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So I see they're continuing to go the opposite direction regarding exclusivity, with the patch
jeanlucpicante
Member Posts: 9 Arc User
Why be so punitive towards your casual players in such a way that even investing in the game monetarily does not relieve the punitive nature of your model? Why? There's only so many people that will be able to drop everything they're doing and come to every event, and I seriously question the percentage of those that actually have an income to contribute to the fiscal well-being of a business.
Hands down, 100%, the single biggest problem I have with this game is the sheer volume of stuff that is exclusive/time sensitive, and how punitive it is for people, ya know, with lives?
I like a lot about this game, but I don't understand why they want to alienate so many casual players, do they believe someone will change their RL schedules, cancel a vacation, change their work hours, just to earn a stupid ship? Perhaps they should open up the past event ships to veteran/LTS rewards in some way. My solution, is there are three exclusive event ships per year, why not give 1,000 day vets/LTS one event ship voucher per year? It would take someone like me a very long time to get the backlog, and I'd have to still grind the others when I was here, and when I cannot be here, well, I'd have to choose which one I want the most. For those dutiful and very loud people who have faithfully committed to the event ship grind every single time (I SWEAR this must be a superminority despite the squeaky wheels in the forums) they get to use their voucher to skip one of the grinds and go straight to grinding rep for the entire event.
I love star trek, and I enjoy the game when I can be here, but the experience is unfortunately bittersweet, and has and will continue to affect how I spend my money, why should I spend another penny in a game where f2p accounts have the same if not more benefits? (our family f2p account got a free pathfinder ship code/package in the mail, my LTS account doesn't have this, for example.)
I applaud STO for giving so much away, this initially encouraged me to spend money, so many f2p models are very greedy and naggy, but really, I have a dreadnought package, and that's pretty much it, for LTS, and I'm sure there's some crazy guy out there with a dozen f2p accounts that all have every single accountwide event ship, because some people approach a game like a job, and other people see it as more of a casual put-it-down-and-pick-it-up experience.
All time sensitive unlocks should be available for vets/LTS at their leisure, they supported the game and paid for that right, and they are more likely to have "real lives" which preclude STO pilgrimages like clockwork three times a year, because as fun as it is, let's face it, it's just a game, one of THOUSANDS of f2p/microtrans games.
Hands down, 100%, the single biggest problem I have with this game is the sheer volume of stuff that is exclusive/time sensitive, and how punitive it is for people, ya know, with lives?
I like a lot about this game, but I don't understand why they want to alienate so many casual players, do they believe someone will change their RL schedules, cancel a vacation, change their work hours, just to earn a stupid ship? Perhaps they should open up the past event ships to veteran/LTS rewards in some way. My solution, is there are three exclusive event ships per year, why not give 1,000 day vets/LTS one event ship voucher per year? It would take someone like me a very long time to get the backlog, and I'd have to still grind the others when I was here, and when I cannot be here, well, I'd have to choose which one I want the most. For those dutiful and very loud people who have faithfully committed to the event ship grind every single time (I SWEAR this must be a superminority despite the squeaky wheels in the forums) they get to use their voucher to skip one of the grinds and go straight to grinding rep for the entire event.
I love star trek, and I enjoy the game when I can be here, but the experience is unfortunately bittersweet, and has and will continue to affect how I spend my money, why should I spend another penny in a game where f2p accounts have the same if not more benefits? (our family f2p account got a free pathfinder ship code/package in the mail, my LTS account doesn't have this, for example.)
I applaud STO for giving so much away, this initially encouraged me to spend money, so many f2p models are very greedy and naggy, but really, I have a dreadnought package, and that's pretty much it, for LTS, and I'm sure there's some crazy guy out there with a dozen f2p accounts that all have every single accountwide event ship, because some people approach a game like a job, and other people see it as more of a casual put-it-down-and-pick-it-up experience.
All time sensitive unlocks should be available for vets/LTS at their leisure, they supported the game and paid for that right, and they are more likely to have "real lives" which preclude STO pilgrimages like clockwork three times a year, because as fun as it is, let's face it, it's just a game, one of THOUSANDS of f2p/microtrans games.
