This change sounds like one of the best design ideas to come from this game in a long time. It reduces homogenization, kicks power creep in the globes, and adds a layer of customization to characters' performance in ground and space.
Admittedly this is at the cost of a hefty nerf to those who've T5'd every rep just to collect powers like Pokemon, and for those people, that sucks. But this is a decision that will be much, much better for the game in the long run and it's damn refreshing to see long-term planning from the team that isn't just a new grind.
The entire problem is the content of the game and what reps have become. They are as of current end game, the entire end game. They are the only form of player progression and gaining player power. They shouldn't of been this in the first place.
Every other mmo has a gearing system designed to advance player power and that system is updated and moved along as new content comes out. Every new tier is a re balance and every tier is a general chance for all to catch up. Reps are used to help players with the new content and to provide titles, vanity items and gear. STO you do the content to advance the rep. I think the very way you do reps vs content is backwards.
The best way to address power creep is to create content with the idea of power creep in mind and have content that is more of a challenge. The idea that everyone should be doing the same content and that the moment you hit lvl cap you should be doing end game is wrong.
Star Trek Online needs a end game beyond the rep systems. Star Trek Online needs to have a tier system that you progress into and you reach for the highest level.
Love this!!! Best thought out comment in this thread.
1) Those that know there are bugs, know they'll eventually be fixed, but still hate on the folks that reported the bug.
2) Those that are clueless that the bugs are even there as they blindly go about exploiting them, and will thus cry about nerfs after somebody has reported it.
3) Those that despise the first two and will continue to report any bugs they come across.
4) Those that know things are OP, know they'll eventually be fixed, but still hate on the folks that brought it to the devs' attention.
5) Those that have no idea how bad they really are as they blindly go about using something OP, and will thus cry about nerfs when somebody brings it to the devs' attention.
6) Those that despise the previous two and will continue to report any balance issues they come across.
Ugh, I just realized this list could go on and on...because it has nothing to do with PvP or PvE...it's basically about the people.
Well when you put it that way.... My overreaction aside, there's really nothing to do since it's already going to happen except wait for all this to blow over.
If this isn't just some very bad trolling, then what you're positing here is the exact reason why we need changes like this, and more to boot.
No. I can't help it if I want to push my builds to the maximum. I believe ISE can be done by one person, Cryptic has made the Borg that possible to beat. It's not about trolling. Just because you don't believe it's fair for me to make a build to tackle a tactical cube doesn't make my thoughts invalid.
I earned what I have done so far. I don't like of the fact losing a good amount of abilities.
I do not go around STO playing against players blowing them up with the latest toys Cryptic can give. I do not do PVP unless playing against fleet mates or Kerrat. Our goals are to making the best builds even discussing builds for hours and hours.
I play. I know many other females who play. I don't need to hear his sexist or him following that stereotype in his statement.
I agree i know plenty of women who play this game to and other games, I always hate that stereotype and try to change people's perspective about women and games.
(STO)
Matriarch of Banished Orion Girls. Neela D'tan @captaintpol (with many alts)
May we sail and have fun always and forever. LLAP
(PC version NW)
Arwen@captaintpol TR - Tully's of RiverRun
Mai Kelly DC-Tully's of RiverRun
Neela BumKisses HR-
Arya Stark GF-
Sansa Stark CW- Team Fencebane
Crystal Marie OP-
(xbox version NW)
Arwen@Admiral Jazdia TR- Team Fenebane
Mai Kelly DC- " "
Ahsoka Tano CW- " "
Neela BumKisser HR- " "
Omega
New Rom (have to complete Omega to access New Rom content)
Nukara (have to complete Omega to access New Rom to complete New Rom to access Nukara content)
Dyson (have to complete Omega to access New Rom to complete New Rom to access Nukara to complete Nukara to access Dyson)
Undine/Counter-Command (have to complete Omega to access New Rom to complete New Rom to access Nukara to complete Nukara to access Dyson to complete Dyson to access Undine/Counter-Command)
Over and over and over?
Throw in some sort of sidekicking or reverse sidekicking feature to allow friends actually to play together.
Make PvP into a separate mini-game so it doesn't have to deal with the powercreep.
Create additional tiers of ships or a special console slot that folks can slot to represent their new faux level as they progress - since the ships will be outclassed by the content otherwise.
Create additional marks of gear to keep up with the content gear.
Create an upgrade path for previous content gear to be upgraded to give people a choice in gear as opposed to forcing them to use certain gear or go through and create a plethora of gear for each content level so that it's otherwise covered.
