That is the issue though, you do not really need reputation powers to play pve content. You need to be competent. that doesnt mean this isnt a nerf or that this isnt right to take away what people have earned.
However, this is solely being done for pvp. A player with 50 rep passives and a player with 0 can do the same ISE together so long they have good ship builds but pvp together, good luck. Another thing to remember, the player that has been here longer will always have something the other new player (doffs, gear, ship, etc) doesnt have to make them better in pvp. This is just a band-aid fix. Cryptic will have to nerf more things in the future to make new players happy and close the "gap" as they are claiming to be trying to do.
However, why is cryptic forcing players to always choose 4 space or 4 ground passives when they are not needed. No captain obviously needs 4 ground traits in space nor 4 space traits while on ground. AT LEAST it should be modeled after captain traits where you can choose ANY 8 passives to your liking at any time.
This is one of the major flaws in STO. PvP skills should be SEPARATE form PvE. Guild Wars was competent enough to split skills up so they changed to something different or less powerful in PvP. There's no reason Cryptic can't modify the Rep powers to have a similar system. Keep the current Rep powers as-is, and if you go into a PvP match, pick and choose.
Cryptic should double the Romulan Crit chance one to be in line with the others, giving not 5%, but 6% bonus.
Or the should nerf the other ones to give less than a double bonus and dont lie about doubling the effectiveness.
Second:
Powercreep is mostly a problem of Lockbox ships and A2B with Technicians. Just remove technician bonus from the game, and the power creep would drop a hundred times better than if all the rep bonuses were deleted.
Third:
There are numerous alternatives that have been listed here already:
-Harder content, new difficulty levels.
-More reputation slots.
-Giving PVP ques a matchmaking system that puts together teams of equal power. -Making reputation gain faster so that noobs can get tier 5 much faster.
Fourth:
New reputations. They'll either have to be better than the ones we have before item and power wise, or they arent worth all the investment of time and energy.
However, making all the many reputations that are to come progressively better is quite the power creep, is it not?
Also, reputations are not end game content, but a poor substitute done by lazy company.
Fifth:
Taking stuff from old customers is a bad idea. Didnt any of you guys read anything about the Ferengi?
Good customers are as rare as latinum -- treasure them.
Let us wear Swimsuits on Foundry maps or bridges please! I would pay zen for that.
Reducing the power gap between new players and veterans is not a bad idea in general, however by limiting the traits you will not accomplish that target.
The true problem is not in the rep. powers but the steep increase of item quality once you reach 50 and got key reputation on 5. That is were the major reason for the gap lies not in the rep. powers.
Of course you wont dare touch that, it is what most people here keeps playing after all.
So go on with alibi and pretend instead doing something useful like fixing bugs, add new content or smooth some disliked edges.
And replaced them with more marks. So you get enough marks to do the same thing a commendation would do, PLUS enough marks to do an hourly PLUS 10 more marks to bank.
So you do your one "daily" mission like before that would net a commendation and you get more out of what you would have doing it today.
My God are you people still raging and whine over a minor and good
change that's a must to keep the game healthy in the long run.
You all must be in the I.D.10.T club?
Or do you all want to see GOD toons running around with all the powers
from 10 rep trees a year from now 1 shooting Tac cube's a bit of overstatement
but you all get the point? right?
One thing I do agree on I that this should have been done from start of rep
system but done is done now it's time to swallow the much needed medicine.
For all the mother's boys and girls Saying I been robbed BS = losers?
I have been here from F2P start and is a Life time sub now have 7 toons with full
rep and in NOW fracking way fell that they robe me in any way in fact is we are
getting access to 50% more rep powers only thing is cant slot all at same time
and thank god for that.
My God are you people still raging and whine over a minor and good
change that's a must to keep the game healthy in the long run.
You all must be in the I.D.10.T club?
Or do you all want to see GOD toons running around with all the powers
from 10 rep trees a year from now 1 shooting Tac cube's a bit of overstatement
but you all get the point? right?
