The Enterprise C was destroyed defending a Klingon colony from Romulans, and this honorable act led to peace between the Klingon Empire and the Federation, the key reason why they never went into a war that would weaken both and allow the Tholians to take over.
Every non-Tholian faction has good reason to revert that timeline to the current one.
Ya, I just read the synopsis so it makes even less sense to send a KDF toon to rescue the Ent-C that was snatched by the Tholians before it was destroyed defending the klingon base, averting the war the federation was going to lose.
:eek:
Ya, I just read the synopsis so it makes even less sense to send a KDF toon to rescue the Ent-C that was snatched by the Tholians before it was destroyed defending the klingon base, averting the war the federation was going to lose.
:eek:
For what it's worth, the rest of the NPCs in the Temporal Ambassador mission explain that after the Klingon empire conquered the Federation, the Bajorans discovered the wormhole. Which then led to the Dominion coming through and conquering the Alpha quadrant including the Klingon Empire. The little region the FE takes place in is just the space the Tholians negotiated for after the dust settled, while the Dominion ran the Alpha Quadrant. Possibly in exchange for reversed engineered tech.
Member since November 2009... I think. (UFP) Ragnar
For what it's worth, the rest of the NPCs in the Temporal Ambassador mission explain that after the Klingon empire conquered the Federation, the Bajorans discovered the wormhole. Which then led to the Dominion coming through and conquering the Alpha quadrant including the Klingon Empire. The little region the FE takes place in is just the space the Tholians negotiated for after the dust settled, while the Dominion ran the Alpha Quadrant. Possibly in exchange for reversed engineered tech.
So did the Temporal cops separate themselves from the prime universe before those events ? Because those events didn't take place yet in 2409, how did those NPC's know of them since the NPC's were also from 2409, and since the Temporal cops sent the PC's back to their own time were they themselves guilty of altering the timeline, and possibly changing the Dominions already past events ?
Don't put too much thought into the mission. The writers of Temporal Ambassador didn't. As for the KDF we've already been kicking around the idea of in game protests, and contacting the gaming media voicing our displeasure. Some wanted to wait till the release of S8 before doing anything which is what i'm doing. I'm giving them one last chance to make it right.
So did the Temporal cops separate themselves from the prime universe before those events ?
Ships like the Wells from the Temporal Integrity Commission in the 29th Century are protected from changes in the timeline, so they know of the original timeline. Obviously the timeline they protect is the one where they exist.
So did the Temporal cops separate themselves from the prime universe before those events ? Because those events didn't take place yet in 2409, how did those NPC's know of them since the NPC's were also from 2409, and since the Temporal cops sent the PC's back to their own time were they themselves guilty of altering the timeline, and possibly changing the Dominions already past events ?
Supposedly, for the FE, the events of "Yesterday's Enterprise" propelled them forward in time to 2409 instead of backwards to Narenda III. All the events in the Deep Space Nine TV series still happen (sans Federation), except the Dominion won. Which, since DS9 happen in from 2369 to 2375 is history for the NPCs who live now in 2409.
Might be a bit too late by now, but major spoilers ahead.
In the mission, you are scanning anomalies in the Nebula but the one you can get close enough to scan is one with an Ambassador-class ship sticking out of it...
... so you evidently drawn the ENT-C to the year 2409 instead of Narenda III by getting too close to the temporal anomaly.
The NPCs in the mission then just recite the "alternate history" as it had happen to them (resistance fighters when the Klingons took over, then the Dominion came, slaves under one master and now a new master, etc).
This sets everything on course as in my previous post. So pretty much, the first problem of the Ent-C's displacement is further escalated because of our "accident". The Time Cops do arrive, however, to make sure the Ent-C is put back where it belongs and where you belong.
Member since November 2009... I think. (UFP) Ragnar
It's like regular soda vs. diet soda. Once you get used to diet soda, regular soda tastes funny. Having gotten used to the red, the blue seems awkward.
As one who just came back after a long break and has been grinding fleet stuff non-stop, if this season goes in a direction that I really care not to see... Am just gonna move on and spend my money elsewhere. No drama, no mess, no support.
"Dammit J'mpok! I'm a Warrior, not a Worrier!"
- KDF Ambassador Syon vocalizing her objection to the discussions of possible peace talks with the UFP due to recent Borg and Undine activities.Hegh'bat, Stardate 66588.8
I am looking forward May when we have a playable Romulan species as part of the Klingon faction :cool:
Yeah, a sub-sub faction.
That would be some evil yet epic trolling on cryptic's part if they did that. Hehe.
Make it... so-so.
"Dammit J'mpok! I'm a Warrior, not a Worrier!"
- KDF Ambassador Syon vocalizing her objection to the discussions of possible peace talks with the UFP due to recent Borg and Undine activities.Hegh'bat, Stardate 66588.8
The big problem is Cryptic didn't know what big IP they bought when they took pver STO in the first place. The end result we are playing today. Cryptic was and will never be the right company for a Star Trek MMO. It would have been better if CBS would have approached one big company with decent ressources.
Cryptics hope was to make a decent Fed experience and add the KDF with the failed 45th day patch. That promise was never fullfilled, every time they had one excuse or another.
Riigggghttttt!!! Because they've done a bang up job of representing the federation so fracking well.
I dont buy that "It should have a fed world only" TRIBBLE. Klingons have been a vibrant fanbase in the IP for decades and the KDF where mentioned on stage by the owner of Cryptics in 2008.
The KDF may have been half-assed badly for reasons both legit and s**t but they are never been just the fluke you making them out to be.
Thats an injustice.
That would be like someone saying the IP exists today becuase in the 60's a bunch of semi-hippieish, socially wierd geeks whined to CBS or who ever until they got thier way and never stopped since instead of fanbase that strove hard for something they wanted because of an idea they loved.
So how are we Klingons fans so vastly different again? How are we less important again for pushing for what we love ?
Yeah, I dont buy the KDF is a fluke TRIBBLE.
One thing I do agree with is that they certainly could have done the KDF better.
The only problem was they did a couple of things that in hindsight they shouldnt have done.
