rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,976Community Moderator
And the funny thing about calling Discovery TRIBBLE is that those haters keep saying Discovery is "Not Star Trek", yet what does that attempted insult abbreviation stand for? STAR TREK Discovery.
lol I don't think the haters thought that through.
I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
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LOL. No, TRIBBLE is fine. For one, you can't blame ppl for using an acronym that the makers of the show couldn't be arsed to think 5 minutes about to realize Star Trek Discovery would lead to TRIBBLE. Duh. Next time, ppl, think before doing!
Also, has this discussion gotten so petty that we're talking punctuation now?!
I doubt they thought of it because no one actually uses the ST in the abbreviations, unless you are really trying to say people called Deep Space 9 STDS9
That's because, if you were to treat Discovery like DS9, you'd just get D. So, it's logical ppl prefixed it with ST. Marketing department normally run sanity checks like that.
And the funny thing about calling Discovery TRIBBLE is that those haters keep saying Discovery is "Not Star Trek", yet what does that attempted insult abbreviation stand for? STAR TREK Discovery.
lol I don't think the haters thought that through.
Nice strawman, but no dice. It's detractors usually loathe it, because TRIBBLE spits on canon (and on what Klingons are in particular; heck, I recall reading even the makers, sideways, admitted their mistake, saying we're getting new-looking Klingons in Season 2). So, it's Trek alright, just broadly considered an insult to existing Trek. "It's Trek, Jim, but not as we know it."
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,976Community Moderator
How is it a Strawman? *confused* What else could it mean execpt Star Trek? Its no different than shortening Star Trek Online to STO.
Anyways back on topic... we might get to see some new ship designs from the 24th Century that could be introduced into STO.
I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite colored text = mod mode
That's because, if you were to treat Discovery like DS9, you'd just get D. So, it's logical ppl prefixed it with ST. Marketing department normally run sanity checks like that.
By that logic Voyager would have just been V, and Enterprise would have just been E, and they clearly were not.
That's because, if you were to treat Discovery like DS9, you'd just get D. So, it's logical ppl prefixed it with ST. Marketing department normally run sanity checks like that.
By that logic Voyager would have just been V, and Enterprise would have just been E, and they clearly were not.
Your arguments are so faulty its hilarious.
It's quite funny how you keeping shooting yourself in the foot. Enterprise isn't called E, because, like D, it's exceedingly too ambiguous. So, it generally referred to as ST:E, or simply ENT. DS9 works standalone, sans ST prefix, because it's a compound name, unlike Enterprise or Discovery, or Voyager. Discovery could have become DIS, perhaps, if it weren't for the negative connotation ('diss').
Like I said, it's the responsibility of marketing departments to do sanity checks, beforehand, to see whether perhaps unwanted abbreviations may occur. That's a very basic rule of thumb. They goofed; and pretty much said so, that they hadn't thought of TRIBBLE being the logical outcome. Ppl do make mistakes: it's rather childish blaming others for it, though.
That's because, if you were to treat Discovery like DS9, you'd just get D. So, it's logical ppl prefixed it with ST. Marketing department normally run sanity checks like that.
By that logic Voyager would have just been V, and Enterprise would have just been E, and they clearly were not.
Your arguments are so faulty its hilarious.
Hehehe... V was already taken though! (as if that actually matters when making abbreviations)
And thanks for making my point exactly: that single letters are too ambiguous.
That's because, if you were to treat Discovery like DS9, you'd just get D. So, it's logical ppl prefixed it with ST. Marketing department normally run sanity checks like that.
By that logic Voyager would have just been V, and Enterprise would have just been E, and they clearly were not.
Your arguments are so faulty its hilarious.
It's quite funny how you keeping shooting yourself in the foot. Enterprise isn't called E, because, like D, it's exceedingly too ambiguous. So, it generally referred to as ST:E, or simply ENT. DS9 works standalone, sans ST prefix, because it's a compound name, unlike Enterprise or Discovery, or Voyager. Discovery could have become DIS, perhaps, if it weren't for the negative connotation ('diss').
Like I said, it's the responsibility of marketing departments to do sanity checks, beforehand, to see whether perhaps unwanted abbreviations may occur. That's a very basic rule of thumb. They goofed; and pretty much said so, that they hadn't thought of TRIBBLE being the logical outcome. Ppl do make mistakes: it's rather childish blaming others for it, though.
So sanity checks only apply to marketing departments? because it's pretty silly to try using an abbreviation in daily life when you know ahead of time that 99% of people will associate it with something OTHER than what you're using it for.
That's because, if you were to treat Discovery like DS9, you'd just get D. So, it's logical ppl prefixed it with ST. Marketing department normally run sanity checks like that.
By that logic Voyager would have just been V, and Enterprise would have just been E, and they clearly were not.
Your arguments are so faulty its hilarious.
It's quite funny how you keeping shooting yourself in the foot. Enterprise isn't called E, because, like D, it's exceedingly too ambiguous. So, it generally referred to as ST:E, or simply ENT. DS9 works standalone, sans ST prefix, because it's a compound name, unlike Enterprise or Discovery, or Voyager. Discovery could have become DIS, perhaps, if it weren't for the negative connotation ('diss').
Like I said, it's the responsibility of marketing departments to do sanity checks, beforehand, to see whether perhaps unwanted abbreviations may occur. That's a very basic rule of thumb. They goofed; and pretty much said so, that they hadn't thought of TRIBBLE being the logical outcome. Ppl do make mistakes: it's rather childish blaming others for it, though.
So sanity checks only apply to marketing departments? because it's pretty silly to try using an abbreviation in daily life when you know ahead of time that 99% of people will associate it with something OTHER than what you're using it for.
People probably used TRIBBLE, at first, because it felt logical; and then it got stuck, I suppose, because of 'the other meaning.' But you can't blame ppl for using TRIBBLE, as they basically put the acronym in ppl's mouths.
Honestly, sanity checks against names and abbreviations are quite customary. For instance, there's a Turkish beer you won't find under the same brand name in the Netherlands, called Kutman. ;p It's like they'd then blame the Dutch for using that word. Honesty, lawyers/marketing departments, they generally check against the target language for unwanted abbreviations/names. It's so much easier to do some prechecks yourself, rather than blaming everyone else, later on.
'The question "How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?" is a reductio ad absurdum of medieval scholasticism in general, and its angelology with the imagery of scholars debating about minutiae while the Turks besieged Byzantium. In modern usage, it therefore has been used as a metaphor for wasting time debating topics of no practical value, or questions whose answers hold no intellectual consequence, while more urgent concerns pile up.'
TRIBBLE anyone?
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite colored text = mod mode
So says the liar, and what is that link supposed to show? it links to the top of a thread page, and going a quick search using ctrl+F shows people using ENT, and not ST:ENT.
Best retract that vile tongue of yours, calling other ppl a liar. Lemme guess?! 'Fake news', eh? Everyone can call your bluff, do Ctrl-F on that page, and find 'ST:E' on that page. Or better yet, just search forum for 'ST:E'.
I know you like to be, let's put this politely, 'contrary' a lot; but you shouldn't do so in the face of cold facts contradicting your statements.
Heheh… I mean I'm just entirely excited to see a Star Trek series that actually going to advance the timeline for a change. Discovery went back in history to expand our knowledge of the past just as Enterprise did.
But in 7 more months it will have been 25 years since Star Trek TNG stopped in the Spring of 1994. I mean if they advance the 2370 timeline out just 25 years it be 2395; yet I'll suspect writers will likely advance it 35-40 years. I mean they'll likely want to say Picard is 10-15 years older than he is in real life, and explain the difference as human lifespan have improved, with most human's regularly reported as living out to almost 150 years.
So we could see Picard in the later year's of his Career as he possibly considers the Ambassador Role; which earlier TNG episodes talked about him doing. It may also reveal many new aspects of what choices he made that lead him down that path or what several other pursuits he explored like his love of Archaeology among many other things that lead's him into new directions.
I think this will be an exciting journey regardless.
Heheh… I mean I'm just entirely excited to see a Star Trek series that actually going to advance the timeline for a change. Discovery went back in history to expand our knowledge of the past just as Enterprise did.
Except Discovery creates more problems than it answers. Enterprise had the excuse of the Temporal Cold War and being set 100 years before TOS to have creative control over their era. Discovery needs to resolve the issue about why the Spore Drive doesn't exist in the other Star Trek series and why we don't see Discovery Klingons any more. Discovery had a good reason why the Spore Drive no longer worked due to all the spores being destroyed, but then they terraformed that planet to make more spores. Remove the name drops and Discovery has nothing that screams 23rd Century. It could have been easily set in the 25th Century by removing the name drops and naming the Discovery Klingons as some new alien race.
As far as the Picard series goes, it should have absolutely no effect on STO since STO is set in a parallel universe. The novels and STO have contradicting histories that both can't be the Prime Universe. Although, an organization like the Typhon Pact involving the Romulan Star Empire, Breen Confederacy, Tholian Assembly, Gorn Hegemony, Tzenkethi, and maybe the Andorians or some other Federation race to counter the Federation would be more interesting than Romulans becoming a bunch of refugees, Breen harassing a single race, Gorn becoming Klingon lackeys, and Tzenkethi becoming genocidal maniacs.
Personally, I want Picard to become an Archaeologist rather than an Ambassador. After all, Archaeologists are far more exciting to watch than Ambassadors unless they are being Ambadassadors, but Ambadassery is only temporary.
Unlike DSC, or Disco, or Discovery, or using VOY or VGR, all of which get the point of which show you are talking about in the same way, the use of the moniker TRIBBLE clearly indicates that the person is simply insulting the show, and doesn't care for any actual, substantive, or serious, discussion about it.
I've used TRIBBLE & DSC, I've never mocked the show with either choice.
Even the way the Klingons in Discovery speak Klingonese is more accurate to how the language was originally designed by Marc Okrand then compared to past shows, and even the writers of TNG/DS9/VOY admitted they edited it to make it sound more human and get the words out easier, rather then follow how it was designed to be spoken.
In truth, the best Klingonese I've ever heard has been on the outtakes of the 2009 Star Trek film. Disco Klingonese is a little too ... barky for my liking.
Except Discovery creates more problems than it answers. Enterprise had the excuse of the Temporal Cold War and being set 100 years before TOS to have creative control over their era. Discovery needs to resolve the issue about why the Spore Drive doesn't exist in the other Star Trek series and why we don't see Discovery Klingons any more. Discovery had a good reason why the Spore Drive no longer worked due to all the spores being destroyed, but then they terraformed that planet to make more spores. Remove the name drops and Discovery has nothing that screams 23rd Century. It could have been easily set in the 25th Century by removing the name drops and naming the Discovery Klingons as some new alien race.
The points you raised would amount to a lot more if they were unanswered once the show wraps up. We've only had a single season. You can't expect everything to be answered straight away.
The Spore drive (why it can't be used) will likely be explained in an upcoming season. People can accept the TOS Klingons, the TMP Klingons, the TNG Klingons, and the JJ Klingons, but not the TRIBBLE Klingons? That in itself is laughable. I'll be the first to admit that I don't like them, but I do accept them.
Up until 3 days ago I was hoping it would prompt some ships from that Era getting released, like the New Orleans, Rhode Island, Luna, getting screen time and game releases. One of Three already.
Thanks for the Advanced Light Cruiser, Allied Escort Bundles, Jem-Hadar Light Battlecruiser, and Mek'leth
New Content Wishlist
T6 updates for the Kamarag & Vor'Cha
Heavy Cruiser & a Movie Era Style AoY Utility Cruiser
I don't understand why people act like the question of why the Spore drive was abandoned is unanswered when we have already seen why it was.
A. You need a space tardigrade to use it, and they are so rare only one has been found. And that one found the Glen more then the Glen found it.
B Barring a space tardigrade, you need to use a human, and perform highly illegal genetic augmentation on them, by injecting tardigrade DNA into them so they can use the spore drive.
C. Humans using the spore drive causes an eventual alteration of white matter in their brain, which can kill them, or at least cause severe mental problems.
D. There is the whole problem of using the spore drive incorrectly can cause you to jump to another universe where everyone is evil and wants to kill you. Something that was immediately classified when the Discovery got back and Cornwell found them.
The whole thing is a giant deathtrap. Its like asking why the Federation would never use the warp 10 drive they develop in Voyager when we see that it turns them into lizards. Hmm, I wonder why.
In truth, the best Klingonese I've ever heard has been on the outtakes of the 2009 Star Trek film. Disco Klingonese is a little too ... barky for my liking.
If yo uare talking about the outtakes I think you are that it was a lot closer to real Klingonese then what we got in other shows, but the Discovery Klingonese is still close to the original intent.
Oh I don't doubt that DSC/TRIBBLE Klingonese is closer to what it was intended to be, I just prefer the JJ outtake Klingonese. It left the tongue better and seemed more of an actual language rather than a bark.
Picard will be in the Vinyards with the Gallo Brothers reminiscing each week about the good old days.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
The Spore drive (why it can't be used) will likely be explained in an upcoming season. People can accept the TOS Klingons, the TMP Klingons, the TNG Klingons, and the JJ Klingons, but not the TRIBBLE Klingons? That in itself is laughable. I'll be the first to admit that I don't like them, but I do accept them.
I don't understand why people act like the question of why the Spore drive was abandoned is unanswered when we have already seen why it was.
A. You need a space tardigrade to use it, and they are so rare only one has been found. And that one found the Glen more then the Glen found it.
B Barring a space tardigrade, you need to use a human, and perform highly illegal genetic augmentation on them, by injecting tardigrade DNA into them so they can use the spore drive.
C. Humans using the spore drive causes an eventual alteration of white matter in their brain, which can kill them, or at least cause severe mental problems.
D. There is the whole problem of using the spore drive incorrectly can cause you to jump to another universe where everyone is evil and wants to kill you. Something that was immediately classified when the Discovery got back and Cornwell found them.
The only valid reason to not use the Spore Drive is D, but that is due to a low probability of entering an alternate reality. Lorca forced the Discovery to enter the Mirror Universe and the trip back to their universe caused them to lose a few months. For all we know, it requires extraordinary circumstances to travel to an alternate reality with the Spore Drive and will never happen if the Spore Drive is used properly.
A, B, and C are only reasons why the Federation would not use the Spore Drive not some unscrupulous organization or civilization would not use it. Section 31 can easily create their own Spore Drives since they seem to have some connection to the Discovery and can easily get Stamets' DNA to create their own Spore Drive pilots. It will be difficult for other organizations like the Tal Shiar, but they can break into classified files or bribe some Starfleet Officer and kidnap Stamets.
Then there is the issue of 24th Century technology compared to 23rd Century technology. The 23rd Century Federation needs a living pilot to use the Spore Drive, but 24th Century computers might be powerful enough to pilot the Spore Drive. If a sapient being is required, then Data and the Doctor are possible pilots.
Therefore, the only way for the Spore Drive to not be used is if the mushrooms become extinct or the Mycellial Network no longer allows transportation.
As far as Discovery Klingons go, the transition between TOS Klingons to TNG Klingons was easily acceptable due to better makeup techniques. The TOS Klingons always looked like TNG Klingons, but TOS didn't have the technology to create Klingons as how they should look. Then DS9 ruined that explanation by indicating that it was not due to better makeup techniques, but there was an actual difference between TOS Klingons and TNG Klingons. Enterprise gave an explanation how Enterprise/TNG Klingons turned into TOS Klingons with a TOS Klingon in Enterprise. If DS9 and Enterprise didn't have those explanations about the difference between TOS Klingons and TNG Klingons, then Discovery Klingons could be explained through better makeup techniques, but since the difference between TOS Klingons and TNG Klingons was explained, then Discovery Klingons have to be explained as well.
Comments
lol I don't think the haters thought that through.
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That's because, if you were to treat Discovery like DS9, you'd just get D. So, it's logical ppl prefixed it with ST. Marketing department normally run sanity checks like that.
Nice strawman, but no dice.
Anyways back on topic... we might get to see some new ship designs from the 24th Century that could be introduced into STO.
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colored text = mod mode
My character Tsin'xing
My character Tsin'xing
It's quite funny how you keeping shooting yourself in the foot.
Like I said, it's the responsibility of marketing departments to do sanity checks, beforehand, to see whether perhaps unwanted abbreviations may occur. That's a very basic rule of thumb. They goofed; and pretty much said so, that they hadn't thought of TRIBBLE being the logical outcome. Ppl do make mistakes: it's rather childish blaming others for it, though.
And thanks for making my point exactly: that single letters are too ambiguous.
My character Tsin'xing
People probably used TRIBBLE, at first, because it felt logical; and then it got stuck, I suppose, because of 'the other meaning.' But you can't blame ppl for using TRIBBLE, as they basically put the acronym in ppl's mouths.
Honestly, sanity checks against names and abbreviations are quite customary. For instance, there's a Turkish beer you won't find under the same brand name in the Netherlands, called Kutman. ;p It's like they'd then blame the Dutch for using that word. Honesty, lawyers/marketing departments, they generally check against the target language for unwanted abbreviations/names. It's so much easier to do some prechecks yourself, rather than blaming everyone else, later on.
TRIBBLE anyone?
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
That's because you're bending the Truth to 'win' the argument. Fortunately, you're easily, and decisively, proven wrong. For example:
https://arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline#/discussion/comment/13409347
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite
colored text = mod mode
Best retract that vile tongue of yours, calling other ppl a liar. Lemme guess?! 'Fake news', eh? Everyone can call your bluff, do Ctrl-F on that page, and find 'ST:E' on that page. Or better yet, just search forum for 'ST:E'.
I know you like to be, let's put this politely, 'contrary' a lot; but you shouldn't do so in the face of cold facts contradicting your statements.
My character Tsin'xing
But in 7 more months it will have been 25 years since Star Trek TNG stopped in the Spring of 1994. I mean if they advance the 2370 timeline out just 25 years it be 2395; yet I'll suspect writers will likely advance it 35-40 years. I mean they'll likely want to say Picard is 10-15 years older than he is in real life, and explain the difference as human lifespan have improved, with most human's regularly reported as living out to almost 150 years.
So we could see Picard in the later year's of his Career as he possibly considers the Ambassador Role; which earlier TNG episodes talked about him doing. It may also reveal many new aspects of what choices he made that lead him down that path or what several other pursuits he explored like his love of Archaeology among many other things that lead's him into new directions.
I think this will be an exciting journey regardless.
Except Discovery creates more problems than it answers. Enterprise had the excuse of the Temporal Cold War and being set 100 years before TOS to have creative control over their era. Discovery needs to resolve the issue about why the Spore Drive doesn't exist in the other Star Trek series and why we don't see Discovery Klingons any more. Discovery had a good reason why the Spore Drive no longer worked due to all the spores being destroyed, but then they terraformed that planet to make more spores. Remove the name drops and Discovery has nothing that screams 23rd Century. It could have been easily set in the 25th Century by removing the name drops and naming the Discovery Klingons as some new alien race.
As far as the Picard series goes, it should have absolutely no effect on STO since STO is set in a parallel universe. The novels and STO have contradicting histories that both can't be the Prime Universe. Although, an organization like the Typhon Pact involving the Romulan Star Empire, Breen Confederacy, Tholian Assembly, Gorn Hegemony, Tzenkethi, and maybe the Andorians or some other Federation race to counter the Federation would be more interesting than Romulans becoming a bunch of refugees, Breen harassing a single race, Gorn becoming Klingon lackeys, and Tzenkethi becoming genocidal maniacs.
Personally, I want Picard to become an Archaeologist rather than an Ambassador. After all, Archaeologists are far more exciting to watch than Ambassadors unless they are being Ambadassadors, but Ambadassery is only temporary.
In truth, the best Klingonese I've ever heard has been on the outtakes of the 2009 Star Trek film. Disco Klingonese is a little too ... barky for my liking.
The points you raised would amount to a lot more if they were unanswered once the show wraps up. We've only had a single season. You can't expect everything to be answered straight away.
The Spore drive (why it can't be used) will likely be explained in an upcoming season. People can accept the TOS Klingons, the TMP Klingons, the TNG Klingons, and the JJ Klingons, but not the TRIBBLE Klingons? That in itself is laughable. I'll be the first to admit that I don't like them, but I do accept them.
Oh I don't doubt that DSC/TRIBBLE Klingonese is closer to what it was intended to be, I just prefer the JJ outtake Klingonese. It left the tongue better and seemed more of an actual language rather than a bark.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
The only valid reason to not use the Spore Drive is D, but that is due to a low probability of entering an alternate reality. Lorca forced the Discovery to enter the Mirror Universe and the trip back to their universe caused them to lose a few months. For all we know, it requires extraordinary circumstances to travel to an alternate reality with the Spore Drive and will never happen if the Spore Drive is used properly.
A, B, and C are only reasons why the Federation would not use the Spore Drive not some unscrupulous organization or civilization would not use it. Section 31 can easily create their own Spore Drives since they seem to have some connection to the Discovery and can easily get Stamets' DNA to create their own Spore Drive pilots. It will be difficult for other organizations like the Tal Shiar, but they can break into classified files or bribe some Starfleet Officer and kidnap Stamets.
Then there is the issue of 24th Century technology compared to 23rd Century technology. The 23rd Century Federation needs a living pilot to use the Spore Drive, but 24th Century computers might be powerful enough to pilot the Spore Drive. If a sapient being is required, then Data and the Doctor are possible pilots.
Therefore, the only way for the Spore Drive to not be used is if the mushrooms become extinct or the Mycellial Network no longer allows transportation.
As far as Discovery Klingons go, the transition between TOS Klingons to TNG Klingons was easily acceptable due to better makeup techniques. The TOS Klingons always looked like TNG Klingons, but TOS didn't have the technology to create Klingons as how they should look. Then DS9 ruined that explanation by indicating that it was not due to better makeup techniques, but there was an actual difference between TOS Klingons and TNG Klingons. Enterprise gave an explanation how Enterprise/TNG Klingons turned into TOS Klingons with a TOS Klingon in Enterprise. If DS9 and Enterprise didn't have those explanations about the difference between TOS Klingons and TNG Klingons, then Discovery Klingons could be explained through better makeup techniques, but since the difference between TOS Klingons and TNG Klingons was explained, then Discovery Klingons have to be explained as well.