One thing I do agree on I that this should have been done from start of rep
system but done is done now it's time to swallow the much needed medicine.
For all the mother's boys and girls Saying I been robbed BS = losers?
I have been here from F2P start and is a Life time sub now have 7 toons with full
rep and in NOW fracking way fell that they robe me in any way in fact is we are
getting access to 50% more rep powers only thing is cant slot all at same time
and thank god for that.
My God are you people still raging and whine over a minor and good
change that's a must to keep the game healthy in the long run.
You all must be in the I.D.10.T club?
Or do you all want to see GOD toons running around with all the powers
from 10 rep trees a year from now 1 shooting Tac cube's a bit of overstatement
but you all get the point? right?
One thing I do agree on I that this should have been done from start of rep
system but done is done now it's time to swallow the much needed medicine.
For the all the mother's boys and girls Saying I been robbed BS = losers?
I have been here from F2P start and is a Life time sub now have 7 toons with full
rep and in NOW fracking way fell that they robe me in any way in fact is we are
getting access to 50% more rep powers only thing is cant slot all at same time
and thank god for that.
Why don't you be quiet? Yes. We are raging. I spent time earning every passive skill I have and I want to use them. You know how many bloody hours it took. You can't deal with people stating facts or truth?
Are you that special?
I have no problem with the idea of dev blog #5. My problem is stripping which they are doing. So, we have a pool of 16 passive skills to use, so keep that. Cryptic can make how many reputation systems they want. Keep the limit to 16 passive skills.
Now for power creep, make it easier to skill up the reputation system not the Dyson(that's too easy). Match skill level and create better content which requires players to have those passive skills.
We all will be happier.
I played STO since Season 1 and have 3 toons full rep 5. So that is not a argument.
And replaced them with more marks. So you get enough marks to do the same thing a commendation would do, PLUS enough marks to do an hourly PLUS 10 more marks to bank.
So you do your one "daily" mission like before that would net a commendation and you get more out of what you would have doing it today.
It's like no one read the blog.
/stunned
Except buddy before with the dyson rep you could do the hourly XP project non-stop and finish the rep in like two weeks. Now, they are limiting how many hourlies you can do so they are extending the grind of dyson, NOT making it easier, that is a NERF. That is then being applied to all reputations so, how is the standard, current dyson rep, being nerfed, cryptic making repuation grind easier????
I'm not sure if I like or hate this really it could go either way I guess and be absolutely horrible or good.
I really think they need to increase the number of available rep active slots tho currently we have essentially 24, 12 space & 12 ground. Maybe increase the number useable to 6/6 or make provisions to give a free extra rep slot unlock to any new reputation you reach t5 in.
I'm also kinda unsure about how this is going to work with the final t5 rep ability ? might have just missed that part but I'm hoping they aren't going to need to be slotted to function.
On the other hand I am also kind of unsure about trying to lower the difference between a fresh level 50 character and one that has spent hundreds of hours at endgame. Realistically the player that has been around longer should have a advantage, now for things like pvp or whatever yeah sure disable or lower the higher players ability's in-line for the match. Also the player with fewer hours then has a reason to work on their reputation and play the game (the quest for power as it were).
With the current rep system and rate of leveling in STO you can pretty easily hit level 50 in less than 3 days with a sponsorship token its like what ? a month to t5 in all the reps maybe 1.5 months ?, without the token your looking at around 3 months. Now realistically the rep system is kinda another way to increase level just time gated and much slower so it really doesn't make much sense to me to try to bring a full t5 rep character lets say level 55 char down to the level of a level 50 char.
The other problem with this is realistically if you want to even the playing field between old and new players you need to stop creating event / time limited ships. items and doff's which essentially create a imbalance. You would also need to add a way for players to get something of equal power to the "Red Matter Capacitor" and other no longer available items.
If that was done it would actually be kind of a nice change.
Ah before I forget also please please stop with the back to back grind event's I'm getting burned out playing the game and needing to repeat the same bloody thing over and over again to get x item / x reward we need at least enough time leeway to either take a day or two between needing to run them or just add rep item once every 20 hrs to any STF or episode run after completing the special event at least once for the duration of the event.