First, It was allowing the existence of a versus faction, this have pretty much all been abandoned by MMO since its doubling their work effort for no real tangible reward, might work on PvP oriented games but on PvE its pretty what I said, double the work.
Second, it was picking the Klingon faction that does not really make much sense besides the fact it was the most popular choice at the time, basically you people walked in by yourselves and now are complaining the house does not have a roof.
Star Trek always been about the Federation, never about the Klingons or the Romulans ... something some people stubborn continue to claim, it was the voyages of the Starship Enterprise, the voyagers of Yovager and the genocidal adventures of Janeway and also the occasional voyages of the Starship Defiant, when Runabouts were not available (shields not included) ... and some Quantum Leap crossover? Not of Captain Kark of the Battlecruiser n'TrPrse or Centurion K'rk of the Warbird Ent'rpris
The model they picked was wrong, better had dropped the whole "versus" before going Live but that is water under the bridge, I do say this ... few other companies would make such a mistake and STO apparently is trying to move towards unifying content since that is the best they can do and it would be what everyone else would be doing as well.
Your dreams of Klingons:Online are just that, dreams.
Also for the record, I am not trying to be mean ... what I do want is proper Klingon experience and that means NO GORN ON MY B'REL! as some of you are diluting the Klingon Empire with things that in my opinion do not belong there, as much damage Cryptic have done it would not nearly enough of the damage some of you would inflict as the entire thing would became "Birds-of-Prey:Online", Featuring General T'ts, the Orion female .... slave dancer.
...I don't think you got the point: we want more for the KDF if possible, not for STO to be centered around it :rolleyes:
That's just plain unrealistic
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
I never said they were a fluke, I say the current state of the KDF is a fluke and you keep trying to add more, including races that as far we know are either members of the Federation or live within the Federation sectors.
You're trying to confuse the issue. First you argue that the Klingons never should have been a faction in STO and that Star Trek was never about Klingons anyway, now you're arguing the Klingon Empire should not include other races. Something no-one in this thread has disagreed with or even brought up.
I rarely play my Klingon characters (for a variety of reasons), but I still feel a Star Trek MMO would not be complete without a Klingon faction. Of all the races in Trek (other than humans) Klingons are the most fleshed out and bring a uniqueness to the table that can only be experienced by having them be faction seperate from the Federation. While imo the inclusion of other races in the KDF somewhat dillutes that uniqueness, it's not the biggest mistake Cryptic has made regarding the Klingon faction.
1. No one but they know exactly how the Romulans will be implemented.
For all we know the Rommies could be a race unlock + exclusive missions and new ships added to both existing factions. My prediction was you'd found a romulan character that starts at a similar (or likely higher) level to current Klink toons and complete a set of storyline missions that, by the end, see you join the endgame as either Fed or KDF.
If this is what happens, then technically Dstahl didn't lie about "new factions" being added to the game before they fix KDF (whatever that means).
2. Would handing STO to a big company have been any better? This is just my impression, but Star Trek doesn't have nearly the brand power to sustain a major, triple-A MMO. Hell, Star Wars, which I figure has orders of magnitude more brand power, couldn't sustain itself as a triple-A subscription-exclusive MMO.
And what design form would a theoretical triple-A STO take? Pretty much every "big company" MMO was a WoW derivative with emphasis on ground combat. IMO for all its unbalanced emphasis on combat, I find the basic structure of STO, especially now that the "Patrol" missions have been de-emphasized in favor of story missions, is a lot like what I want out of a "Trek" RPG. It's very episodic. One mission you're doing this, another you're doing that, with self-contained plots operating beneath an overarching narrative.
In conclusion, I'm going to keep the faith until they do a more substantial unveil. All things considered, I'll probably keep the faith even after, because so far I like STO and most of what Cryptic's done, considering the circumstances and limitations in mind. STO isn't perfect, but it's good enough for me.
The only problem was they did a couple of things that in hindsight they shouldnt have done.
[snap]
Also for the record, I am not trying to be mean ... what I do want is proper Klingon experience and that means NO GORN ON MY B'REL! as some of you are diluting the Klingon Empire with things that in my opinion do not belong there, as much damage Cryptic have done it would not nearly enough of the damage some of you would inflict as the entire thing would became "Birds-of-Prey:Online", Featuring General T'ts, the Orion female .... slave dancer.
??? :eek: *facepalm*
1. When I walked in, the door was open and there was a KDF faction. 2. The shows were about the Federation's perception of things, but that is by no means a valid argument for making a MMO one-centered. Every half-decent MMO has at least two factions. What you're saying is allowing the devs. to get lazy on us by bothering themselves with only one faction. 3. The shows had financial restrictions and tight budget many times. That's one of the reasons most of the crewmembers we see are human. That's also the reason that most of the alien species are humanoid. It was the sixties. Surely you don't think that from all the worlds of the Federation humans are most numerous and only they serve Starfleet. By the logic of what you mentioned, we should restrict the numbers of players that can use Andorian, Vulcan or Caitian in STO because especially these 3 races in game have around the same population of players with human, and in no ST show have we ever seen a fully alien bridge that has no human serving on it. 4. I don't dream of "Klingons:Online", nor does any of the Klingon fans I had the opportunity to speak with on these forums. We just wish we had a proper faction, nothing more, nothing less. 5. Sooo, Federation captains can break the "prime directive" whenever they feel it's right, but the Klingon Empire can't adapt and join forces with warlike species that share their discontent with the Federation? With the rate the Federation is expanding, the Klingon Empire had to adapt or be ovverrun. Honestly, people should really stop seeing the Klingons like mindless brutes that don't know anything but holding a bathleth. There is much more to their culture.
I have a KDF character, Klingon since its the only race the KDF actually have, everyone acts like a Klingon regardless of their actual species and this annoys the TRIBBLE out of me.
[snap]
And this is the difference of what I want (The Klingon Empire) and what some of you want (A version of the Federation), also for the record I dont like when my Vulcan BO act emotional either but a lot of things get a easier pass in the Federation due to its structure, now the KDF ... I dont think we ever seen a non-Klingon Captain or heck a non-Klingon Officer serving about a Klingon ship.
