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PvP Space Discussion Concerns Discussion's Discussions Thread
aquitaine985
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
I just wanted to follow the crowd 
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@Aquitaine985
Lag Industries STO PvP Fleet - Executive
A Sad Panda of Industrial calibre.
2010: This is Cryptic PvP. Please hold the line, your call is very important to us...
@Aquitaine985
Lag Industries STO PvP Fleet - Executive
A Sad Panda of Industrial calibre.
2010: This is Cryptic PvP. Please hold the line, your call is very important to us...
Post edited by aquitaine985 on
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This is like when two pretty girls show up to a party in the same dress.
I'll request my thread by merged into yours as tbh I'm spread a bit thin on threads I'm managing
This thread has no value, it was a mockery of all the other thread names i saw in a row. your thread has much value sir!
@Aquitaine985
Lag Industries STO PvP Fleet - Executive
A Sad Panda of Industrial calibre.
2010: This is Cryptic PvP. Please hold the line, your call is very important to us...
My apologies, mon capitan, but you now have the helm on this one. :P
To be honest, I'm not sure how I feel on this one.
I know that you are correct, they were changed to not stack.
But in recent testing there are ways to defeat even the level of stealth that these stacked BOFFs provide.
I'm talking about being able to actually target battelcloaked ships from 10km or beyond level of detection.
Some of the problems posted do seem a little trivial. Others affect the whole balance or gameplay and are on a "Must Fix" basis.
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9
My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
In those tests though, was it not a case that the person seeing them were dedicated to seeing such folks?
I've got my dedicated Snooper that can see folks - but it's such a specialized build, that overall it's useless otherwise. It's that in the first few minutes of a match, things go really bad for the other team - then the rest of the match, the main thing the guy's seeing is the Respawn button.
To see somebody at 10km, you need 500 more Perception than they have Stealth. So you're looking at folks with Perception values in the 6100-6300+ range.
I think maybe if they were broken into smaller lists would be good.
Low Impact
Moderate Impact
Severe/Critical Impact
Then we could have three lists, 1 under each heading. And I will have to buy naz some chocolates for making that soon-to-be threadnaught even more complicated!
if i introduce this, i would be open to "Who put you incharge?" comments.....
Yes aboslutely,
But being dedicated to seeing someone shouldn't completely negate all of their stealth advantages to the point that you can see them from 10km away.
2 Ships built in such a manner could theoretically circle 9km apart, and cover an sphere that is 30km wide.
I also believe that once they spot you, their team has effectively spotted you (needs confirmation).
Then you get into the discussions on what folks think the impact of each is...as well as getting into subjective discussions on certain things.
Hrmm, perhaps a Bugs Thread and a Concerns Thread? Bugs are Bugs, Concerns are...the subject of much popcorn munching reading through entertaining threads.
Well a few options.
1) "I'm in charge, because I made the bloody thread"
2) Players themselves give it a rating, and we go by the honor system. Other players are allowed to debate the accuracy of the assessment in this thread.
This thread can contain all, it is the alpha and the omega of all concerns, bugs and discussions as laid out by Regulus of Lag Industries, JHAS pilot extraordinaire and master of ceremonies.
On the other hand, this is all volunteer stuff.
This is all initiative driven stuff.
If you feel the need for a separate Bugs discussion and have the moxy to run it, I'm all for it. Set it up and I will support it.
Sounds a better idea splitting the 2 apart...... Care to create? :P
See somebody cloaked, Target Aux, Grav Well, fire off a Spread of the new Subspace Torp, etc, etc, etc - decloak them.
The thing about somebody that's obviously a Snooper is they're prime SNB bait. They break out their Snoop, you SNB it off. They're left with nothing because they specialized in it so much.
Maybe it's the way I look at it, I have three Sci - 1 Fed (Snooper), 1 KDF (used to fly a 4x Sci BOFF Hegh'ta), and 1 KDF-aligned Rom in a T'varo.
At some point I'm going to respec the Fed...I've said it would be nify if we had 10 man teams instead of 5 man teams (2x 5 man teams are not 10 man teams) for that kind of specialization...there would be room for it as long as the Snoopers had support, cause they're going to need more Support than any body else on the field of battle, imho.
The KDF I decided to change how he flies, so he's dorking around with various other ships.
The Rom though...heh, yeah - after Cryptic gave out the free Nebula and folks started trying to Snoop more, it's been a case of SNB oh no you don't...
There's still going to be a level of dedication/opportunity cost to being a Snooper even if they don't have to take it to the level needed to see the stacked +Stealth.
There's also the issue that arises when comparing KDF cloakers and Rom cloakers that arises out of the stacking...which is the more general Rom BOFF issue - and - one of my favorite current jokes: R'Mor are more better than Wells/Korath...same stats, better BOFFs.
That's fine. It's too easy to have "perfect" cloak in this game. And building a ship to have that kind of detection has a hefty opportunity cost on the team, compared to what slotting 5 boffs, max spec in Stealth does for Roms.
Forget I said anything.
Honestly, I haven't even logged in today. It's gotten harder and harder to log in each day. The combination of being burnt out on the tedious PvE grind, the sheer number of bugs/quirky bugs, the brute force spammage manner in which so many folks PvP these days...well, it's just not fun.
I was going to post in one of your threads about that last one, but I held off - I still haven't thought of a good way to put it. Was even going to create a thread about it, but I didn't have enough give a TRIBBLE to do it at the time.
It used to be a case of seeing folks complaining about chained Tractors, VMs, SNBs - etc, etc, etc - coordinated efforts to kill folks, which at the same time were often pointed to as a means actually to be able to kill something because how much defensive powercreep had taken place as well.
