The shaved heads during wartime was inspired by the story Kahless's clone told of the forging of the first bat'leth and since you have precisely zero proof that wasn't intended from day 1 the production staff has the credibility. Also Klingons are not always at war and never have been.
Klingon culture is focused around honor through combat. If they are not fighting aliens, then they are fighting themselves. If Klingons shaved their heads only during wartime, then they would have hair in the first couple of episodes before the war started. Yet we have T'Kuvma and the other Klingon leaders bald before the Battle at the Binary Star. So if the Klingons are bald during times of war, then they must have been at war before their war with the Federation.
The creators of Discovery wanted bald Klingons and tried to use the excuse of sensory organs on the head to explain their lack of hair. When that excuse failed miserably and due to the hairless Klingons controversy, they came up with the only bald during wartime excuse.
Some debates are worth your time, because the matters are open or the explanations can improve.
This ain't one of 'em, because you're essentially right, but being right doesn't matter, you're not going to change any minds and you're not going to get anyone to re-think their positions or consider yours.
Speaking from personal experience? Some battles are worth fighting for since surrender means killing a part of the soul, but debating on a forum about a fictional story or game is just wasting time or is for fun.
> @starkaos said:
> azrael605 wrote: »
>
> The black badges were always for S31, this was explicitly stated by the production staff, and the bonus scene was cut from the season finale so they could use it as a teaser later which they did.
>
> Even if it was always intended to be part of Section 31, there is a huge difference between Section 31 being an active part of Starfleet and Section 31 personnel being on a ship that has ties to Section 31. It is just a matter of whether Section 31 installed some of their technology on the Discovery or if the Discovery is a Section 31 ship.
>
> Also, I don't give much credence to what the Discovery production staff says due to their explanation for bald Klingons. It was originally that Klingons had heightened senses on the top of their head that are dulled by having hair. Now they are only bald for war. The heightened senses explanation makes sense while the bald for war explanation makes zero sense since Klingons are always at war.
The shaved heads during wartime was inspired by the story Kahless's clone told of the forging of the first bat'leth and since you have precisely zero proof that wasn't intended from day 1 the production staff has the credibility. Also Klingons are not always at war and never have been.
Which raises an interesting question: "How do Klingons define 'wartime'?"
> @starkaos said:
> azrael605 wrote: »
>
> The black badges were always for S31, this was explicitly stated by the production staff, and the bonus scene was cut from the season finale so they could use it as a teaser later which they did.
>
> Even if it was always intended to be part of Section 31, there is a huge difference between Section 31 being an active part of Starfleet and Section 31 personnel being on a ship that has ties to Section 31. It is just a matter of whether Section 31 installed some of their technology on the Discovery or if the Discovery is a Section 31 ship.
>
> Also, I don't give much credence to what the Discovery production staff says due to their explanation for bald Klingons. It was originally that Klingons had heightened senses on the top of their head that are dulled by having hair. Now they are only bald for war. The heightened senses explanation makes sense while the bald for war explanation makes zero sense since Klingons are always at war.
The shaved heads during wartime was inspired by the story Kahless's clone told of the forging of the first bat'leth and since you have precisely zero proof that wasn't intended from day 1 the production staff has the credibility. Also Klingons are not always at war and never have been.
Which raises an interesting question: "How do Klingons define 'wartime'?"
Are they awake and breathing? Is there another lifeform in the same room (optional).
Shaving their heads in wartime is fanon. Just because some of those fans happen ti be writers for the show doesn't make it canon.
All that is canon is that for the period between T'Kuvma finding his ship and L'Rell holding Kronos hostage a large amount of Klingons on one planet and a few ships didn't have hair until it was noted in dialogue they'd started growing it again. Ash simply said 'the rumours were true' not 'yes, because the war's over'.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
By that definition, Artan, everything ever written for the show is "fanon", and this entire discussion is even more pointless than it seemed at the beginning.
