We are going to be testing a change to the power levels for Warbirds soon.
Rather than having a 40 base to all power levels, we are going to be testing how they perform with 45 to all power levels.
Please keep in mind that this is a test and that we may end up changing it back to 40 base or making other changes to compensate for the presence of Romulan Battle Cloaking and the Singularity mechanic on Romulan ships. For example, there is a possibility we may end up removing console slots or BOFF seats instead of or in addition to the power level differences.
We are still evaluating making changes to the Singularity mechanics and Romulan Battle Cloak as well.
Thank you for your continued testing and feedback.
How about restoring power levels to 50 across the board and no core powers. But let the player add core powers via consoles, and each console added reduces power levels?
You could then have different quality levels of the core power consoles that combine more then one core power into a single console.
That should lead to a pretty balances approach. No core powers, no penalty, core powers that the player wants to use, induce a penalty accordingly.
I understand losing a bit of power for the battle cloak, Klingons typically lose some shield strength for their cloak. Losing bridge officer slots for singularity abilities is a pretty bad trade off from what I've seen, would much rather just have a typical bridge officer compliment than singularity abilities .
Losing console slots kind of feels like a deal breaker, but when I think about it, it could be a fair trade off. I think about how I have to equip a cloaking device as a console in my defiant and galaxy X, so it would be somewhat of an equivalency (except for it being mandatory). Perhaps there could be a way in which the captain has to select a console slot on their ship for the cloaking device at Romulan head quarters. That slot then becomes permanently occupied by the cloaking device until the captain returns to the outfitter to reassign a different console position (in this way we can choose where we want to be shot :cool:).
Being able to battle cloak on something as large as the Mogai is extremely awesome. Hopefully I'll be able to test more this weekend as I can't wait to get a D'deridex .
Well, in a moment of madness I'm going to defend Cryptic here a little bit. The Romulan ships as a whole have something very special already built in, which is the battle cloak. It works. It has great availability.. It offers a lot of tactical potential. The only other ships to date that have had battle cloaks are the Klingon BOPs, which sacrifice both a bridge seat and significant basic durability compared to ships of their level.
So... it's not only the singularity abilities that we're "buying" here, it's the battle cloak, which is a completely unique feature on ships that aren't suffering from Brittle BOP Disease.
Just saying. Don't "overbalance". Halving the core penalty would go a loooong way toward justifying the singularity opportunity cost.
I am curious as to how exactly this "reduction of boff seating" would work... I doubt they would make it fully universal like on the bop as people would throw a fit... of joy or rage, depending on which side you're on. I think it would be interesting to have a carrier 4 boff or even a 3boff setup. Like on the D'deridex, if it was commander eng, lt.com tac, lt.com sci... that could actually be workable. Yes, you'd have access to some higher abilities in tac and sci, but two less bridge officer skills and two less bridge officer trait passives. But if they went that route, I think the power level penalties would be overkill.
Perhaps -5 to all subsystems (which if you consider the D'deridex a cruiser, would be the equivalent of "no +5 to all subsystems" rather than "-5 all subsystems." And then use a carrier type 4 boff layout with a lt.com tac, lt.com sci, commander engineer, and... lt eng? ensign eng? ensign universal?
Either way, it seems there's a real opportunity to create a real contrast between romulan ships and the other ships.
Though I am curious... what if the introduction of the romulans simply brought battle cloak to all ships that can cloak? Would we need a penalty to power or boffs if klingon ships that can cloak and the defiant and gal-x could battle cloak with their consoles?
Something else to consider is... why seemingly "nerf" the romulans with lower power? Why not give romulan ships the normal power mechanic that exists and then give +5 power to all subsystems for the klingon and federation ships to compensate?
I have no idea how anyone can have any other conclusion based on what we have at the moment. Battle cloak sort of works on a BOP because it can move fast enough to make use of it. Even then BOP isn't a particularly good ship. Battle cloak may be fine on some of the C-Store ships that have a layout which suits it. On the only free ship available? No, it's not going to be particularly useful.
First off you're assuming you're being attacked all the time. Even on the D'Deridex, if I'm not being shot, and my Battle Cloak is up, use it for the five second damage burst you get when you come out of it.
Secondly, even on my Oddy, there have been times where things just don't go right, and I want to shake agro off to the other cruiser in the group. Battle Cloak plus evasive manuevers and power to engines would at least gets me out of the immediate threat area.
The problem isn't the worthlessness of Battle Cloak, the problem is, you don't fully understand all its benefits.
I have never once flown around in my Odyssey thinking "what I want is a ship that has lower power levels and a worse turn rate, where I can turn off my shields and stop shooting my weapons, it would make this battle so much more fun".
