Mary Sue Mary Sue where are you? Oh there you are!
I found several mary sues.
Excelsior, Galor, Regent, D'Kora, Monbosh, Jem'Hadar Bug Ship, Scimitar, Fleet Kamarag, Fleet Tor'Kaht, Fleet Nova almost any (canon) ship in STO.
But please don't think i reacted on your poor try to troll. I just wanted to say something too.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
those battleships didn't seem to be terribly impressive, they might have been built to be as expendable as the bug ships or something.
the dreadknot the valiant fought though, it wasn't even harmed in the slightest by their attack, and they shot it down with what seemed like a half hearted effort. i can picture the vorta captain laughing at them through the whole fight, saying just shoot torpedoes at them till they did, dont even bother fireing any other weapons, lol.
The stats did say it is only armed with 10 torpedo launchers. I didn't make that up. Plus the Valient Captain was a stupid bullheaded cadet who was more interested in self glory than fighting smart or just follow the orders.
Trolling is statement without purpose.
My statement had purpose. It was my response to the last three pages of the thread that again seems to want the Galaxy to be the Ark of the Covenent of fed vessels.
Undefeatable, Unchallengeable and throwing death to all whom see it.
I have nothing against the Galaxy getting love but the roller coaster of concepts is hard to enjoy.
Trolling is statement without purpose.
My statement had purpose. It was my response to the last three pages of the thread that again seems to want the Galaxy to be the Ark of the Covenent of fed vessels.
Undefeatable, Unchallengeable and throwing death to all whom see it.
I have nothing against the Galaxy getting love but the roller coaster of concepts is hard to enjoy.
Agreed.
Even if the GCS was that good, STO is clearly NOT the game to ask for it to become that good.
But on the other hand, other ships are ok to be OP... just saying.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
Trolling is statement without purpose.
My statement had purpose. It was my response to the last three pages of the thread that again seems to want the Galaxy to be the Ark of the Covenent of fed vessels.
Undefeatable, Unchallengeable and throwing death to all whom see it.
I have nothing against the Galaxy getting love but the roller coaster of concepts is hard to enjoy.
You have a valid point. This discussion is running circles because there is no real consent what a better in-game representation of the ship would be and suddenly BAM someone suggests 5 tac consoles again. For the record, I'm entirely certain that if this game was not the dps race it is nobody would demand more tactical capabilities to "improve" the ship. Just in the same way that nobody demands less tac capabilities on the Nova class )because it would be nonsense to demand something like that in STO).
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
Trolling is statement without purpose.
My statement had purpose. It was my response to the last three pages of the thread that again seems to want the Galaxy to be the Ark of the Covenent of fed vessels.
Undefeatable, Unchallengeable and throwing death to all whom see it.
I have nothing against the Galaxy getting love but the roller coaster of concepts is hard to enjoy.
Hold up!!!!!!! You complaining about sombody wanting the Galaxy to be a god ship but why aren't you or anybody complaining about the Jem'Hadar Bug ship being OP? The game vesion of the ship is way off canon and is the most op and tanking ship out of all escorts. Some people want keep the cruisers nerfed so they can continue to fly their escorts unchallenged. Maybe, you should complain about that godship bug first, then try to block a competitive Galaxy later.
Almost every version of the Galaxy R is a total joke in comparison to other cruisers. The so called engineering heavy BOFF setup is one major problem for it in healing and removing debuffs because there are no duration of ENG team like Tac Team. Hazard Emitters has a duration of healing and the higher the power, the longer the duration. Tac Team and Hazard emitters also buff against damage during the duration. There are no ENG powers that buff against anything. That shows that an ENG heavy boff setup is not practical unless the Devs change the mechanics of ENG powers.
The console setup is also weak because the ship lacks a 3rd weapon console slot, putting it behind all the cruisers, save the Star Cruiser, in DPS. Without enough DPS you can't ward off an attack from escorts or even other cruisers, and you loose the chance to get good end game loot in PVE fleet actions. The heaviest damage dealers get all the very rare items while low DPS Cruisers is lucky to come in 3rd place and get green or blue items. There is no way a cruiser with 2 Weapon consoles can stand up to ships with 3 or more weapon consoles. Engineering consolse don't boost weapon damage or even make shields more resistant to damage. They just boost power levels that don't really help much if your ship is maxed out on desired power levels.
The mockery of TNG, is that every cruiser, new and old, is more well rounded and better at everyting than the Galaxy R. They all heal faster, move faster(keeping defense level high), turn rate higher, and DPS higher than the Galaxy. Even the Fleet version is not a real upgrade for the C-store version because the BOFF set up is the exact same and a weapon slot is not added to improve the DPS. This is great disregard for the TNG fan base, for we had to grind very hard in fleets to get our fleet starbases and shipyards to tier 4 to access the fleet exlorer class.
The Galaxy should get revamped and get the same BOFF setup as the Galaxy X. It is basicly the same ship minus a lance and cannons. The C-store version should move the 3rd science console slot to be a 3rd Tac console slot because the Galaxy is not a science ship, so you don't need more than two science console slots. The fleet version should of get the 5th Eng console slot changed to be a3rd or 4th Tac slot giving a beam boat more teeth to ward off attack. The BOFF setup for the fleet version should get rid of the Eng ensign BOFF and chang to a LTC tac power so the cruiser can enjoy level 3 tac powers or manuvers.
All the powers like saucer separation shold be returned to inate abilty just like the lance and cloaks of alen ships.
It's hard to be a TNG fan and to play STO.
As much as i agree with you, this thread is going to be ignored by the devs as any other Galaxy -R thread.
Let's face it Cryptics devs just hate the Galaxy Class and TNG for some reason.
As someone that became a Trek fan with TNG, it is very hard to play STO without being annoyed by Cryptics attitude towards TNG related things. Heck, they even gave the D'D a imaginable useless BOFF layout that makes the use of A2B pretty hard.