Would have to go through and revamp the Exchange.
Would need to gate DOFFs based on the tiers you've created.
Would need to create new tiers of BOFFs.
And well, one could go on and on with all the things that sort of thing would require...
...all the while, the little nagging question would be sitting there - how is it all being paid for? Would they sell each new tier of content? Would every little thing have an actual dollar cost instead of some form of alternate payment method?
If there is negative feed back to the proposed changes to the rep system will the changes get scrapped or will you just do what you plan on doing anyways?
Are there any plans in motion to give players more reputation passive slots in the future via fleet holdings, 1 per new rep, etc?
Why should any currently fully repped player bother with any new reputation systems? Personally it will take far superior passives and gear to make me bother playing any of s9's reputation based content.
Currently there isn't data available other than generalizations with regards to several of the changed passives, can you release some hard numbers that way people can make informed decisions?
Please answer these questions. They are not aggressively phrased, nor flameful in intent.
Well when you put it that way.... My overreaction aside, there's really nothing to do since it's already going to happen except wait for all this to blow over.
Nah, folks can get on Tribble when it hits - try to push for things to be balanced as possible - and then complain when that's ignored. :P
Meh...I'm trying to laugh at that, but it's definitely not hard to feel that way at times, eh?
I can only hope that any future reps will add more passive slots, otherwise micromanagement is gonna be hell.
Have to wonder if either with the next holding or the one after, there might not be the +1 Ground/+1 Space thing like they did with the Active DOFFs. Cause although they proclaimed that they would not be selling slots directly, they didn't say additional slots would not be available in some manner...eh?
No. I can't help it if I want to push my builds to the maximum. I believe ISE can be done by one person, Cryptic has made the Borg that possible to beat. It's not about trolling. Just because you don't believe it's fair for me to make a build to tackle a tactical cube doesn't make my thoughts invalid.
I earned what I have done so far. I don't like of the fact losing a good amount of abilities.
I do not go around STO playing against players blowing them up with the latest toys Cryptic can give. I do not do PVP unless playing against fleet mates or Kerrat. Our goals are to making the best builds even discussing builds for hours and hours.
Heaven forfend that steps be taken to contain the power creep.
You can destroy a tactical cube on an un-repped character. You will still be able to push your builds to the maximum. We've reached a point in PvE where players can achieve nearly 90k DPS. What's the change in reputation going to knock off, 5k? I think that's being generous. People will still be more than capable of warping through dated content by themselves should they so wish.
This change could be the first of many steps towards providing a semblance of balance in PvP and perhaps even a bit of challenge in PvE. Those are concepts which tend to exist in popular, successful MMO's, and indeed quality games in general. I truly hope that they are concepts which Cryptic has decided to embrace.
The content itself is the topic of an entirely different discussion, given that it has been trivialized rather thoroughly at this point. I would love to see new PvE material requiring real thought and strategy.
Heaven forfend that steps be taken to contain the power creep.
You can destroy a tactical cube on an un-repped character. You will still be able to push your builds to the maximum. We've reached a point in PvE where players can achieve nearly 90k DPS. What's the change in reputation going to knock off, 5k? I think that's being generous. People will still be more than capable of warping through dated content by themselves should they so wish.
This change could be the first of many steps towards providing a semblance of balance in PvP and perhaps even a bit of challenge in PvE. Those are concepts which tend to exist in popular, successful MMO's, and indeed quality games in general. I truly hope that they are concepts which Cryptic has decided to embrace.
The content itself is the topic of an entirely different discussion, given that it has been trivialized rather thoroughly at this point. I would love to see new PvE material requiring real thought and strategy.
One step at a time.
taking away our earned skills totally will reduce powercreep eh? i call bs.
powercreep comes from doff abilities nowadays, not from rep skills.
all this does is make standard builds more weak and the cookie cutter power creep
builds more powerful.
more necessity to run lockbox/cstore ships with the right doffs isnt reducing powercreep,
its increasing it.
dont know where you take your reasoning from, seriously.
taking away our earned skills totally will reduce powercreep eh? i call bs.
powercreep comes from doff abilities nowadays, not from rep skills.
all this does is make standard builds more weak and the cookie cutter power creep
builds more powerful.
more necessity to run lockbox/cstore ships with the right doffs isnt reducing powercreep,
its increasing it.
dont know where you take your reasoning from, seriously.