Call me crazy. This isn't really anything a D'Deridex is going to be able to use. And if that's the only tier 5 free ship, then yes. Seriously. Since nothing before Tier V really matters, at the end of the day. This game starts at level 50. A ton of content unlocks and the game opens up. Everything before that is a warm up round.
I have no idea how anyone can have any other conclusion based on what we have at the moment. Battle cloak sort of works on a BOP because it can move fast enough to make use of it. Even then BOP isn't a particularly good ship. Battle cloak may be fine on some of the C-Store ships that have a layout which suits it. On the only free ship available? No, it's not going to be particularly useful.
The real issue is how will singularity powers work at level 50. That's what we really need to see next, and will soon enough.
Yup, because suddenly tripling your turn rate...who would want that? And then getting a 25% damage boost...there's no way anyone could find any use for that. /sarcasm
As for singularity powers, I've been watching what Plasma Shockwave can do, and so far, at lvl 25, my science officer under the right conditions can do over 67k damage with a top ranked plasma shockwave. Granted, that's 6.7k to 10 unshielded ships, but that's still a lot of damage for a skill that far too many people are ragging on as "useless".
Quantum Absorption I assume will rise with level so that it continues to provide a meaningful heal/defense at higher levels. Warp Shadows...I guess the shadows you leave behind will be tougher, so that could help, but effectively, it's as good as it gets. And we'll just have to wait and see on the remaining two singularity powers.
How about restoring power levels to 50 across the board and no core powers. But let the player add core powers via consoles, and each console added reduces power levels?
You could then have different quality levels of the core power consoles that combine more then one core power into a single console.
That should lead to a pretty balances approach. No core powers, no penalty, core powers that the player wants to use, induce a penalty accordingly.
How 'bout you just go play a Federation or Klingon? You obviously love the existing gameplay, so hey just roll another one of the same, right?
EDIT: Disregard, I misread. Apologies, sorry, my bad.
That being said, still, no. Because the end result will be countless people just playing the exact same way they would play on their Fed or Klingon ship rather than adapting to the challenges and advantages of the Warbird.
How 'bout you just go play a Federation or Klingon? You obviously love the existing gameplay, so hey just roll another one of the same, right?
No he has a point. I don't think he should use console powers, but we could use something on the same line where Singularity Engines have slots we can fill. The first comes free, but each slot filled gives us a -5 to either weapons, shields, engines, or aux, our choice depending on what slot we fill.
Means if I don't want to slot a Singularity power, I get power, but if I like one, I slot it into one of the slots, and that simply diverts power from something into powering up that power.
Seriously? If you're going to gimp the ships for some gimmicky powers, then just get rid of the whole singularity mechanic altogether...
Now we know that's not going to happen. They didn't spend all this time designing these powers, creating the visuals for them, programing them in, creating the UI assets for them and special singularity cores separate and apart from warp cores just to chuck it all out.
No he has a point. I don't think he should use console powers, but we could use something on the same line where Singularity Engines have slots we can fill. The first comes free, but each slot filled gives us a -5 to either weapons, shields, engines, or aux, our choice depending on what slot we fill.
Means if I don't want to slot a Singularity power, I get power, but if I like one, I slot it into one of the slots, and that simply diverts power from something into powering up that power.
Seriously? If you're going to gimp the ships for some gimmicky powers, then just get rid of the whole singularity mechanic altogether...
I've had a blast with the singularity powers. I don't know if they're balanced - the content I play most of the time (especially with a low-level character) doesn't demand exceptional min-maxing - but I'd be sad to see it go.
Why do people say the game starts at level 50? Most of the most fun stuff is pre-level cap.
People say that about MMOs all the time and I've never met an MMO that got better at level cap.
In most mmo's, one is no where near their potential until end game. One typically has access to fewer abilities, "meh" equips/items, all the "goods" character building wise are at the end. But yes, most of the content is in the lower levels. This is why I prefer leveling up without the content and then playing through the content once I get to end game. For me it's much more fun to play through the star trek missions in a ship I want (which are typically end-game) with all my abilities than to play through with a gimpy ship with crappy weapons, and an idiot crew that can't perform half of the functions on a star ship.
No he has a point. I don't think he should use console powers, but we could use something on the same line where Singularity Engines have slots we can fill. The first comes free, but each slot filled gives us a -5 to either weapons, shields, engines, or aux, our choice depending on what slot we fill.
Means if I don't want to slot a Singularity power, I get power, but if I like one, I slot it into one of the slots, and that simply diverts power from something into powering up that power.
My bad, I misread; edited my original reply to a more appropriate answer (and an apology, of course.)
Now we know that's not going to happen. They didn't spend all this time designing these powers, creating the visuals for them, programing them in, creating the UI assets for them and special singularity cores separate and apart from warp cores just to chuck it all out.
