The cost of getting [Borg] weapons seems so prohibitive now, I think the intent is to push everyone to get fleet weapons... which conveniently props up the starbase system...
With the amount of dil drains in this game and as you've said much more incentive to charge for dil, there'd be a shift of zen to dil demand such that dil per zen prices will pummel.
We're already down 2 points since all this S7 stuff started showing up. I can hardly imagine what happens when the patch hits.
1 Turn Over Contraband netting enough dil to buy a 2000 cpoint ship? Scary thought.
The exchange has minimum and maximum values. The most you could get for 5k dilithium us 200 ZEN if the market shifted that way.
The cost of getting [Borg] weapons seems so prohibitive now, I think the intent is to push everyone to get fleet weapons... which conveniently props up the starbase system...
'Can't even do that, since they're going to slap the dil-tax on the DOff system - so starbase won't get to tier 3, so no fleet weapons.
This whole patch will eat up more dil than you can earn in months. Pointless.
Not even crafts, since you'd have to save up dil for all the other sinks. And EC prices for crafts will probably skyrocket to where MK XII stuff is now, since nobody will have Dil to spare any more.
-> Any new char will run around in Mk X greens. Yay!
All the different dil-sinks they're coming up with even prevent you from paying the tax on the next one - you have to grind to be allowed to grind to be allowed to grind!
That makes even the worst korean grinder look tame.
If this isn't the worst timed april's fool ever, that's really it for this game.
Well with the news that Cryptic nerfed Dilithium to 480 for Elite, that effectively cuts the majority of our income to a trickle. Just more evidence they don't care about their players and how much they do not care about Star Trek.
The more we hear about Season 7, the more people are leaving.
At this rate, I think Cryptic is going to become the most infamous company in the MMO industry. Making Sony look like angels.
At this rate, I think Cryptic is going to become the most infamous company in the MMO industry. Making Sony look like angels.
QFT.
I don't know why they even bother continuing with Neverwinter development - by the time that's going into beta, their rep will have hit rock-bottom.
Well with the news that Cryptic nerfed Dilithium to 480 for Elite, that effectively cuts the majority of our income to a trickle. Just more evidence they don't care about their players and how much they do not care about Star Trek.
The more we hear about Season 7, the more people are leaving.
At this rate, I think Cryptic is going to become the most infamous company in the MMO industry. Making Sony look like angels.
Just curious, what do people in the gaming industry outside of Cryptic/PWE circles or the podcasts etc... Think of this game in general?
Even though Champion's Online is a Cryptic game, I remember folks on that side of this company stating they didn't want the TRIBBLE thats happening over here to land on their game.
I do not know what came of that situation, but they were like heck no, STO FLU, stay away.
Just curious, what do people in the gaming industry outside of Cryptic/PWE circles or the podcasts etc... Think of this game in general?
Even though Champion's Online is a Cryptic game, I remember folks on that side of this company stating they didn't want the TRIBBLE thats happening over here to land on their game.
I do not know what came of that situation, but they were like heck no, STO FLU, stay away.
Prior to PW buying Cryptic, they were viewed rather fondly due to City of Heroes. And both Champions and STO was regarded rather positively.
But given the recent changes, things are not as they once were.
Well with the news that Cryptic nerfed Dilithium to 480 for Elite, that effectively cuts the majority of our income to a trickle. Just more evidence they don't care about their players and how much they do not care about Star Trek.
The more we hear about Season 7, the more people are leaving.
At this rate, I think Cryptic is going to become the most infamous company in the MMO industry. Making Sony look like angels.
Wow, just wow.... 480 dil??? REALLY??? :eek:
When I thought Cryptic could sink no lower, they strike yet again with a new time low.
How many STF's are we supposed to run to get enough dil to unlock what we want from the STF store??
300?? 500?? 1000??? :eek:
This is a low blow, and I hope they will keep the dil rewards as is on Holodeck right now, otherwise they risk loosing many players, just due to getting burnt out grinding anything that gives dil...
This is getting utterly out of hand... Please reconsider this Cryptic, please, I beg of you....
When I thought Cryptic could sink no lower, they strike yet again with a new time low.
How many STF's are we supposed to run to get enough dil to unlock what we want from the STF store??
