Judging from the limited time discount at the bottom it will be released next Thursday.
This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
It isn't my intention to rain on your parade but he's stating a negative, honey muffin.
It follows he only needs to provide sufficient evidence of absence and/or proof of impossibility to establish the shadow of doubt. In this particular case the evidence of absence is implicit: Cryptic has provided no explanation, therefore there is no evidence of an explanation existing. That's enough to fulfill his role: As no explanation has been provided, it is possible for an explanation not to exist.
As we have established the shadow of doubt, per probatio diabolica the burden of proof is now on you. So can you provide sufficient evidence to prove beyond the shadow of doubt an explanation does exist for why secondary deflectors are unable to be implemented on those ships he mentioned?
Furthermore, given the following statements are both true:
1. Cryptic has implemented secondary deflectors on some ships.
2. Cryptic has full access to the code.
We can say the following statements are both true as well:
1. It is possible to implement secondary deflectors.
2. Cryptic has all it needs to do so.
Thus we have proof of impossibility as well: In demonstrating it is possible for Cryptic to implement it, we have demonstrated it is impossible for there to be a reason because of which it can't be implemented. Per probatio diabolica the burden of proof is again on you: Can you demonstrate beyond the shadow of doubt that these two statements being true does not mean it is impossible for there to be a reason because of which they can't implement it?
Otherwise Puttenham statement stands: As no reason has been given and no reason can possibly be given, there is quite literally no reason his nova class, or other science vessel, shouldn't be able to equip a secondary deflector.
And as a friendly piece of advice, if you are going to play it pedantic and start asking for formal demonstration during informal internet discussions at least learn the rules for burden of proof and proving negatives beforehand.
I wasn't actually trying to convince you about anything, I was just pointing out my belief of the uselessness of the "If you don't like it, walk away" argument that has become so common on the forum.
Doesn't mean it's not justified, though I'll be the first to say that not every instance of it is justified. People tell it to someone who's merely complaining about one or two things? Not justified. Someone telling someone else who is complaining about the entire game that? IMHO it kinda is justified.
As for the minority argument, see above in the reply I wrote to westx211. I know that forumites are generally a minority in the games' populations, it's common knowledge for anyone that plays these games. I just wanted to point out that if you expect others to provide proof of their claims you should be prepared to do so yourself as well.
Fair enough, but if you're not trying to either 1-give your opinion or 2-convince someone, why even post?
Besides, I did demonstrate it via pointing out the way that STO is growing. Games can't funds themselves, and most people don't wanna spend money on something they don't like. Most likely, it's because people enjoy playing this game that they continue funding it.
I didn't say that. I was just pointing out that whenever a complaint pops-up on the board, there is usually someone being a wise guy/gal and pointing towards the door, regardless of the validity of the complaint or the person behind it.
In that context, my "rabid fanboy" remark was aimed to point out that if everyone who has any issue with the game or the developers is told to STFU and leave, the only people who'll be left are the ones that genuinely believe there are no issues in the game whatsoever, which in the case of a game like STO could only be a handfull of rabid fanboys.
Guess we weren't on the same page then. Can't say I know of anyone who thinks that Cryptic is completely faultless(outside of a few obvious forum trolls that frequent here), but I'll gladly speak out against them as well.
Actually, many people are dissatisfied with the game. To many, DR seemed to be the breaking point, which is sad. It's not a question of tracking down numbers only. Especially ones prior DR. My fleets are generally ok in popualtion and as they've always been, but I can't really turn a blind eye to the empty queues ever since DR released, more than a month now. That doesn't bode well. And many people I know that still do play really are dissatisfied with the game's current state. But some people can't just give up what they worked for and enjoyed for a long time just like that, that's where numbers may lie.
Yes, the pugs have turned low in number. But isn't that just because it's better to organize a group now?
About the larger updates....unfortunately, it's not true. If anything, starting this year the updates are getting smaller and smaller. Season 9 was one of the smallest most insignificant releases ever, no story attached, repurposed what was announced as a later part of S8 for the Voth to be about Undine instead and a couple of queues one of which has been bugged since release to this day. Season 9.5.....lol that wasn't even a thing. More like a Thursday's patch.
Delta Rising? Apart from being the most rushed, broken and bugged expansion/update I've ever seen in a game, it's nowhere near as big as LoR was - the game's previous expansion. It's more like a glorified season TBH.
So no, it's not getting any bigger unfortunately. As much as I'd want it too.
*examines the season's and expansion's content again*
Fair enough. I just always get irritated when I see those words, because they've been used far too many times to shake off very valid complaints and negative feedback. Maybe not by you personally, but others have used them in that manner and I really hate that.
