I honestly don't care if the layout stays the same. I understand that Captain Geko has a specific niche set aside for the endgame Exploration Cruiser. The problem is that his theoretical role for the ship is completely redundant and not supported by the game mechanics. In order for the existing configuration to be viable, the following needs to happen:
Engineering consoles need to have options that increase damage so that a shortage of Tactical slots isn't an issue.
Ensign-level Engineering powers need more variety, so that the ship doesn't get tripped up by global cooldowns.
cryptic just released another ship that has a LTC and LT uni, that also allows you to forgo completely 1 of the 3 station types. not to mention theres 2 LTC station, ones even universal for christ sake.
the other ship, the cruiser, has a station setup similar to what some people have asked for the galaxy as well. scratch that configuration off the list.
COM eng LTC sci LT tac LT uni
ENS uni
Honestly, I wish they would stop with the non-faction ships. Pretty soon, the oddball player will be the one command a ship built at a Fed', KDF, or Romulan shipyard. When it was one or two designs, it was okay, now it's become an infestation of a grand scale.
I don't remember the lighted steps on the Enterprise - D, is that artistic licence? Perhaps return fire at JJ Abrams lens flare?
yreodred may correct me, but I think that the 'Order' variant, which is closest in color configuration to the actual Enterprise-D bridge doesn't have the lighted steps. At least from what I remember on the C-Store pics of the bridges (I'm not in game to check atm).
Or maybe the lights are there and it can all be added to the box of weird interpretations Cryptic does, like the bridge itself being the size of the Sydney Opera House.
You do know that Star Trek is not about "who has the biggest guns" right. The Federation only put weapons on their ships to defend them, even during wartime. Federation ships are not blindly focused on combat, they are focused a variety of tasks that Klingon vessels would simply never be able to achieve.
Honestly, I wish they would stop with the non-faction ships. Pretty soon, the oddball player will be the one command a ship built at a Fed', KDF, or Romulan shipyard. When it was one or two designs, it was okay, now it's become an infestation of a grand scale.
TBH, i don't care if one ship has the same BOFF/Console layout as another ship in game
When i fly a ship i like, couldn't care less if the next ship has the same BOFF layout.
I don't remember the lighted steps on the Enterprise - D, is that artistic licence? Perhaps return fire at JJ Abrams lens flare?
No, just Cryptics sense of "coolness".
Each of those 3 bridges are so much out of scale, you could put 4 "real" sized Galaxy Bridges in one of them, lol.
yreodred may correct me, but I think that the 'Order' variant, which is closest in color configuration to the actual Enterprise-D bridge doesn't have the lighted steps. At least from what I remember on the C-Store pics of the bridges (I'm not in game to check atm).
Or maybe the lights are there and it can all be added to the box of weird interpretations Cryptic does, like the bridge itself being the size of the Sydney Opera House.
The Defiant was a one time Exception, created by producers wanting to make Star Trek into something completely different.
Cryptic found it "cool" (of course) and made that type of ship (which is completely atypical for Star Trek) rule the entire game.
EDIT:
In-universe the Defiant was (just like the venegance) a try to militarize Starfleet. But this is not Starfleets way. They are Explorers defending the federation is only one of MANY other dutys they do perform.
Have you ever though why Starfleet ships have such a big volumina compared to Klingon or Romulan ships (canon, not Cryptics weird creations)?
Even J.J. Abrams (many ppl seem to hate so much) understands this.
This is what Star Trek make so different to other Sci fi universes i have no idea why this is even up to debate all the time. If you want to see Humans flying small flying Jetfighter-like ships then watch BSG, Star Wars or some other Series/Movies.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
I completely forgot that they somewhat 'enhanced' or changed the set for Generations. That's why I didn't remember the lights, cause I didn't remember the stairs! :P
To tell the truth, I'd like to have the one from the show more, without the consoles to the side of the Captain and First/Second Officer's seating. I always prefered smaller more compact bridges.
Anyone ever get the impression Cryptic/PWE hold the wrong license, Trek instead of Wars,
No, but I'm getting the impression that Star Trek has the wrong developer.
The really sad part is that I wasn't getting that impression before some 6 months ago.