300?? 500?? 1000??? :eek:
This is a low blow, and I hope they will keep the dil rewards as is on Holodeck right now, otherwise they risk loosing many players, just due to getting burnt out grinding anything that gives dil...
This is getting utterly out of hand... Please reconsider this Cryptic, please, I beg of you....
yeah I am pretty disgusted with the nerfing of the Dilithium reward, though on the upside I believe they included a Dilithium reward to some of the Fleet Actions.
Someone estimated around 50x in order to get a Mk XII set or piece - Yet at a Dilithium cost. Go figure.
yeah I am pretty disgusted with the nerfing of the Dilithium reward, though on the upside I believe they included a Dilithium reward to some of the Fleet Actions.
Someone estimated around 50x in order to get a Mk XII set or piece - Yet at a Dilithium cost. Go figure.
Indeed.......
They increased Dilithium costs in key areas, and at the same time decreased our income. It's going to hurt bad.....
When I thought Cryptic could sink no lower, they strike yet again with a new time low.
How many STF's are we supposed to run to get enough dil to unlock what we want from the STF store??
300?? 500?? 1000??? :eek:
This is a low blow, and I hope they will keep the dil rewards as is on Holodeck right now, otherwise they risk loosing many players, just due to getting burnt out grinding anything that gives dil...
This is getting utterly out of hand... Please reconsider this Cryptic, please, I beg of you....
Mind you I said that was for Elite STFs, Normal STFs get half that......
From Stahl's post, we have to get to Tier 5 Omega to be able to turn in the stuff for extra dilithium or do Fleet Actions for 960 Dilithum. And First Place in Fleet Actions give 1960 Dilithium.
Of course we know that's always going to Tacticals in Escorts......
Really, this is the most disappointed I have ever been with Cryptic. Words cannot describe.
As much as I am concerned for how this will effect the game economy, I kinda want to see how it turns out. I used to love doing STF's but after the 100th time doing the same mission over and over I got tired of it and began to do foundry missions. If this ends up making a positive impact on the game I'll be a happy man.
Hopefully prices do collapse to that point. Maybe the devs might wake up. If not, at least I can start impulse shopping in the Z-store.
Thats right, prices will collapse and zen became worthless. Which will make people to buy moar zen to get their dilith, which is limited in S7, so pwe will get moar money.
__________________
[Combat (Self)] You lose 6549 (7572) Cold from the torment of the underworld.
It seems our Communist...erm...newly-minted Capitalist overlords at PWE never run out of new ways to decrease our daily dilithium income while finding new ways to coax/coerce us into spending it. Almost all of my dilithium across five lvl 50 characters gets poured into my small fleet's starbase projects, and as an avid space elite STF player I'm cringing at the idea of having to pay dilithium to get borg weaponry. Seriously, it seems with each season now they are coming out with loads of awesome content, but then turning the screws on us with dilithium cost.
Can you stop it, please? Before you wear out more of your player base? Because I've seen other Chinese companies build or take over a good product and then TRIBBLE their players over little by little so that the companies make a boatload of money in a few months before the game then collapses. (greed isn't limited to any one country, but I'm sick of crooked business practices in China or anywhere else)
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Former/Cryptic Name: Captain_Hans_Langsdorff
Founding member, Special Service Squadron
"Fear God and Dread Nought." First Sea Lord, Adm. Jacky Fisher
>Woke up
>Thought to play STO a bit before getting to work
>Decided to check the forums first
>Read about reduced STF rewards
>Now want to stop playing STO whatsoever
Well, look on the bright side... Now we'll have more time to do something actually productive AND save some money...
But in all seriousness, I hate the new changes and despite the fact that many people will call this trolling and exaggerating I'll say that I honestly feel discouraged from playing anymore, seeing how despite all the efforts the carrot on a stick is only getting further and further.
Pay2Play all the way it seems. And smaller fleets are going to suffer even more than before due to most of these changes. Typical for Cryptic - introduce something nice and then ruin it by future updates completely so that nobody will even care anymore.
480 dilithium for a ground elite STF... lames joke I've read this month...
Oh, and about that mark => dilithium conversion, how much do you want to bet those will just be just another 1d,16h projects with predetermined (obviously small) amounts of mark to be converted?
And yeah, let the DPS-fest commence, as anything but dpscorts have no chances for the first place at all in any current space fleet action.
Oh, and expect A LOT of AFKers during those...