For what it's worth, I don't see many instances of it myself. Excluding, ironically enough, when someone posted that towards me when I was complaining about Tovan Khev. =p
Mhmmm.. You will never be .. ahmm.. what is the english word for the people who refill the snack and coffee vendors, and bring items from one office to the other?
You could have been the Executor Manager or what ever it is called, of this department..
My guess is Thursday, cause next Thursday is thanksgiving and I don't think anyone will be at Cryptic for that day or weekend until the following week. Thursday after is launch of winter event so my money is on day after tomorrow, especially where they mention the thursday through Monday discount thing.
I honestly don't mind them making money, as long as they keep adding content (which they do) rather than just raking money off a stagnant game I'm fine with them continually adding new things to buy, after all, it's optional for us to buy them.
I really like the look & intention of the Pathfinder.
I'd be 100% entirely happy with this new ship if I could just spend an upgrade token on my current T5-U intrepid and it would turn into a T6 Pathfinder. What I don't want to have to do is pay full T6 prices for a ship I already own 95% of - especially when I'd end up with a T5U intrepid sitting in my hangar unused because really, why use a T5u version of a ship when you have the T6 version of that ship? Makes so much more sense to offer upgrades to T5U owners.
Especially since, being new to the game, I've only recently purchased my T5U intrepid. I would probably feel differently if I'd had it for months.
I'm not asking for 'free' anything, I know they need to make money and I'm totally happy to support that (hence why I buy Zen things, to support a game I really enjoy playing), but an upgrade option seems like a very fair and expected thing to do here.
Making sense and making a profit can be two different things sometimes.
If it were just a T5U to T6 Intrepid, ok 100 to 200 Zen upgrade.... but, nope... the made a whole new ship skin, so now they have the excuse to charge full price. Very shrewd business move, which would have been made more apparent if they actually showed pictures of the Pathfinder.
Star Trek Battles Channel - Play Star Trek like they did in the series!Avatar: pinterest-com/pin/14003448816884219Are you sure it isn't time for a "colorful metaphor"? --Spock in 'The Voyage Home' SCE ADVISORY NOTICE: Improper Impulse Engine maintenance can result in REAR THRUSTER LEAKAGE. ALWAYS have your work inspected by another qualified officer.
Well, it find that it a bit strange, the u advertise the new T6 pathfinder in this blog, but not even one little picutre of it.
Selling new T6 ship ship... no problem with that
Selling new T6 ship with that can use older skin.. well not to good for those who upgraded but still can live with it.
But how u guys doing that, look like u just want us to buy the same ship two times.....
While I thought that the Intrepid visuals during the DR trailer, mention of updated interiors (important to some but not me), and the absence of an updated Intrepid given the new T6 ships (up to this point) and a Delta Quadrant was a clear indication, to me, that a T6 Intrepid version was on the way, being more direct about a T6 release in this case would have been better for your image and bottom dollar.
As it stand s now, some players may assume that all pre-T6 purchasable ship will be reintroduced at some point and see the cost of the T5 upgrade system as disingenuous, a bait, and in negative terms.
That said, given that the Aero Shuttle was originally an atmospheric ship it would make sense to give the Intrepid the ability to slot the Delta Flyer for space missions and combat.
I'd like to see:
A discount for those who have purchased the Intrepid before.
A unique secondary deflector
More Science/Science vessels like this please
While I resigned myself to the reality of possibly having to buy another Intrepid, I'm not happy about it.
P.S. I'm not a fan of the new Luna-ish, downward swept nacelles, look.
If only the player base was split into 6:2:2 ratios there might BE more Rom and KDF ships. I think its going to be up to the players to make more rom and kdf captains and BUY rom and kdf stuff to make them getting more ships a reality.
That's what I was about to say / ask.
How is the playerbase split up?
I'm sure Cryptic has a list of how many players are in each faction, how many play, and for how many hours, etc etc.
To have all this Fed. stuff must be because more peeps play the Fed. then the other two combined. This is more money to be made by making Fed. stuff.
And this is Star Trek, you know about the Federation, the rest of the stuff is just support cast :P
i have a couple of points on this . one i feel for Thomas the Cat . its a nice looking interesting design . but to have it completely left out of the offical blog is meh .
the other is the time frame , for ppl that bought a upgrade token or a pack of upgrade tokens and taken a Fleet intrepid to the FT5U then in a couple of weeks release this . that upgrade could have gone to another ship then purchase of the T6 pathfinder to then just wait for the new fleet. or such .
this ship pack should have been released at launch of DR with the DR pack . not saying it should have been in the DR pack but along side it . not weeks after launch .
great $5 discount for those that spend $7 on a token hmm .
as for the stats , im not sure what they were thinking . other than the ship trait and the use of intel doffs in the mean time til the FT6 its kinda lacking in all accounts from first glance . im not looking for highly tact ship but it should be on par with the other T6 sci and intel ships with the universal set there should be accounted space for which i dont see of the bat .
