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Upcoming changes to Hangar Pets and Separation pets.

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  • ummaxummax Member Posts: 529 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Now that we are over 600 posts. Has there been any word from a dev or someone from cryptic too reply? Good Communication skill !!! NOT !!!!

    I think their initial post was pretty clear....

    I logged in to do the mirror event and i have two characters who use carriers exclusively
    now my science officer appears to have this bug .. but its not constant, but I am pretty sure a brel fighter pet should not have a hull that is 65k.

    I went to the other guy who is the engineer he has pets too and the same carrier but his pets were looking like they should even though they were named on the list.. anyhow that tiny little fighter has more hull then my carrier unbuffed.

    Anyhow its pretty clear there is a bug and the pets need to be fixed I dont think there is much more to say lol.
  • nova2284nova2284 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Now that we are over 600 posts. Has there been any word from a dev or someone from cryptic too reply? Good Communication skill !!! NOT !!!!

    keep waiting...:confused: its like this...:( with cryptic...:mad: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKbX3mUd5tY
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    DELTA RISING FIXS THERE NEVER COMING WHY I'M I WASTING MY TIME ASKING FOR THEM ???
  • gpgtxgpgtx Member Posts: 1,579 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    jadenmia wrote: »
    Then that is an issue specific to his Advance Escort separator console in which each one of those has a different hull value and they always have. On top of the ability to choose which section of that ship you want, which means the player can choose one of the lesser hull pieces making this picture a non-issue and invalid for reference.


    also remember NPCs (even pets) use hull HP instead of active healing at least this is how it was explained to us as to why the new NPCs are giant HP bags but apreantly that is only true for enemies pets must be weak and stupid :rolleyes:




    55 seconds.......
    victoriasig_zps23c45368.jpg
  • trek21trek21 Member Posts: 2,246 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Now that we are over 600 posts. Has there been any word from a dev or someone from cryptic too reply? Good Communication skill !!! NOT !!!!
    Geko makes a post that's pretty clear about the issue (if misinterpreted a bit), posts it a few weeks before it happens, and why. It's a unintentional bug, and they're fixing it. What else do you want him to say?

    Besides, we've gotten about 5-6 threads about similar changes coming in a few weeks; that's better communication already in recent history
    Was named Trek17.

    Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
  • imperialmirrorimperialmirror Member Posts: 147 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    trek21 wrote: »
    Geko makes a post that's pretty clear about the issue (if misinterpreted a bit), posts it a few weeks before it happens, and why. It's a unintentional bug, and they're fixing it. What else do you want him to say?

    Besides, we've gotten about 5-6 threads about similar changes coming in a few weeks; that's better communication already in recent history

    Everytime your post you make it more clear that your a cryptic/PWE puppet. How Hard do they pull you strings? lol

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eGykxlfSbM
    1Wv2pWK.gif
  • hravikhravik Member Posts: 1,203 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    trek21 wrote: »
    Well, as far as I understand it, they're only nerfing the over-scaling aspect, not the usual values pets would have at lvl 60. So really, they're only getting worse when compared to the benefits of this bug - but when compared to before that, they're slightly better than before (lvl 60 compared to lvl 50)

    My concern is that they'll over compensate, or break pets in some way. Good intentions or not, their QA is awful.
  • dreaper1985dreaper1985 Member Posts: 29 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    I launch my elite fighters from the Nukara rep and boom on the bay I see them blowing up as the both go into rapid fire at will. Elite scorpion fighers luaghable launch things bigger then them and implode on sight. Only ship that last for 2 sec now is my Delta flyers or Runabouts glad I only opted for adv not idiotic elite variants. So again lets see giving us back half what they took in dil from us for rewards, making it worthless for anything short of an escort to be flown sorry Vesta devs want daddy to buy their new **** ships. Talking about better treatment yeah right synery in the perks of the new ships which resemble PAY TO WIN dark orbit style horse #$%&. Yet my fleet mate say SWTOR is worse how exactly part from spending cartel coins and failing to receive set item exactly the same.

    WHOOOHOOOO PAY TO WIN ALL THE WAY
  • trek21trek21 Member Posts: 2,246 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Everytime your post you make it more clear that your a cryptic/PWE puppet. How Hard do they pull you strings? lol

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eGykxlfSbM
    ...I'll probably regret asking this, but what's your basis on that? The fact that I defend a few things here and now for Cryptic, that I don't hate them?