Can you stop it, please? Before you wear out more of your player base? Because I've seen other Chinese companies build or take over a good product and then TRIBBLE their players over little by little so that the companies make a boatload of money in a few months before the game then collapses. (greed isn't limited to any one country, but I'm sick of crooked business practices in China or anywhere else)
EA is an American company waaaaay more evil than PWE....and they have a bigger track record
EA is an American company waaaaay more evil than PWE....and they have a bigger track record
point well taken
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Former/Cryptic Name: Captain_Hans_Langsdorff
Founding member, Special Service Squadron
"Fear God and Dread Nought." First Sea Lord, Adm. Jacky Fisher
Prior to PW buying Cryptic, they were viewed rather fondly due to City of Heroes. And both Champions and STO was regarded rather positively.
But given the recent changes, things are not as they once were.
I think this is the most ridiculous thing said in ages on here.
Prior to PW, Cryptic were laugh at and labeled as company that produces quick, shallow, content light MMos, but with very good character customization.
They pitched themselves to Atari as this, hence why they bought them and we got STO 18months later, but at least the 45 day patch helped
And to say that STO was regarded rather positively is fanboyism at it's height. STO was ridiculed and got at best average scores. Why did people leave in droves? No cups in the kitchen? Vic 20 computers being used to create stuff?
Now the one thing that can be said is that with COH, they were thought of as a good company and COH was an excellent, fun game, but after that, it's been down hill since.
Sorry, but I just couldn't believe that Fondly and Cryptic, could be said in the same sentence.
Straight from the mouth of one of the leaders of the CDF - "I tell you what, Haven't spent any money either - I'm a lousy freeloader" - Jonsills 17/12/2014
So, instead of it taking:
less than two week to outfit a ship in full MK XII borg, M.A.C.O. shield and 3/4 Assimilated, getting ~80k spare Dil in the process as well as some spare copies of the remaining M.A.C.O. and Omega parts, some spare weapons, and enough EDC for a MK XI ground set
EA is an American company waaaaay more evil than PWE....and they have a bigger track record
Case in point the SWTOR Free-to-play model, or as I think of it the reason why my annoyance with PWE has had a dramatic decrease.
I mean Perfect World is just nickel and diming me on gear I can live without, with my only issues being the Doff cost increase and thats just because it makes it hard to get white commons for Starbase projects and if I want to make any new characters since dilithium isn't that available at the start. the other issue being the rumors about removing the investigate officer reports mission, because I like the 50 fleet marks I get from it a day.
EA on the other hand seems to think free-to-play means something completely different that everyone else, I mean YOU HAVE TO SUB TO SPRINT FOR GOD'S SAKE! SPRINTING!
Case in point the SWTOR Free-to-play model, or as I think of it the reason why my annoyance with PWE has had a dramatic decrease.
EA on the other hand seems to think free-to-play means something completely different that everyone else, I mean YOU HAVE TO SUB TO SPRINT FOR GOD'S SAKE! SPRINTING!
ROFLMAO - you mean in this so-called fantastic new f2p model that everyone here claims they are leaving STO for - SWTOR: you can walk in the game for free - but running requires a sub?? - that is frakking hilarious!!
eh...
pwe's sticky fingers are in this mess too, the whole new fleet approach~>pwe has this mistaken idea that people who are in guilds/fleets are less likely to leave and more likely to stay and pay to keep up with their peers. forsaken world, (another pwe game) is all about guilds, can only get higher tier items if you're in one.
they haven't yet moved beyond highschool psy to realize there's no onus on anyone leaving a game...because it's just a game, and if friends play usually the entire group leaves.
so you have both companies wanting to cash in, throw in badly done guesswork on what gamers want and what will make them stay and pay, mix in decision makers who aren't gamers, and you get something like S7
a bunch of theories on what gamers want, more theories on what they'll put up with, and stupidly stubborn refusal to accept that this isn't reality, it's just a game. that no one is so invested that they just won't walk away.
it's a game cryptic, it's not like you're packaging air that people need to breath, no one needs this game. you should be first and foremost working on how to make the game appeal to newcomers and old hands alike. or is the plan to milk it for every chunk of loose change before shutting it down? LTS sale seems to lend credence to that theory. one shot money grab, followed by another.
Dr. Patricia Tanis ~ "Bacon is for sycophants and products of incest."
