TOR is a well done game, which feels like a 2005'ish mmo revamp. It's all about "been there, done that". No money from my part just because it bears the SW title.
STO takes you away from the classic mmo recipe and tries to diversify the gameplay experience by giving some not so conventional elements (space travel, space and ground combat, third person shooter, excellent character personalization etc). STO feels different, because it was intended for a different player type, rather than a themepark hand-holding addict.
Is STO perfect? Hell no!
However it is different from most other mmos you see there on the market and this is what is/will keep me playing for a long time.
Regardless of how good TOR is, regardless of the millions spent on voice acting and advertising, it still remains a game which should have been released many years ago (gameplay wise), since it brings little innovation and doesn't try to differentiate itself in any way from its competitors (seriously, voice acting is not that big of a deal).
I've chosen STO to experience a different gameplay from what is available on the market at this time and I got my money worth so far.
I can't say the same thing about TOR.
you know, its funny, I feel the exact opposite, I found ToR boring and repetitive and I had issue after issue with it on my pc, issues that being in the beta and posting many bug reports about should have been fixed before release (and I was in the very first beta weekend too)
STO is no where near perfect I agree, but story, feel, etc is by far much better to me than ToR
(Also, ToR is so astronomically expensive compared to STO, with ToR being released at now the most expensive RRP on the market for an MMO release, its just not worth it)
you do know sto was not selling for 10$ when it first came out its CE was 80$ alone wich now it nothing more then a box now whit a pen
and sorry could say sto is very much as repetitive as tor all you do in sto kill kill kill get data get data get data thats right all you do in sto and story sto has very little of a story
ive put 11 days all ready in to my toon on tor 11days not even cap in sto you can be cap from what i here now in 3 days 3 days hek when sto came out only took me one week to get cap then one more week to be in all the best stuff
you know, its funny, I feel the exact opposite, I found ToR boring and repetitive and I had issue after issue with it on my pc, issues that being in the beta and posting many bug reports about should have been fixed before release (and I was in the very first beta weekend too)
STO is no where near perfect I agree, but story, feel, etc is by far much better to me than ToR
(Also, ToR is so astronomically expensive compared to STO, with ToR being released at now the most expensive RRP on the market for an MMO release, its just not worth it)
To each their own, I've found TOR's story to be quite amazing. Each planet has a unique feel with a unique set of problems that all lead back to the greater galactic issue of the war. STO's story seemed to lose focus with each new sector and planet, it didn't really point back to anything. At least that is what I saw.
TOR runs better for me than STO so I can't comment on any issues and as for price, new and popular games tend to be more expensive than games that are old or aren't very popular / successful. Not to mention the whole F2P thing.
To each their own, I've found TOR's story to be quite amazing. Each planet has a unique feel with a unique set of problems that all lead back to the greater galactic issue of the war. STO's story seemed to lose focus with each new sector and planet, it didn't really point back to anything. At least that is what I saw.
TOR runs better for me than STO so I can't comment on any issues and as for price, new and popular games tend to be more expensive than games that are old or aren't very popular / successful. Not to mention the whole F2P thing.
Yes, but you payed 60$ for the game's story, since that's the only thing the "defenders" of the game bring up in an argument. Once that story is over, what makes you continue paying 15$/month?
Let's not forget that if it was a single player game, you could pay once, hop in and finish the story missions all over again. In TOR's case, if you return after 4 months and decide you want to replay a character, you need to give another 15$.
So pretty much you're paying for a game which should have been single player, but the masterminds at EA though that if they add a chat function they can squeeze more money.
I would have had no problems what so ever with TOR, if it was released just as KOTOR 3, but the monthly fee is not justifiable at all, because the multiplayer part is not innovative in any way, shape or form.
Well TOR is superior when it comes to being an MMO.
Main crippling weakness of STO as far as i am concerned?
It punishes group play.
I cannot join my friends who have come back to take a look at the game without inflating the difficulty of the mobs to a point where they feel useless (spawns get bigger, all is scaled to VA levels).
TOR never punishes me or my mates for grouping.
That is, chiefly, what makes TOR superior. I can group with low levels without ruining the game for them.
Low levels still have things to contribute (crowd control for example, or trash mob cleaning) when joining others that do higher level content.
And TOR is, even with its slight imbalances and several bugs right out of the "wtf why did nobody catch that?!" category still a much better crafted game.
I cannot join my friends who have come back to take a look at the game without inflating the difficulty of the mobs to a point where they feel useless (spawns get bigger, all is scaled to VA levels).
You haven't been using the leveling feature to bump yourself down or them up that's been in place since season 1 or 2 have you?
Yes, but you payed 60$ for the game's story, since that's the only thing the "defenders" of the game bring up in an argument. Once that story is over, what makes you continue paying 15$/month?
Let's not forget that if it was a single player game, you could pay once, hop in and finish the story missions all over again. In TOR's case, if you return after 4 months and decide you want to replay a character, you need to give another 15$.
So pretty much you're paying for a game which should have been single player, but the masterminds at EA though that if they add a chat function they can squeeze more money.