I'd rather have more canon-inspired originals like the Intel series, Guardian, Odyssey, and Dyson series (maybe the Vesta series as well), though I would love it if Cryptic just changed all the T5 3-ship packs to T6; they're already 90% of the way there (10 consoles default like T6 ships, scaling and 1- 4 Masteries at T5U, 11 consoles already programmed and set for Fleet versions). It would both pad the T6 lineup, sell more packs, and pad KDF/Rom with a Sci-ship + Mastery Trait and a 4th Ship-based Mastery trait.
Especially when any further release of some old canon ship would just incite another ****estorm like the Intrepid is doing now. It won't matter how far in the future a T6 "canon" ship would be released; it's going to spark another flamestorm.
At least Cryptic has CBS' blessing on allowing originals as long as they conform to certain standards, which not only allows them to better customize based on current and future specialization and abilities, but allows them to avoid the legion of rabid fans raging over how their favorite ship got an upgrade but isn't to their liking (most vocal currently being the Galaxy-X fans, though now in this thread, Intrepid fans).
People complaining about the console reduction forget that this is a T6 C-Store ship. 10 Consoles. Fleet versions will get 11.
Nice Idea and I do actualy prefer the design to the newer ships atm.....I am not going to buy it however. I bought the Life time mebership the girst month I played, and each and every new tier ship has been offered to me for each new rank. I would think hitting Fleet Admiral would be worthy of a new ship as well. A new race to play is interseting, but I have my maim sitting in her OLD Deffy and no, she isn't leaving it for anything you have created to this point. Sadly, this is why I left STO for about two years......Gold Members were being dealt a bad hand and again, I am starting to feel that way just a few months back. Please concider that I and so many others Gold members stayed with STO when Cryptic was beening sold and we had almost nothing to do but play the old (and my favorite) STFs. It's hard to think that alot of the DEVs have no idea what the Old STFs were like. The old STFs gave reasons for fleets to grow, for friendships to be formed and for players to band together to beat a real test of their toon's. Please, think hard about the direction 6you take the game, the Queued events are not a design I like nor is the fact a ship design is not being offered for a Gold Members new rank.
Pre dr....I'd have bought an intrepid pack on general principle much as I did the Gal-x pack.
Post dr....not a chance for many of the reasons others have stated.
The fanboy in me wants it....but I am just feeling too burned with no end in sight.
I can only hope enough people who spent money on this game feel as I do and put a huge dent in cryptic's profit projections. Maybe such losses will effect some positive change.
Bottom line... I know much of the new dr stuff was inspired to get us to spend more money but it has had the opposite effect on me.
Is it possible to use the Bellephon or Intrepid skins on the Pathfinder? If not, that would be a deal breaker for me even though I want the interiors more than any of it.
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Looking for a new fleet? Drop by the in-game chat channel, "tenforwardforum", and say hi to the members of A Fleet Called Ten Forward (Fed) and The Orion Pirates (KDF). If you already have a fleet you are happy with, please feel free to drop by our chat channel if you are looking for a friendly bunch of helpful people to socialize with.
Is it possible to use the Bellephon or Intrepid skins on the Pathfinder? If not, that would be a deal breaker for me even though I want the interiors more than any of it.
I would hedge a bet that you can, its the usual practice
And owners of the ship currently have reported some issues with the two skins recently, which is indicative of some back end changes to make them compatable I think.
These are the Voyages on the STO forum, the final frontier. Our continuing mission: to explore Pretentious Posts, to seek out new Overreactions and Misinformation , to boldly experience Cynicism like no man has before.......
The amount of content demonstrates otherwise. Besides, aren't those only Steam users? Hardly a gauge for the entire STO community.
*awaits inevitable "nice cherrypicking there" comment from someone* :rolleyes:
Way late but okay.
It's true the Steam numbers don't represent the whole of the STO player numbers, but the sample is large enough that using it as a ballpark estimate isn't at all unreasonable. Far from ideal, but in absence of concrete numbers from more sources, it'll suffice.
I was considering using the free upgrade token I got as an 800 day veteran to upgrade the Fleet Intrepid on my 'Voyager' character, guess I'll be keeping that token for another ship/character now!
