I'm not sure if we're still not allowed to call this what it is, but it rhymes with rolling, bowling, and polling, and the noun assosciated with that verb, in D&D rules, is commonly dealt with using fire in some manner, their natural habitat being caves, lakes, and under bridges. Kira often called Quark one too. Oh, and obvious is obvious. Eat up.:)
You guys are too kind to these folk. IMO this guy just got rolled one too many times raged on the inside and it's coming out in the form of a subtle superiority complex in his post since the game mechanics don't fit his skill level.
I love how he says the masses have spoken that pvp sucks. Of course the pve hero and rpers have all spoken about pvp sucking. Consider the source then. Don't mistake rpers and pver's making up the majority of the population of this game for pvp sucking.
Actually this is a very good "tacish" engie oddy. I'm assuming you have two blue engi maint doffs? (to get ET3 into it's global)? IIRC 2 blues is enough to kick it to the global so that frees up your other doff slots.
I'd consider the Omega deflector instead of the borg one, and try the borg shield out. Imo the borg shield is abit better on a cruiser since the turn rate proc on the Omega shield is soo bad, and the extra shield power is enough to get you 1.4 (or is it 1.8) percent more shield resistance. Either way expect this post of yours to be linked to in my Oddy Post
Fyi, you need 3 purple doffs now (it used to be you need only a blue and a green to effect all teams) for a specific team to be at global cooldown.
Atm using FaW negates the need for the targeting boost the Omega gives. Personally, w/the FaW targeting issue w/the exception of cruiser imo people shouldn't use FaW see below for more details. Cruisers have so little options and they're relatively restricted in movement, imo it's ok they use it.
Off topic Tet Glider didn't get the nerf that was listed (25%) nor do power insulators work, so imo no player should use this w/the exception of taking down the new FE broke shields, or someone is annoying you w/P2W stuff.
Also off topic imo Phasers are too OP for fast volley combos. For example using Phasers w/CRF3 I was able to drop a test player FE shields enough to get a tric HYT through (and we know how slow those are). I also observed during this test dbb and turrets fired 4 shots/volley. Phasers have 4 rolls/shot. 1 volley of 3 dbb and 3 turrets = 3x4x4 + 3x4x4 rolls = 96 rolls (this is w/o any extra shots from special abilities). With 2.5% chance of procing that's ~ 2 procs/volley. So, combined w/FaW never missing (not even counting extra shots) in 2 volleys odds are the targets shields will drop (2 volleys = 4 procs, shields proc odds 1/4). This leaves a 4th high slot for HYT torp of choice to punch through. In theory Polaron procs can come close to this in drain builds to be fair (for those spec'd in flow cap w/console&deflector boosts).
While it would be nice to see people not run Tet Gliders (I'm not even going to call it the Omega set cause we -all- know what it's used for) or FAW it's not going to happen anytime soon, especially in a public que. It's better to just go ahead and state it's place on ship builds. So people can at least expect the pros and "cons" of not using them.
Thanks for the updated doff info. The lolcryptic changes this stuff so quickly these days. I suppose in an effort to make us spend more c points heh.
This thread is a joke as is the OP trying to support NON canon pvp in this non canon game. Pvp is joke, it isnt close to canon and ships do NOT operate as per any star trek, old or news series i have seen, ever.
The OP trying to support current ship design and what ship types should and shouldnt do is a joke unto itself. The op needs to do some reading or moviewatching, or in the OP's case they like the way things are in STO pvp play and are talking out their plasma vents.
Cryptic made this game and the masses spoke, it plain sucked, and still sucks, those that enjoy it good for you, i play the pve side because i like the pew pew sound, i do not play the pvp after testing the waters two years ago and found the play abyssmal as do thousands of others, that why you pvp fanatic are always running around spamming chat wasting your typing skills trying to get the F2P people to pvp so you can gank, pathetic, this also shows the lack of interest in pvp and the lack of any solid community in pvp for STO, the que times prove this over and over.
When Cryptic decides to make ships operate per canon and space battle operate per canon people may begin to give more than a **** about your lack of pvp targets and less than stellar advice on building ships to suit the non canon style of sbag pvp play.
Pitifull and worthless, the watchwords of the sto pvp crowd. You folks would do better to press cryptic into making ships canon, making fights canon and hiring devs that at least have a clue, until then enjoy the barrens chat in your little circle jerk of friends, all of whom i am sure the hardest core sto playuhhhs around.
:rolleyes:
Also, to be clear, no anger, no hate, though i am quite sure you will project the feeling you want. Laugh.
I don't see the point of this post...what do you want to actually tell us?
While it would be nice to see people not run Tet Gliders (I'm not even going to call it the Omega set cause we -all- know what it's used for) or FAW it's not going to happen anytime soon, especially in a public que. It's better to just go ahead and state it's place on ship builds. So people can at least expect the pros and "cons" of not using them.
Thanks for the updated doff info. The lolcryptic changes this stuff so quickly these days. I suppose in an effort to make us spend more c points heh.
The unsaid con is people become reliant on broken abilities and then cry nerf xyz when they're fixed because their build no longer holds up. Look at the rash of complaints after MACO shields were fixed, or the old FaW was brought back in line. Imo, builds shouldn't be based around known broken things like FaW & Tet Glider. At least start the match w/o it then add it if needed later.
