Faction Bases: Tell me this is a joke...wth

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  • Vitenka - Dreamweaver
    Vitenka - Dreamweaver Posts: 4,125 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Or, the huge faction can just fake-bid on itself a couple of times.

    15m for three fake bids from a midsized faction is nothing.

    5m for one fake bid from a smaller faction is a problem.


    This setup is NOT friendly.
  • Baalzor - Heavens Tear
    Baalzor - Heavens Tear Posts: 272 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    whata huge disappointment for the guild base. huge. was really looking forward to work something for with my guild. i think i speak in the name of all of us when i say i demand an explanation for this.
    give me a reason to continue playing this game...its getting boring. you gave us 1.1 gb of NOTHING with this patch. NOTHING. or at least try to recruit the devs that were working on PW the first place and try to get the code out of their heads so you can start fixing bugs and changing stuff easily.
    http:// fr.xfire.com/video/36f4d6/
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  • Deceptistar - Sanctuary
    Deceptistar - Sanctuary Posts: 10,454 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Vitenka - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Or, the huge faction can just fake-bid on itself a couple of times.

    15m for three fake bids from a midsized faction is nothing.

    5m for one fake bid from a smaller faction is a problem.


    This setup is NOT friendly.
    you forget each of the bidding factions need to also own a base.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]lagunal8.deviantart.com
    ★"New weekly quests! "Discover the bug in the patch""-Nihillae★"My father would beat me if he found out I was QQing over a virtual pony."-Neurosis★"You're amongst the biggest blobs of fail I've ever seen in my life."-Ninnuam★"A statistic said 3% people of the world get enjoyment primarily from making people upset, and you are trying to discriminate them"-ilystah★["How To Tank Rebirth Order Delta (86+)"-Stickygreen Barb (1)restat. you want full magic, Arcane armour build (2)when mobs come /faceroll on your keyboard and you will one shot all the mobs (3)rinse and repeat]★"I've been spammed with 3 poops for 2 hours."-ColdSteele★"If someone fights learning, I don't bother with them outside of amusement factor."-Telarith★"This thread is a joke right? Please say yes."-eatwithspoons★ "This is why you don't post your opinions on the internet, most of the replies you get will be from people who missed a hug or two sometime in their youth."-Alacol★"Sexy! A post with a Binomial Distribution."-Asterelle★"It's about time PW starts to separate out the noob Sins from the rest."-salvati0n★"Shoo troll >:O"-TheDan
  • fiercerage
    fiercerage Posts: 137 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Vitenka - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Or, the huge faction can just fake-bid on itself a couple of times.

    15m for three fake bids from a midsized faction is nothing.

    5m for one fake bid from a smaller faction is a problem.


    This setup is NOT friendly.

    I'm not speculating on whether or not this will happen, but keep in mind fake bidding is still bannable, and as posted above me, they'd have to spend a lot of money to try to fake bid and keep alternate bases alive.
  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Atreyuthus - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Well, since I am in the guild with all the ~50's, and I have the money, that's how we have 200m.

    AND last time I checked, 101 is endgame

    Read my posts b4 responding to them b:angry

    Edit: and just because there is a few high lvl ppl in a guild dominated by 50's, doesn't mean the AVERAGE still wont be ~50 (shall i run the numbers for you to confirm or do you get the concept of averages?)
    Well then you clearly cant understand that the guild bases are aimed at guilds that are high leveled.


    I hate to break it to ya, but the guild bases AREN'T DESIGNED FOR EVERY SINGLE PERSON OUT THERE.


    This is designed for high level factions with high average levels. Just like TW there will be a few guilds that aren't strong enough.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."
  • Vasilisk - Harshlands
    Vasilisk - Harshlands Posts: 208 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Well then you clearly cant understand that the guild bases are aimed at guilds that are high leveled.


    I hate to break it to ya, but the guild bases AREN'T DESIGNED FOR EVERY SINGLE PERSON OUT THERE.


    This is designed for high level factions with high average levels. Just like TW there will be a few guilds that aren't strong enough.

