Gene Roddenberry had one simple thing when it came to starships with his series, "Starfleet Vessels had to be immediately identifiable".
You get a bunch of Star Trek fans, show them that picture and the first thing in their minds is "Vulcan Ship" because of that Warp Ring. But you show them a badly drawn ship with a saucer and some warp nacelles, and the first thing you think of is "Federation Starship".
Again I can understand the point you're making but I disagree, any Star Trek fan who looks at that ship will see a Starfleet Vessel, it does not have a "warp ring", it is an arch or a curve. Every other aspect of that ship design says Starfleet so why would anyone think Vulcan? Cryptic could just alter the model slightly and add it as a skin and then you could vote with you're wallet.
People don't need to be designers themselves to criticize something. Far from it; if you're a designer, the vast majority of people you're trying to appeal to are non-designers.
You don't need to direct a movie, or author a book, or paint a picture to have an opinion on a movie, book, or painting.
+1 I hate when people use this lazy argument, it's simple trolling.
This might be interesting if scaled wayyyyyyy down (think Nova size) and refocused a bit with some D'Kyr and 2150's scout ship elements as a modern Vulcan cruiser. An update to that 2150's design would be welcome. Perhaps a Vulcan escort.
Delta Rising is the best expansion ever and the players love it! No, seriously! ...Why are you laughing so hard?
When Rademaker was making the Vesta, he specifically said his nacelles were meant to integrate the slipstream system. And he went back and forth with Eaves, Drexler, Okuda, Probert, etc. Then there is the ship that gave us slipstream, the Dauntless, that too had nacelles.
And with Transwarp, do I need not remind you of the Borg. Giant Cubes in space? I really don't think design has anything to do with that sysytem. :rolleyes:
I don't know much about the Vesta, but to me those nacelles look like any other nacelles.
even the Renegade Borg Ship opened these conduits and the 1701-D did actually follow it through it (and there was a nice Visual FX how it entered it too) after managing to open it with it's deflector, so did Voyager.
There is no need for a Transwarp drive like the Excelsior was supposed to have.
So where is the Federations Transwarp Hub? Do we even have one or do we just ride in Borg Conduits all the time?
And why can we Transwarp to locations (ESD, DS9, K7) who do not have a Stargate like that as exit point anywhere in sight?
For me those Transwarp to X buttons are just what they are, "load this map instantly"-buttons for convenience. Not actual technological advancement.....
also one would think, if you can go faster, then you can go further.
With this tech we should be able to fly around the Gamma and Delta Quadrants just like that, and the real explorers should already be as far as the next Galaxy outside of ours... mapping gaseous anomalies or whatever...
Again I can understand the point you're making but I disagree, any Star Trek fan who looks at that ship will see a Starfleet Vessel, it does not have a "warp ring", it is an arch or a curve. Every other aspect of that ship design says Starfleet so why would anyone think Vulcan? Cryptic could just alter the model slightly and add it as a skin and then you could vote with you're wallet.
Again, I rather Cryptic spend their resources wisely on remaining canonical ships than experimenting with "what ifs".
even the Renegade Borg Ship opened these conduits and the 1701-D did actually follow it through it (and there was a nice Visual FX how it entered it too) after managing to open it with it's deflector, so did Voyager.
There is no need for a Transwarp drive like the Excelsior was supposed to have.
So where is the Federations Transwarp Hub? Do we even have one or do we just ride in Borg Conduits all the time?
And why can we Transwarp to locations (ESD, DS9, K7) who do not have a Stargate like that as exit point anywhere in sight?
For me those Transwarp to X buttons are just what they are, "load this map instantly"-buttons for convenience. Not actual technological advancement.....
also one would think, if you can go faster, then you can go further.
With this tech we should be able to fly around the Gamma and Delta Quadrants just like that, and the real explorers should already be as far as the next Galaxy outside of ours... mapping gaseous anomalies or whatever...
Transwarp Hubs are not the same as the Borg Transwarp System that uses the Drive Coils.
And not sure why you suddenly ranting about the transwarp system, the point of the response is that starship design had nothing to do with the Transwarp system.
This is a form before function look that if you really think about it, is TRIBBLE to hell.
If you like this design, then answer this... What is the function of the back "scaffold"? No, you can't answer that, don't even try. It's not a deflector and it's not an impulse engine and it's not inertial dampeners. It's just... Fluff.