My God are you people still raging and whine over a minor and good
change that's a must to keep the game healthy in the long run.
You all must be in the I.D.10.T club?
Or do you all want to see GOD toons running around with all the powers
from 10 rep trees a year from now 1 shooting Tac cube's a bit of overstatement
but you all get the point? right?
One thing I do agree on I that this should have been done from start of rep
system but done is done now it's time to swallow the much needed medicine.
For all the mother's boys and girls Saying I been robbed BS = losers?
I have been here from F2P start and is a Life time sub now have 7 toons with full
rep and in NOW fracking way fell that they robe me in any way in fact is we are
getting access to 50% more rep powers only thing is cant slot all at same time
and thank god for that.
Perhaps if this thought was coherent, I would be able to make sense of it.
Except buddy before with the dyson rep you could do the hourly XP project non-stop
Woah woah WOAH ... they didn't give commendations after the first run. So why'd you mention commendations?
and finish the rep in like two weeks.
It's time gated but stupid easy to do. They won't take much longer than two weeks. And they've made ALL the other reps just as easy to do, reducing the time spent overall. For every rep, including new ones.
Except buddy before with the dyson rep you could do the hourly XP project non-stop and finish the rep in like two weeks. Now, they are limiting how many hourlies you can do so they are extending the grind of dyson, NOT making it easier, that is a NERF. That is then being applied to all reputations so, how is the standard, current dyson rep, being nerfed, cryptic making repuation grind easier????
Woah woah WOAH ... they didn't give commendations after the first run. So why'd you mention commendations?
It's time gated but stupid easy to do. And they've made ALL the other reps just as easy to do, reducing the time spent overall. For every rep, including new ones.
It's like you didn't read the blog.
lmfao wtf u cant read.
there is a hard limit to the amount of the hourly projects that you will be able to run on the retrofitted reps.
there is no such limit to the hourly projects under dyson rep.
So the devs are punishing players that have busted their humps to "GET AND USE" everything from the Rep system?! They say it is for balancing reason, well here is an idea, how about the fresh max level characters do what everyone else has and work for it? This is the most idiotic idea yet! I as well as many others have poured hours upon to many hours into this game to get all the passives and powers to be able to use, and use at once. Now we have to choose wich ones to use? How in the world is that fair? Why even bother working on Rep any more? I mean come on that is just Mule stinking stupid on your parts.
So the devs are punishing players that have busted their humps to "GET AND USE" everything from the Rep system?! They say it is for balancing reason, well here is an idea, how about the fresh max level characters do what everyone else has and work for it? This is the most idiotic idea yet! I as well as many others have poured hours upon to many hours into this game to get all the passives and powers to be able to use, and use at once. Now we have to choose wich ones to use? How in the world is that fair? Why even bother working on Rep any more? I mean come on that is just Mule stinking stupid on your parts.
Sir, you are being really offensives to mules.
Let us wear Swimsuits on Foundry maps or bridges please! I would pay zen for that.
So the devs are punishing players that have busted their humps to "GET AND USE" everything from the Rep system?!
Well except that they're improving the boost of every single one of those rep passives. So it's like they realized they had to make a change to the system, but to take the sting out of the change they made everything work better to help with the change.
But you know, why bother noticing how much better the powers are going to get? There's threads to rage!
Dyson rep hourly xp projects can be ran 24/7, for the first time character you can clear dyson rep within 17 days.
A character with sponsorship can be cleared within 8-9 days.
So clearly your comprehension skills are at an all time low as to how limiting how many times the hourly can be done will slow down the progression on both new and old reputation systems.
Now that I have spelled it out for you, you might be able to understand just a tiny bit better.
A better solution to the balance issue should be nightmare level content for veteran lvl50 characters.
So new lvl50 characters could do normal mode, matured lvl50s could do elite mode... and characters with all reputation powers and gears could do nightmare mode missions.
And why Cryptic won't do it?