I would have had no problems what so ever with TOR, if it was released just as KOTOR 3, but the monthly fee is not justifiable at all, because the multiplayer part is not innovative in any way, shape or form.
star trek online is more a solo player game then Tor is and as i said before star trek online sell's for 10$ for a reason Tor has raids and there more then 5 player group's they go from 8 player to 16 players only time you see that many in sto is on ESD or when pvp was alive in star trek online and Tor has 4 player mission's which is the equivalent of what the special task force uest to be guess what there is more then 4 of them and they start out at lvl 10 i think going all they way to 50 and guess what thats just the easy mode there a hard mode for when you hit lvl 50 which is the equivalent of VA in sto
and as i recall star trek online was 60$ when it came out 80$ for the CE now you can get both for 10 and 14$
Ok so ive been playing SWTOR for a bit now, my view?
It is fun, so much more to do than STO and hard to think SWTOR is a new release.
But it doesnt come without faults, personal things i dont like.
1 PvP - Utter rubbish, unbanded level PvP, totally stupid. They even call them warzones! total failure on this part. Trooper or Smuggler etc are the way to go here, shoot and kill before a Sabre wielder can even get a blow in, 1v1 combat between weilders is really stupid as it comes to running and smashing buttons, you cant keep a focus on them and use abilities quick enough, once locked in combat they should go head to head etc.
I agree 100% (Commando here); last night I even voiced my opion in a realistically calm way saying that PvP is just flawed in general chat...and I got flamed and /ignored for it.. :rolleyes:
2 Running around - You are sent back and forth way way too much and you end up getting bored and fed up with it, they should give out basic mounts at around 15 to 18ish.
MEh, I'm ok with the running, it's not that bad. I have the CE STAP anyway, so +90 movent speed. Plus quicktravel and taxis everywhere help too.
3 Map Design, some of it looks really nice, but walls etc are badly placed, noone wants to keep walking aroud a huge map to get to something thats more or less next to them, for example umm i forgot the planets name lol, Tranis or something, terrible terrible design.
Taris is the planet...that is the only bad map in my opinion. I love all the others so far....but my God Tairs has so many days of quests and so many places to go haha.
4 Grinding, this isnt so much a problem, but on the above mentioned Planet it never seems to end, back n forth new quest after quest in same area, they should rip out half of these as there all the same and get the Player moving on.
Well I though the never ending quests on Taris showed more pros than cons; showed that Bioware wanted to give us a ton of content unlike Crytpic.
5 Confusing, so many areas, so many commendations etc, it is really confusing and not very well thought out, it gets easier as you level but it is still a pain.
I disagree. It's pretty simple if you sit back and give some time ot look at it. The Republic fleet has an entire area for planet commendations, and warzone commendations. And there are vendors in all WZ's anyway too. TOR has a very simple com system.
6 Ship Combat, a complete joke, may as well say it hasnt any, how on Earth did they release it like that, completely and totally rubbish, STO is God here im afraid.
I agree, I don't want to play Starfox 64...X-wing vs Tie Fighter or anything close to SWG's Jump to Lightspeed would have been more realistic for a game like TOR.
7 Lag, this may just be me, but Lag isnt there, not at the start, after playing for a few hours it starts to get slower and slower till i have to come out of the game or i crash.
I rarely get lag. I only had it when I went down to North Carolina to visit family, otherwise I get next to no lag.
8 Bugs, i mean big bugs, i spent days doing a chain quest for it to bug out at the end and can no longer carry on with it, spent hours doing a Flashpoint to only keep falling through the floor etc.
Been some patches lately to fix that and....it's the FIRST MONTH still. Compare TOR's bugs with STO"s.
9 Servers, way too many, theres simply loads of them , close some push more players into same servers.
Well TOR has over 1 million subs...and most servers are full all the time. The server number is needed.
Yes all the shouting about it is WoW with a SW skin is completely true, carbon copy really, a real total rip off, nothing unique or new or anovative, but its a proven formula for some, for me its ok but new breed of MMOs are starting to change things, for me GW2 looks the real deal.
Sounds like i dont like SWTOR, i do , it is fun when said and done and unlike STO it actually has things to do in it, so yes ill carry on playing for the moment and see if Space combat and PvP improves. If it doesnt? i can see me leaving allready after a short spell as the above complaints will be too much after awhile.
GW2 is more hype than it's worth really, but yes TOR does have WoW-like aspects becasue it wanted to take the WoW-refugees..which is working for good or bad...
Yes, but you payed 60$ for the game's story, since that's the only thing the "defenders" of the game bring up in an argument. Once that story is over, what makes you continue paying 15$/month?
Let's not forget that if it was a single player game, you could pay once, hop in and finish the story missions all over again. In TOR's case, if you return after 4 months and decide you want to replay a character, you need to give another 15$.
So pretty much you're paying for a game which should have been single player, but the masterminds at EA though that if they add a chat function they can squeeze more money.
I would have had no problems what so ever with TOR, if it was released just as KOTOR 3, but the monthly fee is not justifiable at all, because the multiplayer part is not innovative in any way, shape or form.