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it amazes me how many people come out with the "I have got work, family, life" TRIBBLE to excuse not playing timed events, they seem to be under some illusion that the only players who do take part in these events don't have any of these things.
the best laugh is the "I was away from home on vacation/business" rubbish excuse.
they get no sympathy from me as I have work a family and a full life outside of sto but I can always spare the few minutes a day it takes to get the ships while the events are running and amazingly I have often been away from home during the events but my laptop and mobile internet goes with me so even that doesn't stop me taking part.
so from one lifer to another either make time or don't but either way don't think your lifetime sub gives you the right to gain rewards without having to play the game when they are available.
in any case as you are a casual player you should not need many ships if you cant spare the time to actually use them.
When I think about everything we've been through together,
maybe it's not the destination that matters, maybe it's the journey,
and if that journey takes a little longer,
so we can do something we all believe in,
I can't think of any place I'd rather be or any people I'd rather be with.
Actually, there is no "TRIBBLE the rules, I have money". One of the "rules" is that any player can invest money to "buy" the anniversary ship.
And the method to do so is "Acquire Zen. Buy Master Keys. Use said keys to acquire Lobi. Spend Lobi on anniversary token packages. Get ship."
Granted, it's not something that comes directly from the LTS. However, if his LTS stipend has accumulated large enough, he should have the zen to do so...
Admittedly, it's going to take an (IMO) "ungodly" amount of money to get the ship, but the option exists...
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
the sheer arrogance and presumption in this quote is so much, it makes me wonder if the one in the quote has lost his mind to insanity for a moment and forgot what his day it is let alone trying to tell the difference between a life and a hole in the ground... but if it floats his boat, who am i to tell him to stop and think right? he thinks hes so right i will leave him to it.
seriously? i mean there are jobs out there that can go from 8-12 hours a day,plus travel time, plus work breaks, plus food shopping, family matters and other matters that may come up to ruin the day further. that does not leave any room for games and even if it does, the window is so small there may not be any point in trying.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
funnily enough "arrogance and presumption" were the two words that sprang to mind when I read the opening post, sure there are jobs and jobs I work 12 hours a day not including traveling time, I put in 60 hours a week, sometimes I work 74 hours a week if I have to cover shifts, I work days, nights, week ends and bank holidays, I was even working Christmas day.
I have a home life and a large family and I socialise a lot, obviously with a home and a large family I also have a lot of family matters and other matters to deal with.
funnily enough I still find time to play the event and get the ships.
but like I said if you haven't got that short amount of time to spare why care if you don't get the ship you haven't got time to use it anyway.
When I think about everything we've been through together,
maybe it's not the destination that matters, maybe it's the journey,
and if that journey takes a little longer,
so we can do something we all believe in,
I can't think of any place I'd rather be or any people I'd rather be with.
I expected some trolling responses, but you two guys above ^ and your oneliners are 100% trolling, and not at all conducive to real conversation by any stretch of the imagination.
Well, I'm one of those people who'd never pay for respec anyway, I mean you can't take PvP seriously in STO, which is fine with me as I'm more PvE, if you happen to be someone that would actually respec more than once or twice, then I guess that means a lot more to you than it does to me, I'm just here for the storyline and ambiance, I don't see much use minmaxing with this particular engine
Back to that topic: Let's say someone today, right now, discovers STO, buys LTS, spends $10,000 in zen all because they decide it's their favorite game and one of the only games they will play in the future, then they realize there are so many things %100 freep players have, console sets, breen carriers, etc, that they cannot have no matter how much they support the game. Bittersweet is a kind word in that situation, it seems fiscally irresponsible and overly punitive to the people who have contributed to the health of the game.
I'm concerned that the considerations of the people who want to consciously support the business has taken a back seat to the lockbox casino, why care about what anyone thinks when on the one hand you have a bunch of gloating f2pers and on the other hand you have a bunch of people with a gambling problem?
I appreciate your level-headedness, and Counter-Trolling, I knew the screaming minority would do everything to shut me down, they have their ships and are on top of the world in their own minds, TRIBBLE the rest of us, eh...
as I do not support outrage of OP (yeah the issue is there but by raging on forums we won;t change things... i think) that I aggree with him that your response is slightly out of place.
I don't know if you feel insecure or something about if your social life is social enought for society standard but truth is that they are people that in certain months/weeks are more busy than you - that they have more than enought stuff on their heads to not be able to participate in the event for the ship, even if you have so much social life family etc and still have time for doing so.
also not everyone can afford good enought mobile internet to play event when on vacation.
so Your rant about "rubbish excuses" is more rubbish than these excuses - just saying....
and on topic of exclusivity - oh I missed 2 week timeframe for reasons, shoudl that mean that I should not be able to even see if I'll like that ship? (not mentioning item sets hat for previous 2 anniversaries were bound to these ships..., warp core from deyson sci destroyer, console from samsar cruiser....
