Definitely feasible. The Constitution class ship can hang with the Excelsior class ship. Which in this game is superior to the Sovereign.
LOL yea pretty bad when a ship designed back in 2285 can do more damage then a ship designed and built in 2370. I don't hear too many people complaining about the Excelsior Class ship being in game. :rolleyes:
I myself would love to see a high tier Constituion refit, that is the ship I grew up watching. That one Captain Logan is working on looks pretty cool from the pics so far.
2.5 is a good step forward to letting me be Kirk all the time.
We still need the tier 5 though. How can you give us a wicked new look and not let us use it endgame?
Because the tiers are broken, make no sense at all, and Cryptic is smarter than all of us, in understanding that we'll pay for it, even though it's not what we'd like to have?
Consider this:
Right now, it takes a mere couple of days to go from Lieutenant Commander to Commander. Like a week if you play casually. Then you move on to a "better" ship.
Now also consider that Cryptic has stated they will be increasing the rate of leveling in the lower levels. So you'll likely get out of this ship even FASTER.
What is the point?
Spend so much time making such an awesome looking ship, only to have it set aside in 4-7 days. What a waste. A complete and total waste.
Much as I like it, I don't think I can compel myself to buy this new Tier 2.x cruiser, because I know just how little use I'll get out of it, and the console doesn't really appeal to me.
Now, if they released this as a ship that would level up with you? I'd EASILY drop $25.00 on that. No joke.
Because the tiers are broken, make no sense at all, and Cryptic is smarter than all of us, in understanding that we'll pay for it, even though it's not what we'd like to have?
Consider this:
Right now, it takes a mere couple of days to go from Lieutenant Commander to Commander. Like a week if you play casually. Then you move on to a "better" ship.
Now also consider that Cryptic has stated they will be increasing the rate of leveling in the lower levels. So you'll likely get out of this ship even FASTER.
What is the point?
Spend so much time making such an awesome looking ship, only to have it set aside in 4-7 days. What a waste. A complete and total waste.
Much as I like it, I don't think I can compel myself to buy this new Tier 2.x cruiser, because I know just how little use I'll get out of it, and the console doesn't really appeal to me.
Now, if they released this as a ship that would level up with you? I'd EASILY drop $25.00 on that. No joke.
Consider this, as it currently stands, if you decide to remain in a lower tier ship, you don't have to spend the dilithium awarded on rank up missions on ships so can instead put it to other uses.
CBS will not allow a higher tiered Constitution, thats a final decision and any complaining or getting hopes up won't change anything. I for one am also a bit wiered out by the Tier system however this is not the topic discussion.
Yes, everyone wants a T5 Connie (which isnt ever going to happen) so you go for a T4.5. Thats just a hopes us work-around "read inbetween the lines" thinking right there. Tier 2 (or 2.5) ships are the max Connies will go and I believe that is also final.
But consider, in the show, did you have a century old Constitution fighting with the likes of Akira's, Defiant's and Galaxy's? Nope. Did you have a century old Excelsior fighting with the likes of Akira's, Defiant's and Galaxy's? Yes. What tier it is in is up for another topic but as it stands, this is much more canon than everyone wants.
And people will point out we already have designs at T5 that are over 100 years old...
The BOP and Excel were still in use during TNG, DS9, VOY. The connie wasn't. It was decommissioned, and should not even be in the game to begin with. Be happy that you have it for what it is, Connie endgame is not canon. BOP/Excel end game work thanks to the shows.
CBS will not allow a higher tiered Constitution, thats a final decision and any complaining or getting hopes up won't change anything. I for one am also a bit wiered out by the Tier system however this is not the topic discussion.
I can agree with your point when it comes to the default TOS-era Connie. I can also agree with your point when it comes to the default TMP-era Connie Refit.
However, I disagree when it comes to the:
Tier 2.5 "Venture" style Connie Refit Refit
Excalibur Class
Vesper Class
The Excalibur and the Vesper are 25th Century vessels. If the Klingons can take an aged BOP and upgrade it (Tier 5 BOP) then I am quite certain the Fed Engineers should be smart enough to be able to take ships built in the 25th Century and beef them up to equal standards.