Hmm, you talk like STO wasn't a sub game and everything you say can be said about STO and even more so. I notice TOR doesn't offer lifetime subs. Wanna know why? Because only companies that don't have confidence in their product want you to pay way in advance so they got your money regardless. And yes, I know TOR offers a 6 month package, but that's not the same as saying pay £100s in front.
The problem is people didn't come back after the first months or STO and now we are at the doors of F2P. Not many games have gone F2P because they were making money before (LoTR springs to mind as a game that was doing well but knew it could do better F2P) and I think we can safely say the STO had to go F2P to survive (no cups and from the looks of it no content was being made).
One thing that's been labled about STO is that it too is a single player game even more so than TOR (tons of heroic quests that you need to group up for in TOR plus Warzones etc).
What's going to keep people coming back for more in TOR? Content... The main thing missing from STO.
Also the altaholics out there, myself included have plenty of other toons to try out. How many on STO?
Look, it's horses for courses. There are things in STO I like but not as much as TOR. I am only going to play STO because it's free.
I can no longer hate on STO as I mentioned, I am not paying for it but some of the garbage people are saying about TOR either means they haven't played it or it didn't come up to their own expectations. A bit like another game I could mention.
Hmm, you talk like STO wasn't a sub game and everything you say can be said about STO and even more so. I notice TOR doesn't offer lifetime subs. Wanna know why? Because only companies that don't have confidence in their product want you to pay way in advance so they got your money regardless. And yes, I know TOR offers a 6 month package, but that's not the same as saying pay £100s in front.
The problem is people didn't come back after the first months or STO and now we are at the doors of F2P. Not many games have gone F2P because they were making money before (LoTR springs to mind as a game that was doing well but knew it could do better F2P) and I think we can safely say the STO had to go F2P to survive (no cups and from the looks of it no content was being made).
One thing that's been labled about STO is that it too is a single player game even more so than TOR (tons of heroic quests that you need to group up for in TOR plus Warzones etc).
What's going to keep people coming back for more in TOR? Content... The main thing missing from STO.
Also the altaholics out there, myself included have plenty of other toons to try out. How many on STO?
Look, it's horses for courses. There are things in STO I like but not as much as TOR. I am only going to play STO because it's free.
I can no longer hate on STO as I mentioned, I am not paying for it but some of the garbage people are saying about TOR either means they haven't played it or it didn't come up to their own expectations. A bit like another game I could mention.
No one had a gun at people's heads to make them buy a life sub. That's one aspect. Another aspect is that, if you think about it, it's been 2 years since release.
A 15$ per month means that after 1 year and 5 months, all life subs got their money worth (in subscription time).
Now that we got that out of the way... :
How much content do you think you will get to be worth the 15$ a month in TOR? I'll tell you, not much.
Because every month you'll be paying 1/4 of the initial game price, while receiving content like 2-3 missions (voice acting will make things longer to complete - and more money).
I will give you some "inside" news. Take them with a grain a salt if you wish.
I have a buddy who is currently working as a tester for EA. He and his team were some of the first to play TOR, so he started to like it.
Last week, we had a conversation about TOR, STO and EVE and among other things he told me that they've received a very very early alpha build for a TOR expansion, which will not be free. Apparently they will use Blizzard's method of releasing expansions.
That is the content you will receive, at best, not worth the 15$ per month, but as a separate 30-40$ purchase. Their testing deadline is a little unclear, but he told me that it will end sometime this Autumn.
PS - off-topic: When I asked him how the hell does a developer start working on an expansion right after a game's release (which means less resources and time allocated for the live content), he told me that it is something normal these days for most big-name devs (he worked for Ubi and Activision before as a testing manager/coordinator).
To my knowledge, Cryptic did add the featured episodes and everything else for free. Sure, it took them a while, but we got them eventually.
If you put both games side by side, you will see two things:
1.STO/Cryptic had way less money than EAware. It means less money for the development, less money for buying the so-called "reviewers" who gave TOR a 9/10 even if it was out for like 4 days, and less money for advertising, meaning less players and less motivation to go on. Regardless of all those problems, STO is alive and kicking, possibly looking at a rebirth once f2p hits.
2.TOR had all the time in the world to take a look at the competition and try to really come out with something unique and interesting.
I see the excuse "the game is released recently, so be patient, because they will eventually add more content."
My reaction to that is "what the hell did they wait for in the 5 years the game was in dev?" Couldn't they just take a look at the competition and come up with a new game, rather than using the same old tired themepark recipe?
I'm sorry but I can't help to notice that this was Bioware's (excellent) idea for KOTOR3, until EA came and told them "you're gonna make a mmo out of it".
No one had a gun at people's heads to make them buy a life sub. That's one aspect. Another aspect is that, if you think about it, it's been 2 years since release.
A 15$ per month means that after 1 year and 5 months, all life subs got their money worth (in subscription time).
Now that we got that out of the way... :
How much content do you think you will get to be worth the 15$ a month in TOR? I'll tell you, not much.
Because every month you'll be paying 1/4 of the initial game price, while receiving content like 2-3 missions (voice acting will make things longer to complete - and more money).
I will give you some "inside" news. Take them with a grain a salt if you wish.
