The only way they could save it is by adding just 1 new map, whether it's queued or Open PvP.
I do not agree.
A new map is only bandaid....more like a weak excuse to please us and keep us pacified as if we were little kids needing a sucker so we shut up....insulting!!!
there decision to plan things out and do the build code with season 4 and revamp ground fixes more issues with PvE players than it gives us anything as a PvP player. Having to wait for the so-called "PvP Revamp" in season 5 is too long to wait for December.
Having to fix/balance abilities and their counters or ability to remove is sorely needed. New mechanics for PvP, giving KDF more ships to compete with the abundance of Fed ships and "special Powers" is another area of neglect.
Fighting in the same Arena or CNH, no matter the map is getting dull. It is becoming more fun to play in Kerrat amid the Borg sometimes.
There are no new weapon types, ability to craft your own weapon stats, way to really do anything unique.....furthering the fact the Skill Path is needed for a revamp: distinguishing ground from space with points to fill both, somewhat, skilling in energy types with a purpose, skilling in a ship type or 2 with purpose.
There is so much to fix that would PLEASE the PvP players beyond a map that cryptic would prolly mess up when adding it.
1:
Any group entering a PvP que grouped, is a premade.. Otherwise there isnt *any* premades in regular PvP
What do I know about you? I allready said that:
1: I havent heard or seen your fleet prior to the latest change to FAW I've never met you either! I'm still waiting for my invite for a round or two of *pre-made* action. I'll bring my non-faw build if you like, I have many...
2: You use a lot of beam arrays If by *YOU*, you mean me, then LOL. Sure on one character, out of many, Black WIdow specifically!
3: You use a lot of FAW/GW/SS3 See answer above. Also there are counters to grav well and SS. Although SS is hard to remove, they should consider a resistance or a Sci Team that can accurately be targeted on yourself...Again, don't hate the player, in fact, don't waste time hating at all (2 of these skills have been discussed on these forums)
4: If seen more than a few from your fleet flying solo, all of them used FAW, none of them were particulary good (dont mean that they were "bad", but merely that they were very unremarkable)No offense taken. There is no ego here, I simply question your facts. You know nothing of the 528th Fleet. At all. You offer no facts. All I see are pitchforks and torches. I swear to you, we are not witches. I think.
2: My problem is that Ive seen a few posts from users with 528 mentioned in their sig use the terms "Lrn2Play", "Adapt" and "There are easy counters" What? Where? Who?
Now, if you were fighting teams using FAW without using it yourself, Id listen.. Coming from a fleet that I havent seen using anything other than FAW, it begins to sound very biased..Your basing your facts on limited information. You've said so yourself. You've never heard or seen us.. before.. correct?
3: This isnt the only topic Ive seen with posts by 528th members, I dont know you guys.. No names stick really out, so I cannot say which names they were. *But* Ive seen a fair few posts using the quoted terms above. Aside from Bluerock? Again, where are these posts
4: When you (and the other fleets abusing FAW) is directly responsible, I argue against it.. Dont get me wrong, Im not in any way emotically affected.. Like I said, Im a professional soldier, with 2 tours in the sandbox.. A game isnt going to ruffle my feathers. I just think its a shame to lose people (and potentially the PvP part of the game), because a few people cannot restrain themselves (all in the name of "fun") No one in STO who pays to play broke the power. Cryptic did. Also, when you say *YOU*, whom are you reffering to? Are you stereotyping the 528th community or just me?
5: You get me wrong, I do have fun.. There are still a few good people playing.. And regardless of its cheesy nature, its still fun to blow up FAW jockeys up.. But... If this keeps up for much longer, all the good PvPers might be gone soon, and I might not have fun anymore.
That's unfortunate, and I sympathize with you... However, every month, there is something systemically *wrong* with pvp. We played in a KT league. What's stopping the *hard-core* pvp'ers from entering that league OR, creating a new league? After all, you can sit here and point fingers, or create solutions, at least until the devs resolve the issue.. . Which is it?
Thats it really.. PvP have been neglected for a long time.. For every month without anything added, weve lost people.. Several people argued that FAW was broken before it was pushed live, everyone knows it is broken, so why make the matter worse.. All in all, I fear the PvP in this game will soon be so broken, it will likely never recover.. It might not come to pass, but it is a hit and miss chance at this point.. We took a huge blow when the ques were broken, and this might just end up as a deathblow..
As a semi-casual pvp-er, I think that PVP could be an awesome end-game dynamic for STO. Unfortunately, for one reason or another, Cryptic has not put any energy into PVP besides various balance sweeps. I am as frustrated as you are by the lack of attention to detail and the utter lack of pvp content up to now. We even lost that Space assault map. Remember that?
