The way I see it is a lot of people here are hung up on our own culture....on how we are about the dead, we each have our own customs when it comes to what we do with the dead... This does not mean every species in the galaxy would be the same.....
I dont consider myself hung up on my own culture...actually i think that the Kobali are the ones hung up on their own culture. It seems like in game they do know that other species find what they do repulsive. And they keep talking that its because people dont care about their culture. But what of the Kobalis respect for other cultures? if you encounter a culture that is willing to go to war over their burial beliefs why would you go to war with them anyways? or rather why wouldnt you do everything you could to try and prevent a war? especially when the purpose of that was is to prevent your own extinction and ESPECIALLY when your opponent is technologically superior to your own. And not only that but the Vaadwuar are determined to do that it takes to stop the Kobali from using dead Vaadwuar because they are infecting bodies with a chemical to make them useless to a Kobali.
The Kobali should go pick on some Kazon imo...nobody likes those guys, they may even be able to convince a few other species to join up with them. Their only condition is they get to keep all the dead bodies from the war...friendly and kazon :P
Considering the circumstances, the Kobali have earned their fate, I understand that to use the bodies of the dead are the only way they have to replicate themselves but at the very least they should respect the customs of other races as regards their death rituals and attitudes towards the bodies of the dead and ask the permission of those races before using the corpses.
The thing is that they don't do any of the above and I must admit if I was watching them turning my people and fallen forces into more of them, I'd want to put an end to it and if that meant killing them, so be it. If I had to go to the extremes of genocide before they changed their ways and respected other cultures practices as regards death then I would say they earned their fate.
Unless someone is being hunted to extinction and killing them all is the only way to stop it and I mean absolutely there is not other option what so ever and you should still face the consequences for it genocide should never be acceptable.
Are the Kobali hunting the Vaadwaur to extinction?
No.
Then they don't get to kill all of them.
Besides given that Harry Kim may have implied that the Vaadwaur have been slaughtering god knows how many people probably up to multiple genocides with his surprise about the Kobali city not being annihilated, and the fact that they like to murder people in cold blood just to make a point including turning it into the sadistic choice game they would have probably tried to wipe out the Kobali even if they didn't reprocess their dead just for craps and giggles.
I dont consider myself hung up on my own culture...actually i think that the Kobali are the ones hung up on their own culture. It seems like in game they do know that other species find what they do repulsive. And they keep talking that its because people dont care about their culture.
No they do it becuase their sterile due to some science experiment that went wrong.
You find this out by talking to one of them during the story missions.
Honestly its amazing how much stuff you find out about this game by taking the time to ask NPCs all kinds of questions.
No they do it becuase their sterile due to some science experiment that went wrong.
You find this out by talking to one of them during the story missions.
Honestly its amazing how much stuff you find out about this game by taking the time to ask NPCs all kinds of questions.
I dont really care what word or term you use to describe it. Whether you want to call it their way of life, a necessity, a part of their culture, whatever. It is a "thing" that they have to do and they get so hung up on their own "thing" that they disregard other species cultural beliefs.
I'm only part way through the story right now. There was a Kobali NPC that said that they cannot stop what they are doing because they will go extinct. BUT so far i'm only getting the impression that the Vaadwuar just want the Kobali to stop using the Vaadwuar in the stasis tubes and their fallen Vaadwuar soldiers.
I dont really care what word or term you use to describe it. Whether you want to call it their way of life, a necessity, a part of their culture, whatever. It is a "thing" that they have to do and they get so hung up on their own "thing" that they disregard other species cultural beliefs.
Its a thing they have to do not to die.
Thats like saying someone breathing oxygen is offensive so they should stop doing it, Or humans giving birth is offensive and we should stop doing it and any complaints about not doing so are just being a cultural thing.
Plus the Federation pretty much has to keep their nose out of it anyway due to the Prime Directive.
Plus...
Spoilers for All That Glitters.
The Vadwaar are currently being led by a twisted sadistic psychopath, who seems to be peeved at the alliance becuase they won't allow killing all the Kobali to be part of any peace proposal. So they probably would have tried to kill all the Kobali anyway just for craps and giggles
No they do it becuase their sterile due to some science experiment that went wrong.