It seems this guy thought Starfleet would design a new vessel with the Vulcan rim push-pull design, which is laughable. It's outdated.... This design is just pants-on-head. Utterly. No redeeming features.
The vanity I find rather offensive tbh.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] bloodpact.net
"The greatest danger for most of us is not that our aim is too high and we miss it, but that it is too low and we reach it."
Again, I rather Cryptic spend their resources wisely on remaining canonical ships than experimenting with "what ifs".
"Wisely" is a loaded word there; while it may be your preference, it's a fact (and has been stated here by devs before) that the Cryptic-designed ships are very popular in the C-store and in the game. I think pursuing a mix of canon, fanon, and original ships is probably more "wise".
Former moderator of these forums. Lifetime sub since before launch. Been here since before public betas. Foundry author of "Franklin Drake Must Die".
"Wisely" is a loaded word there; while it may be your preference, it's a fact (and has been stated here by devs before) that the Cryptic-designed ships are very popular in the C-store and in the game. I think pursuing a mix of canon, fanon, and original ships is probably more "wise".
You misunderstand me, I wasn't refering to the already existing ships. I was refering to this "Fan" Odyssey.
any Star Trek fan who looks at that ship will see a Starfleet Vessel
Clearly this isn't true, because there's a number of Star Trek fans here who look at ship and do not think Starfleet. One of them being me. There may be some who do, but there's also a number who don't.
I wouldn't care if the ship was in the game, although personally I have to say it's not a very nice design. Looks too much like a cross between standard ST ships and something else. But it's clearly not evocative of Starfleet to a number of people.
Clearly this isn't true, because there's a number of Star Trek fans here who look at ship and do not think Starfleet. One of them being me. There may be some who do, but there's also a number who don't.
I wouldn't care if the ship was in the game, although personally I have to say it's not a very nice design. Looks too much like a cross between standard ST ships and something else. But it's clearly not evocative of Starfleet to a number of people.
Then I stand corrected, I just though since the whole design is basically Starfleet except for the arched nacelle it would be easy to spot as a Starfleet vessel.
No matter the design, I feel like we should have extra parts for the Ody so we can have customization. We currently don't have any parts to swap out in the Ody.
saw the pictures...Meh....sorry not an enterprise which is what it's supposed to be. Personally...I'd like to see an Odyssey variant that has a single neck rather than that dual bulging monstrosity. The Oberth is the ugliest ship in existence for a reason.
I don't see how that makes a difference? Compare the shape of all the Enterprise variants. From the TOS Connie to the Sovereign, there was a common, general shape. The Enterprise E doesn't share the same nacelles as the TOS Connie but shares the general configuration.
That's the point, Starfleet vessels use linear warp Nacelles. From the Phoenix all the way to the Enterprise-J.
You clearly did not understand the conversation where the person I was responding to pointed out that the Miranda's Rollbar was similar, which it was not. The Miranda's rollbar was a structral addition to allow additional weapon systems such as Phaser Banks, the Torpedo launcher, and in STO the Deflector Dish. While he was comparing it to the Fan Odyssey's warp ring and trying to equate the two. Which was like comparing apples and oranges.
their Ships can enter those conduits, but they could not go to Transwarp *just like that* from anywhere.
even the Renegade Borg Ship opened these conduits and the 1701-D did actually follow it through it (and there was a nice Visual FX how it entered it too) after managing to open it with it's deflector, so did Voyager.
There is no need for a Transwarp drive like the Excelsior was supposed to have.
So where is the Federations Transwarp Hub? Do we even have one or do we just ride in Borg Conduits all the time?
And why can we Transwarp to locations (ESD, DS9, K7) who do not have a Stargate like that as exit point anywhere in sight?
For me those Transwarp to X buttons are just what they are, "load this map instantly"-buttons for convenience. Not actual technological advancement.....
.
Do you even read what you write? You contradicted yourself several times in one post.
Though I do agree, there should be gates of some sort at the various bases you can diplo-transwarp to.
Cryptic BUY THIS DUDE OUT and add it as Alternate Visual for the Oddy!
Not a fan of the nacelle overbridge, but the colour scheme is rather pretty.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
___________________________
Joined April 2008. Lifetime Subscriber. Original member of the original 2nd Fleet.
Expended $1,961 USD on this game - regretting it all. This game and some of its staff disappointed me, time and again, per every single cent spent!!!
