It directly affects incentive to play KDF characters. This lowers the chance of people even considering KDF characters, which they might if there were things you could only get by doing so.
This, in turn, lowers the percentage of KDF players, which lowers the chances of further KDF content/items available ("Not enough people play that, so we aren't putting time into it").
I play a KDF character. I have had him since before the KDF even really had any true PvE content at all. It amuses me that he is max level and still has all the intro tutorial type missions sitting there. Nothing that has come out has driven me to drop the character. Reintroducing the aquarius as a raider does not change that. I still love my b'rel retrofit, I have had it on my character since the original T5 retrofit ships were first introduced with the vice admiral level cap expansion. Back then common concensus was that it wasn't worth it over the hegh'ta. But I liked it anyways, because the B'Rel is just a damn classic. If you want to be really technical, a b'rel bird of prey is the only star trek ship to survive a direct combat engagement with God.
So yeah, anyways, I do take some issue with the statting on the new aquarius here or there. But it's nothing huge, and honestly I don't give a damn that there is a "fed raider". Just like I didn't give a damn that they threw in a fed battlecruiser. One odd man out ship design that attempts to mimic advantages employed by the enemy is natural and logical in war (even though the war is technically off now). But the imitator ships will never capture the identity of the classic klingon ships.
Exactly, BoPs are easy to deal with. A stated, spec into sensors and you can see them coming, spec into it a lot (e.g. Sci in a Nebula with both consoles, 125 Aux, EPTA, Sensor Scan...) and no BoP within 20-25km is safe. (depends on their stealth)
And once you can see them and stop them, the BoP making soggy paper look like granite part comes in - and while one alone Nebula wont have the damage, the rest of the Fedball will. (or at least should)
Cue one dead BoP, as no BoP can survive a protracted fight.
In some ways, a battle-cloak is a disadvantage, especially if your opponent uses Torp Spread and the torps catch up while you are cloaked. (due to its auto-hit component)
ahem...okay, being as you ARE a Fed-only player, your ignorance about the battlecloak can be forgiven-until someone explains to you how easy it is to keep a Bird of Prey from cloaking.
(pardon my saying so, it's not that hard.)
basically, TB1 stops it, but doesn't prevent shields from dropping-and you have 18 seconds minimum (least amount of time) to acquire target and tractor them, and the duration of the TB to finish killing them. If you do it quick, you'll do it before he can get his shields back up.
while cloaked, a BoP has zero shields. NONE. Mines see cloaked ships just fine thankyewverymuch, and all those hits go straight to hull (as well as alerting your opponents as to the general location you're in...direction of flight, etc. etc.)
EPTA and a decent score in sensors will show you a Bird of Prey out to some pretty good distances, depending on if you chose a build with a deflector that includes the (Sen) in it's description, you can get detection out to beyond weapons range.
I havent' even started on uni consoles or things that are profession specific here.
Things that knock a BoP out of cloak?
GW1, 2, and 3 knock cloaked vessels out of cloak to varying ranges.
TBR hits cloaked ships even when they weren't seen by the guy triggering it.
Photonic Shockwave. A cloaked ship bumbling across EWP will be decloaked, and take direct damage to hull...
There's more-and that's none of them profession specific or even ship-specific-except for ships with ONLY a Lt. Sci. bridge officer position.
Thanks but no thanks. As a hardcore Scimitar user I know what brings you out of cloak. What I meant to say is that the Aquarius can't escape as long as you keep it in red alert. Battle Cloak lets you do it at any moment; of course if you're facing someone able to decloak you at will it's like smashing your head on the wall.
If you run the Aquarius as a BoP, and get caught in the getaway, it won't survive.
You're forgetting that behind that ship, captain race, freaking faction and stuff like that, we're all humans playing a game made of many many bits.
Ah, but it's also vice-versa. There is no pure hate aimed at a certain group of players from the majority of people here, but there is a solid group of Federation only players that has been whining for years for everything KDF related. If you're objective, you have to admit that. The problem here is - the developer. When the developer succumbs and does whatever that group that's whining asks for, it irks people. Rubs them the wrong way. And it's completely justifiable.
Now put in this mix the fact that Cryptic says they make so little for the KDF because less players play the faction. Then take a look at the "Delta Operations Pack", where Fed players get more then the 2 other factions combined and 2.5 times more than each.