You find this out by talking to one of them during the story missions.
Honestly its amazing how much stuff you find out about this game by taking the time to ask NPCs all kinds of questions.
So because they put their species on the fast track to extinction. Other cultures should endure the desecration of their dead so that the Kobali get a second chance? They couldnt find a less invasive and disrespectful way of reproduction?
Sorry Im not buying it. Its one thing for them to regenerate their own dead. Its another to turn into graverobbers and steal the dead of other civilizations and regenerate them as their own. To claim that everyone else is clueless and disrespectful of their own cultures rather then accept that they have crossed a line. Its the definition of denial.
I don't really get the Kobali hate. It's not like anyone's using the corpses they're taking... it's just lifeless, rotting meat. It's just going to get stinkier and more rotten lying around in the ground, going to waste. You honestly can't tell me you still have further plans for your dead after you've buried them.
I don't really get the Kobali hate. It's not like anyone's using the corpses they're taking... it's just lifeless, rotting meat. It's just going to get stinkier and more rotten lying around in the ground, going to waste. You honestly can't tell me you still have further plans for your dead after you've buried them.
If you cant comprehend why people are bothered by it. You probably shouldnt be commenting on it.
They may no longer be alive. They may or may not be in a better place or anywhere at all. But that body is the physical remains of someone that once lived, loved and was loved. To those that cared for them. They would wish for them to have a proper burial as its a last chance to express respect and love for that person. When someone comes along and snatches up the body and desecrates it, regenerates it for their own gains whether cultural or individual. It is not only disrespectful of those who knew that person, but the person who is now deceased.
If you cant comprehend why people are bothered by it. You probably shouldnt be commenting on it.
They may no longer be alive. They may or may not be in a better place or anywhere at all. But that body is the physical remains of someone that once lived, loved and was loved. To those that cared for them. They would wish for them to have a proper burial as its a last chance to express respect and love for that person. When someone comes along and snatches up the body and desecrates it, regenerates it for their own gains whether cultural or individual. It is not only disrespectful of those who knew that person, but the person who is now deceased.
How is it disrespectful? Honestly?
It's just meat. It's not that person they loved anymore because that person is gone. When the last electrical activity peters out in the brain, that person ceases to exist. The corpse is just an inanimate husk thereafter. No one's using it. Why build up so much attachment over a piece of rotten meat that you buried in a hole?
It's just meat. It's not that person they loved anymore because that person is gone. When the last electrical activity peters out in the brain, that person ceases to exist. The corpse is just an inanimate husk thereafter. No one's using it. Why build up so much attachment over a piece of rotten meat that you buried in a hole?
I take it youve never lost someone. Or you have a serious disconnect emotionally to the people who has passed away.
I take it youve never lost someone. Or you have a serious disconnect emotionally to the people who has passed away.
Actually in the past decade I've lost two beloved cats and a grandfather. I buried the cats in my grandparents' backyard and my grandfather was cremated. I will not lose sleep over some future possibility of the cats' remains ever being dug up during some manner of landscaping project by a future owner of that house, because I will always have the memories of them in my head. The same goes for my grandfather. I've always found it odd that humans put so much undue importance in a lifeless body when memories are forever.
Actually in the past decade I've lost two beloved cats and a grandfather. I buried the cats in my grandparents' backyard and my grandfather was cremated. I will not lose sleep over some future possibility of the cats' remains ever being dug up during some manner of landscaping project by a future owner of that house, because I will always have the memories of them in my head. The same goes for my grandfather. I've always found it odd that humans put so much undue importance in a lifeless body when memories are forever.
Memories arent forever. Eventually youll be forgotten. Unless people actually take care of that headstone over your grave....If people dig it up and destroy your remains in the process. Youll definitely disappear into obscurity.
Memories arent forever. Eventually youll be forgotten. Unless people actually take care of that headstone over your grave....If people dig it up and destroy your remains in the process. Youll definitely disappear into obscurity.