I believe (I may be wrong) that its a critical point, and everything you (FAWers, not you personally) do just make matters worse.. Thats why I argue strongly against using FAW in any way or form. You not you personally I'm confused... Anyway, I'm still waiting on that PVP invite damn it
Nothing personal Its just good business... We should pvp, I'd love to see that tetryon dual beam bank in action!
our fleet is young, and new to pvp but there are a couple ideas we have been throwing around to counter the FEDFAW ball of fury.
1. hello 5 defiant r's. cloak.. creep.. pick 1...unleash. run and hope he dies. cloak. regroup, repeat.
(everyone has good burst, polarize hull for getaway ect...)
2. super spam sci rage. 5 scis with 120+aux popping weapons batts like candy. 5 photo fleets, scorpion fighters, have 2 of them lay dispersal pattern beta on some select mines (chroniton was the choice for us i think) dampening field constantly on rotation..or stacked? yeah, and let em rip with all the tachbeams and cpb's you got.
3. play the damn FAW fest.
fight fire with fire....there can be a balance. but as long as people are gonna exploit 1 particular ability there can never really be true tactical combat. just throw your version of the pre-nerf'd flavor of the month out there....and keep going.
our fleet is young, and new to pvp but there are a couple ideas we have been throwing around to counter the FEDFAW ball of fury.
1. hello 5 defiant r's. cloak.. creep.. pick 1...unleash. run and hope he dies. cloak. regroup, repeat.
(everyone has good burst, polarize hull for getaway ect...)
2. super spam sci rage. 5 scis with 120+aux popping weapons batts like candy. 5 photo fleets, scorpion fighters, have 2 of them lay dispersal pattern beta on some select mines (chroniton was the choice for us i think) dampening field constantly on rotation..or stacked? yeah, and let em rip with all the tachbeams and cpb's you got.
3. play the damn FAW fest.
fight fire with fire....there can be a balance. but as long as people are gonna exploit 1 particular ability there can never really be true tactical combat. just throw your version of the pre-nerf'd flavor of the month out there....and keep going.
see you on the battlefield.
This is the inherent problem, when you have to use unbalanced setups using multiple copies of skills or combinations to beat one setup that is simple it is out of balance. The current form of BFaW has taken the variation out of the game, so instead of 2-3 optimal builds per ship type now there is one type per ship type.
that was my whole point. i love balanced combat. i hate to see the overuse of 1 ability. fleet battles should be won on the tactics of the squad commander, and the excecution of the pilots...with the gear he has equiped and a ship designed to play whatever role it is intended to play.
2. super spam sci rage. 5 scis with 120+aux popping weapons batts like candy. 5 photo fleets, scorpion fighters, have 2 of them lay dispersal pattern beta on some select mines (chroniton was the choice for us i think) dampening field constantly on rotation..or stacked? yeah, and let em rip with all the tachbeams and cpb's you got.
Forget spamming them to death, 5 Scis should be able to make short work for FAW builds. Just have 1 or 2 people rock CPB, add in a Tyken's or 2 and then whatever else you choose, and you're good to go. Especially if you rotate TSS 2 (or 3) on each other.
yah, it sounds good in your head or on a piece of paper :rolleyes:
Of course, putting it to use in a match where anything can happen sometimes, well.....
A new map is only bandaid....more like a weak excuse to please us and keep us pacified as if we were little kids needing a sucker so we shut up....insulting!!!
there decision to plan things out and do the build code with season 4 and revamp ground fixes more issues with PvE players than it gives us anything as a PvP player. Having to wait for the so-called "PvP Revamp" in season 5 is too long to wait for December.
Having to fix/balance abilities and their counters or ability to remove is sorely needed. New mechanics for PvP, giving KDF more ships to compete with the abundance of Fed ships and "special Powers" is another area of neglect.
Fighting in the same Arena or CNH, no matter the map is getting dull. It is becoming more fun to play in Kerrat amid the Borg sometimes.
There are no new weapon types, ability to craft your own weapon stats, way to really do anything unique.....furthering the fact the Skill Path is needed for a revamp: distinguishing ground from space with points to fill both, somewhat, skilling in energy types with a purpose, skilling in a ship type or 2 with purpose.
There is so much to fix that would PLEASE the PvP players beyond a map that cryptic would prolly mess up when adding it.
For the most part that is true, but something is better than nothing. Because I honestly don't think there is going to be any PvP love til next year, no joke. PvP is so low on their prority list that it barely registers with them, and the rage over FAW isn't getting them to budge like the NPC Spam issue.
