Was just reminded of another species who's status I'm curious about in STO:
Kobliad
In 2369, the Kobliad were a dying race that was sustained only by shipments of deuridium, a rare element hazardous to other species. Deposits were so rare that it couldn't service the entire Kobliad population, leading to many of them to turn to underground sources, and the infamous Kobliad scientist Rao Vantika to perform numerous experiments on prisoners at a facility he was chief medical officer at in efforts to prolong his own life. Another Kobliad, Yteppa, also worked with the Cardassian Obsidian Order in 2371. Deuridium was discovered in the Gamma Quadrant shortly after the discovery of the wormhole, but shipments were likely cut off when the Dominion revealed itself to the Alpha and Beta Quadrant species a year later.
By the time of STO in the early 25th Century, do the Kobliad even exist any more? Or are they continuing to struggle for survival with more and more members of the species turning desperate enough to associate with the less savory elements of the galaxy?
Ferenginar is in Sector Space, we just don't have any missions or whatever there so far.
No Foundry missions there either but I've got one in the works to rectify that (with more cloud and rain on other ground maps but this one is in the best shape to show ATM).
that photo looks awesome i barely wait to see that mission
Why wouldn't I? Should I expect Picard to lie about it? For what purpose?
Who implied he was lying? Just like every other distance/speed given in the TV show, its wrong, and doesn't make much sense with anything else seen in the shows, even in TNG. Not that TNG was consistent either, but that's the point. You can't take what Picard said seriously for the same reason you can't take ANYONE'S claim of distance/time seriously.
You spend all this time making up reasons why EVERYONE else's claims in all the other TV shows/movies are wrong, but dont realize the sheer utter hypocrisy of taking what Picard says as being any more valid then previous or later claims.
You can take it AS seriously as any other claim of distance/time.
There are no "everyone else's claims" about the size of the Federation in distance. But there are many claims to it's size in number of planets and member species, which support the 8,000 ly Picard claims. And totally trash some non-canon graphic that tries to pass a claim of 20 ly.
FFS, even the number of planets visited on screen totally trash the 20 ly claim.
If you'd done your research you'd know that the galaxy isn't the only thing that gets divided into quadrants in Star Trek. And it isn't just a quirk of TOS, either.
And, if you had ode your research, you would know that, within the context of Star Trek, was only made up after ToS aired to explain away the inconsistency. Its literally writer handwavium.
Sure they do. Like in ST5 when they take a trip to the center of the galaxy.
You mean the same Star Trek 5 often criticized for being illogical? Like how they supposedly started on the neutral world of Nimbus, that supposed to be between the Federation, Romulan Star Empire, and Klingon Empire, and somehow got from there, to the center of the galaxy, by going in a straight line, and yet never passed through any of said faction's territories, and somehow managed to avoid so much of all those faction's space that literally only ONE vessel was anywhere near enough to catch up to them?
A gaff so large the movie is still made fun of it in the Star Trek community to this day for how little it makes sense, and even the people who made the Star Charts had to make the ultimate fudge excuse of "its nowhere near Klingon space, they just have an ambassador there because movie!"
Great support for your point there.
Yes, because the community can make fun of it all they want, the canon is the Enterprise visited the center of the galaxy and no amount of "fudging" is going to change that.
I might also say that space is big and depending on the precise arrangements of Federation, Klingon and Romulan territories (which have never been elaborated in canon), it's entirely plausible to draw a straight line from the middle of the three to the center of the galaxy without intersecting any of them. And as already established, having only one ship in range to do something is quite common in Star Trek.
Some people just overanalyze things because they like to complain.
So Earth is close to the Klingon border. What's the point?
The point being its also equally close to everything from Romulus and Remus, to Cardassia, to Feneginar, to every other major power that isn't the Tholians and Breen, as seen in the TV shows, because its not that large.
Or, because the Federation naturally expanded in the direction AWAY from the major hostile powers in the region, because it obviously couldn't expand THROUGH them.
Except, it's never even said how close it is to the powers other than the Klingons. Romulus, Cardassia, Ferenginar, etc are never visited in Enterprise, and by TOS their ships are already quite fast enough to get everywhere they want.
Yes, because one ship stranded in the middle of nowhere having to trade or scavenge for supplies, evade or fight various hostiles and generally engage in all kinds of adventures is of course the very model of fast travel.
Nor did Voyager ever use maximum sustainable warp outside emergencies anyway, preferring to plod along at warp 6 or something most of the time...likely to conserve fuel.
Also, [citation needed].
Look up the word sustainable. Voyager could go faster, but thats not sustainable because it would destroy their engines.
No, it really doesn't. Because "maximum warp" doesn't actually mean anything.
And of course, nobody ever said the Federation was a perfect sphere, so it could be thinner in some places and wider in others. The quote only specifies its 8,000 ly at some point.
Sure it does, it means as high of a warp as they could go.
In other words "pedal to the metal." They could get from point A to point B in time X by going as fast as they can go...in a vehicle who's top speed is unknown. Which says nothing of the distance covered.
Which still doesn't make any sense, barbecue it would take literally years for any ship to cross that, and theres no way any government could survive like that.
It would take literally as long as it would take. Which remains unspecified. We only know that the Federation is 8,000 ly wide at some point and that a ship of unspecified speed can cross from one side to the other in 8 weeks at some point. Which may or may not be the same point.
There are no "everyone else's claims" about the size of the Federation in distance. But there are many claims to it's size in number of planets and member species, which support the 8,000 ly Picard claims. And totally trash some non-canon graphic that tries to pass a claim of 20 ly.
The only claim of 20ly was your dumb as hell straw man.
The Star Charts actually show the Federation to be at least 200ly from top to bottom, and by top I mean(nearest the galactic core) and bottom as(nearest the galactic edge), and thats not even the whole Federation shown on there.
You have completely resorted to nothing but made up arguments at this point. I don't know why you are so hellbent to worship Picard, even when the people who made the show disagree, but its really pathetic.
You're the one who said 8,000 ly³ volume. That's 20x20x20 ly. Next you're probably claiming math doesn't work the same way in Star Trek either.
Comments
Kobliad
In 2369, the Kobliad were a dying race that was sustained only by shipments of deuridium, a rare element hazardous to other species. Deposits were so rare that it couldn't service the entire Kobliad population, leading to many of them to turn to underground sources, and the infamous Kobliad scientist Rao Vantika to perform numerous experiments on prisoners at a facility he was chief medical officer at in efforts to prolong his own life. Another Kobliad, Yteppa, also worked with the Cardassian Obsidian Order in 2371. Deuridium was discovered in the Gamma Quadrant shortly after the discovery of the wormhole, but shipments were likely cut off when the Dominion revealed itself to the Alpha and Beta Quadrant species a year later.
By the time of STO in the early 25th Century, do the Kobliad even exist any more? Or are they continuing to struggle for survival with more and more members of the species turning desperate enough to associate with the less savory elements of the galaxy?
My character Tsin'xing
that photo looks awesome i barely wait to see that mission
There are no "everyone else's claims" about the size of the Federation in distance. But there are many claims to it's size in number of planets and member species, which support the 8,000 ly Picard claims. And totally trash some non-canon graphic that tries to pass a claim of 20 ly.
FFS, even the number of planets visited on screen totally trash the 20 ly claim.
Yes, because the community can make fun of it all they want, the canon is the Enterprise visited the center of the galaxy and no amount of "fudging" is going to change that.
I might also say that space is big and depending on the precise arrangements of Federation, Klingon and Romulan territories (which have never been elaborated in canon), it's entirely plausible to draw a straight line from the middle of the three to the center of the galaxy without intersecting any of them. And as already established, having only one ship in range to do something is quite common in Star Trek.
Some people just overanalyze things because they like to complain.
Or, because the Federation naturally expanded in the direction AWAY from the major hostile powers in the region, because it obviously couldn't expand THROUGH them.
Except, it's never even said how close it is to the powers other than the Klingons. Romulus, Cardassia, Ferenginar, etc are never visited in Enterprise, and by TOS their ships are already quite fast enough to get everywhere they want. [citation needed]
In other words "pedal to the metal." They could get from point A to point B in time X by going as fast as they can go...in a vehicle who's top speed is unknown. Which says nothing of the distance covered.
It would take literally as long as it would take. Which remains unspecified. We only know that the Federation is 8,000 ly wide at some point and that a ship of unspecified speed can cross from one side to the other in 8 weeks at some point. Which may or may not be the same point.
You're the one who said 8,000 ly³ volume. That's 20x20x20 ly. Next you're probably claiming math doesn't work the same way in Star Trek either.
I support the Star Trek Battles channel.
My character Tsin'xing