Yeah, I guess that family tree my mother has been maintaining and will most assuredly be passed down is completely meaningless. A slab of worm-eaten meat is the only way to make the memories count. :rolleyes:
This is of course beside the point that the headstone is usually left behind by grave robbers. Oh, and let us not forget the numerous examples of where a body was unrecoverable and only a memorial exists instead.
But do you think that maybe the Kobali would have gotten the hint when they find out that the Vaadwuar are giving themselves chemicals so that they cant be used by the Kobali?
Are the Kobali hunting the Vaadwaur to extinction?
No.
Then they don't get to kill all of them.
Considering that the Kobali are raising the Vaadwaur dead in their pods as well as on the battlefield it doesn't get much more insulting than that... you wouldn't forgive the Borg if you were fighting them and they assimilated your people and turned them on you, wh should the Kobali be treated any different when they are doing the same darn thing!?
Besides given that Harry Kim may have implied that the Vaadwaur have been slaughtering god knows how many people probably up to multiple genocides with his surprise about the Kobali city not being annihilated, and the fact that they like to murder people in cold blood just to make a point including turning it into the sadistic choice game they would have probably tried to wipe out the Kobali even if they didn't reprocess their dead just for craps and giggles.
**Spoilers** If you pay attention in that mission you find that the Vaadwaur motivation on Kobali prime is not the extinction of the Kobali race (you'll notice in other missions that they haven't made other races exinct, just beat them into submission and servitude), they are there, for the temple and killing Kobali who were probably Vaadwaur to start with to protect their own and probably putting the undead of their race to rest.
I take it youve never lost someone. Or you have a serious disconnect emotionally to the people who has passed away.
Just because they don't agree with you doesn't mean that they either have never lost someone or suffer an emotional disconnect.
Some people believe once dead what makes that individual the unique personality that they were is gone, and all that is left is a "meat sack" for wants of a better word. The corpse is not the person, it just happens to be the tissue and bone that the sole has on loan, and yes that is from a song but quite appropriate to some people. To those that think this way there tends to be a difference between honouring a person and honouring a corpse.
As for your comment on memories, well as soon as those who knew you as a person die then yes you as a person will be forgotten, that is the way of life. If family down the line who never knew you contiue to "care" for the headstone, then it becomes more a family obligation and you become an abstract concept of a person. Because these people will have no memories or emotional attachment to you, therefore you have not avoided "disappearing into obscurity" as you put it.
Regardless of what you think about the undead thing, the Kobali also have large numbers of living Vaadwuar in those stasis pods. It is simply inexcusable to hold those helpless people hostage, waiting for the worn-out old pods for inevitably break down so they can do their thing. Its murder, even if the Kobali pretend otherwise.
This could be right or wrong. But without spoilers, has anyone yet to complete all the new story missions?
It's just a guess, but considering DR is based around Intel, stealth and spies it is possible that other things are at work in the background which in time will make more sense of this alliance.
I've not touched DR content as yet, but I've seen threads already saying the ending wasn't what they expected.
I actually find the Kobali an interesting and unique species, doing what they must to survive.
But then again I'm one of those people who ascribe no particular importance to the body once its dead. Its just an empty meat bag. The person that they once were is gone.
That's why I'm on the organ donor list and anything that's left goes to medical science. Let the living make use of what I will no longer have use for.
Honestly if I were a Starfleet Officer, I'd want my superiors to hand me off to the Kobali for resurrection.
I don't really get the Kobali hate. It's not like anyone's using the corpses they're taking... it's just lifeless, rotting meat. It's just going to get stinkier and more rotten lying around in the ground, going to waste. You honestly can't tell me you still have further plans for your dead after you've buried them.
when someone you love dies, one of the most important parts of the grieving process is the acceptance of the idea that your time with that person is over, that they are gone and you can never see them again. the catharsis of this emotional event usually marks the end of mourning, and the beginning of your new life without your love.
the Kobali method of reproduction turns that on its head. all of a sudden, your beloved is not gone forever, merely reanimated and turned into a lizard person. this destruction of the grieving process offends most people on a very basic level because it reopens a searingly painful emotional wound. I, for one, would go literally insane if my significant other was exhumed by aliens and alive again somewere i could never see them, forced to forget i existed.
however, if the kobali had "afterlife options"... an arrangement could be made.
if, for example, it would be permissible for one to euthanise themselves, and be remade a kobali alongside your deceased love with the emotional bonds to each other left intact, it could be an acceptable choice of afterlife for many people.
personally, i would just straight steal their bring back the dead technology and use it without the becoming a lizard with amnesia part, if it wasn't technically committing genocide to do that without fixing the Kobali reproductive problems first.