I'll buy that with the conditional statement that the selective use of canon is across the board, not just by Cryptic, not just by those who aren't in line with a certain belief by some players on what the ship should be, but by all.
the problem is not that some galaxy fan want that everyone be in line with the idea that the galaxy should be the best ship ever.
the problem is not that the non galaxy fan want that everyone be in line with the idea that the galaxy should be an inneficient brick.
in the end that is irrelevant.
what is relevant in the end, is that a compagny that design MMO do not use these bias point of view to intentionally make a ship bad in everyway just because they don't want it to be as good than an other ( here the sovereign ).
this is acceptable in a solo game where the player have acces to these ship in the progression of the game.
this is not acceptable in an MMO where ships should be as efficient as others but in different way, and not outright bad in everything... just because.
forget about canon, forget that we are talking about a galaxy or sovereign, call them robert and peter if you want.
even without canon the problem is still here, there is no reason why robert should be les efficient than peter, but also less efficient than marie, lucie, gerard,ngyuen and brian.
I agree that this ship should have a role, and I think that role should be an engineer-heavy cruiser, but Cryptic really needs to revamp the way that engineer BOff skills and consoles work to bring them to parity with the other classes. It can be done, and I think that there would be many more options of current ships that people have and could use more effectively if parity between the classes/ship was addressed.
the engeneer class do need a revamp indeed, but this has nothing to do with the galaxy problem.
the galaxy is not useless because he suffer engeneer ineficiency.
the galaxy is useless because their is nothing he can do differently then other cruiser that are also engie heavy.
an enhanced engie galaxy would still be useless against an enhanced engie star cruiser.
in a role point of view there is nothing that you can do with a galaxy that you can not do with a star cruiser.
an ambassador can do things that a star cruiser can't because of it ltcommander sci.
why is this so difficult to anderstand?
better engie power may help your exelsior indeed, but will not give the galaxy a role, that for sure.
the bo layout in conjonction with turn and inertia determines the role of a ship, not the efficiency of it specific career power.
engineer-heavy cruiser is not a role it a class of ship, if it were, every cruiser would have the same role then.
stating that the role of the galaxy should be engie heavy cruiser daesn't mean anything.
this is not a fight to make cruiser closing the gap in term of firepower with escort, this is to make the galaxy a real choice in end game cruiser.
this guy said it better than me.
Polishing up Engineering abilities in general may help the Galaxy, but it needs to have something of its own. It needs to have a reason to exist in the playable ship lineup...
and i would concluded by... other than beeing a bad star cruiser clone.... with a galaxy skin.
You do know that Star Trek is not about "who has the biggest guns" right. The Federation only put weapons on their ships to defend them, even during wartime. Federation ships are not blindly focused on combat, they are focused a variety of tasks that Klingon vessels would simply never be able to achieve.
Technically, the Klingon's should never have Quantum Slipstream in this game because the Klingon Empire would hardly be interested in that technology. They are mostly brain-dead now and like big and better guns. Ever since the end of the Federation-Klingon Alliance made no logical sense.
Brain dead? My my, your arrogance is showing.
Klingons are conquest minded unlike Star Fleet. So any technology that can be seen to strengthen that is of interest to the Empire.
Ensign-level Engineering powers need more variety, so that the ship doesn't get tripped up by global cooldowns.
yes, that for sure.
Engineering consoles need to have options that increase damage so that a shortage of Tactical slots isn't an issue.
no, that is just power creep, with the additional effect to not have the desire effect since 90% of escort got 3 engeener console slot and some even got 4.
guess what they will slot into it then?
Brain dead? My my, your arrogance is showing.
Klingons are conquest minded unlike Star Fleet. So any technology that can be seen to strengthen that is of interest to the Empire.
Quoted for truth, otherwise the wouldn't even be still using K'tingas or Somraws, no matter how heavly retrofitted they can be.
The pure problem with the Galaxy stems from the belief that the Excelsior is a better ship. Why? you may ask? Well according to Geko, it simply is, for no logical reason and in this game, he is god. He makes the rules and you are all just simply playing a game that is in line with what he wants.