I do love how Cryptic/PWE are taking double dipping to a whole new level with Delta Rising! :rolleyes: Personally I feel that anyone who has upgraded their T5 Intrepid to T5-U should get a 700 Zen discount on the T6 Intrepid. I would also like to see a discount on bundle packs when you've already bought part of the bundle, proportionate to how much of the bundle you already own. :cool:
Comments
Judging from the limited time discount at the bottom it will be released next Thursday.
It isn't my intention to rain on your parade but he's stating a negative, honey muffin.
It follows he only needs to provide sufficient evidence of absence and/or proof of impossibility to establish the shadow of doubt. In this particular case the evidence of absence is implicit: Cryptic has provided no explanation, therefore there is no evidence of an explanation existing. That's enough to fulfill his role: As no explanation has been provided, it is possible for an explanation not to exist.
As we have established the shadow of doubt, per probatio diabolica the burden of proof is now on you. So can you provide sufficient evidence to prove beyond the shadow of doubt an explanation does exist for why secondary deflectors are unable to be implemented on those ships he mentioned?
Furthermore, given the following statements are both true:
1. Cryptic has implemented secondary deflectors on some ships.
2. Cryptic has full access to the code.
We can say the following statements are both true as well:
1. It is possible to implement secondary deflectors.
2. Cryptic has all it needs to do so.
Thus we have proof of impossibility as well: In demonstrating it is possible for Cryptic to implement it, we have demonstrated it is impossible for there to be a reason because of which it can't be implemented. Per probatio diabolica the burden of proof is again on you: Can you demonstrate beyond the shadow of doubt that these two statements being true does not mean it is impossible for there to be a reason because of which they can't implement it?
Otherwise Puttenham statement stands: As no reason has been given and no reason can possibly be given, there is quite literally no reason his nova class, or other science vessel, shouldn't be able to equip a secondary deflector.
And as a friendly piece of advice, if you are going to play it pedantic and start asking for formal demonstration during informal internet discussions at least learn the rules for burden of proof and proving negatives beforehand.
Fair enough, but if you're not trying to either 1-give your opinion or 2-convince someone, why even post?
Besides, I did demonstrate it via pointing out the way that STO is growing. Games can't funds themselves, and most people don't wanna spend money on something they don't like. Most likely, it's because people enjoy playing this game that they continue funding it.
Indeed, but is every instance of it unjustified?
Guess we weren't on the same page then. Can't say I know of anyone who thinks that Cryptic is completely faultless(outside of a few obvious forum trolls that frequent here), but I'll gladly speak out against them as well.
Yes, the pugs have turned low in number. But isn't that just because it's better to organize a group now?
*examines the season's and expansion's content again*
I humbly disagree.
For what it's worth, I don't see many instances of it myself. Excluding, ironically enough, when someone posted that towards me when I was complaining about Tovan Khev. =p
Best idea yet.
Helpful Tools: Dictionary.com - Logical fallacies - Random generator - Word generator - Color tool - Extra Credits - List of common English language errors - New T6 Big booty tutorial
Mhmmm.. You will never be .. ahmm.. what is the english word for the people who refill the snack and coffee vendors, and bring items from one office to the other?
You could have been the Executor Manager or what ever it is called, of this department..
My guess is Thursday, cause next Thursday is thanksgiving and I don't think anyone will be at Cryptic for that day or weekend until the following week. Thursday after is launch of winter event so my money is on day after tomorrow, especially where they mention the thursday through Monday discount thing.
Release iconic ship
ReRelease iconic t-5u ship for a high price
ReReRelease iconic ship as a t-6 for an even higher price?
Im betting alot of gullible morons will buy this load of TRIBBLE like good little sheep.
Hey craptic the Grand nagus on ferenginar called ...he says he is very proud of you
Whhooooaaaaa that was unique.
You should start a second career as writer of gift cards
Wai wait wait. You forgot about the FLEET T6 variant that will no doubt be out in a few months time.
Then all the 'morons' can go through this, all over again... Like good little sheep.:P
FEDs must be loaded to be able to afford this BS business plan... Variant of a variant, of a variant.
ITS THE SAME DAME SHIP U FOOLS...
To dame funny...
D,
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Please keep the QQ to a minimum.
>>>PUNISH THE FEDs<<<
>>>Positive Feedback from a PvE HERO<<<
Yeah i might just try sending this to hallmark ....you know since its the holliday season and all....
U mad santa?
KDF
ROM
I guess the Feds just don't know how to make ships. They always have to remake them over and over again.
Making sense and making a profit can be two different things sometimes.
If it were just a T5U to T6 Intrepid, ok 100 to 200 Zen upgrade.... but, nope... the made a whole new ship skin, so now they have the excuse to charge full price. Very shrewd business move, which would have been made more apparent if they actually showed pictures of the Pathfinder.
