Who digs the raw materials and feeds the machine? Who fixes the broke down machine? Who trains them to do so? What motivates anyone to take on these roles?
with all the replicators out there, the need to work for food is gone, and with simple replication technology, transporter technology, everything is easy to build.
with that mindset in place, the only other thing for people to think about is the betterment of humanity and civilization as a whole. if you want to live on earth then you can enjoy the paradise that it is, you can enjoy what you want to do.
there is also the option to go out and earn latinum for other things, everyone is given a set amount of points a day (so to speak) so replicator points, and things that replicators can't make can be earned through honest work.
starfleet itself has more than just a military and exploration department, they also have mining and refinement assignments, you earn your way up in starfleet, it's not just about being better at one thing than someone else, everything in starfleet is structured so that experience and time trumps simple promotions like we have now.
and motivation is just on who wants to do what, it's dificult to explain, but let me put it this way, if you had been born into a world where you can be what you want, do whatever you wanted, without the looming stress of bills and entrapment like we've got now, would you think you'd want to do something?
If there was a way to go into the Star Trek world, I'd enjoy paradise for a little while, but then i'd get bored and want to do something.
there are people out there who love to farm, who love the work in mining, or who love to fix broken things. Finland did a tremendous triumph in this kind of socialism, they've so far managed to build a stable economy on this philosophy, there are plenty of jobs because the employers don't have to worry about paying someone so much for all the help, there are plenty of people pursuing their goals on what they want to do, since they enacted these policies they've gotten an influx of teachers, farmers, fishermen, electricians, and engineers etc.
that's not to say its perfect, they've been having many problems integrating these things.
it all depends on what your goals are and how it can be achieved.
but I can say this, Capitalism works...when it's heavily regulated by a democratic system of government, capitalism does NOT work when free market ideals and no regulations run rampant, most of the economic decline can be traced back to the massive De-Regulation of our banking system which was put in place after the 1920's collapse where our banks made horrible investments and ran rampant. but since the 70's it's been de-regulated heavily and our economy took a recognizable decline.
when you can pay politicians to pass whatever laws you want, or pay them to pass laws that protect your personal accounts from the IRS, it becomes a different story.
When Roddenberry died, his net worth was estimated at $1 billion, the vast majority of which came from Star Trek.
And his paychecks, in the millions, weren't enough. He systematically stole money from the writers and composers who worked on the original series and early Next Generation. Most famously, he wrote lyrics to the TOS theme song, then tricked the composer into signing a new contract (he claimed the original was lost and it was just a reprint, but it included new terms), so that Roddenberry would get 50% of all royalties on the song.
He also renamed numerous characters and races so he could claim 50% of the writer pay on the episode and 50% royalties on the character. Just for changing names. Doing this he turned repeat villains into aliens of the week and killed (arguably poorly laid) plans for an entire junior officer B cast for TNG just by renaming the character who was planned to link the A and B casts.
where'd you get this informaton?
because from what I've found through multiple articles from his living time period, and from "The Trek Nation", only the franchise was worth close to that much by his death, not him.
Incredible. No one notices interplanetary trade conducted by individuals. No one sees the shops at DS-9. Everyone just gets up every day and builds Star ships without any compensation. I can only wonder how many high school kids are going to get out of bed in the morning for that. The trade reality goes on throughout Star Trek, but someone finally decides that no one actually builds the replicator. They don't need raw materials for it. They just replicate on their own.
Believe it or not... not everyone works for money. I hold a masters and 2 degrees in 2 major fields I don't work in. I could easily do either of those instead of what I do. They would both pay me at least three of four times what I make now. I made a choice to spend my time working in a field where helping others is the goal. I make enough to pay my bills and eat, that's fine by me. Perhaps I won't be buying a BMW this year or next, and I'll make do in the 1100 sq.ft. I have. I'm happy to do it. Getting out of bed doesn't have to be about getting more stuff, that is a very silly idea. Its also likely why so many people are deeply unhappy. Stop chasing the buck my friend. Focus on yourself and those around you and the little things take care of themselves.