    Well newsflash, I don't particularly like them either, and I rarely praise them if at all. I have nothing against them, or this game (which I find fun, perfectly serious fun), and have no reason to put them down - so I decide to work with how things are, is all. If I was a puppet, I'd only be saying unrealistic good things about them, that they can do no wrong, etc.

    Well I haven't said any of that. I've said fairly neutral things that take into account the general reality of this game, and how it all operates, good and bad, based on how I view it (and how I view what I've already said)
    Was named Trek17.

    Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
  • giveroffacialsgiveroffacials Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    100% right And it was from the CEO (at the time) of Cryptic lmao

    And Ironically talking about how to use grind to reduce the cost of adding new content about a minute later.
    Space the final frontier. These are the voyages of [your name here] on a five year mission to gain one level after the delta rising xp nerf.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • donowickdonowick Member Posts: 269 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    I understand some hulls are really high on pets. I have a friend with dread with saucer seperation the saucer has 104k hull lol and advance runabouts with 54k hull lol. The problem I have with pets is they are not smart enough to get away from warpcore breach and poof are gone lol could that ba adressed as well?:)
  • vesterengvestereng Member Posts: 2,252 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Amnesia? Again?

    The first carrier nerf was about reducing the speed at which you could spawn pets...

    (although other things were nerfed aswell)


    The previous concept having been your entire hangar bays are lost everytime you kill something, SO you have to be able to respawn them all constantly;

    (and it used to work fine before nerf 1)

    THUS the premise of the first nerf being, we going to cut the spawn rate down with 200% NOW THAT WE HAVE FIXED THE AI, and they don't blow up everytime something dies

    PROBLEM being, the AI was NOT FIXED, they still die constantly and too fast to be able to replace them even with full aux

    Now someone is saying pets live too long that's crazy talk you don't fly a carrier

    So in conclusion forget nerf 2 and do a re-call, pun, on nerf 1 and instead get to work on fixing the AI as you promised and even claimed you had done

    Then after that if you ain't got anything better to do fix all the broken pets such as shield repair pets and elite siphon drones

    /edit

    ps. you also said the pet commands would be able to drag to the bar - as they always have been

    That is the current carrier situation to all them who forgot
  • trek21trek21 Member Posts: 2,246 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    vestereng wrote: »
    Amnesia? Again?

    The first carrier nerf was about reducing the speed at which you could spawn pets...

    (although other things were nerfed aswell)


    The previous concept having been your entire hangar bays are lost everytime you kill something, SO you have to be able to respawn them all constantly;

    (and it used to work fine before nerf 1)

    THUS the premise of the first nerf being, we going to cut the spawn rate down with 200% NOW THAT WE HAVE FIXED THE AI, and they don't blow up everytime something dies

    PROBLEM being, the AI was NOT FIXED, they still die constantly and too fast to be able to replace them even with full aux

    Now someone is saying pets live too long that's crazy talk you don't fly a carrier

    So in conclusion forget nerf 2 and do a re-call, pun, on nerf 1 and instead get to work on fixing the AI as you promised and even claimed you had done

    Then after that if you ain't got anything better to do fix all the broken pets such as shield repair pets and elite siphon drones

    /edit

    ps. you also said the pet commands would be able to drag to the bar - as they always have been

    That is the current carrier situation to all them who forgot
    Ignoring the AI aspect for now, they're not actually nerfing the pets, in the normal manner. Fact is, there was an bug on them that made their HP/Shield values overscale from lvls 50-to-60, until eventually the pets had more health than the players' ships.

    Didn't happen consistently or to everyone, but it did happen. This aspect is the one being reverted, but the pets normal values at those levels are intended to remain
    Was named Trek17.

    Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
  • marc8219marc8219 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    This is a bad idea, pets are the last thing that need to be scaled back, they are not the problem.
    People aren't using pets to do 50k-100k dps, they are using bfaw builds with overcap, beta stacking, crit stacking, and fully upgraded gear. That is overpowered, not pets. In pvp pets are not the problem, new abilities like surgical strikes and ionic turbulence, and new rep items like the neutronic torps are causing problems.

    Queues are slower then ever, and short-sighted decisions like nerfing pets won't help, please think things over carefuly instead of making drastic descisions like this.
    Tala -KDF Tac- House of Beautiful Orions
  • marcaptain2010marcaptain2010 Member Posts: 26 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    The developers definitely have messed up priorities. I love my hangar pets, and they were not making my ships way more powerful; just more interesting. It seems like the devs hate it when we have too much fun or have something that works too well, and are trying everything that they can to suck the fun out of this game. This pet nerf, in my opinion, is an incredibly poortl decision. Not that they care much what we think anyway, unless they lose money. But it seems to take them a long time to pull their heads out of the sand and realize that it is happening.
  • sean2448sean2448 Member Posts: 815 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    been talking with fleet we are mad, and we have a right to be. several of us use carriers like myself we have invested a lot of time to get the elite pets.
    most of us are going to shelve our carriers over theses chamges
    and what sucks is i just invested a lot to dial in my xindi aquatic carrier, jem ha'dar dreadnaugt 2, 2 recluses :mad: all wil be getting shelved :mad:


    fleet leader 77th ESA
  • trek21trek21 Member Posts: 2,246 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    sean2448 wrote: »
    been talking with fleet we are mad, and we have a right to be. several of us use carriers like myself we have invested a lot of time to get the elite pets.
    most of us are going to shelve our carriers over theses chamges
    and what sucks is i just invested a lot to dial in my xindi aquatic carrier, jem ha'dar dreadnaugt 2, 2 recluses :mad: all wil be getting shelved :mad:


    fleet leader 77th ESA
    As has been argued several times, they are not dialing down pets below their usual stats - rather, they are dailing back an overscaling bug, which allowed some pets to have more hull/shields than the player's ships at lvls 50-60 (more so the later levels you got)
    Was named Trek17.

    Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
  • gwassalorgwassalor Member Posts: 164
    edited November 2014
    Ridiculous. Ridiculous. Ridiculous.

    Devs, you should really check the stats regarding how many people who bought carrier actually fly carrier. I invested ZEN into Atrox and it's been parked at Spacedock ever since I took it for a few spins, because it's utterly non-competitive. I did invest into elite pets, I did invest into wingmen trait and it is still non-competitive. So let's make it clear: the reason for me not flying Atrox is NOT that his pets are OP.

    Instead my poor Vulcan Sci captain is flying Dyson or (God protects!) Tactical Oddy. Which brings me to the Aquarius pet that is still useless flying coffin that dies constantly and when it dies, you're normally even not aware of it, because there's no HUD for monitoring separation pet's health. Right, so instead of fixing that, let's nerf Aquarius and make it die even more.

    And like this was not enough, my playable Talaxian can't wear sun glasses!
  • gulberatgulberat Member Posts: 5,505 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    My Vesta IS flying, and I haven't looked back since I bought it. If I have to reconsider the Vesta I may be forced to reconsider that toon entirely due to the extreme outlay to start another ship build, and that would hurt because he is my main. :(

    As I've asked for elsewhere, please share the numbers AND show how this is going to compare with the NPC scale-downs, so that we know whether we are going to maintain status quo ante bellum, end up net winners, or net losers. And that way we could maybe have a conversation about how to handle this without hurting those who DO love their carriers.

    Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-)
    Proudly F2P.  Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
  • maxvitormaxvitor Member Posts: 2,213 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Unbelievable, so many things broken and this is what you go after. Why do I get the feeling this is a not so subtle nudge to boost sales for the T6 ships, Cryptic/PWE once again doesn't surprise in their ability to make a mess of things. I wonder which of the few remaining functional parts of the game they are going to TRIBBLE up next.
    Maybe it is time to start looking for somewhere else to get my space Sci Fi gaming fix, because this game almost seems like it's under attack rather than being enhanced.
    If something is not broken, don't fix it, if it is broken, don't leave it broken.
    Oh Hell NO to ARC
  • trek21trek21 Member Posts: 2,246 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    maxvitor wrote: »
    Unbelievable, so many things broken and this is what you go after. Why do I get the feeling this is a not so subtle nudge to boost sales for the T6 ships, Cryptic/PWE once again doesn't surprise in their ability to make a mess of things. I wonder which of the few remaining functional parts of the game they are going to TRIBBLE up next.
    Maybe it is time to start looking for somewhere else to get my space Sci Fi gaming fix, because this game almost seems like it's under attack rather than being enhanced.
    Actually, this is a bug they're fixing; an over-scaling HP/Shield value from lvl 50-to-60. As an example below:

