Not at all. But, considering how defensive the detractors have become in this topic, I expected the Fleet Owners and their supporters for this so-called "entitlement would rally together to defend their position to make a profit from their T5 starbases.
I haven't heard a single constructive comment that explains why they feel entitled to charge a feee to gain access to their T5 Starbase. After all, as someone said earlier, its not costing Fleet Owners anything for a member to purchase something from their starbase vendors.
I'm a wealthy player, in-game. With multiple thousands of refined dilithium, Zen and a ton of EC ... it's offensive that Fleet owners think they have the right to abuse the game in this fashion. I go out of my way to educate other players to NOT pay any fleet for the privilege of joining them. Fleet Owners are simply a minority because a majority of the players in-game find the mere act of selling access to a starbase to be offensive and that it "ruins" the game for every player.
They feel entitled to charge for access because it is their starbase and they can charge whatever they damn well please.
Why does it ruin the game for every player? A player decides he can either wait for ages to get some yellowstones for example, or he can pony up 10M or so (chump change) and get them right away, and a fleet gets some extra EC in the bank. It's a win win for both parties. I don't see why this is a problem, other than from over entitled whiners who think they should get something for nothing.
The point of fact that the detractors posting in this topic keep forgetting is that Fleet Starbases are being built upon by their members. Unless the Fleet Owners have decided to build these Starbases by themselves, with no help from any other fleet member, then their argument that "they" spent a lot to build their starbases to Tier 5 is a baseless argument.
Fleet Owners forget that its their fleet members who help contribute to the building of their starbases and once they get to Tier 5, they seem to claim credit that "they" as a single person, built their starbase.
This is a legit concern that I posted in the first post and from the rumors I've been hearing in-game, that the STO devs are going to be addressing this problem with STO. Nobody involved with the development of STO have actually come out and said anything about it.
As I said in my first post, the Fleet Owners have opted to troll this topic in defense of them making money by selling access to their fleet.
I like how you think we are trying to defend our selling starbase access.
What you don't know is that Shutup Wesley has NEVER sold access to a single person EVER and we never intend to do so. Why might you say? Because we really don't care about pubbies getting anything from the starbase, you don't deserve it.
Bootstraps are needed by this community and it seems like you should be subject zero.
Youknowwhatitis...
-Supporter of Cryptic Lockboxes!
I haven't heard a single constructive comment that explains why they feel entitled to charge a feee to gain access to their T5 Starbase. After all, as someone said earlier, its not costing Fleet Owners anything for a member to purchase something from their starbase vendors.
#1 It's their starbase, they can do whatever the hell they want with it.
#2 Nobody is forcing you to pay them.
#3 That last part is like saying, farmers should give away milk for free since the cow making milk in itself didn't cost them anything, completely ignoring the fact that they had to raise the cow first. You're using the same logic.
I for one am glad other fleets are selling their ships this way.
Not everyone wants to be in a fleet, and they are giving these people other options.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Vornek@oberlerchner123 - Join Date: July 2008
Not at all. But, considering how defensive the detractors have become in this topic, I expected the Fleet Owners and their supporters for this so-called "entitlement would rally together to defend their position to make a profit from their T5 starbases.
as opposed to your 'urgent plea' to cryptic to stop players from doing something that you dont agree with?
I haven't heard a single constructive comment that explains why they feel entitled to charge a feee to gain access to their T5 Starbase. After all, as someone said earlier, its not costing Fleet Owners anything for a member to purchase something from their starbase vendors.