6. Klingons were once fast friends with the Romulans. Now they just want to kill each other even faster. The relations between the Fed. and KDF have always been hot/cold, so why is it weird if now it's cold and they are at conflict once more? 7. Noone is asking for more KDF species, we're asking for more genuine content that is not a Fed. digest. 8. True Way in KDF = you should know by now that some people in the forums just need to be ignored. 9. Why you go on insulting the Ferasan? They are actually Kzinti, a race that is Star Trek cannon, but do not have their name because Cryptic couldn't handle buying the copyrights to call them what they are. They don't deserve this namecalling due to your lack of information on the subject. 10. Orions are not "servant" race to the KDF. They are allied now. The Orions were looking for a new homeworld and a new allience to protect their assets from the Federation. They approached the Breen and the Klingon Epire. I guess J'mpok is a better negotiator than the Breen. They are not slaves, they are allies. 11. The Nausicaans were an advanced spacefaring race more than 1000 years ago, back when humanity was still in diapers. They were struck by a genetic virus that destroyed their civilization and the sole survivors were prisoners and criminals that were used as guinea pigs to test different cures for the disease. That's how most of them ended as pirates. Who's to say that there is no Nausicaan that has a sence of honor? Be objective, if mankind managed to create an utopia of Earth in a 1000 years, why wouldn't at least couple of Nausicaans develop sense of honor, especially now living amongst Klingons? 12. I'm giving you just one example, you can look up for the rest - Jadzia Dax was serving as a senior officer on a Klingon Bird of Prey. 13. Just how does an emotional Vulcan pass in the Federation because of it's structure? I don't get it. 14. I have a Klingon captain with only Klingon bridge crew. Nothing restricts me from doing this. Same goes for you if you don't like other than Klingon Boffs. But to say that it is not possible for Klingons to ally with anybody is a nonsence. What were they doing in DS9 with the Dominion threat? Weren't there Romulans as well, their arch enemy?
And now, feeling a bit exausted I'm going to bed. Thank you and good night! :P
First of all sorry, I'm gonna snap the quotes because if I leave them the post will be from here to Mt.Everest.
??? :eek: *facepalm*
1. When I walked in, the door was open and there was a KDF faction. 2. The shows were about the Federation's perception of things, but that is by no means a valid argument for making a MMO one-centered. Every half-decent MMO has at least two factions. What you're saying is allowing the devs. to get lazy on us by bothering themselves with only one faction. 3. The shows had financial restrictions and tight budget many times. That's one of the reasons most of the crewmembers we see are human. That's also the reason that most of the alien species are humanoid. It was the sixties. Surely you don't think that from all the worlds of the Federation humans are most numerous and only they serve Starfleet. By the logic of what you mentioned, we should restrict the numbers of players that can use Andorian, Vulcan or Caitian in STO because especially these 3 races in game have around the same population of players with human, and in no ST show have we ever seen a fully alien bridge that has no human serving on it. 4. I don't dream of "Klingons:Online", nor does any of the Klingon fans I had the opportunity to speak with on these forums. We just wish we had a proper faction, nothing more, nothing less. 5. Sooo, Federation captains can break the "prime directive" whenever they feel it's right, but the Klingon Empire can't adapt and join forces with warlike species that share their discontent with the Federation? With the rate the Federation is expanding, the Klingon Empire had to adapt or be ovverrun. Honestly, people should really stop seeing the Klingons like mindless brutes that don't know anything but holding a bathleth. There is much more to their culture.
6. Klingons were once fast friends with the Romulans. Now they just want to kill each other even faster. The relations between the Fed. and KDF have always been hot/cold, so why is it weird if now it's cold and they are at conflict once more? 7. Noone is asking for more KDF species, we're asking for more genuine content that is not a Fed. digest. 8. True Way in KDF = you should know by now that some people in the forums just need to be ignored. 9. Why you go on insulting the Ferasan? They are actually Kzinti, a race that is Star Trek cannon, but do not have their name because Cryptic couldn't handle buying the copyrights to call them what they are. They don't deserve this namecalling due to your lack of information on the subject. 10. Orions are not "servant" race to the KDF. They are allied now. The Orions were looking for a new homeworld and a new allience to protect their assets from the Federation. They approached the Breen and the Klingon Epire. I guess J'mpok is a better negotiator than the Breen. They are not slaves, they are allies. 11. The Nausicaans were an advanced spacefaring race more than 1000 years ago, back when humanity was still in diapers. They were struck by a genetic virus that destroyed their civilization and the sole survivors were prisoners and criminals that were used as guinea pigs to test different cures for the disease. That's how most of them ended as pirates. Who's to say that there is no Nausicaan that has a sence of honor? Be objective, if mankind managed to create an utopia of Earth in a 1000 years, why wouldn't at least couple of Nausicaans develop sense of honor, especially now living amongst Klingons? 12. I'm giving you just one example, you can look up for the rest - Jadzia Dax was serving as a senior officer on a Klingon Bird of Prey. 13. Just how does an emotional Vulcan pass in the Federation because of it's structure? I don't get it. 14. I have a Klingon captain with only Klingon bridge crew. Nothing restricts me from doing this. Same goes for you if you don't like other than Klingon Boffs. But to say that it is not possible for Klingons to ally with anybody is a nonsence. What were they doing in DS9 with the Dominion threat? Weren't there Romulans as well, their arch enemy?
And now, feeling a bit exausted I'm going to bed. Thank you and good night! :P
A valid argument indeed, I just wish people could see that Cryptic have made mistake after mistake, lied and cheated their way into popularity and nobody feels the need to hold them to account for their actions. Its almost false advertising and fraud really...
Klingons have been a vibrant fanbase in the IP for decades
Actually, Klingon fans tend to be a more dedicated minority. The majority of any fan base is more casual, and casual Star Trek fans don't care about the Klingons since the entire main franchise has been about the Federation.
