Thats a problem with most mmo designs like this is that they turn fleets/guilds into a pyramid scheme where it forms a true dictatorship.
But you have the choice of joining/creating another fleet. You always have that choice. And I'm sure that fleets with good leaders are always looking for good players.
But you have the choice of joining/creating another fleet. You always have that choice. And I'm sure that fleets with good leaders are always looking for good players.
And then finding a good fleet looks like a full time job. No thank you. I prefer a completely free system where no one can abuse any kind of power. Where there is no possibility to be a pain there is no pain, it's an easy statement but it works. :rolleyes:
If you would like to run a fascist fleet where there are many restrictions about player's rights to do/use stuff, then you're free to start/join one. This is a better version of what you said, seriously. And you'll see if it's popular.
At the very least we deserve a different fleet system if it has to remain in game. Create two kind of fleets : dictatorships (with the new restrictions) and free ones (without it). It could be an option we choose when we create the fleet and then it cannot be changed. Everyone would be ok with that, there cannot be any trick and you know how it's run at first glance.
And then finding a good fleet looks like a full time job. No thank you. I prefer a completely free system where no one can abuse any kind of power. Where there is no possibility to be a pain there is no pain, it's an easy statement but it works. :rolleyes:
If you would like to run a fascist fleet where there are many restrictions about player's rights to do/use stuff, then you're free to start/join one. This is a better version of what you said, seriously. And you'll see if it's popular.
At the very least we deserve a different fleet system if it has to remain in game. Create two kind of fleets : dictatorships (with the new restrictions) and free ones (without it). It could be an option we choose when we create the fleet and then it cannot be changed. Everyone would be ok with that, there cannot be any trick and you know how it's run at first glance.
I'm too tired to argue semantics, but why is finding a good fleet a full time job? You would know after a few questions, or worse case, after spending a week with the people, if it's a "dictatorship" or not.
The devs have only so much time, and I'd guess it's much easier to create a highly structured fleet system than giving players free reign. Consider that fleets are supposed to be highly structured in real life.
Then again, I'm in a good fleet, with leadership that aren't jerks, so maybe I just wouldn't understand. (Collective, if you are interested.)
That whole function(choosing who can contribute) is absolutely disgusting and frankly frightens me a bit. If Cryptic thinks that this is even in the realm of 'good' or 'okay' - they still haven't learned what constitues a good game - or what their playerbase wants.
Hard caps need to be put in place(per character; per x time) or the system needs to redesign the whole contribution thing. Personal gain shouldn't have even come into play(for the most part) when it's supposed to be a FLEET system. Making players handicapped(or subpar) because they are either not on at certain times, lack specific things, etc does not make for a good system.
The Fleet System is going to become something that a lot of folks are going to just throw their hands up in the air with disgust..., and not be bothered with.
I also think that many fleets will end up loosing more players than gaining.
IMO, It's going to end up very much looking like a Trek version of EVE.
If what we've seen so far goes to the Holodeck...
In a very short time there's going to end up being just a couple of Massive Fleets (which will dominate the game)...
And a Multitude of Solo Fleets (that will constantly be trying to catch up).
I'm just gonna toss this out there..., Cause it's something to keep in mind...
"Absolute Power... Corrupts Absolutely"
Before this Starbase System, the only real advantage to being a Fleet Leader...
Was the ability to Control Access to the Fleet Bank Tabs...
Now...
Fleet Leaders are going to have the Power & Control over How Effectively Other Players will be able to Play The Game...
I hope I'm wrong... But...,
I don't see this ending well...
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
It's been mentioned several times before and it is something I would desperately like to see: Slider for Data Sample contributions. It's really not fun to contribute hundreds of data samples when you have to do it one at a time.
I find the hand wringing over fleet credit accumulation to be silly at best. It raises legitimate questions how far these posters have advanced their Starbase, or how legitimate their evaluation of the system as designed is.
The abundance of fleet credits with nothing useful to purchase will be the issue on Halodeck. The extremely limited number of items this broken Starbase economy is designed to allow right now is the source of all ills.
Until the Starbase economy is fixed, this will be a flop on Halodeck. All the complaints are simply a symptom of a poorly designed Starbase economy that has no link whatsoever between currency and product purchased.
That any fleet leader would ever allow their fleet to use the special mission for Fleet credits, or that Cryptic is so silly as to believe such a mission holds any value at all in their Starbase economy design, highlights just how bad the design of the Starbase economy is.
