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Open PvP format: A Pitch
kyeto13
Member Posts: 3 Arc User
In the hindsight of the recent ceasefire between the Klingons and the Federation, this post might seem a bit... too little too late. But this is an idea I have been kicking around to allow for a fair but open PvP system that will allow for dynamic battles to evolve within sector blocks, and allow for a more organic feel for combat.
This system will take place within several stages. Most of these I believe have been tuned to allow for ease of use by the player and ease of installation by Cryptic. However, as I am not a coder, I have zero idea how difficult any of this might be, so feel free to refute me is the engine simply cannot handle it.
In the following examples, I will be using a Klingon Mogh class Battlecruiser, IKS SuD tojwI', attacking a Federation Vesta Class Science Vessel, USS Magellan, of equal skill and gear.
The system will be level locked so that only those within the 10 level tier can attack each other, to prevent ganking. Also, this will take place in certain "contested" sector blocks that will be clearly marked.
There will be an Opt in button
STAGE 1: The Interception
Both the USS Magellan and the IKS SuD tojwI' are in the Eta Eradani sector block. The SuD tojwI' sees the Magellan from a distance and targets them. They must get within 1 lightyear of a target in order to pull up the "Intercept..." option on right click menu.
This will stop the Magellan and pop up a dialogue saying that we are being intercepted. The Magellan than has three choices, either evade, confront, or negotiate.
Evade (means you pay a modest 300 dil fee*remove*) Will do a RNG Roll based on your driver coil skill. It will take the base driver coil skill of each ship, and then do a random roll of 1-20 on top of it. Bigger numbers wins.
The Magellan will then have a 15 minute immunity to interception. The SuD tojwI' gets a message that the vessel has pulled out of range, and must find another target.
Confront means that the Magellan accepts the challenge and moves to the next part. Both the Magellan and the SuD tojwI' are warped into a space PvP arena map and the battle begins.
Negotiate means that you send diplomats to negotiate a peaceful solution. In this option, the Magellan will select two diplomatic duty officers to represent them. The SuD tojwI' will then have chance to send two of their own Marauding duty officers to make a "counter proposal" These will act like a standard doff mission and will have critical success traits and failure chance. The two sides "meet" and whoever has the highest success score wins. Ties are given to the Magellan, as she is defending herself. A Successful negotiation will give the Magellan a 15 minute immunity to interception, with a critical chance of earning a 30 minute immunity. If the Magellan fails to negotiate, the interception continues and combat begins.
This could also be a part where Diplomatic Immunity/Raiding Party comes into play, and can give your character a better base diplomacy/marauding skill for the negotiation. It could also level up in much the same way that R&D does, where your recommendation ranking gives you a base score to work off of, augmented by the doffs you send to represent yourself.
STAGE 2: The Encounter
Let's say that the Magellan tries to negotiate and fails. Combat begins and both ships drop out of warp and into a PvP arena map. Standard rules apply. First one to 5 kills wins. This is (in theory) to keep the battle's short, but to allow for evolution of tactics and to prevent vaping from auto winning it in one blow. This is a private match and no one may enter it... yet
STAGE 3: The Reinforcements
Let's say that the Magellan is taking a beating and died 2 times. After the 2nd death, she then has the option of requesting reinforcements. This will cost 1000 dilithium to do, more than if she just evaded earlier. Doing so will place a Red Alert Marker in the Eta Eradani sector block that all players, Federation and Klingon will see. Both sides can click the marker and chose to assist their side, much like a Borg Red Alert. This will work up to a max of 10 players per side, to prevent massive one sidedness and lag issues. After the max is reached, the Red Alert marker will drop for the one side.
Since the SuD tojwI' is the attacker, she cannot send a distress signal until 3 deaths into the match. The same 1000 dilithium cost applies.
After Reinforcements arrive, the game changes from a standard PvP match. The main players, the Magellan and the SuD tojwI', become Kings of the match. They become specially marked by a halo effect, and the kill count continues. If the kill count was 2-1 when the Magellan used a distress call, the SuD tojwI' itself will have to die 4 more times for a total of five deaths in order to win. No one elses deaths matter.