For the most part that is true, but something is better than nothing. Because I honestly don't think there is going to be any PvP love til next year, no joke. PvP is so low on their prority list that it barely registers with them, and the rage over FAW isn't getting them to budge like the NPC Spam issue.
I don't think I posted anything but blunt, grim truth. Their Ask Cryptic, Engy Reports and State of the game all skirt the issues of PvP for more uniforms, hair do's and Belt Buckles.
It is very sad and troubling. It is even worse when i sit half the game watching Hulu for Anime or browsing the Rift forums and Bioware forums for the next game to get into, THAT CARES enough to do what it takes and be interactive with their players.
yah, it sounds good in your head or on a piece of paper :rolleyes:
Of course, putting it to use in a match where anything can happen sometimes, well.....
I'll just leave it at that for now
Yeah you have to join one of the fleets that is using these "counters" and probably spec out of your ship of choice. Yeah that is fun, like I want to be a tac flying a sci, or sci flying a sci
I've never met you either! I'm still waiting for my invite for a round or two of *pre-made* action. I'll bring my non-faw build if you like, I have many...
I meant you as in 528th.. Before FAW I never saw or heard of you. And sure, Im always up for PvP. I dont have a FAW build anymore (save a KDF Tac I respecced for doing CE)
If by *YOU*, you mean me, then LOL. Sure on one character, out of many, Black WIdow specifically!
No, I mean 528th, a lot of beam arrays
See answer above. Also there are counters to grav well and SS. Although SS is hard to remove, they should consider a resistance or a Sci Team that can accurately be targeted on yourself...Again, don't hate the player, in fact, don't waste time hating at all
STeam does not clear SS3 reliably, which is what Ive been hit with in .. FAW that makes 5 ships do damage like 10+.. Its cheesy tactics, and its the *only* thing Ive seen you (528th) use.
No offense taken. There is no ego here, I simply question your facts. You know nothing of the 528th Fleet. At all. You offer no facts. All I see are pitchforks and torches. I swear to you, we are not witches. I think.
The fact is: The only thing Ive seen from you guys, is the most cheesy, OPd setup around.. I can only make a judgement based on what I see, right?
What? Where? Who?
Some of the FAW posts, I distinctly remember 528th mentioned in sig, and the player(s? - Might just be one person tbh.. Didnt pay attention to names) were talking L2P, easy counters, adapt..
Your basing your facts on limited information. You've said so yourself. You've never heard or seen us.. before.. correct?
Limited in a way that I havent seen you guys doing anything else.. Granted, we're talking 6-7 matches.. 1 with a "premade" and the others individual players.. *All* used FAW, *All* SVs used SS3.. Dont blame me for making an opinion based on those experienced.
Aside from Bluerock? Again, where are these posts
FAW threads... Maybe here, maybe in Cruiser forum.. It was a few days ago, and I really didnt pay attention to names.
No one in STO who pays to play broke the power. Cryptic did. Also, when you say *YOU*, whom are you reffering to? Are you stereotyping the 528th community or just me?
Im referring to every single of your members Ive seen in PvP..
That's unfortunate, and I sympathize with you... However, every month, there is something systemically *wrong* with pvp. We played in a KT league. What's stopping the *hard-core* pvp'ers from entering that league OR, creating a new league? After all, you can sit here and point fingers, or create solutions, at least until the devs resolve the issue.. . Which is it?
The difference is.. There never were anything *this* wrong before (except maybe the CSV problem we had).. It was never *this* easy before.. I mean.. I took 1st place in damage against a premade with 8 common MK X arrays, and circling a fight.. VM was bad, CSV was bad, broken ques were bad.. This is worse.. Perhaps not because the broken power is worse off, but because there are very few regular PvP players.. I PvPd all day today.. Best PvP I had was in Kerrat, fighting Jakub, Tide, Goose and a couple more.. Killed some, died more.. But it was pretty much free of cheesy powers.
As a semi-casual pvp-er, I think that PVP could be an awesome end-game dynamic for STO. Unfortunately, for one reason or another, Cryptic has not put any energy into PVP besides various balance sweeps. I am as frustrated as you are by the lack of attention to detail and the utter lack of pvp content up to now. We even lost that Space assault map. Remember that?
Yes I remember, but we got a ground PvP (lol) map instead.. But thats *it*.. The worst part isnt that they didnt add any things for us.. The worst part is that they break more than they fix... And all the while, we see a 1000 threads asking for this uniform and that ship.. Oh, and 100 threads about a T5 Constitution..