There have been plenty of constructive arguments, you are just dismissing them because you dont agree with it, and calling people trolls in the process.
other than the fact the MASSIVE amount of time and effort, and potential money players have invested, some people offer players the ability to get into big fleets and quickly use those resources others have spent months making.
why should someone get access to a fleet store for free? provisions cost resources in the first place and some may want some return on that investment. if some offer them for free then fine, if someone wants to charge then fine. its not up to you to decide if that is right or wrong or demand cryptic do something about it.
no one has to accept that offer. any player can make a choice as to whether they want to do this, or if its a good trade off.
none of my fleets ask anyone to pay up front, we do ask players to contribute before opening up the stores via higher ranks to show loyalty in some cases. some fleets ask a player contributes straight away. what that fleet does with the money is up to them. some will invest it, some will use it themselves. either way it is irrelevant what they do with it as the invited player only has to decide whether getting access is worth the EC. If they decide no, then they go find a fleet that does not charge.
Fleet Owners are simply a minority because a majority of the players in-game find the mere act of selling access to a starbase to be offensive and that it "ruins" the game for every player.
also spoken to all 2 million accounts have we? you cant even get the majority of people in this thread to agree with you, so what makes you think you have the first clue what the majority in game find acceptable?
I should like to point out OP that your definition of "fleet owner" is ambiguous. Everyone in a fleet is the owner, you may be referring to fleet leaders in your diatribe against selling access to fleet owned vendors.
If this is the case I should further point out that anyone... ANYONE... with the permissions to invite a non-fleet member to the fleet starbase could be charging for access. It all depends on what permissions the fleet leader/leaders have allowed... it could be senior officers and leaders or even officers and above. Doesn't seem like a one-man dictatorship anymore when you look at it like this, does it?
The simple problem you seem to be expressing is that it does not cost the fleet leader (or whomsoever it is inviting you to the base) anything to allow you access to the store. However, each item available in-store has to be "bought" or stocked-up through provisioning projects, which cost the fleet dil, doffs, XP, consumables, fleet marks and commodities. This costs a HUGE amount of time, which the fleet is recouping slightly by charging YOU access for a few measly EC. Members have already paid for access through grinding.
How is this any different to buying Zen to convert to Dil, because you don't want to invest the time grinding it out?
Whilst I share the concern that a single member granting access for 10million EC may keep that EC for selfish reasons, the simple fact is you cannot prove that it does not go into a fleet bank.
"...we are far more united and have far more in common with each other than the things that divide us.”
Jo Cox 22.6.1974 - 16.6.2016
I find it hilarious that you all are bickering over the work of others. You assume that fleet leaders are greedy because they charge a fee for others to buy ships off their base. Of course, if you had the facts that they share the profits with their fleet mates, you'd have nothing to be crying about here, so I doubt any of you have looked into that.
Is it really too much to ask to be happy that some fleets have the ability to get this access for their fleet members? Of course it is, it just means all you that have complaints about it don't have the ec to gain from the offers being made. Which in turn, makes it all even more funny. Who cares what people are doing with their base? Do you have nothing better to do in game then to see what everyone else is doing so you can run to forum and QQ about it?
I think it's spectacular that people more fortunate are offering this option to smaller fleets that don't have the means to build up their bases as quickly as larger fleets. If you have watched the thread, you would see the things needed to make the base available to gain these things. When with big fleets offering their base to others for a minor fraction of what it costs to build, a few people can get together and get said access. Kudos to the fleet leaders sharing their love!
Some 2 months ago tier 5 access costed around 25-30 million. Now its' about 10 million. In a few months so many fleets will be tier 5 nobody will pay for access anymore. The problem will solve itself.
Some 2 months ago tier 5 access costed around 25-30 million. Now its' about 10 million. In a few months so many fleets will be tier 5 nobody will pay for access anymore. The problem will solve itself.
It's almost like price is dictated by supply and demand!
They feel entitled to charge for access because it is their starbase and they can charge whatever they damn well please.
Why does it ruin the game for every player? A player decides he can either wait for ages to get some yellowstones for example, or he can pony up 10M or so (chump change) and get them right away, and a fleet gets some extra EC in the bank. It's a win win for both parties. I don't see why this is a problem, other than from over entitled whiners who think they should get something for nothing.