Like you said, we're all people playing a game including the KDF players. But then I have less chance to enjoy stuff in the game, because I get less. And I get less because less players play the faction. So you tell me, how am I to expect improvement and bringing more people in the faction when everything that's unique is being ported over to team blue and on top of that blue gets 10 times the attention and content in the game? Why would someone, apart from being a ST fan (and Cryptic has done a good job pissing and chasing off a huge portion of those already) choose KDF over Fed, when as a Fed he gets everything + he gets much much more? Let's be real, 50% of the STO playerbase are probably not hardcore Trekkies. Apart from a small number that happen to like the species, they'll chose the faction that gives them everything.
And that's why people get angry. Because the ability of the KDF players to receive enjoyable content is being undermined by the developers themselves.
We wouldn't be so pissed at Fed players if "mommy" Cryptic didn't pamper them so much. They cry a little for something and Cryptic gives that to them on a silver platter. It's infuriating at times and some people project that rage on the group asking for it, because "they took it" while on the other hand there is only one entity responsible for it - Cryptic.
Listen, I don't care if the Feds get a lot of stuff or new stuff or whatever. This does not necessarily have to include undermining the KDF's potential to retain a playerbase. Like errab here hit the nail on the head:
It's a short work high return cash grab that will have no real down side for them and the Fed BOP is going to sell like crazy until the novelty of it wears off and then it will be given a Battle Cloak ;P
It's a lazy cop-out. Just like the "Galaxy Revamp". Copy-paste work for easy cash. Cryptic could have shown some sense for the KDF and proactivity, but this is the way they do stuff. Slap something that you already have prepared for something else like a hangar bay or a cloaking device and call it a day.
They could have turned the Aquarius into something completely unique and new for the Feds, and I doubt that apart for a few "eternal complainers" anyone here would care. But that'd require some actual work on their behalf. Why do that when you can give the shaft to the KDF once again?
Yep they have over time given away everything unique to the KDF plus reduced our beloved faction down to almost nothing. For people like myself and I would wager to say you as well that STO has finally ran its course for us. Good luck to Cryptic they are going to need it with lots of us loyal players putting down the game for good.
There should be a stock, unchanging answer from the devs when people playing only feds ask for KDF stuff:
"Of course you can have x. It's available KDF side, by doing x."
Since it's not happening now, it never will. Sad.
I'm a fed player with a single fed allied rom alt as well with the rest all fed... no KDF alts at all. I just don't like the KDF side, and yes I tried it and leveled a alt to 50 before deleteing him. Anyway.. having said all that I agree with this statement completely.
I'm a fed player with a single fed allied rom alt as well with the rest all fed... no KDF alts at all. I just don't like the KDF side, and yes I tried it and leveled a alt to 50 before deleteing him. Anyway.. having said all that I agree with this statement completely.
Yeah why would you want to play KDF if it isn't going to be as good as your fed stuff lol. We do have fed characters too but I just find fed content has too many gimmicks. Which a lot of what we face is due to cash grabs, poor design, and just pure lack of development when it comes to the KDF. Atleast people like yourself can see the same things of us though that mostly have KDF characters though .
Ah, but it's also vice-versa. There is no pure hate aimed at a certain group of players from the majority of people here, but there is a solid group of Federation only players that has been whining for years for everything KDF related. If you're objective, you have to admit that. The problem here is - the developer. When the developer succumbs and does whatever that group that's whining asks for, it irks people. Rubs them the wrong way. And it's completely justifiable.
Now put in this mix the fact that Cryptic says they make so little for the KDF because less players play the faction. Then take a look at the "Delta Operations Pack", where Fed players get more then the 2 other factions combined and 2.5 times more than each.
Like you said, we're all people playing a game including the KDF players. But then I have less chance to enjoy stuff in the game, because I get less. And I get less because less players play the faction. So you tell me, how am I to expect improvement and bringing more people in the faction when everything that's unique is being ported over to team blue and on top of that blue gets 10 times the attention and content in the game? Why would someone, apart from being a ST fan (and Cryptic has done a good job pissing and chasing off a huge portion of those already) choose KDF over Fed, when as a Fed he gets everything + he gets much much more? Let's be real, 50% of the STO playerbase are probably not hardcore Trekkies. Apart from a small number that happen to like the species, they'll chose the faction that gives them everything.
And that's why people get angry. Because the ability of the KDF players to receive enjoyable content is being undermined by the developers themselves.
We wouldn't be so pissed at Fed players if "mommy" Cryptic didn't pamper them so much. They cry a little for something and Cryptic gives that to them on a silver platter. It's infuriating at times and some people project that rage on the group asking for it, because "they took it" while on the other hand there is only one entity responsible for it - Cryptic.