If you have so little free time you can't find 3 minutes a day, perhaps you should stop playing? Can I haz ur stuffs?
if a new player has spent $10,000 on the game its probable he has just about every ship the c-store has to offer, the last thing he is going to worry about is a hand full of event ships I would think.
When I think about everything we've been through together,
maybe it's not the destination that matters, maybe it's the journey,
and if that journey takes a little longer,
so we can do something we all believe in,
I can't think of any place I'd rather be or any people I'd rather be with.
unless its samsar cruiser we are talking about and the 4th console to command console set - then if he wanted to utilise to maximum his shiny command ships that could be an issue :P
well as I'm not whining about that thing as that winter dreadnought was ugly I indeed realised that winter event is going on and what rewards are in a moment when by simple calculation I've also realised that with amounts of day left on event I simply won't make enought of those portraits or whatever to get that dread...
[easy english translation - I had a little break from the game and I found out the t6 winter ship being a thing just on the end of december and judging by price, amounts of portraits possible to obtain daily, and the known to me duration of event I would not make it in time so I dropped it and just cared on]
I can see someone caring more on "gotta have them all" that in my situation could get a little bit mad...
we had all of these complaints when they retired the past summer ships, we had them again when they retired the past winter ships surely by now you have all got the message that all these rants are serving no purpose at all.
dredging this all up again for the past anniversary ships will not help any more then the other complaints, the past event ships are gone for good, from now on if you don't get them when they are available you wont get them ever.
I am happy and secure with my life the way it is thanks, if for some reason I could not get to play an event that would just be my bad luck but it would not bother me, I except that's just the way it is.
it seems to me that it is the ones who are worrying over the past ships are the ones that are insecure, in one breath they say they haven't got much time to play yet in the other they are worrying over a handful of ships they will likely never use anyway if they are so short on time.
they live such busy lives how do they ever get any time to play the game at all for that matter.
it seems to me it is them that are so insecure as to worry so much over some silly game when they are so busy working and vacationing and dealing with their family life, like getting these ships will make their life so much the better.
When I think about everything we've been through together,
maybe it's not the destination that matters, maybe it's the journey,
and if that journey takes a little longer,
so we can do something we all believe in,
I can't think of any place I'd rather be or any people I'd rather be with.
This statement right here is why people are calling the OP out on what sounds an awful lot like entitlement. "I payed cash so I should have X" is an old, worn out argument that doesn't really help anyone's case regarding anything in game. All it does it make the person making the argument sound childish. Sorry, but that's how it does come across.
The fact of the matter is, unless your computer is dead or you're working 24 hours a day, you should by all rights have time to hop on with at least one character and do whatever the daily is for the ship. They DID make it an account unlock so you don't have to grind your brains out if you have a case of altitis and have a lot more than one character.
While I do agree that locking certain setpiece items behind exclusive event ships (Kobali Samsar console and warp core anyone?) was a bad move as the full Kobali set and that console is pretty awesome (but still needs visuals for the set), the fact that they are locked behind last year's event ONLY means it hurts some players. I really wish they would take the Samsar and put it in the Lobi store like they did the event Dyson Destroyers. Or make it available via fleet like they did with the Obelisk Carrier. Give people an alternate means of obtaining these items off the ship or even the ship itself if they were unable to acquire it during the event.
A: EVERY game is dying because of advances in technology. Even if it just came out. Only a matter of when it dies. I for one believe STO will live a long time.
B: You missed the Dooooom Thread by at least a year.
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite
colored text = mod mode
Their Annorax, Jem'Hadar AS & SS, Herald 3-ship-set and 200 C-Store ships will ease the terrible pain at least slightly.
As if retiring ships just because they can or for this 'exclusivity' thing serves any purpose. I've pointed out, several times, that it serves no purpose at all, that it's in fact bad for the game since they're missing money and play time from those that are interested in ships that are already there anyway.