My Klingon and Imperial Romulan couldnt give an epohs behind about the Kobali. If the Vaadwar are the power in the region we should be aligning with them and not some parasitic necrophiles.
Zombie movie #6,000,000 comes out with dead coming from their graves and getting shot in the head = good times.
Imaginary alien race using the dead so they can keep species alive = horrible monstrosity.
I'm detecting a double standard here.
The spirit is gone off, he/she moved to your choice of paranormal paradise and is laughing it up with your Space Jesus. The body is now gonna get digested by various worms, parasites, and bacteria. But that's ok as long as some alien race doesn't come along and use that Biomatter to help their species stay alive long enough to maybe solve that problem.
Funny how often Humans ****ed up on their planet and they still have the audacity to say "they started this problem themselves, let em die".
How much garbage that takes more than a few years to decay have you made just this week?
How much garbage that takes more than a few years to decay have you made just this week?
None? But as I don't make things...
As to your point about us messing things up on our planet, we haven't got any interstellar assistance with fixing it and I think most would look at our actions as a race and decide to let us kill ourselves off and rightly so if you ask me.
I hadn't got that far into the new Delta Rising yet.
However its both good and bad. They are doing what they need to survive due to their plight. However doing so is being "Grave Robbers". So its a double sided sword. Survive by messing around with the dead. Or the whole civilization dies off. It would be a hard thought to process unless you are in their shoes.
I don't know the story outcome or ending of it. However perhaps helping them defending off the invaders. Could pave the way for them to overcome their plight. Its been 32 years since Voyager's visit. There might be a "fix" for their problem. That the story hadn't told yet. Maybe not in this part of the new Delta Rising expansion. But maybe in a future part of it yet to come.
Granted they do sound horrible for their actions, but I'm kinda keeping an open mind on it. Thinking their might be a fix to their problem. Specially since the Fed/KDF/Romulan alliance or some help from other Delta Quadrant residents might can help them.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
I just make sure I vapourise any bodies I see, stops 99% of all known necromancy.
(Also technically necromancy is divining the future from the dead, not brining the dead to life ).
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Zombie movie #6,000,000 comes out with dead coming from their graves and getting shot in the head = good times.
Imaginary alien race using the dead so they can keep species alive = horrible monstrosity.
I'm detecting a double standard here.
The spirit is gone off, he/she moved to your choice of paranormal paradise and is laughing it up with your Space Jesus. The body is now gonna get digested by various worms, parasites, and bacteria. But that's ok as long as some alien race doesn't come along and use that Biomatter to help their species stay alive long enough to maybe solve that problem.
Funny how often Humans ****ed up on their planet and they still have the audacity to say "they started this problem themselves, let em die".
How much garbage that takes more than a few years to decay have you made just this week?
I don't see any double standard here.
Nobody is objecting to the Kobali being in the game, but rather that we are forced to HELP them and that we can not align ourselves with the Vaadwuar against the Kobali.
It would be like if the protagonists in all these movies were actually HELPING the zombies turn the rest of humanity into more zombies. :P
In fact in a way the Kobali are no different than the Borg. The reanimation itself isn't that offensive, but rather the supression and cleansing of the deceaseds memories, identity and culuture and ultimately complete Assimilation of the Deceased into being fully Kobali.
Damned right. I don't have any idea why the hell we are helping these people. They disgust me~! Why don't I get dialogue options to tell them to go blow it out their exhaust port?
We all die, and our bodies decompose, and eventually serve a building block for new life. The Kobali just do it a lot faster and more directed.