Listen, I don't care if the Feds get a lot of stuff or new stuff or whatever. This does not necessarily have to include undermining the KDF's potential to retain a playerbase. Like errab here hit the nail on the head:
It's a lazy cop-out. Just like the "Galaxy Revamp". Copy-paste work for easy cash. Cryptic could have shown some sense for the KDF and proactivity, but this is the way they do stuff. Slap something that you already have prepared for something else like a hangar bay or a cloaking device and call it a day.
They could have turned the Aquarius into something completely unique and new for the Feds, and I doubt that apart for a few "eternal complainers" anyone here would care. But that'd require some actual work on their behalf. Why do that when you can give the shaft to the KDF once again?
I have Lvl50 chars in every faction. But I always come back to my Klingon who was created in the days when the only way to level a Kdf characater was to pvp. I do play the blue side from time to time but for some reason I just don't like it. I have a KDF-aligned Romulan that I play a lot also but I always come back to my first love. Of course I'm not happy that the blue side gets everything and all we get are bits and pieces but I will never play the blue side only. The only thing that really annoys me however is that every Klingon ship we've seen in the shows that was equipped with a cloak had a battle cloak. I never understood why it was not the case in the game. I can understand why the Romulans have enhanced battle cloaks however: they invented the thing.
The Aquarius needed something. Brass tacks, the ship is pointless as it currently exists. It was launched behind the curve of every other Federation ship in the game. We knew that it was going to get the raider treatment eventually. This shouldn't really come as a surprise to anyone. The only surprise in this is how quickly they've done it. Frankly I thought it was going to be another year before they gave the vehicle another look.
What did you expect? They are the evul Klinguns, our most vicious and ruthless enemy!:P
Anyway it's really funny...the evuls are whining like little scared girls because of our Feddie Bop without the bcloak, while we Feds fight against their Bops with bcloak every time...LOL!
Now, if the bcloak sucks so much, then I think the Devs should give it also to our Aquarius!
And Devs...decrease the Aquarius stats below the Bop ones...we used to fight disadvantaged!:D
To a honest note, the new Aquarius is what the Defiant should have been, with more hull and -1 turn.
As a fed player, I feel it's insulting that a mission pod defeated a canon ship meant for combat. Unless they do something for my beloved Defiant class.
They did, it's called the "Phantom" and it got some Tron-like bodywork.
Under the hood, it's an updated Defiant with better. a bit the way the Ma'Ha is a Qin update, only in the case of the Ma'Ha, they scrupulously kept the defects in place and added a bigger gun.
This. Like all but Oddy and Avenger Fed Cruiser Boff layouts being obsoleted by the Guardian, The Defiant dies to serve the Phantom...
Yep they have over time given away everything unique to the KDF plus reduced our beloved faction down to almost nothing.
Were you even playing this game when it first came out? The KDF faction has only grown, immensely even. There was no PvE content. There was "go to this place and fight lots of respawning enemies", but that's it. None of the ship classes designed by the other non-klingon imperial races in the faction were playable. Until commander rank, you couldn't even run anything other than a bird of prey or a raptor. At top tier, you got your choice of bird of prey, raptor, battlecruiser, or carrier. One of each. That was it. Just because more content is released for the federation doesn't mean the klingon faction has been "reduced". There will always be more content for the federation. It's because far more people playing as feds than anything else.
I can almost guarantee the decision to revamp the Aquarius as a "raider" has about jack squat to do with federation players complaining on forums. It's just a neat gimmick they decided to give it to make it stand out instead of being superfluous, or as it has been until now, garbage.
Were you even playing this game when it first came out? The KDF faction has only grown, immensely even. There was no PvE content. There was "go to this place and fight lots of respawning enemies", but that's it. None of the ship classes designed by the other non-klingon imperial races in the faction were playable. Until commander rank, you couldn't even run anything other than a bird of prey or a raptor. At top tier, you got your choice of bird of prey, raptor, battlecruiser, or carrier. One of each. That was it. Just because more content is released for the federation doesn't mean the klingon faction has been "reduced". There will always be more content for the federation. It's because far more people playing as feds than anything else.
I can almost guarantee the decision to revamp the Aquarius as a "raider" has about jack squat to do with federation players complaining on forums. It's just a neat gimmick they decided to give it to make it stand out instead of being superfluous, or as it has been until now, garbage.
Go read the forums about flanking and all that QQ from almost a year ago.