Probably not, but if they really want our feedback, I think it's good to communicate that some of us think that all their hard work has been a huge waste of time. No one was really clamoring for the singularity mechanic anyway.
Personally, I'd be fine with giving up an ensign slot if the singularity cooldown was between thirty seconds to a minute. Most people complain about the ensign slot anyway, but make the power roughly equivalent. Decent but not extraordinary and something you can activate at least once a minute. It would at least give us an opportunity for some new powers. But I'd rather not be gimped with my power levels or console, because that would affect us the entire time while we're in combat.
Probably not, but if they really want our feedback, I think it's good to communicate that some of us think that all their hard work has been a huge waste of time.
Some people think having to level is a huge waste of time.
Some people think that Cruisers are a huge waste of time.
Some people think costumes are a huge waste of time.
Different people consider all sorts of different things to be a waste of time.
The Singularity Mechanics (and their balancing factors) add an additional level of complexity to the game. They require additional thought from the player in regard to how they're going to fly these ships. Some people think additional complexity and thought is a huge waste of time...
How 'bout you just go play a Federation or Klingon? You obviously love the existing gameplay, so hey just roll another one of the same, right?
EDIT: Disregard, I misread. Apologies, sorry, my bad.
That being said, still, no. Because the end result will be countless people just playing the exact same way they would play on their Fed or Klingon ship rather than adapting to the challenges and advantages of the Warbird.
Yes, but the way I presented it, it allows customization. Personally I like the singularity powers, others don't. This was it allows players to customize their play, much like BOff powers and consoles do now, in just one more way.
Will alot of people just go and play them the way the Feds and KDF do, yes they will. But if people want to play uncreative cookie-cutter builds, who are we to say that's not fun for them? It's not me, I couldn't care less about the Power-of-the-month club, but many do, and they're game play is just as right and fun as yours and mine.
Will alot of people just go and play them the way the Feds and KDF do, yes they will. But if people want to play uncreative cookie-cutter builds, who are we to say that's not fun for them? It's not me, I couldn't care less about the Power-of-the-month club, but many do, and they're game play is just as right and fun as yours and mine.
If somebody likes flying an Escort, just because they happen to hop in a Cruiser - should they be able to fly that Cruiser like an Escort?
This isn't taking anything away from anybody...they haven't flown it yet. If they don't like how it flies, they don't have to fly it. Heck, they can still run a Romulan if they want - T1-4 they can fly non-Rom ships. At T5, they can run any of the non-faction Lockbox ships out there as well.
But much like the guy going from an Escort to a Cruiser is going to have to adapt...if folks want to fly a Warbird, they're going to need to adapt.
That battle claok can be really powerful, but it's one of those items that takes some skill to use. If you use it at the wrong time it can get you blown up instantly, but if you use it at the right time, it can let you exit a losing battle and come back in to make it a winning battle. It's situational and requires skill.
THe singularity powers are similar in this regard.
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I don't like the idea of removing console slots and BOFF seating at all. Definitely not with the current (lack of) strenght on the powers and the long cooldown they have. I do profer having -5 power to each subsystem rather than -10, but before ANY blanacing is decided on, we need the rest of the levels unlocked so we can test everything at end game. We are missing 2 abilities to test, and end game is where most of the game is and where balance is more critical.
Probably not, but if they really want our feedback, I think it's good to communicate that some of us think that all their hard work has been a huge waste of time. No one was really clamoring for the singularity mechanic anyway.
Personally, I'd be fine with giving up an ensign slot if the singularity cooldown was between thirty seconds to a minute. Most people complain about the ensign slot anyway, but make the power roughly equivalent. Decent but not extraordinary and something you can activate at least once a minute. It would at least give us an opportunity for some new powers. But I'd rather not be gimped with my power levels or console, because that would affect us the entire time while we're in combat.
I see your point, I just doubt they are willing to lay their efforts to waste by scrapping the endeavor entirely. I think what is more productive is for us to figure out a palatable way for these mechanics to be implemented without leaving a bad taste in our mouths. Personally, I think the best way to do that, is instead of a perceived "gimping" of romulan ships with lower power levels than we are used to, let them use the normal power mechanic and give warp core vessels an additional +5 to all subsystems instead. That, and/or, remove the power drain mechanic from energy weapon fire.
The way things stand now, to do decent damage to anything with shields, one needs to put high energy into weapons, and not only high energy, but above and beyond what they are actually aiming for, because if you aim for 100 power, you're going to dip to 80 once you fire your weapons, so if you want 125, you have to put in 145+
I think even such a big drop in power as 10 per subsystem would be easier to swallow if that maximum 90 you can put into weapons actually gave you what the tool tip said you would get for investing that much power.
Other systems don't work that way. When you set your shields to 125 power and get 1000 regeneration every 6 seconds, that regeneration doesn't drop off because someone's shooting at you.