I have a buddy who is currently working as a tester for EA. He and his team were some of the first to play TOR, so he started to like it.
Last week, we had a conversation about TOR, STO and EVE and among other things he told me that they've received a very very early alpha build for a TOR expansion, which will not be free.
That is the content you will receive, at best, not worth the 15$ per month, but as a separate 30-40$ purchase. Their testing deadline is a little unclear, but he told me that it will end sometime this Autumn.
To my knowledge, Cryptic did add the featured episodes and everything else for free. Sure, it took them a while, but we got them eventually.
If you put both games side by side, you will see two things:
1.STO/Cryptic had way less money than EAware. It means less money for the development, less money for buying the so-called "reviewers" who gave TOR a 9/10 even if it was out for like 4 days, and less money for advertising, meaning less players and less motivation to go on. Regardless of all those problems, STO is alive and kicking, possibly looking at a rebirth once f2p hits.
2.TOR had all the time in the world to take a look at the competition and try to really come out with something unique and interesting.
I see the excuse "the game is released recently, so be patient, because they will eventually add more content."
My reaction to that is "what the hell did they wait for in the 5 years the game was in dev?" Couldn't they just take a look at the competition and come up with a new game, rather than using the same old tired themepark recipe?
All lifetime subs got their monies worth "IF" they were playing the game for a year and a half. I am sure if you asked, a lot of those lifetime subbers would have loved to have not played when they were not playing like those who subbed monthly and left and came back as and when they wanted too. So no, I don't buy into the thought that if you got a lifetime sub you got your monies worth. But hey, I don't know and neither do you.
And as to the rest of your post, I gave up reading. Want to know why. You don't like TOR. I get it. But right now, millions are and are having fun. If I get bored in a month, I will play something else, but so far I don't see that happening. STO left me feeling hollow after I reached max level in 3 weeks of casual play. TOR so far I haven't even scratched the surface so as far as I am concerned, it has already passed my expectations. I loved U/O, I loved E/Q and I loved WoW. To me TOR is just the next MMo that is going to suck up my time. To bad STO couldn't and never will.
STO is the game I will play as a single player 30 mins pew pew. That's it. TOR is my main.
All lifetime subs got their monies worth "IF" they were playing the game for a year and a half. I am sure if you asked, a lot of those lifetime subbers would have loved to have not played when they were not playing like those who subbed monthly and left and came back as and when they wanted too. So no, I don't buy into the thought that if you got a lifetime sub you got your monies worth. But hey, I don't know and neither do you.
And as to the rest of your post, I gave up reading. Want to know why. You don't like TOR. I get it. But right now, millions are and are having fun. If I get bored in a month, I will play something else, but so far I don't see that happening. STO left me feeling hollow after I reached max level in 3 weeks of casual play. TOR so far I haven't even scratched the surface so as far as I am concerned, it has already passed my expectations. I loved U/O, I loved E/Q and I loved WoW. To me TOR is just the next MMo that is going to suck up my time. To bad STO couldn't and never will.
STO is the game I will play as a single player 30 mins pew pew. That's it. TOR is my main.
Enjoy your STO, I will for the basic game it is.
Cheers.
You don't care what I just wrote, but you bother replying. That's...interesting.
Millions of people are addicted to drugs and are having "fun" too. Let's all get on the bandwagon!
I am also one of the (2) millions who bought the game so far, and I've quit it after going through the (well done) single player storyline experience. So did/will others. So stating that there are still millions of people playing TOR is an overstatement.
Was it worth the 60$? Yes, it was, but I can't say the same about paying a quarter of that monthly just to experience the "heroic" dungeon content, which I can find in any free Asian mmo out there.
^ How about this, 3rd party stepping in and asking to take this arguement outside the thread.
I got a Collector's Edition of TOR, to me, was it worth it. Hell yes. The bonus of a security key was a good aspect as well.
Story. I actually listen to all the quests and don't skip at all. Why? I want to honor all the work Bioware put into TOR and to get my money's worth. I'm nearly level 39, but in general, the stories for my one class alone will be enough entertainment for months, let alone alts I'll make in te near future.
Whne I see negative posts on TOR, it's mainly about PvP, space, or the opinion that it is WoW with lasers. My response is alway that if one willing to try to truey look into something instead of forming a fast bias and sticking with a negative view...why play? I mean that form a customer stance. Why would you use X product if it truely brought you nothing but anger?
It's only the first half month of TOR, and with the first real update coming this month nad more realistic promises of new content for TOR, I can see fixes alongside the new content that'll improve the overall opinion.
If TOR really is just WoW in space, I wonder if I should give WoW another try. But the time I tested it out, the starter missions were weak and boring. Maybe I am colored by my Sith Inquistor's starter quest. But basically the first relevant NPC I meet has a personality - and I hate him. I was immediately emotionally engaged.
So I think, yes, the voice acting and the story writing makes a big impact on whether this is "WoW in Space" or its own thing that uniquely appeals to me.
If TOR really is just WoW in space, I wonder if I should give WoW another try. But the time I tested it out, the starter missions were weak and boring. Maybe I am colored by my Sith Inquistor's starter quest. But basically the first relevant NPC I meet has a personality - and I hate him. I was immediately emotionally engaged.