I agree everyone wins, unless the fleet in question is running a recruitment scam, which will happen as more large fleets hit tier 5. It's not hard to take 10mill of some noob and put them on ignore if everyone knows the fleet you are in has a t5 star base.
But you would have to be a right goon to do something like that, eh?
Some 2 months ago tier 5 access costed around 25-30 million. Now its' about 10 million. In a few months so many fleets will be tier 5 nobody will pay for access anymore. The problem will solve itself.
Same thing with elite carrier pets. Don't want to pay 30M? Wait until they become common.
There's a simple solution to this issue: Don't join fleets that are being jerks about it, and don't pay for access to things.
Much like kidnapping for ransom, the only reason this kind of thing happens is because it's EFFECTIVE. Nobody would do this kind of stuff unless it was getting them the rewards they're seeking.
In this case it's somewhat self limiting: As more fleets hit higher tiers, it'll get harder and harder to pull this kind of BS, because there'll be more and more competition from groups that aren't such jerks about it as time goes on.
In essence, it's a short-term, self-limiting problem in the end, because MAINTAINING a level 5 starbase requires...nothing at all.
In essence, it's a short-term, self-limiting problem in the end, because MAINTAINING a level 5 starbase requires...nothing at all.
Correct me if I'm wrong but provisioning the starbase vendors stores will still require upkeep, otherwise there's nothing to sell... nothing to do with the base itself, just the shops in it.
"...we are far more united and have far more in common with each other than the things that divide us.”
Jo Cox 22.6.1974 - 16.6.2016
Heh, Good thing I am in The Third Fleet Task Force, All we had to to is contrubite to the projects but that's it no EC to join or use any of anything all was free to use.
It was one of the first Fleets sense I started playing. I am glad I do not have to pay, I am already struggling on EC as it is but I do get by and always find some way to get enough but end up flat broke in the end so I try to keep my budget with my EC tight for while until I earned enough most of it now goes directed to New Romulus untill I finnish the Tiers I won't have enough for other things. (Sense I use the replicator a lot for the projects)
Like the antiprotons im the Exchange 2 million is to much for me but I have enough to get one at are Fleet Base much cheaper by just using my time instead.
Anyways, You can always find a fleet best suitable to you. Are Fleet is one that dose not charge you anything. But anyways good luck in finding a Fleet that don't charge EC. ^^
In essence, it's a short-term, self-limiting problem in the end, because MAINTAINING a level 5 starbase requires...nothing at all.
No that is totally wrong. it takes a lot of resources to maintain the provisions. you have to constantly run projects to stock up if people are using them and they are not cheap.
This also goes for the whole getting to tier 5 in the first place. it takes a massive amount of work to suddenly allow someone to just walk in and take what they want for nothing.
the cost of spending hundreds of millions of EC, millions of dilithium, countless thousands of doffs to get there does not suddenly wipe itself out just because you hit tier 5. getting there is just as important as its maintenance when considering what people can take out.
Until a few days ago I have never had a fleet version of a starship. I have been a member of some great fleets but I just never asked if I could use the provisioning, mostly because I could describe my play style as "less than casual" and I never felt like I contributed enough to ask to use provisioning stores. I probably would have continued to have a "less than casual" play style had Legacy not been announced, at which point I left Fed side and joined The Trivium on the KDF side and began putting as much as I possibly could into our own Starbase. So.. my KDF and Romulan characters are going to be set as we progress.
What's that have to do with anything?
Well, I still have three Federation characters at cap that I enjoy playing from time to time. They're all in fleets that are friendly with Trivium, ran by people my fleet mates know and like. They're really cool groups of people, but like before my main focus is elsewhere so I don't get to contribute a lot and with their size it seems like most of their projects are on cool down when I log on.
But man.. I finally found THE cruiser for my Engineer that I absolutely love. I found myself wanting to try out a Fleet Assault Cruiser, which lo and behold requires a Tier 5 shipyard, which the fleet he's in has recently achieved.