"Hey, computer, you said if I put 100 power to weapons, I would get 1000 dps from each of my weapons, but when I fire them, I'm doing 600dps, what's up with that?"
Computer: "Oh, I didn't realize you intended to fire your weapons more than one at a time, if you fire more than one, the damage output will drop."
"Well then, please calculate my dps assuming I will fire more than one and give me that readout then."
Computer: "That would be quite complicated and depend on which firing arc an enemy is in, so sorry, no."
Now imagine if we applied that elsewhere.
"Computer, we have put 100 power to shields and have a regeneration level of 1000 every six seconds, but when we come under fire, the regeneration rate drops, why?"
Computer: "Oh, I"m sorry, I didn't realize you were going to enter combat with your shields, if you enter combat, the regeneration rate drops."
"....why???"
Computer: "Because."
"Because???"
Computer: "Because I said so, and if you say one more thing about it, I"m confining you to your quarters and disabling the replicator."
I dunno about the rest of you, but I like the numbers I see to be the numbers I get. Yes, removing the drain mechanic would pretty much make engineering captain's nadeon inversion go from pretty much useless to entirely useless, but we can give them something else, I'm sure they won't mind.
In no other subsystem is putting more than 125 power deemed necessary, or even useful, I don't see why that should be the case with weapons.
but before ANY blanacing is decided on, we need the rest of the levels unlocked so we can test everything at end game.
Combination of other available gear, the various Captain abilities, the additional traits, etc, etc, etc...yeah, it's very difficult to say how anything may work other than through speculation. Even though we can formulate what the loss might be - are we taking everything else into consideration. Yes, the definitive testing will come later...
We are going to be testing a change to the power levels for Warbirds soon.
Rather than having a 40 base to all power levels, we are going to be testing how they perform with 45 to all power levels.
Please keep in mind that this is a test and that we may end up changing it back to 40 base or making other changes to compensate for the presence of Romulan Battle Cloaking and the Singularity mechanic on Romulan ships. For example, there is a possibility we may end up removing console slots or BOFF seats instead of or in addition to the power level differences.
We are still evaluating making changes to the Singularity mechanics and Romulan Battle Cloak as well.
Thank you for your continued testing and feedback.
If I get higher power levels and keep my consoles feel free to take my ensign slots...heck even a Lt. slot if you "MUST". Console powers are as good or better than many of the Lt. an Ens. powers anyway...
If I get higher power levels and keep my consoles feel free to take my ensign slots...heck even a Lt. slot if you "MUST". Console powers are as good or better than many of the Lt. an Ens. powers anyway...
Good job proving you don't know anything about the game, a simple transfert shield strength 1 heal a LOT more shield point than quantum shield, have about half the cooldown and provide a good bit of shield damage resistance on top of it all. And that's just an ensign power.
As if that wasn't enough , you'd actually be willing to sacrifice a lt slot for that piece of **** of a console "power", assuming you can call smething that pityfully weak a power.
Oh my god, seriouslyhow is it possible to be that clueless? transfert shield strenght 2 effective healing per minute is at minimum 4 times stronger than quantum shield, and that's talking at medium aux power
What kind of sad dimwit would ever willingly make that trade?
We are going to be testing a change to the power levels for Warbirds soon.
Rather than having a 40 base to all power levels, we are going to be testing how they perform with 45 to all power levels.
Please keep in mind that this is a test and that we may end up changing it back to 40 base or making other changes to compensate for the presence of Romulan Battle Cloaking and the Singularity mechanic on Romulan ships. For example, there is a possibility we may end up removing console slots or BOFF seats instead of or in addition to the power level differences.
We are still evaluating making changes to the Singularity mechanics and Romulan Battle Cloak as well.
Thank you for your continued testing and feedback.
So instead of doing what you described... scrap the singularity system entirely. Or make the powers worth having (without gimping the ship in any other way). Or (and heres the option that I prefer the most) allow us to opt out and not have any of the TRIBBLE powers and have our ships not constantly debuffed in regards to subsystem power levels.
You have got to be kidding me if you think that a situational power (which may not be useful by the time its even charged) is worth a constant debuff to your ship.
And you have to be kidding me if you think the minute bonuses that the Romulan battle cloak provides is worth any sort of debuff ever.
Honestly... the singularity power system/romulan battle cloak debuffing our ships is a deal breaker as far as playing the romulan faction... (that in the stupid tutorial with so many unskippable boring story cutscenes.)
The only other ships in this game which have a battlecloak do sort of suffer from a constant debuff. BoPs have less hull, less shields and -1 rear weapon slot than the average raptor/escort of the same class, so it kinda make sense that the Romulan ships get some drawbacks, too.
However I strongly advise against removing Boff seats or console slots. Especially the latter would have a huge impact, even more so than removing a rear weapon slot. I would even prefer to keep the -10 to all subsystems instead.
Honestly... the singularity power system/romulan battle cloak debuffing our ships is a deal breaker as far as playing the romulan faction... (that in the stupid tutorial with so many unskippable boring story cutscenes.)
Completely agree. I could say more on the topic (and I have in other posts) but that pretty much sums it up.
Liked the romulan introduction though, but I'm really struggling to see why I'd put my romulan in an actual romulan faction ship apart from "it looks cool I guess".
If the battle cloak is an issue just reduce shield / hull like the KHG ships have. Nerfing baseline power levels to any extent is NOT WORTH any trade off at all.
The only other ships in this game which have a battlecloak do sort of suffer from a constant debuff. BoPs have less hull, less shields and -1 rear weapon slot than the average raptor/escort of the same class, so it kinda make sense that the Romulan ships get some drawbacks, too.
However I strongly advise against removing Boff seats or console slots. Especially the latter would have a huge impact, even more so than removing a rear weapon slot. I would even prefer to keep the -10 to all subsystems instead.
No. They are raider class ships. They have the hull they have because of their classification not their abilities.
No. They are raider class ships. They have the hull they have because of their classification not their abilities.
They have the hull they have to balance them in regard to escorts, not because of some sort of classification (which doesn't even exist in canon anyway).
We are going to be testing a change to the power levels for Warbirds soon.
Rather than having a 40 base to all power levels, we are going to be testing how they perform with 45 to all power levels.
Please keep in mind that this is a test and that we may end up changing it back to 40 base or making other changes to compensate for the presence of Romulan Battle Cloaking and the Singularity mechanic on Romulan ships. For example, there is a possibility we may end up removing console slots or BOFF seats instead of or in addition to the power level differences.
We are still evaluating making changes to the Singularity mechanics and Romulan Battle Cloak as well.
Thank you for your continued testing and feedback.
ack! you can keep the power, leave the slots alone!
The only other ships in this game which have a battlecloak do sort of suffer from a constant debuff. BoPs have less hull, less shields and -1 rear weapon slot than the average raptor/escort of the same class, so it kinda make sense that the Romulan ships get some drawbacks, too.
However I strongly advise against removing Boff seats or console slots. Especially the latter would have a huge impact, even more so than removing a rear weapon slot. I would even prefer to keep the -10 to all subsystems instead.
They have the hull they have to balance them in regard to escorts, not because of some sort of classification (which doesn't even exist in canon anyway).
It's difficult to say that bops suffer some sort of penalty for their battle cloak as there is really nothing to compare them against. There is no "non battlecloak bop" that shows what the bop's stats would be if it did not have a battle cloak. Raptors are more closely compared to a federation escort than to a bop, and the federation has no bop, unless you look at the aquarius, but that ship seems to simply have the hull of a bop, 5% lower shields and one less aft weapon slot than an escort, and all in exchange for a universal lt and a universal ensign seat. I have no idea what the point of that ship is, it gives up a whole lot for a whole lot of not much.
For a fairer comparison of the penalty of a battle cloak, we should look at the peghqu' vs the chimera. Yes they are both "super rare" or whatever as lifer rewards or veteran reward or whatever, however, they are a clear contrast between two equivalent ships, one with a battle cloak, one without.
The difference between the battle cloaking peghqu' and the chimera in exchange for its battle cloak is: approximately 8% lower shields.
So for a warbird, should it not have 8% lower shields or 8%% lower hull or the equivalent there of in exchange for a battle cloak?
Now, if I'm not mistaken, the D'derdex is a "captain" level ship and thus flies alongside the galaxy and vorcha. The vorcha and the galaxy are nearly identical except the vorcha has 500 more crew... i'm not sure if that's supposed to be a bonus or a penalty given current crew death/injury mechanics, and has approximately 8% less hull than the galaxy in exchange for 167% of the turn rate, plus it can normal cloak. If the devs go forward with giving the D'deridex a 5.5 turn rate, that would be approximately 8% lower turn rate than a galaxy. So if we give the D'derdex 8% lower hull than a galaxy, and 8% lower turn rate than the galaxy (45% lower turn rate than the vorcha), that should more than make up for the occasional special abilities it gains from singularity core and a battle cloak, no?
So lets just do that with all the romulan ships. 8% lower hull and 8% lower turn rate than their compatriots in exchange for their occasional core abilities and battle cloaks. Tada. No boff penatlies needed, no power penalties needed.
Comments
How about restoring power levels to 50 across the board and no core powers. But let the player add core powers via consoles, and each console added reduces power levels?
You could then have different quality levels of the core power consoles that combine more then one core power into a single console.
That should lead to a pretty balances approach. No core powers, no penalty, core powers that the player wants to use, induce a penalty accordingly.