These days, lol - it's the chained everything including the kitchen sink. I've seen folks drop out three Subspace Poos on somebody...seen folks alternating AMS, SNB, DOFF'd Scrambles, SNB, AMS. Seen four folks fire off GPGs at the same time.
It's gotten ridiculous - I mean, seriously...I started trolling with Shadows. Back during the LoR beta, I complained that the Shadows would suck for PvP because nobody would be stupid enough to target them...lol, I've never been more wrong. It's freaking hilarious to drop out Shadows and watch folks waste all their console CDs spamming the Hell out of the Shadows. When I mentioned in zone that the Shadows weren't real, one of the guys that had been spamming them complained about my cheese. Dude, I almost pissed myself laughing...
I did 5 CnH yesterday - three really awesome ones on Willard, sure things were spammy at times with pets, various poo, etc, etc, etc - was like flying through molasses and laggy as Hell - but it was fun. Then two on Plague where it was just epic /facepalm, if the guys had spent half as much effort on their damage instead of their spamsoles - then they could have killed me in a quarter of the time. At one point, it felt like I was going to die of old age sitting there buried in stacked Subspace Poo while tractored...were they waiting for the damage from the Subspace Poo to kill me or something?
PvP's becoming as mindless as PvE...
...so yeah, while I may have shared some bugs I've seen (some that were part of the original concerns thread) - I'm not sure I care enough at this point.
Sadly, the stealth skill does almost nothing.
I actually wish it was reverse, with the skill providing a dramatic effect and the boffs adding a smaller bonus.
9 Ranks in the T4 skill adds something like 1% to stealth. For a standard "cloak" that's about 50 in stealth.
1 Rom BOFF adds +150.
1 Rom BOFF adds 3x as much as a T4 skill?
I agree that we shouldn't have perfect cloaks, and I do like the idea of "snooper" builds.
But if you can view a cloaked ship from beyond 10 km, there are probably a few mechanics that aren't working correctly.
Not only is there the low cloaking CD, but there's all sorts of fun things involved.
Quantum Singularity Manipulation (available to all)
Singularity Stabilizer (T'varo Refit console, available to all Roms)
Warp Shadows (Rom)
Singularity Jump (Rom)
There's others, but those work very well in combination with the CD...to make it easy for somebody to hop around with little concern as opposed to what a KDF cloaker might experience.
Vin Naftero@playhard88 - FED Sciencie
K'tan@playhard88 - KDF Tactical
Argento@playhard88 - RRF Tactical (FED)
We need to be specific if we want to get any kind of attention. An this is very arguable, the offensive sci can be really powerfull and is very imporant have one in your team, ofc is not made for killing, but it can disable/hold/debuff making killing very easy for your team.
Imo, this is fine as is right know, i dont want sci draining shields and blowing up everyone again, is a very frustrating mechanic.
And if u want, you can still make your sci a dps tool. I used my sci only in 1 match in the No BS #3, in playoff vs and IC/Omega fleet team, i outdamaged all the tacticals in the match...ofc is not a regular build, but u can do dps is that what u want.
That can be solved very simple with a hard cap
Vin Naftero@playhard88 - FED Sciencie
K'tan@playhard88 - KDF Tactical
Argento@playhard88 - RRF Tactical (FED)
You can only view people at those distances for a limited time, and you have to really spec into those things to get a real effect.
Getting a good cloak is way too easy in a comparison. You don't have to gimp your build to do it, nor sacrifice your damage in any way.
Snoop builds are fine, it's the cloaks that are out of whack.
Romulans have a distinct advantage.
It takes no effort or spec against most KDF cloaks.
Then again, scis run multiple rolls now whereas they used to be more focused...
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
@Aquitaine985
Lag Industries STO PvP Fleet - Executive
A Sad Panda of Industrial calibre.
2010: This is Cryptic PvP. Please hold the line, your call is very important to us...
Uncle Ulti said he was going to ask to have his merged with this one...conceding it to you. It's your thread. You're responsible.
Correct, I was clearly bested in the battle of the amazing thread titles.
So I conceded to Reg. :P
This. It's important to make this distinction. KDF battlecloaks are unfairly weaker than Romulan ones. Not only does the Romulan battlecloak have a very slightly higher innate 'stealth' bonus, but you've gotta factor in the boffs as well.
I PvP with a Fleet Norgh running 6 points into Stealth, 70-ish AUX in most cases (unless I'm REALLY trying to hide), and whatever bonuses my Mk XII 2pc KHG setup (shields and deflector) is giving me, and I've come across a few folks who can see me. Usually it's snooper builds. . .but once someone can see through the battlecloak, it's amazing how vulnerable the BoP is at that point. Just leaving cloak often isn't a good option, especially if the snooper is working with Romulan wingmen.
good idea, i'll edit my posts with the correct color heading.
Ideas:
1. Infiltration mission where we try to beam out a spy at an enemy installation and the other side tries to stop us.
2. VIP mission, where one person is vote to be the VIP ship that can't die moving between way points (cruiser friendly).
3. Wrath of Kahn remake in the sense that the pvp is done with limited sensors and no shields, acc goes through the toilet, and pets die in the radiation field.
4. Combo space and ground. Start in space accomplishing an objective like attacking a starbase/npc ship/base, if you defeat the shields and can launch away team shuttles to it everyone transfers to ground pvp to either capture or repel boards on the ship/starbase/etc.
5. Evade. 1 vs many, they just have to make it to an area of reinforcements, or similar to Nemesis, where the Enterprise was trying to return to the fleet before being overtaken at the end of the movie. Have one on the far side and his buddies else where and have to make it to him.
6. Tweaks to cap and hold, hull size impacts the speed you cap points.
Lots of bizarre ideas, can you tell i coach youth soccer?