Changing the rep passives helps to address power creep so long as it is not the only step. It's slightly noticeable with four sets of rep passives. What happens when we reach 10? 15? Are all of our captains from the Q Continuum?
Moreover, nothing is being 'taken away'. In fact, you'll have access to more passives more readily than ever before. 4/4 is more than enough to accentuate a proper build. 8/8 begins to push things. 12/12? 16/16? Come now. If you cannot see how that would contribute to power creep, I cannot help you.
Regarding DOFF abilities - absolutely. They do contribute more to power creep than rep passives. I've said as much in this very thread. I would love to see certain doffs addressed (thinking of technicians In particular) with a similar intent towards balance and power creep containment.
Think about it. A captain doing, say, 6k dps is more than sufficient for an ISE, no? Well, we have entire channels dedicated to 10k, 20k, 30k, etc. (Not knocking the DPS guys at all, just illustrating the point). By the time you reach 30k, you are doing five times the damage necessary to handily complete the encounter. In PvP terms, a minimally repped level 50 character facing a fully-repped one is looking down the barrel of several marked disadvantages including shield bleedthrough, passive healing, and straight-up points on the skill tree (Tier 4 Nukara). If that doesn't tell you that we've reached a point of critical mass when it comes to power creep, again, I cannot help you.
I don't see this change as good enough on its own. I do think that it represents a step in the right direction towards a more sustainable game. That is where I take my reasoning from. I can't see from where you take yours beyond misplaced entitlement.
Nerfing the reputation system is not what has to be done to stop power creep. Punishing veterans and taking away our hard earned progress is the wrong direction.
Simply add another level of difficulty after Elite to the PVE queues. We already have Normal and Elite. Call the third level "Ultra" or "Super Elite".
Super Elite difficulties can reward bonus marks (an additional 10 or 15 marks), add additional challenge, make grinding easier, and be difficult enough to require the additional power of Rep systems.
Everyone wins.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
If you oppose the Reputation nerf, feel free to use my signature
No. I can't help it if I want to push my builds to the maximum. I believe ISE can be done by one person, Cryptic has made the Borg that possible to beat. It's not about trolling. Just because you don't believe it's fair for me to make a build to tackle a tactical cube doesn't make my thoughts invalid.
I earned what I have done so far. I don't like of the fact losing a good amount of abilities.
I do not go around STO playing against players blowing them up with the latest toys Cryptic can give. I do not do PVP unless playing against fleet mates or Kerrat. Our goals are to making the best builds even discussing builds for hours and hours.
I think you have sort of proved there is a problem no.
Have you ever played a MMO before ?
What would happen in any other developers games if 5 man dungeons became something that could be soloed.
I am not saying it can't be done because I have done it with optional solo. lol
That is sort of the problem... Power Creep has gotten to a point where group content no longer functions as group content.
Now that might be well in good from your point of view... you say so what if I can solo it... everyone can still do it and win so who cares.
Well 1) the developer cares because they have designed there reward system to work based on that mission being a group mission. 2) you ARE going to get bored I know I sure as heck have. The PvE is mindless there is nothing challlenging about it.
So what does Cryptic do release some harder content that I can enjoy and anyone else that can 1-2 man a STF. Where does that leave 90% of the game population that can't solo those missions ?
The issue is clear there is no way one person should be able to pull 40+k DPS and decimate the content.
They have said this is the issue very clearly which is likely why people are not hearing big detailed responses from Jeff... he explained There position in his blog.
Something has to give.... and no they can't just make things harder because like it or not we are all level 50s.... they can't continue to reward fresh level 50s, level 50 rewards if you can walk in as a level 50++++ and clean it up in 60s, when there design intentions for reward on that content is 10min or more.
So they have an issue... reducing rewards for fresh 50s would be game suicide... increasing rewards for hardmod/nightmare mode for you and everyone else that is all creeped up ends things in the same place... if they do that they also have issues in that the new reps are like it or not the end game content... so they are not going to start releasing new content (rep grind mission) that are nightmare mode... and then either lock fresh or unrepped 50s out of it... or just let them be unable to complete it because again they will LOOSE money.
There is no way to achieve that type of balance... so the only real answer is to control what can be controlled. The simple answer to that is.... start by reigning in Passive power creep... and then Gear (they are already fixing some bugged things like borg set 2pc... which according to Mancoms math STILL accounts for over 50% of the games entire hull healing. After that as many have pointed out there are many other creep issues that need looked at... and I think you and many others need to brace yourself. There are more balance adjustments coming. Call them nerfs if it makes you feel better... chirp it like a parrot Nerf Nerf Nerf. Its not a bad word... and EXACTLY what STO needs right now a good old string of nerfs.