You not you personally I'm confused... Anyway, I'm still waiting on that PVP invite damn it
You, as in you FAW users, make matters worse.. Imagine a guy standing on a ledge, 500m straight down.. FAWers are the person that kicks his leg away under him.. Thats what I fear, that this will be the last nail in the coffin.
Its just good business... We should pvp, I'd love to see that tetryon dual beam bank in action!
About to head to bed, add me and we'll see what we can see... Maybe arrange a fight, or get to know eachother better.. Ill be online again tomorrow.
Most annoying match ever, being hit with FAW, GW, Chronitons and SS all the time. Wouldn't have been much fun at all, except for the pleasure of pwning a cheesy FOTM setup!
We have to remember that things happen for a reason. When you say to nerf something one has to stop and think :rolleyes:, what led to the abuse of the thing in the first place? Well lets see, I remember when Klingon Sci Captains started using the Carriers and started to spam the area with 6 BoP and Photonic fleet, wow a total of 9 pets from one ship at the start of the battle, and heaven forbid you get the dam thing to 50% hull because here we go, Bam! fleet support, Oh no another ship what is one to do with one player calling in all these ships, oh let me think, I know, Fire at Will.
See things happen for a reason if you want to scale back an abuse of power then you need to scale back the other abuse that created it. Then we need to ask ourselves, how far back do we go. Do we scale back the carrier that Spam the area? The Fire at Will issue was created because someone else was abusing something else in PvP. No one likes to lose, and now when they queue for FvK they automatically think that the klinks are going to spam the area and come in with Fire at Will to even out the playing field. So you see the issue isnt with Fire at Will. It is what created it in the first place.
We have to remember that things happen for a reason. When you say to nerf something one has to stop and think :rolleyes:, what led to the abuse of the thing in the first place? Well lets see, I remember when Klingon Sci Captains started using the Carriers and started to spam the area with 6 BoP and Photonic fleet, wow a total of 9 pets from one ship at the start of the battle, and heaven forbid you get the dam thing to 50% hull because here we go, Bam! fleet support, Oh no another ship what is one to do with one player calling in all these ships, oh let me think, I know, Fire at Will.
See things happen for a reason if you want to scale back an abuse of power then you need to scale back the other abuse that created it. Then we need to ask ourselves, how far back do we go. Do we scale back the carrier that Spam the area? The Fire at Will issue was created because someone else was abusing something else in PvP. No one likes to lose, and now when they queue for FvK they automatically think that the klinks are going to spam the area and come in with Fire at Will to even out the playing field. So you see the issue isnt with Fire at Will. It is what created it in the first place.
Klingons had nothing to do with it. Mine spam is the reason.
Klingons had nothing to do with it. Mine spam is the reason.
Do you really think that people would go out of there way to put 8 beam arrays and retrain Boff with FaW and stack Fire at Will for mines, "I Don't Think So". The mine spam was used to counter the constant battle cloaking that was going on in PvP. The Fire at Will issue was due to pet spam. So do we nerf the battle cloak to get rid of the mine spaming. Where will it end or where should it end? Their is allways a reason for the abuse of a power in the game, all you have to do is think back to see why the abuse started.
Do you really think that people would go out of there way to put 8 beam arrays and retrain Boff with FaW and stack Fire at Will for mines, "I Don't Think So". The mine spam was used to counter the constant battle cloaking that was going on in PvP. The Fire at Will issue was due to pet spam. So do we nerf the battle cloak to get rid of the mine spaming. Were will it end or were should it end? Their is allways a reason for the abuse of a power in the game, all you have to do is think back to see why the abuse started.
People aren't rocking 8 Beam FAW cruisers for spam control - they're using it because it's horribly OP.
People aren't rocking 8 Beam FAW cruisers for spam control - they're using it because it's horribly OP.
Yes I do agree, but it started with the spaming in the game and then they noticed how much of an advantage it gave them and evolved from there. So it was because of the spaming in PvP that created this monster. And Klingons are the only toons that can spam a large amount of pets in a short amount of time.
No, PvP broke when Cryptic added the Scorpion Fighters to the game. FAW is just making a small crack a bigger one, and the April Ask Cryptic was the point where the land fell into the ocean. And when TOR comes out, the space queues would be empty like the ground queues.
The only way they could save it is by adding just 1 new map, weither it's queued or Open PvP.
This is one thing Azurian is right about . One day in the near future pvp will be cut in 1/2 or fully extinct.