Because a nightmare mode needs proper planning and balancing and lots of work to do... so they choose the easier was and nerf the whole reputation system.
The problem:
a., most of the players will choose 4 space traits and maybe they will switch to ground trairs on the rare occasions when go to to some ground missions.
b., there will be some "abandoned" reputations: why should I do X reputation if I can't use Y powers because of the trait limit and if there is no good reputation gear for me?
c., some STFs will be deserted or at least we have to wait longer for a game. For example Vault or Azure which gives Romulan or Nukara marks... If I don't need Nukara marks because I don't need Nukara powers/gear, why should go to an STF which gives Nukara?
This whole "solution" is a bad fix for a problem which is not exists. Yeah, power creep is a problem but it is not coming from a reputation system. In fact reputation is a system which levels the playing field: in time every lvl50 character can achieve the same powers and the same gear options.
The devil is in the details of how the issues you raise are addressed.
I have no disagreement that there are these issues, but too many of these ideas wont actually work.
Hawks proposal, as you ably demonstrated, actually buffs min maxers while giving little to no extra power to new VAs.
Thus it simply fails to address the stated issue.
I can understand why PvP players in particular would like to limit universal consoles too.
However, if they were balanced properly in the first place, which would have been the opposite of 'super powerful', this wouldnt be an issue.
This whole affair cries out for a much more measured approach.
I say, run this on tribble, but dont transfer it to holodeck.
Not until all the rest of the balancing adjustments have been made and we can look at how it all works, not just one bit of it.
Because, while the aim is worthy, the approach needs some work.
And that IS what tribble is for.
You see? This I can agree to, iron out all the details first before introducing a major change like this, something like this if not handled correctly could cause the game to be well shut down due to minimal interest
We are the Borg. Existence as you know it is over. Lower your shields and surrender your ships. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile.
I agree with those who worked hard to obtain their skill. I also hate it when MMOs try to make thing easier because a hand full of people complain it it too hard. In my opinion this game is too easy to level. There is no real challenge to leveling a character in this game.
They should not change the current reputation system other than to use one kind of mark instead of multiple.
AKA Primus01, Lifetime member since January 16, 2010
***********************************************************
Windows 10 Pro
Intel Core i7-5700
RAM 32 GB
2 Titan GTX 980M GDDR5 8 GB
***********************************************************
I have no problem with the idea of dev blog #5. My problem is stripping which they are doing. So, we have a pool of 16 passive skills to use, so keep that. Cryptic can make how many reputation systems they want. Keep the limit to 16 passive skills.
.
Don't quiet since not interested in naming or shame anyone.
You have point if they don't buff any off powers I can see this working.
Comments
Thread summary - they all hate the change
My take on that summary - good.
=D
Fleet Admiral Rylana - Fed Tac - U.S.S Wild Card - Tactical Miracle Worker Cruiser
Lifetime Subscriber since 2012 == 17,200 Accolades = RIP PvP and Vice Squad
Chief of Starfleet Intelligence Service == Praise Cheesus
MY take on this change = GREAT!!!
This is one of the major flaws in STO. PvP skills should be SEPARATE form PvE. Guild Wars was competent enough to split skills up so they changed to something different or less powerful in PvP. There's no reason Cryptic can't modify the Rep powers to have a similar system. Keep the current Rep powers as-is, and if you go into a PvP match, pick and choose.
First:
Cryptic should double the Romulan Crit chance one to be in line with the others, giving not 5%, but 6% bonus.
Or the should nerf the other ones to give less than a double bonus and dont lie about doubling the effectiveness.
Second:
Powercreep is mostly a problem of Lockbox ships and A2B with Technicians. Just remove technician bonus from the game, and the power creep would drop a hundred times better than if all the rep bonuses were deleted.
Third:
There are numerous alternatives that have been listed here already:
-Harder content, new difficulty levels.
-More reputation slots.
-Giving PVP ques a matchmaking system that puts together teams of equal power.
-Making reputation gain faster so that noobs can get tier 5 much faster.