Cryptic actually has an out here, if they are ambitious enough to take it. They could take the Tier 2 Connie Refit, and combine it with the TOS Connie, and make that a singular, unique ship. Then, take the 3 "new" vessels, whose only commonality with the Connie is siloutte, and give it not only Tier 2 treatment, but also a Tier 5 treatment, which would make it a good counterpart to the Tier 5 BOP.
The BOP and Excel were still in use during TNG, DS9, VOY. The connie wasn't. It was decommissioned, and should not even be in the game to begin with. Be happy that you have it for what it is, Connie endgame is not canon. BOP/Excel end game work thanks to the shows.
Oh hey mr.Canon man. where in Star Trek was remen shields,borg parts, Phaser Miniguns and whatnot. ITS A GAME. NOT CANON THIS OR THAT.
where in Star Trek was remen shields, borg parts, Phaser Miniguns and whatnot. ITS A GAME. NOT CANON THIS OR THAT
QFT. Nothing on the shows actually happened. Its all make-believe with plastic models, and later with CGI models. Get over it and let people play the game in the manner in which they want to play it.
Especially if they will spend extra $ to do it. (which is, incidentally, exactly why at some point there will be a higher tiered connie refit. Might not be soon, but it'll eventually happen.)
I can agree with your point when it comes to the default TOS-era Connie. I can also agree with your point when it comes to the default TMP-era Connie Refit.
However, I disagree when it comes to the:
Tier 2.5 "Venture" style Connie Refit Refit
Excalibur Class
Vesper Class
The Excalibur and the Vesper are 25th Century vessels. If the Klingons can take an aged BOP and upgrade it (Tier 5 BOP) then I am quite certain the Fed Engineers should be smart enough to be able to take ships built in the 25th Century and beef them up to equal standards.
Cryptic actually has an out here, if they are ambitious enough to take it. They could take the Tier 2 Connie Refit, and combine it with the TOS Connie, and make that a singular, unique ship. Then, take the 3 "new" vessels, whose only commonality with the Connie is siloutte, and give it not only Tier 2 treatment, but also a Tier 5 treatment, which would make it a good counterpart to the Tier 5 BOP.
True, very true, however Starfleet has devoted resources to building bigger and better ships. Most of the ships at the FC battle were new constructions (yes ok they were made to fight the Borg) because the old ones were aging and out of date. Just look at the Nova, it was built to replace the Oberth (Lucky Shot Sir!). The Excelsior is an exception since it has proven to be a long lasting worthy ship with very few signs showing it is aging.
The Klingon Empire have the same thinking as behind the Excelsior, the B'rel proved itself massively well and they continued to upgrade it (plus the fact it is a unique ship to the KDF and it gives them an advantage in the case of swift raids). Battlecruisers were also developed (like the Vor'cha and Negh'var) to replace the likes of the D7 and co.
The thing in STO is that the BOP Retrofit is an answer to having the KDF get a T5 refit (like the Galaxy and Intrepid Refits). There is no equivelent to ANY BOP's in STO, it is a unique KDF ship. Making the T5 Connie as a way to fight the B'rel Retro is not a valid point, since it does not equal the T2 or even T1 version already. The console for the Tier 2.5 Connie has the ability to be placed on ANY Cruiser, including the Dreadnought. So, get the console by buying the ship and transfer it to your Galaxy-X, Star Cruiser, Assault Cruiser or Excelsior and THEN you will have an anti-cloak weapon. You do not need a T5 Connie to counter the Klinks and it is not as powerful as a Sovy in canon.
*facepalm* if the game doesn't at least have a basis in established canon, and extrapolates on it with the use of common sense, then the game should have its star trek license striped from it.
all this hooky TRIBBLE like reman shields, tier 5 excelsior, conies, miranda, tos phasers and vulcan ships even being in the game at all detract from a 2409 star trek experience, instead its become this bazaar star trek disneyland that cant be made sense of, and is growing less and less fun as the craziness continues.
this absurd 'canon is stupid' attitude does not make you look smart or cool. why are you playing a star trek game if you don't want it to be star trek like? out of all the things they could possibly do to move the game farther in the wrong direction, making a high tier connie is the number 1 worst.
