THIS IS ALL SUBJECT TO CHANGE!!! (unless you forgot what happened with the Excelsior) but better to start talking about it now than weeks from now.
Also keep in mind this ship has been in development for some time (pre-dates the new KDF ships being worked on)
Ok... here it is
Nebula
A StarCruiser variant (Its not a Retrofit. It utilizes the StarCruiser Skill).
Requires:
Rear Admiral
Weapons:
4 Fore
4 Aft
Boff seats (4 Boffs, 11 Powers):
1 Lt Tact
1 Cm Eng
1 LC Science
1 Lt Universal
Mods:
4 Eng
3 Sci
2 Tact
3 Device Slots
750 Crew
Unique Ability:
Tachyon Detection Grid: PBAoE buff that increases your, and allies w/in 10k, Starship Sensor Stat and Cloak Detection. Each buffed ally in turn will buff more allies within 10k of them - thus extending the grid.
Turn Rate = Galaxy
Any other stats not mentioned are the same as a Star Cruiser.
Screenshots attached - the second is one of the mission pod swap out configuration options
seriously!!!!!! change the commander slot to science and the lc slot eng omg!!!! we have enough cruisers Bro!!!!
Not much to add to what everyone else has said. I do think there should be a science version and a cruiser version. I cant imagine it with the same turn rate as the Galaxy class, I had always imagined it as a bit more nimble than the lumbering Galaxy class. And I'm excited about the universe slot, but I was hoping that would show up on all ships eventually and represent our first officer position. It would definitely make who we pick to fill that position more of a big deal and offer a ton of variety.
If the flood of specail ships with extra torpedoes pods that function outside of the global cooldown, more universal BO slots, etc - are implemented then Cryptic might as well just bend the Klingons over the barrel and have complete the TRIBBLE.
The Nebula is a good well thought out design that should solve one of the whines about cloaking in pvp, but to implement some other ideas in this thread would only hurt the game in its current state. Keep chasing off the Klingon fans and the only thing left for the Federation will be to play with themselves.
Kill the drama here, this is so overwrought and unnecessary.
And why are you asking in the forums for people to balance the ships? This is about the worst idea, the game designers should be designing and testing for balance and then tweaking as needed based on actual testing.
Making decisions by committee isn't always a good thing. I'm not saying don't listen but I wouldn't follow someone who just did whatever the loudest section of the crowd says. That may work on The Price Is Right but perhaps this approach should be rethought for STO.
This is how there is such nonsense as the T5 Excelsior having the same power as a ship built 100 years later when they were shown getting absolutely melted in the Dominion War 35 years ago (STO-timeline wise).
Indeed, if you want to see how the community "balances" things, try downloading a few ships for Bridge Commander. I mean, seriously. People make things with a thousand torpedo launchers and enough firepower to obliterate the most powerful stock ships in the game in less than 2 seconds.
People have no idea how to make things in a balanced manner. Some of us have actually MADE games in the past, and have a bit more insight into this, but it's hard to separate the knowledgable from the ignorant.
Hmm i was thinking about this earlier and i've decided to make my own little suggestion in regards to set up, (Btw i don't think most people will actually like the set up, and alot might complain or call it TRIBBLE but here it is anyway)
My suggestion is instead of making it any one specific ship type i.e science or cruiser etc, make it into an extra ship line that has a combination of all 3 factors to go in line with the general multi purpose role of this vessel.
Nebula
Affected by any of the RA Ship skills with a 10% penalty (So if your a tactical captain with points in assault cruiser those points also go towards this vessel but are 10% less affective, same with cruiser and science)
Turn Rate 12 (Half way between Escort and Sci Vessel manouverability but much higher than cruiser as lets face it its about 1/3 as large) (I think this value is correct i'm not in game atm so can't check sorry)
Hull: 32,500
Impulse Modifier: .15
Inertia: 25
Now the thinking behind this is that it has weakness across the board as its a more multi-purpose vessel, so it wouldn't have Target subsystems, or bonus to power systems,
however it would have better turn rate than cruiser or sci, and only slightly less than escort
Also it would have better armor than escort or sci but worse than Cruiser
And a shared amount of mod slots to represent again its multi purpose role
Now alot of these weakness i believe would be made up by the 4 Universal Slots allowing greater flexibility
So i think with this set up the ship would be a good workable ship, without being either underpowered or over powered and would help the ship be more useful to all types of captains and give extra flexibility across the tier 5 range and would keep the ship true to its Multi-Role heritage.