There's a phenomenon called "moving the goalposts". And calling everything you don't like in the canon (that is, the materials that are shown on TV or in movies) "fanon" is a very good example of this.
By that definition, Artan, everything ever written for the show is "fanon", and this entire discussion is even more pointless than it seemed at the beginning.
There's a phenomenon called "moving the goalposts". And calling everything you don't like in the canon (that is, the materials that are shown on TV or in movies) "fanon" is a very good example of this.
Not if its onscreen it's not. If it's not onscreen it's fanon. If it's onscreen it's canon. Unless an explanation for Klingon hair shows up in an episode then it's a writers own headcanon and worth exactly as much as anyone on here's headcanon.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
By that definition, Artan, everything ever written for the show is "fanon", and this entire discussion is even more pointless than it seemed at the beginning.
There's a phenomenon called "moving the goalposts". And calling everything you don't like in the canon (that is, the materials that are shown on TV or in movies) "fanon" is a very good example of this.
Not if its onscreen it's not. If it's not onscreen it's fanon. If it's onscreen it's canon. Unless an explanation for Klingon hair shows up in an episode then it's a writers own headcanon and worth exactly as much as anyone on here's headcanon.
By that definition, Artan, everything ever written for the show is "fanon", and this entire discussion is even more pointless than it seemed at the beginning.
There's a phenomenon called "moving the goalposts". And calling everything you don't like in the canon (that is, the materials that are shown on TV or in movies) "fanon" is a very good example of this.
Not if its onscreen it's not. If it's not onscreen it's fanon. If it's onscreen it's canon. Unless an explanation for Klingon hair shows up in an episode then it's a writers own headcanon and worth exactly as much as anyone on here's headcanon.
Is that your definition or CBS's?
As always it's CBS'.
Recently brought to the forefront. The writer of the first DSC Mirror episode put his explanation for the Emperor's titles and names on Twitter with the postlude that what he (bearing in mind the writer of the episode so 'the word of god') was saying wasn't canon as it wasn't onscreen.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Can i point out...
"McCoy... Leonard McCoy!... I met him when he was a student at Ole Miss... I had a feeling he'd become a Doctor – he had the hands of a surgeon."
so he was not a full fledged doctor then.
"It appears we have lost our sex appeal, captain."- Tuvok
Comments
Speaking from personal experience? Some battles are worth fighting for since surrender means killing a part of the soul, but debating on a forum about a fictional story or game is just wasting time or is for fun.
My character Tsin'xing
Are they awake and breathing? Is there another lifeform in the same room (optional).
Shaving their heads in wartime is fanon. Just because some of those fans happen ti be writers for the show doesn't make it canon.
All that is canon is that for the period between T'Kuvma finding his ship and L'Rell holding Kronos hostage a large amount of Klingons on one planet and a few ships didn't have hair until it was noted in dialogue they'd started growing it again. Ash simply said 'the rumours were true' not 'yes, because the war's over'.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
There's a phenomenon called "moving the goalposts". And calling everything you don't like in the canon (that is, the materials that are shown on TV or in movies) "fanon" is a very good example of this.
Not if its onscreen it's not. If it's not onscreen it's fanon. If it's onscreen it's canon. Unless an explanation for Klingon hair shows up in an episode then it's a writers own headcanon and worth exactly as much as anyone on here's headcanon.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
My character Tsin'xing
As always it's CBS'.
Recently brought to the forefront. The writer of the first DSC Mirror episode put his explanation for the Emperor's titles and names on Twitter with the postlude that what he (bearing in mind the writer of the episode so 'the word of god') was saying wasn't canon as it wasn't onscreen.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
"McCoy... Leonard McCoy!... I met him when he was a student at Ole Miss... I had a feeling he'd become a Doctor – he had the hands of a surgeon."
so he was not a full fledged doctor then.
"It appears we have lost our sex appeal, captain."- Tuvok