So I think, yes, the voice acting and the story writing makes a big impact on whether this is "WoW in Space" or its own thing that uniquely appeals to me.
I played WoW from the start and only left it after I completed Cata as I got bored. But 5 years plus of playing was well worth it. This is and isn't WoW in space and the only reason people say this is because WoW took alot of elements from other MMo's and made the game fun, easier and casual friendly and that's what TOR is aiming for. EQ and U/O and DAOC were never casual and were not easy but they certainly were fun (hard core MMoer here).
Having said that, since BC I have never read any quest text (unless I got stuck on the quest and had to read it). With TOR, every quest I do I listen to the VO and like you, I too get emotionally engaged. Even the standard kill 5 rats doesn't seem as boring because I know why I have to kill 5 rats and it generally has a reason on the chain quest or overall class quest.
I think after playing TOR though, it would be hard to go back to WoW or even try it new, as V/O and story is a pretty big thing now. Well for me it is.:)
... I think after playing TOR though, it would be hard to go back to WoW or even try it new, as V/O and story is a pretty big thing now. Well for me it is.:)
In essence, games like Mass Effect and now TOR has paved the way for BIG Budget MMO"s - They have taken a milestone for the genre, in regards to game interaction & participation, while at the same time remaining true to the MMO spirit.
Expect other games to follow suit - I won't be surprise if Blizzard develops a large voice interactive MMO like TOR., but with a smaller budget. All Blizzard needs to do is hire good talented actors that aren't necessarily well known, which wasn't the case with TOR.
In essence, games like Mass Effect and now TOR has paved the way for BIG Budget MMO"s - They have taken a milestone for the genre, in regards to game interaction & participation, while at the same time remaining true to the MMO spirit.
Expect other games to follow suit - I won't be surprise if Blizzard develops a large voice interactive MMO like TOR., but with a smaller budget. All Blizzard needs to do is hire good talented actors that aren't necessarily well known, which wasn't the case with TOR.
Wouldn't surprise me in the least if "Titan" Blizz secret MMo, is once again taking the best bit's from other MMos and doing their thing with it. Fully V/O with Story.
They are one of the only other companies that can afford to do it.
In essence, games like Mass Effect and now TOR has paved the way for BIG Budget MMO"s - They have taken a milestone for the genre, in regards to game interaction & participation, while at the same time remaining true to the MMO spirit.
Expect other games to follow suit - I won't be surprise if Blizzard develops a large voice interactive MMO like TOR., but with a smaller budget. All Blizzard needs to do is hire good talented actors that aren't necessarily well known, which wasn't the case with TOR.
Wouldn't surprise me in the least if "Titan" Blizz secret MMo, is once again taking the best bit's from other MMos and doing their thing with it. Fully V/O with Story.
They are one of the only other companies that can afford to do it.
I like TOR and I like TOR better than STO. However, I'm too busy with school and work that I feel like I'd be throwing my subscription fee down the drain on TOR, since I won't be able to play it a whole lot. Since STO went free to play, I'll be able to play that whenever I find the time. I might activate my TOR subscription a month here and there. But I don't think I'll keep it constantly active. STO will suffice for my irregular, casual play in the meantime.
I'm not surprised that TOR is the more polished game... If STO had TOR's budget, I'm sure it would have been much better.
In essence, games like Mass Effect and now TOR has paved the way for BIG Budget MMO"s - They have taken a milestone for the genre, in regards to game interaction & participation, while at the same time remaining true to the MMO spirit.
Expect other games to follow suit - I won't be surprise if Blizzard develops a large voice interactive MMO like TOR., but with a smaller budget. All Blizzard needs to do is hire good talented actors that aren't necessarily well known, which wasn't the case with TOR.
Though obviously not as big an IP, I think if Blizzard made a Starcraft MMO it would definitely be a competitor to the sci-fi MMO market. And Blizzard has lots of cash to make sure its polished before release.
I wasn't going to play TOR, but a friend bought me a copy - so I've been playing it alongside STO. I wanted to give TOR a fair shake because I wasn't buying the cynical "it's just WoW in the SW universe" , but now that I've played it, I kind of agree. It's the WoW for Star Wars. The leveling, the grinding, the skill tree, the travel time, the missions - they all feel "WoWsian." That being said, I still enjoy TOR, but I don't understand why some people are so incredibly impressed with it. The story, and cutscenes are pretty cool, but it still seems like WoW to me.
I wasn't going to play TOR, but a friend bought me a copy - so I've been playing it alongside STO. I wanted to give TOR a fair shake because I wasn't buying the cynical "it's just WoW in the SW universe" , but now that I've played it, I kind of agree. It's the WoW for Star Wars. The leveling, the grinding, the skill tree, the travel time, the missions - they all feel "WoWsian." That being said, I still enjoy TOR, but I don't understand why some people are so incredibly impressed with it. The story, and cutscenes are pretty cool, but it still seems like WoW to me.
<ducks>
I like the crafting more--and the stories on the Imperial side are quite fun (especially the Imperial Agent).