ITS JUST A GAME is not an argument. they could easily make the game feel more 'canon' with this game engine. if they had from the start then all those rabid star trek fans that left the game in disgust early on would still be here. now almost all that's left is the 'general audience', that wants star trek disneyland, and that's only going to get worse with free to play.
Technically the Excelsior class was the replacement for the Constitution class, then it was replaced with the Ambassador class then the Galaxy. The Star Cruiser (Avenger) is supposed to be the replacement for the Galaxy. And you want a connie that's as powerful as a T5 ship? They could make a 2.5 refit of it.
all this hooky TRIBBLE like reman shields, tier 5 excelsior, conies, miranda, tos phasers and vulcan ships even being in the game at all .....
Are what pays the bills.
Judging by all of the original Connies and NX classes I see flitting around ESD (not to mention the Excelsiors at endgame) I think it safe to say those seem to sell very well.
Bummer about your 2409 trek experience immersion suffering, but its an IP that covers what..300 years of fake history? Fans are going to have their favorite historical periods and Cryptic would be incredibly dumb not to give players what they want and make a buck while doing it.
As has been said many times before - in a video game, fun > canon every time.
The thing in STO is that the BOP Retrofit is an answer to having the KDF get a T5 refit (like the Galaxy and Intrepid Refits). There is no equivelent to ANY BOP's in STO, it is a unique KDF ship. Making the T5 Connie as a way to fight the B'rel Retro is not a valid point, since it does not equal the T2 or even T1 version already. The console for the Tier 2.5 Connie has the ability to be placed on ANY Cruiser, including the Dreadnought. So, get the console by buying the ship and transfer it to your Galaxy-X, Star Cruiser, Assault Cruiser or Excelsior and THEN you will have an anti-cloak weapon. You do not need a T5 Connie to counter the Klinks and it is not as powerful as a Sovy in canon.
I think you might have missed the point.
The point is big, fat, battleships suck and look more "Battlestar Galactica" than Star Trek.
The Connie has a unique siloutte, which is not found anywhere beyond Tier 2.
The suggestion is, take the New-Age Excalibur and Vesper, and give it a retrofit, so people could have a honest "Trek" looking ship at Tier 5, instead of all the super star destoryers we have now.
Why must everything at Tier 5 be gigantic?
Sure, the escorts aren't, but they don't look "Trek" either!
True, very true, however Starfleet has devoted resources to building bigger and better ships. Most of the ships at the FC battle were new constructions (yes ok they were made to fight the Borg) because the old ones were aging and out of date. Just look at the Nova, it was built to replace the Oberth (Lucky Shot Sir!). The Excelsior is an exception since it has proven to be a long lasting worthy ship with very few signs showing it is aging.
The Klingon Empire have the same thinking as behind the Excelsior, the B'rel proved itself massively well and they continued to upgrade it (plus the fact it is a unique ship to the KDF and it gives them an advantage in the case of swift raids). Battlecruisers were also developed (like the Vor'cha and Negh'var) to replace the likes of the D7 and co.
The thing in STO is that the BOP Retrofit is an answer to having the KDF get a T5 refit (like the Galaxy and Intrepid Refits). There is no equivelent to ANY BOP's in STO, it is a unique KDF ship. Making the T5 Connie as a way to fight the B'rel Retro is not a valid point, since it does not equal the T2 or even T1 version already. The console for the Tier 2.5 Connie has the ability to be placed on ANY Cruiser, including the Dreadnought. So, get the console by buying the ship and transfer it to your Galaxy-X, Star Cruiser, Assault Cruiser or Excelsior and THEN you will have an anti-cloak weapon. You do not need a T5 Connie to counter the Klinks and it is not as powerful as a Sovy in canon.