You know that i support a reworked Galaxy Class for years now, but as long as the same people are in charge at Cryptic, there won't be any useful or at least equal strong Galaxy Class in game.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
For the record, I'm entirely certain that if this game was not the dps race it is nobody would demand more tactical capabilities to "improve" the ship. Just in the same way that nobody demands less tac capabilities on the Nova class )because it would be nonsense to demand something like that in STO).
I wouldn't be so sure about that.
At least i am very dipleased about the "role" Cryptic gave the GCS.
Obviously their intention was to make the GCS the best tank. Even if that wouldn't have completely failed, i wouldn't want her to be like that. The GCS is a much more versatile than just a flying brick IMO and so she should be represented in STO, too.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
The stats did say it is only armed with 10 torpedo launchers. I didn't make that up. Plus the Valient Captain was a stupid bullheaded cadet who was more interested in self glory than fighting smart or just follow the orders.
what stats say that? theres no way to know what its actual armament was, you cant just count arrays on it like you could a fed ship. no mater what the valient did, it couldn't harm that dreadnought, not alone. sorta like how 3 bug ships could shoot at a shieldless galaxy for 10 minutes and not really do all that much damage too it
Trolling is statement without purpose.
My statement had purpose. It was my response to the last three pages of the thread that again seems to want the Galaxy to be the Ark of the Covenent of fed vessels.
Undefeatable, Unchallengeable and throwing death to all whom see it.
I have nothing against the Galaxy getting love but the roller coaster of concepts is hard to enjoy.
we were talking about canon, not setting an in game mandate. we want a competitive galaxy, and when you look at the source materiel it shows a very large and powerful ship
it really shouldn't be a surprise that the biggest fed ship with the biggest guns is a bit of a juggernaut. but a sue comparison, really? :rolleyes: the word your looking for is underdog, thats how the ship was written in every story, not as the biggest and most powerful federation ship like it actually was. they cant seem to tell a story if the ship wasn't getting jobbed at every turn, or fighting something unbeatable like the borg or a ship mentally projected by some god like alien.
Almost every version of the Galaxy R is a total joke in comparison to other cruisers. The so called engineering heavy BOFF setup is one major problem for it in healing and removing debuffs because there are no duration of ENG team like Tac Team. Hazard Emitters has a duration of healing and the higher the power, the longer the duration. Tac Team and Hazard emitters also buff against damage during the duration. There are no ENG powers that buff against anything. That shows that an ENG heavy boff setup is not practical unless the Devs change the mechanics of ENG powers.
The console setup is also weak because the ship lacks a 3rd weapon console slot, putting it behind all the cruisers, save the Star Cruiser, in DPS. Without enough DPS you can't ward off an attack from escorts or even other cruisers, and you loose the chance to get good end game loot in PVE fleet actions. The heaviest damage dealers get all the very rare items while low DPS Cruisers is lucky to come in 3rd place and get green or blue items. There is no way a cruiser with 2 Weapon consoles can stand up to ships with 3 or more weapon consoles. Engineering consolse don't boost weapon damage or even make shields more resistant to damage. They just boost power levels that don't really help much if your ship is maxed out on desired power levels.
The mockery of TNG, is that every cruiser, new and old, is more well rounded and better at everyting than the Galaxy R. They all heal faster, move faster(keeping defense level high), turn rate higher, and DPS higher than the Galaxy. Even the Fleet version is not a real upgrade for the C-store version because the BOFF set up is the exact same and a weapon slot is not added to improve the DPS. This is great disregard for the TNG fan base, for we had to grind very hard in fleets to get our fleet starbases and shipyards to tier 4 to access the fleet exlorer class.
The Galaxy should get revamped and get the same BOFF setup as the Galaxy X. It is basicly the same ship minus a lance and cannons. The C-store version should move the 3rd science console slot to be a 3rd Tac console slot because the Galaxy is not a science ship, so you don't need more than two science console slots. The fleet version should of get the 5th Eng console slot changed to be a3rd or 4th Tac slot giving a beam boat more teeth to ward off attack. The BOFF setup for the fleet version should get rid of the Eng ensign BOFF and chang to a LTC tac power so the cruiser can enjoy level 3 tac powers or manuvers.
All the powers like saucer separation shold be returned to inate abilty just like the lance and cloaks of alen ships.
Dont get me wrong, I love TNG.
I believe you want to change the Galaxy R in accordance to your playstyle.
The Boff setup and the console setup of the galaxy X is ENG heavy setup and maximizing this ship with an ENG toon. The best role for this ship is a tank/healer.
It is not meant to do sci control crowd stuff nor dps like the other cruisers. The 2 Sci boff slots are enough for a tank/healer Fleet Galaxy R on the ENG side. With its current tac and sci slots, you can slot TT, HE and TSS. All the complaints that you say that the Galaxy R is utterly lacking.
ENG boffs have also the best resistance when you compare EPTS vs TSS or Aux2Sif vs HE.
ENG boffs have still the best burst heals out there -> EPTS vs TSS or Aux2Sif VS HE.
2 Tac console and boffs are enough to be above average(2 times) your DPS PUG in pve.
It is still one of the best pvp ships out their for its role.
When it comes to defense, all cruisers have the same base defense % rate. Only escorts have higher defense % rate than any cruiser. For speed, all fed fleet cruisers have the same impulse modifier. So where did you get your info?
Turn rate? Are you kidding? This is one of the largest ships out there in STO. This ship is not meant do bring DHCs. Nor have the same playstyle as an Avenger, assault cruisers or Escorts. Why make it have better Turn rate when you can heal anyone even at your back?