Think about it. A captain doing, say, 6k dps is more than sufficient for an ISE, no? Well, we have entire channels dedicated to 10k, 20k, 30k, etc. (Not knocking the DPS guys at all, just illustrating the point). By the time you reach 30k, you are doing five times the damage necessary to handily complete the encounter. In PvP terms, a minimally repped level 50 character facing a fully-repped one is looking down the barrel of several marked disadvantages including shield bleedthrough, passive healing, and straight-up points on the skill tree (Tier 4 Nukara). If that doesn't tell you that we've reached a point of critical mass when it comes to power creep, again, I cannot help you.
6K dps to complete ISE in elite mode. Heck no way. You need at least 3 to 4 times that.
I want to do all Borg STFS alone except for the Hive. I am going have to hit the higher DPS and damage brackets.
Nerfing the reputation system is not what has to be done to stop power creep. Punishing veterans and taking away our hard earned progress is the wrong direction.
Simply add another level of difficulty after Elite to the PVE queues. We already have Normal and Elite. Call the third level "Ultra" or "Super Elite".
Super Elite difficulties can reward bonus marks (an additional 10 or 15 marks), add additional challenge, make grinding easier, and be difficult enough to require the additional power of Rep systems.
Everyone wins.
That might be simple on paper, but, what happens when the people who try to join "Super Elite" do so and get roflstomped because they weren't ready? Cry foul and demand nerfing.
Thus, Normal, Elite and "Super Elite" will because "Child's Play", "Easy" and "Slightly Less Easy"
Nerfing the reputation system is not what has to be done to stop power creep. Punishing veterans and taking away our hard earned progress is the wrong direction.
Simply add another level of difficulty after Elite to the PVE queues. We already have Normal and Elite. Call the third level "Ultra" or "Super Elite".
Super Elite difficulties can reward bonus marks (an additional 10 or 15 marks), add additional challenge, make grinding easier, and be difficult enough to require the additional power of Rep systems.
That might be simple on paper, but, what happens when the people who try to join "Super Elite" do so and get roflstomped because they weren't ready? Cry foul and demand nerfing.
Thus, Normal, Elite and "Super Elite" will because "Child's Play", "Easy" and "Slightly Less Easy"
They should have Lazy, Child's Play, Easy, Advanced,Elite, and Super Elite. It seems Cryptic wants to cater to group 1 and 2. (Lazy and Child's Play)
well jeff this one is gonna cost the company plenty. lots of wallets will close over this . but we both know people have been leaving in droves for quite some time. ive been watching your responses to some of the questions for 2 days now and you skirt the issue very nicely without answering anything. 150+ pages of rage say 1 thing jeff , as the numbers stand as you stated they add up to adding more to whats wrong, power creep aux2batt and faw to name a few and does absolutely nothing to fix it exept take powers that were earned from vets with hundreds of hours invested in the rep. and the problems will remain. As a paying gold member for 4yrs maybe the only way to make you listen to the community is cut off the money . because frankly I don't think free to players spend more than vets and we both know it. sad to say lots of the old guard here go more than comeback now for these very reasons stated in these 150+ pages here.I will not continue to spend my hard earned money on a game that takes what I have earned with hundreds of hrs reping my toons up. why don't you for once jeff actually fix whats wrong instead of smoke and mirrors and lying to the community, or not telling them at all[which is worse in my book] well if u go look at my account jeff it is now deactivated. and whats sad is im not in the minority here jeff its the majority of most vets who have been kicked in the teeth by criptic for years your standing in the community will suffer greatly over this as well. instead of attacking the problems head on like a leader should to make his community happy, you and your team took the easy way out. jeff you knew the rep as it was given to us was not gonna work and yet you added more. we all know this jeff no hiding it no running from it mate. thing is jeff we both know all this is going live nothing going to be tweaked or changed don't we, nothing ever is all you have proven to us is that you care more for your paycheck than u do your community and your game and you don't fool most of us one bit
I think you have sort of proved there is a problem no.
Have you ever played a MMO before ?
What would happen in any other developers games if 5 man dungeons became something that could be soloed.
I am not saying it can't be done because I have done it with optional solo. lol
That is sort of the problem... Power Creep has gotten to a point where group content no longer functions as group content.
Now that might be well in good from your point of view... you say so what if I can solo it... everyone can still do it and win so who cares.