Heck, we are made from the corpses of long dead stars. If the sun was intelligent, would it hate us and try to burn us to death because we desecrate her ancestors?
It's a silly sentiment. And it's not even like a Buffy Vampire that removes the soul and replaces it with a demonic being, or an evil spirit possessing the body -the body alters completely, there is nothing left from the original person.
But in turn, it does allow a new life to form - and not just a new life, like a few extra worms in the dirt that eventually end up as bird food and who knows what - an intelligent, sapient life form with its own ambitions and hopes.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
I take it youve never lost someone. Or you have a serious disconnect emotionally to the people who has passed away.
I've lost people that meant something to me. But what happens after the burial is not important to me. The place of burial may serve as a point of remembrance, but the important part is the remembrance itself- the memories - keeping them alive who they were, what they meant to me.
I suspect if he hadn't died of cancer but of something else, he would have wanted his organs to be donated for others to survive (with the cancer, I can't imagine that's an option), and hey - the biggest organ donation you could give would be the whole body for a completely new life...
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
Comments
I dont consider myself hung up on my own culture...actually i think that the Kobali are the ones hung up on their own culture. It seems like in game they do know that other species find what they do repulsive. And they keep talking that its because people dont care about their culture. But what of the Kobalis respect for other cultures? if you encounter a culture that is willing to go to war over their burial beliefs why would you go to war with them anyways? or rather why wouldnt you do everything you could to try and prevent a war? especially when the purpose of that was is to prevent your own extinction and ESPECIALLY when your opponent is technologically superior to your own. And not only that but the Vaadwuar are determined to do that it takes to stop the Kobali from using dead Vaadwuar because they are infecting bodies with a chemical to make them useless to a Kobali.
The Kobali should go pick on some Kazon imo...nobody likes those guys, they may even be able to convince a few other species to join up with them. Their only condition is they get to keep all the dead bodies from the war...friendly and kazon :P
Unless someone is being hunted to extinction and killing them all is the only way to stop it and I mean absolutely there is not other option what so ever and you should still face the consequences for it genocide should never be acceptable.
Are the Kobali hunting the Vaadwaur to extinction?
No.
Then they don't get to kill all of them.
Besides given that Harry Kim may have implied that the Vaadwaur have been slaughtering god knows how many people probably up to multiple genocides with his surprise about the Kobali city not being annihilated, and the fact that they like to murder people in cold blood just to make a point including turning it into the sadistic choice game they would have probably tried to wipe out the Kobali even if they didn't reprocess their dead just for craps and giggles.
No they do it becuase their sterile due to some science experiment that went wrong.
You find this out by talking to one of them during the story missions.
Honestly its amazing how much stuff you find out about this game by taking the time to ask NPCs all kinds of questions.
I dont really care what word or term you use to describe it. Whether you want to call it their way of life, a necessity, a part of their culture, whatever. It is a "thing" that they have to do and they get so hung up on their own "thing" that they disregard other species cultural beliefs.
I'm only part way through the story right now. There was a Kobali NPC that said that they cannot stop what they are doing because they will go extinct. BUT so far i'm only getting the impression that the Vaadwuar just want the Kobali to stop using the Vaadwuar in the stasis tubes and their fallen Vaadwuar soldiers.
Its a thing they have to do not to die.
Thats like saying someone breathing oxygen is offensive so they should stop doing it, Or humans giving birth is offensive and we should stop doing it and any complaints about not doing so are just being a cultural thing.
Plus the Federation pretty much has to keep their nose out of it anyway due to the Prime Directive.
Plus...
Spoilers for All That Glitters.
The Vadwaar are currently being led by a twisted sadistic psychopath, who seems to be peeved at the alliance becuase they won't allow killing all the Kobali to be part of any peace proposal. So they probably would have tried to kill all the Kobali anyway just for craps and giggles
So because they put their species on the fast track to extinction. Other cultures should endure the desecration of their dead so that the Kobali get a second chance? They couldnt find a less invasive and disrespectful way of reproduction?
Sorry Im not buying it. Its one thing for them to regenerate their own dead. Its another to turn into graverobbers and steal the dead of other civilizations and regenerate them as their own. To claim that everyone else is clueless and disrespectful of their own cultures rather then accept that they have crossed a line. Its the definition of denial.