I don't experience a grind at all in this game--there is always enough story content. I've never needed to grind mobs or dailies to level.
Though obviously not as big an IP, I think if Blizzard made a Starcraft MMO it would definitely be a competitor to the sci-fi MMO market. And Blizzard has lots of cash to make sure its polished before release.
I would jump for a Starcraft MMO, just as long as it was 3 factioned and launched with a a teritory control system.
... I want a Resident Evil Online too...
... and a GTA online...
... dang I want alot....
I would jump for a Starcraft MMO, just as long as it was 3 factioned and launched with a a teritory control system.
... I want a Resident Evil Online too...
... and a GTA online...
... dang I want alot....
I highly doubt the Zerg would be a real faction. If we ever see a Starcraft MMO I anticipate the Terrans and Protoss being the 2 main factions with the Zerg being a common enemy and possibly a monster play faction.
IMHO TOR isn't a very good MMO - Rift is the best MMO of 2012. Just the world of Rift seems based on the outcome of a brainstorming session with class of 9-year olds. "dragons and space aliens and robots and ponies and elves and time-travel and demons and sea monsters and ...."
TOR itself is a weak MMO, with a great storyline. But a storyline is not a good driver for an MMO - when the storyline ends, you've got a rather big problem (after running flashpoints twice, the spacebar starts to appeal - but if I press it, the only 'hook' of STO is lost...). I don't think TOR will be a huge failure, and I don't think it'll be a huge success. It looks set to be a bit of a weird pseudo-mmo, and I'm not sure there's any way to change that.
One thing TOR gets both right & wrong (which is interesting for STO) is the 'ship interiors'. You often see your ship interior in TOR, something that doesn't happen in STO. On the other hand it takes 4 loading screens per planet change to support this, and it's basically a time sink - which isn't a good state of affairs. This is an area STO could/should improve, although TOR shows the pitfalls of it's specific approach.
Another aspect worthy of note is that TOR crafting is done by companions - in STO terms perhaps the equivalent of moving crafting to the duty roster...
IMHO TOR isn't a very good MMO - Rift is the best MMO of 2012. Just the world of Rift seems based on the outcome of a brainstorming session with class of 9-year olds. "dragons and space aliens and robots and ponies and elves and time-travel and demons and sea monsters and ....".
Rift? Really??? ok, first time I've heard someone say its "the best"
Comments
STO takes you away from the classic mmo recipe and tries to diversify the gameplay experience by giving some not so conventional elements (space travel, space and ground combat, third person shooter, excellent character personalization etc). STO feels different, because it was intended for a different player type, rather than a themepark hand-holding addict.
Is STO perfect? Hell no!
However it is different from most other mmos you see there on the market and this is what is/will keep me playing for a long time.
Regardless of how good TOR is, regardless of the millions spent on voice acting and advertising, it still remains a game which should have been released many years ago (gameplay wise), since it brings little innovation and doesn't try to differentiate itself in any way from its competitors (seriously, voice acting is not that big of a deal).
I've chosen STO to experience a different gameplay from what is available on the market at this time and I got my money worth so far.
I can't say the same thing about TOR.
you do know sto was not selling for 10$ when it first came out its CE was 80$ alone wich now it nothing more then a box now whit a pen
and sorry could say sto is very much as repetitive as tor all you do in sto kill kill kill get data get data get data thats right all you do in sto and story sto has very little of a story
ive put 11 days all ready in to my toon on tor 11days not even cap in sto you can be cap from what i here now in 3 days 3 days hek when sto came out only took me one week to get cap then one more week to be in all the best stuff
btw love the eveonline avatar
To each their own, I've found TOR's story to be quite amazing. Each planet has a unique feel with a unique set of problems that all lead back to the greater galactic issue of the war. STO's story seemed to lose focus with each new sector and planet, it didn't really point back to anything. At least that is what I saw.
TOR runs better for me than STO so I can't comment on any issues and as for price, new and popular games tend to be more expensive than games that are old or aren't very popular / successful. Not to mention the whole F2P thing.
Yes, but you payed 60$ for the game's story, since that's the only thing the "defenders" of the game bring up in an argument. Once that story is over, what makes you continue paying 15$/month?
Let's not forget that if it was a single player game, you could pay once, hop in and finish the story missions all over again. In TOR's case, if you return after 4 months and decide you want to replay a character, you need to give another 15$.
So pretty much you're paying for a game which should have been single player, but the masterminds at EA though that if they add a chat function they can squeeze more money.
I would have had no problems what so ever with TOR, if it was released just as KOTOR 3, but the monthly fee is not justifiable at all, because the multiplayer part is not innovative in any way, shape or form.
Main crippling weakness of STO as far as i am concerned?
It punishes group play.
I cannot join my friends who have come back to take a look at the game without inflating the difficulty of the mobs to a point where they feel useless (spawns get bigger, all is scaled to VA levels).
TOR never punishes me or my mates for grouping.
That is, chiefly, what makes TOR superior. I can group with low levels without ruining the game for them.
Low levels still have things to contribute (crowd control for example, or trash mob cleaning) when joining others that do higher level content.
