Lol....I know....used to a be WoW player long time ago and stopped playing b/c of the all the "important" raids. So yeah, got boring real fast.
As or the whiners, I used play paladins in the early years of WoW. When the nerf bat came several times, well....the whiners came out of the woodwork.
Followed by the rogues for not being able to kill fast enough then the mages begin too squishy and the priest no being able to do dmg or the warriors wine about losing armor to paladins because of Wisdom is on it.
The true whining was the which class got what gear from raids or general instances, which eventually lead the devs to strip down many items into more "specific" class, of course this lead to more whining about missing stats or who benefit more.
Sadly...whining takes over the mmo and eventually the world.....:D
Later.
PS. People whine just sake of whining, because if they do, they lose the spotlight for attention.
Well, aside from that's what they teach in Marketing 101, there were representatives on the forums who were answering questions people asked. One of the questions was whether the uniform would ever be obtainable any other way.
Did anyone have the intelligence to ask "will it ever be available by other means?" or "does 'exclusive' and 'unique' mean that it will never, ever be able to be purchased by anyone else in the future"?
At the time, it wasn't available anywhere else, so what they posted was correct. You misinterpreted what was posted based on what you wanted to hear, not what was intended.
This is no different than a new movie being "only in theatres" when it's first released. Does that mean it will never be on DVD and PPV??
This is no different than Disney encouraging you to buy Cinderella on DVD now because it will "go back into the vault forever" ... forever meaning until the next big shopping season.
Did our blind optimism in Cryptic set us up for a fall? You may have a solid point there. We did let trust get in the way of our decision process. Which, from what I can see, is exactly the point Metallurgist was trying to make. We are indeed learning from our mistakes.
You can start learning by accepting responsibility for your actions.
Did anyone have the intelligence to ask "will it ever be available by other means?" or "does 'exclusive' and 'unique' mean that it will never, ever be able to be purchased by anyone else in the future"?
At the time, it wasn't available anywhere else, so what they posted was correct. You misinterpreted what was posted based on what you wanted to hear, not what was intended.
This is no different than a new movie being "only in theatres" when it's first released. Does that mean it will never be on DVD and PPV??
This is no different than Disney encouraging you to buy Cinderella on DVD now because it will "go back into the vault forever" ... forever meaning until the next big shopping season.
Lol...they say it will be put "go back to the vault" never said "forever". The movie is reintroduced later as new because of better technology or added features...ie, blue-ryu. HD TV channels or some other form.
I'm fairly new to MMOs, so I'm not as familiar with "the QQ," as my friends call it, but people need to calm down. The word "exclusive" in gaming especially refers to something time limited. It's true for console exclusive games that come out for other systems months later simply because game companies want to make money. They make money by selling things, and cordoning off part of their potential customer base doesn't make sense. These "exclusivity" deals are just as a sort of political partnership (like between game company X and Sony/Microsoft/Gamestop), or to promote consumers buying a product they might be more excited about at launch, when it will make the company the most money. Metallurgist seems to understand this, but still be disappointed that it happened "too soon." It is indeed pretty soon, but I don't understand how the level of disappointment scales with time.
The way I see it, my preorder got me certain costumes. I preordered because I wanted those bonuses. Paying extra for the collector's edition gets me other bonuses. The bonus you get is having something extra, not ensuring that someone else can't. I used to work at Gamestop (ugh), and often there would be pre-order bonuses, which in those days were usually just posters, shirts, or hats. In the case of an unpopular game that got few pre-orders, the extra swag would just be given away after release to buyers. Does it make sense for someone who pre-ordered, and got their t-shirt demand that someone who did not pre-order be denied a shirt to somehow artificially make the shirt they own more "rare" and "special"?