Then take in consideration that if a company like Cryptic is going to make a multi faction game they need to find ways to not make non-federation content subpar to the federation content which is a big problem here. You get one group of players who mostly get nothing and then another that gets whatever they want. Worst of all they enable these people to do so. His name isn't jack squat its dave the klingon so get it right
they only did this to drum up more sales of the aquarius. which is a fleet shipyard only ship.... doubt you'll see that many fleet aquarius's since theres no way to get a discount on them..... unless they add the aquarius to the c-store and remove the base version from the fleet store.
they only did this to drum up more sales of the aquarius. which is a fleet shipyard only ship.... doubt you'll see that many fleet aquarius's since theres no way to get a discount on them..... unless they add the aquarius to the c-store and remove the base version from the fleet store.
Having bought several KDF fleet ships with no discount, I'm not bothered.
I'll pick up a Fleet Aquarius for my fed just for fun now. Heck got the Fleet Ambassador with no discounts, and love that cruiser as well.
Thanks for the Advanced Light Cruiser, Allied Escort Bundles, Jem-Hadar Light Battlecruiser, and Mek'leth
New Content Wishlist
T6 updates for the Kamarag & Vor'Cha
Heavy Cruiser & a Movie Era Style AoY Utility Cruiser
Wow, this thread makes me tempted to erase all 4 of my level 50 kdf.. well maybe not the kdf allied reman, she isnt as much of a little B1$#h as you all sound... Its a game, we all know its for a profit, instead of complaining how about suggesting balanced built vessels for the kdf as well?
Comments
I play a KDF character. I have had him since before the KDF even really had any true PvE content at all. It amuses me that he is max level and still has all the intro tutorial type missions sitting there. Nothing that has come out has driven me to drop the character. Reintroducing the aquarius as a raider does not change that. I still love my b'rel retrofit, I have had it on my character since the original T5 retrofit ships were first introduced with the vice admiral level cap expansion. Back then common concensus was that it wasn't worth it over the hegh'ta. But I liked it anyways, because the B'Rel is just a damn classic. If you want to be really technical, a b'rel bird of prey is the only star trek ship to survive a direct combat engagement with God.
So yeah, anyways, I do take some issue with the statting on the new aquarius here or there. But it's nothing huge, and honestly I don't give a damn that there is a "fed raider". Just like I didn't give a damn that they threw in a fed battlecruiser. One odd man out ship design that attempts to mimic advantages employed by the enemy is natural and logical in war (even though the war is technically off now). But the imitator ships will never capture the identity of the classic klingon ships.
Exactly, BoPs are easy to deal with. A stated, spec into sensors and you can see them coming, spec into it a lot (e.g. Sci in a Nebula with both consoles, 125 Aux, EPTA, Sensor Scan...) and no BoP within 20-25km is safe. (depends on their stealth)
And once you can see them and stop them, the BoP making soggy paper look like granite part comes in - and while one alone Nebula wont have the damage, the rest of the Fedball will. (or at least should)
Cue one dead BoP, as no BoP can survive a protracted fight.
In some ways, a battle-cloak is a disadvantage, especially if your opponent uses Torp Spread and the torps catch up while you are cloaked. (due to its auto-hit component)
Thanks but no thanks. As a hardcore Scimitar user I know what brings you out of cloak. What I meant to say is that the Aquarius can't escape as long as you keep it in red alert. Battle Cloak lets you do it at any moment; of course if you're facing someone able to decloak you at will it's like smashing your head on the wall.
If you run the Aquarius as a BoP, and get caught in the getaway, it won't survive.
Ah, but it's also vice-versa. There is no pure hate aimed at a certain group of players from the majority of people here, but there is a solid group of Federation only players that has been whining for years for everything KDF related. If you're objective, you have to admit that. The problem here is - the developer. When the developer succumbs and does whatever that group that's whining asks for, it irks people. Rubs them the wrong way. And it's completely justifiable.
Now put in this mix the fact that Cryptic says they make so little for the KDF because less players play the faction. Then take a look at the "Delta Operations Pack", where Fed players get more then the 2 other factions combined and 2.5 times more than each.
Like you said, we're all people playing a game including the KDF players. But then I have less chance to enjoy stuff in the game, because I get less. And I get less because less players play the faction. So you tell me, how am I to expect improvement and bringing more people in the faction when everything that's unique is being ported over to team blue and on top of that blue gets 10 times the attention and content in the game? Why would someone, apart from being a ST fan (and Cryptic has done a good job pissing and chasing off a huge portion of those already) choose KDF over Fed, when as a Fed he gets everything + he gets much much more? Let's be real, 50% of the STO playerbase are probably not hardcore Trekkies. Apart from a small number that happen to like the species, they'll chose the faction that gives them everything.
