Community's opinion on APS [Poll]

It just seems like a simple example of bad coding. -_- I very much wish it were re-coded so that APS would behave like the other stats.

Yeah Fuzzy, it'd be nice to just post polls without allowing comments, wouldn't it? ._.

(inb4flimsyjustificationsofOPness)

Simple and short answer: no

(voted "No" too off course b:chuckle)

The whole APS/interval discussion here is pointless.

If you want something like this to change then go over to the PW-CN forums and post it there.

Next topic: Community's opinion on channeling/soulforce/defense levels/etc.!

Nael - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Am I the only one who doesn't understand what the OP is talking about?

Seems to me like OP is saying -int should be a negative thing because it's got negative sign on it...

Um, no. What he is saying is this: due to the mechanics of -interval, the more you have it, the better the effect of the next -interval piece you get, e.g. 0.5-0.05 = 0.45 (2.0-> 2.22, 0.22 gain), vs. 0.45 - 0.05 = 0.4 (2.22 -> 2.5, 0.28 gain). And he's asking if this is fair in the light that most other things, such as defenses, attack and defense levels, skill damage, -channeling and +matk/patk all work the opposite way: the more you have, the less you gain from the next increment.

not one of those stupidity again b:cold

y do i see the majority of ppl complaining abt aps r lower lvls or mediocre players ? who refuse to spend as much $ or time as those aps players ? u know, if u spend as much RL money OR time merchanting like them, ur char might be as good as them b:shutup

in short, these players worked for it either in game or in RL.
there is no cheap -int gear where -CT gears r cheaper

how abt starting a QQ thread abt R9 wiz/psy/arch 1shotting everybody and their grandmas in TW ?
like we should cap aps at 2.22 or something and cap casters dmg at 10k per hit max ? b:sin

Zeyar - Dreamweaver wrote: »

not one of those stupidity again b:cold

y do i see the majority of ppl complaining abt aps r lower lvls or mediocre players ? who refuse to spend as much $ or time as those aps players ? u know, if u spend as much RL money OR time merchanting like them, ur char might be as good as them b:shutup

in short, these players worked for it either in game or in RL.
there is no cheap -int gear where -CT gears r cheaper

how abt starting a QQ thread abt R9 wiz/psy/arch 1shotting everybody and their grandmas in TW ?
like we should cap aps at 2.22 or something and cap casters dmg at 10k per hit max ? b:sin

Level 103 cleric and I voted no. By your assumption if I spent as much you on my gear, I should be every bit as good. But it isn't true. Dragons orbs cost me the same as you, but I will never reach the same damage out put with equivalent gears and refines. I have +10 r9 and just as many channeling pieces as an -int user would need for 5aps, but I will never be able to solo a boss in as much time as it takes aps people. And sins should be capped at 2.22 imo.

Zeyar - Dreamweaver wrote: »

not one of those stupidity again b:cold

y do i see the majority of ppl complaining abt aps r lower lvls or mediocre players ? who refuse to spend as much $ or time as those aps players ? u know, if u spend as much RL money OR time merchanting like them, ur char might be as good as them b:shutup

in short, these players worked for it either in game or in RL.
there is no cheap -int gear where -CT gears r cheaper

how abt starting a QQ thread abt R9 wiz/psy/arch 1shotting everybody and their grandmas in TW ?
like we should cap aps at 2.22 or something and cap casters dmg at 10k per hit max ? b:sin

Here's a hint: people complaining about aps =/= wanting to be "as good" as aps players. -_- The PVP system has a lot of problems, R9 being another one. But the last thing we need is people assuming that those who bring up legitimate problems just have gear envy. >_>

This is hardly the community's opinion on anything. What percentage of players visit the forums, and take the time to vote/discuss on anything? Not a large one. Hell, some players are too lazy to even bother coming here to check if there's maintenance of not each week.
Instead another thread that will be fuelled by the same people who go back and forth on APS.

_Aubree__ - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Level 103 cleric and I voted no. By your assumption if I spent as much you on my gear, I should be every bit as good. But it isn't true. Dragons orbs cost me the same as you, but I will never reach the same damage out put with equivalent gears and refines. I have +10 r9 and just as many channeling pieces as an -int user would need for 5aps, but I will never be able to solo a boss in as much time as it takes aps people. And sins should be capped at 2.22 imo.