I worked in special FX briefly in the early nineties. You know that fuzzy time when traditional models were phased out and CGI was getting phased in. The reason the Excelsior and KDF ships continue on into canon so long has nothing to do with superior Starfleet or KDF design and everything to do with real world budget constraints.
Old school styrene models cost A LOT. So if there is no budget to make a ship to fill a gap you recycle an old model. Now with CGI there is an upfront cost for a new digital model but you can blow that up indefinitely, and they are much more plastic when it comes to making stylistic changes to them. Canon only covers for the limits of budget and the sensibilities of the audience...
The Connie was retired the same way that a star athlete's number is retired. Simplest terms the audience got tired of seeing the grand old lady blown up at the end of every movie.
*facepalm* if the game doesn't at least have a basis in established canon, and extrapolates on it with the use of common sense, then the game should have its star trek license striped from it.
all this hooky TRIBBLE like reman shields, tier 5 excelsior, conies, miranda, tos phasers and vulcan ships even being in the game at all detract from a 2409 star trek experience, instead its become this bazaar star trek disneyland that cant be made sense of, and is growing less and less fun as the craziness continues.
this absurd 'canon is stupid' attitude does not make you look smart or cool. why are you playing a star trek game if you don't want it to be star trek like? out of all the things they could possibly do to move the game farther in the wrong direction, making a high tier connie is the number 1 worst.
ITS JUST A GAME is not an argument. they could easily make the game feel more 'canon' with this game engine. if they had from the start then all those rabid star trek fans that left the game in disgust early on would still be here. now almost all that's left is the 'general audience', that wants star trek disneyland, and that's only going to get worse with free to play.
This is nothing personal Dontdrunk. I usually agree with you on the PvP forums but, Starfleet officers running around in comic book style body armor all the time with giant wonky kits that in some cases look like alien growths about to swallow those characters, (NPC and player alike), whole are canon? Can't think of a time I ever saw Starfleet dressed like that on a TV or gaming screen prior to STO.
This is nothing personal Dontdrunk. I usually agree with you on the PvP forums but, Starfleet officers running around in comic book style body armor all the time with giant wonky kits that in some cases look like alien growths about to swallow those characters, (NPC and player alike), whole are canon? Can't think of a time I ever saw Starfleet dressed like that on a TV or gaming screen prior to STO.
OK you can call me a TOSser now.
oh i hardly endorse that ether. it wasn't in the list of stupid TRIBBLE because there is simply to much stupid TRIBBLE to list!
if i were in charge of ground, 1 unshielded hit would ether stun you, incapacitate you, or kill you just like it did in the show. BUT, weapon accuracy on everything would be terrible, most shots would miss, also like the show during big shootouts. the pace wouldn't even change, but it would be a more canon accurate portrayal of a star trek gun fight. these are thing they could do to give a nod to canon, but they don't, they instead make the game even more into a wacky amusement park.
oh i hardly endorse that ether. it wasn't in the list of stupid TRIBBLE because there is simply to much stupid TRIBBLE to list!
if i were in charge of ground, 1 unshielded hit would ether stun you, incapacitate you, or kill you just like it did in the show. BUT, weapon accuracy on everything would be terrible, most shots would miss, also like the show during big shootouts. the pace wouldn't even change, but it would be a more canon accurate portrayal of a star trek gun fight. these are thing they could do to give a nod to canon, but they don't, they instead make the game even more into a wacky amusement park.
well i'm glad some one thinks so! stuff like this would be nothing more then stat changes in the current system, a tedious task but more then doable with even a small number of devs. there's like 100 other similar changes they could make to space combat too, but that's not what this thread is about, and even though i think the topic its a bad idea its not my place to derail it with my tangents.
Comments
LOL yea pretty bad when a ship designed back in 2285 can do more damage then a ship designed and built in 2370. I don't hear too many people complaining about the Excelsior Class ship being in game. :rolleyes:
I myself would love to see a high tier Constituion refit, that is the ship I grew up watching. That one Captain Logan is working on looks pretty cool from the pics so far.