    May be so clever barb can also answer "WHY?"
    FB not designed for non endgame _faction_
    TW not designed for non endgame _faction_
    Most events not designed for non endgame _faction_ and _player_
    Is this game designed for old 100+ and theirs alts?
  • Maiya - Lost City
    Maiya - Lost City Posts: 2,686 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Lul. The moment I read about guild bases, I knew they would backfire on a lot of players.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • LenieClarke - Heavens Tear
    LenieClarke - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,275 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Just like TW there will be a few guilds that aren't strong enough.

    "a few"?

    so, how many guilds do you guys have on raging tides by now, ten? twelve?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Heaven's Tear alts: KenLubin, Sou_Hon, JudyCaraco --- level 5x chars.
  • fiercerage
    fiercerage Posts: 137 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Vasilisk - Harshlands wrote: »
    May be so clever barb can also answer "WHY?"
    FB not designed for non endgame _faction_ Squad instance
    TW not designed for non endgame _faction_ Yes it is. Faction instance
    Most events not designed for non endgame _faction_ and _player_ Most, yes. Not this one.
    Is this game designed for old 100+ and theirs alts? Yes, or else there would be no reason to reach endgame?

    Responses in red.
  • Laranda - Heavens Tear
    Laranda - Heavens Tear Posts: 283 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    *facepalm*

    I should have known something like this might happen. Doesn't look like they bothred to check over their design notes from the fw version. They could have implimented it alot better. They already did in that game. :/

    (@Rawrgh, I'm including your post about gear prices in with this. It's clear they didn't do a good job.)
  • Conavar - Heavens Tear
    Conavar - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,193 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Alot of you are mistaking " needing to be high level to compete " as " designed for endgame ". If they were designed for endgame only they would have a level limit like Nirvana
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Keirslyana - Heavens Tear
    Keirslyana - Heavens Tear Posts: 17 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    The attacks as far as I'm aware aren't predetermined, they're RANDOM.


    So every week you fight two RANDOM opponnent, so no, you don't have to fight the top guild every week.





    So yea, if your guild is even in the top 30 to 40 guilds you should be fine.


    So, please, do your reasearch BEFORE you QQ.



    You people make it sound like if you lose just one fight then you lose every single thing and your base is destroyed.


    FROM PWI WIKI: "How to declare a battle - 2) The Faction Leader pick a target faction from the available list. so number one, it is not random according to this source linked in the opening. also, this PWI WIKI page notes that it needs updating.. this page is also dubious in saying that you need 1k contribution to participate in these battles and we do not have a clue how much time/effort is needed to reach this level. so, my research has turned up two "facts" along with others which i spend the rest of the day questioning.

    also from your earlier post of how these smaller guilds get the original $ to build a base - they cooperate towards a single goal. yes it is very time consuming for them, but why is that concept is so foreign to you?

    there are so many comments to respond to but the bottom line i see is:

    1) even if it takes more than one attack to destroy a base, the smaller guilds will still not ever build one. i agree that it is not logical that one attack will destroy a base, but if the guild needs to re-strengthen their base week after week, this takes time away from normal gameplay whereby the smaller guilds get strong enough to fully defend them. this also applies to the factions who don't want to fight 40v40 in the first place. just by saying that this feature is not meant for everybody was not spelled out earlier so that guilds could decide to even start raising the funds.
    2) larger guilds will "farm the crops once they are ready to harvest" to quote Kiyoshi. one of many posts he has made defending this system. so if as you say the "top 30 - 40 guilds you should be fine" only means your crop grows until the top factions want to harvest you, it is just matter of time and all those who worked so hard to build their base are still out the original cost.

    WHERE ARE THE MODS ON THIS THREAD TO DISPEL OR CONFIRM ANY OR ALL OF THESE DIFFERING INTERPRETATIONS AND CONCERNS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • Shahiro - Dreamweaver
    Shahiro - Dreamweaver Posts: 39 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    What is the incentive for smaller guilds to grow? It seems to me that this new add-on is only rewarding guilds that have been around for a long time and have had a long steady time to grow. With modern guilds it's now-- you have to be all or nothing. Go big or go home. That's not realistic or fair.

    And I feel like if this was truly endgame content it should be more clear and the items less attainable. As leader of an avg sized, avg level guild we have gathered most of the requirements.

    It's like-- first placing candy in a kid's reach (on purpose) then snatching and putting it on a higher shelf "Oh no, that's for bigger kids-- But you'll never get this piece of candy because all of the bigger kids will eat them all before you get to it and one big kid dominates the only piece of candy left in the world-- Anyway-- Have fun and run off!"