Donate Brains, zombies in Washington DC are starving.
The only way to stop this, is for ever single player to stop spending Zen, whether purchased or earned through a LTS.
That is the only thing that will make PWE/Cryptic realize they are going down the wrong street. Unfortunately, people wont do that, so a small amount of the player-base will continue to spend 100's of times what they would have on a subscription based game, only to see it end its life cycle, which STO is already over the 3yrs mark for all intensive purposes.
We can only hope this game eventually turns the corner and finds a happy median where it can continue on.
eh...
pwe's sticky fingers are in this mess too, the whole new fleet approach~>pwe has this mistaken idea that people who are in guilds/fleets are less likely to leave and more likely to stay and pay to keep up with their peers. forsaken world, (another pwe game) is all about guilds, can only get higher tier items if you're in one.
they haven't yet moved beyond highschool psy to realize there's no onus on anyone leaving a game...because it's just a game, and if friends play usually the entire group leaves.
so you have both companies wanting to cash in, throw in badly done guesswork on what gamers want and what will make them stay and pay, mix in decision makers who aren't gamers, and you get something like S7
a bunch of theories on what gamers want, more theories on what they'll put up with, and stupidly stubborn refusal to accept that this isn't reality, it's just a game. that no one is so invested that they just won't walk away.
it's a game cryptic, it's not like you're packaging air that people need to breath, no one needs this game. you should be first and foremost working on how to make the game appeal to newcomers and old hands alike. or is the plan to milk it for every chunk of loose change before shutting it down? LTS sale seems to lend credence to that theory. one shot money grab, followed by another.
BINGO!!
At this stage i follow PW/Cryptic lead, they seem to invest nothing into this game and seem quite happy to allow it to continue to stagnate while focusing totally on grind and lockbox money grabs........so if it's good enough for them not to invest then its good enough for me....its that simple.
Thanks PW/Cryptic....you contnue to save me a fortune in cash i would have otherwise squandared on C-store stuff to use to play all that extra content you would have produced if you had not got lockbox fever. lol
Sure it was. I soloed Thrall once in WoW as a Fury warrior. That's being nerfed by a factor of around 40+.
But it IS steep for a non-exploit, I agree. And devs sometimes confuse players exceeding their own mis-estimates as exploits, which I think leads to a lot of silly drama when they decide they need to correct for it.
How dare you kill Thrall !!! Death to the Alliance !!!
And if this was WoW, they probably would have banned people for using the DOFF grinder. You got rid of 5 Bartenders and got a Security...that seems unfair...3-day BAN.
NO... It is time for the developers to start spending more time figuring out new things for people to play and less time figuring out new ways to play the people.
Comments
The cost of getting [Borg] weapons seems so prohibitive now, I think the intent is to push everyone to get fleet weapons... which conveniently props up the starbase system...
Still, I thin Acc CritH CritD are better mods, and nothing in the in-game stores has them.
"Last Engage! Magical Girl Origami-san" is in print! Now with three times more rainbows.
Support the "Armored Unicorn" vehicle initiative today!
Thanks for Harajuku. Now let's get a real "Magical Girl" costume!
The exchange has minimum and maximum values. The most you could get for 5k dilithium us 200 ZEN if the market shifted that way.
'Can't even do that, since they're going to slap the dil-tax on the DOff system - so starbase won't get to tier 3, so no fleet weapons.
This whole patch will eat up more dil than you can earn in months. Pointless.
Not even crafts, since you'd have to save up dil for all the other sinks. And EC prices for crafts will probably skyrocket to where MK XII stuff is now, since nobody will have Dil to spare any more.
-> Any new char will run around in Mk X greens. Yay!
All the different dil-sinks they're coming up with even prevent you from paying the tax on the next one - you have to grind to be allowed to grind to be allowed to grind!
That makes even the worst korean grinder look tame.
If this isn't the worst timed april's fool ever, that's really it for this game.
The more we hear about Season 7, the more people are leaving.
At this rate, I think Cryptic is going to become the most infamous company in the MMO industry. Making Sony look like angels.
QFT.
I don't know why they even bother continuing with Neverwinter development - by the time that's going into beta, their rep will have hit rock-bottom.
Just curious, what do people in the gaming industry outside of Cryptic/PWE circles or the podcasts etc... Think of this game in general?