I know the following have one faction: Vindictus, Ragnarok Online, Perfect World, Guild Wars, Lord of the Rings Online, Dungeons & Dragons Online, Champions Online, Maple Story, and (haha) Hellgate: London.
I am unsure but believe the following have one faction: Asheron's Call, Everquest, Ultima Online, Age of Conan, Final Fantasy XI, Lineage, Rift, *********, and Tabula Rasa.
City of Heroes really only had one faction, with a seperate related game that later merged with it. I believe EVE Online doesn't have game factions, but player-created ones.
Most MMOs have shared content, not faction separate ones like WoW. Even WoW ends up with shared content after a certain level. It doesn't make much sense for a company to double their workload by limiting content to half their player base.
A valid argument indeed, I just wish people could see that Cryptic have made mistake after mistake, lied and cheated their way into popularity and nobody feels the need to hold them to account for their actions. Its almost false advertising and fraud really...
Peregrine's history of the KDF exists because the folks who have played the faction and care about it and the game want to hold Cryptic accountable for their actions. They don't want people to forget. And they do feel it has been false advertising, borken promises, and a whole lot of mularkey for three straight years.
Everquest, Everquest 2, World of ********, Star Wars: The Old Republic. They all have multiple factions. EQ has three.
Dungeons & Dragons Online
DDO has good characters. And evil. Their alignment system, which is the grand daddy of factions, has multiple paths, so DDO does have a second faction. Unlock your dark elf, and run with it.
City of Heroes really only had one faction, with a seperate related game that later merged with it.
There was nothing "Later" about it. From the moment COV launched, you could fight heroes in PVP. Two factions, one game. And then ... and THEN ... COX went ROGUE!
Even WoW ends up with shared content after a certain level.
A lot of KDF players are fine with shared content at the end-game which has been in place since season 1. The Borg STFs really do require teaming up. It's the BORG for crying out loud. It's just the fact that so much is simply Fed made missions that the KDF can play (the anniversary mission is a good example). And really what the KDF has been asking for since day 1 is to fill out 1 to 50. So that when the KDF gets to the end-game and starts sharing goals with the other faction(s) ... Cause you know they've teased a third faction for almost three years too ... that they had a normal second faction levelling experience to get there in the first place.
They want their faction completed.
And anyone who wants to play a Romulan in this game should support that idea, else the Romulans get the same lackadasical half-done treatment the Klingons got.
It doesn't make much sense for a company to double their workload by limiting content to half their player base.
In the 36 months this game has been live if they had just added one small mission per month, or tweaked/changed a Fed mission to have a KDF equivalent, their work on the KDF would be complete. 36 more missions to fill in the blanks. That would have been enough to fill in the gaps. And this entire debate would have been dead.
It will be put up or shut up time for Cryptic when it comes to the Klingon Faction in May.
I've been here since open beta (no playable Klingon faction) and I've listened to all of the empty promises of what was to come for the Klingons for the last 3 years and I hope that Cryptic delivers this time.
It would be something to see a fleshed out KDF faction and a new Romulan Faction; however, if playable Romulans are coming, I fear that they may just be added to both factions.
The Reputation System has already laid the ground work for explaining why some Romulans would side with the KDF and others would choose to side with the Federation.
I hope that if we do get a Romulan faction that the faction is solely Romulan.
What a finished KDF faction means to me:
A full tutorial explaining STO from the Klingon perspective (Need)
The ability to level a New KDF Captain from 1 ? max (Need)
More True Science Ships (Need)
Featured Episodes that are built around KDF issues that the Federation can (assist) in (Want)
A Klingon House Reputation System that?s solely for Klingons (want)
The ability to oust J?mpok and appoint Worf has the new Chancellor by thrusting the power upon him
Actually, Klingon fans tend to be a more dedicated minority. The majority of any fan base is more casual, and casual Star Trek fans don't care about the Klingons since the entire main franchise has been about the Federation.
Small or not, the point is the Klingon have been vibrant and active as a fanbase that grew out of the IP.
Besides the feds what other fanbase from the IP has done as much growth, had as much public awareness out there or just plain done as much as reprisenetive as the Klingon fanbase?
Where are the Romulan charities? The Cardassian productions of Skaekespear? The andorians used TV commercials and the like?
So as fans, even if small, who else has brought such notice and publicity back to the IP?
TRIBBLE doughnuts man, most do not even know how the first Klingon fans came to be back in the first days of Star Trek going public.
We may be small but we are vibrant. Its a shame that Cryptic has not finished the MMO faction that has been the "frenemy" since the oldest days of the IP.
Honestly (IMO) I think the OP should give up and find another MMO that he would like to play as from his overall posting history he just dose't like STO or the development team behind it.
IMO - Problem is, I don't think there is an MMO development team that would be able to do STO in a manner he would enjoy - SOE has sucked as an MMO developer from day one (Even n the heyday of EQ; the playerbase attitude was EQ was successful in spite of SOE, not because of it); Blizzard would have zero interest. EA/BioWare took the Star Wars IP and made a bad WoW clone with space combat on rails; NCSoft doesn't want to back/use Western developers beyond porting/translating Korean MMOs -- and the original holder of the STO IP was given 4 years by CBS to create something at at the end of that 4 year period, had a few concept screenshots (all made with photoshop); some hi rez interior model renders done with off the shelf 3D software (that they admitted could be used for an MMO and wouldn't render like the model on your average end user PC) -- and it's why Cryptic took the license, and CBS set a hard launch date (since they didn't want a repeat of the Perpetual situation.)
It's okay to move on from an MMO you don't like (even if you like the IP source material); and find something yo0u enjoy playing in your spare time.
I's say atm - CBS is very happy with the situation as:
- The game continues to attract players to return (as evidenced by the large login queues from 1/31/13 that lasted into the weekend ant peak times.
- CBS has a game that keeps the original version IP alive in some fashion, and helps them promote teh Blu-Ray remaster release of TNG, the release of Enterprise on native Blu-Ray, and alsoo allows them to make cash from Paramount in cross prompoting the new Star Trek film series.
Cryptic is also happy as:
- The game (by Cryptic's own public estimate) cost about $20-$25 million to make; and I think it's at the point where they've recouped those initial costs, and the game is now paying for itself and generating a decent profit.
- They survived a sell of buy Atari and got a large developer/publisher to better support the game in terms of server capacity and staffing levels -- and PWE seems happy too as STO is often their top Western MMO (unless you believe someone's lying.)
So, sorry, but I don't see PWE closing/selling off Cryptic, or CBS ending what to date for them has been a profitable, and generally well received venture; to instead sell the IP to another developer (with all the extra cost, legal and otherwise that entail's) somehow hoping for an even more profitable result.
Remember, in the end, Star Trek really ISN'T a philosophy (as much as some might like to believe) -- it's entertainment, and a business (and one GR made a very good living off of and if you read about the man -- and not the myth surrounding him -- it was all about the business. He was angry about the fact that he SOLD TOS 100% lock stock and barrel to Paramount at the end of its run, as he never thought it would do well in syndication; and Paramount took it, marketed it, and managed to find an audience willing to spend a lot of money on it. That's why, when they asked GR to be involved in TNG, he tried to make TNG as different in tone as possible to TOS, as he didn't consider TOS his as he could gt a cut from what Paramount had done with it alone.)
As long as it's profitable in it's current form; and/or CBS continues to see the value in it as a marketing tool for future Star Trek related media ventures; they'll happily keep STO going with Cryptic at the helm.
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
Peregrine's history of the KDF exists because the folks who have played the faction and care about it and the game want to hold Cryptic accountable for their actions. They don't want people to forget. And they do feel it has been false advertising, borken promises, and a whole lot of mularkey for three straight years.
Personally, I feel it's all because most people mistook 'We'd LIKE to get this done by then' wording for actual promises... imo, business always have changing schedules and such, so it's not surprising when things change and/or fall through.
But no, many treated Cryptic's words like they're contracts written in blood... and some still do even though they're not sharing as much :rolleyes: I never understood how others see things like that...
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
I am waiting for May's update to see if Cryptic has completely screwed over the KDF faction. If they introduce a new playable faction and KDFs aren't at the level that Feds were at launch, then they have screwed up. It is possible to have two well designed factions in one major update, but considering their past, then it is not surprising that most people doubt that they can do it. Cryptic had a really short development time which initially screwed up the KDF faction. They should have just done the Federation faction, then introduce the KDF faction later instead of releasing the KDF faction as a PvP faction. Then there was the problem of Atari TRIBBLE over Cryptic since they obviously wanted to just sell Cryptic and not provide a decent budget. Even after PWE took over and hired a bunch of people, it takes time for employees to be properly trained and develop content. Hopefully, STO is done with all the idiocy that has hindered the development of this game.
Here is how I see it...
During the first six months of my "STO" experience, Cryptic kept saying they were: (1) developing new featured episodes, (2) pushing to restore the first 25 levels of KDF, (3) adding content for casual players, and (4) adding new 'overall' content for KDF. (Jan 2012-June 2012)
After my first six months of experience, Cryptic did a complete one-hundred eighty degree turn on all four issues. According to the folks in charge, KDF doesn't make enough money. Instead of creating new featured episodes, Cryptic decided to abandon them for the 'Foundry Spotlight'. (June 2012-December 2012)
Approximately three days ago, I decided to seek out another game. Even though its F2P elements are slightly restricted, compared to "STO's", I am having a one hell of a great time. Since Cryptic didn't want to deliver a variety of factions, new clothing styles, new main quests, new c-store items (outside of duty officers and cruiser ships), and less grinding, I decided that I had to find my thrill somewhere else.
...and, I did.
Even though I have decided to play another game, I will come back to see what Cryptic has done for season eight. If they do not finally deliver the goods, while keeping the costs down, I may decide its time to move onward.
As far as I am concerned, "Star Trek: Online" is a great game overall. When it comes to delivering new content, the only thing we will get is grinding, grinding, grinding, grinding, grinding, grinding, grinding, etc...
Cryptic will never-ever flesh out the KDF faction, nor will they reduce the insane grinding caused by the reputation system, fleet bases, and embassies combined.
When it comes to the Romulan faction, I personally do not think Cryptic is going to come through. Instead of getting a full Romulan faction, I bet we are only going to get a 'playable character'. We will get something similar to the Caitian, Trill, and Ferasan. Its not going to be a completely new faction. Its going to be a 'playable character'.
I bet you a lot of money that players have hyped season eight into something it is not.
Unless someone comes down from the heavens, the only thing Cryptic will do is add to the grindfest.
I love Cryptic. I really do.
I just do not think they know the definition of fun.
Cryptic's version of fun is insane grinding, and I do not think that will ever change.
i had a long TRIBBLE rant posted. re-read it and was like "lol, this community isn't worth saving. a bunch of ingrates wouldn't know a good mmo if it bit them in the rear."
i had a long TRIBBLE rant posted. re-read it and was like "lol, this community isn't worth saving. a bunch of ingrates wouldn't know a good mmo if it bit them in the rear."
LOL. I just managed to read it.
MMOs are pretty much TRIBBLE to what they were imo.
Glad, I managed to play the classics, pre-WoW. hehe.
"Dammit J'mpok! I'm a Warrior, not a Worrier!"
- KDF Ambassador Syon vocalizing her objection to the discussions of possible peace talks with the UFP due to recent Borg and Undine activities.Hegh'bat, Stardate 66588.8
i had a long TRIBBLE rant posted. re-read it and was like "lol, this community isn't worth saving. a bunch of ingrates wouldn't know a good mmo if it bit them in the rear."
Comments
Ya, I just read the synopsis so it makes even less sense to send a KDF toon to rescue the Ent-C that was snatched by the Tholians before it was destroyed defending the klingon base, averting the war the federation was going to lose.
:eek:
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
For what it's worth, the rest of the NPCs in the Temporal Ambassador mission explain that after the Klingon empire conquered the Federation, the Bajorans discovered the wormhole. Which then led to the Dominion coming through and conquering the Alpha quadrant including the Klingon Empire. The little region the FE takes place in is just the space the Tholians negotiated for after the dust settled, while the Dominion ran the Alpha Quadrant. Possibly in exchange for reversed engineered tech.
(UFP) Ragnar
So did the Temporal cops separate themselves from the prime universe before those events ? Because those events didn't take place yet in 2409, how did those NPC's know of them since the NPC's were also from 2409, and since the Temporal cops sent the PC's back to their own time were they themselves guilty of altering the timeline, and possibly changing the Dominions already past events ?
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
Ships like the Wells from the Temporal Integrity Commission in the 29th Century are protected from changes in the timeline, so they know of the original timeline. Obviously the timeline they protect is the one where they exist.
Supposedly, for the FE, the events of "Yesterday's Enterprise" propelled them forward in time to 2409 instead of backwards to Narenda III. All the events in the Deep Space Nine TV series still happen (sans Federation), except the Dominion won. Which, since DS9 happen in from 2369 to 2375 is history for the NPCs who live now in 2409.
Might be a bit too late by now, but major spoilers ahead.
In the mission, you are scanning anomalies in the Nebula but the one you can get close enough to scan is one with an Ambassador-class ship sticking out of it...
... so you evidently drawn the ENT-C to the year 2409 instead of Narenda III by getting too close to the temporal anomaly.
The NPCs in the mission then just recite the "alternate history" as it had happen to them (resistance fighters when the Klingons took over, then the Dominion came, slaves under one master and now a new master, etc).
This sets everything on course as in my previous post. So pretty much, the first problem of the Ent-C's displacement is further escalated because of our "accident". The Time Cops do arrive, however, to make sure the Ent-C is put back where it belongs and where you belong.
(UFP) Ragnar
8th time's the charm?
Like blue is intrinsically better by default?
I like the red. It reminds me of Terran blood. So colorful yet so tasty.
True.
Not for me.
As one who just came back after a long break and has been grinding fleet stuff non-stop, if this season goes in a direction that I really care not to see... Am just gonna move on and spend my money elsewhere. No drama, no mess, no support.
- KDF Ambassador Syon vocalizing her objection to the discussions of possible peace talks with the UFP due to recent Borg and Undine activities. Hegh'bat, Stardate 66588.8
Yeah, a sub-sub faction.
That would be some evil yet epic trolling on cryptic's part if they did that. Hehe.
Make it... so-so.
- KDF Ambassador Syon vocalizing her objection to the discussions of possible peace talks with the UFP due to recent Borg and Undine activities. Hegh'bat, Stardate 66588.8
The big problem is Cryptic...
As much as I look forward to a waking colon exam. The KDF need to be completed without a doubr but the RSE (imo) also deserves a faction.
R.I.P
I dont buy that "It should have a fed world only" TRIBBLE. Klingons have been a vibrant fanbase in the IP for decades and the KDF where mentioned on stage by the owner of Cryptics in 2008.
The KDF may have been half-assed badly for reasons both legit and s**t but they are never been just the fluke you making them out to be.
Thats an injustice.
That would be like someone saying the IP exists today becuase in the 60's a bunch of semi-hippieish, socially wierd geeks whined to CBS or who ever until they got thier way and never stopped since instead of fanbase that strove hard for something they wanted because of an idea they loved.
So how are we Klingons fans so vastly different again? How are we less important again for pushing for what we love ?
Yeah, I dont buy the KDF is a fluke TRIBBLE.
One thing I do agree with is that they certainly could have done the KDF better.
R.I.P
That's just plain unrealistic
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
I rarely play my Klingon characters (for a variety of reasons), but I still feel a Star Trek MMO would not be complete without a Klingon faction. Of all the races in Trek (other than humans) Klingons are the most fleshed out and bring a uniqueness to the table that can only be experienced by having them be faction seperate from the Federation. While imo the inclusion of other races in the KDF somewhat dillutes that uniqueness, it's not the biggest mistake Cryptic has made regarding the Klingon faction.
For all we know the Rommies could be a race unlock + exclusive missions and new ships added to both existing factions. My prediction was you'd found a romulan character that starts at a similar (or likely higher) level to current Klink toons and complete a set of storyline missions that, by the end, see you join the endgame as either Fed or KDF.
If this is what happens, then technically Dstahl didn't lie about "new factions" being added to the game before they fix KDF (whatever that means).
2. Would handing STO to a big company have been any better? This is just my impression, but Star Trek doesn't have nearly the brand power to sustain a major, triple-A MMO. Hell, Star Wars, which I figure has orders of magnitude more brand power, couldn't sustain itself as a triple-A subscription-exclusive MMO.
And what design form would a theoretical triple-A STO take? Pretty much every "big company" MMO was a WoW derivative with emphasis on ground combat. IMO for all its unbalanced emphasis on combat, I find the basic structure of STO, especially now that the "Patrol" missions have been de-emphasized in favor of story missions, is a lot like what I want out of a "Trek" RPG. It's very episodic. One mission you're doing this, another you're doing that, with self-contained plots operating beneath an overarching narrative.
In conclusion, I'm going to keep the faith until they do a more substantial unveil. All things considered, I'll probably keep the faith even after, because so far I like STO and most of what Cryptic's done, considering the circumstances and limitations in mind. STO isn't perfect, but it's good enough for me.
??? :eek: *facepalm*
1. When I walked in, the door was open and there was a KDF faction.
2. The shows were about the Federation's perception of things, but that is by no means a valid argument for making a MMO one-centered. Every half-decent MMO has at least two factions. What you're saying is allowing the devs. to get lazy on us by bothering themselves with only one faction.
3. The shows had financial restrictions and tight budget many times. That's one of the reasons most of the crewmembers we see are human. That's also the reason that most of the alien species are humanoid. It was the sixties. Surely you don't think that from all the worlds of the Federation humans are most numerous and only they serve Starfleet. By the logic of what you mentioned, we should restrict the numbers of players that can use Andorian, Vulcan or Caitian in STO because especially these 3 races in game have around the same population of players with human, and in no ST show have we ever seen a fully alien bridge that has no human serving on it.