And TOR is, even with its slight imbalances and several bugs right out of the "wtf why did nobody catch that?!" category still a much better crafted game.
You haven't been using the leveling feature to bump yourself down or them up that's been in place since season 1 or 2 have you?
star trek online is more a solo player game then Tor is and as i said before star trek online sell's for 10$ for a reason Tor has raids and there more then 5 player group's they go from 8 player to 16 players only time you see that many in sto is on ESD or when pvp was alive in star trek online and Tor has 4 player mission's which is the equivalent of what the special task force uest to be guess what there is more then 4 of them and they start out at lvl 10 i think going all they way to 50 and guess what thats just the easy mode there a hard mode for when you hit lvl 50 which is the equivalent of VA in sto
and as i recall star trek online was 60$ when it came out 80$ for the CE now you can get both for 10 and 14$
Opionion in red.
Hmm, you talk like STO wasn't a sub game and everything you say can be said about STO and even more so. I notice TOR doesn't offer lifetime subs. Wanna know why? Because only companies that don't have confidence in their product want you to pay way in advance so they got your money regardless. And yes, I know TOR offers a 6 month package, but that's not the same as saying pay £100s in front.
The problem is people didn't come back after the first months or STO and now we are at the doors of F2P. Not many games have gone F2P because they were making money before (LoTR springs to mind as a game that was doing well but knew it could do better F2P) and I think we can safely say the STO had to go F2P to survive (no cups and from the looks of it no content was being made).
One thing that's been labled about STO is that it too is a single player game even more so than TOR (tons of heroic quests that you need to group up for in TOR plus Warzones etc).
What's going to keep people coming back for more in TOR? Content... The main thing missing from STO.
Also the altaholics out there, myself included have plenty of other toons to try out. How many on STO?
Look, it's horses for courses. There are things in STO I like but not as much as TOR. I am only going to play STO because it's free.
I can no longer hate on STO as I mentioned, I am not paying for it but some of the garbage people are saying about TOR either means they haven't played it or it didn't come up to their own expectations. A bit like another game I could mention.
No one had a gun at people's heads to make them buy a life sub. That's one aspect. Another aspect is that, if you think about it, it's been 2 years since release.
A 15$ per month means that after 1 year and 5 months, all life subs got their money worth (in subscription time).
Now that we got that out of the way... :
How much content do you think you will get to be worth the 15$ a month in TOR? I'll tell you, not much.
Because every month you'll be paying 1/4 of the initial game price, while receiving content like 2-3 missions (voice acting will make things longer to complete - and more money).
I will give you some "inside" news. Take them with a grain a salt if you wish.
I have a buddy who is currently working as a tester for EA. He and his team were some of the first to play TOR, so he started to like it.
Last week, we had a conversation about TOR, STO and EVE and among other things he told me that they've received a very very early alpha build for a TOR expansion, which will not be free. Apparently they will use Blizzard's method of releasing expansions.
That is the content you will receive, at best, not worth the 15$ per month, but as a separate 30-40$ purchase. Their testing deadline is a little unclear, but he told me that it will end sometime this Autumn.
PS - off-topic: When I asked him how the hell does a developer start working on an expansion right after a game's release (which means less resources and time allocated for the live content), he told me that it is something normal these days for most big-name devs (he worked for Ubi and Activision before as a testing manager/coordinator).
To my knowledge, Cryptic did add the featured episodes and everything else for free. Sure, it took them a while, but we got them eventually.
If you put both games side by side, you will see two things:
1.STO/Cryptic had way less money than EAware. It means less money for the development, less money for buying the so-called "reviewers" who gave TOR a 9/10 even if it was out for like 4 days, and less money for advertising, meaning less players and less motivation to go on. Regardless of all those problems, STO is alive and kicking, possibly looking at a rebirth once f2p hits.
2.TOR had all the time in the world to take a look at the competition and try to really come out with something unique and interesting.
I see the excuse "the game is released recently, so be patient, because they will eventually add more content."
My reaction to that is "what the hell did they wait for in the 5 years the game was in dev?" Couldn't they just take a look at the competition and come up with a new game, rather than using the same old tired themepark recipe?
I'm sorry but I can't help to notice that this was Bioware's (excellent) idea for KOTOR3, until EA came and told them "you're gonna make a mmo out of it".
All lifetime subs got their monies worth "IF" they were playing the game for a year and a half. I am sure if you asked, a lot of those lifetime subbers would have loved to have not played when they were not playing like those who subbed monthly and left and came back as and when they wanted too. So no, I don't buy into the thought that if you got a lifetime sub you got your monies worth. But hey, I don't know and neither do you.
And as to the rest of your post, I gave up reading. Want to know why. You don't like TOR. I get it. But right now, millions are and are having fun. If I get bored in a month, I will play something else, but so far I don't see that happening. STO left me feeling hollow after I reached max level in 3 weeks of casual play. TOR so far I haven't even scratched the surface so as far as I am concerned, it has already passed my expectations. I loved U/O, I loved E/Q and I loved WoW. To me TOR is just the next MMo that is going to suck up my time. To bad STO couldn't and never will.
STO is the game I will play as a single player 30 mins pew pew. That's it. TOR is my main.