As for DS9 You seem to forget the early episodes where the Star Fleet officers where easily taken by Quark. They had no idea how to interact with Ferengi... because they really didn't understand the concept of money anymore. No one is saying greed and capitalism isn't around in the Trek Future.. They are saying Star Fleet and earth culture in general really has all but eliminated money and material gain. I'm not saying oh look isn't that nice... I'm saying its canon. If you don't see that you didn't watch enough trek.
because from what I've found through multiple articles from his living time period, and from "The Trek Nation", only the franchise was worth close to that much by his death, not him.
However when his wife died a few years ago her will put there dogs up in a mansion. They also managed a 60 million bump for Rod the son...with 10 million every 5 years for a long time to come, they also gave him one of the other mansions.
Not sure if the dogs themselves have there own wills. lol
because from what I've found through multiple articles from his living time period, and from "The Trek Nation", only the franchise was worth close to that much by his death, not him.
There are several extensive resources for celebrity net worths. They're not entirely accurate, because paychecks are rarely a matter of public record, but in the case of Roddenberry, the majority of his estate eventually ended up in Roddenberry Entertainment and the Roddenberry Foundation.
Nitpicking is a time-honored tradition of science fiction. Asking your readers not to worry about the "little things" is like asking a dog not to sniff at people's crotches. If there's something that appears to violate natural laws, then you can expect someone's going to point it out. That's just the way things are.
However when his wife died a few years ago her will put there dogs up in a mansion. They also managed a 60 million bump for Rod the son...with 10 million every 5 years for a long time to come, they also gave him one of the other mansions.
Not sure if the dogs themselves have there own wills. lol
yea the first link is not completely accurate, it was based on what the star trek franchise actually is worth, Roddenberry died in a time when the royalties were being held by CBS and one other company I forgot which, so he wasn't even given the full royalties, but he did get most of the movie royalties when TMP came out, and that along with TNG gained him some comfortable royalties, but the worth wasn't as high as it is now, this was back when Star Trek was only heard of by that one nerd out of 10 people.
and you do know Majel Barrett was not exactly mentally stable near her demise right? and that she wasn't a Roddenberry? she divorced Gene when he cheated on her in the past, she remained Majel Barrett after that.
not to mention the second link isn't backed up well enough with enough coverage.
Rod (son) is to recieve only 40 million in royalty rights, after that he gets them via royalties in increments.
but yea Majel Barrett wasn't exactly on the stable mindset by the time she died.
and also to point out, the money came late in his life, before he died, they managed to afford what they have now. but durring the making of TNG there was barely enough to live on.
Getting out of bed doesn't have to be about getting more stuff, that is a very silly idea.
It's also a bit of a hyperbole. If communism has taught mankind anything, then it is that humans need motivation (didn't we recently have a similar discussion about the power creep). Aka, you have to *want* to get out of bed in the morning to begin with.
An economy where ppl just work to better themselves, Trek style, either doesn't work at all, or ppl all have the exact amount of possessions. And yet, even on Star Trek Earth, many ppl live in many different sized-homes, apartments, farms, etc. My point being, who decides who gets the bigger home?
And how do Star Trek ppl on Earth feed and clothe their children? Ah yes, the 'Deus ex machina' replicator! On that note, a true holodeck would all but paralyze and kill mankind! Ppl would just lock themselves up in their homes, playing out whatever fantasy they desire, on their holodeck. And not even that, why even bother to buy a home in the first place!? Holodeck, baby, yeah!
No one is saying greed and capitalism isn't around in the Trek Future.. They are saying Star Fleet and earth culture in general really has all but eliminated money and material gain.
I agree that American-style greed has been reduced to non-obsessive proportions in Roddenberry's future. However, I think Picard's comment about their being no currency whatsoever in the future, was probably a bit of an exaggeration.
When Roddenberry died, his net worth was estimated at $1 billion, the vast majority of which came from Star Trek.
And his paychecks, in the millions, weren't enough. He systematically stole money from the writers and composers who worked on the original series and early Next Generation. Most famously, he wrote lyrics to the TOS theme song, then tricked the composer into signing a new contract (he claimed the original was lost and it was just a reprint, but it included new terms), so that Roddenberry would get 50% of all royalties on the song.
He also renamed numerous characters and races so he could claim 50% of the writer pay on the episode and 50% royalties on the character. Just for changing names. Doing this he turned repeat villains into aliens of the week and killed (arguably poorly laid) plans for an entire junior officer B cast for TNG just by renaming the character who was planned to link the A and B casts.