If your fleet does the special mission on Holodeck under the current design published to Tribble, you are in a fleet led by ignorant fools who believes flushing 600 fleet marks and who knows how many precious DOFFS down the toilet for 20XP in each field of study is smart. Because as a member of the fleet that has advanced the furthest on Tribble - here is a tip.
Fleet marks are earned at rates 30-40x the ability to spend them. The currency will be worthless and abundant long before players actually can spend them on anything useful.
Tried to contribute items to the Kryptic Klingon fleet. The dialog "Transferring Fleet Marks" came up and just stuck. Did it previously with no issues, second time it fails.
Update:
Hit the "X" Close dialog button and tied again with success.
It is incredibly hard to test anything related to Fleet-specific content when, although copied in every other way to the letter, my character is suddenly "Not in a Fleet."
Everything that I would otherwise have access to with my fleet during regular play is now out of reach. I don't think I'll be able to convince them all to come over to the test server, so how am I supposed to test Fleet content?
Any insights?
Fleet Commander
Caprica's Revenge (...actually active since November 2010, which may one day be important to archaeologists, but not to anyone else...)
It is incredibly hard to test anything related to Fleet-specific content when, although copied in every other way to the letter, my character is suddenly "Not in a Fleet."
Everything that I would otherwise have access to with my fleet during regular play is now out of reach. I don't think I'll be able to convince them all to come over to the test server, so how am I supposed to test Fleet content?
Any insights?
WEEEELLL...don't I feel stupid. The article doesn't specify the exact timing of the Tribble patch start, just the end. Turns out it isn't patched yet.
Kind of confusing, guys!
Fleet Commander
Caprica's Revenge (...actually active since November 2010, which may one day be important to archaeologists, but not to anyone else...)
It is incredibly hard to test anything related to Fleet-specific content when, although copied in every other way to the letter, my character is suddenly "Not in a Fleet."
Everything that I would otherwise have access to with my fleet during regular play is now out of reach. I don't think I'll be able to convince them all to come over to the test server, so how am I supposed to test Fleet content?
Any insights?
OK; questions back on: still am not in a Fleet after the patch and can't access anything fleet content-wise I'm supposed to be testing...am I missing a trick or a memo in her somewhere?
Please advise.
Fleet Commander
Caprica's Revenge (...actually active since November 2010, which may one day be important to archaeologists, but not to anyone else...)
OK; questions back on: still am not in a Fleet after the patch and can't access anything fleet content-wise I'm supposed to be testing...am I missing a trick or a memo in her somewhere?
Please advise.
Join the TTS chat channel and ask someone to add you to the Fed/KDF Cryptic Test Fleet
Join the TTS chat channel and ask someone to add you to the Fed/KDF Cryptic Test Fleet
Thanks, mate - I will do that!
Fleet Commander
Caprica's Revenge (...actually active since November 2010, which may one day be important to archaeologists, but not to anyone else...)
Rock Roof Covering Map View of Some Rooms
Lack of Odjects in Ops Area in Round Glass Area
Eng. Deck Glass Windows Missing Space Exterior
Tac. Deck Could Use Less Generic Consoles
OK, so IS there a TTS Fleet out there that can be joined so that the fleet content can be tested? I asked several people with the name "Tribble Fleet" or something to that effect about joining, and each one said the fleet was full.
So, if you can't join a fleet - and my fleet from the Holodeck aren't coming in to test in enough numbers to create our own fleet here - I'd say the feedback I have on the Fleet System and the Starbases is negative!
Even without any fleet sampling though I can say one thing: from the emphasis being put on fleet organization (e.g. the use of 'Expertise' as a sort of currency to get 'Marks,' among other means - which all look to complicate things and change what I feel is a pretty solid system (Bridge Officer points, etc.)), it is clear that solo players are going to feel slighted, and rightly so - if you aren't in a fleet, Season 6 is going to be a lot of not much...
Fleet Commander
Caprica's Revenge (...actually active since November 2010, which may one day be important to archaeologists, but not to anyone else...)
The officer of the watch - scan the holdings mission only lets you scan while your ship is stationery. really needs to allow you to move at the same time, especially for big ships that take ages to stop and park correctly.
the ship requisition page has the rank selector not working. if you click on it it goes to the lieutenant rank and can not be changed so you can only see lt. ships.
OK, so IS there a TTS Fleet out there that can be joined so that the fleet content can be tested? I asked several people with the name "Tribble Fleet" or something to that effect about joining, and each one said the fleet was full.