Enjoy your STO, I will for the basic game it is.
Cheers.
You don't care what I just wrote, but you bother replying. That's...interesting.
Millions of people are addicted to drugs and are having "fun" too. Let's all get on the bandwagon!
I am also one of the (2) millions who bought the game so far, and I've quit it after going through the (well done) single player storyline experience. So did/will others. So stating that there are still millions of people playing TOR is an overstatement.
Was it worth the 60$? Yes, it was, but I can't say the same about paying a quarter of that monthly just to experience the "heroic" dungeon content, which I can find in any free Asian mmo out there.
I got a Collector's Edition of TOR, to me, was it worth it. Hell yes. The bonus of a security key was a good aspect as well.
Story. I actually listen to all the quests and don't skip at all. Why? I want to honor all the work Bioware put into TOR and to get my money's worth. I'm nearly level 39, but in general, the stories for my one class alone will be enough entertainment for months, let alone alts I'll make in te near future.
Whne I see negative posts on TOR, it's mainly about PvP, space, or the opinion that it is WoW with lasers. My response is alway that if one willing to try to truey look into something instead of forming a fast bias and sticking with a negative view...why play? I mean that form a customer stance. Why would you use X product if it truely brought you nothing but anger?
It's only the first half month of TOR, and with the first real update coming this month nad more realistic promises of new content for TOR, I can see fixes alongside the new content that'll improve the overall opinion.
So I think, yes, the voice acting and the story writing makes a big impact on whether this is "WoW in Space" or its own thing that uniquely appeals to me.
I played WoW from the start and only left it after I completed Cata as I got bored. But 5 years plus of playing was well worth it. This is and isn't WoW in space and the only reason people say this is because WoW took alot of elements from other MMo's and made the game fun, easier and casual friendly and that's what TOR is aiming for. EQ and U/O and DAOC were never casual and were not easy but they certainly were fun (hard core MMoer here).
Having said that, since BC I have never read any quest text (unless I got stuck on the quest and had to read it). With TOR, every quest I do I listen to the VO and like you, I too get emotionally engaged. Even the standard kill 5 rats doesn't seem as boring because I know why I have to kill 5 rats and it generally has a reason on the chain quest or overall class quest.
I think after playing TOR though, it would be hard to go back to WoW or even try it new, as V/O and story is a pretty big thing now. Well for me it is.:)
In essence, games like Mass Effect and now TOR has paved the way for BIG Budget MMO"s - They have taken a milestone for the genre, in regards to game interaction & participation, while at the same time remaining true to the MMO spirit.
Expect other games to follow suit - I won't be surprise if Blizzard develops a large voice interactive MMO like TOR., but with a smaller budget. All Blizzard needs to do is hire good talented actors that aren't necessarily well known, which wasn't the case with TOR.
Wouldn't surprise me in the least if "Titan" Blizz secret MMo, is once again taking the best bit's from other MMos and doing their thing with it. Fully V/O with Story.
They are one of the only other companies that can afford to do it.
Wouldn't surprise me in the least if "Titan" Blizz secret MMo, is once again taking the best bit's from other MMos and doing their thing with it. Fully V/O with Story.
They are one of the only other companies that can afford to do it.
I'm not surprised that TOR is the more polished game... If STO had TOR's budget, I'm sure it would have been much better.
Though obviously not as big an IP, I think if Blizzard made a Starcraft MMO it would definitely be a competitor to the sci-fi MMO market. And Blizzard has lots of cash to make sure its polished before release.
<ducks>
I like the crafting more--and the stories on the Imperial side are quite fun (especially the Imperial Agent).
I don't experience a grind at all in this game--there is always enough story content. I've never needed to grind mobs or dailies to level.
I would jump for a Starcraft MMO, just as long as it was 3 factioned and launched with a a teritory control system.
... I want a Resident Evil Online too...
... and a GTA online...
... dang I want alot....
I highly doubt the Zerg would be a real faction. If we ever see a Starcraft MMO I anticipate the Terrans and Protoss being the 2 main factions with the Zerg being a common enemy and possibly a monster play faction.
http://www.transformersuniverse.com/landingpage/2012-you-decide
TOR itself is a weak MMO, with a great storyline. But a storyline is not a good driver for an MMO - when the storyline ends, you've got a rather big problem (after running flashpoints twice, the spacebar starts to appeal - but if I press it, the only 'hook' of STO is lost...). I don't think TOR will be a huge failure, and I don't think it'll be a huge success. It looks set to be a bit of a weird pseudo-mmo, and I'm not sure there's any way to change that.
One thing TOR gets both right & wrong (which is interesting for STO) is the 'ship interiors'. You often see your ship interior in TOR, something that doesn't happen in STO. On the other hand it takes 4 loading screens per planet change to support this, and it's basically a time sink - which isn't a good state of affairs. This is an area STO could/should improve, although TOR shows the pitfalls of it's specific approach.
Another aspect worthy of note is that TOR crafting is done by companions - in STO terms perhaps the equivalent of moving crafting to the duty roster...
Rift? Really??? ok, first time I've heard someone say its "the best"