Unfortunately, I only foresee the Galaxy changing, if Geko is one day hopefully sent packing back to social security and we get in somebody who is actually capable to look after the interest of iconic vessels and has passion and drive for Star Trek OVER money. His blatant misrepresentation and misunderstanding of certain iconic ships (Klingon ones included) is shocking and shows a real lack of talent and almost an open distain for Star Trek in general. The Negh'var has been horribly misrepresented as well as the D'Deridex.
You all saw the interview, you all heard and read what he said. He simply doesn't CARE! Because he's still getting his exceptionally large paycheck at the end of every month for producing sub-par ships and content. Capitalism at its best, folks!
Brain dead? My my, your arrogance is showing.
Klingons are conquest minded unlike Star Fleet. So any technology that can be seen to strengthen that is of interest to the Empire.
Right, the take the cool shiny without knowing how it works and kill those that do. The moderates in the Klingon empire are despised for being weak even though they are providing the support for the 'superior' houses. Hmm, didn't someone get upset because one of the houses concentrated on farming? The warrior caste mentality has been pushed so far into an extreme that if the Klingons were contained they would destroy themselves through stagnation and self destruction brought on by arrogance and short sightedness.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
basically the guy search for opinion for helping him to choose between a galaxy and a star cruiser.
guess what he choose in the end?
and the guy clearly don't ask for firepower, but pure tanking
Well, shortly after the game finished patching today I decided to get the Fleet Star Cruiser because of the 4 sci consoles, having an ensign sci instead of engi, faster turn rate, and being able to use the mirror skin. I am glad I got this ship. I am able to quite easily tank against anything I have done so far (Contested Zone in Dyson Sphere going against a citadel and its support ships on my own, and against the cubes/gates in KSE). The build I am using so far is http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=ussindomitablefleetstarcruiserbuild_0
Right, the take the cool shiny without knowing how it works and kill those that do.
Riiiiiighhhttt.....you do understand that you're talking about a civilization that has been invaded by an spacefaring Hur'q species when said civilization was on the level of development that would equal the Earth timeframe of the Dark Ages, then exterminated the much more advanced Hur'q and managed not only to understand how their technology works, but completely recreate it and established one of the most feared interstellar Empires on the base on that technology.
Now apply the said scenario to our 'Dark Age' and tell me with a straight face that we would have recreated such technology from an alien race in that period of time on Earth.
Right, the take the cool shiny without knowing how it works and kill those that do. The moderates in the Klingon empire are despised for being weak even though they are providing the support for the 'superior' houses. Hmm, didn't someone get upset because one of the houses concentrated on farming? The warrior caste mentality has been pushed so far into an extreme that if the Klingons were contained they would destroy themselves through stagnation and self destruction brought on by arrogance and short sightedness.
And your narrow mindedness is showing as well. You only see what little view has been given by the limited TV and movie appearances. It does not show the whole picture.
Its akin to saying all Americans are camo wearing gun toting soldiers if I lived in Irag because thats all I would ever see without accepting that its one aspect of a much larger society.
Makes little difference to me. Keep the zealots view that only the Humans are the paragonof the galaxy and all other races/ societies are just barbarians grubbing in the dirt. Such stupidity fits well with how Star Fleet is viewed from the outside and your mindset supports it perfectly.
And your narrow mindedness is showing as well. You only see what little view has been given by the limited TV and movie appearances. It does not show the whole picture.
Its akin to saying all Americans are camo wearing gun toting soldiers if I lived in Irag because thats all I would ever see without accepting that its one aspect of a much larger society.
Makes little difference to me. Keep the zealots view that only the Humans are the paragonof the galaxy and all other races/ societies are just barbarians grubbing in the dirt. Such stupidity fits well with how Star Fleet is viewed from the outside and your mindset supports it perfectly.
Are you finished insulting people? Seriously, the Klingons want to be seen as more then just the STO players that want to whine about everything then why are you even here, complaining about the KDF which is not even the point of this topic.
For the record, I completely agree with the majority of KDF complaints. Simply put, Federation ships should not have 5 weapon slots at the front or even HAVE ESCORTS. The Defiant was an exception but Cryptic seem intent of making it a rule.