STO has the best space combat, addicting even. This is what makes pvp so much, fun is the skill of sto and graphic. STO has one thing going for it " It is the best space combat MMo." TOR wont beat sto in space combat but will offer Grade A pvp at launch (ground). Cryptic its been over a year, all pvp lots hope and feel mistreated by STO and nothing is ever done. No, "were working on it" just a plain out truthfull reason would make me happy. I can say for my self and alot of other pvper we dont expect it to get better, now we just wait for a company to reconise its player base or move on. I dont see this getting better and we have already been ignored I just gave up testing , because are feedback is never listen to.
Ill test MMO's that listen to feedback, CHANGE FAW cryptic WE have thread after thread FIX it cant u do a normal damage calculator ro see whats wrong. Iam just fed up with it all and I have played 4 cryptic titles over a 8 years span. So the from a vetran consumer of cryptic product, your messing up big time with this game. ONE PVP Zone and balance powers pls, I could make a list. pls Outsource a better testing firm if thats who u all are listen to.
Carriers where a 1 month or so anomaly when cryptic decided to make a ship that had been in the gmae since beta usable. However Federation teams have been spamming mines at least as long. Mine spam was the issue... then the silly fighters on top of that.
Do you really think that people would go out of there way to put 8 beam arrays and retrain Boff with FaW and stack Fire at Will for mines, "I Don't Think So". The mine spam was used to counter the constant battle cloaking that was going on in PvP. The Fire at Will issue was due to pet spam. So do we nerf the battle cloak to get rid of the mine spaming. Where will it end or where should it end? Their is allways a reason for the abuse of a power in the game, all you have to do is think back to see why the abuse started.
I retrained one BOff for FAW just to deal with mines and pets. Mostly on the Klingon side, but also for some Feds. I don't stack it, though.
Do you really think that people would go out of there way to put 8 beam arrays and retrain Boff with FaW and stack Fire at Will for mines, "I Don't Think So". The mine spam was used to counter the constant battle cloaking that was going on in PvP. The Fire at Will issue was due to pet spam. So do we nerf the battle cloak to get rid of the mine spaming. Where will it end or where should it end? Their is allways a reason for the abuse of a power in the game, all you have to do is think back to see why the abuse started.
???
And the mine spam in FvF was what ??? countering defiants. lol I don't think you grasp the issue.
Mines were always the major issue. Premades spamming them to be exact. Carriers went crazy for a short period, when the pets were really hard to kill, but once this was fixed, people stopped using carriers almost completely.
The problem with Old-FAW, and the reason it did not work well enough as a minesweeper, was the number of shots fired. 2x the number of shots fired & 2x the powerdrain would have been a good way to go imo.
Spam doesn't require the new Beam Fire At Will. The old one did handle it quite well. Mines were always the thing you could abuse most to spam. You can drop a new mine every 6 to 10 seconds. A new batch of Fighters takes way longer to deploy. And mines just need a single hit to be destroyed. Mines got extra-popular even by PuGs with the ridicilously unbalanced Tractor Beam Mines. The TBMs have been nerfed, and you see less of them in action.
The change to BFAW was probably motivated by the idea that BFAW was only a spam clearing tool. It required very specific builds to make it into a potential single target damage buff power.
The new BFAW fixes the issue - by making the ability broken and overpowered. There is nothing wrong per se with a single target damage buff, but having a "full enemy team damage buff" that can more then double your damage output is obviously out of line.
Spam doesn't require the new Beam Fire At Will. The old one did handle it quite well. Mines were always the thing you could abuse most to spam. You can drop a new mine every 6 to 10 seconds. A new batch of Fighters takes way longer to deploy. And mines just need a single hit to be destroyed. Mines got extra-popular even by PuGs with the ridicilously unbalanced Tractor Beam Mines. The TBMs have been nerfed, and you see less of them in action.
The change to BFAW was probably motivated by the idea that BFAW was only a spam clearing tool. It required very specific builds to make it into a potential single target damage buff power.
The new BFAW fixes the issue - by making the ability broken and overpowered. There is nothing wrong per se with a single target damage buff, but having a "full enemy team damage buff" that can more then double your damage output is obviously out of line.
Yeh.. Woulda been better if the power had never been touched..
In other words.. Arguements from persons like TSI and QEW members that refrain from using these powers are worth a hell of a lot more to me, than opinions from people Ive only ever seen using cheesy tactics. To me those opinions are more worthless than a Fed newbie in his first T1 PvP match.
TSI is not above using this ability at all.
In fact over the last week or two, we have been running mixed TSI/Legends/D.O.B. pugmades, and it will usually get used somewhere within that pool of players. Every person I have spoken to within those fleets seem to agree that it is a joke. Where we cannot all agree, is how best it should be changed.