I had the fleet credits for it but 99% of them came from contributions elsewhere. It didn't feel right to me to ask this fleet to give up one of it's provisions when I had barely contributed. Other members put in marks, dilithium, doffs, and other items into completing these provisioning projects. Did they do it so that some new person could just waltz in take ownership of a shiny new ship from their shiny new tier 5 shipyard?
I don't think so. They put into those projects so that their fleetmates who had been participating in projects could have shiny new ships.
So I asked the fleet leader if I could compensate them for the use of a ship provision. We hashed out the details, I handed over 8 million EC, my toon's rank was bumped up, and I took ownership of my beautiful new Fleet Assault Cruiser. I don't feel cheated. I've already almost built that 8 million EC back without really trying. I received my ship, they received game currency to compensate for the fleet projects I hadn't been able to contribute to.
Commerce is not a scam good sir. If the player has a Tier 5 Starbase and he wants to sell access to it, good on him. If he uses the money for fleet related expenses it's even a legitimate use of fleet resources.
This also goes for the whole getting to tier 5 in the first place. it takes a massive amount of work to suddenly allow someone to just walk in and take what they want for nothing.
Nobody's saying fleets should open their wares for anyone to plunder, any time, and any where. Very few complain about fleets time-, social-, or contribution-gating recruits, even though those tactics can also be used to scam players. Hardly anyone is even complaining about charging access for players who have no intention of joining or staying in a fleet, and merely want to purchase gear or ships.
What people are complaining about, here, is using a fleet starbase's stores as a carrot to charge EC's for would-be recruits, looking to join fleets in good faith. This is a system in which recruits don't have automatic, unfettered access to starbase resources, and that's specifically to allow fleets to vet recruits before taking on the risk of opening stores. The process of vetting recruits can be done in good faith entirely without absorbing risk by the fleet, charging the recruit, or even foregoing opportunity cost by fleet officers (given recruitment and vetting are part of their duties) so why charge anything beyond project contributions?
Somebody getting uppity about canon? No problem! Just take a deep breath, and repeat after me:
Ever since the first Starbase hit Tier 5, an obvious problem has cropped up turning STO into a pathetic scam involving Fleet Owners trying to turn their Starbases into a revenue generating scam where they are now charging players to join their fleets.
how the f**k is that a scam is beyond me.
I tell you what is a scam .A fleet is t5 and the fleet owner or owners sell fleet stuffs for ec so they get rich while members who cant invite to fleet maps to sell get no ec ,even thou everyone worked to get those provisions.That is a scam and a a**hole attitude (btw all big fleets do this ...so if you are in a big fleet and can invite to a map tell your fleet leader how a**shole he is).Thats how "some" special people get to make easy billions without even selling anything on exchange.
No that is totally wrong. it takes a lot of resources to maintain the provisions. you have to constantly run projects to stock up if people are using them and they are not cheap.
All this does is set a minimum price. How many energy credits are 1200 fleet marks, 90k dilithium, 65 non-civilian white quality Doff's, 100k expertise, 2500 shield generators, and 1250 warp coils worth? I'm having trouble pricing the dilithium and expertise but I'm coming up with something around 25 million energy credits, but lets say 30 million energy credits to keep the numbers tidy. That makes your "break even price" 2 million EC's per ship provision. Anything above that is pure profit.
This also goes for the whole getting to tier 5 in the first place. it takes a massive amount of work to suddenly allow someone to just walk in and take what they want for nothing.
the cost of spending hundreds of millions of EC, millions of dilithium, countless thousands of doffs to get there does not suddenly wipe itself out just because you hit tier 5. getting there is just as important as its maintenance when considering what people can take out.
Ah, there's the rub. But still, you could be selling ship provisions as early as Tier-1, the demand will be less and it will be less efficient overall but it would make a nice way to soften fleet expenses.
They feel entitled to charge for access because it is their starbase and they can charge whatever they damn well please.