I think it would have been more unique to let the Federation have "Frigates" INSTEAD of Escorts with the Defiant taking a more "destroyer" like role that normal destroyers do. Just a lot less tanky. Frigates would have synergy with Duel Beam Banks and the YES, there would be T5 Miranda as I'm using that as an example. Watch Wrath of Khan and look at the Reliant's phasers. THAT is what I want to see for smaller ships...
The Federation only had ONE ship with canons, ever other Federation ship in existance had BEAM WEAPONS! Why can't Cryptic just get this right. Give the Klingon's their canons and uniqueness and give people a reason to play the Klingons and give the Federation uniqueness as well.
Brain dead? My my, your arrogance is showing.
Klingons are conquest minded unlike Star Fleet. So any technology that can be seen to strengthen that is of interest to the Empire.
In his defense, he said "braindead NOW" and that's about right. All factions in STO are portrayed as being total morons. The whole game is depicting morons because otherwise there would be a brief moment without shooting each other...
(...)Give the Klingon's their canons and uniqueness and give people a reason to play the Klingons and give the Federation uniqueness as well.(...)
Cannons shouldn't even be the Klingons specialty. Aside from the B'Rel and K'Vort, prime-universe Klingon ships were shown to utilise far more beam weapons (single emitters and banks) than the game suggests. My personal opinion is that Klingons should excel at torpedo weaponry, Starfleet sport superior beams (arrays) and Romulans would specialize in heavy cannon weapons (Warbird fore cannons).
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
Are you finished insulting people? Seriously, the Klingons want to be seen as more then just the STO players that want to whine about everything then why are you even here, complaining about the KDF which is not even the point of this topic.
For the record, I completely agree with the majority of KDF complaints. Simply put, Federation ships should not have 5 weapon slots at the front or even HAVE ESCORTS. The Defiant was an exception but Cryptic seem intent of making it a rule.
I think it would have been more unique to let the Federation have "Frigates" INSTEAD of Escorts with the Defiant taking a more "destroyer" like role that normal destroyers do. Just a lot less tanky. Frigates would have synergy with Duel Beam Banks and the YES, there would be T5 Miranda as I'm using that as an example. Watch Wrath of Khan and look at the Reliant's phasers. THAT is what I want to see for smaller ships...
The Federation only had ONE ship with canons, ever other Federation ship in existance had BEAM WEAPONS! Why can't Cryptic just get this right. Give the Klingon's their canons and uniqueness and give people a reason to play the Klingons and give the Federation uniqueness as well.
Everyone happy... JOB DONE!
Feds should have been the top with beam weapons with there cruisers whopping back any alien threat just like canon showed it and how it was wrote over and over
the defiant was armed with pulsle phasers not cannons
The klingons should be the cannon race with there destroyers and scout ships and second class in cruisers just like canon state's over and over
Romulans there green beams and the real plasma device like the Tavaro has
So much for canon look what we get
Jellico....Engineer ground.....Da'val Romulan space Sci
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Feds should have been the top with beam weapons with there cruisers whopping back any alien threat just like canon showed it and how it was wrote over and over
the defiant was armed with pulsle phasers not cannons
The klingons should be the cannon race with there destroyers and scout ships and second class in cruisers just like canon state's over and over
Romulans there green beams and the real plasma device like the Tavaro has
So much for canon look what we get
Yeah, Cryptic has used their "soft-canon" excuse to completely rewrite Star Trek to what THEY WANT it to be.
And your narrow mindedness is showing as well. You only see what little view has been given by the limited TV and movie appearances. It does not show the whole picture.
Its akin to saying all Americans are camo wearing gun toting soldiers if I lived in Irag because thats all I would ever see without accepting that its one aspect of a much larger society.
Makes little difference to me. Keep the zealots view that only the Humans are the paragonof the galaxy and all other races/ societies are just barbarians grubbing in the dirt. Such stupidity fits well with how Star Fleet is viewed from the outside and your mindset supports it perfectly.
So many things to reply to so let's go from the beginning.
Yup my knowledge of the movies and TV shows is vastly inferior to your time actually living on Qo'nos. Please feel free to let the rest of us know how that went.