The general attitude on vent seems to be "if we don't show it up to be silly, nothing will change". Several well known players chat in zone after matches and ask that the aggrieved teams/individuals to "go make a post in the forums".
All power to La Familia if they choose not to run it, but we cannot expect every fleet to stop using it - they will not.
I wouldn't blame the 528th one iota for using it if they in fact do, for me, it's all part of the big picture - send the (usually silent) outraged PvP'ers here to the forums please, lets get their opinions on record too, and get an adjustment to the FAW issue asap.
In fact over the last week or two, we have been running mixed TSI/Legends/D.O.B. pugmades, and it will usually get used somewhere within that pool of players. Every person I have spoken to within those fleets seem to agree that it is a joke. Where we cannot all agree, is how best it should be changed.
The general attitude on vent seems to be "if we don't show it up to be silly, nothing will change". Several well known players chat in zone after matches and ask that the aggrieved teams/individuals to "go make a post in the forums".
All power to La Familia if they choose not to run it, but we cannot expect every fleet to stop using it - they will not.
I wouldn't blame the 528th one iota for using it if they in fact do, for me, it's all part of the big picture - send the (usually silent) outraged PvP'ers here to the forums please, lets get their opinions on record too, and get an adjustment to the FAW issue asap.
I noticed it..
I wont complain anymore about it, the Devs dont care about PvP.. Ill just zerg through the unwinnable matches, instead of fighting a fight that cannot be won.. Neither option is much fun for me, so might as well take the quickest.
Atleast I had good PvP in Kerrat against QEW and a few others yesterday, so logging in wasnt completely wasted.
Comments
A new map is only bandaid....more like a weak excuse to please us and keep us pacified as if we were little kids needing a sucker so we shut up....insulting!!!
there decision to plan things out and do the build code with season 4 and revamp ground fixes more issues with PvE players than it gives us anything as a PvP player. Having to wait for the so-called "PvP Revamp" in season 5 is too long to wait for December.
Having to fix/balance abilities and their counters or ability to remove is sorely needed. New mechanics for PvP, giving KDF more ships to compete with the abundance of Fed ships and "special Powers" is another area of neglect.
Fighting in the same Arena or CNH, no matter the map is getting dull. It is becoming more fun to play in Kerrat amid the Borg sometimes.
There are no new weapon types, ability to craft your own weapon stats, way to really do anything unique.....furthering the fact the Skill Path is needed for a revamp: distinguishing ground from space with points to fill both, somewhat, skilling in energy types with a purpose, skilling in a ship type or 2 with purpose.
There is so much to fix that would PLEASE the PvP players beyond a map that cryptic would prolly mess up when adding it.
Questions, musings and points in red above!
*cheers*
1. hello 5 defiant r's. cloak.. creep.. pick 1...unleash. run and hope he dies. cloak. regroup, repeat.
(everyone has good burst, polarize hull for getaway ect...)
2. super spam sci rage. 5 scis with 120+aux popping weapons batts like candy. 5 photo fleets, scorpion fighters, have 2 of them lay dispersal pattern beta on some select mines (chroniton was the choice for us i think) dampening field constantly on rotation..or stacked? yeah, and let em rip with all the tachbeams and cpb's you got.
3. play the damn FAW fest.
fight fire with fire....there can be a balance. but as long as people are gonna exploit 1 particular ability there can never really be true tactical combat. just throw your version of the pre-nerf'd flavor of the month out there....and keep going.
see you on the battlefield.
This is the inherent problem, when you have to use unbalanced setups using multiple copies of skills or combinations to beat one setup that is simple it is out of balance. The current form of BFaW has taken the variation out of the game, so instead of 2-3 optimal builds per ship type now there is one type per ship type.
Forget spamming them to death, 5 Scis should be able to make short work for FAW builds. Just have 1 or 2 people rock CPB, add in a Tyken's or 2 and then whatever else you choose, and you're good to go. Especially if you rotate TSS 2 (or 3) on each other.
Of course, putting it to use in a match where anything can happen sometimes, well.....
I'll just leave it at that for now
For the most part that is true, but something is better than nothing. Because I honestly don't think there is going to be any PvP love til next year, no joke. PvP is so low on their prority list that it barely registers with them, and the rage over FAW isn't getting them to budge like the NPC Spam issue.
I don't think I posted anything but blunt, grim truth. Their Ask Cryptic, Engy Reports and State of the game all skirt the issues of PvP for more uniforms, hair do's and Belt Buckles.