Because the tiers are broken, make no sense at all, and Cryptic is smarter than all of us, in understanding that we'll pay for it, even though it's not what we'd like to have?
Consider this:
Right now, it takes a mere couple of days to go from Lieutenant Commander to Commander. Like a week if you play casually. Then you move on to a "better" ship.
Now also consider that Cryptic has stated they will be increasing the rate of leveling in the lower levels. So you'll likely get out of this ship even FASTER.
What is the point?
Spend so much time making such an awesome looking ship, only to have it set aside in 4-7 days. What a waste. A complete and total waste.
Much as I like it, I don't think I can compel myself to buy this new Tier 2.x cruiser, because I know just how little use I'll get out of it, and the console doesn't really appeal to me.
Now, if they released this as a ship that would level up with you? I'd EASILY drop $25.00 on that. No joke.
Yes, everyone wants a T5 Connie (which isnt ever going to happen) so you go for a T4.5. Thats just a hopes us work-around "read inbetween the lines" thinking right there. Tier 2 (or 2.5) ships are the max Connies will go and I believe that is also final.
But consider, in the show, did you have a century old Constitution fighting with the likes of Akira's, Defiant's and Galaxy's? Nope. Did you have a century old Excelsior fighting with the likes of Akira's, Defiant's and Galaxy's? Yes. What tier it is in is up for another topic but as it stands, this is much more canon than everyone wants.
The BOP and Excel were still in use during TNG, DS9, VOY. The connie wasn't. It was decommissioned, and should not even be in the game to begin with. Be happy that you have it for what it is, Connie endgame is not canon. BOP/Excel end game work thanks to the shows.
I can agree with your point when it comes to the default TOS-era Connie. I can also agree with your point when it comes to the default TMP-era Connie Refit.
However, I disagree when it comes to the:
Tier 2.5 "Venture" style Connie Refit Refit
Excalibur Class
Vesper Class
The Excalibur and the Vesper are 25th Century vessels. If the Klingons can take an aged BOP and upgrade it (Tier 5 BOP) then I am quite certain the Fed Engineers should be smart enough to be able to take ships built in the 25th Century and beef them up to equal standards.
Cryptic actually has an out here, if they are ambitious enough to take it. They could take the Tier 2 Connie Refit, and combine it with the TOS Connie, and make that a singular, unique ship. Then, take the 3 "new" vessels, whose only commonality with the Connie is siloutte, and give it not only Tier 2 treatment, but also a Tier 5 treatment, which would make it a good counterpart to the Tier 5 BOP.
Oh hey mr.Canon man. where in Star Trek was remen shields,borg parts, Phaser Miniguns and whatnot. ITS A GAME. NOT CANON THIS OR THAT.
Would be a great cover band name....
QFT. Nothing on the shows actually happened. Its all make-believe with plastic models, and later with CGI models. Get over it and let people play the game in the manner in which they want to play it.
Especially if they will spend extra $ to do it. (which is, incidentally, exactly why at some point there will be a higher tiered connie refit. Might not be soon, but it'll eventually happen.)
Besides Canon is a lie anyway.
I believe you're thinking of cake.
True, very true, however Starfleet has devoted resources to building bigger and better ships. Most of the ships at the FC battle were new constructions (yes ok they were made to fight the Borg) because the old ones were aging and out of date. Just look at the Nova, it was built to replace the Oberth (Lucky Shot Sir!). The Excelsior is an exception since it has proven to be a long lasting worthy ship with very few signs showing it is aging.
The Klingon Empire have the same thinking as behind the Excelsior, the B'rel proved itself massively well and they continued to upgrade it (plus the fact it is a unique ship to the KDF and it gives them an advantage in the case of swift raids). Battlecruisers were also developed (like the Vor'cha and Negh'var) to replace the likes of the D7 and co.