4. I don't dream of "Klingons:Online", nor does any of the Klingon fans I had the opportunity to speak with on these forums. We just wish we had a proper faction, nothing more, nothing less.
5. Sooo, Federation captains can break the "prime directive" whenever they feel it's right, but the Klingon Empire can't adapt and join forces with warlike species that share their discontent with the Federation? With the rate the Federation is expanding, the Klingon Empire had to adapt or be ovverrun. Honestly, people should really stop seeing the Klingons like mindless brutes that don't know anything but holding a bathleth. There is much more to their culture.
6. Klingons were once fast friends with the Romulans. Now they just want to kill each other even faster. The relations between the Fed. and KDF have always been hot/cold, so why is it weird if now it's cold and they are at conflict once more?
7. Noone is asking for more KDF species, we're asking for more genuine content that is not a Fed. digest.
8. True Way in KDF = you should know by now that some people in the forums just need to be ignored.
9. Why you go on insulting the Ferasan? They are actually Kzinti, a race that is Star Trek cannon, but do not have their name because Cryptic couldn't handle buying the copyrights to call them what they are. They don't deserve this namecalling due to your lack of information on the subject.
10. Orions are not "servant" race to the KDF. They are allied now. The Orions were looking for a new homeworld and a new allience to protect their assets from the Federation. They approached the Breen and the Klingon Epire. I guess J'mpok is a better negotiator than the Breen. They are not slaves, they are allies.
11. The Nausicaans were an advanced spacefaring race more than 1000 years ago, back when humanity was still in diapers. They were struck by a genetic virus that destroyed their civilization and the sole survivors were prisoners and criminals that were used as guinea pigs to test different cures for the disease. That's how most of them ended as pirates. Who's to say that there is no Nausicaan that has a sence of honor? Be objective, if mankind managed to create an utopia of Earth in a 1000 years, why wouldn't at least couple of Nausicaans develop sense of honor, especially now living amongst Klingons?
12. I'm giving you just one example, you can look up for the rest - Jadzia Dax was serving as a senior officer on a Klingon Bird of Prey.
13. Just how does an emotional Vulcan pass in the Federation because of it's structure? I don't get it.
14. I have a Klingon captain with only Klingon bridge crew. Nothing restricts me from doing this. Same goes for you if you don't like other than Klingon Boffs. But to say that it is not possible for Klingons to ally with anybody is a nonsence. What were they doing in DS9 with the Dominion threat? Weren't there Romulans as well, their arch enemy?
And now, feeling a bit exausted I'm going to bed. Thank you and good night! :P
A valid argument indeed, I just wish people could see that Cryptic have made mistake after mistake, lied and cheated their way into popularity and nobody feels the need to hold them to account for their actions. Its almost false advertising and fraud really...
Define "half-decent".
I know the following have one faction: Vindictus, Ragnarok Online, Perfect World, Guild Wars, Lord of the Rings Online, Dungeons & Dragons Online, Champions Online, Maple Story, and (haha) Hellgate: London.
I am unsure but believe the following have one faction: Asheron's Call, Everquest, Ultima Online, Age of Conan, Final Fantasy XI, Lineage, Rift, *********, and Tabula Rasa.
City of Heroes really only had one faction, with a seperate related game that later merged with it. I believe EVE Online doesn't have game factions, but player-created ones.
Most MMOs have shared content, not faction separate ones like WoW. Even WoW ends up with shared content after a certain level. It doesn't make much sense for a company to double their workload by limiting content to half their player base.
Peregrine's history of the KDF exists because the folks who have played the faction and care about it and the game want to hold Cryptic accountable for their actions. They don't want people to forget. And they do feel it has been false advertising, borken promises, and a whole lot of mularkey for three straight years.
Everquest, Everquest 2, World of ********, Star Wars: The Old Republic. They all have multiple factions. EQ has three.
DDO has good characters. And evil. Their alignment system, which is the grand daddy of factions, has multiple paths, so DDO does have a second faction. Unlock your dark elf, and run with it.
There was nothing "Later" about it. From the moment COV launched, you could fight heroes in PVP. Two factions, one game. And then ... and THEN ... COX went ROGUE!
A lot of KDF players are fine with shared content at the end-game which has been in place since season 1. The Borg STFs really do require teaming up. It's the BORG for crying out loud. It's just the fact that so much is simply Fed made missions that the KDF can play (the anniversary mission is a good example). And really what the KDF has been asking for since day 1 is to fill out 1 to 50. So that when the KDF gets to the end-game and starts sharing goals with the other faction(s) ... Cause you know they've teased a third faction for almost three years too ... that they had a normal second faction levelling experience to get there in the first place.
They want their faction completed.
And anyone who wants to play a Romulan in this game should support that idea, else the Romulans get the same lackadasical half-done treatment the Klingons got.
In the 36 months this game has been live if they had just added one small mission per month, or tweaked/changed a Fed mission to have a KDF equivalent, their work on the KDF would be complete. 36 more missions to fill in the blanks. That would have been enough to fill in the gaps. And this entire debate would have been dead.
I've been here since open beta (no playable Klingon faction) and I've listened to all of the empty promises of what was to come for the Klingons for the last 3 years and I hope that Cryptic delivers this time.
It would be something to see a fleshed out KDF faction and a new Romulan Faction; however, if playable Romulans are coming, I fear that they may just be added to both factions.
The Reputation System has already laid the ground work for explaining why some Romulans would side with the KDF and others would choose to side with the Federation.
I hope that if we do get a Romulan faction that the faction is solely Romulan.
What a finished KDF faction means to me:
A full tutorial explaining STO from the Klingon perspective (Need)
The ability to level a New KDF Captain from 1 ? max (Need)
More True Science Ships (Need)
Featured Episodes that are built around KDF issues that the Federation can (assist) in (Want)
A Klingon House Reputation System that?s solely for Klingons (want)
The ability to oust J?mpok and appoint Worf has the new Chancellor by thrusting the power upon him
Worf has always been a traitor in my mind, and I will be first in line to remove him should he EVER become chancellor.