SCE ADVISORY NOTICE: Improper Impulse Engine maintenance can result in REAR THRUSTER LEAKAGE. ALWAYS have your work inspected by another qualified officer.
Selling new T6 ship ship... no problem with that
Selling new T6 ship with that can use older skin.. well not to good for those who upgraded but still can live with it.
But how u guys doing that, look like u just want us to buy the same ship two times.....
While I thought that the Intrepid visuals during the DR trailer, mention of updated interiors (important to some but not me), and the absence of an updated Intrepid given the new T6 ships (up to this point) and a Delta Quadrant was a clear indication, to me, that a T6 Intrepid version was on the way, being more direct about a T6 release in this case would have been better for your image and bottom dollar.
As it stand s now, some players may assume that all pre-T6 purchasable ship will be reintroduced at some point and see the cost of the T5 upgrade system as disingenuous, a bait, and in negative terms.
That said, given that the Aero Shuttle was originally an atmospheric ship it would make sense to give the Intrepid the ability to slot the Delta Flyer for space missions and combat.
I'd like to see:
While I resigned myself to the reality of possibly having to buy another Intrepid, I'm not happy about it.
P.S. I'm not a fan of the new Luna-ish, downward swept nacelles, look.
Gahhh .. why couldn't this been in at launch? Itsss pressssousssss
That's what I was about to say / ask.
How is the playerbase split up?
I'm sure Cryptic has a list of how many players are in each faction, how many play, and for how many hours, etc etc.
To have all this Fed. stuff must be because more peeps play the Fed. then the other two combined. This is more money to be made by making Fed. stuff.
And this is Star Trek, you know about the Federation, the rest of the stuff is just support cast :P
i have a couple of points on this . one i feel for Thomas the Cat . its a nice looking interesting design . but to have it completely left out of the offical blog is meh .
the other is the time frame , for ppl that bought a upgrade token or a pack of upgrade tokens and taken a Fleet intrepid to the FT5U then in a couple of weeks release this . that upgrade could have gone to another ship then purchase of the T6 pathfinder to then just wait for the new fleet. or such .
this ship pack should have been released at launch of DR with the DR pack . not saying it should have been in the DR pack but along side it . not weeks after launch .
great $5 discount for those that spend $7 on a token hmm .
as for the stats , im not sure what they were thinking . other than the ship trait and the use of intel doffs in the mean time til the FT6 its kinda lacking in all accounts from first glance . im not looking for highly tact ship but it should be on par with the other T6 sci and intel ships with the universal set there should be accounted space for which i dont see of the bat .
Especially when any further release of some old canon ship would just incite another ****estorm like the Intrepid is doing now. It won't matter how far in the future a T6 "canon" ship would be released; it's going to spark another flamestorm.
At least Cryptic has CBS' blessing on allowing originals as long as they conform to certain standards, which not only allows them to better customize based on current and future specialization and abilities, but allows them to avoid the legion of rabid fans raging over how their favorite ship got an upgrade but isn't to their liking (most vocal currently being the Galaxy-X fans, though now in this thread, Intrepid fans).
People complaining about the console reduction forget that this is a T6 C-Store ship. 10 Consoles. Fleet versions will get 11.
Post dr....not a chance for many of the reasons others have stated.
The fanboy in me wants it....but I am just feeling too burned with no end in sight.
I can only hope enough people who spent money on this game feel as I do and put a huge dent in cryptic's profit projections. Maybe such losses will effect some positive change.
Bottom line... I know much of the new dr stuff was inspired to get us to spend more money but it has had the opposite effect on me.
But mam it's maths don't make me do another patrol mission lol
Vice Admiral Volmack ISS Thundermole
Brigadier General Jokag IKS Gorkan
Centurion Kares RRW Tomalak
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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I would hedge a bet that you can, its the usual practice
And owners of the ship currently have reported some issues with the two skins recently, which is indicative of some back end changes to make them compatable I think.
Way late but okay.
It's true the Steam numbers don't represent the whole of the STO player numbers, but the sample is large enough that using it as a ballpark estimate isn't at all unreasonable. Far from ideal, but in absence of concrete numbers from more sources, it'll suffice.
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I do love how Cryptic/PWE are taking double dipping to a whole new level with Delta Rising! :rolleyes: Personally I feel that anyone who has upgraded their T5 Intrepid to T5-U should get a 700 Zen discount on the T6 Intrepid. I would also like to see a discount on bundle packs when you've already bought part of the bundle, proportionate to how much of the bundle you already own. :cool: