stated that "apparently" River gave up all her regenerations. "Apparently" being the key word. Should clever River have retained one, then after Doctor 10 left the library, with a bit of writers' mumbo-jumbo, River could come back as someone else. What was in the machine was a backup, a copy of herself, as I understood from the episode.
As far as the Regenerations, whether she gave him 1, 5, or 9 doesn't really matter. It'll, hopefully, be several years before we need to worry about 13, 14, and 15 - and the continuity can be changed a dozen times by then. Heck, the Timelord will probably even be back by then.
What do you mean Younger guys, the Doctor is at least 1104 years old, that's one hell of an age gap and I don't know how old River Song is, but it's not that old
We all assume they will continue the series after this doctor but I think that could be false. They might give it a rest and reboot and remake the series in a few years.
It really depends on what personality they want for the character this go around. Nutty? Serious and stern? Brooding and Angry? I am kind of tired of the youngish nuts in the role.
Who should be Dr. Who, that's Who. ....what? no what's on second....
If "D"=Doctor and "R"=regeneration, then:
D#1, R#1, D#2, R#2,D#3, R#3, D#4, R#4, D#5, R#5, D#6, R#6, D#7, R#7, D#8, R#8, D#9, R#9, D#10, R#10, D#11, R#11, D#12, R#12, D#13, the end(?)
So, if Matt Smith is the 11th, then there are two more left.
If you count David's second regeneration and John Hurt the current body would be the 13th. But, as I said above, River gave the Doctor her regenerations - some or all. So the Doctor would have up to 22 regenerations because River used 2.
Edit: And I would assume that River gave him all her regens, as the Doctor had to use some of his healing energy to heal River when she broke her wrist.
-- Smoov
Anyone ever wonder why they didn't try a spin off following Unit? Coulda had Martha n Micky in it. That woulda been cool . I know that's slightly off topic but it just popped in there haha
Would be very easy to do... 11th Doctor transfers his regeneration energy to the Metacrisis Doctor, who then puts himself through the chameleon arch... Doctor restored :cool:
However... As much as I miss Tennant in the role, I don't necessarily think that a backwards step would be the best thing for the series, and would like to see a new Doctor, and less Moffatt influences...
They're not going to bring David back, as he still wants 600k+. They're going to pick another relative unknown so they can keep the salary down.
I would dread to find out who his companion might be.
Parallels: my second mission for Fed aligned Romulans.
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius