This is an example of the difference that I'm seeing personally with plasmonic leech.
The above 2 images are from my tribble build currently. the only changes that i've made are going to the new system. Below are is my holodeck build and numbers on the leech.
Above are my holodeck numbers. As you can see this is a huge drop for me. Due to this I can only assume that drain expertise is not scaling properly in comparison with its holodeck counterparts currently or a nerf has been made. I'm assuming based on some posts that this is currently being looked at for possible balancing purposes. No change have been made save going to the new system. This is one of the major things that could potentially effect my build negatively at the moment. Needless to say this confuses me if it's supposed to be a 1:1 or mostly 1:1 thing.
"Someone once told me that time was a predator that stalked us all our lives. I rather believe that time is a companion who goes with us on the journey and reminds us to cherish every moment, because it will never come again." - Jean Luc Picard in Star Trek Generations
Hmm, I might have to reconsider that skill tree decision. Seems pretty low.
Low, sure. But if you specialize in Drains then it will be running almost constantly. It will like having an extra weapon equipped, albeit a lesser Marked one.
To keep on Topic: I am indifferent about Leech. Energy Siphon I like to use, though. That hit will be worse for me.
Due to this I can only assume that drain expertise is not scaling properly in comparison with its holodeck counterparts currently or a nerf has been made. I'm assuming based on some posts that this is currently being looked at for possible balancing purposes. No change have been made save going to the new system. This is one of the major things that could potentially effect my build negatively at the moment. Needless to say this confuses me if it's supposed to be a 1:1 or mostly 1:1 thing.
Re-read the tooltip for DrainX. You get 100% skill effectiveness/value/whatever for Power Insulators, but 50% for actual drain... And then there's probably a leech nerf on top of that...
What everyone buying Zen are really saying while all these bugs are still floating freely:
Stop new content until quality returns
Borticus made a final comment on this down on the Tribble feedback thread for those interested. For what it's worth he's correct and most of us agree with his assessment.
Borticus made a final comment on this down on the Tribble feedback thread for those interested. For what it's worth he's correct and most of us agree with his assessment.
That's nice. Where/which one?
What everyone buying Zen are really saying while all these bugs are still floating freely:
Stop new content until quality returns
Due to this I can only assume that drain expertise is not scaling properly in comparison with its holodeck counterparts currently or a nerf has been made. I'm assuming based on some posts that this is currently being looked at for possible balancing purposes. No change have been made save going to the new system. This is one of the major things that could potentially effect my build negatively at the moment. Needless to say this confuses me if it's supposed to be a 1:1 or mostly 1:1 thing.
Re-read the tooltip for DrainX. You get 100% skill effectiveness/value/whatever for Power Insulators, but 50% for actual drain... And then there's probably a leech nerf on top of that...
That's the problem that myself and alot of others are having. If they're doing a 1:1 conversion and we're supposed to be able to 100% replicate our builds that we have on holodeck, then this seriously puts a damper on that as we won't be able to replicate our builds with drains having been potentially severely nerfed going off face value. i'm just confused overall as to what everything is supposed to be.
"Someone once told me that time was a predator that stalked us all our lives. I rather believe that time is a companion who goes with us on the journey and reminds us to cherish every moment, because it will never come again." - Jean Luc Picard in Star Trek Generations
Borticus made a final comment on this down on the Tribble feedback thread for those interested. For what it's worth he's correct and most of us agree with his assessment.
By "most" you mean you because almost every comment below that one is negative.
Borticus made a final comment on this down on the Tribble feedback thread for those interested. For what it's worth he's correct and most of us agree with his assessment.
By "most" you mean you because almost every comment below that one is negative.
This^
Do appreciate the link though, thank you, not sure I'd have found it before giving up given how far in it was.
I do agree with the base assessment that the leech is dominating a lot of peoples thoughts, but frankly, that's the part I don't get. It's useful, sure, but is it broken? I'd actually still go with no. I'm willing to bet that if they hadn't opened it up to being distributed through cross-faction packs the argument would still be here but you'd still have the Fed-core whining about KDF having it rather than complaining about how it's being nerfed after they paid so much for it in ECs which is, well, 'meh, I did too, tough shizzle, let's move on'.
Let's not get into what-might-have-beens though.
What everyone buying Zen are really saying while all these bugs are still floating freely:
Stop new content until quality returns
The difference between a 100k player, and one who barely musters 10k, is simply piloting. The former knows what buttons to push when, the latter does not. Simple as that. No amount of 'normalization' is ever going to change that.
Do you actually believe that? I'm very sorry dude but that IS a bunch of real BS. Just a small tiny example...real whales spent real money on this game without knowing which buttons to push...unless those buttons are used to buy.
Quite frankly the Leech should "never" have been unshackled from its Nausicaan ship in the first place.
Because when it was first released it could ONLY be used on a single mid tier ship, and that was pretty balanced.
"If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross. But it's not for the timid." - Q
Quite frankly the Leech should "never" have been unshackled from its Nausicaan ship in the first place.
Because when it was first released it could ONLY be used on a single mid tier ship, and that was pretty balanced.
I'm yes and no on this. I don't think it should've been allowed outside of the KDF. I'd also have liked to see more factional differences across the board. From around about the time the Oddy/Bort launched (I think it was about then), a lot of what started coming out for the Feds was 'x class ship in career variants' with KDF and later Rom skinned versions and little more. I mean who knows? Perhaps there would've been something else as effective come up for the Feds that wasn't the MACO shield...
What everyone buying Zen are really saying while all these bugs are still floating freely:
Stop new content until quality returns
So much truth here that the anti-DPSers just don't seem to get.
Also, any nerf to the high end WILL decimate the low end while at the same time be considered an annoyance by the high end.
That's something else the anti-DPSers don't seem to get.
They don't 'get it' because it's NOT. ****ING. TRUE.
If you don't have plasmonic leech, you are 100% exempt from the consequences of nerfing it. If you don't have inspirational leader, you don't give a flying targ's backside it's getting cut in half.
Buffing everything except antiproton helps everybody except the people abusing the snot out of the only energy proc that scales with crit chance
The 'high end' is built on combos you can down tune or outright ravage without touching the majority of 10k crowd at all.
I thought the nerf to kemocite was a little heavy handed, but I supported it even though I had spent several million ec on it. Unfortunately, I'm noticing a trend now. Cryptic happily release a lockbox with overpowered stuff in it. Let's it's players buy it up then once the box has run its course and is no longer profitable nerf it. It honestly wouldn't be a huge deal, but people paid for these things and it's, at least in my view, bad form to advertise a product as something then change it later on under the guise of "balance". Let's be honest sto isn't balanced and will never be balanced. Cryptics entire business model revolves around releasing more and more power creep to the masses every few months for moar profit. So any talk from them of balance is laughable. It makes me wary of purchasing anything. Why take the chance of wasting money, or time, acquiring in game items if they will just nerf them at a later date? I think this was a bad move on their part.
I thought the nerf to kemocite was a little heavy handed, but I supported it even though I had spent several million ec on it. Unfortunately, I'm noticing a trend now. Cryptic happily release a lockbox with overpowered stuff in it. Let's it's players buy it up then once the box has run its course and is no longer profitable nerf it. It honestly wouldn't be a huge deal, but people paid for these things and it's, at least in my view, bad form to advertise a product as something then change it later on under the guise of "balance". Let's be honest sto isn't balanced and will never be balanced. Cryptics entire business model revolves around releasing more and more power creep to the masses every few months for moar profit. So any talk from them of balance is laughable. It makes me wary of purchasing anything. Why take the chance of wasting money, or time, acquiring in game items if they will just nerf them at a later date? I think this was a bad move on their part.
Time will tell. I was absent for most of Kemocite follies, I did buy the Pilot Escorts b/c I favored the idea of penetration on my torps and got burned by "a correction." At the end of the day this interaction between the powers that be and the client base will determine how far they can go on the "we need balance" justification gambit and whether or not another mass exodus would finish the game off.
Given my family has three lifetime accounts going back to launch I am in no way shape or form in love with the devolution of the game towards Pew-Pew Space Barbie or a client base so burned it leaves.
I hope both sides choose wisely, but as wary as I am of "corrections" I am just as wary of lockbox console necessitated "I win" buttons.
To say that there's been a communication breakdown is, in my opinion, an overstatement edging on falsehood. If you're not getting the information that you want or need regarding these changes, then I'm fairly certain you haven't made those needs clear.
Edging on falsehood? You have to be kidding.
You can't really think that snip you posted in any way informed people that you were going to nerf the Plasmonic Leech.
Remember the part of the announcement 'players lose nothing?' sound familiar? This is supposed to be a re-organization of the skill system and you're using it to cover up changes to ship consoles that have nothing to do with the skill system. Stealth Nerf is EXACTLY what it is and you know it. You're taking the oppurtunity to completely re-work game mechanics at every level and trying to pass it off as just a more simplistic way of presenting the skill chart.
You know exactly what you're doing, so don't try and say that us crying foul is a 'falsehood,' that's ridiculous and you know it. It's the same lack of transparency and communication that your staff has perpetuated for years and it's the exact reason the player base reacts the way that they do. The lack of trust comes with good reason, and this is just more of the same.
I try to be nice to the staff and respect the work that they do, but that post was a joke. You made a change that wasn't advertised and the player base found it and now you're mad about it.
So if it's all "piloting skill", why are you worried about nerfs? They can't remove knowledge and skills from you, right? Why do you care about a nerf to a specific console or weapon if you're not exploiting it to get your numbers and it all comes from your 1557 skillz?
Got 2 words for you: ceterus paribus. Everything else being equal (like piloting skills, and using a Leech), but with major drain nerfs, the end-result = 'less numbers.'
)
So what you're saying is, so long as everyone has a 69 million EC lockbox console and the knowledge about its necessity and how it is used, then everything is equal and it's all PILOTING SKILL. Because everyone has that kind of purchasing power and specialized knowledge, right? It's not at all an elite thing? Suuure.
I got most of my plasmonic leeches (7 of them) from 1 t3 ship purchase. And the information is all over the place. Ask in zone chat, theyll even be able to tell you. Between piloting, and clicking things in the right order, 5k turns into 30k+ very quickly, almost completely regardless of gear.
To say that there's been a communication breakdown is, in my opinion, an overstatement edging on falsehood. If you're not getting the information that you want or need regarding these changes, then I'm fairly certain you haven't made those needs clear.
Edging on falsehood? You have to be kidding.
You can't really think that snip you posted in any way informed people that you were going to nerf the Plasmonic Leech.
Remember the part of the announcement 'players lose nothing?' sound familiar? This is supposed to be a re-organization of the skill system and you're using it to cover up changes to ship consoles that have nothing to do with the skill system. Stealth Nerf is EXACTLY what it is and you know it. You're taking the oppurtunity to completely re-work game mechanics at every level and trying to pass it off as just a more simplistic way of presenting the skill chart.
You know exactly what you're doing, so don't try and say that us crying foul is a 'falsehood,' that's ridiculous and you know it. It's the same lack of transparency and communication that your staff has perpetuated for years and it's the exact reason the player base reacts the way that they do. The lack of trust comes with good reason, and this is just more of the same.
I try to be nice to the staff and respect the work that they do, but that post was a joke. You made a change that wasn't advertised and the player base found it and now you're mad about it.
I thought the nerf to kemocite was a little heavy handed, but I supported it even though I had spent several million ec on it. Unfortunately, I'm noticing a trend now. Cryptic happily release a lockbox with overpowered stuff in it. Let's it's players buy it up then once the box has run its course and is no longer profitable nerf it. It honestly wouldn't be a huge deal, but people paid for these things and it's, at least in my view, bad form to advertise a product as something then change it later on under the guise of "balance". Let's be honest sto isn't balanced and will never be balanced. Cryptics entire business model revolves around releasing more and more power creep to the masses every few months for moar profit. So any talk from them of balance is laughable. It makes me wary of purchasing anything. Why take the chance of wasting money, or time, acquiring in game items if they will just nerf them at a later date? I think this was a bad move on their part.
In this case however that's not entirely true.
The plasmonic leech is not actually a lockbox creation but existed already long before that.
"If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross. But it's not for the timid." - Q
what a shock. cryptic once again worrying about the top 5% dpsers and handing 100% a nerf to fight them.
...and thinking they are being sneaky about it.
I think folks need to keep in mind as well that what's happening on Tribble is NOT the final build just yet. It was put onto Tribble for the purposes of testing specifically for issues like this and others. Give them time, they'll get things lined out.
"Someone once told me that time was a predator that stalked us all our lives. I rather believe that time is a companion who goes with us on the journey and reminds us to cherish every moment, because it will never come again." - Jean Luc Picard in Star Trek Generations
I think folks need to keep in mind as well that what's happening on Tribble is NOT the final build just yet. It was put onto Tribble for the purposes of testing specifically for issues like this and others. Give them time, they'll get things lined out.
Don't bother.
This is just an example that people don't know or care about it being a work in progress.
This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
I think folks need to keep in mind as well that what's happening on Tribble is NOT the final build just yet. It was put onto Tribble for the purposes of testing specifically for issues like this and others. Give them time, they'll get things lined out.
Don't bother.
This is just an example that people don't know or care about it being a work in progress.
It IS a work in progress and NOW is the time to be concerned about it before the change goes to the live server and then it's a backward fight to get the changes undone. Complain NOW WHILE they are adjusting things. Don't wait and then fight it.
They are requesting feedback for good reasons, not all feedback will be sunshine and roses though.
Comments
The above 2 images are from my tribble build currently. the only changes that i've made are going to the new system. Below are is my holodeck build and numbers on the leech.
Above are my holodeck numbers. As you can see this is a huge drop for me. Due to this I can only assume that drain expertise is not scaling properly in comparison with its holodeck counterparts currently or a nerf has been made. I'm assuming based on some posts that this is currently being looked at for possible balancing purposes. No change have been made save going to the new system. This is one of the major things that could potentially effect my build negatively at the moment. Needless to say this confuses me if it's supposed to be a 1:1 or mostly 1:1 thing.
Star Trek Online volunteer Community Moderator
Low, sure. But if you specialize in Drains then it will be running almost constantly. It will like having an extra weapon equipped, albeit a lesser Marked one.
To keep on Topic: I am indifferent about Leech. Energy Siphon I like to use, though. That hit will be worse for me.
Re-read the tooltip for DrainX. You get 100% skill effectiveness/value/whatever for Power Insulators, but 50% for actual drain... And then there's probably a leech nerf on top of that...
Stop new content until quality returns
That's nice. Where/which one?
Stop new content until quality returns
Bottom of page #21
That's the problem that myself and alot of others are having. If they're doing a 1:1 conversion and we're supposed to be able to 100% replicate our builds that we have on holodeck, then this seriously puts a damper on that as we won't be able to replicate our builds with drains having been potentially severely nerfed going off face value. i'm just confused overall as to what everything is supposed to be.
Star Trek Online volunteer Community Moderator
Yeah, Plasmonic Leech WILL get hammered but the rest of Drains are going down with it.
By "most" you mean you because almost every comment below that one is negative.
This^
Do appreciate the link though, thank you, not sure I'd have found it before giving up given how far in it was.
I do agree with the base assessment that the leech is dominating a lot of peoples thoughts, but frankly, that's the part I don't get. It's useful, sure, but is it broken? I'd actually still go with no. I'm willing to bet that if they hadn't opened it up to being distributed through cross-faction packs the argument would still be here but you'd still have the Fed-core whining about KDF having it rather than complaining about how it's being nerfed after they paid so much for it in ECs which is, well, 'meh, I did too, tough shizzle, let's move on'.
Let's not get into what-might-have-beens though.
Stop new content until quality returns
Do you actually believe that? I'm very sorry dude but that IS a bunch of real BS. Just a small tiny example...real whales spent real money on this game without knowing which buttons to push...unless those buttons are used to buy.
Original STO beta tester.
Because when it was first released it could ONLY be used on a single mid tier ship, and that was pretty balanced.
I'm yes and no on this. I don't think it should've been allowed outside of the KDF. I'd also have liked to see more factional differences across the board. From around about the time the Oddy/Bort launched (I think it was about then), a lot of what started coming out for the Feds was 'x class ship in career variants' with KDF and later Rom skinned versions and little more. I mean who knows? Perhaps there would've been something else as effective come up for the Feds that wasn't the MACO shield...
Stop new content until quality returns
They don't 'get it' because it's NOT. ****ING. TRUE.
If you don't have plasmonic leech, you are 100% exempt from the consequences of nerfing it. If you don't have inspirational leader, you don't give a flying targ's backside it's getting cut in half.
Buffing everything except antiproton helps everybody except the people abusing the snot out of the only energy proc that scales with crit chance
The 'high end' is built on combos you can down tune or outright ravage without touching the majority of 10k crowd at all.
Time will tell. I was absent for most of Kemocite follies, I did buy the Pilot Escorts b/c I favored the idea of penetration on my torps and got burned by "a correction." At the end of the day this interaction between the powers that be and the client base will determine how far they can go on the "we need balance" justification gambit and whether or not another mass exodus would finish the game off.
Given my family has three lifetime accounts going back to launch I am in no way shape or form in love with the devolution of the game towards Pew-Pew Space Barbie or a client base so burned it leaves.
I hope both sides choose wisely, but as wary as I am of "corrections" I am just as wary of lockbox console necessitated "I win" buttons.
Edging on falsehood? You have to be kidding.
You can't really think that snip you posted in any way informed people that you were going to nerf the Plasmonic Leech.
Remember the part of the announcement 'players lose nothing?' sound familiar? This is supposed to be a re-organization of the skill system and you're using it to cover up changes to ship consoles that have nothing to do with the skill system. Stealth Nerf is EXACTLY what it is and you know it. You're taking the oppurtunity to completely re-work game mechanics at every level and trying to pass it off as just a more simplistic way of presenting the skill chart.
You know exactly what you're doing, so don't try and say that us crying foul is a 'falsehood,' that's ridiculous and you know it. It's the same lack of transparency and communication that your staff has perpetuated for years and it's the exact reason the player base reacts the way that they do. The lack of trust comes with good reason, and this is just more of the same.
I try to be nice to the staff and respect the work that they do, but that post was a joke. You made a change that wasn't advertised and the player base found it and now you're mad about it.
So much for 'players lose nothing.'
It's dead Jim...
I got most of my plasmonic leeches (7 of them) from 1 t3 ship purchase. And the information is all over the place. Ask in zone chat, theyll even be able to tell you. Between piloting, and clicking things in the right order, 5k turns into 30k+ very quickly, almost completely regardless of gear.
In this case however that's not entirely true.
The plasmonic leech is not actually a lockbox creation but existed already long before that.
...and thinking they are being sneaky about it.
free jkname
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Star Trek Online volunteer Community Moderator
Don't bother.
This is just an example that people don't know or care about it being a work in progress.
It IS a work in progress and NOW is the time to be concerned about it before the change goes to the live server and then it's a backward fight to get the changes undone. Complain NOW WHILE they are adjusting things. Don't wait and then fight it.
They are requesting feedback for good reasons, not all feedback will be sunshine and roses though.