That's the point, Starfleet vessels use linear warp Nacelles. From the Phoenix all the way to the Enterprise-J.
And they can never deviate from that can they? So it does not matter what new shape the actual hull takes, as long as it has standard Starfleet warp nacelles its a Starfleet ship. And its a Nacelle arch, not a ring like you keep saying it is.
I am happy for Cryptic to add all the canon ships even if they are relics, but I also want to see some fresh designs, why not a class of ship with an arched nacelle? Or more Defiant style ships with the nacelles built in? Or large Cruisers/science vessels with built-in nacelles?
1st pics looks very good to me. but only cause the nacelle-thing seems to be a part of the saucer/hull.
a re-work with a saucer/hull like that and fitting-(canon-)warp nacelles (don't care if endo- or exo) and you get my vote .
Hell no! I would take the Jupiter over that...thing.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
And they can never deviate from that can they? So it does not matter what new shape the actual hull takes, as long as it has standard Starfleet warp nacelles its a Starfleet ship. And its a Nacelle arch, not a ring like you keep saying it is.
I am happy for Cryptic to add all the canon ships even if they are relics, but I also want to see some fresh designs, why not a class of ship with an arched nacelle? Or more Defiant style ships with the nacelles built in? Or large Cruisers/science vessels with built-in nacelles?
Why does CBS get so involved with STO's ship design ideas, etc... any of the previous games, particularly Starfleet Academy, Legacy, etc... seem to have a more unique selection of ships. Particularly where the first game is concerned and including subsequent sequels allowed players to play a variety of different species with their own story arch, ship choices, etc...
Don't get me wrong, I love STO but CBS keeps popping up as being a major party pooper.
"The world ain't all sunshine and rainbows. It's a very mean and nasty place and I don't care how tough you are it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it. You, me, or nobody is gonna hit as hard as life. But it ain't about how hard ya hit. It's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward." - Rocky Balboa (2006)
if you want to put a phaser lance on it, then sure. Otherwise, what's the point. No v neck for slipstream, no slot for the Aquarius which was specifically designed to give added firepower to the Odyssey, does not look like the saucer separates from the stardrive. what would be the point of this design?
Hell no! I would take the Jupiter over that...thing.
Jupiter SUCKS! Why do you think they replaced it ingame with the Galaxy Refit. Maneuverability is next to nothing, poor weapons layout, speed is non existent, hull integrity is terrible. A Jupiter is essentially a big, lumbering target.
Comments
Again I can understand the point you're making but I disagree, any Star Trek fan who looks at that ship will see a Starfleet Vessel, it does not have a "warp ring", it is an arch or a curve. Every other aspect of that ship design says Starfleet so why would anyone think Vulcan? Cryptic could just alter the model slightly and add it as a skin and then you could vote with you're wallet.
+1 I hate when people use this lazy argument, it's simple trolling.
This might be interesting if scaled wayyyyyyy down (think Nova size) and refocused a bit with some D'Kyr and 2150's scout ship elements as a modern Vulcan cruiser. An update to that 2150's design would be welcome. Perhaps a Vulcan escort.
I don't know much about the Vesta, but to me those nacelles look like any other nacelles.
The Borg... interesting that you say this, because the Borg have giant Transwarp Hubs like this
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Transwarp_hub?file=Transwarphub.jpg
their Ships can enter those conduits, but they could not go to Transwarp *just like that* from anywhere.
all we need in STO is a Stargate like this http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110913015916/stargate/images/1/16/Jumper.jpg
uhm sorry like this: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-mrqjUoTgPyY/UHNWdmahHrI/AAAAAAAACPQ/4FLTdlMnhyI/s1600/Transwarp-1.jpg
even the Renegade Borg Ship opened these conduits and the 1701-D did actually follow it through it (and there was a nice Visual FX how it entered it too) after managing to open it with it's deflector, so did Voyager.
There is no need for a Transwarp drive like the Excelsior was supposed to have.
So where is the Federations Transwarp Hub? Do we even have one or do we just ride in Borg Conduits all the time?
And why can we Transwarp to locations (ESD, DS9, K7) who do not have a Stargate like that as exit point anywhere in sight?
For me those Transwarp to X buttons are just what they are, "load this map instantly"-buttons for convenience. Not actual technological advancement.....
also one would think, if you can go faster, then you can go further.
With this tech we should be able to fly around the Gamma and Delta Quadrants just like that, and the real explorers should already be as far as the next Galaxy outside of ours... mapping gaseous anomalies or whatever...