Edit: For me I won't start a match w/phasers b/c I think they're OP if by nothing else then the fact I can get a HY Quant volley through the new FE shields using them w/CRF. But, that's a debatable OP issue not a basic broken one.
finally started rebuilding my engineering characters, been playing nothing but my tactical ones for months. my kdf and starfleet engineers both still had all their skill points undistributed from the final skill tree changes! great for loading into tribble and trying things out with though. better get them in shape before the FE reward expires.
im just a cruiser fan, i have had great success in an escort, but i just keep ending up with my characters back in cruisers. my tac excelsior dealing between 3000 and 1500 a shot with 8 beams when fully buffed melts things so well, and i have all that survivability with 2x EPtS, ET2, A2S3, RSP2, TSS2, and HE1. RSP2 and ET2 would switch places to RSP1 and ET3 provided i ever get a response from "could anyone train ET3 please?" at DS9 and space dock. i swear that hasn't worked since F2P happened.
so my fed engineer is in a galaxy R, i think its kinda hip to fly one now, the odyssey has assumed the im a noob mantra the galaxy R had. love the ship, but its far from optimal stations and terrible turn rate are so unfortunate. ive made it work, with its stats all it can be are an impenetrable tank and healer. it will never deal damage, best it can seem to do is 1000- 500 damage a shot with 8 beams. my kdf is basically a clone of this build in a neg var, only it deals more damage with its 3rd tactical console. since it has more built in weapons power, im able to run 2xEPtA1 instead of weapons, quite helpful for those heals.
still deals more damage then about 75% of the other cruisers i see in stfs, and i regularly placed second and third in damage on the pvp scoreboards. you would think that with all the "kirks" and "The Dragon Flagship" flying around that my dedicated healer with 2 tactical consoles wouldn't be dealing better damage then them, :rolleyes: i must just know how to play! its amazing just how HARD escorts gun for me, i must suck if im flying this thing, it must be so frustrating when i simply won't die, and can run almost as fast as they can.
skills are as follows TT1, FAW2 EPtW1, RSP1, EWP1, A2S3 in stfs, for pvp EPtW1, RSP1, A2S2, ES3
EPtW1, EPtS2, ET3
EPtS1 HE1, TSS2
im stfs i run 2 netronium, 1 monotonium, and 1 anti plasma/tetryon armor with my green mk12 [turn]
engine and blue mk11 deflector that's nothing but + to hull repair and shield hp. might swap this with 3 part borg eventually, a lot of grinding still needed for that, a lot of this equipment is from season 3 and 4. with the points i put into threat control, literally ever borg npc targets ONLY me, but this build can take it. if i cant contribute meaningful dps, i can at least tank 3 or 4 spheres and let the dps'er do their job without interference.
in pvp its 2 netronium, borg and sep console slotted for engineering with 2 flow cap consoles and omega deflector and engine for maximum shield damaging with the glider. so far im happy with it, ive saved many asses in the pubs ive played.
at least when it inevitably gets boring not doing the killing i can swap back to my tacticals and 'kirk' it up, with actual success, as i see fit!
RSP2 and ET2 would switch places to RSP1 and ET3 provided i ever get a response from "could anyone train ET3 please?" at DS9 and space dock. i swear that hasn't worked since F2P happened.
I'm 95% certain I can train Engineering Team 3. Send me a mail, I will reply when I'm in game and have time to train. I'm generally on around 7-9 ish mountain time (9-11 eastern) in the evenings on the weekdays I am on.
Based on some emails I have, I can also train Extend Shields 3, if you want that.
I'll have to get in game and verify what I can train, since I don't remember and I'm at work. Sorry in advance if there's disappointment.
Fyi, you need 3 purple doffs now (it used to be you need only a blue and a green to effect all teams) for a specific team to be at global cooldown.
This is incorrect.
You only need 1 Purple and 1 Blue Doff for a specific team to be at global cooldown.
For example, I use 1 purple quality and 1 blue quality Developmental Lab Scientist for Science team. They reduce the global cooldown by 14 seconds total (8 seconds=Purple, 6 seconds=Blue). With those slotted, I go from 29 seconds to 15 seconds cooldown on a single Science Team.
So you only need 1 purple and 1 blue Doff, not 3 purples, to be at Global cooldown on a specific team.
I use 1 purple quality and 1 blue quality Developmental Lab Scientists which reduce the global cooldown by 14 seconds total (8 seconds=Purple, 6 seconds=Blue). With those slotted, it goes from 29 seconds to 15 seconds cooldown on a single Science Team.
So you only need 1 purple and 1 blue Doff, not 3 purples, to be at Global cooldown.
The dev has stated they want 3 purples to achieve this goal. The fact there's shoddy work and the Doffs are giving giving the values they should doesn't change this. It just makes them broken. Check out the Purple KDF conn officers as an example 1 purple gives only a 3 second reduction the other purple gives 4 while they both should be @ 5 seconds. I mentioned in a thread over a month ago the stores aren't giving out Doffs who's abilities are as the Devs describe them. For awhile though those same conn officers were giving 8 & 6 second reductions while other blues were giving 8. The Doffs are just a mess tbo.
Check out the Purple KDF conn officers as an example 1 purple gives only a 3 second reduction the other purple gives 4 while they both should be @ 5 seconds. I mentioned in a thread over a month ago the stores aren't giving out Doffs who's abilities are as the Devs describe them. For awhile though those same conn officers were giving 8 & 6 second reductions while other blues were giving 8.
Are you sure that you don't have the purple Evasive Conn Officer Doff confused with the other 2 Variants when you describe discrepancies in cooldowns? I will admit that they really did need to add new titles when they introduced the variants instead of calling them Conn officers, which was already being used.
I'm 95% certain I can train Engineering Team 3. Send me a mail, I will reply when I'm in game and have time to train. I'm generally on around 7-9 ish mountain time (9-11 eastern) in the evenings on the weekdays I am on.
Based on some emails I have, I can also train Extend Shields 3, if you want that.
I'll have to get in game and verify what I can train, since I don't remember and I'm at work. Sorry in advance if there's disappointment.
thanks for the offer, im sure i'll have luck with this soon. if not, i'll proboly send an email. don't need extend shields on this ship, its a greedy kirk damage dealer, the healer is the character i talked about in the rest of my post.
You only need 1 Purple and 1 Blue Doff for a specific team to be at global cooldown.
For example, I use 1 purple quality and 1 blue quality Developmental Lab Scientist for Science team. They reduce the global cooldown by 14 seconds total (8 seconds=Purple, 6 seconds=Blue). With those slotted, I go from 29 seconds to 15 seconds cooldown on a single Science Team.