    Before it happened (plain lvl 50 being the cap) -> After they fix it (up to lvl 60) -> Before they fix it (where some pets have HP/Shield values that are above what the player's ships have, as seen here: http://i.imgur.com/EWK9fzS.png)

    So they're not nerfing the usual values of the pets, just the unintended too-high values
    Was named Trek17.

    Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
  • meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,594 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    shpoks wrote: »
    The fact remains that if pets were not intended to scale like this during leveling, then it's a bug or a broken mechanic if you will. The only reality about this particular situation is the carrier pets doing something that they weren't programmed to do by the developer.

    The fact remains that intention is irrelevant, really. Let's say they accidentally fixed the loadout system, would you insist they break it again, just because the fix was unintentional?! You say 'It was unintended, therefore per definition broken.' I say: while untended maybe, upscaling pets with the rest was the most natural thing to have happened, and therefore ere a fix than anything else. Hence, the 'Happy Accident.'
    You can't dance around with bugs, you're either for them or against them. "This one I like, leave it be - that one I don't, squash it" doesn't work like that based on our convenience as players.

    It works on the convenience of the fix. :)
    I won't pretend to be clairvoyant and to know wheather the devs. will take the carrier pet efficency discussion seriously in the future or not. They're at least trying to communicate with us it seems.

    Fortunately, you don't need to be clairvoyant. Rather the opposite: we just need to look at the past. And Cryptic's past, with regard to fixing bugs, looks absolutely dismal -- from any angle.
    Sending them the message that we don't like bug fixes after we asked for bug fixes isn't the smartest thing to do now. It doesn't make us look serious as playerbase.

    Only because you're taking a very black-and-white perspective here: either fixed or broken. Whereas I say: just blindly nerfing pets back into oblivion now may fix the 'OMG! This wasn't intented!' thingy, but will render em totally broken again otherwise. What we need is a true pet fix: one that nerfs their hull maybe, but gives them improved survivability back another way. Else this whole endeavor just spells certain breakage.
    3lsZz0w.jpg
  • shpoksshpoks Member Posts: 6,967 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    meimeitoo wrote: »
    The fact remains that intention is irrelevant, really. Let's say they accidentally fixed the loadout system, would you insist they break it again, just because the fix was unintentional?! You say 'It was unintended, therefore per definition broken.' I say: while untended maybe, upscaling pets with the rest was the most natural thing to have happened, and therefore ere a fix than anything else. Hence, the 'Happy Accident.'

    It depends - if the loadout was randomly fixed for me while remaining broken for others, I'd like them to fix it one way or another. Furthermore, if the loadout was doing something unintentional, like allowing me to slot 8 loadouts without me buying aditional slots, I'd also want it fix on principle. Because at the end of the day, there's no knowing how something that is left broken will interfere with other current and future things in the game and if it'll lead to breaking something else even more.
    meimeitoo wrote: »
    Fortunately, you don't need to be clairvoyant. Rather the opposite: we just need to look at the past. And Cryptic's past, with regard to fixing bugs, looks absolutely dismal -- from any angle.

    KDF player here, no need to tell me that. I reckon I realize this better than most players. But if we constantly keep looking and turning to the past, we'll never be able to change the future.
    I know Cryptic's dismal history of bug fixing and makng them into "features" and WAI, however I strongly believe that the best thing to do is keep pushing them to fix and improve the stuff we want/need rather than become complancent and depressed saying - "Cryptic will never fix anything, so let's keep this particular broken mechanic because we happen to like it".
    meimeitoo wrote: »
    Only because you're taking a very black-and-white perspective here: either fixed or broken. Whereas I say: just blindly nerfing pets back into oblivion now may fix the 'OMG! This wasn't intented!' thingy, but will render em totally broken again otherwise. What we need is a true pet fix: one that nerfs their hull maybe, but gives them improved survivability back another way. Else this whole endeavor just spells certain breakage.