STAGE 4: The Rewards
Now, this is the fun part; the rewards for doing all of this. The Score table is broken up into 4 parts, depending on who is defending, who is attacking, and who is the reinforcement for either. You get MORE rewards for being a defender, as you did not chose this fight. You will also get more rewards for winning an engagement either way. However, everyone leaves with at least 480 dil at the end for participating.
If the Magellan, the Defender, wins:
Magellan: 1440 dilithium
Federation Allies: 1160 dilithium
SuD tojwI': 720 dilthium
Klingon Allies: 480 dilithium
If the SuD tojwI', the attacker wins
SuD tojwI': 1160 dilithium
Klingon Allies: 960 dilithium
Magellan: 640 dilithium
Federation Allies: 480 dilithium
Also, both the Magellan and the SuD tojwI' get a 1 hour immunity to interception. Meaning that neither can start or be dragged into an interception. However, they may queue for PvP or assist other players as needed.
Yes, the numbers are rough estimates that I came up with, but hopefully this shows how this system might be beneficial to everyone.
*It allows for PvPers to have more organic and dynamic battles that spawn out of deep space.
*It is a dynamic and open battle system that allows combat to start anywhere, and allow the community as a whole to participate in the victory.
*It gives enough exit points for those who wish to avoid it the means to do so.
*It has a decent risk versus reward system in to entice some people to at least try it.
*It favors the defender, who did not start the fight, while giving the attacker enough incentive to actually win the battle.
*It has a baseline minimum rewards for all participants. So even if you lose, you will leave with something.
*It has a lose/win rewards scale encouraging people to participate and try their best.
*It cost dilithium, so Cryptic has yet another dilithium sink
*Edited based on feedback
This system will take place within several stages. Most of these I believe have been tuned to allow for ease of use by the player and ease of installation by Cryptic. However, as I am not a coder, I have zero idea how difficult any of this might be, so feel free to refute me is the engine simply cannot handle it.
In the following examples, I will be using a Klingon Mogh class Battlecruiser, IKS SuD tojwI', attacking a Federation Vesta Class Science Vessel, USS Magellan, of equal skill and gear.
The system will be level locked so that only those within the 10 level tier can attack each other, to prevent ganking. Also, this will take place in certain "contested" sector blocks that will be clearly marked.
There will be an Opt in button
STAGE 1: The Interception
Both the USS Magellan and the IKS SuD tojwI' are in the Eta Eradani sector block. The SuD tojwI' sees the Magellan from a distance and targets them. They must get within 1 lightyear of a target in order to pull up the "Intercept..." option on right click menu.
This will stop the Magellan and pop up a dialogue saying that we are being intercepted. The Magellan than has three choices, either evade, confront, or negotiate.
Evade (means you pay a modest 300 dil fee*remove*) Will do a RNG Roll based on your driver coil skill. It will take the base driver coil skill of each ship, and then do a random roll of 1-20 on top of it. Bigger numbers wins.
The Magellan will then have a 15 minute immunity to interception. The SuD tojwI' gets a message that the vessel has pulled out of range, and must find another target.
Confront means that the Magellan accepts the challenge and moves to the next part. Both the Magellan and the SuD tojwI' are warped into a space PvP arena map and the battle begins.
Negotiate means that you send diplomats to negotiate a peaceful solution. In this option, the Magellan will select two diplomatic duty officers to represent them. The SuD tojwI' will then have chance to send two of their own Marauding duty officers to make a "counter proposal" These will act like a standard doff mission and will have critical success traits and failure chance. The two sides "meet" and whoever has the highest success score wins. Ties are given to the Magellan, as she is defending herself. A Successful negotiation will give the Magellan a 15 minute immunity to interception, with a critical chance of earning a 30 minute immunity. If the Magellan fails to negotiate, the interception continues and combat begins.
This could also be a part where Diplomatic Immunity/Raiding Party comes into play, and can give your character a better base diplomacy/marauding skill for the negotiation. It could also level up in much the same way that R&D does, where your recommendation ranking gives you a base score to work off of, augmented by the doffs you send to represent yourself.