So you only need 1 purple and 1 blue Doff, not 3 purples, to be at Global cooldown on a specific team.
wow. i had like no interest in all this doff TRIBBLE at all, and now i come to find out i can reduce the team ability cooldown to just the global cooldown level by slotting the right couple of doffs in my active roster? thats ridiculuse, well glad the exchange makes finding the right doffs so easy now.
Are you sure that you don't have the purple Evasive Conn Officer Doff confused with the other 2 Variants when you describe discrepancies in cooldowns? I will admit that they really did need to add new titles when they introduced the variants instead of calling them Conn officers, which was already being used.
I can train ET3, EPtS3, and Extend Shields 3. The offer to train isn't just for dontdrunk; anyone who wants those should feel free to send me a mail, and hopefully we can meet in game if you want something.
Edit: also ground stuff like phaser turret fab 3.
In other news, this is an AWESOME thread. Very helpful! Are you going to consider doing anything for the new Oddy/Bortas C Store ships?
I can train ET3, EPtS3, and Extend Shields 3. The offer to train isn't just for dontdrunk; anyone who wants those should feel free to send me a mail, and hopefully we can meet in game if you want something.
Edit: also ground stuff like phaser turret fab 3.
In other news, this is an AWESOME thread. Very helpful! Are you going to consider doing anything for the new Oddy/Bortas C Store ships?
ya....no $100 for all versions of both ships is absurd, i can understand 1 costing 2000 points, but the next 2 should cost you 500 each. i think my healer will continue on in the galaxy in protest.
its not like there is a single difference in the model between the 3, just slightly different stats and consoles. if they were selling 3 completely different, made from scratch ships, charging for 3 compleatly different ships would be understandable. instead they're charging you 2000 for a ship, and then 2000 for 2 consoles, if you get the package deal.
well if enough people cant help them selvs, the game will continue to live, so i guess thats a good thing.
Actually this is a very good "tacish" engie oddy. I'm assuming you have two blue engi maint doffs? (to get ET3 into it's global)? IIRC 2 blues is enough to kick it to the global so that frees up your other doff slots.
I'd consider the Omega deflector instead of the borg one, and try the borg shield out. Imo the borg shield is abit better on a cruiser since the turn rate proc on the Omega shield is soo bad, and the extra shield power is enough to get you 1.4 (or is it 1.8) percent more shield resistance. Either way expect this post of yours to be linked to in my Oddy Post
I am curious:
Back on your Excelsior part you actually said you'd like to try out the Omega Shield for the turnrate proc. Since I have painfully grinded my way through all those STF the past few days (yawn!), I would be rather disappointed to buy the wrong items.
So far this would be my Excelsior setup, I know I am an Engineer captain:
Weapons: 3x Polarized Tetryon Beam Array, 1x Chroniton Launcher - both for and aft. I choose Chroniton because of the debuff to slow other ships down. Deflector: Tachyon Deflector Array Mk XI - supports +24 Flow Capacitors and +16 Particle Generators, helping both my Tet Glider and my EWP III. Engines: Omega Engines MK XI Shields: Omega Shields Mk XI - the Proc should help for some turnrate and speed boosts, which would be nice for better EWP maneuvering.
Devices: Red Matter Capacitor, Subspace Field Modulator, Weapon Battery, Engine Battery Eng Consoles: Borg Console, Neutronium Mk XI, EPS Mk XI, RCS Mk XI Sci Consoles: Field Generator Mk XI, Flow Capacitor Mk XI - the FC should again help the Tet Glider Tac Consoles: 3x Tetryon Pulse Generator Mk XI
As you can see I specced quite much into Particle Generators to get much better Eject Warp Plasma results. I also have a purple Doff which grants a 20%(25%) chance to completely immobilize the target within the plasma cloud.
I am still not sure if I should use the Omega or MACO shield. Back on Tribble, I found the proc from the Omega shield rather... lackluster. A mere gimmick if you want. The MACO on the other hand offers a much better defensive stat.
However if I go for MACO, I'd have to drop my non-set Deflector, which heavily supports both the Tet Glider and the EWP.
I'd consider changing out HYT for Torpedo Spread but other than that it looks like a really solid build. With only 6 beams and two EPTW1s you do not need an EPS console, it's really not doing you any favors especially as you are an Engineer captain.
I'd change it out for either an SIF Generator, or more Armor (like one of the 4 energy resist consoles)
I'd consider changing out HYT for Torpedo Spread but other than that it looks like a really solid build. With only 6 beams and two EPTW1s you do not need an EPS console, it's really not doing you any favors especially as you are an Engineer captain.
I'd change it out for either an SIF Generator, or more Armor (like one of the 4 energy resist consoles)
Thanks, any more opinions from you about the MACO/Omega decission?
The Maco shield is so amazing (for what it is. Though with all the shield ripping going on right now in pvp, I think a Borg shield might not be a bad choice).
It's hard to pass it up.
I definitely would do your best to keep the glider. And If I recall correctly the Omega Deflector -does- do a good job at buffing the glider, and particle generators. I guess if I were in your position I'd give the maco shield a shot, and run with the omega deflector and engine.
The Maco shield is so amazing (for what it is. Though with all the shield ripping going on right now in pvp, I think a Borg shield might not be a bad choice).
It's hard to pass it up.
I definitely would do your best to keep the glider. And If I recall correctly the Omega Deflector -does- do a good job at buffing the glider, and particle generators. I guess if I were in your position I'd give the maco shield a shot, and run with the omega deflector and engine.
i really miss my old high cap shield when i use the maco and get alpha striked off guard, it just doesn't have the hitpoints to blunt those as well and they are almost always breached. its great at dealing with any other type of incoming damage though
Question for cruiser gurus: I just got the new Bortasq', and I would appreciate some guidance from you. Normally I fly a BoP, but the new klink cruisers seem pretty good, so I decided to give it a try. I am a tac and choosed to fly the command Bortasq. The reasons for that is the extra sci console that I can use with a flow capacitor console in conjunction with 2 pc omega and plasmonic leech. So this is my setup (I am not looking to be a healer, since as a tac I think I could be more appropriate for damage):
Shield: honor guard
Deflector and engines: omega
Power settings for attack (with bonuses without leech bonus, with leech I get at least 15 more I think per level):
- weapons 120
- engines little less than 60
- shield about 55-ish
- aux about 40-ish
Not exactly sure if I am accurate with this, I'll update while in game with exact values.