Well 1) the developer cares because they have designed there reward system to work based on that mission being a group mission. 2) you ARE going to get bored I know I sure as heck have. The PvE is mindless there is nothing challlenging about it.
So what does Cryptic do release some harder content that I can enjoy and anyone else that can 1-2 man a STF. Where does that leave 90% of the game population that can't solo those missions ?
The issue is clear there is no way one person should be able to pull 40+k DPS and decimate the content.
They have said this is the issue very clearly which is likely why people are not hearing big detailed responses from Jeff... he explained There position in his blog.
Something has to give.... and no they can't just make things harder because like it or not we are all level 50s.... they can't continue to reward fresh level 50s, level 50 rewards if you can walk in as a level 50++++ and clean it up in 60s, when there design intentions for reward on that content is 10min or more.
So they have an issue... reducing rewards for fresh 50s would be game suicide... increasing rewards for hardmod/nightmare mode for you and everyone else that is all creeped up ends things in the same place... if they do that they also have issues in that the new reps are like it or not the end game content... so they are not going to start releasing new content (rep grind mission) that are nightmare mode... and then either lock fresh or unrepped 50s out of it... or just let them be unable to complete it because again they will LOOSE money.
There is no way to achieve that type of balance... so the only real answer is to control what can be controlled. The simple answer to that is.... start by reigning in Passive power creep... and then Gear (they are already fixing some bugged things like borg set 2pc... which according to Mancoms math STILL accounts for over 50% of the games entire hull healing. After that as many have pointed out there are many other creep issues that need looked at... and I think you and many others need to brace yourself. There are more balance adjustments coming. Call them nerfs if it makes you feel better... chirp it like a parrot Nerf Nerf Nerf. Its not a bad word... and EXACTLY what STO needs right now a good old string of nerfs.
Problem is, STO endgame is very ....stagnant, and under developed. My main character I have played for years. With all that advancement, she should be able to solo an instance that has been in game for years.
Lets all just face it. Cryptic is just too lazy to do new harder end game, and that's the source of the problem.
Let us wear Swimsuits on Foundry maps or bridges please! I would pay zen for that.
That might be simple on paper, but, what happens when the people who try to join "Super Elite" do so and get roflstomped because they weren't ready? Cry foul and demand nerfing.
Thus, Normal, Elite and "Super Elite" will because "Child's Play", "Easy" and "Slightly Less Easy"
There is a difference between being unprepared and getting your TRIBBLE whooped and being fully prepared and still not standing a chance.
If I recall correctly, the PVE queues warn players that there is enhanced difficulty. This warning acts as the "release form". Players agree to play on a higher difficulty, whether they are ready or not and they accept the responsibilities.
I remember when I first started Elite STFs with my newly minted VA. I barely made it through, and died a few times a game. After I saw the demands on my ship, I did a full overhaul of my build and playstyle, and I put the time into improvement. SInce then, that has been my gaming mantra and I am now a very capable player, to the point that when I newly mint a VA, I can compete in an Elite STF.
challenges forces us to step back, look at ourselves, and learn to better ourselves. If we want to kill the power creep, Cryptic needs to ignore the nerfing crowd. Until cryptic ignores the nerfing crowds, we will continue to lose aspects of the game.
How long will it be until the nerfing crowd cries fowl about how long it takes to build starbases? How will Veteran fleets react when new fleets can reach the same level of accomplishment, with a fraction of the time and resource investment? People need to pay their dues, and work for what they will eventually get.
Stop the nerfing. Just add a higher level of difficulty.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
If you oppose the Reputation nerf, feel free to use my signature
Problem is, STO endgame is very ....stagnant, and under developed. My main character I have played for years. With all that advancement, she should be able to solo an instance that has been in game for years.
Lets all just face it. Cryptic is just too lazy to do new harder end game, and that's the source of the problem.
And that right there is the wrong way to think! What fun is a PVE match where you can roflstomp (and yes, I'm gonna keep using that phrase because I think it fits quite well) the opposition and not give your teammates a chance to do anything?
I remember going into ISE once with a Scimmy. The match was over in under five minutes. Five minutes. I barely got in enough hits to register. Do you really think that's fair? No. And I don't think that's fair for the people who want in on these things, too.
And that right there is the wrong way to think! What fun is a PVE match where you can roflstomp (and yes, I'm gonna keep using that phrase because I think it fits quite well) the opposition and not give your teammates a chance to do anything?