Again, I rather Cryptic spend their resources wisely on remaining canonical ships than experimenting with "what ifs".
The difference is the Reliant had normal warp Nacelles.
Transwarp Hubs are not the same as the Borg Transwarp System that uses the Drive Coils.
And not sure why you suddenly ranting about the transwarp system, the point of the response is that starship design had nothing to do with the Transwarp system.
This is a form before function look that if you really think about it, is TRIBBLE to hell.
If you like this design, then answer this... What is the function of the back "scaffold"? No, you can't answer that, don't even try. It's not a deflector and it's not an impulse engine and it's not inertial dampeners. It's just... Fluff.
It seems this guy thought Starfleet would design a new vessel with the Vulcan rim push-pull design, which is laughable. It's outdated.... This design is just pants-on-head. Utterly. No redeeming features.
The vanity I find rather offensive tbh.
bloodpact.net
"The greatest danger for most of us is not that our aim is too high and we miss it, but that it is too low and we reach it."
-Michelangelo
"Wisely" is a loaded word there; while it may be your preference, it's a fact (and has been stated here by devs before) that the Cryptic-designed ships are very popular in the C-store and in the game. I think pursuing a mix of canon, fanon, and original ships is probably more "wise".
You misunderstand me, I wasn't refering to the already existing ships. I was refering to this "Fan" Odyssey.
Clearly this isn't true, because there's a number of Star Trek fans here who look at ship and do not think Starfleet. One of them being me. There may be some who do, but there's also a number who don't.
I wouldn't care if the ship was in the game, although personally I have to say it's not a very nice design. Looks too much like a cross between standard ST ships and something else. But it's clearly not evocative of Starfleet to a number of people.
Then I stand corrected, I just though since the whole design is basically Starfleet except for the arched nacelle it would be easy to spot as a Starfleet vessel.
At this point I would be happy with ANY Odyssey variant, no matter who does it. And Bortasqu', and Chimera, etc. Vesta got variants, why not them?
Edit: Yes!
That's the point, Starfleet vessels use linear warp Nacelles. From the Phoenix all the way to the Enterprise-J.
You clearly did not understand the conversation where the person I was responding to pointed out that the Miranda's Rollbar was similar, which it was not. The Miranda's rollbar was a structral addition to allow additional weapon systems such as Phaser Banks, the Torpedo launcher, and in STO the Deflector Dish. While he was comparing it to the Fan Odyssey's warp ring and trying to equate the two. Which was like comparing apples and oranges.
Do you even read what you write? You contradicted yourself several times in one post.
Though I do agree, there should be gates of some sort at the various bases you can diplo-transwarp to.
Not a fan of the nacelle overbridge, but the colour scheme is rather pretty.
___________________________
Joined April 2008. Lifetime Subscriber. Original member of the original 2nd Fleet.
Expended $1,961 USD on this game - regretting it all. This game and some of its staff disappointed me, time and again, per every single cent spent!!!
And they can never deviate from that can they? So it does not matter what new shape the actual hull takes, as long as it has standard Starfleet warp nacelles its a Starfleet ship. And its a Nacelle arch, not a ring like you keep saying it is.
I am happy for Cryptic to add all the canon ships even if they are relics, but I also want to see some fresh designs, why not a class of ship with an arched nacelle? Or more Defiant style ships with the nacelles built in? Or large Cruisers/science vessels with built-in nacelles?
a re-work with a saucer/hull like that and fitting-(canon-)warp nacelles (don't care if endo- or exo) and you get my vote
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
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That's a warp ring dude, not traditional linear starfleet warp nacelles.
Well that ultimately is up to CBS, now is it?
Why does CBS get so involved with STO's ship design ideas, etc... any of the previous games, particularly Starfleet Academy, Legacy, etc... seem to have a more unique selection of ships. Particularly where the first game is concerned and including subsequent sequels allowed players to play a variety of different species with their own story arch, ship choices, etc...
Don't get me wrong, I love STO but CBS keeps popping up as being a major party pooper.
Jupiter SUCKS! Why do you think they replaced it ingame with the Galaxy Refit. Maneuverability is next to nothing, poor weapons layout, speed is non existent, hull integrity is terrible. A Jupiter is essentially a big, lumbering target.
Those are not warp Nacelles. Case in point, where is the blue glow if they were? :P