I also use a healing power with 105 aux and max engine I can get, all others are at min possible. shield tank settings is with 120 weapons, max possible shield and min possible aux and engine, speed with max engine and then aux and min weapons and shield.
Cmd Eng: Eps1, Aux to Inertial1 (trying to gain a little turn), Eps3, Aux to Structural 3
Lt Cmd Universal Tac: TT1, Torp Spread2, FaW3
Lt Tac: TT1, FaW2
Lt Sci: HE1, TSS2
Ens Universal Sci: Polarize Hull 1 (mainly to gain some extra defense)- thinging maybe a tractor? But I'm not speced and tb1 kinda sucks IMO.
Weapons:
Front:
- 1 mkxi purple Chronitron Acc x2 - for torp spread and slowing the target (not specced in torps at all). Note: I use those with evasives and reverse to quickly turn then use disruptor auto cannon while fully buffed and hoping to get few secs of no subnuc, lol
- 2 phaser disruptor beam from Galor (Accx2 and Dmg),
- 1 Mkxi purple disruptor beam CrtHx3 - using it mainly for faw never miss proc, lol
Consoles:
Eng: plasmonic leech, mkxi purple neutronium, Borg, and disruptor cannon- thinking to change with an eps
Sci: 35%shield, mkxi purple flow cap(with weapons 120 I get 55 shield drain for tet glider per beam)
Tac: 3x mkxi blue disruptor, mkxi purple disruptor
Now, i have tried it yesterday briefly in pug pvp and kerrat and did ok. Cant say how ok bc i am not a cruiser pilot, but in kerrat, at spawning point i hit evasives, an escort and a cruiser chased me, buffed all i have and hit them back. 30 sec later they left me alone, escort almost dead and cruiser with 30-ish hull. I was at almost full shields and about 85 hull, but never had to use he. Definitely they were not top of the line players though. What I am not too happy with is the turn rate, but I really don't think it's worth throwing in a turn console bc it will still suck. Do you have any recommendations for that? Also, pol hull gives some dmg resistance, but I'm thinking something else may be better value. Also, aux to struct is on same global with aux to inertial. Dps wise, I think it's ok, but I would like to know if you guys would go for bo3 rather than faw3. I have tried replacing faw3 w apo, but ive found that my dps drops quite a bit. I may think too much in terms of a bop pilot, and I'll appreciate your suggestions.
should be fine in pve, but i don't think there is enough survivability there to last very long in an actual pvp match. also, you don't have to run engine power quite that high, adjust it down until you see your defense score start to drop and keep it there.
should be fine in pve, but i don't think there is enough survivability there to last very long in an actual pvp match. also, you don't have to run engine power quite that high, adjust it down until you see your defense score start to drop and keep it there.
Thanks for answering, I don't really give a squat about pve since no matter what you do pve is just plain easy. I am more interested in what would you do to improve what i have from a Pvp stand point. So you suggest taking some power from engine and put it to shields? On the other side, I can't even dream to have the survivability on an eng, as an eng cannot even dream to get the damage of a tac. I know, cruisers are mainly for engies, but with this console and boff layout, the output damage is pretty god for bortasq. Also, there is an added damage from sensor scan that's passive on bortas command. Bottom line is I'm looking for any advices you folks have. I don't plan sticking to a cruiser anyway, not bc I don't like them, but as the novelty fades away, i tend to fall asleep lol, those are just too slow for my play style.
Thanks for answering, I don't really give a squat about pve since no matter what you do pve is just plain easy. I am more interested in what would you do to improve what i have from a Pvp stand point.
So you suggest taking some power from engine and put it to shields? On the other side, I can't even dream to have the survivability on an eng, as an eng cannot even dream to get the damage of a tac. I know, cruisers are mainly for engies, but with this console and boff layout, the output damage is pretty god. Bottom line is I'm looking for any advices you folks have. I don't plan sticking to a cruiser anyway, not bc I don't like them, but as the novelty fades, i tend to fall asleep lol, those are just too slow for my play style.
are you asking for a tactical or engineering captain? im gonna assume tactical for this post. as far as my power level suggestion goes, you only really need to be moving fast enough for your defense score to max out, its a value listed in your ship's character sheet. when you max the skills that support it you should cap at about 60.8%, adjust your engine power levels until they give you this value or a value right under this, this is your evasion score, it causes your enemies to miss. you don't need more engine power then this, dump the rest into shields, always keep your weapons power maxed, and use aux batterys like candy whenever you or your team mate need especially potent heals.
well the best thing about the bortas is that is has 4 tactical consoles. you can focus mainly on tanking with it and it will still deal better damage over time then other cruisers. my kdf tactical uses one currently, with the universal ensign used for engineering and the LTC for tactical. with just 5 engineering powers, you can get pretty good survivability, but less then you could have with even an excelsior.