Losing console slots kind of feels like a deal breaker, but when I think about it, it could be a fair trade off. I think about how I have to equip a cloaking device as a console in my defiant and galaxy X, so it would be somewhat of an equivalency (except for it being mandatory). Perhaps there could be a way in which the captain has to select a console slot on their ship for the cloaking device at Romulan head quarters. That slot then becomes permanently occupied by the cloaking device until the captain returns to the outfitter to reassign a different console position (in this way we can choose where we want to be shot :cool:).
Being able to battle cloak on something as large as the Mogai is extremely awesome. Hopefully I'll be able to test more this weekend as I can't wait to get a D'deridex
Just my two cents.
I am curious as to how exactly this "reduction of boff seating" would work... I doubt they would make it fully universal like on the bop as people would throw a fit... of joy or rage, depending on which side you're on. I think it would be interesting to have a carrier 4 boff or even a 3boff setup. Like on the D'deridex, if it was commander eng, lt.com tac, lt.com sci... that could actually be workable. Yes, you'd have access to some higher abilities in tac and sci, but two less bridge officer skills and two less bridge officer trait passives. But if they went that route, I think the power level penalties would be overkill.
Perhaps -5 to all subsystems (which if you consider the D'deridex a cruiser, would be the equivalent of "no +5 to all subsystems" rather than "-5 all subsystems." And then use a carrier type 4 boff layout with a lt.com tac, lt.com sci, commander engineer, and... lt eng? ensign eng? ensign universal?
Either way, it seems there's a real opportunity to create a real contrast between romulan ships and the other ships.
Though I am curious... what if the introduction of the romulans simply brought battle cloak to all ships that can cloak? Would we need a penalty to power or boffs if klingon ships that can cloak and the defiant and gal-x could battle cloak with their consoles?
Something else to consider is... why seemingly "nerf" the romulans with lower power? Why not give romulan ships the normal power mechanic that exists and then give +5 power to all subsystems for the klingon and federation ships to compensate?
First off you're assuming you're being attacked all the time. Even on the D'Deridex, if I'm not being shot, and my Battle Cloak is up, use it for the five second damage burst you get when you come out of it.
Secondly, even on my Oddy, there have been times where things just don't go right, and I want to shake agro off to the other cruiser in the group. Battle Cloak plus evasive manuevers and power to engines would at least gets me out of the immediate threat area.
The problem isn't the worthlessness of Battle Cloak, the problem is, you don't fully understand all its benefits.
Yup, because suddenly tripling your turn rate...who would want that? And then getting a 25% damage boost...there's no way anyone could find any use for that. /sarcasm
As for singularity powers, I've been watching what Plasma Shockwave can do, and so far, at lvl 25, my science officer under the right conditions can do over 67k damage with a top ranked plasma shockwave. Granted, that's 6.7k to 10 unshielded ships, but that's still a lot of damage for a skill that far too many people are ragging on as "useless".
Quantum Absorption I assume will rise with level so that it continues to provide a meaningful heal/defense at higher levels. Warp Shadows...I guess the shadows you leave behind will be tougher, so that could help, but effectively, it's as good as it gets. And we'll just have to wait and see on the remaining two singularity powers.
How 'bout you just go play a Federation or Klingon? You obviously love the existing gameplay, so hey just roll another one of the same, right?
EDIT: Disregard, I misread. Apologies, sorry, my bad.
That being said, still, no. Because the end result will be countless people just playing the exact same way they would play on their Fed or Klingon ship rather than adapting to the challenges and advantages of the Warbird.
No he has a point. I don't think he should use console powers, but we could use something on the same line where Singularity Engines have slots we can fill. The first comes free, but each slot filled gives us a -5 to either weapons, shields, engines, or aux, our choice depending on what slot we fill.
Means if I don't want to slot a Singularity power, I get power, but if I like one, I slot it into one of the slots, and that simply diverts power from something into powering up that power.
There has been a lot of this, eh?
Folks just wanting the Romulans to be...costumes for their current Fed/KDF toons. Racial costumes/ship costumes, etc, etc, etc.
Romulans are asking players to kick it up a notch, and I think that's great. Cryptic just needs to tweak the subsystem power loss thing.
People say that about MMOs all the time and I've never met an MMO that got better at level cap.
Now we know that's not going to happen. They didn't spend all this time designing these powers, creating the visuals for them, programing them in, creating the UI assets for them and special singularity cores separate and apart from warp cores just to chuck it all out.
I've had a blast with the singularity powers. I don't know if they're balanced - the content I play most of the time (especially with a low-level character) doesn't demand exceptional min-maxing - but I'd be sad to see it go.