Even though Champion's Online is a Cryptic game, I remember folks on that side of this company stating they didn't want the TRIBBLE thats happening over here to land on their game.
I do not know what came of that situation, but they were like heck no, STO FLU, stay away.
Ah now I see why 1 zen = 25 dil always shows up first. 80zen for 2k dil is still pretty damn worth it. That's 320zen a day with just hitting the cap.
Hopefully prices do collapse to that point. Maybe the devs might wake up. If not, at least I can start impulse shopping in the Z-store.
"Last Engage! Magical Girl Origami-san" is in print! Now with three times more rainbows.
Support the "Armored Unicorn" vehicle initiative today!
Thanks for Harajuku. Now let's get a real "Magical Girl" costume!
Prior to PW buying Cryptic, they were viewed rather fondly due to City of Heroes. And both Champions and STO was regarded rather positively.
But given the recent changes, things are not as they once were.
Just wanted to throw in this link regarding Stahl statement: its fairly recent, dated back in September 26, 2012.
http://www.polygon.com/gaming/2012/9/26/3410292/reviews-dont-do-great-justice-to-mmos-says-star-trek-online-producer
NOTE: The 2010 review of STO by Metacritic rated it a 66/100 - That was before all the major changes and overhauls.
It would be nice to see an update on the ratings. Basically STO receievd mix reviews.
Wow, just wow.... 480 dil??? REALLY??? :eek:
When I thought Cryptic could sink no lower, they strike yet again with a new time low.
How many STF's are we supposed to run to get enough dil to unlock what we want from the STF store??
300?? 500?? 1000??? :eek:
This is a low blow, and I hope they will keep the dil rewards as is on Holodeck right now, otherwise they risk loosing many players, just due to getting burnt out grinding anything that gives dil...
This is getting utterly out of hand... Please reconsider this Cryptic, please, I beg of you....
yeah I am pretty disgusted with the nerfing of the Dilithium reward, though on the upside I believe they included a Dilithium reward to some of the Fleet Actions.
Someone estimated around 50x in order to get a Mk XII set or piece - Yet at a Dilithium cost. Go figure.
Indeed.......
They increased Dilithium costs in key areas, and at the same time decreased our income. It's going to hurt bad.....
Mind you I said that was for Elite STFs, Normal STFs get half that......
From Stahl's post, we have to get to Tier 5 Omega to be able to turn in the stuff for extra dilithium or do Fleet Actions for 960 Dilithum. And First Place in Fleet Actions give 1960 Dilithium.
Of course we know that's always going to Tacticals in Escorts......
Really, this is the most disappointed I have ever been with Cryptic. Words cannot describe.
Thats right, prices will collapse and zen became worthless. Which will make people to buy moar zen to get their dilith, which is limited in S7, so pwe will get moar money.
[Combat (Self)] You lose 6549 (7572) Cold from the torment of the underworld.
In-game handle @Janetza
Can you stop it, please? Before you wear out more of your player base? Because I've seen other Chinese companies build or take over a good product and then TRIBBLE their players over little by little so that the companies make a boatload of money in a few months before the game then collapses. (greed isn't limited to any one country, but I'm sick of crooked business practices in China or anywhere else)
Former/Cryptic Name: Captain_Hans_Langsdorff
Founding member, Special Service Squadron
"Fear God and Dread Nought." First Sea Lord, Adm. Jacky Fisher
>Thought to play STO a bit before getting to work
>Decided to check the forums first
>Read about reduced STF rewards
>Now want to stop playing STO whatsoever
Well, look on the bright side... Now we'll have more time to do something actually productive AND save some money...
But in all seriousness, I hate the new changes and despite the fact that many people will call this trolling and exaggerating I'll say that I honestly feel discouraged from playing anymore, seeing how despite all the efforts the carrot on a stick is only getting further and further.
Pay2Play all the way it seems. And smaller fleets are going to suffer even more than before due to most of these changes. Typical for Cryptic - introduce something nice and then ruin it by future updates completely so that nobody will even care anymore.
480 dilithium for a ground elite STF... lames joke I've read this month...
Oh, and about that mark => dilithium conversion, how much do you want to bet those will just be just another 1d,16h projects with predetermined (obviously small) amounts of mark to be converted?