I'd suggest 2xEPtS1, ET2, RSP2, and A2S3. of if you can get training in ET3, swap your ET and RSP. the innate weapons power the ship has makes it so you don't even need 2xEPtW1 to be basically topped out, unlike with the odyssey. this thing is op and it just makes me laugh, the devs don't even realize it but by giving it +15 to weapons they eliminated the need for 2 station powers. this doesn't even occur to them.
your sci powers are good, the shield resistance from TSS2 is better then the healing potential of HE2. if your just using beam arrays BO3 is wasted on them, they are only worth using with DBBs. and only if you don't have any other beam weapons equipped so you don't accidentally fire it off with a beam array.
as far as tactical powers go, well 5 just arent needed with an 8 beam array cruiser, they are not worth the opportunity cost of additional engineering powers imo, but cant do anything about it. definitely use FAW3, it cooks everything around you, and 2xAPB1 so when you breach shields you hit them even harder, and 2xTT1 or if you want to keep your chronoton TT1 and TS1. you only really need 2 TT1s when you uses duel cannons, your forward shield faceing cant face away from your enemy if you want to deal damage to them, not really an issue on a broadsider.
i haven't tried it, but ive been thinking about a 7 turret, 1 duel beam bank build, that number of tactical powers with those weapons could be interesting, with BO3 2xCRF1, and 2xTT1, or maybe an aft chronoton with TS1.
for consoles, i think it might be worth using 3 Neuronium and borg in engineering, your gonna need all the extra defense you can get. field projector in science and 4 energy type consoles for tactical. omega deflector and engine, with KHG shield.
with that you have basically a clone of what my kdf tac is set up as right now, haven't done much pvp with him since i set him up, but he has been quite effective at killing so far. its got limited support capability too with all its heals being useable on others, just pop an aux battery first. its a pretty shameless kirk otherwise.
since your using chronoton, and the damage they do is irreverent, i wouldn't even spec into torpedo damage, you save yourself 22500 points that way. something seems to boost their proc effectiveness, not sure what it is though, flow capacitors? particle generators?
Thanks for answering, I don't really give a squat about pve since no matter what you do pve is just plain easy. I am more interested in what would you do to improve what i have from a Pvp stand point. So you suggest taking some power from engine and put it to shields? On the other side, I can't even dream to have the survivability on an eng, as an eng cannot even dream to get the damage of a tac. I know, cruisers are mainly for engies, but with this console and boff layout, the output damage is pretty god for bortasq. Also, there is an added damage from sensor scan that's passive on bortas command. Bottom line is I'm looking for any advices you folks have. I don't plan sticking to a cruiser anyway, not bc I don't like them, but as the novelty fades away, i tend to fall asleep lol, those are just too slow for my play style.
oh you bought the bortasqu? do all this and don't change targets lol, i win button engaged. if you bought them all and have all the consoles you will basically have to ditch that armor to make them all fit. the 2nd sci console I'd proboly stick a flow cap console in for even more shield killin. you will pop easy if your shields get breached though so watch for that.
First of all, thanks a lot for your answer! I wanted to post a thank you note right away but I said to try few of your hints first.
Definitely putting an extra neutronium adds some hull resistance. So I went from 1 to 2, and I would really go for 3 or 4, but I feel that the plasmonic leech is worth to trade one neutronium. With Max flow cap skills and no flow console, I get +15 to the power levels. So this is my actual console layout:
Tac: 4xdisrupter
Sci: shield cap, borg
Eng: 2x neutronium, 1 plasmonic leech, disrupter auto cannon universal console.*
What I would try is taking out the auto cannon and replace it with a neutronium. The cannon is good though when you catch an escort in between apo and low shields. I would guess it has similar dmg like 3dhc on crf2 or 3 (havent looked at logs though). On the other side I will get an eng team 3 so I can get a substantial hull heal in case I need it. Over all, that's a bunch of interesting ideas you offered and once again, thanks a lot!
One question: you mentioned rsp, is that some kind of "oh ****" button, when you get subnuced, shield heals on cool down and no way to get a heal in a useful timely manner? I personally find rsp not too useful, especially in a pug when you just manage to stay alive few more seconds. My replacement for rsp is evasive/deuterium plus eng batt when I see myself at 1/4 shields, under constant attack from more opponents and if an escort decides to follow, usually won't last more than I do. If more follow, then i die, but the rest of the team has a chance for more kills in that time. Also, with the bfi doffs assgned, i get a full shield heal.
I havent use the 3 bortasqu consoles in same time, dont really think its worth sacrificing other consoles such as neutronium/flow cap. What do you think?
One question: you mentioned rsp, is that some kind of "oh ****" button, when you get subnuced, shield heals on cool down and no way to get a heal in a useful timely manner? I personally find rsp not too useful, especially in a pug when you just manage to stay alive few more seconds. My replacement for rsp is evasive/deuterium plus eng batt when I see myself at 1/4 shields, under constant attack from more opponents and if an escort decides to follow, usually won't last more than I do. If more follow, then i die, but the rest of the team has a chance for more kills in that time. Also, with the bfi doffs assgned, i get a full shield heal.
I havent use the 3 bortasqu consoles in same time, dont really think its worth sacrificing other consoles such as neutronium/flow cap. What do you think?
glad i could help. rsp is your emergency last ditch shield heal, it should only be used when there is but a sliver of shields left and people are now focusing on you to finish you off. with shields you constantly want to be hitting distribute all, or distribute to the shield faceing that is getting hit, so by the time you do need rsp you have no shields left at all. then after you hit rsp, keep hitting distribute all like mad! all the healing from people shooting at you will refill all your faceings. by then your other heals will be off their cool downs and you can continue on like all that damage you took never happened.
So I've decided to try something. I made an Excel sheet with all my BOs and their powers to play around some builds with, but then I realized I could turn it into a Google Doc, and let anyone (do my work for me) mess around with it! So, if you feel like it, head over to the Google Doc (anyone should be able to edit, with or without a Google account) and make a few builds for an Odyssey class cruiser: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjbPxewaK5DgdHh5cVVSakg2YkhQeUZJbXZXQncxR3c
I think everything you need to know is explained right at the very top. Let me know if it works at all, and if you like the idea.
Comments
You guys are too kind to these folk. IMO this guy just got rolled one too many times raged on the inside and it's coming out in the form of a subtle superiority complex in his post since the game mechanics don't fit his skill level.
I love how he says the masses have spoken that pvp sucks. Of course the pve hero and rpers have all spoken about pvp sucking. Consider the source then. Don't mistake rpers and pver's making up the majority of the population of this game for pvp sucking.
