And just sitting there with your ship on Auto attack is fun? You are grinding EC.... utilising an exploit to do so. These grinders are not fun, they didn't require you to do anything but make sure you have the target in your sights.
Don't blame the reputation system for this. Just doing the Tau Dewa Sector patrol daily provided enough EC for me to meet my daily EC reputation requirements for both Romulan and Omega reps. I am at Tier 5 in Romulan and Omega Rep. and have been for a month or so.
Just PLAY THE GAME, there is no need for anyone to resort to exploits for this game.
Do you know how many STF's you have to do to get even 1/5 of the amount that can be obtained by those what you are calling exploits (The mains are given by Cryptic, and therefore it CAN'T BE an exploit), if you get any descent loot in this game. Admit it, STO is one of the worse MMO's when it comes to descent loot. They have already killed the optionals, everything is "need or greed" and for sure not rewarding according level. Go on whining and spoil the 30 minutes fun of those that can't spend more time on STO. That you are sleeping and live in STO, ain't my problem. Go on, spoiling the least mindless fun of people with limited time. Be proud of it.
For clarity's sake I will provide the definition of Exploit.
An exploit is a flaw in the system which allows people to take advantage of the system in a way that was not intended.
The Voldemort exploits regarding shields that pretty much allowed people to double up their shields. It is the same sort of thing here. For whatever reason cryptic did not consider the effects that utilising the nebula effect combined with timid creatures might have. As cryptic are the programmers here they are the ones that get to decide whether this was an intended (or at least a non-harmful) out come and they have decided that it was.
As a result, they have changed the system to fix this flaw, just like they changed the system to fix the explosion exploit that was being used.
Do you know how many STF's you have to do to get even 1/5 of the amount that can be obtained by those what you are calling exploits (The mains are given by Cryptic, and therefore it CAN'T BE an exploit), if you get any descent loot in this game. Admit it, STO is one of the worse MMO's when it comes to descent loot. They have already killed the optionals, everything is "need or greed" and for sure not rewarding according level. Go on whining and spoil the 30 minutes fun of those that can't spend more time on STO. That you are sleeping and live in STO, ain't my problem. Go on, spoiling the least mindless fun of people with limited time. Be proud of it.
I'm willing to agree that STFs are pretty bad for loot drops. However STFs are not designed to give you loot. They are designed to give you the Omega marks/BNPs that are used as inputs into the Omega reputation.
So if STFs don't give you loot what does? Oh there are Fleet Actions... There is the romulan patrol daily that I mentioned earlier as well as some story missions which do provide rewards for a lot of EC plus whatever you get from foundry. I'd also like to point out that this system does not prevent you from getting the same amount of loot and EC that you would have otherwise gotten however it does make you actually work and play content other than STFs.
I once again re-iterate. Play this game. The STFs are only one element to this game. They may be your favourite element but there are still plenty of ways to get the EC you want without resorting to exploits. I've already mentioned the romulan space patrol daily, Feature episode missions that have space gear engines, shields and deflectors are usually worth 100,000EC each.
Foundry elitists/whiners sadly got what they wanted. :mad:
I think that this nerf won't magically make players play tl;dr missions.
Now I don't have a good source of ec.
Either imrove loot in foundry missions or make a filter for grinder missions and story missions and all players will be happy.
I hope that authors of those farmer missions will adapt their missions to this nerf.
Grinding: hated by some, loved by others. However, there is a flip side: with the introduction of both the Fleets and the rep system, fairly large infusions of resources are needed, such as Energy Credits for commodities, fleet marks and dilithium. While grinding is not necessarily such a good thing, it is a necessary thing in the current make-up of Star Trek online.
If you've removed the potential for 500k EC through Foundry missions... where are we supposed to get it from?
Please, let me know how I can continue to support my fleet and 6 (soon to be 9) toons worth of rep missions.
We've already established using the foundry as provided by Cryptic is not an exploit. Foundry missions, their creation, and replay have no relation with any design flaw of duty officers and that interaction with ship components and bridge officer skills. No amount of opposite spin you place on this will make the spin true. Cryptic made a development decision to fundamentally change a mechanic of their own design to avoid a walkout by their unpaid content editors. Plain and simple.