It is very sad and troubling. It is even worse when i sit half the game watching Hulu for Anime or browsing the Rift forums and Bioware forums for the next game to get into, THAT CARES enough to do what it takes and be interactive with their players.
Yeah you have to join one of the fleets that is using these "counters" and probably spec out of your ship of choice. Yeah that is fun, like I want to be a tac flying a sci, or sci flying a sci
I meant you as in 528th.. Before FAW I never saw or heard of you. And sure, Im always up for PvP. I dont have a FAW build anymore (save a KDF Tac I respecced for doing CE)
If by *YOU*, you mean me, then LOL. Sure on one character, out of many, Black WIdow specifically!
No, I mean 528th, a lot of beam arrays
See answer above. Also there are counters to grav well and SS. Although SS is hard to remove, they should consider a resistance or a Sci Team that can accurately be targeted on yourself...Again, don't hate the player, in fact, don't waste time hating at all
STeam does not clear SS3 reliably, which is what Ive been hit with in .. FAW that makes 5 ships do damage like 10+.. Its cheesy tactics, and its the *only* thing Ive seen you (528th) use.
No offense taken. There is no ego here, I simply question your facts. You know nothing of the 528th Fleet. At all. You offer no facts. All I see are pitchforks and torches. I swear to you, we are not witches. I think.
The fact is: The only thing Ive seen from you guys, is the most cheesy, OPd setup around.. I can only make a judgement based on what I see, right?
What? Where? Who?
Some of the FAW posts, I distinctly remember 528th mentioned in sig, and the player(s? - Might just be one person tbh.. Didnt pay attention to names) were talking L2P, easy counters, adapt..
Your basing your facts on limited information. You've said so yourself. You've never heard or seen us.. before.. correct?
Limited in a way that I havent seen you guys doing anything else.. Granted, we're talking 6-7 matches.. 1 with a "premade" and the others individual players.. *All* used FAW, *All* SVs used SS3.. Dont blame me for making an opinion based on those experienced.
Aside from Bluerock? Again, where are these posts
FAW threads... Maybe here, maybe in Cruiser forum.. It was a few days ago, and I really didnt pay attention to names.
No one in STO who pays to play broke the power. Cryptic did. Also, when you say *YOU*, whom are you reffering to? Are you stereotyping the 528th community or just me?
Im referring to every single of your members Ive seen in PvP..
That's unfortunate, and I sympathize with you... However, every month, there is something systemically *wrong* with pvp. We played in a KT league. What's stopping the *hard-core* pvp'ers from entering that league OR, creating a new league? After all, you can sit here and point fingers, or create solutions, at least until the devs resolve the issue.. . Which is it?
The difference is.. There never were anything *this* wrong before (except maybe the CSV problem we had).. It was never *this* easy before.. I mean.. I took 1st place in damage against a premade with 8 common MK X arrays, and circling a fight.. VM was bad, CSV was bad, broken ques were bad.. This is worse.. Perhaps not because the broken power is worse off, but because there are very few regular PvP players.. I PvPd all day today.. Best PvP I had was in Kerrat, fighting Jakub, Tide, Goose and a couple more.. Killed some, died more.. But it was pretty much free of cheesy powers.
As a semi-casual pvp-er, I think that PVP could be an awesome end-game dynamic for STO. Unfortunately, for one reason or another, Cryptic has not put any energy into PVP besides various balance sweeps. I am as frustrated as you are by the lack of attention to detail and the utter lack of pvp content up to now. We even lost that Space assault map. Remember that?
Yes I remember, but we got a ground PvP (lol) map instead.. But thats *it*.. The worst part isnt that they didnt add any things for us.. The worst part is that they break more than they fix... And all the while, we see a 1000 threads asking for this uniform and that ship.. Oh, and 100 threads about a T5 Constitution..
You not you personally I'm confused... Anyway, I'm still waiting on that PVP invite damn it
You, as in you FAW users, make matters worse.. Imagine a guy standing on a ledge, 500m straight down.. FAWers are the person that kicks his leg away under him.. Thats what I fear, that this will be the last nail in the coffin.
Its just good business... We should pvp, I'd love to see that tetryon dual beam bank in action!
About to head to bed, add me and we'll see what we can see... Maybe arrange a fight, or get to know eachother better.. Ill be online again tomorrow.
Most annoying match ever, being hit with FAW, GW, Chronitons and SS all the time. Wouldn't have been much fun at all, except for the pleasure of pwning a cheesy FOTM setup!
(True, we did have some big names on our side...)