Fyi, you need 3 purple doffs now (it used to be you need only a blue and a green to effect all teams) for a specific team to be at global cooldown.
Atm using FaW negates the need for the targeting boost the Omega gives. Personally, w/the FaW targeting issue w/the exception of cruiser imo people shouldn't use FaW see below for more details. Cruisers have so little options and they're relatively restricted in movement, imo it's ok they use it.
Off topic Tet Glider didn't get the nerf that was listed (25%) nor do power insulators work, so imo no player should use this w/the exception of taking down the new FE broke shields, or someone is annoying you w/P2W stuff.
Also off topic imo Phasers are too OP for fast volley combos. For example using Phasers w/CRF3 I was able to drop a test player FE shields enough to get a tric HYT through (and we know how slow those are). I also observed during this test dbb and turrets fired 4 shots/volley. Phasers have 4 rolls/shot. 1 volley of 3 dbb and 3 turrets = 3x4x4 + 3x4x4 rolls = 96 rolls (this is w/o any extra shots from special abilities). With 2.5% chance of procing that's ~ 2 procs/volley. So, combined w/FaW never missing (not even counting extra shots) in 2 volleys odds are the targets shields will drop (2 volleys = 4 procs, shields proc odds 1/4). This leaves a 4th high slot for HYT torp of choice to punch through. In theory Polaron procs can come close to this in drain builds to be fair (for those spec'd in flow cap w/console&deflector boosts).
Thanks for the updated doff info. The lolcryptic changes this stuff so quickly these days. I suppose in an effort to make us spend more c points heh.
I don't see the point of this post...what do you want to actually tell us?
The unsaid con is people become reliant on broken abilities and then cry nerf xyz when they're fixed because their build no longer holds up. Look at the rash of complaints after MACO shields were fixed, or the old FaW was brought back in line. Imo, builds shouldn't be based around known broken things like FaW & Tet Glider. At least start the match w/o it then add it if needed later.
Edit: For me I won't start a match w/phasers b/c I think they're OP if by nothing else then the fact I can get a HY Quant volley through the new FE shields using them w/CRF. But, that's a debatable OP issue not a basic broken one.
im just a cruiser fan, i have had great success in an escort, but i just keep ending up with my characters back in cruisers. my tac excelsior dealing between 3000 and 1500 a shot with 8 beams when fully buffed melts things so well, and i have all that survivability with 2x EPtS, ET2, A2S3, RSP2, TSS2, and HE1. RSP2 and ET2 would switch places to RSP1 and ET3 provided i ever get a response from "could anyone train ET3 please?" at DS9 and space dock. i swear that hasn't worked since F2P happened.
so my fed engineer is in a galaxy R, i think its kinda hip to fly one now, the odyssey has assumed the im a noob mantra the galaxy R had. love the ship, but its far from optimal stations and terrible turn rate are so unfortunate. ive made it work, with its stats all it can be are an impenetrable tank and healer. it will never deal damage, best it can seem to do is 1000- 500 damage a shot with 8 beams. my kdf is basically a clone of this build in a neg var, only it deals more damage with its 3rd tactical console. since it has more built in weapons power, im able to run 2xEPtA1 instead of weapons, quite helpful for those heals.
still deals more damage then about 75% of the other cruisers i see in stfs, and i regularly placed second and third in damage on the pvp scoreboards. you would think that with all the "kirks" and "The Dragon Flagship" flying around that my dedicated healer with 2 tactical consoles wouldn't be dealing better damage then them, :rolleyes: i must just know how to play! its amazing just how HARD escorts gun for me, i must suck if im flying this thing, it must be so frustrating when i simply won't die, and can run almost as fast as they can.
skills are as follows
TT1, FAW2
EPtW1, RSP1, EWP1, A2S3 in stfs, for pvp EPtW1, RSP1, A2S2, ES3
EPtW1, EPtS2, ET3
EPtS1
HE1, TSS2
im stfs i run 2 netronium, 1 monotonium, and 1 anti plasma/tetryon armor with my green mk12 [turn]
engine and blue mk11 deflector that's nothing but + to hull repair and shield hp. might swap this with 3 part borg eventually, a lot of grinding still needed for that, a lot of this equipment is from season 3 and 4. with the points i put into threat control, literally ever borg npc targets ONLY me, but this build can take it. if i cant contribute meaningful dps, i can at least tank 3 or 4 spheres and let the dps'er do their job without interference.
in pvp its 2 netronium, borg and sep console slotted for engineering with 2 flow cap consoles and omega deflector and engine for maximum shield damaging with the glider. so far im happy with it, ive saved many asses in the pubs ive played.
at least when it inevitably gets boring not doing the killing i can swap back to my tacticals and 'kirk' it up, with actual success, as i see fit!
I'm 95% certain I can train Engineering Team 3. Send me a mail, I will reply when I'm in game and have time to train. I'm generally on around 7-9 ish mountain time (9-11 eastern) in the evenings on the weekdays I am on.
Based on some emails I have, I can also train Extend Shields 3, if you want that.
I'll have to get in game and verify what I can train, since I don't remember and I'm at work. Sorry in advance if there's disappointment.
This is incorrect.
You only need 1 Purple and 1 Blue Doff for a specific team to be at global cooldown.
For example, I use 1 purple quality and 1 blue quality Developmental Lab Scientist for Science team. They reduce the global cooldown by 14 seconds total (8 seconds=Purple, 6 seconds=Blue). With those slotted, I go from 29 seconds to 15 seconds cooldown on a single Science Team.
So you only need 1 purple and 1 blue Doff, not 3 purples, to be at Global cooldown on a specific team.
The dev has stated they want 3 purples to achieve this goal. The fact there's shoddy work and the Doffs are giving giving the values they should doesn't change this. It just makes them broken. Check out the Purple KDF conn officers as an example 1 purple gives only a 3 second reduction the other purple gives 4 while they both should be @ 5 seconds. I mentioned in a thread over a month ago the stores aren't giving out Doffs who's abilities are as the Devs describe them. For awhile though those same conn officers were giving 8 & 6 second reductions while other blues were giving 8. The Doffs are just a mess tbo.