Jack Emmert: "Starfleet and Klingon. ... So two factions, full PvE content." Al Rivera hates Klingons Star Trek Online: Agents of Jack Emmert All cloaks should be canon.
Grinding: hated by some, loved by others. However, there is a flip side: with the introduction of both the Fleets and the rep system, fairly large infusions of resources are needed, such as Energy Credits for commodities, fleet marks and dilithium. While grinding is not necessarily such a good thing, it is a necessary thing in the current make-up of Star Trek online.
If you've removed the potential for 500k EC through Foundry missions... where are we supposed to get it from?
Please, let me know how I can continue to support my fleet and 6 (soon to be 9) toons worth of rep missions.
Tour the Galaxy. Drops from STFs. Foundry missions will still continue to drop loot, it's just you'll have to fight for it now.
Tour the Galaxy. Drops from STFs. Foundry missions will still continue to drop loot, it's just you'll have to fight for it now.
Tour the Galaxy, last time I checked, paid a few thousand EC. Drops from STFs are worth peanuts. The good, interesting missions don't drop nearly as much loot as a farming/grinding mission, and no matter how good I am, I can't fight 25 angry ships. Also, I work full time, so I don't have the time to do an hour-plus mission on 6-9 toons in addition to other things.
This is why some of us like the farming/grinding missions. It gave us a chance.
Which now appears to have been taken away from us. Thanks...
Foundry elitists/whiners sadly got what they wanted. :mad:
I think that this nerf won't magically make players play tl;dr missions.
Now I don't have a good source of ec.
Either imrove loot in foundry missions or make a filter for grinder missions and story missions and all players will be happy.
I hope that authors of those farmer missions will adapt their missions to this nerf.
Easy: Get a few people, 3 or 4 or 5, and play Nerandra, or other similar Tau Dewa missions. Lots of drops. You will have to play the game as intended, but making things go splodey is fun.
You can even make it easier by raising need/greed to very rare or higher, so you don't have to worry about who gets it, it's based on who it drops for, or round robin it.
You wont get dil directly, but you will also get rom marks for the daily.
Chewson Pwan - VA
S.S. Doff Lundgren
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Tour the Galaxy, last time I checked, paid a few thousand EC. Drops from STFs are worth peanuts. The good, interesting missions don't drop nearly as much loot as a farming/grinding mission, and no matter how good I am, I can't fight 25 angry ships. Also, I work full time, so I don't have the time to do an hour-plus mission on 6-9 toons in addition to other things.
This is why some of us like the farming/grinding missions. It gave us a chance.
Which now appears to have been taken away from us. Thanks...
You can get over 3 mil from proper planning with Tour The Galaxy.
I bought a tuffli and a Wells class using only the doff system (over 60 mil for each). Get strange alien artifacts, craft them, and get lucky and get a mk 12 purple anti proton array (for example) and you get 20-30 million.
Also get dil from doff mission, contraband, etc, and buy keys, sell keys on exchange. The dil/zen rate is well in favor for this.
I made 20 mil overnight buy buying 50 keys for 50 mil, then resold in packs of 10 for 14mil each. Bam, wells class.
It's not hard, and for me is fun.
Chewson Pwan - VA
S.S. Doff Lundgren
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Would it not be easier to just set "timid" creatures, not to drop loot? Or if they do, it's only consumables/lockbox type loot???
^^^
Probably the best solution - I'd say keep BOTH types of 'timid' behavior; but NPCs set to Timid - doesn't fight back regardless; drop loot like described above.
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
Due to Cryptic caveing to the crying of 2 or 3 Foundry authors, I will never play another foundry mission again.
If you only played the foundry to exploit it for drops, no one is going to miss you. As far as this change, the ability to gun down a group of innocent civilians in a KDF mission is now gone. Also, my mission for the Tholian Foundry Challenge was going to involve shooting ships docked in a shipyard. I guess now they'll shoot back, ruining what I had planned.
Beacuse of the attitude and Cryptic giving into their demands and ticking off 1000's of players just to make a few happy. I will never play another foundry mission again. And im going back to F2P
Im with a few others, Ive played foundry missions, but I also do a daily run of qwerks which is now impossible thanks to this change, so untill its fixed I will ignore all foundry content from here on out. I can get dilitium and EC other ways. So i will just ignore the foundry.
After todays update, i started playing easy money missions and all of the ships are firing back at the same time (not suppose to fire at all) and its impossible to complete the missions. It gets worse with respawning since it puts me right in the middle of the attackers. I certainly hope it gets fixed soon.
I would like to say that as a person who plays both the ginding/farmer missions and the more indepth story line missions, using the grinding missions to contribute dil to both a fed and kdf fleet and using the story based missions just for fun.
due to this change I am going to be forced to spend more time grinding which is needed for the fleets and less time for enjoyment, so I will now not get to play fun as much as i would like and therefore play less if any of the story based missions.
in the past few weeks I have enjoyed the medium between play both types of missions, but after tonight spending over an hour on 1 grinding mission and still not completeing it on normal level and having to give up. where as before the change I would have spent that same hour making enough of what i needed for the fleet and the rest of the time would have been my own to enjoy.
I'm sorry to say that through this both my fleets have suffered and more importantly so has my enjoyment of the game:mad:
Guys, consider there is a game economy that gets seriously broken when you get all the reward with no risk, and thats what these missions were. What sucks is not a great mechanic is broken because this is the way the problem was fixed.
And honestly, there is alot of stuff we have 'whined and moaned' about for years that is still very much not fixed, so I have to be lead to believe that someone ran the numbers on the backend and went 'this is not what we intended so we need to change it'
Foundry NPC Groups set to Timid creature will now fight back when they take damage.
Who was the genius who came up with this one? Does anyone know what is doing to those who play foundry missions? Well basically they have made the game "useless and senseless" to me. I understand about the 15 min limit to minimize exploits but now this...you have made a bunch of people angry since now we cannot do some of the games we use to love to get "good" rewards...If it aint broken why break it....what kind of business model do you guys run in here...you are alienating a bunch of people that will feel dissatified for what you fixed...now made "unplayable" for the rest of us. Happy annyversary and thanks for the present...hope you develop a better sense of what your players want rather than making their life more difficut and grinding until they suck the very last dollar out of us :eek:
I would like to say that as a person who plays both the ginding/farmer missions and the more indepth story line missions, using the grinding missions to contribute dil to both a fed and kdf fleet and using the story based missions just for fun.
due to this change I am going to be forced to spend more time grinding which is needed for the fleets and less time for enjoyment, so I will now not get to play fun as much as i would like and therefore play less if any of the story based missions.
in the past few weeks I have enjoyed the medium between play both types of missions, but after tonight spending over an hour on 1 grinding mission and still not completeing it on normal level and having to give up. where as before the change I would have spent that same hour making enough of what i needed for the fleet and the rest of the time would have been my own to enjoy.
I'm sorry to say that through this both my fleets have suffered and more importantly so has my enjoyment of the game:mad:
I'm in the same situation. Prior to today, I would play one "story" mission for each grinder I would do. Because of this now I won't have that luxury due to time constraints. Previously I could run the faster missions and then do a story one afterward fitting both in an hour of free time. But this change effectively guarantees that the only mission I'll play from here on out is Battleship Royal Rumble. The way this was executed left a really bad taste in my mouth. The bulk of what I do in this game now is grind, refine contraband, buy commodities, run doff missions, exchange dilithium, and play one or two stf's an hour. None of which feels anything like Star Trek to me anymore. The better foundry story missions did, but I can't justify the time now they require as well as I've got a starbase to feed. I can safely say I'll not play a spotlit mission under this current set up, even if I wanted to. Which means more dull grind without relent until I get tired of this game altogether.
I don't need the loot drops or dilithium. I'd be perfectly happy to see those go away, if that's the solution, anything set to timid doesn't drop loot. Give me 20 minutes of dull repetitive freighters to blow up with no drops for target practice and I'll be fine, and happy to do a story mission after that as soon as the cooldown comes off.
What i direly need is the fleet marks. The foundry right now is the most effective way to earn them. I think at this point then I can only resume playing the more story oriented missions if the fleet marks were doubled. I'm sorry, but that's just the way it works out now in terms of the time economy. As it is, the grind over the last two months is burning me out on this game, this has just annoyed me even more.
Comments
Do you know how many STF's you have to do to get even 1/5 of the amount that can be obtained by those what you are calling exploits (The mains are given by Cryptic, and therefore it CAN'T BE an exploit), if you get any descent loot in this game. Admit it, STO is one of the worse MMO's when it comes to descent loot. They have already killed the optionals, everything is "need or greed" and for sure not rewarding according level. Go on whining and spoil the 30 minutes fun of those that can't spend more time on STO. That you are sleeping and live in STO, ain't my problem. Go on, spoiling the least mindless fun of people with limited time. Be proud of it.
An exploit is a flaw in the system which allows people to take advantage of the system in a way that was not intended.
The Voldemort exploits regarding shields that pretty much allowed people to double up their shields. It is the same sort of thing here. For whatever reason cryptic did not consider the effects that utilising the nebula effect combined with timid creatures might have. As cryptic are the programmers here they are the ones that get to decide whether this was an intended (or at least a non-harmful) out come and they have decided that it was.
As a result, they have changed the system to fix this flaw, just like they changed the system to fix the explosion exploit that was being used.
I'm willing to agree that STFs are pretty bad for loot drops. However STFs are not designed to give you loot. They are designed to give you the Omega marks/BNPs that are used as inputs into the Omega reputation.
So if STFs don't give you loot what does? Oh there are Fleet Actions... There is the romulan patrol daily that I mentioned earlier as well as some story missions which do provide rewards for a lot of EC plus whatever you get from foundry. I'd also like to point out that this system does not prevent you from getting the same amount of loot and EC that you would have otherwise gotten however it does make you actually work and play content other than STFs.
I once again re-iterate. Play this game. The STFs are only one element to this game. They may be your favourite element but there are still plenty of ways to get the EC you want without resorting to exploits. I've already mentioned the romulan space patrol daily, Feature episode missions that have space gear engines, shields and deflectors are usually worth 100,000EC each.
Play the game, get the rewards.
I think that this nerf won't magically make players play tl;dr missions.
Now I don't have a good source of ec.
Either imrove loot in foundry missions or make a filter for grinder missions and story missions and all players will be happy.
I hope that authors of those farmer missions will adapt their missions to this nerf.
If you've removed the potential for 500k EC through Foundry missions... where are we supposed to get it from?
Please, let me know how I can continue to support my fleet and 6 (soon to be 9) toons worth of rep missions.
Al Rivera hates Klingons
Star Trek Online: Agents of Jack Emmert
All cloaks should be canon.
Tour the Galaxy. Drops from STFs. Foundry missions will still continue to drop loot, it's just you'll have to fight for it now.
ROLL TIDE ROLL
Tour the Galaxy, last time I checked, paid a few thousand EC. Drops from STFs are worth peanuts. The good, interesting missions don't drop nearly as much loot as a farming/grinding mission, and no matter how good I am, I can't fight 25 angry ships. Also, I work full time, so I don't have the time to do an hour-plus mission on 6-9 toons in addition to other things.
This is why some of us like the farming/grinding missions. It gave us a chance.
Which now appears to have been taken away from us. Thanks...
Easy: Get a few people, 3 or 4 or 5, and play Nerandra, or other similar Tau Dewa missions. Lots of drops. You will have to play the game as intended, but making things go splodey is fun.
You can even make it easier by raising need/greed to very rare or higher, so you don't have to worry about who gets it, it's based on who it drops for, or round robin it.
You wont get dil directly, but you will also get rom marks for the daily.
S.S. Doff Lundgren
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
You're welcome. Sorry if it sucks to have to play the game to earn junk.
You can get over 3 mil from proper planning with Tour The Galaxy.
I bought a tuffli and a Wells class using only the doff system (over 60 mil for each). Get strange alien artifacts, craft them, and get lucky and get a mk 12 purple anti proton array (for example) and you get 20-30 million.