I remember going into ISE once with a Scimmy. The match was over in under five minutes. Five minutes. I barely got in enough hits to register. Do you really think that's fair? No. And I don't think that's fair for the people who want in on these things, too.
This has happened ONCE out of how many ISE PUGS you have joined? Hundreds? Thousands?
I have never had what you described, happen to me. I have never seen an ISE match end in 5 minutes. That means you saw what can be statistically described as a Unicorn in STO.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
If you oppose the Reputation nerf, feel free to use my signature
Comments
Admittedly this is at the cost of a hefty nerf to those who've T5'd every rep just to collect powers like Pokemon, and for those people, that sucks. But this is a decision that will be much, much better for the game in the long run and it's damn refreshing to see long-term planning from the team that isn't just a new grind.
I Support Disco | Disco is Love | Disco is Life
Love this!!! Best thought out comment in this thread.
Well when you put it that way.... My overreaction aside, there's really nothing to do since it's already going to happen except wait for all this to blow over.
"I always hope for the best. Experience, unfortunately, has taught me to expect the worst."
-Elim Garak
No. I can't help it if I want to push my builds to the maximum. I believe ISE can be done by one person, Cryptic has made the Borg that possible to beat. It's not about trolling. Just because you don't believe it's fair for me to make a build to tackle a tactical cube doesn't make my thoughts invalid.
I earned what I have done so far. I don't like of the fact losing a good amount of abilities.
I do not go around STO playing against players blowing them up with the latest toys Cryptic can give. I do not do PVP unless playing against fleet mates or Kerrat. Our goals are to making the best builds even discussing builds for hours and hours.
Where the hell did you get Sir from? Did you read my name any bit?
Many
Men
Online
Role
Playing
Girls
I Support Disco | Disco is Love | Disco is Life
MMORPG, where the men are men, and the women most likely are too.
I play. I know many other females who play. I don't need to hear his sexist or him following that stereotype in his statement.
I agree i know plenty of women who play this game to and other games, I always hate that stereotype and try to change people's perspective about women and games.
Matriarch of Banished Orion Girls. Neela D'tan
@captaintpol (with many alts)
May we sail and have fun always and forever. LLAP
(PC version NW)
Arwen@captaintpol TR - Tully's of RiverRun
Mai Kelly DC-Tully's of RiverRun
Neela BumKisses HR-
Arya Stark GF-
Sansa Stark CW- Team Fencebane
Crystal Marie OP-
(xbox version NW)
Arwen@Admiral Jazdia TR- Team Fenebane
Mai Kelly DC- " "
Ahsoka Tano CW- " "
Neela BumKisser HR- " "
So you'd have something along the lines of...
Omega
New Rom (have to complete Omega to access New Rom content)
Nukara (have to complete Omega to access New Rom to complete New Rom to access Nukara content)
Dyson (have to complete Omega to access New Rom to complete New Rom to access Nukara to complete Nukara to access Dyson)
Undine/Counter-Command (have to complete Omega to access New Rom to complete New Rom to access Nukara to complete Nukara to access Dyson to complete Dyson to access Undine/Counter-Command)
Over and over and over?
Throw in some sort of sidekicking or reverse sidekicking feature to allow friends actually to play together.
Make PvP into a separate mini-game so it doesn't have to deal with the powercreep.
Create additional tiers of ships or a special console slot that folks can slot to represent their new faux level as they progress - since the ships will be outclassed by the content otherwise.
Create additional marks of gear to keep up with the content gear.
Create an upgrade path for previous content gear to be upgraded to give people a choice in gear as opposed to forcing them to use certain gear or go through and create a plethora of gear for each content level so that it's otherwise covered.
Would have to go through and revamp the Exchange.
Would need to gate DOFFs based on the tiers you've created.
Would need to create new tiers of BOFFs.
And well, one could go on and on with all the things that sort of thing would require...
...all the while, the little nagging question would be sitting there - how is it all being paid for? Would they sell each new tier of content? Would every little thing have an actual dollar cost instead of some form of alternate payment method?
And well...yeah...
...are you so sure about that?
If there is negative feed back to the proposed changes to the rep system will the changes get scrapped or will you just do what you plan on doing anyways?
Are there any plans in motion to give players more reputation passive slots in the future via fleet holdings, 1 per new rep, etc?
Why should any currently fully repped player bother with any new reputation systems? Personally it will take far superior passives and gear to make me bother playing any of s9's reputation based content.
Currently there isn't data available other than generalizations with regards to several of the changed passives, can you release some hard numbers that way people can make informed decisions?