If you cant comprehend why people are bothered by it. You probably shouldnt be commenting on it.
They may no longer be alive. They may or may not be in a better place or anywhere at all. But that body is the physical remains of someone that once lived, loved and was loved. To those that cared for them. They would wish for them to have a proper burial as its a last chance to express respect and love for that person. When someone comes along and snatches up the body and desecrates it, regenerates it for their own gains whether cultural or individual. It is not only disrespectful of those who knew that person, but the person who is now deceased.
How is it disrespectful? Honestly?
It's just meat. It's not that person they loved anymore because that person is gone. When the last electrical activity peters out in the brain, that person ceases to exist. The corpse is just an inanimate husk thereafter. No one's using it. Why build up so much attachment over a piece of rotten meat that you buried in a hole?
I take it youve never lost someone. Or you have a serious disconnect emotionally to the people who has passed away.
Actually in the past decade I've lost two beloved cats and a grandfather. I buried the cats in my grandparents' backyard and my grandfather was cremated. I will not lose sleep over some future possibility of the cats' remains ever being dug up during some manner of landscaping project by a future owner of that house, because I will always have the memories of them in my head. The same goes for my grandfather. I've always found it odd that humans put so much undue importance in a lifeless body when memories are forever.
Memories arent forever. Eventually youll be forgotten. Unless people actually take care of that headstone over your grave....If people dig it up and destroy your remains in the process. Youll definitely disappear into obscurity.
Yeah, I guess that family tree my mother has been maintaining and will most assuredly be passed down is completely meaningless. A slab of worm-eaten meat is the only way to make the memories count. :rolleyes:
This is of course beside the point that the headstone is usually left behind by grave robbers. Oh, and let us not forget the numerous examples of where a body was unrecoverable and only a memorial exists instead.
No, memories are indeed forever.
One would have thought so... Apparently not
Considering that the Kobali are raising the Vaadwaur dead in their pods as well as on the battlefield it doesn't get much more insulting than that... you wouldn't forgive the Borg if you were fighting them and they assimilated your people and turned them on you, wh should the Kobali be treated any different when they are doing the same darn thing!?
**Spoilers**
If you pay attention in that mission you find that the Vaadwaur motivation on Kobali prime is not the extinction of the Kobali race (you'll notice in other missions that they haven't made other races exinct, just beat them into submission and servitude), they are there, for the temple and killing Kobali who were probably Vaadwaur to start with to protect their own and probably putting the undead of their race to rest.
How you can't see that is beyond me.
Just because they don't agree with you doesn't mean that they either have never lost someone or suffer an emotional disconnect.
Some people believe once dead what makes that individual the unique personality that they were is gone, and all that is left is a "meat sack" for wants of a better word. The corpse is not the person, it just happens to be the tissue and bone that the sole has on loan, and yes that is from a song but quite appropriate to some people. To those that think this way there tends to be a difference between honouring a person and honouring a corpse.
As for your comment on memories, well as soon as those who knew you as a person die then yes you as a person will be forgotten, that is the way of life. If family down the line who never knew you contiue to "care" for the headstone, then it becomes more a family obligation and you become an abstract concept of a person. Because these people will have no memories or emotional attachment to you, therefore you have not avoided "disappearing into obscurity" as you put it.
It's just a guess, but considering DR is based around Intel, stealth and spies it is possible that other things are at work in the background which in time will make more sense of this alliance.
I've not touched DR content as yet, but I've seen threads already saying the ending wasn't what they expected.
Just something perhaps to bear in mind.
But then again I'm one of those people who ascribe no particular importance to the body once its dead. Its just an empty meat bag. The person that they once were is gone.
That's why I'm on the organ donor list and anything that's left goes to medical science. Let the living make use of what I will no longer have use for.