Also i'd possibly be willing to consider if people thought it would be too underpowered dps wise to give it the ability to mount cannons, but then i'd think that would make it too OP, but perhaps not i don't know nearly enough to say =]
Feedback is welcomed and looked for as always so roll on guys and gals lets hear it =]
And why are you asking in the forums for people to balance the ships? This is about the worst idea, the game designers should be designing and testing for balance and then tweaking as needed based on actual testing.
While I agree that game testing and balance should be internal first, I believe Dan was merely sharing the plans and communicating with the community in lieu of closed development of the past. He's not asking us to debate and balance the design for him. He's just sharing and possibly looking at feedback.
Indeed, if you want to see how the community "balances" things, try downloading a few ships for Bridge Commander. I mean, seriously. People make things with a thousand torpedo launchers and enough firepower to obliterate the most powerful stock ships in the game in less than 2 seconds.
People have no idea how to make things in a balanced manner. Some of us have actually MADE games in the past, and have a bit more insight into this, but it's hard to separate the knowledgable from the ignorant.
^ THIS
Some of those uberships on BCFiles were completely out of hand. I really don't want to see this game go the same way but it looks like the forums are turning the tide.
Please someone apply the brakes of reason. This thread can't possibly be yielding any good data besides what everyone would do in their own situation as Master of the Universe...someone just posted all Universal slots on the Nebula. :rolleyes:
Please someone apply the brakes of reason. This thread can't possibly be yielding any good data besides what everyone would do in their own situation as Master of the Universe...someone just posted all Universal slots on the Nebula. :rolleyes:
I dunno, I think this thread has been filled with a lot of good data and educated theory guessing that the devs can go over and agree with/laugh at... Don't let the odd bad apple who wants the UBAR ship of UBAR'ness fool you into thinking that every suggestion has been like that
Just release both the dStahl spec'ed cruiser and Gecko mentioned sci-ship with different dorsal pods -- both with better turn rates -- and call it a day. Tactical can come after Klingon stuff 'round New Years. Maybe the cruiser gets an area effect torpedo point defense and tactical gets a super turret on cool down instead of the detection special ability.
Be nice if they could share the same name and number on a single character to portray the same ship outfitted differently.
If I had to choose between the two variants that were given to us then the cruiser is easliy the way to go although I would still suggest evening up the consoles to 3 Eng, 3 Tac, 3 Science.
Is there any update from the dev's current thought process over this and everything that has been discussed?
well i must say this is interesting. It is a good ship that can go either way. its a cruiser with a science feel to it science feild to it. you can have a lt in science or for an engineer you can have a lt helpnig u out. The BO slots are well done.
I would have to say no to that futuristic design, its horrid. please do not do to the nebula what you did to the galaxy. for instance make the nacels sleeker in that futuristic option. make the tripod circular and not jagged edge. starfleet is about smoothness and modern design not roughness. The federation ship where made to look impressive by human standards and not look threatening. that variant is bad work in design. do not use parts from an escort ship as the pod. get creative or just ask your humble subscribers for help in this manner.
I would have to say no to that futuristic design, its horrid. please do not do to the nebula what you did to the galaxy. for instance make the nacels sleeker in that futuristic option. make the tripod circular and not jagged edge. starfleet is about smoothness and modern design not roughness. The federation ship where made to look impressive by human standards and not look threatening. that variant is bad work in design. do not use parts from an escort ship as the pod. get creative or just ask your humble subscribers for help in this manner.
I disagree, partially. I think if they have alternative design parts and options it will appeal to a wider audience. Some people actually like piloting modern "concept" looking ships. Is it canon? No. Is it true-to-shows aesthetically? No. But if we follow that line of reasoning then we might as well restrict all federation players to equipping nothing but phasers as their energy weapons. It's an ideal concept to stay close to canon, but compromises must be made in a video game. This is one we should learn to live with.
So it looks to me that if we want a tactical advantage on the federation side, it won't be our skills, equipment, or setup of our character. It seems to me that we HAVE to buy a ship for 1200+ CP in order to be successful on this game...And here I thought the C-Store was focusing on cosmetic things after the Galaxy-X fiasco......Yeah.......I thought wrong apparently...This is unacceptable....The ship will overpower my Sovereign, well, anybody's sovereign.....So it's 1200+ CP meaning that I have to fork out $14.00 (well this amount roughly because CP are not available in increments such as that...if memory serves properly)....What, they aren't making enough from subscriptions?....imagine that....
Thanks for making the Nebula a cruiser! I will definetly be replacing my Star Cruiser with it. Nebulas have always been my favorite Fed ship. I cant wait! When is its ETA?
Great more OP'd C-store stuff. Awesome STO has gone from L2P to L2B to become good. A uni LT slot, really. The rest of the T5 ships minus the Excelsior are rotting on the vine until "they" decide it is time to fix BOff layout. The game already is becoming a ghost town so I guess cryptic and the OP'd ship proponents win another one. This ship along with the Excelsior should have been released with a patch that fixed all Boff layouts not before.
Great more OP'd C-store stuff. Awesome STO has gone from L2P to L2B to become good. A uni LT slot, really. The rest of the T5 ships minus the Excelsior are rotting on the vine until "they" decide it is time to fix BOff layout. The game already is becoming a ghost town so I guess cryptic and the OP'd ship proponents win another one. This ship along with the Excelsior should have been released with a patch that fixed all Boff layouts not before.
Apparently the addition of a LTC tac spot will allow it to outgun a Sovereign...although it has the turn rate of a Galaxy...Come on, anybody can get a fleetie to train a BO for HY3 or another LTC tac skill...lol. It is an older ship, a refit as it were...and as such should be subject to the same setbacks as the Galaxy refit, defiant, and intrepid....
It has a tactical power to detect cloaked vessels, which until now were the sole domain of Science vessels. I still say it should be in the same setup of a galaxy refit...
As far as I know there are 2 people working on ships...As far as I know they haven't finished the Klingon ships...and therefore to get this out can only focus on one project at a time...If you want to see promises, Stahl said Klink ships would be out in August, now its October...so, you figure that SOMETHING happened..and it aint CBS...lol.
I'm on board with the suggestion that the ship exist in 3 different variations; one each for Engineering, Science, and Tactical Captains. This just strikes me as the best way to represent the ship's multi-role capability.
So they have been planning this for a long time and it should have been out a long time ago. None of the promises etc for more klingon ships were even bought up b4 this poll.
Special Ability-Deployables have FULL Impulse (kicks in after they are 10k away from carrier, kicks off when they are within 10 km) and have Controls.
-attack selected target-(self explanatory)
-defend selected target-Shield Repair Drones will heal the Shields of target, all other deployables will attack the target of your target unless given a new command
-Return to ship-cancels previous commands, deployables return to the VoQuv
Comments
seriously!!!!!! change the commander slot to science and the lc slot eng omg!!!! we have enough cruisers Bro!!!!
And why are you asking in the forums for people to balance the ships? This is about the worst idea, the game designers should be designing and testing for balance and then tweaking as needed based on actual testing.
Making decisions by committee isn't always a good thing. I'm not saying don't listen but I wouldn't follow someone who just did whatever the loudest section of the crowd says. That may work on The Price Is Right but perhaps this approach should be rethought for STO.
This is how there is such nonsense as the T5 Excelsior having the same power as a ship built 100 years later when they were shown getting absolutely melted in the Dominion War 35 years ago (STO-timeline wise).
People have no idea how to make things in a balanced manner. Some of us have actually MADE games in the past, and have a bit more insight into this, but it's hard to separate the knowledgable from the ignorant.
My suggestion is instead of making it any one specific ship type i.e science or cruiser etc, make it into an extra ship line that has a combination of all 3 factors to go in line with the general multi purpose role of this vessel.
Nebula
Affected by any of the RA Ship skills with a 10% penalty (So if your a tactical captain with points in assault cruiser those points also go towards this vessel but are 10% less affective, same with cruiser and science)
Requires
Rear Admiral
Weapons
3 Fore
3 Aft
Boff Seats
1 LT Universal
1 CM Universal
1 LC Universal
1 LT Universal
Mods
3 Eng
3 Tact
3 Sci
3 Device Slots
750 Crew
Turn Rate 12 (Half way between Escort and Sci Vessel manouverability but much higher than cruiser as lets face it its about 1/3 as large) (I think this value is correct i'm not in game atm so can't check sorry)
Hull: 32,500
Impulse Modifier: .15
Inertia: 25
Now the thinking behind this is that it has weakness across the board as its a more multi-purpose vessel, so it wouldn't have Target subsystems, or bonus to power systems,
however it would have better turn rate than cruiser or sci, and only slightly less than escort
Also it would have better armor than escort or sci but worse than Cruiser
And a shared amount of mod slots to represent again its multi purpose role
Now alot of these weakness i believe would be made up by the 4 Universal Slots allowing greater flexibility
So i think with this set up the ship would be a good workable ship, without being either underpowered or over powered and would help the ship be more useful to all types of captains and give extra flexibility across the tier 5 range and would keep the ship true to its Multi-Role heritage.
Also i'd possibly be willing to consider if people thought it would be too underpowered dps wise to give it the ability to mount cannons, but then i'd think that would make it too OP, but perhaps not i don't know nearly enough to say =]
Feedback is welcomed and looked for as always so roll on guys and gals lets hear it =]
Terra~
While I agree that game testing and balance should be internal first, I believe Dan was merely sharing the plans and communicating with the community in lieu of closed development of the past. He's not asking us to debate and balance the design for him. He's just sharing and possibly looking at feedback.
As frustrating as this style of feedback process may be, it's all they have.
^ THIS
Some of those uberships on BCFiles were completely out of hand. I really don't want to see this game go the same way but it looks like the forums are turning the tide.
Please someone apply the brakes of reason. This thread can't possibly be yielding any good data besides what everyone would do in their own situation as Master of the Universe...someone just posted all Universal slots on the Nebula. :rolleyes:
I dunno, I think this thread has been filled with a lot of good data and educated theory guessing that the devs can go over and agree with/laugh at... Don't let the odd bad apple who wants the UBAR ship of UBAR'ness fool you into thinking that every suggestion has been like that
That's the sole reason dstahl started the thread, the Excelsior info wasn't given till a day or two before it hit live.
Be nice if they could share the same name and number on a single character to portray the same ship outfitted differently.
I should browse the forums more often.
Is there any update from the dev's current thought process over this and everything that has been discussed?
I would have to say no to that futuristic design, its horrid. please do not do to the nebula what you did to the galaxy. for instance make the nacels sleeker in that futuristic option. make the tripod circular and not jagged edge. starfleet is about smoothness and modern design not roughness. The federation ship where made to look impressive by human standards and not look threatening. that variant is bad work in design. do not use parts from an escort ship as the pod. get creative or just ask your humble subscribers for help in this manner.
these types of design are okay too
http://www.trekmania.net/art/nebvariants.jpg
http://memory-gamma.wikia.com/wiki/File:Nebula2.png
I disagree, partially. I think if they have alternative design parts and options it will appeal to a wider audience. Some people actually like piloting modern "concept" looking ships. Is it canon? No. Is it true-to-shows aesthetically? No. But if we follow that line of reasoning then we might as well restrict all federation players to equipping nothing but phasers as their energy weapons. It's an ideal concept to stay close to canon, but compromises must be made in a video game. This is one we should learn to live with.
yeah...see?...someone actually gets it....
No ships were pushed back to get this ship out...
Do research then make statements.
Apparently the addition of a LTC tac spot will allow it to outgun a Sovereign...although it has the turn rate of a Galaxy...Come on, anybody can get a fleetie to train a BO for HY3 or another LTC tac skill...lol. It is an older ship, a refit as it were...and as such should be subject to the same setbacks as the Galaxy refit, defiant, and intrepid....
It has a tactical power to detect cloaked vessels, which until now were the sole domain of Science vessels. I still say it should be in the same setup of a galaxy refit...
As far as I know there are 2 people working on ships...As far as I know they haven't finished the Klingon ships...and therefore to get this out can only focus on one project at a time...If you want to see promises, Stahl said Klink ships would be out in August, now its October...so, you figure that SOMETHING happened..and it aint CBS...lol.
Exactly. It should be a cruiser. It can be science based, sure, but a cruiser it should be.
http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=157662
So they have been planning this for a long time and it should have been out a long time ago. None of the promises etc for more klingon ships were even bought up b4 this poll.
Weapons- 3 Fore, 4 Aft
BOFF Seats-Lt Tac, Lt Cmdr Eng, Lt Cmdr Sci, Cmdr Sci
Consoles- 4 Sci, 2 Tac, 3 Eng
Device slot-4
Crew-4.5k
Turn Rate-4Deg/sec
Special Ability-Deployables have FULL Impulse (kicks in after they are 10k away from carrier, kicks off when they are within 10 km) and have Controls.
-attack selected target-(self explanatory)
-defend selected target-Shield Repair Drones will heal the Shields of target, all other deployables will attack the target of your target unless given a new command
-Return to ship-cancels previous commands, deployables return to the VoQuv