So, if you can't join a fleet - and my fleet from the Holodeck aren't coming in to test in enough numbers to create our own fleet here - I'd say the feedback I have on the Fleet System and the Starbases is negative!
Even without any fleet sampling though I can say one thing: from the emphasis being put on fleet organization (e.g. the use of 'Expertise' as a sort of currency to get 'Marks,' among other means - which all look to complicate things and change what I feel is a pretty solid system (Bridge Officer points, etc.)), it is clear that solo players are going to feel slighted, and rightly so - if you aren't in a fleet, Season 6 is going to be a lot of not much...
The official fleet is Cryptics Tribbles and I am a member and as of the last time I was logged in there was only 1 spot open.
Scan this QR code to go to the website of Klingon Legacy [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Not sure if this is where this belongs, but I didn't think it deserved its very own thread. I noticed alot of lag everywhere I went on Tribble, space and ground, it could just be me, if so, no big deal, but wanted to mention it in case others had the same problem.
Cloaking generators break down at first sign of language.
I have tested out the fleet system for the last 2 days while I don't have much experience with the system like most people here the only thing I picked up on that annoyed me slightly is:
Entering any of the fleet defence or fleet pve queues then finishing finding myself in sector space, can't it run like how a character is on esd then doing an stf in KASE then reappearing on esd instead of magically appearing at kitamore system,
Also no dabo table? Come on I need a dabo table on my fleets station, I just need one I spend all my spare time that I get in game playing dabo
Hello!
I just got into a test fleet and I notice that the Fleet starbase transwarp shares the same cooldown as the Sol transwarp.
I feel this might be limiting for fleetmates that are actively transwarping and have to get to their starbase for a function. I suppose this is mitigated by advanced planning, sure, but still.
I wonder if it'd be a better idea to have the Starbase Transwarp on it's own cooldown timer.
I like how you could requisition experimental ships next to shuttle information from the shipyard. I like how you pay with energy credits to. Hope this would pass and be on the holodeck once season 6 launches.
I had a chance to use the new Fleet System and I have to say- I LOVE IT!
The UI is very intuitive, the learning curve was small and I was able to help complete the Teir 0 (?) Tactical Stage Objectives. It's very exciting all the difference ways you can contribute- DOffs, Expertise, Marks, and materials (Paragrine Fighters, for instance).
Hoping that more ways to contribute are unlocked at later teirs- like contributing Dilithium, Crafting, Tribbles (or for the KDF Tribble to the Bon Fire. LOL), maybe even straight up crafting materials.
Can't wait to see DOff mission open up that help the fleet grow.
Take a serious page from Turbine with these star bases.
In Dungeons and Dragons Online they have a similar guild housing system, but it's airships instead of star bases. What guilds would do in DDO was recruit anyone and everyone. Then, once the guild was maxed, or high enough, the guild leadership would start booting everyone, reaping all the benefits, and leaving a lot of people out in the cold with time and resources wasted.
To combat this, Turbine has it so that if the guild kicks a person from their guild, a sizable portion of their contribution is taken with them, effectively de-leveling the guild if you boot the people you took advantage of.
I feel this should be taken into real consideration, since one of the major requirements for improving a star base is processed dilithium, which is in a direct way tied to real currencies.
I don't think a refund of resources spent would be a good solution, since that can lead to the abuse of people contributing everything, getting kicked, refunded, then rejoin only to pour "free" resources into increasing the star base.
Some kind of incentive for a fleet to not use abusive recruiting practices against players who want to benefit from the perks of being in a fleet.
Take a serious page from Turbine with these star bases.
In Dungeons and Dragons Online they have a similar guild housing system, but it's airships instead of star bases. What guilds would do in DDO was recruit anyone and everyone. Then, once the guild was maxed, or high enough, the guild leadership would start booting everyone, reaping all the benefits, and leaving a lot of people out in the cold with time and resources wasted.
To combat this, Turbine has it so that if the guild kicks a person from their guild, a sizable portion of their contribution is taken with them, effectively de-leveling the guild if you boot the people you took advantage of.
I feel this should be taken into real consideration, since one of the major requirements for improving a star base is processed dilithium, which is in a direct way tied to real currencies.
I don't think a refund of resources spent would be a good solution, since that can lead to the abuse of people contributing everything, getting kicked, refunded, then rejoin only to pour "free" resources into increasing the star base.
Some kind of incentive for a fleet to not use abusive recruiting practices against players who want to benefit from the perks of being in a fleet.
Hmm, an interesting design approach. I rather like the concept.