Thx for saying! I knew this about him, in general terms; but thx for the details!
It's also a bit of a hyperbole. If communism has taught mankind anything, then it is that humans need motivation (didn't we recently have a similar discussion about the power creep). Aka, you have to *want* to get out of bed in the morning to begin with.
Well its beyond the sscope of what can argue here really... there has never been a true communism system. What they did in Russia and what they are doing in China ect are not real true communism.
In terms of trek just pointing out that it is 100% canon that the system in place in the trek future is one where money doesn't exist. How they make that work you got me.
I like the dreamer idea that Gene had of a perfect world where money was unneeded and the reason to do anything was to better yourself or someone else. Its a wonderful idea and one of the reasons many people love trek.
If Humans ever are going to get to a point where something like that is a reality it sure won't be a few hundred years from now I have no doubt. Something like that if it is ever possible would take major changes in the way people think and if I was going to guess it would be more like 2000 years off, assuming we don't do anything stupid that sets us back.
In terms of trek just pointing out that it is 100% canon that the system in place in the trek future is one where money doesn't exist. How they make that work you got me.
What's canon is that Earth doesn't use money. Whether the Federation uses it internally or not is flipflopped all over the ****ing place, including back in TOS.
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
I just completed the First Contact mission event. I took the time to visit each of the bridge officers on the Enterprise-F and came across a very disturbing dialog.
While speaking with Lt. Com. Tem Inasi I was informed that Zefram Cochran was one of those evil capitalists types and his endeavor to prove Warp Drive was launched for the wrong reasons. For "personal gain".
This smacks of influence from the ChiCom arraignment and it serves as a leftist propaganda statement for kids playing STO that no self respecting American would condone. It is most definitely not part of the Star Trek story.
I would appreciate a response, especially since I'm a paying customer to one of those evil capitalist endeavors known as Star Trek online. I'm sure Cryptic, CBS, and others involved with this production work for free since "personal gain" is now a taboo.
I'm much more offended that they got the Cromwell guy to play Cochran in FC. He's annoying and looks nothing like the guy who played him in TOS.
Anyways, is the dialogue slanted?
Yeah, I suppose it is. What do you expect when we live in a society where people can just keep repeating things over and over until you believe them? The more you repeat something, the less people will question it. This is also a great indicator of what some of the devs think is more important to add to this game. Meanwhile in the written dialogue of the first Devidian Episode, Cardassian Ensign "Driolic" is a person you read about in the text not long after you scanned for waves which are "Triolic."
I just completed the First Contact mission event. I took the time to visit each of the bridge officers on the Enterprise-F and came across a very disturbing dialog.
While speaking with Lt. Com. Tem Inasi I was informed that Zefram Cochran was one of those evil capitalists types and his endeavor to prove Warp Drive was launched for the wrong reasons. For "personal gain".
This smacks of influence from the ChiCom arraignment and it serves as a leftist propaganda statement for kids playing STO that no self respecting American would condone. It is most definitely not part of the Star Trek story.
I would appreciate a response, especially since I'm a paying customer to one of those evil capitalist endeavors known as Star Trek online. I'm sure Cryptic, CBS, and others involved with this production work for free since "personal gain" is now a taboo.
This can all be resolved by creating a slave race of robots and keeping them only intelligent enough to do their tasks. Making robots just as smart as humans or smarter will only result in a slave revolt or have more "people" not working. Of course, an EMP would destroy civilization, but that is a small price to pay to be free from the slavery of work.
But he DID develop warp drive for personal gain. Direct quote from First Contact: "You wanna know what my vision is? Dollar signs, money! I didn't build this ship to usher in a new era for humanity. You think I wanna see the stars? I don't even like to fly! I take trains! I built this ship so I could retire to some tropical island...filled with naked women. THAT'S Zefram Cochrane. THAT'S his vision. This other guy you keep talking about, this historical figure? I never met him. I can't imagine I ever will."
So what if he did? That is the driving engine of anything. First it's survival, then it's betterment of ones own life. Such has the natural effect of benefiting all. Necessity is the mother of all invention. A rising tide floats all ships.