Do you have a link for that?
Are you sure that you don't have the purple Evasive Conn Officer Doff confused with the other 2 Variants when you describe discrepancies in cooldowns? I will admit that they really did need to add new titles when they introduced the variants instead of calling them Conn officers, which was already being used.
There are 3 versions of Conn Officer Doffs.
Variant #1: Tac team cooldown reduction.
Variant #2: Evasive maneuver cooldown reduction.
Variant #3: Attack patterns cooldown reduction.
thanks for the offer, im sure i'll have luck with this soon. if not, i'll proboly send an email. don't need extend shields on this ship, its a greedy kirk damage dealer, the healer is the character i talked about in the rest of my post.
wow. i had like no interest in all this doff TRIBBLE at all, and now i come to find out i can reduce the team ability cooldown to just the global cooldown level by slotting the right couple of doffs in my active roster? thats ridiculuse, well glad the exchange makes finding the right doffs so easy now.
http://forums.startrekonline.com/showpost.php?p=3998452&postcount=45
http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=251832 post # seven for con officer. And, no it's not fixed on holodeck yet (but at least it's not over 5 sec anymore).
http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=259927
Good advice Mav.
Thanks for posting the link.
Edit: also ground stuff like phaser turret fab 3.
In other news, this is an AWESOME thread. Very helpful! Are you going to consider doing anything for the new Oddy/Bortas C Store ships?
ya....no $100 for all versions of both ships is absurd, i can understand 1 costing 2000 points, but the next 2 should cost you 500 each. i think my healer will continue on in the galaxy in protest.
its not like there is a single difference in the model between the 3, just slightly different stats and consoles. if they were selling 3 completely different, made from scratch ships, charging for 3 compleatly different ships would be understandable. instead they're charging you 2000 for a ship, and then 2000 for 2 consoles, if you get the package deal.
well if enough people cant help them selvs, the game will continue to live, so i guess thats a good thing.
I am curious:
Back on your Excelsior part you actually said you'd like to try out the Omega Shield for the turnrate proc. Since I have painfully grinded my way through all those STF the past few days (yawn!), I would be rather disappointed to buy the wrong items.
So far this would be my Excelsior setup, I know I am an Engineer captain:
Weapons: 3x Polarized Tetryon Beam Array, 1x Chroniton Launcher - both for and aft. I choose Chroniton because of the debuff to slow other ships down.
Deflector: Tachyon Deflector Array Mk XI - supports +24 Flow Capacitors and +16 Particle Generators, helping both my Tet Glider and my EWP III.
Engines: Omega Engines MK XI
Shields: Omega Shields Mk XI - the Proc should help for some turnrate and speed boosts, which would be nice for better EWP maneuvering.
Devices: Red Matter Capacitor, Subspace Field Modulator, Weapon Battery, Engine Battery
Eng Consoles: Borg Console, Neutronium Mk XI, EPS Mk XI, RCS Mk XI
Sci Consoles: Field Generator Mk XI, Flow Capacitor Mk XI - the FC should again help the Tet Glider
Tac Consoles: 3x Tetryon Pulse Generator Mk XI
Bridge Officers:
Cmdr. Engineer: EPtW 1, EPtS 2, ASIF 2, EWP 3
Lt. Engineer: EPtW 1, EPtS2
Ens. Engineer: ET 1
Lt. Cmdr. Tactical: TT 1, HYT 2, FAW 3
Lt. Science: HE 1, TSS 2
Here is a link to the skills:
http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/index.php?build=Teslanar_0
As you can see I specced quite much into Particle Generators to get much better Eject Warp Plasma results. I also have a purple Doff which grants a 20%(25%) chance to completely immobilize the target within the plasma cloud.
I am still not sure if I should use the Omega or MACO shield. Back on Tribble, I found the proc from the Omega shield rather... lackluster. A mere gimmick if you want. The MACO on the other hand offers a much better defensive stat.
However if I go for MACO, I'd have to drop my non-set Deflector, which heavily supports both the Tet Glider and the EWP.
I'd change it out for either an SIF Generator, or more Armor (like one of the 4 energy resist consoles)
Thanks, any more opinions from you about the MACO/Omega decission?
It's hard to pass it up.
I definitely would do your best to keep the glider. And If I recall correctly the Omega Deflector -does- do a good job at buffing the glider, and particle generators. I guess if I were in your position I'd give the maco shield a shot, and run with the omega deflector and engine.
i really miss my old high cap shield when i use the maco and get alpha striked off guard, it just doesn't have the hitpoints to blunt those as well and they are almost always breached. its great at dealing with any other type of incoming damage though
Shield: honor guard
Deflector and engines: omega
Power settings for attack (with bonuses without leech bonus, with leech I get at least 15 more I think per level):
- weapons 120
- engines little less than 60
- shield about 55-ish
- aux about 40-ish
Not exactly sure if I am accurate with this, I'll update while in game with exact values.
I also use a healing power with 105 aux and max engine I can get, all others are at min possible. shield tank settings is with 120 weapons, max possible shield and min possible aux and engine, speed with max engine and then aux and min weapons and shield.
Cmd Eng: Eps1, Aux to Inertial1 (trying to gain a little turn), Eps3, Aux to Structural 3
Lt Cmd Universal Tac: TT1, Torp Spread2, FaW3
Lt Tac: TT1, FaW2
Lt Sci: HE1, TSS2
Ens Universal Sci: Polarize Hull 1 (mainly to gain some extra defense)- thinging maybe a tractor? But I'm not speced and tb1 kinda sucks IMO.