    Is a decline option so hard? I mean, putting PVP required material in a PVE setting is like-- unethical. Sure, some guilds would be annoyed when declined for war. But which is a bigger grief? Being declined by 1 guild out of many. Or losing your entire guild base, previous hard work and pride attained from growing as a community doing it.
  • fiercerage
    fiercerage Posts: 137 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Conavar - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Alot of you are mistaking " needing to be high level to compete " as " designed for endgame ". If they were designed for endgame only they would have a level limit like Nirvana

    Can you give me an example of "needing to be high level to compete" ? Because I'm currently confused with what you think the distinction is.
  • Xyleena - Heavens Tear
    Xyleena - Heavens Tear Posts: 132 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    As far as HT is concerned, why are people goign to QQ about Enrage taking everything over? They put in the hard work and evne the money to be the top, so they are going to be the top. If youre on the bottom, oh well, life sucks and then you die. Seriously, the Guild Bases are there FOR PVP'rs. Whats the use of having a guild base if you don't have to defend it? There isn't one. If you don't want to PVP, make up a guild "base" in your head. Pick a place somewhere on the map and pretend that's your base, have your people meet you there to do... whatever it is you wanna do. EVERYTHING in the bases is expensive to acquire anyway, thus why TW Rewards are back to the way they were. They used to give MONEY in coins as TW Pay, and now it's Ten Million Big Notes, why? because you need them for the bases.

    IMO, if you can't win a TW 80v80 and hold land for a significant amount of time, you don't deserve to have a base.


    If you can't beat em, join em and if you can't join em, get involved in another good faction and ally together and beat them that way. =D; If you gonna complain about what Enrage does, get involved in the factions that are ALMOST but not quite there in defeating them. Enrage used to have a lot of competition, until factions started breaking up and forming smaller but less effective factions. I'm sure they'd appreciate a good fight again.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

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  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    FROM PWI WIKI: "How to declare a battle - 2) The Faction Leader pick a target faction from the available list. so number one, it is not random according to this source linked in the opening. also, this PWI WIKI page notes that it needs updating.. this page is also dubious in saying that you need 1k contribution to participate in these battles and we do not have a clue how much time/effort is needed to reach this level. so, my research has turned up two "facts" along with others which i spend the rest of the day questioning.



    And out of ALL the factions attacking your base (and there will be at least 15-20) Only ONE gets to attack. And that ONE is chosen RANDOMLY
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."
  • Vasilisk - Harshlands
    Vasilisk - Harshlands Posts: 208 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    fiercerage wrote: »
    Responses in red.

    FB i mean Faction Bases.
    And "endgame factions" not same as "factions". If you want to feel difference - find thread with TW map SS - how many factions have real TW.
  • Conavar - Heavens Tear
    Conavar - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,193 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    fiercerage wrote: »
    Can you give me an example of "needing to be high level to compete" ? Because I'm currently confused with what you think the distinction is.

    The current TW situation. You need to be high level to compete because well everyone else is. But it wasn't designed just for high level people since when the servers where new lvl 30 could compete on an equal footing.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Atreyuthus - Sanctuary
    Atreyuthus - Sanctuary Posts: 92 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Xyleena - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    As far as HT is concerned, why are people goign to QQ about Enrage taking everything over? They put in the hard work and evne the money to be the top, so they are going to be the top. If youre on the bottom, oh well, life sucks and then you die. Seriously, the Guild Bases are there FOR PVP'rs. Whats the use of having a guild base if you don't have to defend it? There isn't one. If you don't want to PVP, make up a guild "base" in your head. Pick a place somewhere on the map and pretend that's your base, have your people meet you there to do... whatever it is you wanna do. EVERYTHING in the bases is expensive to acquire anyway, thus why TW Rewards are back to the way they were. They used to give MONEY in coins as TW Pay, and now it's Ten Million Big Notes, why? because you need them for the bases.

    IMO, if you can't win a TW 80v80 and hold land for a significant amount of time, you don't deserve to have a base.


    If you can't beat em, join em and if you can't join em, get involved in another good faction and ally together and beat them that way. =D; If you gonna complain about what Enrage does, get involved in the factions that are ALMOST but not quite there in defeating them. Enrage used to have a lot of competition, until factions started breaking up and forming smaller but less effective factions. I'm sure they'd appreciate a good fight again.