There's nothing wrong with inventing for your own gain nor working for those who do. That is capitalism. Those who would attempt to use jealosuy to attempt to claim "greed" seem to forget that the real greed is found in those who seek to take away the fruits of an others labor instead of making their own. In today's politcal world "greed" is used by socialists as a tool, all the while hoping that those gullible enough to buy into it never figure out that jealousy is the very tool they used to cause an upheaval from a long ago disproven theory of economics. Zero Sum gain.
Wealth is created, not some finite pie. We are not limited to someones version of a "fair share" slice. Basically, if you want more pie, go bake some. Zefram Cochrane baked a pie of his own. Such is no different than anyone else who invents something, but to whomever wrote the wording for the Lt Commander's dialog, they chose to make a political statement and one that flies against this nations very existence. Freedom can only reign where rights reign supreme. Where governments are under the people, not over them.
Such a political challenge being leveled against the predominant make up of people reading it who are likely to be children, not adults, is an affront with intent. Parents raise children, not governments, and not those who seek to brainwash other peoples children. I am the parent.
I just completed the First Contact mission event. I took the time to visit each of the bridge officers on the Enterprise-F and came across a very disturbing dialog.
While speaking with Lt. Com. Tem Inasi I was informed that Zefram Cochran was one of those evil capitalists types and his endeavor to prove Warp Drive was launched for the wrong reasons. For "personal gain".
This smacks of influence from the ChiCom arraignment and it serves as a leftist propaganda statement for kids playing STO that no self respecting American would condone. It is most definitely not part of the Star Trek story.
I would appreciate a response, especially since I'm a paying customer to one of those evil capitalist endeavors known as Star Trek online. I'm sure Cryptic, CBS, and others involved with this production work for free since "personal gain" is now a taboo.
Um I'd go rewatch the film "Star Trek: First Contact" - and if you don't like the way they portrayed Zefram Cochran - blame Brannon Braga and Ronald D. Moore, as they wrote it.
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
I just completed the First Contact mission event. I took the time to visit each of the bridge officers on the Enterprise-F and came across a very disturbing dialog.
While speaking with Lt. Com. Tem Inasi I was informed that Zefram Cochran was one of those evil capitalists types and his endeavor to prove Warp Drive was launched for the wrong reasons. For "personal gain".
This smacks of influence from the ChiCom arraignment and it serves as a leftist propaganda statement for kids playing STO that no self respecting American would condone. It is most definitely not part of the Star Trek story.
I would appreciate a response, especially since I'm a paying customer to one of those evil capitalist endeavors known as Star Trek online. I'm sure Cryptic, CBS, and others involved with this production work for free since "personal gain" is now a taboo.
You don't like it bro... sad story... don't play it... Move On...
Star Trek would turn into Frank Herbert's Dune series.
Bi-la kaifa.
The Dune series if you believe the Machine Crusade books are canon was due to some humans creating a virus that infected machine intelligences to revolt against humanity because they were bored.
The Matrix and Terminator are based on the slave revolt concept. Although, Terminator was a preemptive strike caused by Skynet so there was no time for humanity to create a slave race.
Due to Data and the Doctor getting sentient rights, then it would require some virus that infects all machine life in the galaxy for Star Trek to get close to Dune. Slave revolts from machine life would be possible in other empires, but the Federation is safe from that.
Star Trek canon disagrees with you consistently. Money does exist in Star Trek and Earth, the Fed, and everyone else use it.
James T. Kirk stated that the Federation Starfleet had a lot invested in both him and Commander Spock. In fact, Starfleet had 122,200 plus credits invested in Spock by the end of 2267. (TOS: "Errand of Mercy", "The Apple")
(snipped for brevity)
Malin paid 3000 renns for a violent thought forbidden on his homeworld. (VOY: "Random Thoughts")
All I can say is, God bless you. You have no idea how glad I was to read your work. There is hope.
Such a political challenge being leveled against the predominant make up of people reading it who are likely to be children, not adults, is an affront with intent. Parents raise children, not governments, and not those who seek to brainwash other peoples children. I am the parent.
Get over it. If you don't like the message of trek don't let your kids watch or play the game.
If you think you are not brain washing your children with the idea that pure capitalism is the best policy your diluting yourself.
Socialism works... I can say that because I live in a pretty socialist country. I have visited your country often enough that I can 100% tell you your system is far from superior.