See things happen for a reason if you want to scale back an abuse of power then you need to scale back the other abuse that created it. Then we need to ask ourselves, how far back do we go. Do we scale back the carrier that Spam the area? The Fire at Will issue was created because someone else was abusing something else in PvP. No one likes to lose, and now when they queue for FvK they automatically think that the klinks are going to spam the area and come in with Fire at Will to even out the playing field. So you see the issue isnt with Fire at Will. It is what created it in the first place.
Klingons had nothing to do with it. Mine spam is the reason.
Do you really think that people would go out of there way to put 8 beam arrays and retrain Boff with FaW and stack Fire at Will for mines, "I Don't Think So". The mine spam was used to counter the constant battle cloaking that was going on in PvP. The Fire at Will issue was due to pet spam. So do we nerf the battle cloak to get rid of the mine spaming. Where will it end or where should it end? Their is allways a reason for the abuse of a power in the game, all you have to do is think back to see why the abuse started.
People aren't rocking 8 Beam FAW cruisers for spam control - they're using it because it's horribly OP.
Yes I do agree, but it started with the spaming in the game and then they noticed how much of an advantage it gave them and evolved from there. So it was because of the spaming in PvP that created this monster. And Klingons are the only toons that can spam a large amount of pets in a short amount of time.
This is one thing Azurian is right about . One day in the near future pvp will be cut in 1/2 or fully extinct.
STO has the best space combat, addicting even. This is what makes pvp so much, fun is the skill of sto and graphic. STO has one thing going for it " It is the best space combat MMo." TOR wont beat sto in space combat but will offer Grade A pvp at launch (ground). Cryptic its been over a year, all pvp lots hope and feel mistreated by STO and nothing is ever done. No, "were working on it" just a plain out truthfull reason would make me happy. I can say for my self and alot of other pvper we dont expect it to get better, now we just wait for a company to reconise its player base or move on. I dont see this getting better and we have already been ignored I just gave up testing , because are feedback is never listen to.
Ill test MMO's that listen to feedback, CHANGE FAW cryptic WE have thread after thread FIX it cant u do a normal damage calculator ro see whats wrong. Iam just fed up with it all and I have played 4 cryptic titles over a 8 years span. So the from a vetran consumer of cryptic product, your messing up big time with this game. ONE PVP Zone and balance powers pls, I could make a list. pls Outsource a better testing firm if thats who u all are listen to.
Carriers where a 1 month or so anomaly when cryptic decided to make a ship that had been in the gmae since beta usable. However Federation teams have been spamming mines at least as long. Mine spam was the issue... then the silly fighters on top of that.
I retrained one BOff for FAW just to deal with mines and pets. Mostly on the Klingon side, but also for some Feds. I don't stack it, though.
???
And the mine spam in FvF was what ??? countering defiants. lol I don't think you grasp the issue.
The problem with Old-FAW, and the reason it did not work well enough as a minesweeper, was the number of shots fired. 2x the number of shots fired & 2x the powerdrain would have been a good way to go imo.
The change to BFAW was probably motivated by the idea that BFAW was only a spam clearing tool. It required very specific builds to make it into a potential single target damage buff power.
The new BFAW fixes the issue - by making the ability broken and overpowered. There is nothing wrong per se with a single target damage buff, but having a "full enemy team damage buff" that can more then double your damage output is obviously out of line.
Yeh.. Woulda been better if the power had never been touched..
TSI is not above using this ability at all.
In fact over the last week or two, we have been running mixed TSI/Legends/D.O.B. pugmades, and it will usually get used somewhere within that pool of players. Every person I have spoken to within those fleets seem to agree that it is a joke. Where we cannot all agree, is how best it should be changed.
The general attitude on vent seems to be "if we don't show it up to be silly, nothing will change". Several well known players chat in zone after matches and ask that the aggrieved teams/individuals to "go make a post in the forums".
All power to La Familia if they choose not to run it, but we cannot expect every fleet to stop using it - they will not.
I wouldn't blame the 528th one iota for using it if they in fact do, for me, it's all part of the big picture - send the (usually silent) outraged PvP'ers here to the forums please, lets get their opinions on record too, and get an adjustment to the FAW issue asap.
Proposition D=Old-FAW, + damage to primary target never to drop belove the original 100%. Only the bonus-damage to be used for seconday target beams.
I noticed it..
I wont complain anymore about it, the Devs dont care about PvP.. Ill just zerg through the unwinnable matches, instead of fighting a fight that cannot be won.. Neither option is much fun for me, so might as well take the quickest.
Atleast I had good PvP in Kerrat against QEW and a few others yesterday, so logging in wasnt completely wasted.