I think MMOs often have us think in terms of scarcity/value-- if everyone has purple gear, suddenly it's less valuable for everyone else who has it. Other people having Borg Tribbles or DS9 costumes doesn't mean you don't get to have them anymore, this isn't some crazy zero-sum game. It seems like sometimes MMO players get hung up on things like exclusivity, optional microtransactions, and the dreaded "lack of content." Ultimately, those things miss the point: either you are having fun playing the game, and it is worth your money, or it isn't, and you should quit. My experience is not changed one bit by other people having the option to buy the one thing I got with my pre-order, and so I have trouble understanding some of the indignation at being "bamboozled by crafty marketing lies".
You sir are clearly too level-headed to be an MMO forum poster.
No, sorry, but ridicule is always a red herring and is never a valid response to an argument as it contributes nothing to the point at hand. Also, what are you ridiculing exactly? Trust has been lost, you take issue with that? Too bad. Pretending like people have lost trust in Cryptic doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
No, ridicule is not always a red herring, and is in fact valid, especially when discussants like yourself repeatedly argue from emotion. I can contribute nothing to the discussion because I would have to accept your blatantly false principles as somehow reasonable, which they are not.
Did our blind optimism in Cryptic set us up for a fall? You may have a solid point there. We did let trust get in the way of our decision process. Which, from what I can see, is exactly the point Metallurgist was trying to make. We are indeed learning from our mistakes.
Thank you, that's pretty much exactly what I've been saying. Although what's amusing is the number of people who think I've "got my panties in a bunch", am "being a cry baby" and various other unhelpful things. I've made no demands. Only pointed out that today - technically yesterday now - customer loyalty has gone down hill a bit.
This is exactly my point, except it's not "blind optimism": a much more accurate term would be "self-delusion" or "determination to interpret something in the way that most benefits me." Those are your mistakes, not this so-called "trust" in a company to fulfill your sense of entitlement.
Ok, so having been refuted at a number of stages and in a number of threads, you now wish to claim that you "only" wanted to say that customer loyalty has "gone downhill." Now, if by "gone downhill" you mean that a few self-deluding people were shocked to learn that Cryptic was not formed to cater to their wishes, then yes, it has. But if you mean anything else by it, you are prima facie wrong. And again, since this is the essential foundation of your argument, and you are determined to maintain it no matter how many times it is disproved, the only proper response is ridicule.
*]The unique Mirror Universe Uniform for STO. (Now a $3.50 value)
For the next MMO, make sure you advertise these items exactly like this, because this is exactly what they are. Anything less is being intellectually dishonest. It isn't illegal to mislead people, nor are there any major consequences when you intentionally do so, but it is still wrong. If you really feel that it is ok, to hide behind fine print, might's and maybe's, you need to rethink what 'ok' means.
In any case, I'll remain avoiding playing the game as it now stands, and you'll remain happily counting the money you've made off of me. I, like the OP, am now "much less likely to buy lifetime again". With the addendum that I am also one more person that you really don't want to be asked by others if they 'should' buy a lifetime account.
I won't be saying you're the devil (so don't get all strawman on me, like you've been doing to others), but I will advise based on history and will be very sure they go into anything with the assumption that Cryptic will act exactly as they have acted.
I'm fairly new to MMOs, so I'm not as familiar with "the QQ," as my friends call it, but people need to calm down. The word "exclusive" in gaming especially refers to something time limited. It's true for console exclusive games that come out for other systems months later simply because game companies want to make money. They make money by selling things, and cordoning off part of their potential customer base doesn't make sense. These "exclusivity" deals are just as a sort of political partnership (like between game company X and Sony/Microsoft/Gamestop), or to promote consumers buying a product they might be more excited about at launch, when it will make the company the most money. Metallurgist seems to understand this, but still be disappointed that it happened "too soon." It is indeed pretty soon, but I don't understand how the level of disappointment scales with time.
The way I see it, my preorder got me certain costumes. I preordered because I wanted those bonuses. Paying extra for the collector's edition gets me other bonuses. The bonus you get is having something extra, not ensuring that someone else can't. I used to work at Gamestop (ugh), and often there would be pre-order bonuses, which in those days were usually just posters, shirts, or hats. In the case of an unpopular game that got few pre-orders, the extra swag would just be given away after release to buyers. Does it make sense for someone who pre-ordered, and got their t-shirt demand that someone who did not pre-order be denied a shirt to somehow artificially make the shirt they own more "rare" and "special"?