I also won't claim we have a perfect setup anywhere in the world right now... that is crazy.
Trek is an idealized future no doubt. I don't think a system with no money or profit could ever work right now no. I hope that in our future it can though. Perhaps not in 300 years as Trek would like us to believe but perhaps in 1000-2000 sure... it just takes enough people to view the world differently to move the world forward.
Socialism as an idea though 100% works... saying it doesn't is saying that countries like Denmark, Finland, Canada, Sweden, New Zealand, ect. Don't work.
The truth is our countries work just fine. Its a simple change in a state of mind. The idea of a hospital turning a sick person out is repugnant to pretty much any Canadian I know. The idea of charging people with 20 years of debt when they do get sick... is perhaps even more sickening. Yet down south that doesn't seem to bother many people.
Of course a country like mine Canada we have profit and money, and sure some people choose to make there lives mission the accumulation of money. Nothing wrong with that and just like our friends in the US that is required to keep the economy moving. That doesn't mean there shouldn't be a balance between building a thriving economy and taking care of each other. I'll gladly drive my little cr*p box car instead of a caddy if it means I can help 2 or 3 people to not have to live on a street, or be denied expensive medications that would have them live.
In the trek future more people think like me then you.... its not my thinking. Its how Gene wrote it. So live with it or don't involve yourself with Trek IP games.
Comments
Best words of the week, gentlemen... This discussion is over.
Tell me where this island is, I DEMAND it!!! Already got my suitcase packed!
with all the replicators out there, the need to work for food is gone, and with simple replication technology, transporter technology, everything is easy to build.
with that mindset in place, the only other thing for people to think about is the betterment of humanity and civilization as a whole. if you want to live on earth then you can enjoy the paradise that it is, you can enjoy what you want to do.
there is also the option to go out and earn latinum for other things, everyone is given a set amount of points a day (so to speak) so replicator points, and things that replicators can't make can be earned through honest work.
starfleet itself has more than just a military and exploration department, they also have mining and refinement assignments, you earn your way up in starfleet, it's not just about being better at one thing than someone else, everything in starfleet is structured so that experience and time trumps simple promotions like we have now.
and motivation is just on who wants to do what, it's dificult to explain, but let me put it this way, if you had been born into a world where you can be what you want, do whatever you wanted, without the looming stress of bills and entrapment like we've got now, would you think you'd want to do something?
If there was a way to go into the Star Trek world, I'd enjoy paradise for a little while, but then i'd get bored and want to do something.
there are people out there who love to farm, who love the work in mining, or who love to fix broken things. Finland did a tremendous triumph in this kind of socialism, they've so far managed to build a stable economy on this philosophy, there are plenty of jobs because the employers don't have to worry about paying someone so much for all the help, there are plenty of people pursuing their goals on what they want to do, since they enacted these policies they've gotten an influx of teachers, farmers, fishermen, electricians, and engineers etc.
that's not to say its perfect, they've been having many problems integrating these things.
it all depends on what your goals are and how it can be achieved.
but I can say this, Capitalism works...when it's heavily regulated by a democratic system of government, capitalism does NOT work when free market ideals and no regulations run rampant, most of the economic decline can be traced back to the massive De-Regulation of our banking system which was put in place after the 1920's collapse where our banks made horrible investments and ran rampant. but since the 70's it's been de-regulated heavily and our economy took a recognizable decline.
when you can pay politicians to pass whatever laws you want, or pay them to pass laws that protect your personal accounts from the IRS, it becomes a different story.
where'd you get this informaton?
because from what I've found through multiple articles from his living time period, and from "The Trek Nation", only the franchise was worth close to that much by his death, not him.
From the lips of Picard.
Believe it or not... not everyone works for money. I hold a masters and 2 degrees in 2 major fields I don't work in. I could easily do either of those instead of what I do. They would both pay me at least three of four times what I make now. I made a choice to spend my time working in a field where helping others is the goal. I make enough to pay my bills and eat, that's fine by me. Perhaps I won't be buying a BMW this year or next, and I'll make do in the 1100 sq.ft. I have. I'm happy to do it. Getting out of bed doesn't have to be about getting more stuff, that is a very silly idea. Its also likely why so many people are deeply unhappy. Stop chasing the buck my friend. Focus on yourself and those around you and the little things take care of themselves.