And yeah, let the DPS-fest commence, as anything but dpscorts have no chances for the first place at all in any current space fleet action.
Oh, and expect A LOT of AFKers during those...
EA is an American company waaaaay more evil than PWE....and they have a bigger track record
point well taken
Former/Cryptic Name: Captain_Hans_Langsdorff
Founding member, Special Service Squadron
"Fear God and Dread Nought." First Sea Lord, Adm. Jacky Fisher
I think this is the most ridiculous thing said in ages on here.
Prior to PW, Cryptic were laugh at and labeled as company that produces quick, shallow, content light MMos, but with very good character customization.
They pitched themselves to Atari as this, hence why they bought them and we got STO 18months later, but at least the 45 day patch helped
And to say that STO was regarded rather positively is fanboyism at it's height. STO was ridiculed and got at best average scores. Why did people leave in droves? No cups in the kitchen? Vic 20 computers being used to create stuff?
Now the one thing that can be said is that with COH, they were thought of as a good company and COH was an excellent, fun game, but after that, it's been down hill since.
Sorry, but I just couldn't believe that Fondly and Cryptic, could be said in the same sentence.
Wow you have some good luck.
Case in point the SWTOR Free-to-play model, or as I think of it the reason why my annoyance with PWE has had a dramatic decrease.
I mean Perfect World is just nickel and diming me on gear I can live without, with my only issues being the Doff cost increase and thats just because it makes it hard to get white commons for Starbase projects and if I want to make any new characters since dilithium isn't that available at the start. the other issue being the rumors about removing the investigate officer reports mission, because I like the 50 fleet marks I get from it a day.
EA on the other hand seems to think free-to-play means something completely different that everyone else, I mean YOU HAVE TO SUB TO SPRINT FOR GOD'S SAKE! SPRINTING!
ROFLMAO - you mean in this so-called fantastic new f2p model that everyone here claims they are leaving STO for - SWTOR: you can walk in the game for free - but running requires a sub?? - that is frakking hilarious!!
As for Atari... I'm not sure it was that much better then PWE.
Though it seems companies do best when they are not seconded to a biger company, like some form of subsidiary.
pwe's sticky fingers are in this mess too, the whole new fleet approach~>pwe has this mistaken idea that people who are in guilds/fleets are less likely to leave and more likely to stay and pay to keep up with their peers. forsaken world, (another pwe game) is all about guilds, can only get higher tier items if you're in one.
they haven't yet moved beyond highschool psy to realize there's no onus on anyone leaving a game...because it's just a game, and if friends play usually the entire group leaves.
so you have both companies wanting to cash in, throw in badly done guesswork on what gamers want and what will make them stay and pay, mix in decision makers who aren't gamers, and you get something like S7
a bunch of theories on what gamers want, more theories on what they'll put up with, and stupidly stubborn refusal to accept that this isn't reality, it's just a game. that no one is so invested that they just won't walk away.
it's a game cryptic, it's not like you're packaging air that people need to breath, no one needs this game. you should be first and foremost working on how to make the game appeal to newcomers and old hands alike. or is the plan to milk it for every chunk of loose change before shutting it down? LTS sale seems to lend credence to that theory. one shot money grab, followed by another.
Donate Brains, zombies in Washington DC are starving.
That is the only thing that will make PWE/Cryptic realize they are going down the wrong street. Unfortunately, people wont do that, so a small amount of the player-base will continue to spend 100's of times what they would have on a subscription based game, only to see it end its life cycle, which STO is already over the 3yrs mark for all intensive purposes.
We can only hope this game eventually turns the corner and finds a happy median where it can continue on.
BINGO!!
At this stage i follow PW/Cryptic lead, they seem to invest nothing into this game and seem quite happy to allow it to continue to stagnate while focusing totally on grind and lockbox money grabs........so if it's good enough for them not to invest then its good enough for me....its that simple.
Thanks PW/Cryptic....you contnue to save me a fortune in cash i would have otherwise squandared on C-store stuff to use to play all that extra content you would have produced if you had not got lockbox fever. lol
How dare you kill Thrall !!! Death to the Alliance !!!
And if this was WoW, they probably would have banned people for using the DOFF grinder. You got rid of 5 Bartenders and got a Security...that seems unfair...3-day BAN.
That's what i just said, PvP.
www.divisionhispana.com