I think MMOs often have us think in terms of scarcity/value-- if everyone has purple gear, suddenly it's less valuable for everyone else who has it. Other people having Borg Tribbles or DS9 costumes doesn't mean you don't get to have them anymore, this isn't some crazy zero-sum game. It seems like sometimes MMO players get hung up on things like exclusivity, optional microtransactions, and the dreaded "lack of content." Ultimately, those things miss the point: either you are having fun playing the game, and it is worth your money, or it isn't, and you should quit. My experience is not changed one bit by other people having the option to buy the one thing I got with my pre-order, and so I have trouble understanding some of the indignation at being "bamboozled by crafty marketing lies".
This is an excellent argument, thanks for posting it. What you see here is a discussion that started several days ago when people pointed out exactly what you are stating here. Unfortunately, there are a few, like Metallurgist, who wish to maintain a sense of righteous indignation that is unfounded. It rather obviously boils down to a sense of entitlement that some people simply refuse to give up.
i don't think that the fact these items come to c-store is the problem. its the price difference.
people paid lots of $$$ to get these items and now they are there up for grabs.
if they told them that those items would be there on c-store in june for a few dollars nobody would have bothered buying the pre-order items.
i don't think that the fact these items come to c-store is the problem. its the price difference.
people paid lots of $$$ to get these items and now they are there up for grabs.
if they told them that those items would be there on c-store in june for a few dollars nobody would have bothered buying the pre-order items.
i think that's why they feel cheated.
Don't bother all you will get back is that the customers fault for not knowing and they will link to the faq yet again
i don't think that the fact these items come to c-store is the problem. its the price difference.
people paid lots of $$$ to get these items and now they are there up for grabs.
No, the problem is a select few have lost their elitism.
if they told them that those items would be there on c-store in june for a few dollars nobody would have bothered buying the pre-order items.
Not true at all. The "must have NAO!!!!!" crowd would still buy them and will continue to do so as new specials are offered.
This is an excellent argument, thanks for posting it. What you see here is a discussion that started several days ago when people pointed out exactly what you are stating here. Unfortunately, there are a few, like Metallurgist, who wish to maintain a sense of righteous indignation that is unfounded. It rather obviously boils down to a sense of entitlement that some people simply refuse to give up.
That's what it's all about in a nutshell. Would it be cool to have these items forever exclusive??? Sure, but that's NOT WHAT YOU PAID FOR! If you did pay that much money for a uniform...wow...
i don't think that the fact these items come to c-store is the problem. its the price difference.
people paid lots of $$$ to get these items and now they are there up for grabs.
if they told them that those items would be there on c-store in june for a few dollars nobody would have bothered buying the pre-order items.
i think that's why they feel cheated.
But they didn't. They paid for a lifetime membership. They got the costumes as a free bonus. And while it's possible that some might have bought the lifetime membership solely for the bonus items that still doesn't mean they paid for them.
i don't think that the fact these items come to c-store is the problem. its the price difference.
people paid lots of $$$ to get these items and now they are there up for grabs.
if they told them that those items would be there on c-store in june for a few dollars nobody would have bothered buying the pre-order items.
i think that's why they feel cheated.
People got EXACTLY what they paid for! I got the LS for my money, they gave me the Lib Borg Officer and a bonus. When they offer my bonus on the C-Store I'm not losing anything...I STILL HAVE MY LIFETIME SUB!! If people paid LS money to get some exclusive items without reading the fine print...shame on them.
For the next MMO, make sure you advertise these items exactly like this, because this is exactly what they are. Anything less is being intellectually dishonest. It isn't illegal to mislead people, nor are there any major consequences when you intentionally do so, but it is still wrong. If you really feel that it is ok, to hide behind fine print, might's and maybe's, you need to rethink what 'ok' means.