As for DS9 You seem to forget the early episodes where the Star Fleet officers where easily taken by Quark. They had no idea how to interact with Ferengi... because they really didn't understand the concept of money anymore. No one is saying greed and capitalism isn't around in the Trek Future.. They are saying Star Fleet and earth culture in general really has all but eliminated money and material gain. I'm not saying oh look isn't that nice... I'm saying its canon. If you don't see that you didn't watch enough trek.
http://www.celebritynetworth.com/richest-businessmen/producers/gene-roddenberry-net-worth/
http://www.nbcmiami.com/news/weird/Roddenberry-Fortune-Goes-to-the-Dogs.html
Not sure if the first link is super accurate.
However when his wife died a few years ago her will put there dogs up in a mansion. They also managed a 60 million bump for Rod the son...with 10 million every 5 years for a long time to come, they also gave him one of the other mansions.
Not sure if the dogs themselves have there own wills. lol
There are several extensive resources for celebrity net worths. They're not entirely accurate, because paychecks are rarely a matter of public record, but in the case of Roddenberry, the majority of his estate eventually ended up in Roddenberry Entertainment and the Roddenberry Foundation.
We shall not be blinded by your distraction, vile serpent! Rabble! Rabble Rabble Rabble!
Joined January 2009
yea the first link is not completely accurate, it was based on what the star trek franchise actually is worth, Roddenberry died in a time when the royalties were being held by CBS and one other company I forgot which, so he wasn't even given the full royalties, but he did get most of the movie royalties when TMP came out, and that along with TNG gained him some comfortable royalties, but the worth wasn't as high as it is now, this was back when Star Trek was only heard of by that one nerd out of 10 people.
and you do know Majel Barrett was not exactly mentally stable near her demise right? and that she wasn't a Roddenberry? she divorced Gene when he cheated on her in the past, she remained Majel Barrett after that.
not to mention the second link isn't backed up well enough with enough coverage.
Rod (son) is to recieve only 40 million in royalty rights, after that he gets them via royalties in increments.
but yea Majel Barrett wasn't exactly on the stable mindset by the time she died.
and also to point out, the money came late in his life, before he died, they managed to afford what they have now. but durring the making of TNG there was barely enough to live on.
It's also a bit of a hyperbole. If communism has taught mankind anything, then it is that humans need motivation (didn't we recently have a similar discussion about the power creep). Aka, you have to *want* to get out of bed in the morning to begin with.
An economy where ppl just work to better themselves, Trek style, either doesn't work at all, or ppl all have the exact amount of possessions. And yet, even on Star Trek Earth, many ppl live in many different sized-homes, apartments, farms, etc. My point being, who decides who gets the bigger home?
And how do Star Trek ppl on Earth feed and clothe their children? Ah yes, the 'Deus ex machina' replicator! On that note, a true holodeck would all but paralyze and kill mankind! Ppl would just lock themselves up in their homes, playing out whatever fantasy they desire, on their holodeck. And not even that, why even bother to buy a home in the first place!? Holodeck, baby, yeah!
I agree that American-style greed has been reduced to non-obsessive proportions in Roddenberry's future. However, I think Picard's comment about their being no currency whatsoever in the future, was probably a bit of an exaggeration.
There, fixed it for you
Thx for saying! I knew this about him, in general terms; but thx for the details!
Well its beyond the sscope of what can argue here really... there has never been a true communism system. What they did in Russia and what they are doing in China ect are not real true communism.
In terms of trek just pointing out that it is 100% canon that the system in place in the trek future is one where money doesn't exist. How they make that work you got me.
I like the dreamer idea that Gene had of a perfect world where money was unneeded and the reason to do anything was to better yourself or someone else. Its a wonderful idea and one of the reasons many people love trek.
If Humans ever are going to get to a point where something like that is a reality it sure won't be a few hundred years from now I have no doubt. Something like that if it is ever possible would take major changes in the way people think and if I was going to guess it would be more like 2000 years off, assuming we don't do anything stupid that sets us back.
Doesn't this motivate us all in one variation or another? :P
*cough* Bank of Bolias *cough cough* Federation credit *keeps coughing, digs out teakettle*
What's canon is that Earth doesn't use money. Whether the Federation uses it internally or not is flipflopped all over the ****ing place, including back in TOS.