Fourth:
New reputations. They'll either have to be better than the ones we have before item and power wise, or they arent worth all the investment of time and energy.
However, making all the many reputations that are to come progressively better is quite the power creep, is it not?
Also, reputations are not end game content, but a poor substitute done by lazy company.
Fifth:
Taking stuff from old customers is a bad idea. Didnt any of you guys read anything about the Ferengi?
Good customers are as rare as latinum -- treasure them.
The true problem is not in the rep. powers but the steep increase of item quality once you reach 50 and got key reputation on 5. That is were the major reason for the gap lies not in the rep. powers.
Of course you wont dare touch that, it is what most people here keeps playing after all.
So go on with alibi and pretend instead doing something useful like fixing bugs, add new content or smooth some disliked edges.
And replaced them with more marks. So you get enough marks to do the same thing a commendation would do, PLUS enough marks to do an hourly PLUS 10 more marks to bank.
So you do your one "daily" mission like before that would net a commendation and you get more out of what you would have doing it today.
It's like no one read the blog.
/stunned
change that's a must to keep the game healthy in the long run.
You all must be in the I.D.10.T club?
Or do you all want to see GOD toons running around with all the powers
from 10 rep trees a year from now 1 shooting Tac cube's a bit of overstatement
but you all get the point? right?
One thing I do agree on I that this should have been done from start of rep
system but done is done now it's time to swallow the much needed medicine.
For all the mother's boys and girls Saying I been robbed BS = losers?
I have been here from F2P start and is a Life time sub now have 7 toons with full
rep and in NOW fracking way fell that they robe me in any way in fact is we are
getting access to 50% more rep powers only thing is cant slot all at same time
and thank god for that.
my opinion > fact.
umadbro???
Why don't you be quiet? Yes. We are raging. I spent time earning every passive skill I have and I want to use them. You know how many bloody hours it took. You can't deal with people stating facts or truth?
Are you that special?
I have no problem with the idea of dev blog #5. My problem is stripping which they are doing. So, we have a pool of 16 passive skills to use, so keep that. Cryptic can make how many reputation systems they want. Keep the limit to 16 passive skills.
Now for power creep, make it easier to skill up the reputation system not the Dyson(that's too easy). Match skill level and create better content which requires players to have those passive skills.
We all will be happier.
I played STO since Season 1 and have 3 toons full rep 5. So that is not a argument.
To Smoggy, I'm afraid they also added expertise and EC costs to the Dyson rep. Nerf.
Except buddy before with the dyson rep you could do the hourly XP project non-stop and finish the rep in like two weeks. Now, they are limiting how many hourlies you can do so they are extending the grind of dyson, NOT making it easier, that is a NERF. That is then being applied to all reputations so, how is the standard, current dyson rep, being nerfed, cryptic making repuation grind easier????
looks like YOU didnt READ the blog
I really think they need to increase the number of available rep active slots tho currently we have essentially 24, 12 space & 12 ground. Maybe increase the number useable to 6/6 or make provisions to give a free extra rep slot unlock to any new reputation you reach t5 in.
I'm also kinda unsure about how this is going to work with the final t5 rep ability ? might have just missed that part but I'm hoping they aren't going to need to be slotted to function.
On the other hand I am also kind of unsure about trying to lower the difference between a fresh level 50 character and one that has spent hundreds of hours at endgame. Realistically the player that has been around longer should have a advantage, now for things like pvp or whatever yeah sure disable or lower the higher players ability's in-line for the match. Also the player with fewer hours then has a reason to work on their reputation and play the game (the quest for power as it were).
With the current rep system and rate of leveling in STO you can pretty easily hit level 50 in less than 3 days with a sponsorship token its like what ? a month to t5 in all the reps maybe 1.5 months ?, without the token your looking at around 3 months. Now realistically the rep system is kinda another way to increase level just time gated and much slower so it really doesn't make much sense to me to try to bring a full t5 rep character lets say level 55 char down to the level of a level 50 char.