In most mmo's, one is no where near their potential until end game. One typically has access to fewer abilities, "meh" equips/items, all the "goods" character building wise are at the end. But yes, most of the content is in the lower levels. This is why I prefer leveling up without the content and then playing through the content once I get to end game. For me it's much more fun to play through the star trek missions in a ship I want (which are typically end-game) with all my abilities than to play through with a gimpy ship with crappy weapons, and an idiot crew that can't perform half of the functions on a star ship.
My bad, I misread; edited my original reply to a more appropriate answer (and an apology, of course.)
Probably not, but if they really want our feedback, I think it's good to communicate that some of us think that all their hard work has been a huge waste of time. No one was really clamoring for the singularity mechanic anyway.
Personally, I'd be fine with giving up an ensign slot if the singularity cooldown was between thirty seconds to a minute. Most people complain about the ensign slot anyway, but make the power roughly equivalent. Decent but not extraordinary and something you can activate at least once a minute. It would at least give us an opportunity for some new powers. But I'd rather not be gimped with my power levels or console, because that would affect us the entire time while we're in combat.
Some people think having to level is a huge waste of time.
Some people think that Cruisers are a huge waste of time.
Some people think costumes are a huge waste of time.
Different people consider all sorts of different things to be a waste of time.
The Singularity Mechanics (and their balancing factors) add an additional level of complexity to the game. They require additional thought from the player in regard to how they're going to fly these ships. Some people think additional complexity and thought is a huge waste of time...
Yes, but the way I presented it, it allows customization. Personally I like the singularity powers, others don't. This was it allows players to customize their play, much like BOff powers and consoles do now, in just one more way.
Will alot of people just go and play them the way the Feds and KDF do, yes they will. But if people want to play uncreative cookie-cutter builds, who are we to say that's not fun for them? It's not me, I couldn't care less about the Power-of-the-month club, but many do, and they're game play is just as right and fun as yours and mine.
If somebody likes flying an Escort, just because they happen to hop in a Cruiser - should they be able to fly that Cruiser like an Escort?
This isn't taking anything away from anybody...they haven't flown it yet. If they don't like how it flies, they don't have to fly it. Heck, they can still run a Romulan if they want - T1-4 they can fly non-Rom ships. At T5, they can run any of the non-faction Lockbox ships out there as well.
But much like the guy going from an Escort to a Cruiser is going to have to adapt...if folks want to fly a Warbird, they're going to need to adapt.
THe singularity powers are similar in this regard.
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I don't like the idea of removing console slots and BOFF seating at all. Definitely not with the current (lack of) strenght on the powers and the long cooldown they have. I do profer having -5 power to each subsystem rather than -10, but before ANY blanacing is decided on, we need the rest of the levels unlocked so we can test everything at end game. We are missing 2 abilities to test, and end game is where most of the game is and where balance is more critical.
I see your point, I just doubt they are willing to lay their efforts to waste by scrapping the endeavor entirely. I think what is more productive is for us to figure out a palatable way for these mechanics to be implemented without leaving a bad taste in our mouths. Personally, I think the best way to do that, is instead of a perceived "gimping" of romulan ships with lower power levels than we are used to, let them use the normal power mechanic and give warp core vessels an additional +5 to all subsystems instead. That, and/or, remove the power drain mechanic from energy weapon fire.
The way things stand now, to do decent damage to anything with shields, one needs to put high energy into weapons, and not only high energy, but above and beyond what they are actually aiming for, because if you aim for 100 power, you're going to dip to 80 once you fire your weapons, so if you want 125, you have to put in 145+
I think even such a big drop in power as 10 per subsystem would be easier to swallow if that maximum 90 you can put into weapons actually gave you what the tool tip said you would get for investing that much power.
Other systems don't work that way. When you set your shields to 125 power and get 1000 regeneration every 6 seconds, that regeneration doesn't drop off because someone's shooting at you.
"Hey, computer, you said if I put 100 power to weapons, I would get 1000 dps from each of my weapons, but when I fire them, I'm doing 600dps, what's up with that?"
Computer: "Oh, I didn't realize you intended to fire your weapons more than one at a time, if you fire more than one, the damage output will drop."
"Well then, please calculate my dps assuming I will fire more than one and give me that readout then."
Computer: "That would be quite complicated and depend on which firing arc an enemy is in, so sorry, no."
Now imagine if we applied that elsewhere.
"Computer, we have put 100 power to shields and have a regeneration level of 1000 every six seconds, but when we come under fire, the regeneration rate drops, why?"
Computer: "Oh, I"m sorry, I didn't realize you were going to enter combat with your shields, if you enter combat, the regeneration rate drops."
"....why???"
Computer: "Because."
"Because???"
Computer: "Because I said so, and if you say one more thing about it, I"m confining you to your quarters and disabling the replicator."