The only buffs that I would probably agree on the Fleet Galaxy R are increase in hull and shield modifier due to more and more ships are having near or better than its hull and shield hp even though those ships roles are not for tanking.
what stats say that? theres no way to know what its actual armament was, you cant just count arrays on it like you could a fed ship. no mater what the valient did, it couldn't harm that dreadnought, not alone. sorta like how 3 bug ships could shoot at a shieldless galaxy for 10 minutes and not really do all that much damage too it
we were talking about canon, not setting an in game mandate. we want a competitive galaxy, and when you look at the source materiel it shows a very large and powerful ship
it really shouldn't be a surprise that the biggest fed ship with the biggest guns is a bit of a juggernaut. but a sue comparison, really? :rolleyes: the word your looking for is underdog, thats how the ship was written in every story, not as the biggest and most powerful federation ship like it actually was. they cant seem to tell a story if the ship wasn't getting jobbed at every turn, or fighting something unbeatable like the borg or a ship mentally projected by some god like alien.
Fleet Galaxy R is a very competitive ship for its role. It is an excellent tank/healer. It is a decent pve ship and an excellent pvp ship.
Its not competitive when you want to play it like an assault cruiser, escort or a sci control ship build or ship playstyle. It is not even meant to be versatile ship but Fleet Galaxy R excels on its role as long the player knows how to play and build the Fleet galaxy R.
Absent of Ramming the ship, If you want it to hull tank 3 bug ships and not get destroyed, this ship becomes more powerful than the lockbox ships and Voth dreadnoughts, tac cubes. 3 well built, well played BUG ships can destroy all those mobs. Hence, that kind of build would make this an OP ship.
It is not meant to do sci control crowd stuff nor dps like the other cruisers. The 2 Sci boff slots are enough for a tank/healer Fleet Galaxy R on the ENG side. With its current tac and sci slots, you can slot TT, HE and TSS. All the complaints that you say that the Galaxy R is utterly lacking.
No, the only thing this ship is meant to be in STO is to suck.
EDIT: either that, or Cryptics devs are the most incompetent game developers ever, not even understanding their own game, lol.
(which i do not belive)
Turn rate? Are you kidding? This is one of the largest ships out there in STO. This ship is not meant do bring DHCs. Nor have the same playstyle as an Avenger, assault cruisers or Escorts. Why make it have better Turn rate when you can heal anyone even at your back?
Odyssey, Scimitar, Voth Bastion, Star Cruiser, Atrox, D'Deridex, Haakona, Ha'feh, Ha'apax, Monbosh, Jem'Hadar Dreadnought, Obelisk, Negh'Var, Bortas, Vo'Quv, Kar'Fi. All these ships are at least equal or way bigger than the GCS -R (and some have a rediculus high turn rate).
As for the GCS being meant to heal/tank, thats only Cryptics "interpretation" of the Galaxy class, because the obvioulsy wanted her to be rather boring comared to other ships like the defiant or Sovereign.
If they cared at least a bit about canon they where forced to make the GCS much more versatile.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
As an quite active contributor to the Galaxy thread I have to say that I am not in-line with the proposed changes.
I personally don't want to play a battleship when I play a Galaxy Class. I like the Star Cruiser theme, I would want a bit more room for sci abilities, though. If you want a Galaxy with 4 tac consoles and 2 sci consoles I'd be okay with the Dreadnaught filling that role but I would be upset if my R got it's 3rd sci slot removed.
The Galaxy is a balanced command ship. Either go 3/3/3 consoles and Star Cruiser BOFF layout for the R and 4/3/3 + one universal station for the fleet variant or even 4/4/2 (eng/sci/tac that is) and a LTC sci but I'm against the tactical powerhouse route just because that's the flavour of the game. That's why there is a "Dreadnaught". I mean even the heavy battlecruisers of the KDF have a eng heavy set-up (minus the recent power creep additions).
Turnrate has never been an issue for me personally and I don't get the obsession about it. You are free to seperate and/or use RCS consoles, that's what those are for. I absolutely get that you cannot compensate the lack of damage, but you can compensate the turnrate issue by in-game means.
I'm all for improving engineering skills across the board, however. Engineering skills are all about energy levels (rather obsolete now that every console and item boost power levels) and hull resistance. What about improvements to accuracy, damage, debuffs, drains, anything? I'd like some of that in the engineering branch and I'd love to see egnineering consoles improving damage so that a eng heavy ship can generate enough aggro to tank, if that's what it's supposed to be doing.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
Blame not the galaxy retrofit's boff layout blame engineer skills for not being better. This ship is part of the original trinity and is meant to do engy stuff and only engy stuff just as the defiant is TAC and more TAC and the intrepid us Sci and more Sci. Now if those other two get an updated boff layout then you cab expect the galxy to also get an update but otherwise it will NOT happen.
A balanced command ship with the Saucer attached, yes.
A formidable combat vessel with the saucer detached, no?
Some Universal Console Slots and Bridge Officer Stations would give the Galaxy the versatility that was obviously intended with its saucer separation ability.
And all cruisers should have the ability to mount dual/heavy cannons. That should not be an arbitrary restriction, but a decision each captain makes for their own ship.
And all cruisers should have the ability to mount dual/heavy cannons. That should not be an arbitrary restriction, but a decision each captain makes for their own ship.
Now, my time watching Star Trek might be fuzzy, but I certainly don't remember Kirk or Picard telling their crewmates to fire the Enterprise's dual cannons like a bunch of gun-crazy nuts.
Now, Riker in the Galaxy-X, that's whole different story and we got that ship.
Frankly, I think it would be utterly stupid for any Cruiser outside of the Galaxy-X and the Avenger to run around with cannons, any sort of war be darned!
Change the ensign engineer boff slot to a universal. Then take away an engineering console slot, do a little coding magic and make it the first ever universal console slot.
Boom. Now you have a more flexible ship, and nobody who loves the ship as is can complain, because they can still do the exact same thing with it now as they could before.
Well noone listens to my explanation as they must be in denial as to it being why the galaxy will not get an update. Now if were talking about the galaxy-x then that will get an update with the fleet version but the galaxy will not.
I like tng as well but when it comes to the galaxy it is hard to argue.