Yes clerics should have same DPS since its also a DD-class...b:embarrass

Why would you even make a R9 cleric to solo bosses/instances in pve lol

Sins are of course broken in every aspect of the game, but thats more related to skills than aps. Most endgame sins doesn't give a **** about max aps in PvP, they rely on zerk and attack levels and just 1-2 shots everyone from stealth.

@topic: If you think APS is problem, you most likely haven't played this game for a very long time or you never played it more than casually. Majority of long term players already have one or even two 5.0 chars for PvE by now. Its called adjusting and they dont wanna go back to spending 20 minutes killing 1 boss b:surrender.

Than they use archer/psy/wiz for Mass-PvP and TW since ranged classes (specially with R9) are superior in that area compared to meles. Classes are good for different things in this game, not saying thats a good thing tho.

It makes no sense for ranged classes to have equal dps 1 on 1 as melees. Ranged classes are supposed to have the best aoe dps, not singular dps. This is why they roll melees in mass pvp or tw. Byt in pve, If you want to pull aggro off me and get 1 shot by a world boss, go for it, but people should know their roles as who the designated tanks should be.

_Aubree__ - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Level 103 cleric and I voted no. By your assumption if I spent as much you on my gear, I should be every bit as good. But it isn't true. Dragons orbs cost me the same as you, but I will never reach the same damage out put with equivalent gears and refines. I have +10 r9 and just as many channeling pieces as an -int user would need for 5aps, but I will never be able to solo a boss in as much time as it takes aps people. And sins should be capped at 2.22 imo.

Maybe because that's not what your character is built for? Because it seems like that's all you are complaining about.

The more effort you put into your character the better it is at doing what you build it for. Did you build your character to solo bosses? No you didn't because you choose a class that isn't built for that.


Your character IS better at what you chose to build it for, but don't build a character to do something and then complain when it can't do something else.

So using your argument, archers, sins, and bm's should be the tanks?

Not the barbs? Hmmmmm....

Considering your past arguments, you must be off track today Dan.

Simple fact is that mathematically, the code does not make sense.

Where did he say barbs shouldn't tank? If you build a barb to be able to tank endgame instance, you can do so easily.

Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »

All this complaining is by PvP built classes/characters complaining that their char, SPECIFICALLY DESIGNED FOR PVP, cannot PvE very well.

Quit claiming you know what classes are intended to do. You are not a product manager at pw-beijing. There is no official documentation that says casters are not intended to be used in PVE.

nakhtuul wrote: »

So using your argument, archers, sins, and bm's should be the tanks?

Not the barbs? Hmmmmm....

Considering your past arguments, you must be off track today Dan.

Simple fact is that mathematically, the code does not make sense.

EDIT: Not to mention, some WB's do range magic, which a magic tank would be best at, if I recall. Maybe not, been awhile since I did WB hunts.

Barbs have the best survivability and take the most hits, more suited for pvp tanks as they aren't the best dps tanks. Pve prefers dps tanks against singular opponents. Triple spark 20% hp regen purify and bloodpaint pretty much makes sins the best dps tanks. Two different things. Barbs with aps builds can be good dps tanks as well.

If you're talking machinoslitt or sword tamer, they do massive aoe magic if mage tanked. Whereas if melee tanked, they rarely aoe.

Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »

I'm talking about character builds as well as the potential of the classes. It's obvious that simply because of what they are able to do what the classes are intended for.


Or do you intend to say that a mage with the worst single target DPS in the game, the worst survivability, and absolutely no utility is designed for instances that are completely designed around single target dps?

I don't think the devs paid much consideration at all into the end-game design of the game.
I don't see a problem with dissatisfied people complaining about the game's lousy class balance.

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

I don't think the devs paid much consideration at all into the end-game design of the game.
I don't see a problem with dissatisfied people complaining about the game's lousy class balance.

The classes are balanced (except for fish) they just have different scenarios and roles where their usefulness comes in.


Can a mage be useful in a TT/Nirvana? Not really.

But they can be an unstoppable force in PvP.

Throw them in a TW and they're one shotting entire squads of people and the minute you get close to them they distance shrink back. Combine that with a well refined cube neck and warsong belt with stone barrier on and you've got a pretty scary class.