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
Anyways, is the dialogue slanted?
Yeah, I suppose it is. What do you expect when we live in a society where people can just keep repeating things over and over until you believe them? The more you repeat something, the less people will question it. This is also a great indicator of what some of the devs think is more important to add to this game. Meanwhile in the written dialogue of the first Devidian Episode, Cardassian Ensign "Driolic" is a person you read about in the text not long after you scanned for waves which are "Triolic."
:P
3/10 :rolleyes:
So what if he did? That is the driving engine of anything. First it's survival, then it's betterment of ones own life. Such has the natural effect of benefiting all. Necessity is the mother of all invention. A rising tide floats all ships.
There's nothing wrong with inventing for your own gain nor working for those who do. That is capitalism. Those who would attempt to use jealosuy to attempt to claim "greed" seem to forget that the real greed is found in those who seek to take away the fruits of an others labor instead of making their own. In today's politcal world "greed" is used by socialists as a tool, all the while hoping that those gullible enough to buy into it never figure out that jealousy is the very tool they used to cause an upheaval from a long ago disproven theory of economics. Zero Sum gain.
Wealth is created, not some finite pie. We are not limited to someones version of a "fair share" slice. Basically, if you want more pie, go bake some. Zefram Cochrane baked a pie of his own. Such is no different than anyone else who invents something, but to whomever wrote the wording for the Lt Commander's dialog, they chose to make a political statement and one that flies against this nations very existence. Freedom can only reign where rights reign supreme. Where governments are under the people, not over them.
Such a political challenge being leveled against the predominant make up of people reading it who are likely to be children, not adults, is an affront with intent. Parents raise children, not governments, and not those who seek to brainwash other peoples children. I am the parent.
Um I'd go rewatch the film "Star Trek: First Contact" - and if you don't like the way they portrayed Zefram Cochran - blame Brannon Braga and Ronald D. Moore, as they wrote it.
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
You don't like it bro... sad story... don't play it... Move On...
The Dune series if you believe the Machine Crusade books are canon was due to some humans creating a virus that infected machine intelligences to revolt against humanity because they were bored.
The Matrix and Terminator are based on the slave revolt concept. Although, Terminator was a preemptive strike caused by Skynet so there was no time for humanity to create a slave race.
Due to Data and the Doctor getting sentient rights, then it would require some virus that infects all machine life in the galaxy for Star Trek to get close to Dune. Slave revolts from machine life would be possible in other empires, but the Federation is safe from that.
All I can say is, God bless you. You have no idea how glad I was to read your work. There is hope.
Again, thank you.
Get over it. If you don't like the message of trek don't let your kids watch or play the game.
If you think you are not brain washing your children with the idea that pure capitalism is the best policy your diluting yourself.
Socialism works... I can say that because I live in a pretty socialist country. I have visited your country often enough that I can 100% tell you your system is far from superior.
I also won't claim we have a perfect setup anywhere in the world right now... that is crazy.
Trek is an idealized future no doubt. I don't think a system with no money or profit could ever work right now no. I hope that in our future it can though. Perhaps not in 300 years as Trek would like us to believe but perhaps in 1000-2000 sure... it just takes enough people to view the world differently to move the world forward.
Socialism as an idea though 100% works... saying it doesn't is saying that countries like Denmark, Finland, Canada, Sweden, New Zealand, ect. Don't work.
The truth is our countries work just fine. Its a simple change in a state of mind. The idea of a hospital turning a sick person out is repugnant to pretty much any Canadian I know. The idea of charging people with 20 years of debt when they do get sick... is perhaps even more sickening. Yet down south that doesn't seem to bother many people.
Of course a country like mine Canada we have profit and money, and sure some people choose to make there lives mission the accumulation of money. Nothing wrong with that and just like our friends in the US that is required to keep the economy moving. That doesn't mean there shouldn't be a balance between building a thriving economy and taking care of each other. I'll gladly drive my little cr*p box car instead of a caddy if it means I can help 2 or 3 people to not have to live on a street, or be denied expensive medications that would have them live.
In the trek future more people think like me then you.... its not my thinking. Its how Gene wrote it. So live with it or don't involve yourself with Trek IP games.