STAGE 2: The Encounter
Let's say that the Magellan tries to negotiate and fails. Combat begins and both ships drop out of warp and into a PvP arena map. Standard rules apply. First one to 5 kills wins. This is (in theory) to keep the battle's short, but to allow for evolution of tactics and to prevent vaping from auto winning it in one blow. This is a private match and no one may enter it... yet
STAGE 3: The Reinforcements
Let's say that the Magellan is taking a beating and died 2 times. After the 2nd death, she then has the option of requesting reinforcements. This will cost 1000 dilithium to do, more than if she just evaded earlier. Doing so will place a Red Alert Marker in the Eta Eradani sector block that all players, Federation and Klingon will see. Both sides can click the marker and chose to assist their side, much like a Borg Red Alert. This will work up to a max of 10 players per side, to prevent massive one sidedness and lag issues. After the max is reached, the Red Alert marker will drop for the one side.
Since the SuD tojwI' is the attacker, she cannot send a distress signal until 3 deaths into the match. The same 1000 dilithium cost applies.
After Reinforcements arrive, the game changes from a standard PvP match. The main players, the Magellan and the SuD tojwI', become Kings of the match. They become specially marked by a halo effect, and the kill count continues. If the kill count was 2-1 when the Magellan used a distress call, the SuD tojwI' itself will have to die 4 more times for a total of five deaths in order to win. No one elses deaths matter.
STAGE 4: The Rewards
Now, this is the fun part; the rewards for doing all of this. The Score table is broken up into 4 parts, depending on who is defending, who is attacking, and who is the reinforcement for either. You get MORE rewards for being a defender, as you did not chose this fight. You will also get more rewards for winning an engagement either way. However, everyone leaves with at least 480 dil at the end for participating.
If the Magellan, the Defender, wins:
Magellan: 1440 dilithium
Federation Allies: 1160 dilithium
SuD tojwI': 720 dilthium
Klingon Allies: 480 dilithium
If the SuD tojwI', the attacker wins
SuD tojwI': 1160 dilithium
Klingon Allies: 960 dilithium
Magellan: 640 dilithium
Federation Allies: 480 dilithium
Also, both the Magellan and the SuD tojwI' get a 1 hour immunity to interception. Meaning that neither can start or be dragged into an interception. However, they may queue for PvP or assist other players as needed.
Yes, the numbers are rough estimates that I came up with, but hopefully this shows how this system might be beneficial to everyone.
*It allows for PvPers to have more organic and dynamic battles that spawn out of deep space.
*It is a dynamic and open battle system that allows combat to start anywhere, and allow the community as a whole to participate in the victory.
*It gives enough exit points for those who wish to avoid it the means to do so.
*It has a decent risk versus reward system in to entice some people to at least try it.
*It favors the defender, who did not start the fight, while giving the attacker enough incentive to actually win the battle.
*It has a baseline minimum rewards for all participants. So even if you lose, you will leave with something.
*It has a lose/win rewards scale encouraging people to participate and try their best.
*It cost dilithium, so Cryptic has yet another dilithium sink
*Edited based on feedback
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Post edited by kyeto13 on
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Comments
I had my share of the PvP mentality long ago... I don't need it forced on me... Especially if avoiding it being forced on me costs dil.
However, I'd drop the rewards quite a lot for what is a quick battle, and I'd also make it first to one kill.
Yup, one kill and done.
Also, forget the evade bit, make this a difficulty level. You're either open to it or you're not.
Which is why I suggest the difficulty level that allows it.
That way, it's open PVP only between those who have opted in.
to the
NO...
Fleet leader Nova Elite
Fleet Leader House of Nova elite
@ren_larreck
1)Add a space and ground war zone in each sector block
2) Have two levels of the DSE. One where you enter a PvE instance and one where you enter a PvP instance.
Both of these ideas would allow the player to decide if they want to take part in open PvP or not. No penalties, no costs, no flags. If you want to PvP, enter the map. If you don't, don't.
I support any type of open pvp.
So you're saying you'd be fine with two players tossing tribbles at each other would be fine with you?
Sure... i'd go for that.
When attacked in PvP, the defender (the person that was jumped) has the option to blow up his ship resulting in an instant win for that Captain and no damage to his ship.
The attacker loses and suffers damage normally.