The thing in STO is that the BOP Retrofit is an answer to having the KDF get a T5 refit (like the Galaxy and Intrepid Refits). There is no equivelent to ANY BOP's in STO, it is a unique KDF ship. Making the T5 Connie as a way to fight the B'rel Retro is not a valid point, since it does not equal the T2 or even T1 version already. The console for the Tier 2.5 Connie has the ability to be placed on ANY Cruiser, including the Dreadnought. So, get the console by buying the ship and transfer it to your Galaxy-X, Star Cruiser, Assault Cruiser or Excelsior and THEN you will have an anti-cloak weapon. You do not need a T5 Connie to counter the Klinks and it is not as powerful as a Sovy in canon.
all this hooky TRIBBLE like reman shields, tier 5 excelsior, conies, miranda, tos phasers and vulcan ships even being in the game at all detract from a 2409 star trek experience, instead its become this bazaar star trek disneyland that cant be made sense of, and is growing less and less fun as the craziness continues.
this absurd 'canon is stupid' attitude does not make you look smart or cool. why are you playing a star trek game if you don't want it to be star trek like? out of all the things they could possibly do to move the game farther in the wrong direction, making a high tier connie is the number 1 worst.
ITS JUST A GAME is not an argument. they could easily make the game feel more 'canon' with this game engine. if they had from the start then all those rabid star trek fans that left the game in disgust early on would still be here. now almost all that's left is the 'general audience', that wants star trek disneyland, and that's only going to get worse with free to play.
Are what pays the bills.
Judging by all of the original Connies and NX classes I see flitting around ESD (not to mention the Excelsiors at endgame) I think it safe to say those seem to sell very well.
Bummer about your 2409 trek experience immersion suffering, but its an IP that covers what..300 years of fake history? Fans are going to have their favorite historical periods and Cryptic would be incredibly dumb not to give players what they want and make a buck while doing it.
As has been said many times before - in a video game, fun > canon every time.
I think you might have missed the point.
The point is big, fat, battleships suck and look more "Battlestar Galactica" than Star Trek.
The Connie has a unique siloutte, which is not found anywhere beyond Tier 2.
The suggestion is, take the New-Age Excalibur and Vesper, and give it a retrofit, so people could have a honest "Trek" looking ship at Tier 5, instead of all the super star destoryers we have now.
Why must everything at Tier 5 be gigantic?
Sure, the escorts aren't, but they don't look "Trek" either!
I worked in special FX briefly in the early nineties. You know that fuzzy time when traditional models were phased out and CGI was getting phased in. The reason the Excelsior and KDF ships continue on into canon so long has nothing to do with superior Starfleet or KDF design and everything to do with real world budget constraints.
Old school styrene models cost A LOT. So if there is no budget to make a ship to fill a gap you recycle an old model. Now with CGI there is an upfront cost for a new digital model but you can blow that up indefinitely, and they are much more plastic when it comes to making stylistic changes to them. Canon only covers for the limits of budget and the sensibilities of the audience...
The Connie was retired the same way that a star athlete's number is retired. Simplest terms the audience got tired of seeing the grand old lady blown up at the end of every movie.
This is nothing personal Dontdrunk. I usually agree with you on the PvP forums but, Starfleet officers running around in comic book style body armor all the time with giant wonky kits that in some cases look like alien growths about to swallow those characters, (NPC and player alike), whole are canon? Can't think of a time I ever saw Starfleet dressed like that on a TV or gaming screen prior to STO.
OK you can call me a TOSser now.
oh i hardly endorse that ether. it wasn't in the list of stupid TRIBBLE because there is simply to much stupid TRIBBLE to list!
if i were in charge of ground, 1 unshielded hit would ether stun you, incapacitate you, or kill you just like it did in the show. BUT, weapon accuracy on everything would be terrible, most shots would miss, also like the show during big shootouts. the pace wouldn't even change, but it would be a more canon accurate portrayal of a star trek gun fight. these are thing they could do to give a nod to canon, but they don't, they instead make the game even more into a wacky amusement park.
^^^ This is why you are excellent.
well i'm glad some one thinks so! stuff like this would be nothing more then stat changes in the current system, a tedious task but more then doable with even a small number of devs. there's like 100 other similar changes they could make to space combat too, but that's not what this thread is about, and even though i think the topic its a bad idea its not my place to derail it with my tangents.