Please answer these questions. They are not aggressively phrased, nor flameful in intent.
Nah, folks can get on Tribble when it hits - try to push for things to be balanced as possible - and then complain when that's ignored. :P
Meh...I'm trying to laugh at that, but it's definitely not hard to feel that way at times, eh?
Have to wonder if either with the next holding or the one after, there might not be the +1 Ground/+1 Space thing like they did with the Active DOFFs. Cause although they proclaimed that they would not be selling slots directly, they didn't say additional slots would not be available in some manner...eh?
dont need 4 useless ground 'traits' in space and vice versa
balancing issues this game has arent caused by rep skills, its doff skills mostly,
as people in this thread pointed out before.
Heaven forfend that steps be taken to contain the power creep.
You can destroy a tactical cube on an un-repped character. You will still be able to push your builds to the maximum. We've reached a point in PvE where players can achieve nearly 90k DPS. What's the change in reputation going to knock off, 5k? I think that's being generous. People will still be more than capable of warping through dated content by themselves should they so wish.
This change could be the first of many steps towards providing a semblance of balance in PvP and perhaps even a bit of challenge in PvE. Those are concepts which tend to exist in popular, successful MMO's, and indeed quality games in general. I truly hope that they are concepts which Cryptic has decided to embrace.
The content itself is the topic of an entirely different discussion, given that it has been trivialized rather thoroughly at this point. I would love to see new PvE material requiring real thought and strategy.
One step at a time.
taking away our earned skills totally will reduce powercreep eh? i call bs.
powercreep comes from doff abilities nowadays, not from rep skills.
all this does is make standard builds more weak and the cookie cutter power creep
builds more powerful.
more necessity to run lockbox/cstore ships with the right doffs isnt reducing powercreep,
its increasing it.
dont know where you take your reasoning from, seriously.
Changing the rep passives helps to address power creep so long as it is not the only step. It's slightly noticeable with four sets of rep passives. What happens when we reach 10? 15? Are all of our captains from the Q Continuum?
Moreover, nothing is being 'taken away'. In fact, you'll have access to more passives more readily than ever before. 4/4 is more than enough to accentuate a proper build. 8/8 begins to push things. 12/12? 16/16? Come now. If you cannot see how that would contribute to power creep, I cannot help you.
Regarding DOFF abilities - absolutely. They do contribute more to power creep than rep passives. I've said as much in this very thread. I would love to see certain doffs addressed (thinking of technicians In particular) with a similar intent towards balance and power creep containment.
Think about it. A captain doing, say, 6k dps is more than sufficient for an ISE, no? Well, we have entire channels dedicated to 10k, 20k, 30k, etc. (Not knocking the DPS guys at all, just illustrating the point). By the time you reach 30k, you are doing five times the damage necessary to handily complete the encounter. In PvP terms, a minimally repped level 50 character facing a fully-repped one is looking down the barrel of several marked disadvantages including shield bleedthrough, passive healing, and straight-up points on the skill tree (Tier 4 Nukara). If that doesn't tell you that we've reached a point of critical mass when it comes to power creep, again, I cannot help you.
I don't see this change as good enough on its own. I do think that it represents a step in the right direction towards a more sustainable game. That is where I take my reasoning from. I can't see from where you take yours beyond misplaced entitlement.
lets TRIBBLE everyone over without addressing the real issues, huzzah!!!
and yes, 50% of my region skills are taken away, you didnt realize yet, did you? thats a 50% nerf!
it just will make the current powercreep builds more powerful,
while nerfing people that try not to rely on that stuff.
none of the current power creep builds rely on rep skills at all. not even one.
Simply add another level of difficulty after Elite to the PVE queues. We already have Normal and Elite. Call the third level "Ultra" or "Super Elite".
Super Elite difficulties can reward bonus marks (an additional 10 or 15 marks), add additional challenge, make grinding easier, and be difficult enough to require the additional power of Rep systems.
Everyone wins.
I think you have sort of proved there is a problem no.
Have you ever played a MMO before ?
What would happen in any other developers games if 5 man dungeons became something that could be soloed.
I am not saying it can't be done because I have done it with optional solo. lol
That is sort of the problem... Power Creep has gotten to a point where group content no longer functions as group content.
Now that might be well in good from your point of view... you say so what if I can solo it... everyone can still do it and win so who cares.
Well 1) the developer cares because they have designed there reward system to work based on that mission being a group mission. 2) you ARE going to get bored I know I sure as heck have. The PvE is mindless there is nothing challlenging about it.