In any case, I'll remain avoiding playing the game as it now stands, and you'll remain happily counting the money you've made off of me. I, like the OP, am now "much less likely to buy lifetime again". With the addendum that I am also one more person that you really don't want to be asked by others if they 'should' buy a lifetime account.
I won't be saying you're the devil (so don't get all strawman on me, like you've been doing to others), but I will advise based on history and will be very sure they go into anything with the assumption that Cryptic will act exactly as they have acted.
Just to be clear you DID get the actual thing you bought, a lifetime account. Every other thing is bonus, you pay for game access and get some goodies.
But they didn't. They paid for a lifetime membership. They got the costumes as a free bonus. And while it's possible that some might have bought the lifetime membership solely for the bonus items that still doesn't mean they paid for them.
Incorrect. What they sold were packages. The subscription was part of the package, but not the entirety of it.
Limited-Time Subscription Deals!
We're very excited to announce two special subscription packages available for purchase for a limited-time! Both of these offers are only going to be around until supplies last, so sign up while you still can. Below are the details for both the lifetime and 6-month subscription packages.
That's what it's all about in a nutshell. Would it be cool to have these items forever exclusive??? Sure, but that's NOT WHAT YOU PAID FOR! If you did pay that much money for a uniform...wow...
Yes. If a person purchases a car in order to get the nifty air freshener, there's nothing to stop them because they are well within their rights to do so. And there's nothing wrong with the dealer listing the air freshener as part of the package.
What we have here is some people who purchased a car, and are currently driving it around, but claim that they really only wanted the air freshener.
Is it the dealer's responsibility to tell the buyer that he or she is buying the car for the wrong reason?
My friend and I bought our preorders from Amazon only because of the Borg BO exclusive. I've never ordered my games from Amazon before, I usually get them at Game Stop. If I had known they weren't really exclusive, I probably would have bought my game at Game Stop like I usually do. It's no big deal and I'm not upset or anything. I'm just glad I didn't dish out more money for the DDE too for those bonus items like I was tempted to do.
During the preorder period, a lot of people on the forums were talking about buying multiple preorders from different sources for different exclusive items. It was everyone's understanding that the stuff that was explicitly advertised as "exclusive" would not be offered anywhere else, at any other time. Some items said exclusive and some did not. Everyone thought the "exlusive" items were a one-time deal and everything else might wind up in the C-store.
"Exclusive" does not normally mean: :"not exclusive", "temporarily exclusive", or "exclusive until we want more cash". Exclusive does not normally mean: only right now, for one hour, for one day, for one month, or for four months only.
I don't know how many people bought multiple preorders for the items but I feel bad for those who did. I do think they're entitled to a refund for those extra copies.
Subscription and access to the game forever = $196.50
Mirror Universe Uniform = $3.50
That's the reality of it.
Thats the current reality of it. And the main source of my objection. The items on that package did not have separated cash values associated with them at time of purchase. Because it was not possible to purchase them separately.
Incorrect. What they sold were packages. The subscription was part of the package, but not the entirety of it.
Well, of course they were sold packages: that's what a package is. Would you prefer to call them something else? How about "Collection of incentives that are bundled in a non-packaged manner with the item for sale"?
You want to argue that "package" means that all of the items included necessarily have some sort of equivalent value, but it does not. I bought a computer and received a sticker: the sticker is part of the package. But to say I paid for the sticker and not for the computer is my delusion, and the company has no obligation to tell me that my reasons for buying are wrong.
You paid $199 for a Lifetime Subscription to Champions Online. You never have to pay to play that game again.