And that's why people get angry. Because the ability of the KDF players to receive enjoyable content is being undermined by the developers themselves.
We wouldn't be so pissed at Fed players if "mommy" Cryptic didn't pamper them so much. They cry a little for something and Cryptic gives that to them on a silver platter. It's infuriating at times and some people project that rage on the group asking for it, because "they took it" while on the other hand there is only one entity responsible for it - Cryptic.
Listen, I don't care if the Feds get a lot of stuff or new stuff or whatever. This does not necessarily have to include undermining the KDF's potential to retain a playerbase. Like errab here hit the nail on the head:
It's a lazy cop-out. Just like the "Galaxy Revamp". Copy-paste work for easy cash. Cryptic could have shown some sense for the KDF and proactivity, but this is the way they do stuff. Slap something that you already have prepared for something else like a hangar bay or a cloaking device and call it a day.
They could have turned the Aquarius into something completely unique and new for the Feds, and I doubt that apart for a few "eternal complainers" anyone here would care. But that'd require some actual work on their behalf. Why do that when you can give the shaft to the KDF once again?
Yep they have over time given away everything unique to the KDF plus reduced our beloved faction down to almost nothing. For people like myself and I would wager to say you as well that STO has finally ran its course for us. Good luck to Cryptic they are going to need it with lots of us loyal players putting down the game for good.
I'm a fed player with a single fed allied rom alt as well with the rest all fed... no KDF alts at all. I just don't like the KDF side, and yes I tried it and leveled a alt to 50 before deleteing him. Anyway.. having said all that I agree with this statement completely.
Yeah why would you want to play KDF if it isn't going to be as good as your fed stuff lol. We do have fed characters too but I just find fed content has too many gimmicks. Which a lot of what we face is due to cash grabs, poor design, and just pure lack of development when it comes to the KDF. Atleast people like yourself can see the same things of us though that mostly have KDF characters though
That made my day
I have Lvl50 chars in every faction. But I always come back to my Klingon who was created in the days when the only way to level a Kdf characater was to pvp. I do play the blue side from time to time but for some reason I just don't like it. I have a KDF-aligned Romulan that I play a lot also but I always come back to my first love. Of course I'm not happy that the blue side gets everything and all we get are bits and pieces but I will never play the blue side only. The only thing that really annoys me however is that every Klingon ship we've seen in the shows that was equipped with a cloak had a battle cloak. I never understood why it was not the case in the game. I can understand why the Romulans have enhanced battle cloaks however: they invented the thing.
/facepalm :rolleyes:
As a fed player, I feel it's insulting that a mission pod defeated a canon ship meant for combat. Unless they do something for my beloved Defiant class.
On a serious note, even though I'm PVE only and probably not going to notice, did they seriously leave that weird turn point in the Mat'Ha?
This. Like all but Oddy and Avenger Fed Cruiser Boff layouts being obsoleted by the Guardian, The Defiant dies to serve the Phantom...
Ha, silly Fed, you are meant to demand Phasic Enhanced Battle-Cloaks!
FT5-U or GTFO it seems...
Were you even playing this game when it first came out? The KDF faction has only grown, immensely even. There was no PvE content. There was "go to this place and fight lots of respawning enemies", but that's it. None of the ship classes designed by the other non-klingon imperial races in the faction were playable. Until commander rank, you couldn't even run anything other than a bird of prey or a raptor. At top tier, you got your choice of bird of prey, raptor, battlecruiser, or carrier. One of each. That was it. Just because more content is released for the federation doesn't mean the klingon faction has been "reduced". There will always be more content for the federation. It's because far more people playing as feds than anything else.
I can almost guarantee the decision to revamp the Aquarius as a "raider" has about jack squat to do with federation players complaining on forums. It's just a neat gimmick they decided to give it to make it stand out instead of being superfluous, or as it has been until now, garbage.
Go read the forums about flanking and all that QQ from almost a year ago.
Then take in consideration that if a company like Cryptic is going to make a multi faction game they need to find ways to not make non-federation content subpar to the federation content which is a big problem here. You get one group of players who mostly get nothing and then another that gets whatever they want. Worst of all they enable these people to do so. His name isn't jack squat its dave the klingon so get it right
Having bought several KDF fleet ships with no discount, I'm not bothered.
I'll pick up a Fleet Aquarius for my fed just for fun now. Heck got the Fleet Ambassador with no discounts, and love that cruiser as well.
You haven't actually tried that, have you?