So what does Cryptic do release some harder content that I can enjoy and anyone else that can 1-2 man a STF. Where does that leave 90% of the game population that can't solo those missions ?
The issue is clear there is no way one person should be able to pull 40+k DPS and decimate the content.
They have said this is the issue very clearly which is likely why people are not hearing big detailed responses from Jeff... he explained There position in his blog.
Something has to give.... and no they can't just make things harder because like it or not we are all level 50s.... they can't continue to reward fresh level 50s, level 50 rewards if you can walk in as a level 50++++ and clean it up in 60s, when there design intentions for reward on that content is 10min or more.
So they have an issue... reducing rewards for fresh 50s would be game suicide... increasing rewards for hardmod/nightmare mode for you and everyone else that is all creeped up ends things in the same place... if they do that they also have issues in that the new reps are like it or not the end game content... so they are not going to start releasing new content (rep grind mission) that are nightmare mode... and then either lock fresh or unrepped 50s out of it... or just let them be unable to complete it because again they will LOOSE money.
There is no way to achieve that type of balance... so the only real answer is to control what can be controlled. The simple answer to that is.... start by reigning in Passive power creep... and then Gear (they are already fixing some bugged things like borg set 2pc... which according to Mancoms math STILL accounts for over 50% of the games entire hull healing. After that as many have pointed out there are many other creep issues that need looked at... and I think you and many others need to brace yourself. There are more balance adjustments coming. Call them nerfs if it makes you feel better... chirp it like a parrot Nerf Nerf Nerf. Its not a bad word... and EXACTLY what STO needs right now a good old string of nerfs.
6K dps to complete ISE in elite mode. Heck no way. You need at least 3 to 4 times that.
I want to do all Borg STFS alone except for the Hive. I am going have to hit the higher DPS and damage brackets.
That might be simple on paper, but, what happens when the people who try to join "Super Elite" do so and get roflstomped because they weren't ready? Cry foul and demand nerfing.
Thus, Normal, Elite and "Super Elite" will because "Child's Play", "Easy" and "Slightly Less Easy"
I agree. They are absolutely punishing veterans.
They should have Lazy, Child's Play, Easy, Advanced,Elite, and Super Elite. It seems Cryptic wants to cater to group 1 and 2. (Lazy and Child's Play)
Oh, you're part of that group? The way you've talked about wanting to roflstomp everything in your path makes me think you're there already.
Problem is, STO endgame is very ....stagnant, and under developed. My main character I have played for years. With all that advancement, she should be able to solo an instance that has been in game for years.
Lets all just face it. Cryptic is just too lazy to do new harder end game, and that's the source of the problem.
There is a difference between being unprepared and getting your TRIBBLE whooped and being fully prepared and still not standing a chance.
If I recall correctly, the PVE queues warn players that there is enhanced difficulty. This warning acts as the "release form". Players agree to play on a higher difficulty, whether they are ready or not and they accept the responsibilities.
I remember when I first started Elite STFs with my newly minted VA. I barely made it through, and died a few times a game. After I saw the demands on my ship, I did a full overhaul of my build and playstyle, and I put the time into improvement. SInce then, that has been my gaming mantra and I am now a very capable player, to the point that when I newly mint a VA, I can compete in an Elite STF.
challenges forces us to step back, look at ourselves, and learn to better ourselves. If we want to kill the power creep, Cryptic needs to ignore the nerfing crowd. Until cryptic ignores the nerfing crowds, we will continue to lose aspects of the game.
How long will it be until the nerfing crowd cries fowl about how long it takes to build starbases? How will Veteran fleets react when new fleets can reach the same level of accomplishment, with a fraction of the time and resource investment? People need to pay their dues, and work for what they will eventually get.
Stop the nerfing. Just add a higher level of difficulty.
And that right there is the wrong way to think! What fun is a PVE match where you can roflstomp (and yes, I'm gonna keep using that phrase because I think it fits quite well) the opposition and not give your teammates a chance to do anything?
I remember going into ISE once with a Scimmy. The match was over in under five minutes. Five minutes. I barely got in enough hits to register. Do you really think that's fair? No. And I don't think that's fair for the people who want in on these things, too.
This has happened ONCE out of how many ISE PUGS you have joined? Hundreds? Thousands?
I have never had what you described, happen to me. I have never seen an ISE match end in 5 minutes. That means you saw what can be statistically described as a Unicorn in STO.