You also received for free:
A guaranteed slot into the closed beta for Star Trek Online. (I know, I know, but let's not go there please)
The unique Mirror Universe Uniform for STO. (Now a $3.50 value)
The Art Deco Set (Still exclusive only to lifetime and 6 month pre-order subs from CO)
The Retro Future Set (Still exclusive, only to LT subs for CO)
And the Foxbat Action Figure (Still Exclusive to LT subs for CO)
There's still alot of exclusivity in that package, and you don't have to pay a sub fee for Champs ever again. And in 4 more months, you will essentially be playing for free if you consider the average $14.99 sub cost there (Assuming you still play, and if not, I suggest taking a peek again. Some exciting stuff happening over there!).
It's still a value, and it still has many exclusive bonuses associated with it.
I understand why you're saying what you are. However, the bonus items were just that, bonuses, or incentives, and they were exclusive for a time. What you paid for when you bought the Champions Online Lifetime Sub, and the Star Trek Online Lifetime Sub were the ability to play those games for the life of the game, and never have to pay for those games again.
You'll be able to play both of those games for years to come, and to me, that's where the value of the Lifetime Sub lies. It's not in the Mirror Universe Uniform perk, the Liberated Borg Species, or any other special perk.
Meanwhile, lots of other players were wanting some of those items, and missed out on the opportunity to get them. We feel that allowing those players the opportunity to get them is a good thing.
Thanks,
Stormshade
Yah but dont you guys realize by doing this you guys have shot yourselvs in the foot. Every time you launch a game, your pre order sales are now going to be way way down. Because you have given yourselves the bad name of giving away the exclusives. so whats the point? Hell i now some people that bought the co sub that done even play that failure for a game. Why play co when coh is so much better, sorry to say it but it is. You guys need to realize you want to keep your customer base happy, yes you have buy making these items exclusive to now eveyone, but you have screwed yourselves over for furure sales of future games, because the bonus's as you now put them not exclusives will never be worth the fue extra bucks if you can just buy them in the c store.
"Exclusive" does not normally mean: :"not exclusive", "temporarily exclusive", or "exclusive until we want more cash". Exclusive does not normally mean: only right now, for one hour, for one day, for one month, or for four months only.
Incorrect: the word exclusive does not imply any time other than the time in which it is used.
If I sell you something today as exclusive only to you, while at the same time I sell it to another person, then I have misled you and broken our contract, and you are entitled to compensation.
However, if I sold it to you a month ago as exclusive only to you, but now decide to sell it to others, you have no legitimate complaint. It was exclusive at the time, and therefore I kept my part of the contract.
This is why, in actual contracts, the word exclusive is modified by some kind of time constraint.
Now, having said all that, I do feel bad for those who paid so much for their different copies, because the amount of time they had to enjoy their exclusivity seems short. That does seem unfair to me. But it does not mean that they are entitled to any kind of compensation.
I understand why you're saying what you are. However, the bonus items were just that, bonuses, or incentives, and they were exclusive for a time. What you paid for when you bought the Champions Online Lifetime Sub, and the Star Trek Online Lifetime Sub were the ability to play those games for the life of the game, and never have to pay for those games again.
You'll be able to play both of those games for years to come, and to me, that's where the value of the Lifetime Sub lies. It's not in the Mirror Universe Uniform perk, the Liberated Borg Species, or any other special perk.
Meanwhile, lots of other players were wanting some of those items, and missed out on the opportunity to get them. We feel that allowing those players the opportunity to get them is a good thing.
Thanks,
Stormshade
While I can relate to your position, you guys should have gone out of your way to avoid even the appearance of impropriety with the offers when using the words "exclusive" and "limited time" given the general understanding of those words with regards to point of purchase sales.
It would not have hurt you to have used the expression "exclusive for a limited time" as a single thing would it ? I think not. Unless someone there figured that doing so would cause people to change their mind about purchasing things at a premium and acquiring multiple licenses and if that was the case then you know you guys done wrong. It was bad enough there were so many packages offered in the first place and when people asked about things if memory serves we were lead to believe things were set in stone incentive wise.