:cool:
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
Small or not, the point is the Klingon have been vibrant and active as a fanbase that grew out of the IP.
Besides the feds what other fanbase from the IP has done as much growth, had as much public awareness out there or just plain done as much as reprisenetive as the Klingon fanbase?
Where are the Romulan charities? The Cardassian productions of Skaekespear? The andorians used TV commercials and the like?
So as fans, even if small, who else has brought such notice and publicity back to the IP?
TRIBBLE doughnuts man, most do not even know how the first Klingon fans came to be back in the first days of Star Trek going public.
We may be small but we are vibrant. Its a shame that Cryptic has not finished the MMO faction that has been the "frenemy" since the oldest days of the IP.
R.I.P
IMO - Problem is, I don't think there is an MMO development team that would be able to do STO in a manner he would enjoy - SOE has sucked as an MMO developer from day one (Even n the heyday of EQ; the playerbase attitude was EQ was successful in spite of SOE, not because of it); Blizzard would have zero interest. EA/BioWare took the Star Wars IP and made a bad WoW clone with space combat on rails; NCSoft doesn't want to back/use Western developers beyond porting/translating Korean MMOs -- and the original holder of the STO IP was given 4 years by CBS to create something at at the end of that 4 year period, had a few concept screenshots (all made with photoshop); some hi rez interior model renders done with off the shelf 3D software (that they admitted could be used for an MMO and wouldn't render like the model on your average end user PC) -- and it's why Cryptic took the license, and CBS set a hard launch date (since they didn't want a repeat of the Perpetual situation.)
It's okay to move on from an MMO you don't like (even if you like the IP source material); and find something yo0u enjoy playing in your spare time.
I's say atm - CBS is very happy with the situation as:
- The game continues to attract players to return (as evidenced by the large login queues from 1/31/13 that lasted into the weekend ant peak times.
- CBS has a game that keeps the original version IP alive in some fashion, and helps them promote teh Blu-Ray remaster release of TNG, the release of Enterprise on native Blu-Ray, and alsoo allows them to make cash from Paramount in cross prompoting the new Star Trek film series.
Cryptic is also happy as:
- The game (by Cryptic's own public estimate) cost about $20-$25 million to make; and I think it's at the point where they've recouped those initial costs, and the game is now paying for itself and generating a decent profit.
- They survived a sell of buy Atari and got a large developer/publisher to better support the game in terms of server capacity and staffing levels -- and PWE seems happy too as STO is often their top Western MMO (unless you believe someone's lying.)
So, sorry, but I don't see PWE closing/selling off Cryptic, or CBS ending what to date for them has been a profitable, and generally well received venture; to instead sell the IP to another developer (with all the extra cost, legal and otherwise that entail's) somehow hoping for an even more profitable result.
Remember, in the end, Star Trek really ISN'T a philosophy (as much as some might like to believe) -- it's entertainment, and a business (and one GR made a very good living off of and if you read about the man -- and not the myth surrounding him -- it was all about the business. He was angry about the fact that he SOLD TOS 100% lock stock and barrel to Paramount at the end of its run, as he never thought it would do well in syndication; and Paramount took it, marketed it, and managed to find an audience willing to spend a lot of money on it. That's why, when they asked GR to be involved in TNG, he tried to make TNG as different in tone as possible to TOS, as he didn't consider TOS his as he could gt a cut from what Paramount had done with it alone.)
As long as it's profitable in it's current form; and/or CBS continues to see the value in it as a marketing tool for future Star Trek related media ventures; they'll happily keep STO going with Cryptic at the helm.
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
But no, many treated Cryptic's words like they're contracts written in blood... and some still do even though they're not sharing as much :rolleyes: I never understood how others see things like that...
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
During the first six months of my "STO" experience, Cryptic kept saying they were: (1) developing new featured episodes, (2) pushing to restore the first 25 levels of KDF, (3) adding content for casual players, and (4) adding new 'overall' content for KDF.
(Jan 2012-June 2012)
After my first six months of experience, Cryptic did a complete one-hundred eighty degree turn on all four issues. According to the folks in charge, KDF doesn't make enough money. Instead of creating new featured episodes, Cryptic decided to abandon them for the 'Foundry Spotlight'.
(June 2012-December 2012)
Approximately three days ago, I decided to seek out another game. Even though its F2P elements are slightly restricted, compared to "STO's", I am having a one hell of a great time. Since Cryptic didn't want to deliver a variety of factions, new clothing styles, new main quests, new c-store items (outside of duty officers and cruiser ships), and less grinding, I decided that I had to find my thrill somewhere else.
...and, I did.
Even though I have decided to play another game, I will come back to see what Cryptic has done for season eight. If they do not finally deliver the goods, while keeping the costs down, I may decide its time to move onward.
As far as I am concerned, "Star Trek: Online" is a great game overall. When it comes to delivering new content, the only thing we will get is grinding, grinding, grinding, grinding, grinding, grinding, grinding, etc...
Cryptic will never-ever flesh out the KDF faction, nor will they reduce the insane grinding caused by the reputation system, fleet bases, and embassies combined.
When it comes to the Romulan faction, I personally do not think Cryptic is going to come through. Instead of getting a full Romulan faction, I bet we are only going to get a 'playable character'. We will get something similar to the Caitian, Trill, and Ferasan. Its not going to be a completely new faction. Its going to be a 'playable character'.
I bet you a lot of money that players have hyped season eight into something it is not.
Unless someone comes down from the heavens, the only thing Cryptic will do is add to the grindfest.
I love Cryptic. I really do.
I just do not think they know the definition of fun.
Cryptic's version of fun is insane grinding, and I do not think that will ever change.
LOL. I just managed to read it.
MMOs are pretty much TRIBBLE to what they were imo.
Glad, I managed to play the classics, pre-WoW. hehe.
- KDF Ambassador Syon vocalizing her objection to the discussions of possible peace talks with the UFP due to recent Borg and Undine activities. Hegh'bat, Stardate 66588.8