Comments
But you have the choice of joining/creating another fleet. You always have that choice. And I'm sure that fleets with good leaders are always looking for good players.
And then finding a good fleet looks like a full time job. No thank you. I prefer a completely free system where no one can abuse any kind of power. Where there is no possibility to be a pain there is no pain, it's an easy statement but it works. :rolleyes:
If you would like to run a fascist fleet where there are many restrictions about player's rights to do/use stuff, then you're free to start/join one. This is a better version of what you said, seriously. And you'll see if it's popular.
At the very least we deserve a different fleet system if it has to remain in game. Create two kind of fleets : dictatorships (with the new restrictions) and free ones (without it). It could be an option we choose when we create the fleet and then it cannot be changed. Everyone would be ok with that, there cannot be any trick and you know how it's run at first glance.
God, lvl 60 CW. 17k.
I'm too tired to argue semantics, but why is finding a good fleet a full time job? You would know after a few questions, or worse case, after spending a week with the people, if it's a "dictatorship" or not.
The devs have only so much time, and I'd guess it's much easier to create a highly structured fleet system than giving players free reign. Consider that fleets are supposed to be highly structured in real life.
Then again, I'm in a good fleet, with leadership that aren't jerks, so maybe I just wouldn't understand. (Collective, if you are interested.)
Hard caps need to be put in place(per character; per x time) or the system needs to redesign the whole contribution thing. Personal gain shouldn't have even come into play(for the most part) when it's supposed to be a FLEET system. Making players handicapped(or subpar) because they are either not on at certain times, lack specific things, etc does not make for a good system.
There's gonna be a LOT of Hard Feelings.
The Fleet System is going to become something that a lot of folks are going to just throw their hands up in the air with disgust..., and not be bothered with.
I also think that many fleets will end up loosing more players than gaining.
IMO, It's going to end up very much looking like a Trek version of EVE.
If what we've seen so far goes to the Holodeck...
In a very short time there's going to end up being just a couple of Massive Fleets (which will dominate the game)...
And a Multitude of Solo Fleets (that will constantly be trying to catch up).
I'm just gonna toss this out there..., Cause it's something to keep in mind...
"Absolute Power... Corrupts Absolutely"
Before this Starbase System, the only real advantage to being a Fleet Leader...
Was the ability to Control Access to the Fleet Bank Tabs...
Now...
Fleet Leaders are going to have the Power & Control over How Effectively Other Players will be able to Play The Game...
I hope I'm wrong... But...,
I don't see this ending well...
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
what if you have a fleet of 5 people?
will they just get screwed because u people cant trust ur own fleet?
yes we all have lots of stuff saved up but that will get used up long b4 ur base is max level
if they limit the amount a person can donate it will stunt the growth of smaller fleet's bases
join date: Jan. 2012
The abundance of fleet credits with nothing useful to purchase will be the issue on Halodeck. The extremely limited number of items this broken Starbase economy is designed to allow right now is the source of all ills.
Until the Starbase economy is fixed, this will be a flop on Halodeck. All the complaints are simply a symptom of a poorly designed Starbase economy that has no link whatsoever between currency and product purchased.
That any fleet leader would ever allow their fleet to use the special mission for Fleet credits, or that Cryptic is so silly as to believe such a mission holds any value at all in their Starbase economy design, highlights just how bad the design of the Starbase economy is.
If your fleet does the special mission on Holodeck under the current design published to Tribble, you are in a fleet led by ignorant fools who believes flushing 600 fleet marks and who knows how many precious DOFFS down the toilet for 20XP in each field of study is smart. Because as a member of the fleet that has advanced the furthest on Tribble - here is a tip.
Fleet marks are earned at rates 30-40x the ability to spend them. The currency will be worthless and abundant long before players actually can spend them on anything useful.
Rules of Acquisition at Priority One
Update:
Hit the "X" Close dialog button and tied again with success.
Everything that I would otherwise have access to with my fleet during regular play is now out of reach. I don't think I'll be able to convince them all to come over to the test server, so how am I supposed to test Fleet content?
Any insights?
Fleet Commander
Caprica's Revenge
(...actually active since November 2010, which may one day be important to archaeologists, but not to anyone else...)
WEEEELLL...don't I feel stupid. The article doesn't specify the exact timing of the Tribble patch start, just the end. Turns out it isn't patched yet.
Kind of confusing, guys!
Fleet Commander
Caprica's Revenge
(...actually active since November 2010, which may one day be important to archaeologists, but not to anyone else...)