While this may seem unfair to the attacker, it is actually a way for the people that don't like PvP to show this preference. After a few loses, the attacker will leave the defender alone.
I'd go for this too...
In my opinion, I would rather prefer a setting that disables Open-PvP for my ship so I can fly around unmolested.
(UFP) Ragnar
Neither.
Make open pvp an opt in affair and those who want it can have it, with no impact on those who don't.
Easiest way to opt in is to create a new difficulty level.
Thus, one can also opt out at will.
I wish STO was more like EvE even if it was just a pve game. A star map the size of Eve and each star that has a system to explore certainly would bring the feeling of the vastness of space a lot better then the current sector maps do in Sto. You can even have pvp areas of the map like around neutral zones and all of it would still be optional.
I support this, also: Not Chess, Mr. Spock. Poker.
This I would have no problem with. Don't get me wrong, just because I personally don't pvp doesn't mean I'm against it. In fact a while back when people mentioned the idea of a sector that was open pvp I was all for it. If you don't pvp just don't go there, no problem. What I do have a problem with is pvp being forced on every single player in the game, which is what I got from the OP. So as long as there is an opt in/opt out then everyone should be happy, in theory anyway.
And if I don't want to fight, I have to pay??
This is a wonderful idea - if you never want anyone else to join the game again. And to drive away a substantial fraction of the experienced playerbase we have now.
Yup, Ops evade option was ill judged.
But make it a simpler opt in or out and it'd work, Imo.
Your prayers are answered why look there are 4 such open PVP areas that players can opt in or out of....
Space
Ker'rat System
N'Vak System
Ground
Otha System
Qay'ghun System
The fact that a majority of the player base chooses to not go there should speak volumes on how they feel about it. The idea of blackmailing players to pay dilithium to not accept the challenge is never gonna fly.
You miss the point though.
It's not about the PvP per se, it's the possibility of it, the not knowing.
Sometimes, it really is about the journey and not the destination.
Unfortunately, the PvP journey is a journey most of the STO community has decided they do not want any part of.
I used to love low level PVP space and ground matches as there was a limit on how much you could stuff into the ship, but without some type of Cryptic ranking system the gap in knowledge/ability is too vast for new players vs old timers so most simply opt out of it. Others, seemingly the majority, simply prefer to relax and stroll thru the galaxy picking up whatever shinies of the moment interest them the most and at the moment that is all they want so Cryptic caters to that idea, because it generates the most income for them.
Forcing a random PvP Encounter on people isn't the answer. You'd just promote more camp ganking and stalking of players identified as easy marks. And forcing a player to spend DL to opt out? What's to stop them from bringing friends and basically draining someone of their DL? You'd be opening the door for some serious Troll abuse there.
Until there's an Opt Out setting or something to flag you as non PvP or PvP Ready, this idea is horrible.
Having PvP instigated in Sector space is not a new idea.
I wouldn't be against something like this, but there should be a checkbox in the settings that will enable your participation...and it should be off by default.
RIP KDF and PvP 2014-07-17 Season 9.5 - Death by Dev
An Opt in out system would be added to the menu where you can tick it off if you are adverse to PvP in general.
However, I also thought that I made it clear that you can negotiate your way out of a fight, as in, use diplomacy to defuse a situation. No fighting, no paying dil. You use diplomacy to defuse or outsmart the enemy and then you can walk away, unscatched without firing a shot.
But, again, I can see how forced PvP on those that absolutely would not like it will end in bloody tears. A simple check box will can be added to opt out... at the expense of losing out on another way to earn dilithium. It would much be the same way as people are adverse to ground combat. If you don't like it, then you do not have to play it.
+1 for the Opt in system
After you pay to evade someone, you cannot be incepted for another 15 minutes. Again, the timer is just a mock up, it could be an hour or a day. This will prevent stalking behavior. Same thing after the fight, everyone goes into cooldown and cannot fight again for an hour.
- Judge Aaron Satie
I do remember accidentally clicking on an accept button and getting tossed into a pvp match before, where somebody had challenged me.
Fleet leader Nova Elite
Fleet Leader House of Nova elite
@ren_larreck
Yea... It does... The OP is just looking for a way to grief people in sector space.