Besides, there may be a purpose. I can't speak for the other 'ranters', as you call them (I'd rather say they're worried and disappointed players). But the reason I've posted in the threads of all the retired ships is because I assume that the company is ruled by reasonable people who are willing to consider arguments. So far, we haven't heard any arguments from them as to why this would be a good decision, beside some vague terms like 'exclusiveness' (which in itself is no valid argument when there's so many good counter-arguments). All we get are those who defend the decision and who call those who oppose it 'whiners', we're even discussing how busy one has to be before he can rightfully claim that he didn't have the time to play during the event.
Add to that the lack of information regarding console sets (for example, with the Command Cruisers) and no official response as to whether these ships or their important parts will be made available through other means (which has been respectfully requested by various people on multiple occasions) or if we will ever see a re-run event and I'm not surprised that people are annoyed.
I had hoped that we would see an official blog post, here on the Forum, that answers these questions. I know, that if I had made a decision such as this one, I would have done such a thing, but only after the decision was entirely made for all the events. Which happened this evening. Of course they wouldn't start the debate over and over again, - that is, starting a debate after retiring the summer ships, the winter ships and the anniversary ships-, but now that all event ships have been officially declared retired, it would be the right moment to adress these issues and answer these questions.
Until then, I can fully understand that people keep asking these questions. It's not like we've received any real explanations why this change was made, suddenly, without properly informing everyone when it still could make a difference.
Technically you could say the Support Cruiser Retrofit was retired as well, however they did put in in one of the C-Store giveaways as an account unlock so we still have T5 Ambassadors flying around that aren't fleet. Wish they'd do the same with the T5 Kamarag Retrofit. That was my KDF's baby.
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite
colored text = mod mode
Sorry, but that's just too simple. Like all companies, they have to consider the wishes and concerns of their customers, even if it's just a single customer that has legitimate concerns or is showing understandable disappointment.
And even if it were the only reason they need: like I said, I assume the company is run by reasonable people who can explain their actions to make things easier acceptable. Or at least respond to good suggestions that have been made (those who support this decision may pretend that people are only complaining but that's just not true). I'm sure that if they at least presented some good reasons, and provide more information as to their future plans, that it would benefit themselves as well.
Here is a ton of words. The first few lines your first post was about how the event grind is bad for casual players then everything gets weird. Your "fix" is put the bypass for the event grind behind a pretty huge cash wall.
I'm pretty sure casual players and people who sub or threw down a few 100s for LTS are not two groups with a lot of overlapping.
Here's a poorly thought out analogy. The king is crazed, the poor are hungry, and the people revolt. A subgroup of the revolting people take the throne and kingdom, they get all that they wanted but everyone else not part of this subgroup is hosed.
So yeah, I will say sorry for what I did but asking me to join a revolt that I have no chance of coming out ahead on will get you memed on
However, I think I got one thing out of it, and my answer is this: it all depends on what you want. I've never tried to get a special event ship because I just don't need any more ships. But suppose you just have-ta, have-ta have that ship--then to get it, you have to play by the rules. If you can't play by the rules, you don't get the ship. That's how it works, LTS or no LTS.
Sure, I think that retiring ships is kind of stupid. If I had to make a new account, I'd be rather discouraged at the fact that it'd never measure up to my current one because of all the missing event rewards. It really would be nice if previous-year rewards (which players earned for free at the time) were offered up in some way or another to latecomers. Maybe a slow, ongoing grind not linked to an event, maybe a lobi/zen/ec purchase, or maybe something else entirely. The club wear unlocks followed this model rather nicely.
From a developer standpoint, limited-time rewards is a cheap but effective tactic. It lights fires under players asses and keeps them engaged, and it really is fine in moderation. However, STO over the years has gradually ramped this up and I really think it's time they started to tread carefully. Player engagement through limited-time rewards has its place, however it shouldn't be used as a substitute for richer game content.
Reward your longtime players, but don't make the newer ones feel like they have an impassable wall separating them from the veterans. Removing content seldom sits well with players, so there's really no reason to do as excessively as it has been happening lately.
- - -
In short, I support them changing the currency, as I'm pretty sure their design with switching to account-wide unlocks wasn't "just marathon the event currency one year on a bunch of alts, then retire from that event forever." The limited-time rewards, however, need to be reined in, because they're already getting a bit out of hand. Some of them (such as the crystalline spike, zefram cochrane shotgun, breen carrier, etc) are actually really good. And admiralty makes even the most questionable event ships extremely useful.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."