    How the hell do you figure? A group of 100+ dedicated players in a faction doesn't necessarily mean they can or want to TW O.o horrible assumption

    Just because people can or have the ability to PVP doesn't mean they are going to or even want to, hence PVE servers
  • Vasilisk - Harshlands
    Vasilisk - Harshlands Posts: 208 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »

    And out of ALL the factions attacking your base (and there will be at least 15-20) Only ONE gets to attack. And that ONE is chosen RANDOMLY    [/COLOR]

    Wow, RT really have 15-20 factions which wanna be feeder for 1-2 strong?
  • Ruxal - Harshlands
    Ruxal - Harshlands Posts: 150 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Well since guild bases are intended as end game content, what new features have been introduced for casual players who have no intention of seriously raising an earthguard?

    Also in this expansion have any real issues in terms of balancing or fixing of bugs been handled?

    Once again this is one of the worst expansions I have seen from a major mmo company. All I get for updating my client is a UI I don't like.
  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Rune crafting


    An entire new reward system from completing BH in addition to the old one, you can now get low to mid level molds simply by doing BH. As well as many other things. Just these new rewards alone are pretty substantial.


    New quests.


    And why should every update be aimed at low to mid level players, one of the main concerns prior to this expansion is lack of endgame content, and it's nice we have some added.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."
  • Aisura - Dreamweaver
    Aisura - Dreamweaver Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    I've been apart of bigger guilds, And sometimes theres too much drama or too many ppl. I prefer a smaller guild. And i have a few characters. I casually play.

    I wanted to get a guildbase for my new faction. And when have been gathering materials for it and money. Were only a few mill away. And now we learn about all the dowsides to the base.

    We wanted the base as a fun place to hangout. Lvl, Upgrade ext.

    But if we cant be left to do so because we will not have a choice on declineing fights then what is the point?

    There are some of us who would like a list where we can have a base. New ppl join everyday. Why not say at the beginning what the bottom line is going to be instead of saying. Oh its awesome and everyone will be able to get one. When in retrospect that is a lowed of horse ****.

    PLEASE GMS, DEVS whoever. Please be clear on these things and let us know. NOT everone wants to do TW. That is one of the reasons i left my faction. The leader kept wanting to do tw knowing we were not ready for it. And "Ally's" no matter what agreements u have. Can turn on you in a instant.

    Not everyone wants to PVP. Some of use simply want to enjoy the game. Have fun, Do quest. Hang out with friends. Also some of us do have lives as stated in earlier post. So we cant be on 24/7 365DAY

    So what i am getting from this is all the lower lvls get is a few new quest. 2 classes, couple fashion and that is it.

    Great job............ oh and im still waiting on a reply on 2 problem tickets i gave over 4 months ago.....

    How many ppl actually work for PW???
  • Lesthar - Heavens Tear
    Lesthar - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,045 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    I then guess that many factions won't try this super coin sink that bases are?
    Even if I will never witness that feature (even more less try it), I feel sorry for you guys.

    A compulsory PvP menacing something you bought with tons of coins and materials? It's sad, really sad-sounding.
    Maintenance time. Please choose a line:
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    - Will we get sales? I got a ton of gold to spend.
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  • sig1043a
    sig1043a Posts: 74 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    Xyleena - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Whats the use of having a guild base if you don't have to defend it? There isn't one.

    You're pretty dense if you really believe this.
    The Four Wings of Your Guild Base (plus the center!):

    Your new base will consist of a center room with four looooong hallways extending away from it, each leading to a separate wing. Each wing serves a specific function.

    * Armory
    o From here you'll be able to access special faction-only gear. Gear from the Armory can be purchased with Contribution, and better gear can be accessed by upgrading this wing!

    * Alchemy Lab
    o The Alchemy Lab gives you access to powerful 1 hour buffs that can be purchased with Contribution. Upgrade this wing to gain access to more powerful buffs!

    * Manor of Justice
    o This is where you'll find the various quests that will award you with Contribution.

    * Heavenly Vault
    o This very important wing is where you'll be able to turn in your Guild Materials to upgrade the various wings of your base. You'll also be able to exchange one type of Material for another here, though the exchange rate is not quite 1:1...