Why does it ruin the game for every player? A player decides he can either wait for ages to get some yellowstones for example, or he can pony up 10M or so (chump change) and get them right away, and a fleet gets some extra EC in the bank. It's a win win for both parties. I don't see why this is a problem, other than from over entitled whiners who think they should get something for nothing.
Exactly. The OP seems to be saying in all his posts on this thread that if someone wants access to a Fleet store that they contributed nothing to provisioning it should be free. So what that it took millions of EC and Dil and Fleet credits to get the items unlocked in the store. My Starbase is tier 3 and I wanted a set of Elite Shields/Eng/Deflector and some XII Romulan Consoles. So I found a Fleet that had them. Came to a price that we both agreed on and made the transaction. I got what I wanted and the Fleet leader got what he wanted. Both parties happy. According to the OP this fleet leader should have given me access to these items that cost him and his members an TRIBBLE-ton of loot to get access to for free.
While I would always be against my fleet selling access to our store; I don't see why selling access to a fleet to buy the T5 stuff is considered a scam (unless they really are scamming by taking your money then booting you). I think 10 million is cheap considering all the work and resources that people in that fleet had to shell out to get it to T5 in the first place. If you don't like fleets selling access; then make sure your fleet doesn't do it; but trying to get Cryptic to regulate what others do with their fleet is a bit ridiculous and downright selfish IMO.
Comments
They feel entitled to charge for access because it is their starbase and they can charge whatever they damn well please.
Why does it ruin the game for every player? A player decides he can either wait for ages to get some yellowstones for example, or he can pony up 10M or so (chump change) and get them right away, and a fleet gets some extra EC in the bank. It's a win win for both parties. I don't see why this is a problem, other than from over entitled whiners who think they should get something for nothing.
I like how you think we are trying to defend our selling starbase access.
What you don't know is that Shutup Wesley has NEVER sold access to a single person EVER and we never intend to do so. Why might you say? Because we really don't care about pubbies getting anything from the starbase, you don't deserve it.
Bootstraps are needed by this community and it seems like you should be subject zero.
You know what it is...
-Supporter of Cryptic Lockboxes!
#1 It's their starbase, they can do whatever the hell they want with it.
#2 Nobody is forcing you to pay them.
#3 That last part is like saying, farmers should give away milk for free since the cow making milk in itself didn't cost them anything, completely ignoring the fact that they had to raise the cow first. You're using the same logic.
I for one am glad other fleets are selling their ships this way.
Not everyone wants to be in a fleet, and they are giving these people other options.
Vornek@oberlerchner123 - Join Date: July 2008
as opposed to your 'urgent plea' to cryptic to stop players from doing something that you dont agree with?
There have been plenty of constructive arguments, you are just dismissing them because you dont agree with it, and calling people trolls in the process.
other than the fact the MASSIVE amount of time and effort, and potential money players have invested, some people offer players the ability to get into big fleets and quickly use those resources others have spent months making.
why should someone get access to a fleet store for free? provisions cost resources in the first place and some may want some return on that investment. if some offer them for free then fine, if someone wants to charge then fine. its not up to you to decide if that is right or wrong or demand cryptic do something about it.
no one has to accept that offer. any player can make a choice as to whether they want to do this, or if its a good trade off.
none of my fleets ask anyone to pay up front, we do ask players to contribute before opening up the stores via higher ranks to show loyalty in some cases. some fleets ask a player contributes straight away. what that fleet does with the money is up to them. some will invest it, some will use it themselves. either way it is irrelevant what they do with it as the invited player only has to decide whether getting access is worth the EC. If they decide no, then they go find a fleet that does not charge.
also spoken to all 2 million accounts have we? you cant even get the majority of people in this thread to agree with you, so what makes you think you have the first clue what the majority in game find acceptable?
If this is the case I should further point out that anyone... ANYONE... with the permissions to invite a non-fleet member to the fleet starbase could be charging for access. It all depends on what permissions the fleet leader/leaders have allowed... it could be senior officers and leaders or even officers and above. Doesn't seem like a one-man dictatorship anymore when you look at it like this, does it?