In the show the Galaxy was made in a time of peace. It was a luxury liner in space. No other ship in any series showed a ship designed with a school on it for kids. Most of the galaxy class ships blew up. There was one point where Wesley's school project almost blew up the ship. there were a few times where the Enterprise-D was only saved by Data's unique abilities where if he weren't there they would have blown up.
This ship was designed to do system patrols and chest thumping along the boarders to make people like the Romulans think twice.
There has also been a lot of people who think the Excelsior should not be more power. That ship was a war ship designed to fight Klingons. In DS9 the Defiant went head on head with the Lakota it was able to hold its own. the defiant killed many attack ships and when DS9 had the opportunity to show the galaxy off it was blown up once again.
This favoritism is not just in sto but is depicted in a few locations. The galaxy may have large numbers in cannon but it is not a war ship. It more of a case of too many options to be effective.
I like tng as well but when it comes to the galaxy it is hard to argue.
In the show the Galaxy was made in a time of peace. It was a luxury liner in space. No other ship in any series showed a ship designed with a school on it for kids. Most of the galaxy class ships blew up. There was one point where Wesley's school project almost blew up the ship. there were a few times where the Enterprise-D was only saved by Data's unique abilities where if he weren't there they would have blown up.
This ship was designed to do system patrols and chest thumping along the boarders to make people like the Romulans think twice.
There has also been a lot of people who think the Excelsior should not be more power. That ship was a war ship designed to fight Klingons. In DS9 the Defiant went head on head with the Lakota it was able to hold its own. the defiant killed many attack ships and when DS9 had the opportunity to show the galaxy off it was blown up once again.
This favoritism is not just in sto but is depicted in a few locations. The galaxy may have large numbers in cannon but it is not a war ship. It more of a case of too many options to be effective.
Most of what you write is a common misconception shared with people that (I think) fail to grasp the concept of Starfleet and the associated show.
In short: The Galaxy Class was no luxury liner. It was the pinnacle of Starfleet's ship design and stood for the ideals of Starfleet and the Federation. As Starfleet is not a military it's main task was Exploration and confronting the unknown and that's what the Galaxy Class was for. As she was intented to do that without any external support, crews assigned to those ships had to be ready to serve on these vessels for years and years without returning home. That's why they were allowed to take their families with them. Now, you have a ship loaded with the most precious "cargo" imaginable - that's why the ship was heavily armed in a way it would dwarf many people's military ships. That circumstance hindered first contact situations more than once because most other people's would recognize the ship as a humongous battleship by looking at it. Next to Exploration the ship was everything you needed it to be. It had huge storage potential, a detachable saucer with planetary landing capabilities, it could transport entire colonies, it had a huge number of labs and facilities and yes, it also had a school. Why are people harping on that school? It was a single friggin room on the ship, on a deck reserved for civlians that was dedicated to educate the children of those families that accompanied their Starfleet members for what, a decade? What's so bad about that?
I will however grant you that later in the series, when the Enterprise was more often than not charged with border patrols and muscle flexing, they could have left the families at a starbase (I mean they are still there in Generations...)
Does any of that mean that the ship in this game needs tactical superiority? Not in my opinion, especially since I think the class lacked the agility to be a full fledged battleship, but that's another story.
I think your idea of the Excelsior is also a misconception. Who said it was designed as a battleship versus Klingons? It was designed as a experiment for a new kind of warp drive. Other than that it was an explorer, a transport, a patrol vessel - it was not once stated it was in any way concieved tactically more capable than a constitution or even a miranda. It was bigger, more advanced and more vertasile but that's about it. And that also does in no way mean that it should be superior to a much newer and bigger ship in a game set in the 25th century. At least, the Exploration cruiser has 25th century refits available. The Excelsior still is a retrofitted, 120 year old ship. And what the Lakota recieved in terms of retrofits in the show, the Galaxies scrambled during the dominion war recieved pretty much the same, if not more (see the USS Venture).
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
Fleet Galaxy R is a very competitive ship for its role. It is an excellent tank/healer. It is a decent pve ship and an excellent pvp ship.
Its not competitive when you want to play it like an assault cruiser, escort or a sci control ship build or ship playstyle. It is not even meant to be versatile ship but Fleet Galaxy R excels on its role as long the player knows how to play and build the Fleet galaxy R.
Absent of Ramming the ship, If you want it to hull tank 3 bug ships and not get destroyed, this ship becomes more powerful than the lockbox ships and Voth dreadnoughts, tac cubes. 3 well built, well played BUG ships can destroy all those mobs. Hence, that kind of build would make this an OP ship.
You should fly another ship once in a while and you will see that the Galaxy -R in STO just lacks at all ends.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
This was the most recent suggestion I had for a new Galaxy z-store ship. (posted in another thread)
Call it the Galaxy Class Command Cruiser or something. :P
I already know paxdawn believes it's game-breaking, but I completely disagree.
With this setup, I was shooting for versatility as a priority:
Hull: 40,000+
Shield Modifier: 1.0-1.15
Weapons: 4 Fore / 4 Aft
Crew: 1000
Device Slots: 4
Consoles: 3 Engineering; 3 Science; 3 Tactical; 1 Uni (I think a uni console would be a neat idea, but 3/3/3 at the least)
Turn Rate: 6-7
Bridge Stations:
. Cmdr Engineering: ####
. Lt. Engineering: ##
. Lt. Cmdr Science: ###
. Lt. Cmdr Tactical: ###
It would be VERY close to the D'Deridex-R. (Lt. Eng instead of Tac and Uni ensign stations).
The 2x Lt.Cmdr has already been done with the D'D-R, and Vo'Quv (+ Mirror), if not others.
And I don't believe it should mount dual cannons, as that should be reserved for the Gal-X variants. But that's just my opinion.
**puts 2 pennies on the table**
It's me, Chrome. [Join Date: May 2009]
"Oh, I may be captain by rank... but I never wanted to be anything else but an engineer." ~Montgomery Scott~
-1 --- just "meh". Yet another, pointless, Galaxy thread - where the word "Galaxy" makes one to skip the wall of text and the whole rest of the thread to the very end of it.