The other problem with this is realistically if you want to even the playing field between old and new players you need to stop creating event / time limited ships. items and doff's which essentially create a imbalance. You would also need to add a way for players to get something of equal power to the "Red Matter Capacitor" and other no longer available items.
If that was done it would actually be kind of a nice change.
Ah before I forget also please please stop with the back to back grind event's I'm getting burned out playing the game and needing to repeat the same bloody thing over and over again to get x item / x reward we need at least enough time leeway to either take a day or two between needing to run them or just add rep item once every 20 hrs to any STF or episode run after completing the special event at least once for the duration of the event.
Perhaps if this thought was coherent, I would be able to make sense of it.
Woah woah WOAH ... they didn't give commendations after the first run. So why'd you mention commendations?
It's time gated but stupid easy to do. They won't take much longer than two weeks. And they've made ALL the other reps just as easy to do, reducing the time spent overall. For every rep, including new ones.
It's like you didn't read the blog.
Also, you're really bad at math. Just sayin'
winner winner chicken dinner.
lmfao wtf u cant read.
there is a hard limit to the amount of the hourly projects that you will be able to run on the retrofitted reps.
there is no such limit to the hourly projects under dyson rep.
It's like you can't read either. It's pretty much the reason this thread is filled with misinformation. Including your posts.
Sir, you are being really offensives to mules.
Well except that they're improving the boost of every single one of those rep passives. So it's like they realized they had to make a change to the system, but to take the sting out of the change they made everything work better to help with the change.
But you know, why bother noticing how much better the powers are going to get? There's threads to rage!
rage on my friend. Rage on.
These hourly XP projects may be run a handful of times per day. - new system from blog http://community.arcgames.com/en/news/star-trek-online/detail/3038363
Dyson rep hourly xp projects can be ran 24/7, for the first time character you can clear dyson rep within 17 days.
A character with sponsorship can be cleared within 8-9 days.
So clearly your comprehension skills are at an all time low as to how limiting how many times the hourly can be done will slow down the progression on both new and old reputation systems.
Now that I have spelled it out for you, you might be able to understand just a tiny bit better.
So new lvl50 characters could do normal mode, matured lvl50s could do elite mode... and characters with all reputation powers and gears could do nightmare mode missions.
And why Cryptic won't do it?
Because a nightmare mode needs proper planning and balancing and lots of work to do... so they choose the easier was and nerf the whole reputation system.
The problem:
a., most of the players will choose 4 space traits and maybe they will switch to ground trairs on the rare occasions when go to to some ground missions.
b., there will be some "abandoned" reputations: why should I do X reputation if I can't use Y powers because of the trait limit and if there is no good reputation gear for me?
c., some STFs will be deserted or at least we have to wait longer for a game. For example Vault or Azure which gives Romulan or Nukara marks... If I don't need Nukara marks because I don't need Nukara powers/gear, why should go to an STF which gives Nukara?
This whole "solution" is a bad fix for a problem which is not exists. Yeah, power creep is a problem but it is not coming from a reputation system. In fact reputation is a system which levels the playing field: in time every lvl50 character can achieve the same powers and the same gear options.
You see? This I can agree to, iron out all the details first before introducing a major change like this, something like this if not handled correctly could cause the game to be well shut down due to minimal interest
They should not change the current reputation system other than to use one kind of mark instead of multiple.
***********************************************************
Windows 10 Pro
Intel Core i7-5700
RAM 32 GB
2 Titan GTX 980M GDDR5 8 GB
***********************************************************
Don't quiet since not interested in naming or shame anyone.
You have point if they don't buff any off powers I can see this working.
Yes I cant spell for **** not from a English speaking country + dyslectic
fell superior now?
Fleet Admiral Rylana - Fed Tac - U.S.S Wild Card - Tactical Miracle Worker Cruiser
Lifetime Subscriber since 2012 == 17,200 Accolades = RIP PvP and Vice Squad
Chief of Starfleet Intelligence Service == Praise Cheesus
plz stop spamming my thread with useless rhetoric okthx