The simple problem you seem to be expressing is that it does not cost the fleet leader (or whomsoever it is inviting you to the base) anything to allow you access to the store. However, each item available in-store has to be "bought" or stocked-up through provisioning projects, which cost the fleet dil, doffs, XP, consumables, fleet marks and commodities. This costs a HUGE amount of time, which the fleet is recouping slightly by charging YOU access for a few measly EC. Members have already paid for access through grinding.
How is this any different to buying Zen to convert to Dil, because you don't want to invest the time grinding it out?
Whilst I share the concern that a single member granting access for 10million EC may keep that EC for selfish reasons, the simple fact is you cannot prove that it does not go into a fleet bank.
Jo Cox 22.6.1974 - 16.6.2016
Is it really too much to ask to be happy that some fleets have the ability to get this access for their fleet members? Of course it is, it just means all you that have complaints about it don't have the ec to gain from the offers being made. Which in turn, makes it all even more funny. Who cares what people are doing with their base? Do you have nothing better to do in game then to see what everyone else is doing so you can run to forum and QQ about it?
I think it's spectacular that people more fortunate are offering this option to smaller fleets that don't have the means to build up their bases as quickly as larger fleets. If you have watched the thread, you would see the things needed to make the base available to gain these things. When with big fleets offering their base to others for a minor fraction of what it costs to build, a few people can get together and get said access. Kudos to the fleet leaders sharing their love!
It's almost like price is dictated by supply and demand!
Thats just a crazy idea!
I've heard some wild, crazy theories in my time but you sir win the biscuit.
SHHHH!! Don't let them know!!
I agree everyone wins, unless the fleet in question is running a recruitment scam, which will happen as more large fleets hit tier 5. It's not hard to take 10mill of some noob and put them on ignore if everyone knows the fleet you are in has a t5 star base.
But you would have to be a right goon to do something like that, eh?
Same thing with elite carrier pets. Don't want to pay 30M? Wait until they become common.
Much like kidnapping for ransom, the only reason this kind of thing happens is because it's EFFECTIVE. Nobody would do this kind of stuff unless it was getting them the rewards they're seeking.
In this case it's somewhat self limiting: As more fleets hit higher tiers, it'll get harder and harder to pull this kind of BS, because there'll be more and more competition from groups that aren't such jerks about it as time goes on.
In essence, it's a short-term, self-limiting problem in the end, because MAINTAINING a level 5 starbase requires...nothing at all.
Correct me if I'm wrong but provisioning the starbase vendors stores will still require upkeep, otherwise there's nothing to sell... nothing to do with the base itself, just the shops in it.
Jo Cox 22.6.1974 - 16.6.2016
It was one of the first Fleets sense I started playing. I am glad I do not have to pay, I am already struggling on EC as it is but I do get by and always find some way to get enough but end up flat broke in the end so I try to keep my budget with my EC tight for while until I earned enough most of it now goes directed to New Romulus untill I finnish the Tiers I won't have enough for other things. (Sense I use the replicator a lot for the projects)
Like the antiprotons im the Exchange 2 million is to much for me but I have enough to get one at are Fleet Base much cheaper by just using my time instead.
Anyways, You can always find a fleet best suitable to you. Are Fleet is one that dose not charge you anything. But anyways good luck in finding a Fleet that don't charge EC. ^^
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Fastest Hedgehog Alive
No that is totally wrong. it takes a lot of resources to maintain the provisions. you have to constantly run projects to stock up if people are using them and they are not cheap.
This also goes for the whole getting to tier 5 in the first place. it takes a massive amount of work to suddenly allow someone to just walk in and take what they want for nothing.
the cost of spending hundreds of millions of EC, millions of dilithium, countless thousands of doffs to get there does not suddenly wipe itself out just because you hit tier 5. getting there is just as important as its maintenance when considering what people can take out.
What's that have to do with anything?