    I don't have any arguments against fixing the carrier pets. I mentioned previously, while I don't like the idea of carriers in a Star Trek game I have no problems accepting reality and I even own a Kar'fi, Atrox, Vesta and the Armitage. But in order to ever expect improving carrier pets in any meaningfull way, their current broken state needs to be fixed first. The devs. can't fix the pets issues while keeping the pets broken and preforming against what they were designed for.
    And once again, it's very important to note that this is not happening to all players. I don't need to explain how unfair and broken it is to have some at an advantage over others while sporting the same gear because of a bug.
    HQroeLu.jpg
  • meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,594 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    @shpoks: You do not sound unreasonable, even though we may differ on what a 'fix' is per se.

    Anyway, the 'fix' is coming, and there's nothing we can do about it. I just hope Geko has the foresight (speaking of clairvoyance, *g*) to factor pet survivability into the equation too somehow, and not just focus blindly on hull.
    3lsZz0w.jpg
  • shpoksshpoks Member Posts: 6,967 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    meimeitoo wrote: »
    @shpoks: You do not sound unreasonable, even though we may differ on what a 'fix' is per se.

    Anyway, the 'fix' is coming, and there's nothing we can do about it. I just hope Geko has the foresight (speaking of clairvoyance, *g*) to factor pet survivability into the equation too somehow, and not just focus blindly on hull.

    What I believe they'll do with this is rollback to how pets preformed before this bug crawled out. However, the fact that it will take them 2-3 weeks to implement this could potentially mean that they'll be looking into the quality of carrier pets and making them more worthwhile for the players. I do hope they look into the carrier pets and their preformance, since as a big ENT fan the Narcine was suposed to be the next ship I'm getting. :)

    BTW speaking of Narcine, does that thing have a unique bridge?
    HQroeLu.jpg
  • meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,594 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    shpoks wrote: »
    What I believe they'll do with this is rollback to how pets preformed before this bug crawled out. However, the fact that it will take them 2-3 weeks to implement this could potentially mean that they'll be looking into the quality of carrier pets and making them more worthwhile for the players. I do hope they look into the carrier pets and their preformance, since as a big ENT fan the Narcine was suposed to be the next ship I'm getting. :)

    BTW speaking of Narcine, does that thing have a unique bridge?

    Yes, Narcine has a unique bridge; although, not to be rude, but it's rather crappy, really.

    Best bridges so far (of ships I own):

    C-Store Odyssey
    Elachi S'Golth Escort
    Tal Shiar Adapted Destroyer
    Mobius Temporal Destroyer

    ....
    ....
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    ....
    ....
    ....
    ....
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    Narcine Aquatic Carrier
    3lsZz0w.jpg
  • chalpenchalpen Member Posts: 2,207 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    If it is broken, then cryptic should fix it.
    But I wish we could craft our own pets or "upgrade" the frigates to be able to go on any ship
    Should I start posting again after all this time?
  • meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,594 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    chalpen wrote: »
    If it is broken, then cryptic should fix it.
    But I wish we could craft our own pets or "upgrade" the frigates to be able to go on any ship

    No 'Gold' pets, please. (Part of me still thinks this is precisely yet another monetizing scheme. Maybe I jumped the gun a bit on that; but, by the goddess, don't give em any ideas! :P)
    3lsZz0w.jpg
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    ltminns wrote: »
    By the way Iconians, who the heck is that character in your signature.
    It's the host of this TV show. The guy is extremely predictable in how he links everything to intervention by extraterrestrials, regardless of whether it actually makes sense. His catchphrase is "I'm not saying it was aliens, but...."
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
  • olliereportolliereport Member Posts: 721
    edited November 2014
    I'm not pleased

    against the new super ninja powered mobs, the carrier pets seem fine, and my frigates still die

    I hadn't noticed a huge difference, except on crystal entity pve que, that's it
  • olliereportolliereport Member Posts: 721
    edited November 2014
    maxvitor wrote: »
    this game almost seems like it's under attack rather than being enhanced.

    this is aptly put

    one thing that comes to mind is balancing things again so people can manage to complete advanced and sometimes elite pve ques

    how about rotating different pve ques into "featured" so other things get playtime
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