Zealot's view: Again have to ask someone on these forums to not put words in my mouth. I commented on your points about klingons. Humans and Romulans have their own issues and I could spend entire threads debating them. If you wish to point the way to that thread and we can show the strengths and weaknesses of all three major (from our perspective) groups.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
Riiiiiighhhttt.....you do understand that you're talking about a civilization that has been invaded by an spacefaring Hur'q species when said civilization was on the level of development that would equal the Earth timeframe of the Dark Ages, then exterminated the much more advanced Hur'q and managed not only to understand how their technology works, but completely recreate it and established one of the most feared interstellar Empires on the base on that technology.
Now apply the said scenario to our 'Dark Age' and tell me with a straight face that we would have recreated such technology from an alien race in that period of time on Earth.
Nope can't say it. The church during the dark ages on Earth would have had the demonic devices burned. Also does anyone know that they recreated all of the technology or just what they felt like could hurt people with? Also how long were the Hur'q in control of Qo'nos? (Sorry at work, I can't watch the clip) During that time how much did they teach the reluctant klingon people? How far have they gotten since then growing the technology on thier own?
My favourite section of the Way of the Warrior was the klingon assault on the station. 80+ ships attacking. Over a dozen destroyed and boarders got in. The station gets it's legs back and challenges the armada. The klingons have twenty(?) ships coming as reinforcements. DS9 had five. That number of federation starships was enough to give pause to that armada for diplomacy to convince them the attack was a waste given a common enemy.
(Looking at the scenario, either klingon ships are very weak compared to federation ships. Or they should have reversed the reinforcements number. As is, it makes the klingons look way inferior.)
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
there was at least 1 galaxy class on the way to the station. oh but those are toothless and suck, no one should give pause if one of those shows up :rolleyes:
Comments
I totally agree
Cool. Thank you very much for this!
I knew someone here is bound to have the pack.
Btw, what species is your char in the pics? Is it a custom made alien?
Honestly, I wish they would stop with the non-faction ships. Pretty soon, the oddball player will be the one command a ship built at a Fed', KDF, or Romulan shipyard. When it was one or two designs, it was okay, now it's become an infestation of a grand scale.
I don't remember the lighted steps on the Enterprise - D, is that artistic licence? Perhaps return fire at JJ Abrams lens flare?
yreodred may correct me, but I think that the 'Order' variant, which is closest in color configuration to the actual Enterprise-D bridge doesn't have the lighted steps. At least from what I remember on the C-Store pics of the bridges (I'm not in game to check atm).
Or maybe the lights are there and it can all be added to the box of weird interpretations Cryptic does, like the bridge itself being the size of the Sydney Opera House.
Tell that to the Defiant.
Yeah, that alien is my main character inspired by Arex.
But don't ask me about TAS, i have never seen it i just found that alien cool.
TBH, i don't care if one ship has the same BOFF/Console layout as another ship in game
When i fly a ship i like, couldn't care less if the next ship has the same BOFF layout.
No, just Cryptics sense of "coolness".
Each of those 3 bridges are so much out of scale, you could put 4 "real" sized Galaxy Bridges in one of them, lol.
Here's a better picture of the order Bridge.
LINK
The Defiant was a one time Exception, created by producers wanting to make Star Trek into something completely different.
Cryptic found it "cool" (of course) and made that type of ship (which is completely atypical for Star Trek) rule the entire game.
EDIT:
In-universe the Defiant was (just like the venegance) a try to militarize Starfleet. But this is not Starfleets way. They are Explorers defending the federation is only one of MANY other dutys they do perform.
Have you ever though why Starfleet ships have such a big volumina compared to Klingon or Romulan ships (canon, not Cryptics weird creations)?
Even J.J. Abrams (many ppl seem to hate so much) understands this.
This is what Star Trek make so different to other Sci fi universes i have no idea why this is even up to debate all the time. If you want to see Humans flying small flying Jetfighter-like ships then watch BSG, Star Wars or some other Series/Movies.
http://techspecs.acalltoduty.com/images/galaxy/ed-bridge-generations%5B1%5D.jpg
as you can see it did have steps and step lighting based on how it looked form the series
http://startrekblog.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/bridge.jpg
Ah yes, thanks for posting this!
I completely forgot that they somewhat 'enhanced' or changed the set for Generations.
To tell the truth, I'd like to have the one from the show more, without the consoles to the side of the Captain and First/Second Officer's seating. I always prefered smaller more compact bridges.