I got around it once but I'll be damned if I remember how!
OK; questions back on: still am not in a Fleet after the patch and can't access anything fleet content-wise I'm supposed to be testing...am I missing a trick or a memo in her somewhere?
Please advise.
Fleet Commander
Caprica's Revenge
(...actually active since November 2010, which may one day be important to archaeologists, but not to anyone else...)
Join the TTS chat channel and ask someone to add you to the Fed/KDF Cryptic Test Fleet
Thanks, mate - I will do that!
Fleet Commander
Caprica's Revenge
(...actually active since November 2010, which may one day be important to archaeologists, but not to anyone else...)
Fleet mark slider - grab handle is not obvious, hangs if you leave at 0. Starting point should be 1.
Contributing items - multiple selections would be vastly easier, especially for hundreds of craft items.
A fleet-assigned priority per project would be helpful, since you can have multiple open at a time.
Rock Roof Covering Map View of Some Rooms
Lack of Odjects in Ops Area in Round Glass Area
Eng. Deck Glass Windows Missing Space Exterior
Tac. Deck Could Use Less Generic Consoles
So, if you can't join a fleet - and my fleet from the Holodeck aren't coming in to test in enough numbers to create our own fleet here - I'd say the feedback I have on the Fleet System and the Starbases is negative!
Even without any fleet sampling though I can say one thing: from the emphasis being put on fleet organization (e.g. the use of 'Expertise' as a sort of currency to get 'Marks,' among other means - which all look to complicate things and change what I feel is a pretty solid system (Bridge Officer points, etc.)), it is clear that solo players are going to feel slighted, and rightly so - if you aren't in a fleet, Season 6 is going to be a lot of not much...
Fleet Commander
Caprica's Revenge
(...actually active since November 2010, which may one day be important to archaeologists, but not to anyone else...)
the ship requisition page has the rank selector not working. if you click on it it goes to the lieutenant rank and can not be changed so you can only see lt. ships.
OK logging off and back on again seems to solve it but it is annoying lol
the user formally known as kiss.my.rear.admiral
The official fleet is Cryptics Tribbles and I am a member and as of the last time I was logged in there was only 1 spot open.
I have tested out the fleet system for the last 2 days while I don't have much experience with the system like most people here the only thing I picked up on that annoyed me slightly is:
Entering any of the fleet defence or fleet pve queues then finishing finding myself in sector space, can't it run like how a character is on esd then doing an stf in KASE then reappearing on esd instead of magically appearing at kitamore system,
Also no dabo table? Come on I need a dabo table on my fleets station, I just need one I spend all my spare time that I get in game playing dabo
I just got into a test fleet and I notice that the Fleet starbase transwarp shares the same cooldown as the Sol transwarp.
I feel this might be limiting for fleetmates that are actively transwarping and have to get to their starbase for a function. I suppose this is mitigated by advanced planning, sure, but still.
I wonder if it'd be a better idea to have the Starbase Transwarp on it's own cooldown timer.
https://youtube.com/user/MyBalkanGaming
The UI is very intuitive, the learning curve was small and I was able to help complete the Teir 0 (?) Tactical Stage Objectives. It's very exciting all the difference ways you can contribute- DOffs, Expertise, Marks, and materials (Paragrine Fighters, for instance).
Hoping that more ways to contribute are unlocked at later teirs- like contributing Dilithium, Crafting, Tribbles (or for the KDF Tribble to the Bon Fire. LOL), maybe even straight up crafting materials.
Can't wait to see DOff mission open up that help the fleet grow.
Good Job all around. I love this.
In Dungeons and Dragons Online they have a similar guild housing system, but it's airships instead of star bases. What guilds would do in DDO was recruit anyone and everyone. Then, once the guild was maxed, or high enough, the guild leadership would start booting everyone, reaping all the benefits, and leaving a lot of people out in the cold with time and resources wasted.
To combat this, Turbine has it so that if the guild kicks a person from their guild, a sizable portion of their contribution is taken with them, effectively de-leveling the guild if you boot the people you took advantage of.
I feel this should be taken into real consideration, since one of the major requirements for improving a star base is processed dilithium, which is in a direct way tied to real currencies.
I don't think a refund of resources spent would be a good solution, since that can lead to the abuse of people contributing everything, getting kicked, refunded, then rejoin only to pour "free" resources into increasing the star base.
Some kind of incentive for a fleet to not use abusive recruiting practices against players who want to benefit from the perks of being in a fleet.
Hmm, an interesting design approach. I rather like the concept.