Honestly if I were a Starfleet Officer, I'd want my superiors to hand me off to the Kobali for resurrection.
when someone you love dies, one of the most important parts of the grieving process is the acceptance of the idea that your time with that person is over, that they are gone and you can never see them again. the catharsis of this emotional event usually marks the end of mourning, and the beginning of your new life without your love.
the Kobali method of reproduction turns that on its head. all of a sudden, your beloved is not gone forever, merely reanimated and turned into a lizard person. this destruction of the grieving process offends most people on a very basic level because it reopens a searingly painful emotional wound. I, for one, would go literally insane if my significant other was exhumed by aliens and alive again somewere i could never see them, forced to forget i existed.
however, if the kobali had "afterlife options"... an arrangement could be made.
if, for example, it would be permissible for one to euthanise themselves, and be remade a kobali alongside your deceased love with the emotional bonds to each other left intact, it could be an acceptable choice of afterlife for many people.
personally, i would just straight steal their bring back the dead technology and use it without the becoming a lizard with amnesia part, if it wasn't technically committing genocide to do that without fixing the Kobali reproductive problems first.
Imaginary alien race using the dead so they can keep species alive = horrible monstrosity.
I'm detecting a double standard here.
The spirit is gone off, he/she moved to your choice of paranormal paradise and is laughing it up with your Space Jesus. The body is now gonna get digested by various worms, parasites, and bacteria. But that's ok as long as some alien race doesn't come along and use that Biomatter to help their species stay alive long enough to maybe solve that problem.
Funny how often Humans ****ed up on their planet and they still have the audacity to say "they started this problem themselves, let em die".
How much garbage that takes more than a few years to decay have you made just this week?
None? But as I don't make things...
As to your point about us messing things up on our planet, we haven't got any interstellar assistance with fixing it and I think most would look at our actions as a race and decide to let us kill ourselves off and rightly so if you ask me.
You make garbage. Everyone makes garbage.
However its both good and bad. They are doing what they need to survive due to their plight. However doing so is being "Grave Robbers". So its a double sided sword. Survive by messing around with the dead. Or the whole civilization dies off. It would be a hard thought to process unless you are in their shoes.
I don't know the story outcome or ending of it. However perhaps helping them defending off the invaders. Could pave the way for them to overcome their plight. Its been 32 years since Voyager's visit. There might be a "fix" for their problem. That the story hadn't told yet. Maybe not in this part of the new Delta Rising expansion. But maybe in a future part of it yet to come.
Granted they do sound horrible for their actions, but I'm kinda keeping an open mind on it. Thinking their might be a fix to their problem. Specially since the Fed/KDF/Romulan alliance or some help from other Delta Quadrant residents might can help them.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
(Also technically necromancy is divining the future from the dead, not brining the dead to life
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
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I don't see any double standard here.
Nobody is objecting to the Kobali being in the game, but rather that we are forced to HELP them and that we can not align ourselves with the Vaadwuar against the Kobali.
It would be like if the protagonists in all these movies were actually HELPING the zombies turn the rest of humanity into more zombies. :P
In fact in a way the Kobali are no different than the Borg. The reanimation itself isn't that offensive, but rather the supression and cleansing of the deceaseds memories, identity and culuture and ultimately complete Assimilation of the Deceased into being fully Kobali.
We all die, and our bodies decompose, and eventually serve a building block for new life. The Kobali just do it a lot faster and more directed.
Heck, we are made from the corpses of long dead stars. If the sun was intelligent, would it hate us and try to burn us to death because we desecrate her ancestors?
It's a silly sentiment. And it's not even like a Buffy Vampire that removes the soul and replaces it with a demonic being, or an evil spirit possessing the body -the body alters completely, there is nothing left from the original person.
But in turn, it does allow a new life to form - and not just a new life, like a few extra worms in the dirt that eventually end up as bird food and who knows what - an intelligent, sapient life form with its own ambitions and hopes.
I've lost people that meant something to me. But what happens after the burial is not important to me. The place of burial may serve as a point of remembrance, but the important part is the remembrance itself- the memories - keeping them alive who they were, what they meant to me.
I suspect if he hadn't died of cancer but of something else, he would have wanted his organs to be donated for others to survive (with the cancer, I can't imagine that's an option), and hey - the biggest organ donation you could give would be the whole body for a completely new life...