No, but I'm getting the impression that Star Trek has the wrong developer.
The really sad part is that I wasn't getting that impression before some 6 months ago.
the problem is not that some galaxy fan want that everyone be in line with the idea that the galaxy should be the best ship ever.
the problem is not that the non galaxy fan want that everyone be in line with the idea that the galaxy should be an inneficient brick.
in the end that is irrelevant.
what is relevant in the end, is that a compagny that design MMO do not use these bias point of view to intentionally make a ship bad in everyway just because they don't want it to be as good than an other ( here the sovereign ).
this is acceptable in a solo game where the player have acces to these ship in the progression of the game.
this is not acceptable in an MMO where ships should be as efficient as others but in different way, and not outright bad in everything... just because.
forget about canon, forget that we are talking about a galaxy or sovereign, call them robert and peter if you want.
even without canon the problem is still here, there is no reason why robert should be les efficient than peter, but also less efficient than marie, lucie, gerard,ngyuen and brian.
the engeneer class do need a revamp indeed, but this has nothing to do with the galaxy problem.
the galaxy is not useless because he suffer engeneer ineficiency.
the galaxy is useless because their is nothing he can do differently then other cruiser that are also engie heavy.
an enhanced engie galaxy would still be useless against an enhanced engie star cruiser.
in a role point of view there is nothing that you can do with a galaxy that you can not do with a star cruiser.
an ambassador can do things that a star cruiser can't because of it ltcommander sci.
why is this so difficult to anderstand?
better engie power may help your exelsior indeed, but will not give the galaxy a role, that for sure.
the bo layout in conjonction with turn and inertia determines the role of a ship, not the efficiency of it specific career power.
engineer-heavy cruiser is not a role it a class of ship, if it were, every cruiser would have the same role then.
stating that the role of the galaxy should be engie heavy cruiser daesn't mean anything.
this is not a fight to make cruiser closing the gap in term of firepower with escort, this is to make the galaxy a real choice in end game cruiser.
this guy said it better than me.
and i would concluded by... other than beeing a bad star cruiser clone.... with a galaxy skin.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
Brain dead? My my, your arrogance is showing.
Klingons are conquest minded unlike Star Fleet. So any technology that can be seen to strengthen that is of interest to the Empire.
R.I.P
yes, that for sure.
no, that is just power creep, with the additional effect to not have the desire effect since 90% of escort got 3 engeener console slot and some even got 4.
guess what they will slot into it then?
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
Quoted for truth, otherwise the wouldn't even be still using K'tingas or Somraws, no matter how heavly retrofitted they can be.
Unfortunately, I only foresee the Galaxy changing, if Geko is one day hopefully sent packing back to social security and we get in somebody who is actually capable to look after the interest of iconic vessels and has passion and drive for Star Trek OVER money. His blatant misrepresentation and misunderstanding of certain iconic ships (Klingon ones included) is shocking and shows a real lack of talent and almost an open distain for Star Trek in general. The Negh'var has been horribly misrepresented as well as the D'Deridex.
You all saw the interview, you all heard and read what he said. He simply doesn't CARE! Because he's still getting his exceptionally large paycheck at the end of every month for producing sub-par ships and content. Capitalism at its best, folks!
Right, the take the cool shiny without knowing how it works and kill those that do. The moderates in the Klingon empire are despised for being weak even though they are providing the support for the 'superior' houses. Hmm, didn't someone get upset because one of the houses concentrated on farming? The warrior caste mentality has been pushed so far into an extreme that if the Klingons were contained they would destroy themselves through stagnation and self destruction brought on by arrogance and short sightedness.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
this trhead:
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=909601&page=2
basically the guy search for opinion for helping him to choose between a galaxy and a star cruiser.
guess what he choose in the end?
and the guy clearly don't ask for firepower, but pure tanking
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
Riiiiiighhhttt.....you do understand that you're talking about a civilization that has been invaded by an spacefaring Hur'q species when said civilization was on the level of development that would equal the Earth timeframe of the Dark Ages, then exterminated the much more advanced Hur'q and managed not only to understand how their technology works, but completely recreate it and established one of the most feared interstellar Empires on the base on that technology.