Anyway fortunately for me, I was informed about your company practices prior to my purchase of STO. Consequently, I canceled several box orders and simply dumped some money into the cash shop waiting for this day to happen. Nonetheless I have purchased nearly everything offered and will get the rest of the stuff after the next major update.
However I do feel bad for those that purchased several licenses and even the made the big investment into your other property with no interest in it at all solely for access the sexy uniforms which I just purchased for some token amount.
My feeling or dare I say position, is not about epeen, entitlement or other such lame TRIBBLE things as some are proposing as red herring and ad homonym arguments against those upset by this move. My feeling comes from a clear sense of violation of integrity and weak ethos and pathos on the part of your company with regards to its business practices.
That's also the reality at the time you bought it.
It was not. It had no separate value. It your perception of what it was worth, which is fair. Others percieved it as having greater value than you did, some less.
You want to argue that "package" means that all of the items included necessarily have some sort of equivalent value, but it does not. I bought a computer and received a sticker: the sticker is part of the package. But to say I paid for the sticker and not for the computer is my delusion, and the company has no obligation to tell me that my reasons for buying are wrong.
Incorrect. The sticker was not listed as one of the options of the package. It was just given to you. But the monitor was listed. But not the best analogy, since I never bought a computer where the items included weren't given a price breakdown before package discount.
Regardless, I was not arguing that all items have equivalent value. Just that all items were sold together and not 'freebies' like people keep insisting.
Yah but dont you guys realize by doing this you guys have shot yourselvs in the foot. Every time you launch a game, your pre order sales are now going to be way way down. Because you have given yourselves the bad name of giving away the exclusives. so whats the point? Hell i now some people that bought the co sub that done even play that failure for a game. Why play co when coh is so much better, sorry to say it but it is. You guys need to realize you want to keep your customer base happy, yes you have buy making these items exclusive to now eveyone, but you have screwed yourselves over for furure sales of future games, because the bonus's as you now put them not exclusives will never be worth the fue extra bucks if you can just buy them in the c store.
Most likely their pre-order sales will not drop appreciably because people buy the pre-orders to have the bonuses first. At least, that's what the rational ones do. There have been more than enough pre-order/lifetime people coming in here to explain the foolishness of assuming somehow you paid $200 for a uniform or that "exclusive" meant for all time.
Comments
Lol....I know....used to a be WoW player long time ago and stopped playing b/c of the all the "important" raids. So yeah, got boring real fast.
As or the whiners, I used play paladins in the early years of WoW. When the nerf bat came several times, well....the whiners came out of the woodwork.
Followed by the rogues for not being able to kill fast enough then the mages begin too squishy and the priest no being able to do dmg or the warriors wine about losing armor to paladins because of Wisdom is on it.
The true whining was the which class got what gear from raids or general instances, which eventually lead the devs to strip down many items into more "specific" class, of course this lead to more whining about missing stats or who benefit more.
Sadly...whining takes over the mmo and eventually the world.....:D
Later.
PS. People whine just sake of whining, because if they do, they lose the spotlight for attention.
Did anyone have the intelligence to ask "will it ever be available by other means?" or "does 'exclusive' and 'unique' mean that it will never, ever be able to be purchased by anyone else in the future"?
At the time, it wasn't available anywhere else, so what they posted was correct. You misinterpreted what was posted based on what you wanted to hear, not what was intended.
This is no different than a new movie being "only in theatres" when it's first released. Does that mean it will never be on DVD and PPV??
This is no different than Disney encouraging you to buy Cinderella on DVD now because it will "go back into the vault forever" ... forever meaning until the next big shopping season.
You can start learning by accepting responsibility for your actions.
Lol...they say it will be put "go back to the vault" never said "forever". The movie is reintroduced later as new because of better technology or added features...ie, blue-ryu. HD TV channels or some other form.
Later. :cool:
You sir are clearly too level-headed to be an MMO forum poster.
You just dont GET it man. These little digital items people have, their so...PRECIOUS!