I'll post this here too. I wanted to see what you guys think.
This was the most recent suggestion I had for a new Galaxy z-store ship. (posted in another thread)
Call it the Galaxy Class Command Cruiser or something.
I already know paxdawn believes it's game-breaking, but I completely disagree.
With this setup, I was shooting for versatility as a priority:
Hull: 40,000+
Shield Modifier: 1.0-1.15
Weapons: 4 Fore / 4 Aft
Crew: 1000
Device Slots: 4
Consoles: 3 Engineering; 3 Science; 3 Tactical; 1 Uni (I think a uni console would be a neat idea, but 3/3/3 at the least)
Turn Rate: 6-7
Bridge Stations:
. Cmdr Engineering: ####
. Lt. Engineering: ##
. Lt. Cmdr Science: ###
. Lt. Cmdr Tactical: ###
It would be VERY close to the D'Deridex-R. (Lt. Eng instead of Tac and Uni ensign stations).
The 2x Lt.Cmdr has already been done with the D'D-R, and Vo'Quv (+ Mirror), if not others.
And I don't believe it should mount dual cannons, as that should be reserved for the Gal-X variants. But that's just my opinion.
**puts 2 pennies on the table**
It's me, Chrome. [Join Date: May 2009]
"Oh, I may be captain by rank... but I never wanted to be anything else but an engineer." ~Montgomery Scott~
my roms hafeh is bigger. the obelisk carrier is MUCH bigger.
both turn much better.
I truly shows how misinformed and fallacious your facts are. First of all You compoare a hafeh over a Galaxy R. It is like comparing apples and oranges. The Hafeh can be compared to a fed escort due to its turn 16 and Com Tac not any fed cruiser.
Secondly, Obelisk and Advanced Obelisk have both turn rate 5. Galaxy R has turn rate 6. In whatever math you have 6>5.
The only time I would support a change in Galaxy R's consoles and boffs and consoles is the time that all escorts and sci ships, scimitars, assault cruisers and the like would have equal and same boffs as the current galaxy R with 8 ENG boffs and 2 tac consoles.
People bought Galaxy R for its current boff and console slots. these people are aware what they bought. No one forced you to buy or play the current Galaxy R. It fits a current playstyle and build which is contradictory to sci or tac playstyle or most galaxy r complainers, whiners in forums.
If these people who bought Galaxy R as it is are going to lose so much time and effort building a toon and build to maximize the ship, because some players just want to fit their playstyle, then so all other ships like escorts, sci ships, and all other non ENG Tank/healer build fed, romulan and klingon alike should be change their consoles and boff slots.
Its a good deal. all other ships transforms into Galaxy R stats while galaxy R transforms into ship stats that they want. Everybody gets what they want, and everybody loses their money and the time and effort they built for each of their toons and their ship.
The only time I would support a change in Galaxy R's consoles and boffs and consoles is the time that all escorts and sci ships, scimitars, assault cruisers and the like would have equal and same boffs as the current galaxy R with 8 ENG boffs and 2 tac consoles.
People bought Galaxy R for its current boff and console slots. these people are aware what they bought. No one forced you to buy or play the current Galaxy R. It fits a current playstyle and build which is contradictory to sci or tac playstyle or most galaxy r complainers, whiners in forums.
If these people who bought Galaxy R as it is are going to lose so much time and effort building a toon and build to maximize the ship, because some players just want to fit their playstyle, then so all other ships like escorts, sci ships, and all other non ENG Tank/healer build fed, romulan and klingon alike should be change their consoles and boff slots.
Its a good deal. all other ships transforms into Galaxy R stats while galaxy R transforms into ship stats that they want. Everybody gets what they want, and everybody loses their money and the time and effort they built for each of their toons and their ship.
The only part where I agree with you is that we ought not change the Gal-R.
People have already bought it. Changing it that in any significant way after the fact, I think, is just ethically wrong.
That said, sensationalism does not help your arguments.
Did anyone bring up a Galaxy class with Cmdr+Lt.Cmdr tac stations and 5 tac consoles?
You said it yourself: "It is like comparing apples and oranges."
Incidentally, the Tactical Bortas has 5 Tac Consoles. Possible Lt.Cmdr+Lt.+Ens Tac stations.
Fleet Adv. Heavy cruiser: 4. Lt.Cmdr Tac station.
Avenger/Mogh: 4. Possible Lt.Cmdr+Lt.+Ens Tac stations.
If you have such a beef with damage/Tac focused cruisers, then you are clearly barking up the wrong tree.
Where's your outrage on those other cruisers/battlecruisers?
It's me, Chrome. [Join Date: May 2009]
"Oh, I may be captain by rank... but I never wanted to be anything else but an engineer." ~Montgomery Scott~
Not necessarily for the Galaxy-R, but what I'd like as a non-Lobi option sometime would be CMDR Universal, Lt Engineering, Lt Science, Lt Tactical and Lt Universal.
And I don't believe it should mount dual cannons, as that should be reserved for the Gal-X variants. But that's just my opinion.
I'm more than somewhat fed-up with the "you need dual cannons for best pew pew" thing. The entire starship weapon system desperately needs to be completely overhauled from the ground up.
Comments
R.I.P
Excelsior, Galor, Regent, D'Kora, Monbosh, Jem'Hadar Bug Ship, Scimitar, Fleet Kamarag, Fleet Tor'Kaht, Fleet Nova almost any (canon) ship in STO.
But please don't think i reacted on your poor try to troll. I just wanted to say something too.
The stats did say it is only armed with 10 torpedo launchers. I didn't make that up. Plus the Valient Captain was a stupid bullheaded cadet who was more interested in self glory than fighting smart or just follow the orders.
My statement had purpose. It was my response to the last three pages of the thread that again seems to want the Galaxy to be the Ark of the Covenent of fed vessels.
Undefeatable, Unchallengeable and throwing death to all whom see it.
I have nothing against the Galaxy getting love but the roller coaster of concepts is hard to enjoy.
R.I.P
Agreed.
Even if the GCS was that good, STO is clearly NOT the game to ask for it to become that good.
But on the other hand, other ships are ok to be OP... just saying.
You have a valid point. This discussion is running circles because there is no real consent what a better in-game representation of the ship would be and suddenly BAM someone suggests 5 tac consoles again. For the record, I'm entirely certain that if this game was not the dps race it is nobody would demand more tactical capabilities to "improve" the ship. Just in the same way that nobody demands less tac capabilities on the Nova class )because it would be nonsense to demand something like that in STO).
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Hold up!!!!!!! You complaining about sombody wanting the Galaxy to be a god ship but why aren't you or anybody complaining about the Jem'Hadar Bug ship being OP? The game vesion of the ship is way off canon and is the most op and tanking ship out of all escorts. Some people want keep the cruisers nerfed so they can continue to fly their escorts unchallenged. Maybe, you should complain about that godship bug first, then try to block a competitive Galaxy later.
The console setup is also weak because the ship lacks a 3rd weapon console slot, putting it behind all the cruisers, save the Star Cruiser, in DPS. Without enough DPS you can't ward off an attack from escorts or even other cruisers, and you loose the chance to get good end game loot in PVE fleet actions. The heaviest damage dealers get all the very rare items while low DPS Cruisers is lucky to come in 3rd place and get green or blue items. There is no way a cruiser with 2 Weapon consoles can stand up to ships with 3 or more weapon consoles. Engineering consolse don't boost weapon damage or even make shields more resistant to damage. They just boost power levels that don't really help much if your ship is maxed out on desired power levels.
The mockery of TNG, is that every cruiser, new and old, is more well rounded and better at everyting than the Galaxy R. They all heal faster, move faster(keeping defense level high), turn rate higher, and DPS higher than the Galaxy. Even the Fleet version is not a real upgrade for the C-store version because the BOFF set up is the exact same and a weapon slot is not added to improve the DPS. This is great disregard for the TNG fan base, for we had to grind very hard in fleets to get our fleet starbases and shipyards to tier 4 to access the fleet exlorer class.
The Galaxy should get revamped and get the same BOFF setup as the Galaxy X. It is basicly the same ship minus a lance and cannons. The C-store version should move the 3rd science console slot to be a 3rd Tac console slot because the Galaxy is not a science ship, so you don't need more than two science console slots. The fleet version should of get the 5th Eng console slot changed to be a3rd or 4th Tac slot giving a beam boat more teeth to ward off attack. The BOFF setup for the fleet version should get rid of the Eng ensign BOFF and chang to a LTC tac power so the cruiser can enjoy level 3 tac powers or manuvers.
All the powers like saucer separation shold be returned to inate abilty just like the lance and cloaks of alen ships.
As much as i agree with you, this thread is going to be ignored by the devs as any other Galaxy -R thread.
Let's face it Cryptics devs just hate the Galaxy Class and TNG for some reason.
As someone that became a Trek fan with TNG, it is very hard to play STO without being annoyed by Cryptics attitude towards TNG related things. Heck, they even gave the D'D a imaginable useless BOFF layout that makes the use of A2B pretty hard.
You know that i support a reworked Galaxy Class for years now, but as long as the same people are in charge at Cryptic, there won't be any useful or at least equal strong Galaxy Class in game.
At least i am very dipleased about the "role" Cryptic gave the GCS.
Obviously their intention was to make the GCS the best tank. Even if that wouldn't have completely failed, i wouldn't want her to be like that. The GCS is a much more versatile than just a flying brick IMO and so she should be represented in STO, too.
what stats say that? theres no way to know what its actual armament was, you cant just count arrays on it like you could a fed ship. no mater what the valient did, it couldn't harm that dreadnought, not alone. sorta like how 3 bug ships could shoot at a shieldless galaxy for 10 minutes and not really do all that much damage too it
we were talking about canon, not setting an in game mandate. we want a competitive galaxy, and when you look at the source materiel it shows a very large and powerful ship
it really shouldn't be a surprise that the biggest fed ship with the biggest guns is a bit of a juggernaut. but a sue comparison, really? :rolleyes: the word your looking for is underdog, thats how the ship was written in every story, not as the biggest and most powerful federation ship like it actually was. they cant seem to tell a story if the ship wasn't getting jobbed at every turn, or fighting something unbeatable like the borg or a ship mentally projected by some god like alien.
Dont get me wrong, I love TNG.
I believe you want to change the Galaxy R in accordance to your playstyle.
The Boff setup and the console setup of the galaxy X is ENG heavy setup and maximizing this ship with an ENG toon. The best role for this ship is a tank/healer.
It is not meant to do sci control crowd stuff nor dps like the other cruisers. The 2 Sci boff slots are enough for a tank/healer Fleet Galaxy R on the ENG side. With its current tac and sci slots, you can slot TT, HE and TSS. All the complaints that you say that the Galaxy R is utterly lacking.
ENG boffs have also the best resistance when you compare EPTS vs TSS or Aux2Sif vs HE.
ENG boffs have still the best burst heals out there -> EPTS vs TSS or Aux2Sif VS HE.
2 Tac console and boffs are enough to be above average(2 times) your DPS PUG in pve.
It is still one of the best pvp ships out their for its role.
When it comes to defense, all cruisers have the same base defense % rate. Only escorts have higher defense % rate than any cruiser. For speed, all fed fleet cruisers have the same impulse modifier. So where did you get your info?
Turn rate? Are you kidding? This is one of the largest ships out there in STO. This ship is not meant do bring DHCs. Nor have the same playstyle as an Avenger, assault cruisers or Escorts. Why make it have better Turn rate when you can heal anyone even at your back?