Now apply the said scenario to our 'Dark Age' and tell me with a straight face that we would have recreated such technology from an alien race in that period of time on Earth.
And your narrow mindedness is showing as well. You only see what little view has been given by the limited TV and movie appearances. It does not show the whole picture.
Its akin to saying all Americans are camo wearing gun toting soldiers if I lived in Irag because thats all I would ever see without accepting that its one aspect of a much larger society.
Makes little difference to me. Keep the zealots view that only the Humans are the paragonof the galaxy and all other races/ societies are just barbarians grubbing in the dirt. Such stupidity fits well with how Star Fleet is viewed from the outside and your mindset supports it perfectly.
R.I.P
Are you finished insulting people? Seriously, the Klingons want to be seen as more then just the STO players that want to whine about everything then why are you even here, complaining about the KDF which is not even the point of this topic.
For the record, I completely agree with the majority of KDF complaints. Simply put, Federation ships should not have 5 weapon slots at the front or even HAVE ESCORTS. The Defiant was an exception but Cryptic seem intent of making it a rule.
I think it would have been more unique to let the Federation have "Frigates" INSTEAD of Escorts with the Defiant taking a more "destroyer" like role that normal destroyers do. Just a lot less tanky. Frigates would have synergy with Duel Beam Banks and the YES, there would be T5 Miranda as I'm using that as an example. Watch Wrath of Khan and look at the Reliant's phasers. THAT is what I want to see for smaller ships...
The Federation only had ONE ship with canons, ever other Federation ship in existance had BEAM WEAPONS! Why can't Cryptic just get this right. Give the Klingon's their canons and uniqueness and give people a reason to play the Klingons and give the Federation uniqueness as well.
Everyone happy... JOB DONE!
In his defense, he said "braindead NOW" and that's about right. All factions in STO are portrayed as being total morons. The whole game is depicting morons because otherwise there would be a brief moment without shooting each other...
Cannons shouldn't even be the Klingons specialty. Aside from the B'Rel and K'Vort, prime-universe Klingon ships were shown to utilise far more beam weapons (single emitters and banks) than the game suggests. My personal opinion is that Klingons should excel at torpedo weaponry, Starfleet sport superior beams (arrays) and Romulans would specialize in heavy cannon weapons (Warbird fore cannons).
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Feds should have been the top with beam weapons with there cruisers whopping back any alien threat just like canon showed it and how it was wrote over and over
the defiant was armed with pulsle phasers not cannons
The klingons should be the cannon race with there destroyers and scout ships and second class in cruisers just like canon state's over and over
Romulans there green beams and the real plasma device like the Tavaro has
So much for canon look what we get
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Yeah, Cryptic has used their "soft-canon" excuse to completely rewrite Star Trek to what THEY WANT it to be.
So many things to reply to so let's go from the beginning.
Yup my knowledge of the movies and TV shows is vastly inferior to your time actually living on Qo'nos. Please feel free to let the rest of us know how that went.
Zealot's view: Again have to ask someone on these forums to not put words in my mouth. I commented on your points about klingons. Humans and Romulans have their own issues and I could spend entire threads debating them. If you wish to point the way to that thread and we can show the strengths and weaknesses of all three major (from our perspective) groups.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
I am sorry, I do not understand the point of your statement as a response to mine. Can you please elaborate?
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
Nope can't say it. The church during the dark ages on Earth would have had the demonic devices burned. Also does anyone know that they recreated all of the technology or just what they felt like could hurt people with? Also how long were the Hur'q in control of Qo'nos? (Sorry at work, I can't watch the clip) During that time how much did they teach the reluctant klingon people? How far have they gotten since then growing the technology on thier own?
My favourite section of the Way of the Warrior was the klingon assault on the station. 80+ ships attacking. Over a dozen destroyed and boarders got in. The station gets it's legs back and challenges the armada. The klingons have twenty(?) ships coming as reinforcements. DS9 had five. That number of federation starships was enough to give pause to that armada for diplomacy to convince them the attack was a waste given a common enemy.
(Looking at the scenario, either klingon ships are very weak compared to federation ships. Or they should have reversed the reinforcements number. As is, it makes the klingons look way inferior.)
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.