This is exactly my point, except it's not "blind optimism": a much more accurate term would be "self-delusion" or "determination to interpret something in the way that most benefits me." Those are your mistakes, not this so-called "trust" in a company to fulfill your sense of entitlement.
Ok, so having been refuted at a number of stages and in a number of threads, you now wish to claim that you "only" wanted to say that customer loyalty has "gone downhill." Now, if by "gone downhill" you mean that a few self-deluding people were shocked to learn that Cryptic was not formed to cater to their wishes, then yes, it has. But if you mean anything else by it, you are prima facie wrong. And again, since this is the essential foundation of your argument, and you are determined to maintain it no matter how many times it is disproved, the only proper response is ridicule.
Not according to forum rules. Which I'm certain you've read, being an educated consumer.
In any case, I'll remain avoiding playing the game as it now stands, and you'll remain happily counting the money you've made off of me. I, like the OP, am now "much less likely to buy lifetime again". With the addendum that I am also one more person that you really don't want to be asked by others if they 'should' buy a lifetime account.
I won't be saying you're the devil (so don't get all strawman on me, like you've been doing to others), but I will advise based on history and will be very sure they go into anything with the assumption that Cryptic will act exactly as they have acted.
This is an excellent argument, thanks for posting it. What you see here is a discussion that started several days ago when people pointed out exactly what you are stating here. Unfortunately, there are a few, like Metallurgist, who wish to maintain a sense of righteous indignation that is unfounded. It rather obviously boils down to a sense of entitlement that some people simply refuse to give up.
people paid lots of $$$ to get these items and now they are there up for grabs.
if they told them that those items would be there on c-store in june for a few dollars nobody would have bothered buying the pre-order items.
i think that's why they feel cheated.
Don't bother all you will get back is that the customers fault for not knowing and they will link to the faq yet again
No, the problem is a select few have lost their elitism.
Not true at all. The "must have NAO!!!!!" crowd would still buy them and will continue to do so as new specials are offered.
That's what it's all about in a nutshell. Would it be cool to have these items forever exclusive??? Sure, but that's NOT WHAT YOU PAID FOR! If you did pay that much money for a uniform...wow...
But they didn't. They paid for a lifetime membership. They got the costumes as a free bonus. And while it's possible that some might have bought the lifetime membership solely for the bonus items that still doesn't mean they paid for them.
People got EXACTLY what they paid for! I got the LS for my money, they gave me the Lib Borg Officer and a bonus. When they offer my bonus on the C-Store I'm not losing anything...I STILL HAVE MY LIFETIME SUB!! If people paid LS money to get some exclusive items without reading the fine print...shame on them.
Just to be clear you DID get the actual thing you bought, a lifetime account. Every other thing is bonus, you pay for game access and get some goodies.
Incorrect. What they sold were packages. The subscription was part of the package, but not the entirety of it.
Yes. If a person purchases a car in order to get the nifty air freshener, there's nothing to stop them because they are well within their rights to do so. And there's nothing wrong with the dealer listing the air freshener as part of the package.
What we have here is some people who purchased a car, and are currently driving it around, but claim that they really only wanted the air freshener.
Is it the dealer's responsibility to tell the buyer that he or she is buying the car for the wrong reason?
Lifetime Package = $200
Subscription and access to the game forever = $196.50
Mirror Universe Uniform = $3.50
That's the reality of it.
During the preorder period, a lot of people on the forums were talking about buying multiple preorders from different sources for different exclusive items. It was everyone's understanding that the stuff that was explicitly advertised as "exclusive" would not be offered anywhere else, at any other time. Some items said exclusive and some did not. Everyone thought the "exlusive" items were a one-time deal and everything else might wind up in the C-store.
"Exclusive" does not normally mean: :"not exclusive", "temporarily exclusive", or "exclusive until we want more cash". Exclusive does not normally mean: only right now, for one hour, for one day, for one month, or for four months only.
I don't know how many people bought multiple preorders for the items but I feel bad for those who did. I do think they're entitled to a refund for those extra copies.