Also get dil from doff mission, contraband, etc, and buy keys, sell keys on exchange. The dil/zen rate is well in favor for this.
I made 20 mil overnight buy buying 50 keys for 50 mil, then resold in packs of 10 for 14mil each. Bam, wells class.
It's not hard, and for me is fun.
S.S. Doff Lundgren
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I work full time, have a wife and two kids, and only play a couple hours in the evenings, just FYI.
S.S. Doff Lundgren
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Probably the best solution - I'd say keep BOTH types of 'timid' behavior; but NPCs set to Timid - doesn't fight back regardless; drop loot like described above.
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
If you only played the foundry to exploit it for drops, no one is going to miss you. As far as this change, the ability to gun down a group of innocent civilians in a KDF mission is now gone. Also, my mission for the Tholian Foundry Challenge was going to involve shooting ships docked in a shipyard. I guess now they'll shoot back, ruining what I had planned.
I rather think that Cryptic would have fixed the exploit anyways.
I didn't cry about it, so feel free to play my foundry mission "Unexpected Reflection" without feeling like you are betraying your position.
Question: Would you have taken the time to play my mission before this point, had you known about it?
S.S. Doff Lundgren
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
due to this change I am going to be forced to spend more time grinding which is needed for the fleets and less time for enjoyment, so I will now not get to play fun as much as i would like and therefore play less if any of the story based missions.
in the past few weeks I have enjoyed the medium between play both types of missions, but after tonight spending over an hour on 1 grinding mission and still not completeing it on normal level and having to give up. where as before the change I would have spent that same hour making enough of what i needed for the fleet and the rest of the time would have been my own to enjoy.
I'm sorry to say that through this both my fleets have suffered and more importantly so has my enjoyment of the game:mad:
And honestly, there is alot of stuff we have 'whined and moaned' about for years that is still very much not fixed, so I have to be lead to believe that someone ran the numbers on the backend and went 'this is not what we intended so we need to change it'
Release notes 1/31 Foundry:
Foundry NPC Groups set to Timid creature will now fight back when they take damage.
Who was the genius who came up with this one? Does anyone know what is doing to those who play foundry missions? Well basically they have made the game "useless and senseless" to me. I understand about the 15 min limit to minimize exploits but now this...you have made a bunch of people angry since now we cannot do some of the games we use to love to get "good" rewards...If it aint broken why break it....what kind of business model do you guys run in here...you are alienating a bunch of people that will feel dissatified for what you fixed...now made "unplayable" for the rest of us. Happy annyversary and thanks for the present...hope you develop a better sense of what your players want rather than making their life more difficut and grinding until they suck the very last dollar out of us :eek:
^This was a good call.
I'm in the same situation. Prior to today, I would play one "story" mission for each grinder I would do. Because of this now I won't have that luxury due to time constraints. Previously I could run the faster missions and then do a story one afterward fitting both in an hour of free time. But this change effectively guarantees that the only mission I'll play from here on out is Battleship Royal Rumble. The way this was executed left a really bad taste in my mouth. The bulk of what I do in this game now is grind, refine contraband, buy commodities, run doff missions, exchange dilithium, and play one or two stf's an hour. None of which feels anything like Star Trek to me anymore. The better foundry story missions did, but I can't justify the time now they require as well as I've got a starbase to feed. I can safely say I'll not play a spotlit mission under this current set up, even if I wanted to. Which means more dull grind without relent until I get tired of this game altogether.
I don't need the loot drops or dilithium. I'd be perfectly happy to see those go away, if that's the solution, anything set to timid doesn't drop loot. Give me 20 minutes of dull repetitive freighters to blow up with no drops for target practice and I'll be fine, and happy to do a story mission after that as soon as the cooldown comes off.
What i direly need is the fleet marks. The foundry right now is the most effective way to earn them. I think at this point then I can only resume playing the more story oriented missions if the fleet marks were doubled. I'm sorry, but that's just the way it works out now in terms of the time economy. As it is, the grind over the last two months is burning me out on this game, this has just annoyed me even more.