The only buffs that I would probably agree on the Fleet Galaxy R are increase in hull and shield modifier due to more and more ships are having near or better than its hull and shield hp even though those ships roles are not for tanking.
Fleet Galaxy R is a very competitive ship for its role. It is an excellent tank/healer. It is a decent pve ship and an excellent pvp ship.
Its not competitive when you want to play it like an assault cruiser, escort or a sci control ship build or ship playstyle. It is not even meant to be versatile ship but Fleet Galaxy R excels on its role as long the player knows how to play and build the Fleet galaxy R.
Absent of Ramming the ship, If you want it to hull tank 3 bug ships and not get destroyed, this ship becomes more powerful than the lockbox ships and Voth dreadnoughts, tac cubes. 3 well built, well played BUG ships can destroy all those mobs. Hence, that kind of build would make this an OP ship.
EDIT: either that, or Cryptics devs are the most incompetent game developers ever, not even understanding their own game, lol.
(which i do not belive)
Odyssey, Scimitar, Voth Bastion, Star Cruiser, Atrox, D'Deridex, Haakona, Ha'feh, Ha'apax, Monbosh, Jem'Hadar Dreadnought, Obelisk, Negh'Var, Bortas, Vo'Quv, Kar'Fi. All these ships are at least equal or way bigger than the GCS -R (and some have a rediculus high turn rate).
As for the GCS being meant to heal/tank, thats only Cryptics "interpretation" of the Galaxy class, because the obvioulsy wanted her to be rather boring comared to other ships like the defiant or Sovereign.
If they cared at least a bit about canon they where forced to make the GCS much more versatile.
I personally don't want to play a battleship when I play a Galaxy Class. I like the Star Cruiser theme, I would want a bit more room for sci abilities, though. If you want a Galaxy with 4 tac consoles and 2 sci consoles I'd be okay with the Dreadnaught filling that role but I would be upset if my R got it's 3rd sci slot removed.
The Galaxy is a balanced command ship. Either go 3/3/3 consoles and Star Cruiser BOFF layout for the R and 4/3/3 + one universal station for the fleet variant or even 4/4/2 (eng/sci/tac that is) and a LTC sci but I'm against the tactical powerhouse route just because that's the flavour of the game. That's why there is a "Dreadnaught". I mean even the heavy battlecruisers of the KDF have a eng heavy set-up (minus the recent power creep additions).
Turnrate has never been an issue for me personally and I don't get the obsession about it. You are free to seperate and/or use RCS consoles, that's what those are for. I absolutely get that you cannot compensate the lack of damage, but you can compensate the turnrate issue by in-game means.
I'm all for improving engineering skills across the board, however. Engineering skills are all about energy levels (rather obsolete now that every console and item boost power levels) and hull resistance. What about improvements to accuracy, damage, debuffs, drains, anything? I'd like some of that in the engineering branch and I'd love to see egnineering consoles improving damage so that a eng heavy ship can generate enough aggro to tank, if that's what it's supposed to be doing.
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
lol Well said.
A balanced command ship with the Saucer attached, yes.
A formidable combat vessel with the saucer detached, no?
Some Universal Console Slots and Bridge Officer Stations would give the Galaxy the versatility that was obviously intended with its saucer separation ability.
And all cruisers should have the ability to mount dual/heavy cannons. That should not be an arbitrary restriction, but a decision each captain makes for their own ship.
Now, my time watching Star Trek might be fuzzy, but I certainly don't remember Kirk or Picard telling their crewmates to fire the Enterprise's dual cannons like a bunch of gun-crazy nuts.
Now, Riker in the Galaxy-X, that's whole different story and we got that ship.
Frankly, I think it would be utterly stupid for any Cruiser outside of the Galaxy-X and the Avenger to run around with cannons, any sort of war be darned!
Boom. Now you have a more flexible ship, and nobody who loves the ship as is can complain, because they can still do the exact same thing with it now as they could before.
Get some earl grey, hot, and call it a day.
In the show the Galaxy was made in a time of peace. It was a luxury liner in space. No other ship in any series showed a ship designed with a school on it for kids. Most of the galaxy class ships blew up. There was one point where Wesley's school project almost blew up the ship. there were a few times where the Enterprise-D was only saved by Data's unique abilities where if he weren't there they would have blown up.
This ship was designed to do system patrols and chest thumping along the boarders to make people like the Romulans think twice.
There has also been a lot of people who think the Excelsior should not be more power. That ship was a war ship designed to fight Klingons. In DS9 the Defiant went head on head with the Lakota it was able to hold its own. the defiant killed many attack ships and when DS9 had the opportunity to show the galaxy off it was blown up once again.
This favoritism is not just in sto but is depicted in a few locations. The galaxy may have large numbers in cannon but it is not a war ship. It more of a case of too many options to be effective.
Most of what you write is a common misconception shared with people that (I think) fail to grasp the concept of Starfleet and the associated show.
In short: The Galaxy Class was no luxury liner. It was the pinnacle of Starfleet's ship design and stood for the ideals of Starfleet and the Federation. As Starfleet is not a military it's main task was Exploration and confronting the unknown and that's what the Galaxy Class was for. As she was intented to do that without any external support, crews assigned to those ships had to be ready to serve on these vessels for years and years without returning home. That's why they were allowed to take their families with them. Now, you have a ship loaded with the most precious "cargo" imaginable - that's why the ship was heavily armed in a way it would dwarf many people's military ships. That circumstance hindered first contact situations more than once because most other people's would recognize the ship as a humongous battleship by looking at it. Next to Exploration the ship was everything you needed it to be. It had huge storage potential, a detachable saucer with planetary landing capabilities, it could transport entire colonies, it had a huge number of labs and facilities and yes, it also had a school. Why are people harping on that school? It was a single friggin room on the ship, on a deck reserved for civlians that was dedicated to educate the children of those families that accompanied their Starfleet members for what, a decade? What's so bad about that?