Thats the current reality of it. And the main source of my objection. The items on that package did not have separated cash values associated with them at time of purchase. Because it was not possible to purchase them separately.
Again, Hindsight makes everyone look brilliant.
That's also the reality at the time you bought it.
Well, of course they were sold packages: that's what a package is. Would you prefer to call them something else? How about "Collection of incentives that are bundled in a non-packaged manner with the item for sale"?
You want to argue that "package" means that all of the items included necessarily have some sort of equivalent value, but it does not. I bought a computer and received a sticker: the sticker is part of the package. But to say I paid for the sticker and not for the computer is my delusion, and the company has no obligation to tell me that my reasons for buying are wrong.
Blah blah blah, whatever
/ignore
Yah but dont you guys realize by doing this you guys have shot yourselvs in the foot. Every time you launch a game, your pre order sales are now going to be way way down. Because you have given yourselves the bad name of giving away the exclusives. so whats the point? Hell i now some people that bought the co sub that done even play that failure for a game. Why play co when coh is so much better, sorry to say it but it is. You guys need to realize you want to keep your customer base happy, yes you have buy making these items exclusive to now eveyone, but you have screwed yourselves over for furure sales of future games, because the bonus's as you now put them not exclusives will never be worth the fue extra bucks if you can just buy them in the c store.
Incorrect: the word exclusive does not imply any time other than the time in which it is used.
If I sell you something today as exclusive only to you, while at the same time I sell it to another person, then I have misled you and broken our contract, and you are entitled to compensation.
However, if I sold it to you a month ago as exclusive only to you, but now decide to sell it to others, you have no legitimate complaint. It was exclusive at the time, and therefore I kept my part of the contract.
This is why, in actual contracts, the word exclusive is modified by some kind of time constraint.
Now, having said all that, I do feel bad for those who paid so much for their different copies, because the amount of time they had to enjoy their exclusivity seems short. That does seem unfair to me. But it does not mean that they are entitled to any kind of compensation.
While I can relate to your position, you guys should have gone out of your way to avoid even the appearance of impropriety with the offers when using the words "exclusive" and "limited time" given the general understanding of those words with regards to point of purchase sales.
It would not have hurt you to have used the expression "exclusive for a limited time" as a single thing would it ? I think not. Unless someone there figured that doing so would cause people to change their mind about purchasing things at a premium and acquiring multiple licenses and if that was the case then you know you guys done wrong. It was bad enough there were so many packages offered in the first place and when people asked about things if memory serves we were lead to believe things were set in stone incentive wise.
Anyway fortunately for me, I was informed about your company practices prior to my purchase of STO. Consequently, I canceled several box orders and simply dumped some money into the cash shop waiting for this day to happen. Nonetheless I have purchased nearly everything offered and will get the rest of the stuff after the next major update.
However I do feel bad for those that purchased several licenses and even the made the big investment into your other property with no interest in it at all solely for access the sexy uniforms which I just purchased for some token amount.
My feeling or dare I say position, is not about epeen, entitlement or other such lame TRIBBLE things as some are proposing as red herring and ad homonym arguments against those upset by this move. My feeling comes from a clear sense of violation of integrity and weak ethos and pathos on the part of your company with regards to its business practices.
It was not. It had no separate value. It your perception of what it was worth, which is fair. Others percieved it as having greater value than you did, some less.
Incorrect. The sticker was not listed as one of the options of the package. It was just given to you. But the monitor was listed. But not the best analogy, since I never bought a computer where the items included weren't given a price breakdown before package discount.
Regardless, I was not arguing that all items have equivalent value. Just that all items were sold together and not 'freebies' like people keep insisting.
Most likely their pre-order sales will not drop appreciably because people buy the pre-orders to have the bonuses first. At least, that's what the rational ones do. There have been more than enough pre-order/lifetime people coming in here to explain the foolishness of assuming somehow you paid $200 for a uniform or that "exclusive" meant for all time.