I dunno about the rest of you, but I like the numbers I see to be the numbers I get. Yes, removing the drain mechanic would pretty much make engineering captain's nadeon inversion go from pretty much useless to entirely useless, but we can give them something else, I'm sure they won't mind.
In no other subsystem is putting more than 125 power deemed necessary, or even useful, I don't see why that should be the case with weapons.
Combination of other available gear, the various Captain abilities, the additional traits, etc, etc, etc...yeah, it's very difficult to say how anything may work other than through speculation. Even though we can formulate what the loss might be - are we taking everything else into consideration. Yes, the definitive testing will come later...
If I get higher power levels and keep my consoles feel free to take my ensign slots...heck even a Lt. slot if you "MUST". Console powers are as good or better than many of the Lt. an Ens. powers anyway...
Good job proving you don't know anything about the game, a simple transfert shield strength 1 heal a LOT more shield point than quantum shield, have about half the cooldown and provide a good bit of shield damage resistance on top of it all. And that's just an ensign power.
As if that wasn't enough , you'd actually be willing to sacrifice a lt slot for that piece of **** of a console "power", assuming you can call smething that pityfully weak a power.
Oh my god, seriouslyhow is it possible to be that clueless? transfert shield strenght 2 effective healing per minute is at minimum 4 times stronger than quantum shield, and that's talking at medium aux power
What kind of sad dimwit would ever willingly make that trade?
So instead of doing what you described... scrap the singularity system entirely. Or make the powers worth having (without gimping the ship in any other way). Or (and heres the option that I prefer the most) allow us to opt out and not have any of the TRIBBLE powers and have our ships not constantly debuffed in regards to subsystem power levels.
You have got to be kidding me if you think that a situational power (which may not be useful by the time its even charged) is worth a constant debuff to your ship.
And you have to be kidding me if you think the minute bonuses that the Romulan battle cloak provides is worth any sort of debuff ever.
Honestly... the singularity power system/romulan battle cloak debuffing our ships is a deal breaker as far as playing the romulan faction... (that in the stupid tutorial with so many unskippable boring story cutscenes.)
However I strongly advise against removing Boff seats or console slots. Especially the latter would have a huge impact, even more so than removing a rear weapon slot. I would even prefer to keep the -10 to all subsystems instead.
Completely agree. I could say more on the topic (and I have in other posts) but that pretty much sums it up.
Liked the romulan introduction though, but I'm really struggling to see why I'd put my romulan in an actual romulan faction ship apart from "it looks cool I guess".
If the battle cloak is an issue just reduce shield / hull like the KHG ships have. Nerfing baseline power levels to any extent is NOT WORTH any trade off at all.
No. They are raider class ships. They have the hull they have because of their classification not their abilities.
They have the hull they have to balance them in regard to escorts, not because of some sort of classification (which doesn't even exist in canon anyway).
It's difficult to say that bops suffer some sort of penalty for their battle cloak as there is really nothing to compare them against. There is no "non battlecloak bop" that shows what the bop's stats would be if it did not have a battle cloak. Raptors are more closely compared to a federation escort than to a bop, and the federation has no bop, unless you look at the aquarius, but that ship seems to simply have the hull of a bop, 5% lower shields and one less aft weapon slot than an escort, and all in exchange for a universal lt and a universal ensign seat. I have no idea what the point of that ship is, it gives up a whole lot for a whole lot of not much.
For a fairer comparison of the penalty of a battle cloak, we should look at the peghqu' vs the chimera. Yes they are both "super rare" or whatever as lifer rewards or veteran reward or whatever, however, they are a clear contrast between two equivalent ships, one with a battle cloak, one without.
The difference between the battle cloaking peghqu' and the chimera in exchange for its battle cloak is: approximately 8% lower shields.
So for a warbird, should it not have 8% lower shields or 8%% lower hull or the equivalent there of in exchange for a battle cloak?
Now, if I'm not mistaken, the D'derdex is a "captain" level ship and thus flies alongside the galaxy and vorcha. The vorcha and the galaxy are nearly identical except the vorcha has 500 more crew... i'm not sure if that's supposed to be a bonus or a penalty given current crew death/injury mechanics, and has approximately 8% less hull than the galaxy in exchange for 167% of the turn rate, plus it can normal cloak. If the devs go forward with giving the D'deridex a 5.5 turn rate, that would be approximately 8% lower turn rate than a galaxy. So if we give the D'derdex 8% lower hull than a galaxy, and 8% lower turn rate than the galaxy (45% lower turn rate than the vorcha), that should more than make up for the occasional special abilities it gains from singularity core and a battle cloak, no?
So lets just do that with all the romulan ships. 8% lower hull and 8% lower turn rate than their compatriots in exchange for their occasional core abilities and battle cloaks. Tada. No boff penatlies needed, no power penalties needed.