I will however grant you that later in the series, when the Enterprise was more often than not charged with border patrols and muscle flexing, they could have left the families at a starbase
Does any of that mean that the ship in this game needs tactical superiority? Not in my opinion, especially since I think the class lacked the agility to be a full fledged battleship, but that's another story.
I think your idea of the Excelsior is also a misconception. Who said it was designed as a battleship versus Klingons? It was designed as a experiment for a new kind of warp drive. Other than that it was an explorer, a transport, a patrol vessel - it was not once stated it was in any way concieved tactically more capable than a constitution or even a miranda. It was bigger, more advanced and more vertasile but that's about it. And that also does in no way mean that it should be superior to a much newer and bigger ship in a game set in the 25th century. At least, the Exploration cruiser has 25th century refits available. The Excelsior still is a retrofitted, 120 year old ship. And what the Lakota recieved in terms of retrofits in the show, the Galaxies scrambled during the dominion war recieved pretty much the same, if not more (see the USS Venture).
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
You should fly another ship once in a while and you will see that the Galaxy -R in STO just lacks at all ends.
Call it the Galaxy Class Command Cruiser or something. :P
I already know paxdawn believes it's game-breaking, but I completely disagree.
With this setup, I was shooting for versatility as a priority:
Hull: 40,000+
Shield Modifier: 1.0-1.15
Weapons: 4 Fore / 4 Aft
Crew: 1000
Device Slots: 4
Consoles: 3 Engineering; 3 Science; 3 Tactical; 1 Uni (I think a uni console would be a neat idea, but 3/3/3 at the least)
Turn Rate: 6-7
Bridge Stations:
. Cmdr Engineering: ####
. Lt. Engineering: ##
. Lt. Cmdr Science: ###
. Lt. Cmdr Tactical: ###
It would be VERY close to the D'Deridex-R. (Lt. Eng instead of Tac and Uni ensign stations).
The 2x Lt.Cmdr has already been done with the D'D-R, and Vo'Quv (+ Mirror), if not others.
And I don't believe it should mount dual cannons, as that should be reserved for the Gal-X variants. But that's just my opinion.
**puts 2 pennies on the table**
It's me, Chrome. [Join Date: May 2009]
"Oh, I may be captain by rank... but I never wanted to be anything else but an engineer." ~Montgomery Scott~
This was the most recent suggestion I had for a new Galaxy z-store ship. (posted in another thread)
Call it the Galaxy Class Command Cruiser or something.
I already know paxdawn believes it's game-breaking, but I completely disagree.
With this setup, I was shooting for versatility as a priority:
Hull: 40,000+
Shield Modifier: 1.0-1.15
Weapons: 4 Fore / 4 Aft
Crew: 1000
Device Slots: 4
Consoles: 3 Engineering; 3 Science; 3 Tactical; 1 Uni (I think a uni console would be a neat idea, but 3/3/3 at the least)
Turn Rate: 6-7
Bridge Stations:
. Cmdr Engineering: ####
. Lt. Engineering: ##
. Lt. Cmdr Science: ###
. Lt. Cmdr Tactical: ###
It would be VERY close to the D'Deridex-R. (Lt. Eng instead of Tac and Uni ensign stations).
The 2x Lt.Cmdr has already been done with the D'D-R, and Vo'Quv (+ Mirror), if not others.
And I don't believe it should mount dual cannons, as that should be reserved for the Gal-X variants. But that's just my opinion.
**puts 2 pennies on the table**
It's me, Chrome. [Join Date: May 2009]
"Oh, I may be captain by rank... but I never wanted to be anything else but an engineer." ~Montgomery Scott~
I truly shows how misinformed and fallacious your facts are. First of all You compoare a hafeh over a Galaxy R. It is like comparing apples and oranges. The Hafeh can be compared to a fed escort due to its turn 16 and Com Tac not any fed cruiser.
Secondly, Obelisk and Advanced Obelisk have both turn rate 5. Galaxy R has turn rate 6. In whatever math you have 6>5.
People bought Galaxy R for its current boff and console slots. these people are aware what they bought. No one forced you to buy or play the current Galaxy R. It fits a current playstyle and build which is contradictory to sci or tac playstyle or most galaxy r complainers, whiners in forums.
If these people who bought Galaxy R as it is are going to lose so much time and effort building a toon and build to maximize the ship, because some players just want to fit their playstyle, then so all other ships like escorts, sci ships, and all other non ENG Tank/healer build fed, romulan and klingon alike should be change their consoles and boff slots.
Its a good deal. all other ships transforms into Galaxy R stats while galaxy R transforms into ship stats that they want. Everybody gets what they want, and everybody loses their money and the time and effort they built for each of their toons and their ship.
The only part where I agree with you is that we ought not change the Gal-R.
People have already bought it. Changing it that in any significant way after the fact, I think, is just ethically wrong.
That said, sensationalism does not help your arguments.
Did anyone bring up a Galaxy class with Cmdr+Lt.Cmdr tac stations and 5 tac consoles?
You said it yourself: "It is like comparing apples and oranges."
Incidentally, the Tactical Bortas has 5 Tac Consoles. Possible Lt.Cmdr+Lt.+Ens Tac stations.
Fleet Adv. Heavy cruiser: 4. Lt.Cmdr Tac station.
Avenger/Mogh: 4. Possible Lt.Cmdr+Lt.+Ens Tac stations.
If you have such a beef with damage/Tac focused cruisers, then you are clearly barking up the wrong tree.
Where's your outrage on those other cruisers/battlecruisers?
It's me, Chrome. [Join Date: May 2009]
"Oh, I may be captain by rank... but I never wanted to be anything else but an engineer." ~Montgomery Scott~
Not necessarily for the Galaxy-R, but what I'd like as a non-Lobi option sometime would be CMDR Universal, Lt Engineering, Lt Science, Lt Tactical and Lt Universal.
I'm more than somewhat fed-up with the "you need dual cannons for best pew pew" thing. The entire starship weapon system desperately needs to be completely overhauled from the ground up.