Well, I still have three Federation characters at cap that I enjoy playing from time to time. They're all in fleets that are friendly with Trivium, ran by people my fleet mates know and like. They're really cool groups of people, but like before my main focus is elsewhere so I don't get to contribute a lot and with their size it seems like most of their projects are on cool down when I log on.
But man.. I finally found THE cruiser for my Engineer that I absolutely love. I found myself wanting to try out a Fleet Assault Cruiser, which lo and behold requires a Tier 5 shipyard, which the fleet he's in has recently achieved.
I had the fleet credits for it but 99% of them came from contributions elsewhere. It didn't feel right to me to ask this fleet to give up one of it's provisions when I had barely contributed. Other members put in marks, dilithium, doffs, and other items into completing these provisioning projects. Did they do it so that some new person could just waltz in take ownership of a shiny new ship from their shiny new tier 5 shipyard?
I don't think so. They put into those projects so that their fleetmates who had been participating in projects could have shiny new ships.
So I asked the fleet leader if I could compensate them for the use of a ship provision. We hashed out the details, I handed over 8 million EC, my toon's rank was bumped up, and I took ownership of my beautiful new Fleet Assault Cruiser. I don't feel cheated. I've already almost built that 8 million EC back without really trying. I received my ship, they received game currency to compensate for the fleet projects I hadn't been able to contribute to.
I don't see the big deal.
Nobody's saying fleets should open their wares for anyone to plunder, any time, and any where. Very few complain about fleets time-, social-, or contribution-gating recruits, even though those tactics can also be used to scam players. Hardly anyone is even complaining about charging access for players who have no intention of joining or staying in a fleet, and merely want to purchase gear or ships.
What people are complaining about, here, is using a fleet starbase's stores as a carrot to charge EC's for would-be recruits, looking to join fleets in good faith. This is a system in which recruits don't have automatic, unfettered access to starbase resources, and that's specifically to allow fleets to vet recruits before taking on the risk of opening stores. The process of vetting recruits can be done in good faith entirely without absorbing risk by the fleet, charging the recruit, or even foregoing opportunity cost by fleet officers (given recruitment and vetting are part of their duties) so why charge anything beyond project contributions?
Spock's Brain.
how the f**k is that a scam is beyond me.
I tell you what is a scam .A fleet is t5 and the fleet owner or owners sell fleet stuffs for ec so they get rich while members who cant invite to fleet maps to sell get no ec ,even thou everyone worked to get those provisions.That is a scam and a a**hole attitude (btw all big fleets do this ...so if you are in a big fleet and can invite to a map tell your fleet leader how a**shole he is).Thats how "some" special people get to make easy billions without even selling anything on exchange.
All this does is set a minimum price. How many energy credits are 1200 fleet marks, 90k dilithium, 65 non-civilian white quality Doff's, 100k expertise, 2500 shield generators, and 1250 warp coils worth? I'm having trouble pricing the dilithium and expertise but I'm coming up with something around 25 million energy credits, but lets say 30 million energy credits to keep the numbers tidy. That makes your "break even price" 2 million EC's per ship provision. Anything above that is pure profit.
Ah, there's the rub. But still, you could be selling ship provisions as early as Tier-1, the demand will be less and it will be less efficient overall but it would make a nice way to soften fleet expenses.
Exactly. The OP seems to be saying in all his posts on this thread that if someone wants access to a Fleet store that they contributed nothing to provisioning it should be free. So what that it took millions of EC and Dil and Fleet credits to get the items unlocked in the store. My Starbase is tier 3 and I wanted a set of Elite Shields/Eng/Deflector and some XII Romulan Consoles. So I found a Fleet that had them. Came to a price that we both agreed on and made the transaction. I got what I wanted and the Fleet leader got what he wanted. Both parties happy. According to the OP this fleet leader should have given me access to these items that cost him and his members an TRIBBLE-ton of loot to get access to for free.
Free Market Economy
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Three more words
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