Weapons:
Front:
- 1 mkxi purple Chronitron Acc x2 - for torp spread and slowing the target (not specced in torps at all). Note: I use those with evasives and reverse to quickly turn then use disruptor auto cannon while fully buffed and hoping to get few secs of no subnuc, lol
- 2 phaser disruptor beam from Galor (Accx2 and Dmg),
- 1 Mkxi purple disruptor beam CrtHx3 - using it mainly for faw never miss proc, lol
Rear:
- 2 mkxi purple disruptor beam CrtDx3
- 2 phaser disruptor from galor
Consoles:
Eng: plasmonic leech, mkxi purple neutronium, Borg, and disruptor cannon- thinking to change with an eps
Sci: 35%shield, mkxi purple flow cap(with weapons 120 I get 55 shield drain for tet glider per beam)
Tac: 3x mkxi blue disruptor, mkxi purple disruptor
Now, i have tried it yesterday briefly in pug pvp and kerrat and did ok. Cant say how ok bc i am not a cruiser pilot, but in kerrat, at spawning point i hit evasives, an escort and a cruiser chased me, buffed all i have and hit them back. 30 sec later they left me alone, escort almost dead and cruiser with 30-ish hull. I was at almost full shields and about 85 hull, but never had to use he. Definitely they were not top of the line players though. What I am not too happy with is the turn rate, but I really don't think it's worth throwing in a turn console bc it will still suck. Do you have any recommendations for that? Also, pol hull gives some dmg resistance, but I'm thinking something else may be better value. Also, aux to struct is on same global with aux to inertial. Dps wise, I think it's ok, but I would like to know if you guys would go for bo3 rather than faw3. I have tried replacing faw3 w apo, but ive found that my dps drops quite a bit. I may think too much in terms of a bop pilot, and I'll appreciate your suggestions.
Thanks for answering, I don't really give a squat about pve since no matter what you do pve is just plain easy. I am more interested in what would you do to improve what i have from a Pvp stand point. So you suggest taking some power from engine and put it to shields? On the other side, I can't even dream to have the survivability on an eng, as an eng cannot even dream to get the damage of a tac. I know, cruisers are mainly for engies, but with this console and boff layout, the output damage is pretty god for bortasq. Also, there is an added damage from sensor scan that's passive on bortas command. Bottom line is I'm looking for any advices you folks have. I don't plan sticking to a cruiser anyway, not bc I don't like them, but as the novelty fades away, i tend to fall asleep lol, those are just too slow for my play style.
glad to hear it!
are you asking for a tactical or engineering captain? im gonna assume tactical for this post. as far as my power level suggestion goes, you only really need to be moving fast enough for your defense score to max out, its a value listed in your ship's character sheet. when you max the skills that support it you should cap at about 60.8%, adjust your engine power levels until they give you this value or a value right under this, this is your evasion score, it causes your enemies to miss. you don't need more engine power then this, dump the rest into shields, always keep your weapons power maxed, and use aux batterys like candy whenever you or your team mate need especially potent heals.
well the best thing about the bortas is that is has 4 tactical consoles. you can focus mainly on tanking with it and it will still deal better damage over time then other cruisers. my kdf tactical uses one currently, with the universal ensign used for engineering and the LTC for tactical. with just 5 engineering powers, you can get pretty good survivability, but less then you could have with even an excelsior.
I'd suggest 2xEPtS1, ET2, RSP2, and A2S3. of if you can get training in ET3, swap your ET and RSP. the innate weapons power the ship has makes it so you don't even need 2xEPtW1 to be basically topped out, unlike with the odyssey. this thing is op and it just makes me laugh, the devs don't even realize it but by giving it +15 to weapons they eliminated the need for 2 station powers. this doesn't even occur to them.
your sci powers are good, the shield resistance from TSS2 is better then the healing potential of HE2. if your just using beam arrays BO3 is wasted on them, they are only worth using with DBBs. and only if you don't have any other beam weapons equipped so you don't accidentally fire it off with a beam array.
as far as tactical powers go, well 5 just arent needed with an 8 beam array cruiser, they are not worth the opportunity cost of additional engineering powers imo, but cant do anything about it. definitely use FAW3, it cooks everything around you, and 2xAPB1 so when you breach shields you hit them even harder, and 2xTT1 or if you want to keep your chronoton TT1 and TS1. you only really need 2 TT1s when you uses duel cannons, your forward shield faceing cant face away from your enemy if you want to deal damage to them, not really an issue on a broadsider.
i haven't tried it, but ive been thinking about a 7 turret, 1 duel beam bank build, that number of tactical powers with those weapons could be interesting, with BO3 2xCRF1, and 2xTT1, or maybe an aft chronoton with TS1.
for consoles, i think it might be worth using 3 Neuronium and borg in engineering, your gonna need all the extra defense you can get. field projector in science and 4 energy type consoles for tactical. omega deflector and engine, with KHG shield.
with that you have basically a clone of what my kdf tac is set up as right now, haven't done much pvp with him since i set him up, but he has been quite effective at killing so far. its got limited support capability too with all its heals being useable on others, just pop an aux battery first. its a pretty shameless kirk otherwise.
since your using chronoton, and the damage they do is irreverent, i wouldn't even spec into torpedo damage, you save yourself 22500 points that way. something seems to boost their proc effectiveness, not sure what it is though, flow capacitors? particle generators?
oh you bought the bortasqu? do all this and don't change targets lol, i win button engaged. if you bought them all and have all the consoles you will basically have to ditch that armor to make them all fit. the 2nd sci console I'd proboly stick a flow cap console in for even more shield killin. you will pop easy if your shields get breached though so watch for that.
glad i could help. rsp is your emergency last ditch shield heal, it should only be used when there is but a sliver of shields left and people are now focusing on you to finish you off. with shields you constantly want to be hitting distribute all, or distribute to the shield faceing that is getting hit, so by the time you do need rsp you have no shields left at all. then after you hit rsp, keep hitting distribute all like mad! all the healing from people shooting at you will refill all your faceings. by then your other heals will be off their cool downs and you can continue on like all that damage you took never happened.
I think everything you need to know is explained right at the very top. Let me know if it works at all, and if you like the idea.