    * Hall of Loyalty
    o This is the center of your base, and it specializes in.. well, trivia, actually. Answer questions correctly for different rewards! You'll also find some other quests here.


    Aside from the different wings, your Guild Base also has an area dedicated to raising monsters! You'll be able to get special quests to kill these beasts for tons of EXP and Spirit!

    That just screams pvp to me...oh wait, no, it doesn't. The only thing that make guild bases PvP is the forced TW.
  • Aranarwa - Heavens Tear
    Aranarwa - Heavens Tear Posts: 83 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    A similar system failed hard in RoM.

    I expect it to fail here too.
    Beauty is in the eye of the beerholder b:chuckle
  • Faeble - Heavens Tear
    Faeble - Heavens Tear Posts: 183 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    So every week you fight two RANDOM opponnent, so no, you don't have to fight the top guild every week.

    The random you are referring to is if TWO factions (or more) bid on yours. It is a 50% chance to find Faction A and 50% to fight Faction B

    They pick you out. It's only random between which faction you will have to duel out of the ones who picked you out. Clearly, if only one did, then you have a 100% chance to fight them the next day.
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  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    * Armory
    o From here you'll be able to access special faction-only gear. Gear from the Armory can be purchased with Contribution, and better gear can be accessed by upgrading this wing!


    Useless. The gears here are about the equivalent of tier 1 nirvana at 100x the cost. There are 2 helms (arcane and normal) that are equal to tier 2 nirvana in power. The cost? 960mil. So this allows you to pay more for nirvana gears.
    * Alchemy Lab
    o The Alchemy Lab gives you access to powerful 1 hour buffs that can be purchased with Contribution. Upgrade this wing to gain access to more powerful buffs!


    From what I've seen so far, mediocre at best. Level 10 buffs from a cleric/barb/whatever are more powerful.


    And the other two wings seem to be designed to help level the base... so you can get more useless stuff. The only interesting factor of guild bases is the PvP.

    The random you are referring to is if TWO factions (or more) bid on yours. It is a 50% chance to find Faction A and 50% to fight Faction B

    They pick you out. It's only random between which faction you will have to duel out of the ones who picked you out. Clearly, if only one did, then you have a 100% chance to fight them the next day.


    More than likely everyone (except, ironically, the top guilds) will have at least 10 bids on them, most of which by mid level guilds equal or similar to in strength.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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  • Keirslyana - Heavens Tear
    Keirslyana - Heavens Tear Posts: 17 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    TY Rawrgh for both responding to my post and yet adding to my confusion. like i said before, there are many statements on the wiki page that i find to not be completely fleshed out. like...nevermind, i'll get the main point:

    it just dawned on me while typing in guild forum about this that for all of all other deficiencies, legitimate or QQ, that the timing on this is just WRONG WRONG WRONG even for the top guilds. you have one days notice to participate in a 40v40 at 2300h on a tues or thurs night server time after recieving notice after 2300h on a mon or wed night . personally i am on server time, but i am in NO WAY SHAPE OR FORM in the top 40 of my guild, nor do i want to commit to three battles a week. yeah, a little QQ on my part, it's a part of being in large guild so go ahead and pick on me for that. it will be interesting to see how many guilds can muster sufficient force on short notice and at that time.

    2300h tues and thurs = 0200 east coast US, 0500 GMT (as of today, our ridiculous daylight savings time is coming on mar 13) and so on. this is in the work/schoolday of people in europe, africa and the mideast and very late in the evening for people in the US that have jobs/school or other aspects of rl to consistently participate. chew on that for a moment. any or all feedback on this aspect is welcomed.
  • Cael_Cross - Sanctuary
    Cael_Cross - Sanctuary Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited March 2011
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    The whole end of game = PvP is not true, if not why make PvE servers

    When i saw the wars option i faction base i thought that maybe some items to upgrade your base were only obtained from war, but to be able to loose your base just because you had the bad luck that you have a big strong faction as your next oponent is too much.

    I do hope they change parts of this, theres so many ways of making everyone happy, like for instance the deciding or not in taking part on this wars, that if you dont, you need more materials; or that if you want a high lvl base you have to participate in the wars, that way casual non PvP players have their base where they can meet and relax, and Hardcore players have something otehrs dont as prize for their efforts.
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